Behind the Golf Brand Podcast with Paul Liberatore
#127 - Brian Mogg: Golf Digest’s Top 100 Teachers in America
In this week's episode, I interview my good friend Brian Mogg, the coaching legend who coached YE Yang to victory against Tiger Woods in the 2009 PGA Championship, and one of Golf Digest’s top 100 for ten years in a row.
Brian has taught an incredible 50,000+ lessons, and the results speak for themselves. His students have won ninety tour events. He was named one of Golf Digest’s Top 100 Teachers in America. He’s made Golf Magazine’s Top 100 Teachers list for the past seventeen years. But one of his greatest achievements was helping Bart Bryant go from $200 thousand in earnings to $14 million in his later years.
What’s so unique about Brian’s coaching style is that he has over two decades of inside-the-ropes professional experience, and he still competes at the highest level from time to time, giving him an invaluable 360-degree perspective. His Distance Quadrant has changed the way older golfers dial in their swings and gain distance with age.
In this week's episode, I interview my good friend Brian Mogg, the coaching legend who coached YE Yang to victory against Tiger Woods in the 2009 PGA Championship, and one of Golf Digest’s top 100 for ten years in a row.
Brian has taught an incredible 50,000+ lessons, and the results speak for themselves. His students have won ninety tour events. He was named one of Golf Digest’s Top 100 Teachers in America. He’s made Golf Magazine’s Top 100 Teachers list for the past seventeen years. But one of his greatest achievements was helping Bart Bryant go from $200 thousand in earnings to $14 million in his later years.
What’s so unique about Brian’s coaching style is that he has over two decades of inside-the-ropes professional experience, and he still competes at the highest level from time to time, giving him an invaluable 360-degree perspective. His Distance Quadrant has changed the way older golfers dial in their swings and gain distance with age.
Today we play golf.
Speaker 2:Let me show you how we do it in the pros.
Speaker 3:Welcome to Behind the Golf Brand podcast I never missed with the Seven Iron , a conversation with some of the most interesting innovators and entrepreneurs behind the biggest names in golf. My
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Speaker 3:Just let me put the ball in a hole. This is Behind the Golf Brand podcast with Paul Libert tore .
Speaker 6:What's up guys? Welcome to the Behind the Golf Brand podcast. This week I have a good friend Brian Moog , world famous golf instructor, instructor to many, many, many tour players and I'm super excited to have him on the show, talk about his life, his career, how he got to where he is at, what he's doing now, and it's time to take you into his world. So welcome to the show.
Speaker 7:Hey , thanks so much for having me on.
Speaker 6:So where are you located right now?
Speaker 7:Well , I'm in Orlando, Florida at the moment. Uh, spend about half our year in Orlando and half our year near Seattle. Wife and I are from the area. Oh really ? Our son lives out there. I've got Academy of Chambers Bay and tons of family and friends throughout the , throughout the year. So we definitely get as much get out there as much as we can and then somehow it just seems to work when the weather's good in Florida, we're here and the weather's good out near Seattle. We're there. So that's uh ,
Speaker 6:So when you go back to Seattle,
Speaker 7:Oh , like summer? Yeah, late May, early June we'll probably head back out to Seattle and we just got back , uh, earliest November to Orlando and you know, it works out pretty good. But I've got other academies so there's a lot of moving around and all that. But , um, lot traveling. You know, Seattle's fantastic from the, when the weather's great out there.
Speaker 6:You grew up there, didn't you?
Speaker 7:Tacoma Washington. So I'm from there. My wife's from there. Our son has a job out there. He worked for Russell Wilson for quite a while out in Seattle. And uh ,
Speaker 6:Who , what ,
Speaker 7:Uh , that's a cool part of the story. He , uh, after he graduated from college, he got a job with NBC Sports and he was on the field for Sunday night football with Michelle Tafoya and kind of did Sunday night football bus, you know, we're huge Seahawk fans. And after he did that for about four or five years, I think they won four Emmys as a team. I don't know where Russell called him and said, I've seen some of the work you do. I wants you to come out here and do it just for me. So he was part of Russell's brand. We're talking about brand . So he was part of Russell's brand team and for almost six years, you know, they really did a great job and Russell had the vision to put people around him and empower them to help him with branding and commercials and endorsements and kind of non-football related stuff. And that's cool . And the process became great friends with Russell and we're , you know, friends with a lot of Seahawk players and just fantastic friends out there.
Speaker 6:I feel like Seahawk players , Seahawk fans are like diehard fans. I don't think people realize how diehard Seahawk fans are.
Speaker 7:Like , you snoop around our house here, you'll find tons of jerseys and 12 flags and I think I , yeah ,
Speaker 6:I see
Speaker 7:I've been to three , I think I've been to three games so far this year already. Really ? And they've won every game. So I need to , I guess I need to keep going.
Speaker 6:I like to see how , I remember they used to be so terrible back in the eighties and stuff and then yeah , like then they finally like turned it around and it's kind of crappy . They traded Russell away though.
Speaker 7:Yeah. There, there's a lot of story behind that story, but I need to get you some of my buddies on the show with you because they are some of the biggest Jermaine K wide receiver had had the catch in the Super Bowl .
Speaker 6:I remember . I remember him.
Speaker 7:Awesome . He's one of our close, he was one of our close friends. He and Brian Walters . They are like the biggest golf nuts you've ever seen. I've really
Speaker 6:Do
Speaker 7:You do remember ? All right . Do you remember the Seahawk playoff game against Minnesota? It was six below about seven, eight years ago
Speaker 6:Ring . I do remember that. Yeah. Yeah, yeah .
Speaker 7:Blair Walsh missed a field goal at the short distance at the very end of the game in Seattle One . Well after the game, I got a picture on my phone. I'm in the locker room with Jermaine . It was six below and uh, we're in the locker room, edge of the locker room doing golf tips and drills with Jermaine. He brought some with him . You know , they're waiting for Russell , Russell Dow's interview stuff. But I met Jermaine that year , I don't know how many times at games we're doing drills and, and swing stuff after the game in the locker room or outside the stadium waiting for the buses to leave. And I mean, Brian , he's
Speaker 6:Like, you know that you're like the go-to guy to give him the edge he needs. Have you given him like instructions too outside of that? Like I bet you're picking a lot of players instruction, huh? Like NFL players.
Speaker 7:We just , we just had Michael Vick , one of our golf schools. Uh, in fact when I played with Briston out in the Pebble Beach event here recently, Fred McGriff and Matt La Porter were two of my they baseball guys. I remember
Speaker 6:Griff , I remember him. Dude, that's old school that's , he played for like Toronto. Wait , who did he play for?
Speaker 7:He played for San Diego and Atlanta mostly, but Atlanta.
Speaker 6:That's right. Atlanta.
Speaker 7:But he just got on the Hall of Fame. And you know, one of the cool things from a golf instruction standpoint got to meet so many athletes and just be involved with helping their golfers golf games out. And all of a sudden you're buddies with guys that you could, you know, as a , as a fan you're drooling watching 'em on tv. Next thing you know they're asking you for help with their golf game.
Speaker 6:And there's like normal people.
Speaker 7:They're all , they're all normal people. They may be driven a little more just 'cause they're elite athletes, but you know, they just, you know, Michael Vick texted me yesterday and just said, man, everything we worked on the school's going great. A couple more ways. I can get shots lower here, but these two drills you gave me, I gotta keep doing one with my putter, one with my wedge. And it's just like he's all fired up a few weeks after golf school to keep knocking. He's an eight handicap. He wants to get down to a two or three.
Speaker 6:That's awesome. Um, so like, I, like I know the guys from True Links wear and they're all from that same area, like tr uh, like the Tacoma area. I know they do a lot of stuff in like , you know those guys,
Speaker 7:I know a little bit of them . Ryan Moore's from kind of my hometown out there and Ryan. Yeah. Is that the one company? I think Ryan's involved with the shoes, but yeah,
Speaker 6:Ryan and, and his brother Jason.
Speaker 7:It's just a funny area in the context that, you know, I've been all over the country. I've been all over the world. It might be the most passionate golf place in the world, meaning it could be 42 and rainy outside and the golf course is full. And , uh, my lesson schedule might be fuller out in Chambers Bay than it is in perfect weather in Florida. It's just people are really golf nuts, serious, passionate golfers out in the Northwest, which is not the perception around the country. And there's been a lot of elite tour players that have come out of that area. And Andrew Putnam's on a on nice run the last several years. Ryan Morris had a great career. One of my students, Joe Highsmith, you don't probably know the name, but it'll be a rookie on tour this year. He finished 18th on Korn Ferry. You're gonna hear a lot about Joe. This is one of the most talented golfers I've ever come across with. And they're all from Tacoma, Washington. I mean, of all places. Why is there so many players from there? And it's just been a fun to be a small part of that.
Speaker 6:It's weird too, like I'm like , I'm an outsider, right? And like I went, I was at the Waste Management one year and the guys from Tru Links were like, Ryan was playing in the ProAm day. And so I was texting somebody on his , I can't remember what , on his team, they're like, Hey, do you want to come walk with us in the ropes? And I'm like, I , I was like wearing suit and I was wearing like, oh my boss's crap. I was not planning on doing that, but I was like walking and the , I was walking and it was him and Ches Revy and I went to high school with Chaz , like, and his dad was like my boss, like my very first boss. His dad was an airline pilot. And when I got outta college, I went and worked for the airlines and like, his dad was like one of my bosses. It was crazy. He actually told me to quit my job, so he told me to do , he told me to quit my job and become a pilot, which I did. Um, so it's like, and I remember him telling me all this stuff, like, oh yeah, Che made it the masters , you know, as a , a ProAm. And I was like, what, what's , that's crazy. But um, it was so weird like walking it. But it was interesting because I , um, Jordan Spieth was behind us and I think his caddy is from the same area too, right?
Speaker 7:Mic Michael Greer is from the area. Yeah.
Speaker 6:And they all freaking know each other. Like they all like , like it was , it was like the smallest world. I was like, dude, I had no idea.
Speaker 7:Yeah , I had one of my, one of my friends kid was in eighth grade and Michael was his, I wanna say science teacher is what he taught math or science.
Speaker 6:Seriously. Oh, that's the , that's right. Isn't , wasn't teacher. And then he was like , wasn't he like instructing like part-time or something?
Speaker 7:No , Jordan . Jordan Jordan played in the 2011 US Junior, which was about 30, 40 minutes from Tacoma. And somehow he got hooked up with Michael as his caddy and he won the tournament. So in 2013, Jordan did one year at University of Texas, went to Turn Pro and he got his team together and basically said, all right , we need to get you a full-time caddy, you know, who , who , who do you wanna look at? And he goes, you know, when I won the US Junior, I had this guy who was a high school teacher, junior high teacher. He was the best caddy I've ever had. So they approached Michael, Michael accepted whatever the offer is and you know, whatever it's been now 10, 12 years later, you
Speaker 6:Know , a lot of wins.
Speaker 7:They've , they've been a phenomenal team with a lot of wins and I'm sure a lot of money as well. But they've been at one of the, one of the true kind of partners in the game of golf from a player caddy standpoint the last 10 years. I
Speaker 6:Didn't know that. It was just cool. Like how it's like you were saying , a small world and it's like from that same region and like everybody's knew each other. They're like, oh yeah, we, we talked together, blah, blah, blah . Like , I'm like, what the heck? I mean , I don't know . I think what you see on tv, there's like a huge backstory behind that, you know , and a lot of these guys came up together. Yeah . Um , or know each other, some other way. So you grew up in Seattle, like were you always good at golf or like, how'd you get into golf? I
Speaker 7:I , I did all the other things. Um , played sports and was good and all of 'em and all that. And my funny story is, is I think I was in eighth grade, it was summer baseball and I'm , uh, at the plate and we were facing a guy that was an equivalent of throwing a hundred miles an hour back then he just long hair and threw gas and all that. And you know, the curve ball was just starting to happen at that time. And as I kind of took my stance and kind of wagged got ready , I happened to cheat and looked down at the catcher who flashed a two sign. I was like, oh, the curve ball's coming. Well that was like a free gift. And over the next three or four pitches I cheated each time, saw the catcher flash the sign and knew it was coming. This guy was throwing either gas or nasty curve balls. Well , about the fourth or fifth pitch here comes the curve ball . So I'm gonna All right , stay in the box, stay in the box, stay in the box. Well somehow between the single being sent to the pitch of the pitcher threw high cheese and about took my head off as I was trying to stay on the plate. And that was the year I got into golf. And I said, you know what? I think I'm gonna , I'm gonna go after golf. And the funny part of the story was the very first goal I did at Chambers Bay, I don't know , 20 10, 20 11, somewhere in that range. That picture was in the first golf school. He did shut up and I started laughing at him 'cause I said, you're the reason I'm here today. And he hadn't , I'd never shared that story. But that led to getting into golf and, you know, did well in junior golf. I was first team a JGL American the first time A-J-A-G-A had their, their listing. And , uh, 1979. And then , uh, that led to getting a scholarship to Ohio State. Went back to school there, eventually got be all American turned pro. And uh, two and a half years later I was on the PGA tour . It's crazy.
Speaker 6:Yeah . So like, did your , did your, like, did your dad play golf or like your mom, like , like did , how did you just choose golf?
Speaker 7:They , they did a little bit, nah , a little bit. But in that eighth grade summer, got a birthday present. My summer's, birthday's in July and it was a little gift card for a series of lessons with a guy, a local pro in the Tacoma area and went out and saw Glen mom , great guy. And, you know, worked with him for a long, long time. And it was the coolest thing if Glen said, do this, the ball did what it was supposed to do. And if Glen said, do that, it worked. And it was just the most fascinating thing that, how, how good he was, how right he was. And the results were there. And I kind of went on the acceleration
Speaker 6:Approach . You like fell , love it . Like once you actually saw it, right? When you saw it working and you actually hitting the ball pretty far, you're like , oh wait a minute, this is actually pretty fun.
Speaker 7:It's , it's , it's ironic for what I'm doing now. But back then it was just like, okay, hey, this guy's telling me to do this. Listen to what he's saying. It works. And you know, my parents really didn't play, but they were certainly supportive and gave us all great opportunities to pursue our dreams. And next thing you know, I'm back at Ohio State and next thing I know, I'm, I played the Asian tour for a couple years and then I got my PGA tour card and I did that for, I did professionally golf for nine years, kind of all over the world and all, you know, three years on the PGA tour.
Speaker 6:So how'd you, why'd you choose Ohio State? Like how did they find you?
Speaker 7:Well,
Speaker 6:I was Did you win that tournament?
Speaker 7:Well, I was first team junior All American that year. So I didn't win technically any tournaments. But I , you know, I got to the quarterfinals of us junior and top 10 finishes and it seems like every junior event I played, so coaches came out and saw me play. And you know , it's still funny because back then from a recruiting standpoint, the phone would ring and , you know, all right , it's Ohio State coach calling first. You couldn't believe it. And then it was the Texas coaches calling and North Carolina coaches calling. So I I , I had some really nice choices to make and I , I look back and wonder, 'cause Texas was probably my next option, but I visited University of North Carolina, you know, university of Miami , uh, university of , what
Speaker 6:Was
Speaker 7:That? This was 1979. Wow. So at the time I chose Ohio State, you know, hey , big tradition, Jack Nicholas , all those kind of things. They had some really good players there. Joey Sindelar at the time, John Cook, which you'll hear about later in the story. Uh, John Cook was the reigning us amateur champion there . And um, I played the Ohio State course before. It's phenomenal. The facilities were phenomenal. And I thought, you know what, John Cook will be a senior my freshman year. What better way to learn from the best player in collegiate, amateur golf to be around John for year . Joey Ciara was the year behind him. So I was gonna get two years with Joey, and I just felt like that was the best place for me to pursue my dreams. And um, unfortunately two days before school started was the final of the US amateur. And John, John went to defend his title and lost a Marco . Om well, John turned pro the next day. So all this great plans kinda went out the windows John left school. But what the cool thing that happened is late in that spring, Ohio State had won the ncaa, the first Northern school and long, long time to have won the national title. So I came in, we were defending champions, and with John having left, I got to mostly play Fifth Man for most of the year. But if John was there, I certainly wouldn't have done that. So yeah,
Speaker 6:You got a lot , you got a lot of reps, right, right . You gotta play.
Speaker 7:And then we hosted the NCAA that year. So we were defending champions on our home golf course, and we were three-way tied for the league going into the final round. And it was Ohio State. Columbus is just nuts for sports and to have Oh yeah . ncaa. ncaa . And it was the first year the NCAA's ever televised. I was in the next to last group playing with Bob T and I mean, it was one more nervous situations I ever felt myself in.
Speaker 6:So How'd you do?
Speaker 7:I'll say I, and we did not have a good final round. We , uh, we uh, we allowed Oklahoma State to win
Speaker 6:It's golf. It's ba like baseball. It's , that's how it goes sometimes. Um , that's
Speaker 7:Great. Great learning opportunity.
Speaker 6:Well, so Ohio State man, like, that's like a tradition of like every sport. I mean
Speaker 7:The, now now it's the Ohio State.
Speaker 6:Oh yeah, yeah . I know . I went, I went to Purdue. Oh , cool . So like, you guys kicked our like every freaking year in football, like every year. And there'd be a ton of people there from Ohio, like half the field's , Ohio State fans. And then, but we got , but then the years I was there is when Drew Brees like, oh wow , he was a freshman and then he started and we started winning. And I was like, holy crap, this is what it's to be outta college. You started winning stuff. Like it was awesome. Um, I, I don't have any problems with Ohio State. My of my good friends, Ohio State guy. And , uh, he always goes back every year to go football games, even still from Arizona. Um, but what happened this weekend?
Speaker 7:I mean, nothing you can say is that Well, I , the only thing, the
Speaker 6:Only game that matters all season pretty much, right?
Speaker 7:<laugh> . Yeah. The only thing that matters and, you know, give a , give a shout out . But the Michigan quarterback just had more experience than the Ohio State quarterback. Yeah . And he didn't, he didn't make a mistake. And unfortunately the Ohio State guy threw an interception in the first quarter. That was probably a difference in the game. And I'd like to see a ,
Speaker 6:I love , I love watching Big 10 football though, man. Like honestly, I would rather watch Big 10 football than
Speaker 7:Anything. Well get get ready. 'cause it's next year, it's no longer, it's still the Big 10, but it's not really the big 10. I , I happen to see the schedules come out next year and it's just, it doesn't even look right anymore.
Speaker 6:Like, what is it?
Speaker 7:Well, I just happen to look at Washington schedule for 2024 and they open with Northwestern at home, then they go at Rutgers, come back to Michigan at home, then they go at Iowa and it just, it's this back and forth homing away the whole year. And then they're ,
Speaker 6:It's changed so much, man, the last five years, 10 years. Like before it used to be like, this is the PAC 12 or the PAC 10 or whatever it was, and this is the big 10. Everyone had their conference and like you were loyal to your conference. Yeah . And then the bowl game would be like, that conference was this conference, the two best teams or whatever. And now it's just like, I don't even , I don't even know who's in what conference anymore to be quite honest. Like
Speaker 7:Yeah . The , the problem's gonna eventually be though that, you know, you've got Ohio State, Michigan 11 and oh , you've got Georgia and other teams, SEC 11 and oh , when you have the Texas and Oklahomas coming into the SEC , you've now got Washington, Oregon, U-S-C-U-C-A going into the , in the Big 10. Nobody's gonna go 11 and oh or 12 and oh anymore . You just, there's just too much competition gonna happen. So you go, you go 10 and two in your conference right now, that might be like the winning team 'cause there's just too much talent and depth going on across the board. But I don't know , we'll see.
Speaker 6:That's crazy. So, okay, so you graduated from the Ohio State, correct ? I wanna make sure I say that correctly. Yes. Um , I went to, I went to the Purdue University, which is a lot smaller. Um, and what happened then?
Speaker 7:Um, one of the first things I did , uh, Joey Sindelar , who's been a friend forever now, Joey came outta college, didn't get his tour card and he went and played the Asian tour. So one of Joey's recommendation was go play the Asian tour. I didn't know what that meant. I'd never really been outta the country. But , uh, I graduated in January the next year, went and played 10 weeks in Asia and it was phenomenal. Um , like
Speaker 6:Where do you play in Asia on the , on the Asia tour
Speaker 7:Back , back then there was 10 countries in 10 or 11 weeks. So we started in the Philippines and we went to Hong Kong, still remember the whole thing. And we went to Malaysia and then we went to Thailand, then India. It
Speaker 6:Was like awesome , right? Like they'd be
Speaker 7:23 years old . Yeah, each country's different. Each experience was different, each food was different. Each golf course was different. But you know, in hindsight got to play with some of just the cool guys of the world. I mean, in hindsight, I played several rounds with Vij back then, who was just this tall, skinny kid from Fiji hitting a big hook. Well that's not the Vij we know Vij , we know today. He was buffed out and basically played a power cut shot his whole life and you know, hall of fame golfer, which back then you never thought, well that's gonna happen. And to play golf with a bunch of the, the Australians of the world, Ian Baker Finch's, Roger Davis', you know, he went from college right into that environment and to kind of , to not maybe do the mini tour stuff as much to get kind of national, international experience was just fantastic learning, you know, just to be exposed to so many different things .
Speaker 6:The talent level too. The international talent level, right?
Speaker 7:International, I mean, you just , you you just didn't appreciate how much, you know, stereotype, Asian golfer got the ball in the hole. Maybe it wasn't with an American look and swing, but chipping, putting wedging, managing their game, managing how they shot their score was just so positive and such a fantastic learning experience. And you know, if you remember TM Chen who almost won the 85 US Open, I mean he was a guy that was playing full-time back then over in Asia. And last event was always in Japan. You get to play with, you know, some of the top Japanese golfers. Five or six years later I got paired with SE one year in Japan. And so there are things that you just didn't always get to do on the US tour. And I'm almost say in hindsight was a little more fun playing the Asian tour just because, I mean, Hong Kong, it's a cool city and you're out walking around at night and seeing all the different sites and people and all that. And when you would go out to dinner, it'd be like you'd grab three Americans, maybe one Canadian, a British, a Mexican guy, two Asian guys, eight of you or 10 of you'd be at some restaurant all hanging out together. There was no money list, there was no hierarchy of who's doing good or bad. It's just, you're just out guys having , it's like being
Speaker 6:In college again, right? It just like everyone's doing the same thing trying to go to the next level. And you're not in that, you're in a competitive environment, but you're not. Right, right . Like it's equals like not, oh ,
Speaker 7:The PGA tours got such a hierarchy to it that, you know, as a rookie, I didn't, I didn't have the Gus to go up to Tom Watson say, kind of take you out to dinner and pick your brain Asia , you just went out and you were friends with everybody. So there was a little different context of all that.
Speaker 6:So you did a year of that. So you did or in that for sure out you went
Speaker 7:Two , two years. I did two years of an Asian tour and at the end of the second year I got my, I went to Q School and got my tour card finished six at the finals of Q School and 23 or four years old, I'm starting to play on the PGA tour.
Speaker 6:What year was that?
Speaker 7:1986. What
Speaker 6:Was your first tournament?
Speaker 7:Bob Hope . Now it's called the Amex in Palm Springs. But first, first hole I made 2030 footer for birdie. So I braided my first hole on the tour. Shot 69, my opening round and shot and ended up shooting 11 under par for the week. Finished about 40th, but I think I <crosstalk> hey it's,
Speaker 6:That's the ,
Speaker 7:I I tied Freddy, I think I beat Greg Norman by one. Lanny Watkins was right there. I mean I look back and you know, later on and said , wow, pretty good start for your first week right outta the box.
Speaker 6:And you again , people's radars too. I'm like, Hey, who's this guy? Right? You're not like beeping the pack.
Speaker 7:I got bombard, I pulled into Phoenix in the parking lot the next week and man just pulled in and you could see about 25 caddies go . That's mog . He played good last week and I'm driving the car in the park and 25 guys are running at me all wanting to get a bag that week.
Speaker 6:Such a different, is it a diff It was a different time, wasn't it, than it is now.
Speaker 7:Well , I mean, a hundred percent yes. It was just <laugh> , it was so much more lower scale back then than it is today.
Speaker 6:And the money, right? The but the pots, the the , the money is like crazy high compared to what it was back then.
Speaker 7:Well I , I got two grand for my 40th place finish that . I don't , I don't know what's that gonna be worth today. Probably 25 grand or something like that.
Speaker 6:So then what, what did you, did you play this the tour the whole season then? That whole first week .
Speaker 7:So I played , played the tour the whole year and first month was not bad. I played get the Bob Hope and a couple weeks later at Troy Pines I was in the next to last group playing with Zinger and , uh, zinger Birdie, the ninth hole. And I was three behind him with nine to play and
Speaker 6:Got a chance,
Speaker 7:Had a chance, was a little out of my element. Didn't shut 38 or nine on the back nine. So I finished about 20th, but phenomenal learning. And back then you didn't have like a Korn Ferry tour where you could, you could learn as you go kind of on the, on the road traveling and week to week to week to week. And I basically burned myself out, played too much, didn't know how to use my time very well and really didn't have a very good year.
Speaker 6:It's stressful, isn't it too? 'cause you're trying to like, I mean, were you, when you're on the , when you're back then, I don't know how , I know it's different now, but like did you have to pay your entries or does , did you have , like how did that work back then? I have no idea. Back ,
Speaker 7:Back then there was a hundred dollars entry fee for the tour. You know , to play an event, you had to show up, write a check, enter, you know , give you a goodie bag, et cetera. Today you don't have an entry fee anymore. Champions tour does, but um , regular tour, there's no entry fee at all.
Speaker 6:So then, and then how'd you get around? You fly over or did you have to drive a lot? 'cause you weren't making all that much money?
Speaker 7:Well , you , you
Speaker 6:Whatever. Some ,
Speaker 7:Some weeks you flew, some weeks you drive. You , you try to draw a balance between, you gotta make the cut, you know? Thankfully I had other sponsors that were helping things out behind the scenes. But every week is different. I mean, you , you somewhat have to balance that, wow , it's too far to drive and I need to fly so I'm not exhausted. But you know, sometimes it's just too expensive to fly.
Speaker 6:Yeah , I can't afford it. I'm always driving . Right. So then , um, when, like, how, how many years did you play on the tour? What
Speaker 7:Year? So I lost, I lost my card that first year and just missed getting it back. So I went back and did the Asian tour thing the next year and, and I think I finished 25th or something, the Asian tour came back, went to Q School that next fall and Requalified for the PGA tour. So now I'm back on the tour again. I think I've learned all my mistakes, learned all the things I didn't do very well. I'm ready to rock and roll. And I started out, missed every cut for the first three months and wasn't very close and took some time off, didn't get into some tournaments, made a whole lot of change, et cetera , et cetera. A longer story than this. But I came back and finished second the very next week.
Speaker 6:What did you change?
Speaker 7:<laugh>? Everything . Sure . Everything.
Speaker 6:Oh that much you did that much <laugh>.
Speaker 7:It was a lot of , a lot of change went on and uh , you know, not just the only on the golf side because when you talk about stress, so much of the stress and playing the tour is self-induced stress. I mean, humbly said, golf is just a game. It is a game of get the ball from point A to point B, but all of a sudden when you're making it life and death and all of a sudden this is bigger than that, the smallest flaw on your technique, it's crazy exposed. And the separation on tour, even as we watch it more so today, the separation is much more physical, much more mental than it's physical. Everybody on tour, even back then, still a really good player. I mean they're almost great today, but back then everybody was still a really good player. And the separation is much more on how people think than how it is in their technical side. And that was really what I was fighting the most was more the , the mental side of putting self-induced stress, pressure and golf is such a big thing. And there's just so many things that have helped me tremendously now as a teacher from the mistakes I made not understanding it 24, 5, 6, 7 years old, perspective on what's important, what's not important, what should I be focused on, what , what works, what doesn't work. And I , uh, I would love to have had a conversation with myself today Back, back then. Yeah.
Speaker 6:You needed , you needed you back then, right? Yeah . Somebody like you to be like, look dude, this is how it is. You know,
Speaker 7:There really were, there was very little coaching going on back then. It just, nobody's really a coach back in the day. And it wasn't, you know, one of my mentors, Ken still Kenny played on the Ryder Cup team one , three times on tour. He is from Tacoma, Washington. And I don't know how many phone calls I wore Kenny's ear out, just trying to get as much advice as I could just 'cause Kenny had been there, you know, long time before.
Speaker 6:'cause nobody understands, right? You can't, like there's no , you don't have an equal that'd be like, they would understand what you're going through unless like you just don't. No, I mean, unless
Speaker 7:You know, it's, it's so, so easy to say, well just , just let the puck go. Come on, just relax and hit it . I mean, whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Intellectually that's the correct answer. But it's hard to just let it go, you know, Hey, if I can, if I can do this with my hand or if I can think this thought, I can help it go in better. And it's a very fine line to draw between how much thought is too much thought, how much is getting in your way versus being productive. And I've learned so much in the whatever, 30 years since I've been off the tour, that I , it's something that's really made it easy-ish to help other students and other younger players going through their careers trying to get them off the ground just because I know exactly what they're feeling. I know what the, I know what kind of the danger signs are and , and really some of the ways you have to fix 'em .
Speaker 6:I mean, which you've , which you've done amazing in your teaching career. All the people you've helped and what they've done. I mean, it just shows you that like had you had you, who knows what would've happened, right? Something that , that kind of skill level and understanding and technical skill too.
Speaker 7:Well I'm very fortunate that my background in becoming a top teacher was rooted in playing. It's really not maybe the typical background . You
Speaker 6:Earned it. Yeah. You earned your stripes, right? Yes . It wasn't like you just started teaching at some plays and that was it.
Speaker 7:Right. And you know , I was very fortunate. I had some fantastic mentors over the year and David Ledbetter and Mike Adams have probably been my two biggest mentors that have allowed me to kind of learn underneath them and kind shaped my philosophy and what I think is really important. But to have that <laugh> the difficult training from kind of getting beat up on the PGA tour to what works, what should work, what are the keys, and blend that with some really good technical information that's just been a very valuable bonus enhancer for my career teaching wise .
Speaker 6:So then when you came back and won it or got in second, you're like, oh wait a minute, this is what I was missing. So then how long did you continue playing on tour after that? And how'd you do?
Speaker 7:Um, you know, I finished out that year and, and at the very end of the year just missed keeping my tour cards . So , uh, same thing. Had to go back to Q School , um, didn't qualify again. Oh yeah, yeah. Q School is that we could do, you could do an year long topic on Q School . That's how crazy this is. Um,
Speaker 6:Is it the same now or is it different now?
Speaker 7:Well, up until right at the moment, it's been different for about the last 10 years and there really has not been a Q School to get on the tour, but , uh, in about two weeks the Korn Ferry tour has the finals of Q School , but the top five finishers get their PGA tour card for next year. So I have two Korn Ferry students that, you know, one had a very solid year, just missed getting his card. One guy, really good player, they're in the finals. Well, if they don't finish top five, it doesn't really matter. They're, they're playing Korn Ferry next year, but if they go top five, they're going directly to the PGA tour.
Speaker 6:That's awesome.
Speaker 7:So Mike, to kind of finish where you were going with the question, three consecutive years either lost by one or lost in a playoff into the finals of Q School , therefore, I mean it's, it's, it's
Speaker 6:That one . They're all over again. But ,
Speaker 7:But imagine a plumber having to go to Plumber Q School and you know, X amount of people try and only this percentage get through it . That's, that's what Q School is, you know, typically two, three , 4,000 people send their entry fee in and try and out of it used to be about 25 to 50 people would get their tour card. Now it's much more of a regret qualifying through the KO freight tour. But there is a system where you now they've gone back to a little bit of potential to play the PGA tour. And after I did three straight years of either missing by one stroke or, or in a playoff, Ledbetter called me and said, Hey, would you ever want to consider teaching with me? Love to have you on on our team. You know, and deep down, I didn't wanna do that. I wanted to keep playing. I'm so close, I'm so close. But yeah , it was just kind of from a family standpoint and a let me get my life balance . Let me see what David suggested. How
Speaker 6:Old were you? Like 30 at that time then
Speaker 7:I'm gonna say 31.
Speaker 6:And it's like you had a , you had a , you probably started in your family and you're kind of like ,
Speaker 7:I think number child number two is on the way, if I remember about
Speaker 6:That timeframe . And it was just , yeah , I know it's the age too. It's like, it's time to grow up, right ? Like we're like, I had that conversation too myself. Oh , I was, I was 30, I went to law school, you know, I was like, all right , I gotta get a job. Like
Speaker 7:Yep , yep .
Speaker 6:So it's like, yeah, I know, I get it. And
Speaker 7:It was , it was a very difficult first year because you had to be a gopher, which means you got there at five 30 or six and did all the range stuff to get ready for all the teachers and David to do their things. And then you had to wait throughout the whole day and then clean everything up again. And in between you were training and taking notes and going through all kind of training stuff. But you know, for a year to two years in hindsight it was like kind of like watching Bill Gates on a computer. I mean David was the man and David's ability to diagnose golf swings and use and you know, kind of early technology, just really TV's computers back then was, was brilliant to watch and feel very privileged to kind of learned underneath someone that was so good at what he did. And it's mostly the foundation where I'm at today is watching how David analyzed golf swings and showed us here's what's going on, here's why it's happening. And that's to me, what's made David one of your lead all-time teachers, his ability to , to teach the why not, hey, your head's moving, hey, you're coming over the top. Ah , that's easy for everybody to see, but why is that happening? And really the biggest benefit I had from David being my coach for a very long time while on tour and then working four underneath him for about 10 more years. I'm really good at diagnosing why things happen, you know? And that's if you don't, if you don't fix the root of the problem, you're just putting band-aids on it. So you always want to get to the root of why is this happening? And you know, you'll always get results might not happen instantaneously, but if you nip away at the root cause of your problems, you're gonna become a better golfer.
Speaker 6:Yeah. You're , you're, you're finding a solution to the root core, not a peripheral like, oh I can fix this by doing this other thing. It's like, no, like what's the problem?
Speaker 7:Yep .
Speaker 6:So then in other words, like he was mentoring you, right? Like you were men being mentored for Yeah.
Speaker 7:But
Speaker 6:In that way by seeing it osmosis .
Speaker 7:Yeah , he was, but I mean he was running the business at the same time course . So a lot of it was all kind of like <laugh> life was going really fast and you're sitting there watching David on a computer or TV screen dissecting golf swings. And by the end of year two I was helping him with his golf schools . I think by year three I was running his golf schools with him. And that's when it really got good because guys were paying a lot of money. David was at just the top of everyone's list back then. And I'm in the video room taking notes for each student watching. I said, it's like watching Bill Gates on a computer, watch Dave dissect a swing and you know, having no clue, you're
Speaker 6:Learn , you're trying to see the same things now it's
Speaker 7:In front of you. Yeah. All of a sudden he's opening my eyes to, okay, wow, that club face is really open. I didn't even know what that meant. Or Wow, it's really off plane or you know, you're reasoning your head's moving 'cause your grip is in your palm.
Speaker 6:It's not just words not right , just words . It's like, like you see. Yeah.
Speaker 7:So it really was a challenging but fun time to kind of get, you know, in the middle of him running a business, we're all learning and becoming better teachers. And that first year David hired, I wanna say maybe six to eight to 10 teachers to put in places . He put his academies in all the place. And you know, of the six people in Orlando, I wanna say four of four of us, six became top a hundred teachers within, I don't know, not not that much time. And that's just, David did a great job picking people and you know, guys were really good at what they did and you know, still friends today with it.
Speaker 6:So then if you always lived in Orlando, then outside of that or
Speaker 7:Moving around , so in the late, in the late eighties trying to play the tour from Tacoma , Washington was not much of an option. I mean there were no nonstop flights like you know, Seattle because of Microsoft and Amazon, all the big companies there. You can kind of go nonstop anywhere in the US pretty much now. But back then I remember Microsoft
Speaker 6:Wasn't even anything. There was nothing there . No ,
Speaker 7:No, I missed the cut when you're in Boston, I was just so frustrated, so mad . I'm like, I'm going home. Well I couldn't get out Friday night, so I had to fly out Saturday morning and the next week was in Milwaukee. Well I had to leave Saturday morning and to get to Milwaukee to play a practice and I had to leave Monday morning and it was like $1,800 to go from Boston to Seattle to Milwaukee just to be home for, I don't know, a day and a half . And with Ledbetter kind of being my coach in Orlando, we also had multiple friends in Orlando, a lot of , lot Ohio State friends. You know what, we're getting an apartment in Orlando. So 32 years later or something, you know, our kids were born in Orlando and, and I like Orlando . Our , our , yeah , all our roots are in here and it's been fantastic.
Speaker 6:There's a lot of really good schools there too. Like golf schools, like a lot yours .
Speaker 7:There are a lot of schools . There are a lot of schools here.
Speaker 6:Um, so then like when did, like how long did you work for Ledbetter than 10 years?
Speaker 7:So I worked for David W right , right at 10 years. And in 2002 I had an opportunity to spin off and start my own academy at a course five minutes from my house at a Nicholas facility. And that turned out to be a brilliant move as well. Um , I stayed there for just under 10 years and then I left that private club to join the Waldorf Astoria , which is a five star resort kind of right in the,
Speaker 6:I've
Speaker 7:Been there edger in the heart .
Speaker 6:I
Speaker 7:Believe it . Nice. It's Phenomen , it's really nice five star resort right in on Disney.
Speaker 6:Really nice. Like that's like really nice. I went , they had a, I was at a thing like Fuji Kura had a thing at the Range, like during PGA show or it was the back part of the range or something. I don't know where it was, was private. I had drive down like some like tree road forever and then I'm like, it was at the end, that's all I remember. It was a long walk. Yeah ,
Speaker 7:That wouldn't, that wouldn't be the Waldorf. But there's a couple of places I can think it might've been. But you know, PG shows in Orlando in late January, so they do all kinds of extra things. I
Speaker 6:Could've sworn it was at Waldorf, I could sworn I might , I don't know . I remember walking down a path to go this , it wast even a ranger. I don't even know what it was. It was something, it was um, so then you've been to , you've been there this whole time then? Is that?
Speaker 7:I've been, I've been there for 11 , 12 years now at the Waldorf and one of my kind of add-on things in 2009, ye Yang was one of my students and Ye beat Tiger in the PGA kind of the first guy to ever take Tiger down from Yeah,
Speaker 6:I thought you were , I remember that
Speaker 7:Being behind him and you know, won a major, I think first Asian male to ever won a major. And you know, a lot of opportunities kind of spun off of that because uh , that, that accelerated the Chambers Bay having an academy of Chambers Bay. We were already talking before then , but that kind of accelerated that. Uh, I now have an academy in Honolulu and then I've had one in Korea for almost at the same time. So there's a , there's a lot of fun going on. So how many ,
Speaker 6:How many you have right now?
Speaker 7:There's five Toronto , Toronto's the other one. Um , I've been spending a lot of time in Toronto for the last 25 years. Um, made some, some of my best friends in life were up in Canada and uh, one of my really good friends , uh, did very, very well. And he built his own private club just north of Toronto. And thankfully , uh, he continues to have me up there every year, become friends with all the members. And I kind of Toronto and north of Ontario was just one of the most prettiest places in the summer of all time.
Speaker 6:That's pretty up there. Yeah , I've been , I've been there before. Um, my family lives in, I think that town, like just east of Toronto. Uh , it's a big city. I can't think of the name of it.
Speaker 7:Um , east of Toronto now it's going up the river. Not many people live
Speaker 6:Or not east, it's west. I like to , it's like
Speaker 7:West is back towards Buffalo. Well, east is technically towards Buffalo. It's kind of hooked down around the corner.
Speaker 6:Crap. Yeah, I can't remember the name of it . I was just there for a wedding like a couple years ago.
Speaker 7:West , west , west is technically London and then Hamilton is west, which is where
Speaker 6:Hamilton, that's where they live. They live in Hamilton. Is that west?
Speaker 7:Technically it's West. Uh , that's where the Canadian open will be this year. Hamilton Country Club . Oh really?
Speaker 6:I
Speaker 7:Didn't know that. That might be my favorite course in , in Canada. It's, it's usually the top five. Yeah, well it's just tough there . Old school, everything a golf course should be for being a challenge and , and fun at the same time.
Speaker 6:So you have, and are you traveling around all the academies or how does that work?
Speaker 7:Travel to a lot of academies. I do a lot of outings for companies. I've got several tour students, so there ends up being a lot of travel. I mean more heavily in the summer than anything else, but
Speaker 6:It's slowing down right now 'cause of winter or not really. 'cause all the ies are are taking off
Speaker 7:Now , but now , now it goes the other way. So now these people you've seen all throughout the summertime are going it's 30 degrees and starting to snow. It's like , I'm going to Florida, you know, where's Brian gonna be? I gotta go find him wherever he is at. And kind of , it makes for being in good weather for most of the year for what I'm doing.
Speaker 6:So like when, like, I guess what's, what's the biggest way for people to like find you? Like do they just like, mostly just tour players want to go with you? I know you're not a Champions tour too, right? You do that. Yeah, I've ,
Speaker 7:I've played nine championship events over the last maybe six years or so, but I would love to do more of it status wise . I've gotta , I've gotta do my hard work to get into the events. Um, but you know, at Moog Academy, that's my social media stuff. I'm doing videos every day. Uh , my son now kind of, he does, he's doing other fun stuff. He's not working for us anymore, but I've hired him to do all my social media. I'd love making videos and giving kind of free content out and watch watching people enjoy their game that way. My email's brian@mogacademy.com . Reach out, plug in the schedule. I'll try to , I'll try to make a spot for you . It's ,
Speaker 6:Yeah , you're busy though. You're a busy man. Like you got a lot going on. You've all like, I mean, how many tour players are you helping right now, would you say?
Speaker 7:Well , my cool statement is since 2001 I've had 30 wins by students on the P-G-R-L-P-G tour. That kind of includes Korn Ferry and , and Champions Tour. But I've had 30 wins and two majors by students. So when you ask how many professionals I'm teaching, there's a lot. Technically it's, it's the one guy who's gonna be on the PGA tour in January and a couple of guys on Korn Ferry, but there's, I don't know , couldn't even tell how many more there are playing various mini tours are going overseas or trying to go through Q School and you know, some of 'em are gonna make it. I also have a ton of kids in college right now that are elite D one players. I mean one , one kid's at Duke, couple big 10 players , uh, west Coast players. I mean , I've got one kid that slipped through the cracks, he kind of went in the transfer portal of his first year, really good player. And no one's, no one's signed him yet. They need to, they need to sign him .
Speaker 6:Really. So
Speaker 7:That's , that's, that's
Speaker 6:The hard part, right? They get signed or let people see you?
Speaker 7:Well, one of the dirty secrets that's gone on is Covid really wrecked havoc, at least in the golf world from a standpoint that the , um, the scholarships all got extended. So if you're on a , you know, hypothetically if you're, if you're gonna be finished in 2021, that scholarship or that spot on the team got extended to 2022. So now the coaches are trying to recruit incoming kids. Well at the same time having to extend kids on the program, you know, and one of the tough challenges is both financially and emotionally is , is , you know , you don't want more than about eight, nine, maybe 10 kids on the team. So you've gotta balance all these things out. So a lot of kids, not just a couple of my students, but a lot of kids have gone through some really tough stuff because there's no room, you know, scholarships are promised now they've gotta extend 'em on all that. And , uh, I think next year is the first year you'll kind of have non covid impact on co
Speaker 6:Be cleaned up. Yeah, certainly . It's certainly
Speaker 7:Like be cleaned up. It's nobody's fault. It's just, that's just the byproduct of what happened from all of that. So
Speaker 6:All the delays,
Speaker 7:All the delays really, I don't know that it happened in the other sports, but golf, it's really
Speaker 6:Hurt with,
Speaker 7:I had one very elite junior player that I think could have played at and he was, he was recruited by the Stanfords and some of the top five programs out there, but he finally ran into a wall that the schools just didn't have room to be adding players. And he, he , he's not a deal school . So what
Speaker 6:Do they do in that situation? Like, do they have to go to junior college or they just, what do they , what do they do ? I have no idea. What
Speaker 7:Do players do ? This , this particular kid took, you know, a lower offer. It's still a D one school, but his talent level is much higher than where he is at. And you know, it is what it is. It's , you know, he is nothing you can do about it. And you know, so often when you hear on the p PGA tour just play better. I mean that's, that's the antidote here is, you know, whether it's this kid or somebody else, you play better, you know, your other teams will find , find you other opportunities will, will , will happen. So this kid will be fine. He is , he's a stud, he's gonna be a bigger stud and , uh, just has to work through all the
Speaker 6:Processes. How , how did Ye Yang find you? Was that from your school at Chambers Bay or no ?
Speaker 7:No . Um, there's a LPJ player, me and Kim Kimmy , uh, Kimmy's about five one. And we worked from , I don't know , maybe 2002 through about 2008. And Kimmy hit the ball at best about two 20 off the tee. She had a heart that was just ginormous. She would take down, you know, golfers hitting the ball. Uh , uh, she won the biggest ladies tournament at the time. I don't remember what year it was. Oh five maybe , uh, largest. It was $2 million purse for the ladies. And she's paired with Laura Davies the first two days. And Laura was truly out hitting her by a hundred yards. And Kimmy would take her five wood or seven wood or nine wood and hit it to five or 10 feet repeatedly. And by late, late on Friday's round, Lord Davies finally just threw her hands up there. How are you doing this? How are you? I'm having a wedge. The green . I can't get my wedge inside your five wood Kimmy would win the tournament. And I don't know , that was maybe her fourth or fifth win when we worked together. And in 2008, her caddy, Jason basically got hired away by Ye to come onto the PGA tour as a rookie. And two months into the season, I get a phone call from Jason that said, Ye's, never had an American coach. He's never really had a coach at all. You know, we'd be interested in meeting with him. And at the time, joke means little bit in cran . I didn't have that. And ye's, English wasn't very good either. And over the next year and a half, it was some of the best coaching I've ever done because we couldn't communicate verbiage wise . Uh, he had an agent that was awesome and when he was around, he was great at translating. But basically if I said, you know, hey, do do this with the club, I would have to mimic doing it. And then, you know, alright , your turn, you do it, you know, show him video. No, Joah means good. No joah , no joah , joah . So you'd learn these little words and then you'd mimic doing it. And in 2008, ye he made about 400,000 for the year. And if I remember right, he made about 20 cuts out of about 28 events. I made a lot of cuts. Amazing . But he never really had , never really had to get finished . Well, he
Speaker 6:Didn't get , he didn't get the money though, right? He made the cut, but he didn't quite
Speaker 7:Make the money . He stood super, super erected with a very strong grip, rolled it inside with a shut face. So in the middle of his rookie year on tour, with his permission, we changed his grip to a neutral grip. We got his posture into more athletic posture. We got his swing plane for him, which felt much more upright. His clubface from close to square , he's
Speaker 6:Like , what the hell is this <laugh>?
Speaker 7:And, and he, he truly worked his butt off. He really did a phenomenal job of making changes. And I felt bad because, you know, I , he can't communicate what he's feeling. I can't communicate what I'm trying to see happen. And you know, I went out to a lot of tournaments that year and you know, he is finishing 36th and 44th and 29th, you know, probably did okay financially to break even or something, but you know, it looks like he's going nowhere. Well, he went back to Q School on the final whole Q School. He made a six foot putter. We're not having this conversation right now. So I met him out on the West coast in early January. We had one week at Toy Pines where we kind of kept doing things. Next week we're up at Pebble Beach on Monday on the practice day. And we had one of those epiphany, I found it moments , uh, his caddy and I and and Hawaii were all standing there and we all kinda looked at each other, like, all this work we've been doing for almost a year, just clicked in like everything. You could just see all the work
Speaker 6:He had done , all the pieces went dinging, ding , ding , like fell into place . It dinging , ding , ding , ding . Yeah , yeah . Like a puzzle . It's all like, all collected right there. You're like, that's right.
Speaker 7:So he finished about 20th that week, went down the next week and finished 20th at LA or wherever. It was
Speaker 6:A lot to go down that much like in two weeks to like go from 40 to 20,
Speaker 7:You know ? Well he had , he had something like back-to-back 20th place finishes, nothing crazy special but not bad. So the next week was , uh, Honda PJ National. And late Tuesday afternoon, same thing. It's the caddy, the player caddy y and me we're walking around the back nine and I remember having this weird vibe like it's clicking everything we've been working on. It's, it's there. And if I said, Hey, six iron, you know, back right pin hit the fade, he did it. Driver low , drop the left side. He did it. It was just kind of this like, wow, he's not a rookie in the , because he was like 35 years old. He , he was, he is a veteran international player. But I said, all these changes are kicking in . He's gonna go win when the next four or five events. Meaning like, you know, right before the masters or something. Well after Friday he took the lead. After Saturday he had a one shot lead. This is a cool story. I love it. I agree . I , I had come back to Orlando by then and I debated about driving back down Sunday morning to be with him for the final round. And I thought, you know what, we've put everything in place. We don't need to make this bigger than it is . Let's just trust him to do what's right. So he is final round tee time, twelve forty five, twelve thirty five. My phone rings and I look down, it says Y Ynk . And I'm thinking like, there's gotta be a mistake here . Oh
Speaker 6:Crap, he's calling. He is not good <laugh> .
Speaker 7:And and it was, it was his agent Michael, on the phone. He goes, he goes, if , if you've been to PJ National, it's got a driving range that's who knows 500 yards wide by 400 yards long. I mean, it's just this phenomenal huge field. And his exact words were why he is so nervous he couldn't sleep at all last night and he can't hit the ball, he can't find the range right now. You got anything for him, you know? And as a coach, it was like the ultimate on the spot moment. Like, what are you gonna say? What, what, what can you say? And , and Michael was good 'cause he could translate everything. And I said, I said, Michael, he's on the tee . He goes, I know he just left the putting green. Hand me the phone. He said, call Brian said if he's got any last minute help for me. So I gave him an answer. And as I hung up the phone, I remember the , I remember going, that was the stupidest thing you could have told him that was so dumb. So all you can do is watch the internet until it came on live on, on NBC. Well, he birdie three of the first five holes, goes to a four shot lead from one to a four shot lead. And he finally comes to the 18th hole with a two, two and a half foot putt to win the tournament by one and makes it, and he runs around the green high fiving all the fans was cool. And then Roger Mamby walks up and sticks a mic in his face and says, your first win in America, how, how did this happen? I was so nervous last night I couldn't sleep. I got to the range this morning and I couldn't even find the range. I couldn't even make contact. I was just so nervous. So I'm walking on the first tee , I called my coach Brian Mogg and rem he , he reminded me to walk, talk, think, swing at the same cadence. So I got on the first hole and I just tried to walk and move in a smooth fashion. I burning three of the first five holes. I can't believe I've won the tournament. And I literally was standing up watching it live the interview, and I, I I virtually fell down because four hours before this I'm going, well , this is the stupidest answer I've ever given anybody. And four hours later you are blabbing it on national tv. What a brilliant answer it was. And it's, it's been a good testimony for me. Just because when you are nervous, don't speed up, don't slow down. It's not just your golf swing, walk , talk , think , swing at the same flow. And here he is, he wins the golf tournament. So that was,
Speaker 6:It's like to remember all those things, right? Instead of thinking all the million , like, like you said earlier, like all the things you to think about, it's like, just think about that thing only like , right .
Speaker 7:So that, that was early in 2009 when that happened and he continued to play solid golf. And I went up for the PGA at , uh, Hazelton that year and it was the same weird vibe we're going down. I was there for the Tuesday and Wednesday practice rounds. He's just striping. And on Tuesday. And uh, funny story, I'll give you the , I'll give you the answer first before I tell you what happened. But , uh, uh, as I'm leaving late Wednesday, I bumped into Brandel Chamblee in the parking lot right next to the golf channel trailer. And Brandel said, Hey, you know, who's your pick this week? Who's playing? Well , I said , well, I just got off the course with ye he's playing about as good as I've ever seen him play it . He'd be somebody that's probably gonna finish in the top 10 or top 20 this week. Brando would later go on to say, I said he was gonna win. I didn't say that. I just said he is gonna finish top, he's playing that good. So he goes into a production meeting and Frank Nello walks in the door and he goes, MOG just predicted why he is gonna come close to winning the tournament this week . Well, 40 minutes before that we're on the 16th hole and you have to walk down this path from 15 down a hill out to 16, which is one of the more iconic holes in all the , in the whole us . It's par four , I don't remember the name of the lake, but you kinda walk into the lake, you then tee off back away from the lake over a river, and then your second shot goes back out to a peninsula in the lake. So it's typically a three wood , six iron type hole , but the wind's how long it can be a driver if it's down when it's a , you know, it's a wedge or something, but why is striped it for Tuesday and Wednesday practice rounds. It's late in the day. It's 4 30, 5 o'clock and not below happens to just come out of nowhere and walk down the path with me. You know, how you doing? How's, why you doing man ? He's doing great. Everything's good. You know, looking forward to a good week with him. Why ? He gets up on the tee with his three, there's plenty of practice running with kj and he cold tops at 20, 30 yards in front of the tee <laugh> . And he turned around to look at me. And as a coach, he kind of cringing like, what was that? He looked at me and just started busting out laughing. 'cause we knew, how's
Speaker 6:You tell your kid's good at something? Oh yeah, my kid's really good at that. And then they , and you're like , uh, I didn't say that.
Speaker 7:So we're kinda laughing about it. Well, unbeknownst this is where Nao goes in there and Brandon goes, mark says why he is gonna come close to winning this week. And Na goes, I just watched him top it 30 yards off the tee. But story , the story he played very well. He was in the final group with Tiger the last round. Very nervous. He never, never even met Tiger at that point. And then he , he , he , he took him down and one, one small. If you want more story here,
Speaker 6:I love the story. No, keep it up. This is awesome.
Speaker 7:I love this flip bar . No , I could do him for hours with stories . So anyway ,
Speaker 6:I want take you to a bar
Speaker 7:<laugh> on , on Wednesday. Uh, I'm in the locker room and I just, you know, I , for whatever reason I happened to read all the, you know, the PGA tour or PG America puts up all the, I don't know ,
Speaker 6:Standings.
Speaker 7:No , but they'll put up like, okay, the T marker's gonna be up on number three, or the tees are gonna be here. They just put up some rules, some whole information. And I just happened to read that on the 14th hole. They were gonna move the tee up on the weekend. The 14th hole's about a 3 80, 3 90 uphill power four. So in the practice round late Wednesday afternoon, right, right before the, the novel story I just told , uh, we come to the 13th hole and y and KJ hit their three woods or whatever from the back tee to laid up shore of the bunker. And I said, Hey guys, if you didn't see the memo, they're gonna move the tee up on the weekend. Why don't we hit one from this tee over here? And I remember they lasered it was three 30 and why he got up there and just nuked a driver kind of landed into the front of the green at one hop went up over the back where the gallery would be and up in a nasty down slope position. We didn't think anything about it. So flash forward to Sunday , uh, ye and tiger are now tied coming to 14. Um , nobody's really even close for , for third place. I don't think so. It's , it's a two man game. Well , we get up on 14 and ye I just watching him swing it . He didn't rip a driver like he did in the practice run . We thought he had to rip it to drive the green. He smoothed it, hit a nice shot and it caught an UPS slope . About 10 yard story of the green between kind of a UPS slope in the bunker on the right center, just off the green. And uh, I think Tiger hit it in the bunker. Why he holds little pit shot
Speaker 6:Shut off .
Speaker 7:No, I mean, in , in hindsight I'd like to think if I hadn't caught the memo and all that, we wouldn't have done that and he wouldn't have made two and potentially wouldn't have won the tournament. But why he dunks his little 15 to 20 yard little pitch shop up the slope. Uh, tiger was clutch and made about a 10 footer for birdie . So it was a one shot lead and it stayed one shot through the next four holes and they came to the 18th hole, really good par four dog leg left. Tiger drove it far enough, right that he was very far from the hole. And while he had this four hybrid in his bag and from TV camera, it looked like he headed over this tree right in front of it . Really wasn't quite that dramatic. But tiger missed the green just off the left edge, one down. Why he hits this hybrid over these trees to about five feet. I mean, just truly one of the great shots in the history of major championship golf.
Speaker 6:The shots in your mind that you remember for the rest of your life, like you can see that shot
Speaker 7:Well mean . And so Tiger basically has to chip in now and he doesn't do it. Why he makes the pot , why he wins by three. And if you remember why he walked behind the green, had a big tailor made bag and he he held it up over his head. Very iconic thing he did after he won that. Remember I remember that first Asian male to win a to win a major and to have a small piece of the help going into what made that happen, Ms . Miss probably been the highlight of my teaching career.
Speaker 6:You feel like you've taught a lot of pe Like how many lessons have you given a lot, right?
Speaker 7:People have tried to, I I I wouldn't know 'cause I I don't really, I help people, I don't add up lessons and all that you want , you wanna hear another cool story to go along with this ? Well ,
Speaker 6:Yeah, I wanna hear a lot of cool stories.
Speaker 7:All right . So , um, that about, oh man, I could tell long stories right now, but I don't care.
Speaker 6:Whatever.
Speaker 7:All right , so we , we got about two or three more tournaments after the PGA back then, and then it went into the FedEx playoffs and uh, we're standing at , at Boston, which I think was the second playoff thing. And uh, I said to, I said something to away and I says , well, you do know you're gonna play Tiger in singles on Sunday in the President's Cup. How do you know that? Because that was the week after the , the FedEx thing. And he , I said, well, Mike, we're happened to play him in singles in finals in Montreal last year. I said two years ago, you're probably gonna get Tiger on Sundays. You better be ready for his, his energy, you know, six, seven weeks from now. Okay. Okay. So FedEx playoffs go on. Um , I don't remember how, why he did, but he know he finished 10th on the money list or points list or whatever it probably was by the end of the year. And sure enough, Sunday night , um, why he had gotten hot. I think he won three points going into Sunday, yet the US was up three and a half points going into Sunday. So if you're Fred Couples, where would you put Tiger? One through 12 with a three and a half point lead. Where would you , where would you plug Tiger in?
Speaker 6:Exactly what you said. He is probably gonna be played like right against him.
Speaker 7:Well, no , but, but Greg Norman, the captain's gotta turn his lineup in. Where's, where's Greg gonna put ye , where's Fred gonna put Tiger?
Speaker 6:I have no idea.
Speaker 7:Well, common sense would be you'd put Tiger maybe one or two or 12, you front load him and oh yeah. Get this thing over with or maybe put him at the back end as a reserve if you need to . Clutch point. Well, if you're Greg Norman, where are you gonna put ye? He's got you three . He's , he's gotten you about three points so far, so
Speaker 6:Probably have
Speaker 7:Somewhere in the front.
Speaker 6:Yeah,
Speaker 7:Well you're not gonna put him in the back 'cause it might be over by then, so you're gonna try not . Oh ,
Speaker 6:That's true, that's true.
Speaker 7:True. So you're probably gonna put him somewhere near the , say the front front part of the , the lineup. Well, guess what, coincidentally happened?
Speaker 6:They way up
Speaker 7:Paired . They both June number eight.
Speaker 6:Oh my God.
Speaker 7:How , how did that happen? What are the odds of that happening? And there I could , the story's actually <crosstalk> . Are you like , are
Speaker 6:You like psychic or something?
Speaker 7:Or what
Speaker 6:Are you psychic <laugh> .
Speaker 7:That was , that was an easy call that, that was gonna somehow actually happen. Tiger wanted a piece of weight to get even. And , and there's there's a funny part , there's a funny part to the whole story. You
Speaker 6:Just knew. You just knew, huh? You knew regardless what was gonna happen. You're like,
Speaker 7:He's one . They were , they were both on the putting green getting ready to go. And I know Tiger didn't want to go first to the t he wanted ye to go first to hear the huge USA and Tiger chance and why wouldn't want to go. So they're both on the putting green. Nobody's going over to the first tee until like literally at the last second and uh, get on the first hole. And you know, Tiger's energy is just, I mean it's inspiring to watch just 'cause that's the the ultimate competitor we all know. Yeah , yeah . I mean it was cool and uh , and I've been friends with Tiger for a long time. He's awesome. He's fantastic. One-on-one and, and all that. But you know, I'm feeling awkward 'cause you know, my guys happen to beat him in in the summertime and now they're competing again. But we get on the first hole and Tiger Snap hooks at par five makes power y hits on the green in two, two putts. He's one up, they tie number two. And uh , and I probably should have said when I got to the range that morning, you could tell why his gas tank was empty. We're leaving for Crea that night, which is where I wanna finish the story with. Uh, we're going to crea as a team after this is over. So third Hawaii knocks it down the middle of four 80 par four Doglegged left through the big redwoods. Tiger blocks it to the right and I happen to be on the right. I go over and look at his ball, the lie's okay. But he is 215, 220 yards from the green. Not a ugly lie in the rough , but not great. Well he's, he's either got a punch under some trees to about 60 yards from the green, or I'm not seeing you can do a lot of maneuver the ball. Well, I get behind him, gall's all around him. Somehow he hits a five iron sky high , 20, 30 yards, right? And hooks it all the way back and gets it on the green. I mean, it was a shot like only he can hit that shot like no one else was strong enough and good enough and tall enough to hit the shot and it was jaw dropping. Impressive. Well why he hits it to the same 30 feet the tiger was, and three buts match went even. And then Tiger eventually won the match, maybe three and two. The match is over. We now go the San F it was out in San Francisco. We go out to the San Francisco airport, we're now gonna get on , uh, airline to fly to Seoul all night flight when you fly that direction. So we wake up at 4:30 AM Tuesday morning in Seoul. And you know, we had business class seats , which was fantastic. We all got some sleep. He he brought his trainer . Yeah, he brought his trainer, he brought his, his um , uh, his caddy. Great guy and, and me , uh, there's , there's a few other people. He had wife and three kids at the time. I mean, we're all there, the agents there, et cetera. When we went to get our bags, I've never had this happen before, but we had a private carousel just for ourselves. I don't know how that worked out, but it did. And it's, it's now quarter to five in the morning. You know, you're , you're bleary-eyed, not feeling good and all that. And I see why you walk over to a suitcase and take out a sport coat. I see the agent walk over to a long box about this big with some clasp on it and a lock on it unclass everything and pulls the Wanamaker trophy out. PJ let , oh my God , PPGA let him bring it to Korea. Now it's now like 10 to five and we come out of the carousel and go around like a corner. And I don't know what it was like to say when the Beatles came to America, but it had to be the equivalent. We came around this corner at five to five in the morning. I know what I felt like. I'm sure he felt the same way. He just got done playing some high level golf. There was, I don't know, 20 or 30, like good morning Korea type cameras and anchormen and people waiting to interview, you know, the, the hero returning home for the first time. And we walked out. If you've ever been to, you've ever been to Seoul, the airport is a literally 50 miles from downtown Seoul. It's one of the toughest places in the world for a traffic standpoint. Well, Hawaii , his family jumped in a car, we all got cars and we had for the whole week it was just crazy treatment because they had special lanes just for us with the police escort, like
Speaker 6:Presidential, like
Speaker 7:Yeah , presidential lane. So where , where it would take you like an hour to go 15 miles. I mean, it took us five minutes and we stayed at the , we stayed at the ,
Speaker 6:I get used to this,
Speaker 7:We stayed at the Palace Hotel and just every day was a treat as he played a tournament over there and you know, it was just the hero returned home to his home country. I mean that's , and to , you know, just to see that up close to watch how he handled. He one point , uh, we had a breakfast one morning, he called the whole team back to his room and it's probably the nicest whole term I've ever been in my life. He pulled the Warner make a trophy out and says, I wanna take a picture with each one of you guys. So I still have that picture framed holding that up with him and, and you know, knowing how to small ,
Speaker 6:It's so cool . It's like, like you're a trusted member, right? Like he tr like, like you're in his, his, I don't know if I say it like his
Speaker 7:His camp camp his camp.
Speaker 6:Yeah. Like you're in his world, like you're like family, right, right . Like you're in that, you pass the barrier and it's like, you know, you've been there for him to help him get to that level. Like it's crazy. Like, it's not like you're just there to watch. You're like , oh, I know somebody. It's like, no, you're part of that, right? Is that the best part about being a coach is when you see your players like Excel and you're like, you feel like you help be part of that.
Speaker 7:I mean, broad answer, yes. It's fantastic when something you have personally seen works and you're able to share it with somebody and then they can do the same thing and see that it works also. So that's, that's probably one of the more rewarding elements of it. And it , again, it sounds cool to tell a guy winning into major and cool stories, but I mean, it happens that , you know, Mrs. Smith at the club championship with an 18 handicap and shooting a great score. I mean, it really doesn't matter, you know, the the glamor of, of who the student is as much as you're just trying to help people get better. And whether that's at the 20 handicap level or at the tour level, it's, it's very, very fun from a people standpoint just to have a role in someone's life to be that kind of moment of encouragement or moment of knowing the right thing to help them with.
Speaker 6:Now you have a course on , uh, performance golf, right ?
Speaker 7:A lot of'em . Yes .
Speaker 6:You have a lot of 'em . How did you like get to know them and how'd you start off with them perform ? Didn't your son do some content too? I could have sworn I saw like some videos and I saw it's
Speaker 7:My nephew,
Speaker 6:I your son, it's somebody the same last name as you. But I was like, who's this ?
Speaker 7:And same first and last name. It's my brother's son. Yeah.
Speaker 6:I was like , I'm assuming he's your son, but I don't wanna say that. Yeah ,
Speaker 7:Yeah , he's my nephew. No , he's lefty. So he is gotten really good at demonstrating , demonstrating things. Right . But , uh, you know, Brookson performance golf reached out to me in 2018 or something and for some reason I'm really good on camera doing video tips and whatnot. I think I was the second coach they contacted and we put together a whole training program with some really in depth kind of meet to the golf swing and and golf in general. Yeah . And it's encompasses all parts of the game. And we've done so many videos now that uh , there's gotta be 500 to a thousand video on there of , of I don't a hundred courses with, you know , different content and all that Brookson performance golf doing unbelievable job of Yeah , they're amazing getting that out there . They really are some of the best in the world at what they do. And I've just had a whole lot of fun getting to know them, being a part of their team and watching what they do to create magic and, and also help help golfers get better.
Speaker 6:Yeah. That's how , and that's how we met. And like I , they, it blows my mind like their , their content's amazing. Their products are like really, really, really good.
Speaker 7:I was , I was with them at , i I was with 'em at Pebble. I've seen some of the new products coming. I , they blew me away. Oh
Speaker 6:Really ?
Speaker 7:I've got some of their guys are doing some things. I
Speaker 6:Have the straightaway and I have the Straight Stick and I have the EZ three and I have the launch deck. That's what I got. Right . There's
Speaker 7:More , there's more coming.
Speaker 6:That's what I heard . There's a driver I saw on their website, but then Brixton said they sold out already. So then I was like, oh, I wanna get that. I wanna check it out. I love stuff like that. It , I love, I geek out on that stuff. So , um, there's
Speaker 7:More geek stuff coming.
Speaker 6:Yeah, I could imagine. And like, yeah, I mean I honestly, I always tell people like, if you want really good instruction then just go to performance golf. Like just, just just get it right. And they're , and the products work, so they do, I dunno , they just do. Um, so then what did , so is that your son? I'm assuming so like what kind of That's your nephew?
Speaker 7:Yeah , brother son .
Speaker 6:That's same name is you.
Speaker 7:He's called little Brian in the family, but he is like six three. So that's just what he is been from early on. Yeah .
Speaker 6:Maybe they named the map for you. 'cause they're like so impressed with you. They're like, oh yeah,
Speaker 7:My brother's kinda my best friend, so
Speaker 6:That's kind of cool. Yeah . Um, so, okay, so you , where if people wanna find you, they can find you , um, on your website,
Speaker 7:Website moog moog academy.com . My email's brian@moogacademy.com and uh , Instagram virtually every day . And Twitter some , uh, at Moog Academy I'll have a kind , a free video tip and I love doing that and got some good stuff out there.
Speaker 6:You have a lot of videos, like , you have videos from like old school , like golf.com videos from like 10, 15 years ago. Like I've seen those, like Yeah,
Speaker 7:Did a , I did a ton of stuff on Golf Channel early on, so I know there's a lot out there too that's probably on YouTube and other places everywhere been so much for the years . I ,
Speaker 6:You know , you like to teach it .
Speaker 7:I just like to do it. I, I had some, I had an epiphany happen my very first year. This will be good advice for people to considering doing things like this. But , uh, one of the early years in the golf channel kind of mid to late nineties, I got asked to to , to come on live. Kelly Tillman and I hers her , her first live show and my first time on were , were both our first live shows and back in the day I used to have a , you know, we had a fax machine, I don't know how many mornings I'd walk in and there's a fax from Richard, my buddy from Edmonton, Edmonton, Alberta. And Richard was going, Hey, so-and-so was on golf channel this night. He mentioned this, I don't understand it and I'd have to write a quick note out and fax it back to Richard. Richard was a very left brain person, so I had to always make it as simple as I could. And I figured out when you're doing live TV and or like what we're doing right now, anything kind of communication wise . Yeah , I'm just talk , I'm just talking to Richard Edmmonton make it so Richard gets it. Richard gets it. If Richard gets it, everybody's gonna get it. Make it simple for Richard.
Speaker 6:Yeah. It's like you have, somebody told me once, he is like, we do some training videos for something. And I was like, well how do you do that? And he is like, imagine the dumbest person in the world and then go two levels lower than that <laugh> . And I ask you to explain it . Like, and I'm like, really? He is like, just trust me. Just an like, because and then it's nothing against people. I'm like, really? It's , he is like, yeah, just trust me. Like don't assume anything. Just Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> explain it so they can understand it.
Speaker 7:I just, I'm just, anytime I do anything media-wise, I'm just talking to Richard in Edmonton.
Speaker 6:You're faxing Richard in Edmonton.
Speaker 7:Well maybe faxing is dating myself, but I'm just talking. No ,
Speaker 6:You're not having fax machines. My parents didn't have a fax machine. You bunch of 'em . Um, anyways, well thank you so much for being on the show. I really appreciate it. You guys have to check out Brian's stuff. Like I said, he's everywhere. Um, and he's helped a lot, a lot, a lot of players, normal players, tour players. You wanna go visit him , you can visit him at his schools too. Or you can watch his videos on performance golf or on wherever. So thank you for being on the show and I will see you guys in the next video.
Speaker 3:Thanks for listening to another episode of Behind the Golf Brand podcast. You're gonna beat me golf , stay connected on and off the show by visiting golfers authority.com. Don't forget to like, subscribe and leave a comment. Golf is always more fun when you win. Stay out of the beach and see you on the green.