What You Do In Crisis Reveals Who You Are

We sit down with crisis leadership expert Rob Weinhold to explore service, reinvention, faith, and what it means to lead when the stakes are real. The talk ranges from marriage in motion to building a firm before the category existed, and the questions that reset a life.

• marrying the same person many times through growth and grace
• lessons from Baltimore policing and the duty to serve
• shifting from self to service as a daily practice
• reinvention, transferable skills, and curiosity as a system
• vulnerability as a trust accelerator and ego check
• abundance mindset at events and in careers
• building a crisis leadership firm and defining the category
• the bullseye of passion, competency, monetization, impact
• mentors who tell the truth and taking action over analysis
• reframing fear, stories we tell ourselves, and optimism
• energy givers vs energy takers and the power of subtraction
• creating safe environments and letting others lead
• health audits, tracking, and transformational fitness
• micro‑giving, time as currency, and listening deeply
• spirituality, surrender, and faster recovery in crisis
• the two compass questions that align decisions

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Transcript

Welcome And Episode Setup

SPEAKER_00 0:58

Hey Rob, we just finished the hashtag clocked in podcast. What do you think of it?

SPEAKER_01 1:02

I gotta tell you, it was a great time, right? It was very rarely do I get an opportunity to talk about leadership, life, and legacy all in the same conversation and have fun doing it. But you provided a wonderful container. I enjoyed the questions, very conversational, and I really appreciate you giving me the opportunity to talk about these things, which I don't get an opportunity to talk about each and every day. So big pat on the back.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Absolutely. I appreciate that. And do you think the audience listening will gain value from this?

SPEAKER_01 1:30

I think the audience will gain value, and not just because it's me, but through the conversation, you were able to bring out some things in me that I think were pearls of wisdom that I've been able to gain over, you know, my years. And so I think your audience will have some value that they can walk away with, and with a little bit of luck, they'll think, feel, and act just a little bit differently.

Marriage, Growth, And Grace

SPEAKER_00 1:49

I love that. I hope you guys enjoy. Hey, what's going on, guys? We got a special guest here today. We have Rob Weinhold. Rob has spent decades on the front line of leadership serving as the executive team for the Baltimore Police Department, the U.S. Department of Justice, and alongside Hall of Famer Cal Ripkin Jr., he's seen leadership tested, not in theory, but in real moments of pressure and consequences. Today, as CEO of the Falstein Group, he and the author of the Art of Crisis Leadership, Rob helps leaders navigate their most difficult moments. This conversation goes beyond business into marriage, identity, faith, reinvention, and how we show up when life asks more of us. Rob, welcome to the hashtag Clockedin podcast. The first question is you've been married for 38 years. Congratulations. That's incredible. So but what you say is people marry someone three, four, five times to the same person. What does that really mean?

SPEAKER_01 2:55

Well, I say the first thing about 38 years is you got to find a saint to marry. So I will tell you that right out of the gate. Um I have an incredible person that has shared my life journey with me. Uh but I often also say, you know, you do marry five, six, seven times, and by the way, often to the same person. And what that means is I'm certainly not the person I am now as I was when I was 21 in my 30s or 40s. And I think that you have to be willing to grow in a marriage, grow as an individual, and accept and hold a lot of grace for the person that you've chosen to share your life with. And so I would say that our marriage in our 20s is different than our 30s and 40s. And so here we are. I'm approaching our 60s, and you know, life is good. And I'm very, very grateful for my wife and the person I share every day with.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

That's incredible. And for you, when you started, it was so you were 21, right, when you got married or 22?

SPEAKER_01 3:48

Young, very young, 21 years old. I was running around playing cops and robbers in the city of Baltimore. I got married, I had children at a very young age, and so in some ways it was kids raising kids, but you know, we got through it and very grateful for my family.

Lessons From Law Enforcement

SPEAKER_00 4:02

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And what was that police experience like for you? Because I know that can be so most people are like, I'm a lifer. Like, what ended up happening with you?

SPEAKER_01 4:11

Well, I mean, a lifer, it's kind of interesting when you use that term because it's really about life, right? Your journey in life. And so, again, running around playing cops and robbers in the city of Baltimore taught me a whole lot about life, the very best and the very worst of humanity, sometimes within the same half hour. Uh, so when you see, you know, horrendous violent crimes, and then also have an opportunity to help people during their most difficult time, it's an awesome responsibility. And I always say that I've got just a ton of respect for the men and women in law enforcement because they are ordinary people who are thrust into extraordinary circumstances each and every day, and they have an opportunity to make life better in someone's difficult moment. And when I train young officers, I would say the same thing. I said, You're going to be shocked, sometimes surprised, maybe mortified at some of the things you see. But here's the situation: you have an opportunity, because this is going to happen whether you are here or not. Yeah, you have an opportunity to somehow, some way help someone through a horrible moment. And it's a responsibility. And why many men and women in law enforcement do what they do and they operate in the spirit of service because they truly want to help people.

SPEAKER_00 5:24

Yeah. And and and that identity of service can be one that a lot of us don't carry because we just have so many other things going on. So, how did you keep that identity of service in your life? Because there's so many people that want to be service oriented, but they're like, I haven't gotten mine yet. Yeah. I'm not, I'm not good enough. I'm not secure. How can how can someone give when yeah?

SPEAKER_01 5:45

Well, you said something really important. You said I. Yeah. And so when you wake up every morning, one of the things I try to think about and also I've shared is do you wake up asking yourself, what am I going to get, or what am I going to give?

SPEAKER_04 5:57

Yes.

Service Over Self

SPEAKER_01 5:57

And sometimes it can be a combination of the two. And I know that I feel best and frankly more fulfilled when I'm operating in the spirit of service. And I feel like I've carried that throughout my career. Whether it was in the police department or a DOJ or working for Cal, and then having my own business and what we do today, I mean, I really there's no better day for me than when I see the hope come back into someone's eyes. Because we're dealing with people through a lot of different types of issues: data breach, bad press, social media attack, investigation, litigation, sex scandals, we've handled homicides of chief executives. But when you find people who are very isolated in a beleaguered moment where the world's against them, it's very lonely. But when we work with them and I see the hope come back into someone's eyes, to me, that's why we get up in the morning.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Yeah. Yeah, that's powerful. Yeah. To be able to help change people's mindsets and where they're at. And for you, let's back up a little bit. So you you mentioned how you jumped from a few different careers for yourself. What gave you what was that mindset that you had that allowed you to do that? Because I know a lot of people listening right now are sitting there going, I hate my job. I hate the career. I don't want to be here. And you've reinvented yourself several times.

SPEAKER_01 7:10

Yeah, that's a great word. I think reinvention. I feel I've been blessed with being a curious learner, right?

SPEAKER_04 7:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:17

I don't mind taking some risk, and I certainly don't mind learning. In fact, I love it. While I got my while I was running around on the street, I got my you know bachelor's and my master's degree while I was in a department. So, you know, I always like to be in a situation where I'm learning from someone else, or thinking to myself, well, well, maybe I could do that too. And so while, you know, working in patrol or in a specialized area of the police department was fantastic, what I have found is what you learn, what I've learned on the streets still applies today. What I've learned as public affairs director still applies today. And if you can think to yourself that life really is a journey, it's not necessarily you know an end game or an end line. It's a right, they say a journey, not a destination.

SPEAKER_04 7:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

Then all of a sudden I think you become a little bit more comfortable with holding on to what you've learned and then disregarding some of the things that may not apply to you. But again, I I would say it's just being open and embracing what life is, you know, bringing your way and not being afraid to take some risk because this is not a dress rehearsal.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think you brought up a couple powerful points because the first one is that we're not go we're not just going from experience to experience to experience. Like we don't have to restart every time. We actually have some attributes that will help us along the way each and every step, which I think is super powerful.

Reinvention And Transferable Skills

SPEAKER_01 8:34

Well, I think it's really powerful. And I think it's a great point that you brought up, Jordan. And a lot of times, like when I started my career, it was always that, well, how many years do you have a job? Yeah, the class. How long have you been doing this? Or this person's been in this role for 18, 20 years. And an old boss of mine said, you know, it's kind of funny when you don't do different things in your career or in your life, you actually learn more and more about less and less over time. And that's that made sense to me. So, you know, I think we get all caught up in how many years you've done something, but I prefer to take a look at, well, how many different things have you done in your career and how have you reinvented to yourself and what are you learning along the way? And then not just that, but are you also sharing your wisdom along the way? And so, you know, one of the things I always say is listen, you can be a child or an older adult, maybe someone in their 90s, and both can be the student and the teacher in the very same conversation. Yes. And I love that concept.

SPEAKER_00 9:29

I let's elaborate on a little more because I think it's the So when I met Rob, I it was one of the most impressive things about him was the ability to be a curious learner. Because most people in their 60s and 70s and 80s sit there and go, I have wisdom to dispel. And it's like, they're not like, tell me more. How are you doing this? How does this work? What are we doing? You're always asking people questions. Where do you think that came from for you? And then if someone doesn't naturally think like that, how can they start to apply that to their life?

SPEAKER_01 9:58

That's a really good question. Where did it come from? I don't know. I think at an early age, I just tried different things, you know. I mean, I can remember being, you know, nine, 10, 11 years old, walking around and knocking on doors, you know, see if people need their snow shoveled or the grass cut, right? And the and the interesting part about that is I started doing that summer after summer, I would find myself sitting down with the owners of the homes after, like I cut their lawn and we chat for an hour or two. Yeah. And I was just enamored at people who, you know, were what would be thought of as older, right? 60s, 70s, 80s, who would just share all this wisdom and I couldn't get enough of it. And so I don't know. I just, you know, love to be in that kind of environment. And I think when we get to an age where we think we have all this wisdom to dispel, and that we're kind of, you know, on top of the mountain looking down, sharing with the village what we know, I actually think that's a pretty dangerous place to be. I think that there's an obligation to share your knowledge and your wisdom and not withhold it. Otherwise, I think we're being a little bit selfish. But I also would say that I changed my mind over time, right? That I'm learning, I have, you know, four grandchildren. And when I'm with my nine-year-old grandson, I learn by watching him and seeing how he thinks. I'm like, wow, you know what? I could be a little bit more patient, a little bit more loving, and just have that level of innocence which I see him carry around on a daily basis. And so, man, just be open because the human experience is so amazing. And if you just give people a chance and you become more open and more vulnerable, it's amazing what people will tell you and what you can learn from them. Then I would just encourage others to do the same thing. I certainly don't have the code cracked, but I'm a lot better than I was, you know, 10, 20 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

That's awesome. And you brought up one of the things you brought up about vulnerability. I I had one of the leaders of trust on my group conversation this past week, and he talked about how the more vulnerable we are, the more trusting people will be with us. They'll they'll come to us. And I think that's something where if we're willing to share and we're willing to be vulnerable and say, Hey, can you help me with this? Or hey, how do I do this? It allows for a much better relationship. And I know you've done that throughout your life, and people have done that to you. So who are some of those leaders who might have done that throughout your life?

Curiosity As A Lifelong Habit

SPEAKER_01 12:13

Gosh, there are leaders that I've had who, like in the police department, I had a police commissioner who, when we had private meetings, he would talk about how he was feeling within a certain moment. And you know, I was brought up and he was too, where you don't talk about your feelings. In fact, you don't even speak until spoken to. You know, that kind of thing. And it was a measure of weakness. And so, you know, for me, we love vulnerability. Don't we as a society? We love vulnerability in other people.

SPEAKER_04 12:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

But for us, being vulnerable is a really, really hard thing. It's something I still grapple with too. But, you know, I've also found that that the ability to be vulnerable, if you can get by the fear of being judged, yeah, you will find that vulnerability invites deeper, greater, more substantive conversations that actually lead you to the value of the human experience versus just kind of walking around with our walls up and, you know, I'm my ego's in the way and you know, I'm bigger, faster, stronger than this guy, metaphorically or whatever it might be. But I have found that life is just much more robust. You know, kind of sit here and talk to you. Like one of the things I've grappled with over time is the fear of judgment. Yes. And I've done a lot of work on that to figure out, well, well, where did that come from? You know, and I go back to my childhood days or maybe the relationships I've had or whatever. And if I know that is something that holds me back, then I can analyze decisions that I'm going to make or I'm not going to make and say, well, is that fear sitting there? And is it the obstacle between me and a really good decision or a really good relationship? And so I would say that getting to know yourself is a secret I think that unlocks many more opportunities and possibilities in your life that otherwise we may just ignore. And I'm learning that now in my 50s, and I wish I'd have learned it in my 20s and 30s.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

I love that. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense because for me, it's been this moment of like figuring out what do I even enjoy? Who am I? And you know, right now, there's so much noise, phones, emails, texts, calls, social media. So it's hard for us to really slow down and start to ask ourselves these better questions. And one of the things I give Rob so much credit on is that you ask yourself pretty incredible questions. So, what are some of the biggest questions you've asked yourself that helped you kind of unlock some of these ideas and get to know yourself? Because I don't even know if you realize it, but you sit there and you you provide like through conversation, you ask questions and I'm like, wow.

SPEAKER_01 14:42

Oh, that's that's nice of you to say, thank you. And one of the questions I've come to really ask myself is why am I really doing this? Whatever it is, why am I really doing this? And is there a percentage of why I am making a decision that is not aligned with who I am, or maybe ego-driven, or whatever it is, just just understanding why I'm actually doing it. Also, you know, I've often said too that self is the problem, service is the answer. So, what am I trying to gain here? And maybe there's a logical reason, maybe not. So that's another question. And I think the big question I often challenge people with in small group and large group and keynote settings is when all is said and done, what do you want to have said and done?

SPEAKER_03 15:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:31

So, Jordan, when all is said and done, what do you, Jordan, want to have said and done? And as I reflect on that on a daily or weekly basis, it it it promotes some deep, deep thinking that quiet time for me becomes a little bit more interesting because when you realize your own mortality and you reflect back on the life you live so far, yeah, are you gonna get to a point where your creator, whomever that is for you, you know, looks at you and is it a job well done? Or hey, I wish you'd have been a little bit more of this, that, or the other thing.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

Yeah. And it it really brings you down to like what's the most important thing?

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

And and what it what are we here for? I I think that's incredible.

Vulnerability, Trust, And Self‑Knowledge

SPEAKER_01 16:13

What's our purpose? What's our mission? Am I lining up with that each and every day? Yeah, you know, or am I letting my humanness, which I've struggled with my whole life, my humanness, why why am I doing this, right? What am I after? And but I've become a lot more contemplative about those things as I've gotten older. And actually I find a lot more peace because I'm not out there running around trying to make it happen. What I am trying to do also is be more observant, right? And focus on more discernment and see what is being put in front of me, see what where life is taking me versus me going out and trying to see all the time. Right, right. You know, like that person we've seen in the you know, in the container with all the dollar bills flying around and trying to grab it all. Well, sometimes it's good to sit back and see what, in my view, you know, God puts in front of you.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. That's such a different framework from and we were talking about it a little bit before, but like when you have a networking event and someone's trying to run and meet every single person, let me grab every card instead of exhausting. Let me have three meaningful conversations. Like, let me think about it this way because then we don't exhaust ourselves as much. One of the things you did was you made the jump into crisis leadership. What was the thought process there? And like, how did you kind of come up with that? And why do you think that identifies leader? That's a real leader's moment.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

I want to say something about this networking event real quick because it's really calmed my central nervous system down. I used to be, you know, that person who would be like 500 people in a room, and oh my gosh, I got to talk to everybody and tell them what I do, and da-da-da-da. And it was just simply exhausting. And, you know, as I take a look at faith in my life, I say to myself, I I don't know who I'm going to talk to tonight, but I know it's not going to be everybody. And I just have confidence that the right people will show up, kind of like we talked about the other night. And I find real comfort in if it's meant for me, then God's not going to let me miss it.

SPEAKER_04 18:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:13

And all of a sudden I'm going into events more aligned and just feeling more comfortable than worrying about this thing of who we are and putting a label on and all this other stuff.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

I think I think you're absolutely right. It is really hard for a lot of people to also go into these events because they don't practice. Right. We if we don't practice, then we're like, I don't know what to do. And I talked the whole time and I didn't understand. And I thought everyone liked me, but I just talked the whole time. So did they like me?

SPEAKER_01 18:41

Did I say the right thing? All this other stuff, you know, all this stuff. And so anyway, it's tough to get to that point, but I don't know, it's something that I found a little bit of comfort in.

SPEAKER_00 18:50

It also brings you the idea that there's going to be abundance in this world. Great point.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

That's a really, really good point.

SPEAKER_00 18:56

So there's already 8 billion people. Like you only have so much time for certain clients, only so much time for certain employees, only have so many time for certain shirts, outfits, everything you wear. And it's like we can't be everything to everyone. So we might as well be the best version that we want to show up for as ourselves and not there's no reason to stress yourself out.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

So, you know, that's such an important point. I'm glad you brought it up, right? I mean, when you operate in abundance, yeah, then you realize you don't have to eat everything on a smorgasbord and go up for five plates, right? You can have a nice meal and it's okay.

SPEAKER_04 19:28

Yeah.

Abundance Mindset And Networking

SPEAKER_01 19:28

You know, metaphorically speaking. But anyway, you know, crisis leadership, he asked the question. You know, when I finished and I was thinking about what am I going to do with my life after Ripkin baseball, I knew that I was always entrepreneurial in every you know job I've ever had. I'm always thinking about how do I make something bigger, faster, stronger. And so what I did was I relied on mentors and people in my life who I had a lot of respect for. And I asked for lunches and breakfasts and coffees, and I said, Hey, I'm thinking about starting a business and I want to get your input. You're not going to hurt my feelings. In fact, I want you to be as raw and as honest as you can because I really need to come to the right answer. And I had a feeling of what I might want to get into, but every one of them said, Hey, look, Rob, you know how to lead, you know how to build strategy, galvanize teams, and accomplish goals and this, that, and the other thing. But if there's one guy we turn to who seems to understand the complexity of adversity or crisis, when everybody else is running around with their hair on fire, you seem to be the one who can hear the signal through the noise. You can take a very complex set of circumstances, break them down into easily understood terms, and then figure out the right answer so that the answer today is still the right answer a hundred steps downstream. And so as I take a look, if you can imagine a Venn diagram where in the upper left hand quadrant is passion, and the upper right hand is competency, lower right is monetization, and the lower left is Is making a difference in the world. There's a lot of people who are passionate about what they do, right? Yeah. And they don't like what they do. Meaning they have a passion, they pursue it, but they make no money, let's say.

SPEAKER_04 21:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

We call that a hobby. And there's a lot of people who are really good at what they do and they hate what they do, right? And so they're miserable. But if you can find that bullseye, competency, passion, monetization, and they're making a difference in the world, then that's really where I think you need to camp out in life. And for me, the whole crisis leadership piece was about I felt like I had a passion for helping people. At least I was told that I was very good at it. I truly want to make a difference in the world. So for me, 17 years ago, the question was hey, can I monetize this concept? And so for the first couple of years, I felt like I ran around telling people what I was doing and how you know I might be needed in a boardroom or within an executive team because most organizations do a really, really good job of advancing their mission. But what happens is something happens, an issue of sensitivity, adversity, or crisis, and they don't know how to handle it. And so I have found that crises cost organizations incredible amounts of time, money, customers, absolutely, right? Careers, and in the worst case of scenarios, freedom and lives.

SPEAKER_04 22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:15

And so little by little, I think the world came around and I was there at the right time again, 17 years ago, and I've been very, you know, blessed to have been working with a lot of organizations, public companies, healthcare systems, university-based systems, private sector hospitality, you name it, technology, to be called in the organizations to help them figure out really difficult and complex situations like data breach, bad press, social media attack, investigation, litigation, sex scandals, sudden death or high, you know, profile crimes. And that's what I've been doing for 17 years. And I still love you know the smell of APOP in the morning and getting out of bed every morning and being of service.

SPEAKER_00 22:54

I love it. And and what allowed you to I because I think a lot of people are going through that phase that you were describing where you were going out and doing these, let's call them informational interviews. That's what like info interviews, like with friends, with family, kind of testing it, learning about yourself, figuring out what was the right next step. Who were the who were these people that you were they your mom, dad? Was it your friends? Was it colleagues that you found? Who was that circle? Because I I want to, I'm just thinking about the audience member of the people that are sitting there going, like, that's amazing that Rob figured out what he wants to do. I want to figure out what I want to do. What should they be asking those people around them or what should they be thinking about?

SPEAKER_01 23:35

Well, the first thing you do is you you got to find the right people who will be honest with you.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

For sure.

SPEAKER_01 23:39

Right? They don't mind hurting your feelings, whatever the case may be. They're just going to give it to you, right? And you want people, of course, that have your interest at heart.

SPEAKER_04 23:47

Yeah.

Building A Crisis Leadership Firm

SPEAKER_01 23:47

And and it sounds obvious and a little bit 101, but it's hard to find people like that sometimes because they don't want to hurt your feelings or they might have a motive for saying whatever it is they're saying. Who knows? But I would say that it it is a matter of really understanding maybe where you want to be in life and figuring out of all the jobs that you've had, what gets you up in the morning, not the job, but what is it about the job, right? What is it that you actually did? And then look at the patterns, right, and the trends associated with your career to say, hey, this is a day I circled on the calendar because these are the things I did that day, and this is how it made me feel. And so I would also say, you know, there's a concept, and I I fully agree with it, is you're the most qualified person to give advice to someone else who's going to be walking on the path or down the trail that you've already walked.

SPEAKER_04 24:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 24:38

So find those people who have done it.

SPEAKER_04 24:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:42

And sit down and understand the good, bad, and ugly, and then start to stitch together everything you hear, and then don't be afraid to take risks. I think a lot of people overanalyze like, well, wait a minute. Well, what about what about uh well, wait a minute? What about roll your sleeves up and get in a garden? Yeah. Start to garden and see where it goes and be okay with uncertainty.

SPEAKER_04 25:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

Be okay and comfortable with discomfort.

SPEAKER_04 25:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:06

And it's okay.

SPEAKER_04 25:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

And nothing's irreversible here. But do something, and I think God blesses your action.

SPEAKER_04 25:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Take action, right? We all have heard movement is medicine.

SPEAKER_04 25:17

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

Well, it's movement and is medicine also with the mind, body, and spirit, and also as it relates to figuring out what you want to do in life. So hey, get started.

SPEAKER_00 25:26

Yeah. No, I I love that. I think it is for a lot of us, it's that in analysis paralysis. Yeah. And we don't just take, and I'm not saying like just take massive action wherever, but just just get started.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

There's never the perfect time, there's never the perfect person, the perfect place, the perfect thing, the perfect time. So guess what? Roll your sleeves up, get after it, and see where life takes you.

SPEAKER_04 25:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

And bet on the jockey.

SPEAKER_00 25:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:50

You're the jockey.

SPEAKER_00 25:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:51

Bet on the jockey, and it's okay.

SPEAKER_00 25:53

Yeah. No, absolutely. And I don't think a lot of people have enough faith in themselves. So, where where do you garner your faith from, like inside of yourself, that you can be that person and you are capable of doing this? Because I know it can be challenging. I I and I'm not saying like people ever question it, but there are moments where you're like, am I going in the right place? Am I doing the right thing?

SPEAKER_01 26:15

Yeah, you're gonna you're gonna face all those right emotions and just understand you're going to face them, right? Fear, trepidation, uncertainty, judgment, fear of lack, all these things. But it's normal and it's natural, and it's what we as human beings do. And so if you can somehow, somehow realize that it's part of the equation and you're not abnormal, yeah, and go ahead and take some risk, right? I wouldn't know if I wanted to be a chef or not, or I mean, unless I got in the kitchen and just kind of start it a little bit and see if I like it. And so, you know, understand that the passion's there. We all have gifts, right? We all have zones of genius, and just figure out what those are and what really lights you up. And I feel like if you're aligned from a spiritual perspective, you know, you brought up faith. I think there's faith in yourself, yeah, of course. And I think that there's faith in a higher being or a higher purpose. And for me, it's been very important to focus on, you know, faith, family, fun, finance, fears, you know, fitness, all of those things that really come together in one in one's life to to optimize them as best they can be. But I will say that for me, faith in in my God, in God, has been a core driver in my life and realizing that I can't control everything, and nor do I want to. And it's something I've had to relinquish quite a bit. But just have faith the right things are going to happen for the right reasons if you show up and do your part.

SPEAKER_00 27:38

Yeah, yeah. And one of the parts that you brought up a little bit ago that I thought was really good is when you're doing work or you're doing anything, like there are elements and pieces that you might like.

SPEAKER_04 27:49

Yeah.

Finding The Bullseye: Passion And Pay

SPEAKER_00 27:49

And you might not like the entire thing and you might go, I hate that, but you might enjoy the helping the customer, or you might like whatever it might be. You might like the driving around, going to different locations. You might like the studio portion, you might like whatever it is, but you have to put more chances out there. And the other thing I want to add is I gave a presentation this morning and I was talking about fear, and I was asking this one insurance company, and I said to them, and I was talking to the owner, and I was like, Hey, what do you think about like where does fear show up for you? And he goes, Dude, fear is air. What do you mean? He goes, It is omnipresent. Now it's your decision to go, I like air or I don't like air, but he's like, You gotta go after it yourself, and you gotta move even with that fear in front of you. So I I just think it it's one of the most important things. So, how do you help people move through that fear?

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Well, I also try to get to, and that's a really good question. What story are you telling yourself?

SPEAKER_04 28:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

If I asked you what color, you know, are the clouds in the sky, and you told me pink, well, they're pink.

SPEAKER_04 28:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

Because that's what you are seeing.

SPEAKER_04 28:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Right. So I think what happens is we tell ourselves stories that are maybe not, you know, helpful, right? It might be negative, not helpful, self-deprecating. Now, I'm not saying go out there and be polyannic every single time, but I am saying that it's important to take an approach that's laced in optimism. Yes. Right? I want to hire happy, hungry people who find a way to get it done, right? We all have those people in our lives and we know them. Hey Jordan, how are you doing? Oh, I don't know. It's the sun's out, but I know it's gonna rain soon, or I got a brand new car. I know somebody's gonna dent it soon or whatever. And then you have those other people, hey Joe, how you doing? What what do you need, Rob? How high's the mountain? I'll be there, you know, tomorrow and we'll get it done, whatever. So it it sounds kind of like the pessimist and the optimist, but for me, at my age right now in life, there's only two kinds of people yeah those who give me energy and those who take it away. Yes, those who give me energy and those who take it away. And if you're on the fence, you're taking it away.

SPEAKER_00 29:53

And a very interesting point because I gave a presentation on that before, and the term that was came up was energy vampires. There you go. And I was like, that is such a good term. Yeah. Because how many times are you around people? Family, friends, you don't best friends, you don't ever know. Dude, there's seasons where they're a vampire.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Well, a vampire, and I'll tell you another thing I do is I challenge the audience that I speak to at times, and I challenge myself with this as well, is take inventory of who you have in your life. Yes, the people, places, and things, where you spend your time, and is it a drain or does it pop you full of sunshine? Right and make the hard decisions to eliminate some of those things. And I've never known anybody to live a better life or advance in life through addition.

SPEAKER_04 30:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

Generally, it's through subtraction. I love that. And so making sure that you can go ahead and make the hard decisions around those things so that you show up a better version of you. And also, I would say this yes, take inventory, see who you have in your life. But the harder thing for people to do is to go home, look in the mirror, and say to yourself, which one am I? Do I pop people full of sunshine or am I a drag on the bottom line? When I show up, do I make everybody in the room better? Or am I someone who sucks the life out of the room? And the good news about all of that is as you get to know yourself better, you can make a change immediately and work on it and commit to it. And I've been both of those people, depending on, you know, various seasons of my life. And I will tell you it's much better to have that positive outlook and try to make everybody around you better, and then also be willing and open to have yourself raised a level or two by those who are around you, you know, wanting to help you, versus you feeling like you have to do everything independently.

SPEAKER_00 31:44

Yes, absolutely. And and and for the audience, how many times do you guys ask yourselves, where can I give today? Where can I serve today? Where can I help today? And sometimes a give I don't want people to come back and be like, Oh, it's money, it's this. No, a give is literally texting a friend saying, Hey, I hope you're killing it today. What? Even though on his birthday or not his birthday, even better when it's not the birthday. Like it's calling the friends, it's being there, it's being present, it's it's showing up for people. So it doesn't always take this whole like I gotta do everything.

SPEAKER_01 32:16

Well, and if you subscribe to the fact that we're all connected, right? I think how I was raised and certainly the environments I've been in is you it would you were strong to do things independently.

SPEAKER_04 32:25

Yeah.

Mentors, Honest Feedback, And Action

SPEAKER_01 32:25

Right. My dad told me one time the best thing you can do for your kids is to teach them them how to be independent. But a friend of mine actually, as we were talking one day, said yes, and also teach them how to be interdependent.

SPEAKER_04 32:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

So that you don't have to muscle through everything by yourself. That is, there's strength in asking for help and being vulnerable and sharing, right? And so we're all in this human experience, and I have found that the more open and willing I am to engage with others and lead with grace and lead with love and all those things. I find my life is more fulfilling rather than with my walls up and the ego out there, and I can do it myself because I'm strong and in reality. Congratulations, like you're a human being.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Yeah, we're all human. I love that. Exactly. And you mentioned that you have grandchildren.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:14

How have they kind of reshaped the way you see the world?

SPEAKER_01 33:18

Let me tell you, it's a dimension of life that I never knew existed until I had grandchildren. And it's funny because my three boys walk around and we're like, what the hell happened to him? I mean, he was a disciplinarian, he was this, he was that, he was hard on us. But with the grandkids, they can do anything they want. I lead with love, I give them hugs, I let them lead, and I feel like I'm just a different person around them, and actually it's more comfortable, it's who I want to be.

SPEAKER_04 33:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

And so if one of them throws a rock through a window, I'll give him another rock to throw through another window. I look, admittedly, I am the weakest link. No doubt about it in my family. And so my wife and I have reversed roles a little bit. She led with love the whole my our whole lives, and I was more of the disciplinarian. But now she's like, Rob, you got to tighten up a little bit here. These kids are, you know. So we have a great time together, and I learned so much just from their creativity and their passion and their innocence and their questions, and I just love it. So I I feel like as we get older, you know, we have a responsibility to bring the next generation along and be there for others as a mentor or a good role model. And, you know, I certainly haven't made all the right decisions in my life, and you know, dealing with those types of things, but at least learning from them and and showing up in a way that provides a level of stability and trust is key. But I I love being a grandfather, and I would say it's the best quote unquote job I've ever had. You can love them and you can spoil them, and you can give them chocolate for breakfast and you can send them back home and just kind of smile along the way.

SPEAKER_00 34:45

Yeah. And the cool thing is that you learned along the entire time and applied new information and tried different ways. And when you said something where you're like, I let them lead. Yes. Or I let them show me the way. And it's like to be a leader is to give leadership to others.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

So, man, such a good, good point. Thanks for bringing that up. You know, what I've found is with the grandkids in particular, and and I've applied this to other areas of my life. I'm like, wow, I've learned this, took me this long. I'm a pretty slow learner. But when let's take my nine-year-old grandson, when I let him lead, we could go fishing together. Yeah. But when I make him or you know, say to him, once you make the decision about the bait or where we fish or how to rig the line or whatever the case is, then I'm his student. It's just amazing what you know he comes up with. And I'm like, this is so cool to watch him. And and what I find is is when I do that, I create a safe, empowering environment.

SPEAKER_04 35:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

And just think, you know, if I'd have learned this when I was 20, just empower and create a safe environment, you know, how much better my relationships, you know, may have been. And so I just keep learning.

Reframing Fear And Your Inner Story

SPEAKER_00 35:48

I love that. I actually do that with my with my wife because we travel and for the past two years we've gone to Europe for seven weeks. So we'll go to airports and she's like, Oh, I'm the passenger princess. And I'm like, that's good. But like, this is our third airport this week. Like, you got to take charge here. Like, we'll literally get out, and I'm like, where are we going? She's like, and it's Italy, and she's like, I can't read it. And I'm like, I can't read it either. Where are we going?

SPEAKER_01 36:12

You you bring up a really good point, and and this conversation is interesting because from a relational perspective and how you know I show up today, or or others who show up, they create a safe environment for the people that they are around. And whether it's through vulnerability or just ideation or something else, right? When you create that safe environment, then all of a sudden your relationships go much deeper, they're more fulfilling. You learn, and also, you know, people are open to listen to what you have to say or what you may have learned, depending on how you present it. And so again, I've hit my head on a ton of rocks and still, you know, struggle on a weekly basis to try to show up the way that I want. But what I'm sharing with you now is is what I have learned, and for me at least, is the most fulfilling way to lead life.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

Yeah. No, and it's amazing because it's not my skill to have that I can fly and then like it's not your skill to be like I'm the only one who can fit. No, you got to teach a person to fish and eat for life. Like you got to help these other people. And by giving them that that the the rope and letting them drive, it's like, oh, it's empowering.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

And letting them make mistakes. You know, I think as parents, what we do these days sometimes is we like to go in there and solve all of our kids' problems.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

You want to be the you're you're the bowling ball with and you got the the sides up.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

You're the you're trying, but you it comes from a good place, right? Of course. Good heart, it comes from a good place. You want to see your your kids do well. You know, but don't don't curse your kids with your blessings, right? And allow them to make mistakes, right? And allow them to do the things that they need to do to learn that life lesson so they know how to struggle through it. I heard recently that if you go and you solve your child's problem all the time, your child begins to think to themselves that they can't do it on their own, right? And so it's easy to look back and say, I could have done this or a p as a parent or that as a parent. You learn and you you treat your grandkids a little bit differently than your your own kids. But I would say that's one thing from a parenting perspective, and it also shows up in the workplace is allow people to make mistakes. You know, I had a woman make a mistake when I was in justice that was pretty catastrophic.

SPEAKER_03 38:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:15

And she said to me, You know, do you want to just fire me or should I leave? I said, Absolutely not. I said, You're more valuable today than you were before you made that mistake because you learned a ton along the way. And you know that person just up-leveled their performance and just really appreciated that moment, as people have done for me. Yes. And so I thought I'd share that with you as well. That those people who have thin resumes sometimes or who've made mistakes are incredibly valuable people within organizations.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

Absolutely. Because it's not about the mistake. We're not all perfect, we're human, like you said.

SPEAKER_01 38:50

Right.

SPEAKER_00 38:50

So at in each of these podcasts, I have a part where I ask five questions, and it's the five pillars of Edwards Consulting, which are mental health, physical health, community service philanthropy, spirituality, and relationships. So for you, Rob, what is your mental health like today if you had to rate it on like a one to ten? And I ask, just so the audience can humanize you.

SPEAKER_01 39:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:11

So on a one to ten, where do you think you're at? And if you could explain a little bit why?

SPEAKER_01 39:15

Mental health today, I'd give it around a seven.

SPEAKER_00 39:18

Okay.

Energy Givers, Takers, And Subtraction

SPEAKER_01 39:19

You know, it's I've got to fly back to the northeast today. So that's like, oh my gosh, it's 25 up there, but the Florida weather has been amazing. But we have some things happening at work that are involving some transition. And so as I lie awake at night, I have this terrible habit of waking up at like two in the morning and my mind is off to the races. But I'm thinking about what the next six months looks like and how we're going to go ahead and handle some of the transition. So that chews up my bandwidth. And but overall, I mean, again, grateful for my relationships. But from a mental health standpoint, I give it a solid seven.

SPEAKER_00 39:52

Do you journal at all?

SPEAKER_01 39:54

Not as much as I should, but I do journal intermittently. Okay. Some people are amazing at it, but I'm more of an intermittent, intermittent journalist.

SPEAKER_00 40:01

I'm not the biggest journalist, but a lot of my clients have journaled, and that does help them get through a lot of the things that they're trying to get through. Because it's it's hard to basically map out every single step along the way when we're sitting there and there's like, I don't even know what the next step is. Like, I only know the next step. And then you there's a hill, and then you get to the top of the hill and you can see the rest.

SPEAKER_01 40:22

That's great. You know, and again, I think it comes down to some significant decisions. I have some of those on the forefront in my own life. So I think that's where my mental I don't know if it's mental health. I mean, you could say the health is really good because you're contemplating, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:34

But but I'm searching for a little bit of clarity and discernment. So that's why I kind of went in with a seven. But I have found that the more that you know I do write stuff down, I just get it out.

SPEAKER_00 40:44

Yeah. No, I just appreciate you sharing that. Because most people are like, I'm perfect. And I'm like, Well, that's not human. Come on. Yeah. And then what about physical health? What do you think on a zero to ten?

SPEAKER_01 40:54

Well, let me tell you, yesterday I took twenty two thousand steps. Oh, let's go. Which was awesome. I got up and I ate a big old breakfast and I had a little bit of Taylor ham and some sausage. Oh, I love that. I'm just turning into a little bit of a fat, you know what? So I need to start muscling. So since I've been here in Florida for a couple of weeks, I've been working out, I've been, you know, walking. And so that 22,000 steps for me felt really, really good. And so I don't know. I'm not where I need to be, but at least I feel like I'm in that eight to nine range.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

So how did you even get 22,000 steps? The reason I ask is it might sound like a simple question, but a lot of people don't even know what their step count is and all these different things. So how are you tracking it? How do you think about that?

SPEAKER_01 41:34

Well, I have a Garmin watch which sinks to my iPhone. Very good. And I became very in tune with my health a couple of weeks years ago when I called a buddy of mine who really is an alpinist, and I felt like you know I was so overweight and was hard to play with my grandkids on the floor. And I said, Hey, is that invitation still open to climb a mountain? He said, Well, of course it is. He said, You're my buddy. He said, But you're not ready. And I want you to work with a nutritionist and frankly a trainer who he recommended. And it was transformational. I ended up losing 40 pounds. Oh, no way. I was able to summit the Grand Teton, which for me was an accomplishment in terms of heights and strength and durability and all that type of thing. And I became very, very in tune with every little thing I ate. I could actually tell you how much I weighed before I got on the scale.

SPEAKER_04 42:22

Really?

SPEAKER_01 42:22

And so that reconditioned me to look at heart rate steps and almost take a more scientific approach to health, right? And also being around biohackers and, you know, I listen to that kind of stuff too because it really interests me. And so I know 22,000 and kind of what that means for me only because of my training from several years ago. So I manage it and monitor it pretty closely.

SPEAKER_00 42:46

But that's the cool thing is that the that's a skill set you develop. And the people that don't realize this is like once you develop a skill, it doesn't just go away.

SPEAKER_01 42:53

No, it does.

SPEAKER_00 42:54

You carry it. Yeah. No, you just carry it throughout your life with you.

Empowering Others And Safe Environments

SPEAKER_01 42:58

You carry it throughout your life. And there's another example in life where I just became the learner. Like I am the student. Like, tell me what to do and where to go. And you know, I've not climbed across ridges where there's a 3,000-foot drop. I mean, so I need a little bit of help here, right? And so my friend was an incredible mentor to me and just really it was one of the most transformational things I've done that was so spiritual and really focused on mind, body, and spirit at the same time.

SPEAKER_00 43:24

I love that. And sometimes it is that moment where it's like, I can't keep up.

SPEAKER_01 43:27

Can't.

SPEAKER_00 43:28

What's going on? I need help. I need to make a change.

SPEAKER_01 43:30

I knew that I wouldn't want to wake up and feel like shit every day, or I didn't want to, you know, hustle up a flight of stairs and feel winded.

SPEAKER_04 43:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

I know what that feels like. And so for me, that was one of the best decisions I've ever made in life. And it it allowed me to show up differently for the for my family and the other people around me.

SPEAKER_00 43:48

That's awesome. Yeah. That's powerful.

unknown 43:49

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

Now, community service philanthropy, how does that show up? How did how do you think about that? Is there anything you do in particular?

SPEAKER_01 43:57

It shows up a lot. I mean, there are organizations that I give to on a routine basis. I might volunteer. I mean, there are a bunch of stuff around the holidays. And, you know, I don't want to talk about it too much, but I mean, giving to me can take on a lot of forms. It could be you give to a nonprofit, you go out and you volunteer to build homes or whatever the case is. But I also find that you can give monetarily in very small ways.

SPEAKER_04 44:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:24

And not small to the people that you're giving to, but it could be a person you see on the street. It could be a waiter or waitress you have. It could be somebody who needs a smile and some of your ear time.

SPEAKER_04 44:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:37

So for me, I think giving back and being of service is at my core. So I'd rate that very high. But I also would say that I go through stretches where I'm like, you know what, you're getting a little too much in that self-category. You need to get back in that service category. So I feel more aligned with who I am.

SPEAKER_00 44:55

A really easy one that I actually haven't done in a while, but I do like for the audience that's listening is you go to the goodwill, pick up shirts, clothes, jackets, especially in the northeast if it's cold. And then you can go to like Publix or any of the food stores, get waters, they're like very cheap, and you just drop off all the waters and then you drop off some jackets, and it's just it completely changes people's day. That's a very low cost one. And then another one that people don't realize is especially if you have a skill set or you're a business owner of some capacity, like you can help people.

SPEAKER_01 45:29

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:29

Like it, like my mom, she had I'm just calling her out because she uh like listens to all these.

SPEAKER_01 45:35

It's your mom, call her out.

SPEAKER_00 45:37

She listens to all these, she loves it. But she put out a challenge where she's like, I don't want to eat anything after 8 p.m. And I was like, that's a good challenge. What is gonna be the punishment? And she's like, punishment, I don't want to be punished. And I was like, no, no, no. Like if you do it, then you have to do something that you don't like. So I was like, okay, why don't you like send me and my brother money every single time? And she's like, I don't want to do that. And I'm like, that's the point. If you develop, if you have a punishment, then you won't, like, obviously, I'm not there with her, so I don't know. I haven't woken up this morning and seen a Venmo yet. So I think she's doing well on her path, but it gives us something to work towards. And my point being is that like I coach people on a very regular basis. I did that for free. I did that out of like, hey, like you want to be better, let me help you. Or like another buddy of mine, he's like, Jordan, let's start like working out every single day. And I'm like, you can text me, bro. Like, text me every day you work out. I will support you every single minute. And like, that is such an easy thing that any of us can do as friends and family and mentors. And it's just text me your wins. I am here to cheer you on. Love it. So I my point is that we all have this skill. We all have things to give back, and we can definitely support people like that.

SPEAKER_01 46:53

Well, I do believe this that you're never standing taller than when you're bending over helping someone else.

SPEAKER_00 46:58

I love that.

Five Pillars Check‑In: Mental And Physical Health

SPEAKER_01 46:59

And remember that not all currency is financial. Yes. So you could see someone maybe in a grocery store who's down and out, and for some reason you were able to look them in the eye, or maybe a homeless person and look them and give them the dignity and respect, even though they're in a different place than you are. Yeah. But the fact that that person was heard and validated, which is I think what a lot of people in this world want, to be heard and validated. Yeah, you've given them something. And it doesn't have to be the money, although that certainly helps, but sometimes it's your time and attention with your time being the most important commodity.

SPEAKER_00 47:34

And the listening component. Yeah. People just want to be listened to and understood. Yeah. Then the fourth pillar is relationships. This could be with your wife, it could be with your family, it could be wherever. How do you think about relationships and is there any tips or tricks you have for them?

SPEAKER_01 47:51

Yeah, I mean, I think relationships are being intentional. And you know, you talked about listening, right? So with my wife, it's like being a really good listener. And even though on the inside I might be like, oh my gosh, I can't, you know. But but understanding that you need to camp out and be there for people, right? And you never know, you might learn something along the way. Yeah. But you're giving them the gift, much like I want to be hurt if I'm upset about something. You know, I want somebody to talk to. But I think it's being diligent about investing, to your point, texting someone and saying, Hey man, how you doing? You've been on my your my mind, or calling them, or showing up in a place that might be unexpected, and really doing the very best you can to build relationships and community. And for me, I find that life is more fulfilling when you do that. And when people realize that you care about them, it's important. There's another old adage that people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care.

SPEAKER_04 48:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:41

Right. And you can do the same thing with relationships. And so for me, I look at that a little bit higher on the scale because I know how important it is. I feel like I ran long and hard and independently for such a long time, but I've had this whole new world open up because I've taken the initiative to make my relationships more important, not just for me, but for them. And, you know, it's like the well, they say the Sea of Galilee. It just keeps giving, it rotates. You got stuff pouring in and stuff pouring out, but it's also being open to being helped. I think for a lot of us men in particular, sometimes we're like, well, we got it. Like we, you know, we don't need any help, we got it. But actually you you kind of don't, right? And so when you're willing to accept help as much as you like to give it, that's a hard thing for us to get over from an egotistical standpoint. But once you do and you're able to get there, man, life becomes so much better.

SPEAKER_00 49:33

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I love that. And what one of the things I did, and I do this around the New Year's, is I send out voice notes to people.

SPEAKER_01 49:41

Oh, wow, I love that.

SPEAKER_00 49:42

So I went through my phone, and between Christmas and New Year's, there's like they're pretty slow days. So I just went through and anyone I would just send voice notes. And I sent out maybe like five, six hundred of them, and I probably got like three hundred back. And I don't think less of the people that didn't send one back. But the funny thing is, if I didn't do that, I probably would have got maybe 10 or 15. And it made me realize that if we give more to people, most people are have a matcher's energy, they will match us. Most people are not inherently givers. But if they're willing to match us, then that's okay. That's enough. You know what I mean? And then some people are willing to take, which is totally fine too. Where you just give to them and they just take, and that's okay as well.

SPEAKER_01 50:27

You know, you just spurred a thought of mine. It's something I've done with some keynotes in the past, but I've asked people to take their phone out and we're gonna spend two minutes doing this. Like, take your phone out, and I want you to think to yourself where you've been withholding love.

SPEAKER_02 50:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:46

And if you have the desire or the courage to do it, to send that person a message. And I will tell you, it's like one of the most powerful things because after you know the keynote or something like that, people come out and they're like, I can't believe I just did that. I heard from my sister and I haven't talked to her in six months, or some relationship that is, you know, in jeopardy, right? But but the whole concept of as you look in the mirror to try to ask yourself, where am I withholding love?

SPEAKER_04 51:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

And that can mean a lot of different things, but I think it's part of our journey and our obligation to go ahead and say to yourself, How can I make this better?

SPEAKER_00 51:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:28

And having the courage and the will to do that.

SPEAKER_00 51:30

Yeah. I love that.

Service, Micro‑Giving, And Time As Currency

SPEAKER_01 51:32

Yeah. You took a crack at breaking the wall down. Yeah. You took the chance, you became vulnerable, you showed interest, yeah. You showed love, and you showed that you care about them.

SPEAKER_04 51:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:48

And you're defining the rules of engagement and taking a chance to restore a relationship, right? That maybe isn't as good as it could be today.

SPEAKER_00 51:57

That's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 51:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:58

And now spirituality. Where does that land on a one to ten? Or how do you think about that? Gosh, I mean And that's not always religion. That's it can be whatever.

SPEAKER_01 52:06

No, it's up there. I mean, I I would say that it's something that's core to what I think about every single day. And I feel like I'm a very spiritual person, and I think it guides my behavior, but it also highlights and kind of really illuminates in areas of my life where I need to do better.

SPEAKER_04 52:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:22

So for me, spirituality is very much a measuring stick, but I can't imagine my life without God.

SPEAKER_03 52:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:28

I can't imagine my life without spirituality because it truly is the element of my life that gives me confidence and allows me to rely on something, God in my case, that is bigger than me. And whatever your cosmology is, I really feel like that's an important element that will just shape your life, think shape how you think, how you feel, how you act, and becomes a very, very important guiding force. In fact, in my job, when I help people who are struggling, one of the questions I ask them is about faith.

SPEAKER_03 53:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

Because that becomes an important part of healing.

SPEAKER_03 53:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:07

And those that don't have it, I look at that as opportunity not to impose my will on them, but to begin to get them to think about life outside of their own and through other people's lenses. Yeah. In fact, I will tell you that when I help people who are in trouble and for a living, people that display these two attributes often cycle through crisis the quickest. And the first one is that they're able to put their hand up and say, I need help.

SPEAKER_03 53:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:37

I'm losing control and I want to weather the storm. And that's hard for a lot of people to do because I think tomorrow is going to be a better day than today. I got all the answers. And it's a little bit of ego creeping in, or they just don't know what to do. The second part is that they actually reach out to others and ask for help.

SPEAKER_03 53:55

Love that.

SPEAKER_01 53:56

And we don't do that either because we're embarrassed or we just don't, we don't want to impose on someone else and the whole nine yards. But the people who do that, the leaders I work with, very, very high-performing people, they admit they're losing control and they need help, and they're willing to ask others for help.

SPEAKER_04 54:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 54:15

And when people arrive at that spot, they're generally able to cycle through crisis more quickly than others I see.

SPEAKER_00 54:22

Yeah. And you're going to show up better because you're not that CEO who goes, I need everything. I know everything. Or you're not that leader that's showing up like that.

SPEAKER_01 54:29

And they're willing to take a look in the mirror and say, you know what?

SPEAKER_00 54:34

Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. So I got one more part for us. Okay. And then we're closing this out. Well, probably one thing after this. But Rob, I want to share something your son Brendan said about you.

SPEAKER_01 54:44

Hold on. Do we need to get him on conference line here?

Relationships, Listening, And Caring

SPEAKER_00 54:47

No, I got him. I got him already. He talked about your willingness to take risks before the industry even existed. Public relations was around, but crisis leadership wasn't defined. He said you bet on the jockey, on yourself, and built Falstein Group on out of your dining room table. That decision didn't just build a business, it supported your family and put him through college. And then he said, he said, you often ask leaders a powerful question. And he's like, I want to ask you the same. So he said, when everything is stripped away, titles, roles, achievements, who are you really? And who are you living in? And are you living in alignment with that person today?

SPEAKER_01 55:29

Where do you want to start? So the willingness to take risk. Thank you for that. It's very touching. Yeah. You would say that for sure. Very touching. But I think it's having the conviction and the belief that this is an important thing in this life. And that is being able to help those during life's most difficult times.

SPEAKER_03 55:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:53

And understanding that that is really what drove me in every single, you know, position I've had in my career. And then having the confidence that an entity could exist that others could rely on. Yes. Almost like a little bit of a tiger team to like deploy in and help them through a tough time. And I just believed that it existed. And I ran around for two years of the 17 years that Falston Group has been in business, feeling like I was trying to explain to people what I was doing and like they didn't get it. Like, what are you talking about? Like reputation or crisis leadership. And then all of a sudden, again, I say the world kind of caught up and it was like, oh, this is important. This is why it's important. And you know, it's funny. I met with a chief executive of a Fortune 100 company.

SPEAKER_04 56:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:36

We had sushi together, and I went through this whole rigma roll of trying to explain what I was doing with this PowerPoint and he's eating. And he goes, you know what, Rob? He said, I've never heard of a firm that does this, but I really, really like what you are proposing here because it was very conceptual.

SPEAKER_04 56:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:52

It wasn't like bore buy four tires or something that was more commoditized. So he picked up the phone at lunch over sushi, called his CFO and said, Hire Rob. I want him to do these things for us, and hung up the phone. And that was my first big break because there was somebody who got it.

SPEAKER_04 57:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:10

And so for me, it was the risk and the challenge of explaining something that was more conceptual and how to productize it. So it actually helped organizations save time, customers, careers, and freedom and lives. The second part to that question is a hard one, and that is when all is said and done, right? What do you want to have said and done? What do you want to be known for? I feel like I've done enough work to know that inside, you know, I'm a I think a kind, loving, sensitive person who does want to make a difference. And that might sound less than humble when I say that, but it took me a ton of work to get there to understand that about myself and not pay attention to maybe the other labels I've given myself over time.

SPEAKER_04 57:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:58

And when I feel like I'm in the space where I am caring for or fighting for people that have lost their fight or whatever it is, then I feel like I'm aligned with who I am. And I feel like through the work that I've done on myself, it's much, much more evident now than ever before when I'm not aligned.

SPEAKER_04 58:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:19

And again, I say all of that with an unbelievable, unbelievable amount of humility because it's taking me a long time to get there. And yeah, I'll share that with you. And one of my meditative experiences, as I was dealing with guilt and some shame, and you know, am I a good person or a bad person or whatever the case may be? This incredibly loud voice came to me and said, Who are you to question God's craftsmanship? I was like, So as I cycle through that, I begin to embrace who I am and not pretend to be somebody I'm not.

SPEAKER_02 58:55

Yeah. That's powerful.

SPEAKER_00 58:57

The one last question. What's the one question listeners should ask themselves this week to show up better in their own lives?

Spirituality, Surrender, And Healing

SPEAKER_01 59:07

What's the one question they should ask themselves this week?

SPEAKER_00 59:11

Yeah, because you ask yourself very powerful questions.

SPEAKER_01 59:14

I think the question, if they're willing to be vulnerable and open, even if it hurts, whatever decision they're making, they should ask themselves is there any part of this decision that is a compromise? So what I mean by that is if you make a decision to go somewhere or be with a person or go to a place or buy a thing or whatever it might be, outside of why am I really doing this, am I doing this or making this decision that is a compromise, meaning it's because of what somebody else wants versus what I want.

SPEAKER_02 59:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:57

And I found when I started asking myself those questions, there was an unbelievable amount of decisions I was making that was for someone else. Really, and not for me. And then on the backside of that, have the courage to say no.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:12

Yeah. I love that. And Rob, you're incredible. Where can people learn more about you? Where can they learn about the Falstein group?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:19

Like Yeah, well, thank you. I mean, Falston Group, this has been a great conversation, by the way. Really, like this is so fun to talk about, like life and not just, you know, you know, all the different things you talk about professionally. So this is really great. Thank you for inviting me and the opportunity. Falstongroup.com, F-A-L-L-S-T-O-N group.com. I also have a keynote site, robweinhold.com. And I think between those two sources and what's on the internet, then they might be able to learn a little bit more. And hey, if one of your listeners wants to reach out, yak it out a little bit, then I'd be more than happy to do it. But I really am grateful for the opportunity to sit here with you today.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:55

Absolutely. Awesome. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:57

Thank you.