CoffeePods
A series exploring Christian healing in a handy coffee-break sized podcast. Plug yourself in, pick up your mug of coffee, and let's go.
CoffeePods
Sick and Tired of Being Sick and Tired? Let's Talk
Hello, good to be back with you, Chris.
Speaker 2:Explore what's happening in the world from the perspective of Christian healing.
Speaker 1:Hello, Good to be back with you.
Speaker 2:Chris, I'm angry today and I want to talk about what it's like to be mad.
Speaker 1:Oh no, do you know what? For those who are listening and watching, your face was brilliant in that, because you were smiling while you said it.
Speaker 2:Oh, it was a giveaway.
Speaker 1:But why are you angry? What makes you angry? Because I have to shave every day and I hate it.
Speaker 2:I hate it. It's too hot to shave, it's too hot to even eat. I'm just miserable in this English heat. Right now we're having a heat wave over here and then you turn the television on and there's heat all around the world with angry people and bombs and wars, and I'm just sick and tired of being sick and tired.
Speaker 1:Actually, I think there are a lot of people feeling like you at the moment. Everything just feels up here, doesn't it? And it really does get to us, so maybe that's something we need to talk about today that might be the theme of the whole day.
Speaker 2:today is to talk about anger and peace and reconciliation and how in the world to navigate the chop of the world. At the moment, it sure feels like the boat is rocking.
Speaker 1:It does, it does. I was just going to say how long have we got? Because there's a lot to talk about, today should be part one. Part one going to say how long have we got, because there's a lot today should be part one, that's part one why? Don't we start by saying this is part one, in case we need to have a part two? Um you, um you. You say you're angry like how? How do you feel when you're angry like what, what? What goes on inside?
Speaker 2:I don't know it's, it's the, I guess, my brain.
Speaker 2:I always go to the scripture where Jesus finds the money changers in the temple, and it's like my go-to scripture for rage and anger, because I imagine Jesus walking into the temple, this place that's supposed to be the holy place to celebrate God, the Father, and the tradition of Abraham and Moses, and there they are changing shekels and ripping people off, and Jesus walks into that and we're told in different accounts you know one account he has a cord of leather and he's like whipping people and flipping the tables and throwing stuff.
Speaker 2:You can imagine all the birds I always think about the chickens and the feathers flying because you've got all these birds for sacrifice that are being sold and so he comes through just like a terror and throws it all up in the air and he's furious because he's like you've turned the house of my father into a den of thieves. He's like you've turned the house of my father into a den of thieves. And so when I think about being angry about something that is out of my control, I just sort of think that Jesus actually shares that passion, that real righteous indignation, and so that gives me a bit of comfort, although you can't let your anger play around inside of you too much or you end up lashing out and doing things that become regrettable. You know you can't punch someone in the nose because they've made you mad, even though you want to punch them in the nose.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely, yeah, definitely. I think something that makes me angry is like rudeness when people are rude and disrespectful to other people, particularly when it comes maybe from a place of like injustice. But yeah, just general rudeness. Is there anything else that makes you?
Speaker 2:cultural things. Um, like I was, because recently I've been traveling a lot and and, uh, I noticed, um, an american tourist who happened to be over here and they were walking down, uh, to get on a train and there was, uh, there was an english person, obviously in a hurry, either to get to work or get home or something, but they're in a hurry. So you have the tourist with the suitcase and you have the local person, and the local person goes to pass on the appropriate side while the Americans turned around in their brain. And then there's this moment where the American thinks they're being very polite and they say, oh, excuse me. The English person turns back to say, oh, excuse me. The English person turns back to them and goes, excuse me, because over here, excuse me, is like saying, hey, get out of the way. Yeah, who do you think you are? Yeah, but the American thinks they're saying oh, sorry, and so it's a completely different way of understanding and those two cultures collide in that moment.
Speaker 2:And then you notice there's an awkwardness with both of them, because both are right and yet both are wrong. And so there is a kind of interesting thing when you witness somebody getting fired up because it can escalate, it's kind of funny. You'll watch and and somebody has to disengage and say no, no, no, you, you misunderstood me. I was saying I'm sorry, I'm, I'm sorry, I'm in your way.
Speaker 2:And so sometimes you'll even find people double you know they'll double their comment to say you know, I noticed, like going into a shop or something you know after you, no, no, no, after you, no, no, really after you, and it's kind of a. It's this English competition to see who can be the nicest, which is a great thing. I mean, there's something about English culture where we really are intent on being seen as the nice guy where we really are intent on being seen as the nice guy. It's so weird. But then England is the place of the greatest levels of passive aggressiveness that you've ever seen in the universe.
Speaker 1:Oh, that does not surprise me.
Speaker 2:The other thing that's kind of interesting is even the word mad. When someone says I'm so mad, well, when I was raising our children, you know, somebody would say mad and people would turn around and look and say crazy. You know, insane, so madness and being mad are very different things, and so when someone says you know, I am really cross with you.
Speaker 1:I am mad.
Speaker 2:But if you said I'm cross to an American, they would kind of go cross. What does that mean? Oh, you're not happy. And so I would argue that sometimes there is madness in our madness, that we actually have anger. That makes us a bit crazy.
Speaker 2:And so if we can find a way to disengage the madness from our madness, that we can actually find a way to live a better, more wholesome life and to be more functional, because that's the worst thing in the world to feel dysfunctional because our madness robs us of our clarity, because, you know, when you're angry, when you're cross, you just want to throw the toys around the room and stomp your feet, and so you lack the ability to kind of intellectually look at the lay of the land and figure out what are the possible solutions here where I might be able to get some of what I want, but at the same time I'm not causing this massive disruption.
Speaker 2:But that's, you know, that's kind of my, my knee-jerk reaction, because we live in a time where people are you know I think I've said this before that we live in a time of great isolationism, where countries just become so focused on what they need as an individual nation, and what happens is then that becomes sort of infectious, and then people live their lives in isolation. So I don't need to worry about my neighbor. All I need to worry about is what's going on in my back garden.
Speaker 2:And until you, until you fire up the barbecue and you have smoke going into the neighbor's back garden. And then suddenly, and then suddenly there's a war. It's like can you believe?
Speaker 1:our neighbors.
Speaker 2:Now they may, they may not come and knock on your door and tell you, but they'll tell the neighbors on the other side how disrespectful you were of them. And so then you start thinking well, what's the solution? Where's the reconciliation in that? As?
Speaker 2:a funny example, and I don't think my brother would mind me saying this he has an annual party at his house every year. There's an annual Valentine's Day day party which I'm hoping maybe I can go to after so many years I've not been able to go. But he, he hosts this party in his back garden and it's become like a right, this huge event, and they have a stage they set up and my brother plays. He's a physician, but he plays in a band with a bunch of physicians and all the doctors get together and they play music and and uh, it's a fantastic event. And and I said to him not too long ago I said well, how do you keep from getting the neighbors to complain? I said don't all the neighbors just complain that you make so much noise?
Speaker 2:And he smiled it's typical of my brother he sort of smiled at me and he said well, we invite all the neighbors and they all come and I said well, that's really the magic of finding your way through tense things is that if you include your neighbors in what you're doing, then they get to celebrate and enjoy the party instead of being frustrated because they didn't get invited and so in conflicts in the world and all the other things that are going on, you start thinking if we treated our neighbors as guests at our party, then that would change the way we interact with them. Surely?
Speaker 1:It gets me thinking, though, as well when you're just talking about, you know, your brother in that situation kind of knows what to do, but stuff like anger and other sort of mental journeys and struggles, we so often would be referred to specialist support. So I'm just thinking of something like anger, the benefit of having cognitive behavior therapy, giving you the skill set to be able to respond differently in situations like when anger takes over. And then I just suddenly think, okay, okay, it's not just individuals who are angry, that, like you say, there's world conflicts, so something like cbt may would be as effective.
Speaker 1:I don't know, but there is so much complex stuff, uh, when it comes it's not just oh, I'm angry that there's a lot maybe deeper down. Uh, that needs to be dealt with and you actually provided for this uh podcast. A really helpful quote by mark twain, can you read?
Speaker 2:it to us, chris mark uh mark twain said anger is the acid that can do more harm to the vessel in which it's stored than to any on which it is poured and old Mark Twain was a smart fellow. But you think about that. If you keep anger inside of you, it damages you a whole lot more than anybody else, and when you spew anger onto the world around you, you might think you're doing some great damage to all these bad people that deserve your wrath or your wrath, I should say, since I'm over here. It's one of those words I never can do wrath and wrath.
Speaker 1:I always say wrath and then people say are you American? I thought I've always known it as Rath.
Speaker 2:You've been corrupted by us Americans. So just don't start saying butter and better and batter. If you stop pronouncing your T's you'll lose your passport, they'll throw you out, but no, I think that. I think it's interesting that people hold on to anger. And you're right. Cbt, cognitive behavioral therapy where you're just aware of yourself, your actions, your impulses and your responses. It goes back to kindergarten when you see the teacher look at the little boy and say use your words, count to five, count to five, because what you're doing is you're creating these moments where you stop and you think and you breathe and you, you slow yourself down. You're aware, because that's the whole idea of cognition and being aware of your behaviors and what your triggers are and these things, because if you're aware of it, you can change it, you can modify, you can change your impulse control. And and yet so many people just hit the horn in the car and say you know, f, you, you know, and just it's just like this impulsive release of steam that happens and when it happens on a national scale.
Speaker 2:It can be super frightening because suddenly you have people that are mad and they're fed up and they just say they push a button, they give an order and next thing you know a bomb has gone off somewhere and they say, see, we told you, we told you that we were crossed, we were angry and you didn't believe us and we threatened you and we said if you do this again, we're going to punch you in the nose. And we just punched you in the nose. What are you going to do about it? And so that that whole escalation of national tension and all that's where I think I find it really scary right now, because the world does feel scary, especially to children. I don't know if you've talked to a child recently about what's happening in the world. Leaders of nations should be forced to sit down with a group of 20 under 10-year-old children and they should look at those under 10s and they should ask questions about war. They should ask questions about the environment and global warming and climate change and all these things. Listen to the children. Listen to these children who are going to live into many, many, many years after these world leaders are dead and gone, and they should listen to what these children say, because that, to me, is the way to set a better course for a less angry future, a more peaceful future.
Speaker 2:I think I found a cartoon. It wasn't a cartoon, it was like an illustration of a place that was on the border between Slovakia, austria and Hungary, and the reason Slovakia has been on my brain is that I used to dance with the Bailey mountain cloggers, I believe it, or not. Long time ago, I was a dancer at university and they're actually representing the United States of America in a dancing, a global dancing program, in Slovakia as we record this today. And I bumped into this place because there's a lot of focus on borders and nationalism and people having porous borders. There's a lot of conversation in the UK about migration of people and immigration and things like that, so it's a hot topic around the world.
Speaker 2:And I bumped into this fantastic picture of a picnic table and when I first read about it I thought this doesn't exist. And then I looked it up online and it does, and I have a picture in front of me right now. There is a picnic table on the border between slovakia, austria and hungary where the three countries come together at a point and someone. I'd love to know more about this table. I probably will go read about it. Someone built a picnic table. It's a triangular shaped picnic table and the idea is people from these three nations can come and have a picnic at the table which sits on the border between the three nations. It's not a fence with razor wire, it's not some imposing barrier. You know, keep out, stay away. It's an image of neighborliness, Stay away.
Speaker 2:It's an image of neighborliness. It's kind of. It's so inviting because you see this empty table and you think, gosh, I'd love to have a packed lunch. And you go to the table and who will I meet?
Speaker 1:today from.
Speaker 2:Slovakia, and will they share their piece of fruit with me? It's an image that really says so much to me. Maybe I'm a bit crazy, because I know there are real needs for border protection and all this kind of stuff and this is a bit of a utopian concept. But it is so nice to think about borders which are welcoming instead of imposing, that are friendly rather than anger-producing and tension-rising.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that someone's actually thought the world needs this sort of thing. I mean, it gives you hope that there are people out there who have good hearts and want to see change. But, like you say, I mean I'll put the the photo of it up. It might be even coming up as I speak, when this is all finished, but, um, it is so inviting they've even put like little shrubbery so that it is. It's just great. I, I like you, I'd love to go and sit there and and learn.
Speaker 2:Yeah, imagine that if the places between people become places of possibility and curiosity rather than places of division and hostility, that surely that is the magic to make society better. And back to what we said at the beginning of this is that you're you know you're talking about anger and and hostility and being mad. And and I think to myself, if, if the place between me and my neighbor and my other neighbor, if I can erect a picnic table of love and possibility in between those relationships, always, imagine how much better my life would be, instead of constantly trying to change my neighbor and trying to twist them into believing like I do or thinking like I do, or seeing you know the color red in the same way that I see the color red.
Speaker 2:But instead of just saying, I'm going to erect a possible space between us where we can come together and where I will sit down and listen to who you are, in the hopes that maybe you'll sit down and listen to who I am and we'll share our sandwich and we'll share our sandwich, and I mean that seems to be such a better way of living than what we have at the moment, which is you all wish you could be like us, Don't you all wish you could come and be on our side of the table and see lunch the way we see lunch, instead of saying you're? Going to sit there and have your meat and potatoes in Slovakia.
Speaker 1:Again. Maybe this is simplistic, but I don't think.
Speaker 2:I don't think Jesus was about letting the rubbish persist unchallenged, and I think when I said when I said that I really think about the money lenders in the temple I think Jesus looks at a situation like we have in the world right now and I think it offends him, I really think it deeply offends the heart of God that he sees all of his children.
Speaker 2:We're all created in his image and he looks down at us and he says what is going on? And I think he probably would just show up and absolutely throw the tables to the side, flip everything over and says what is wrong with you in your pursuit of bitcoin? You know this. This world has become so consumed with greed and wealth and power and control and it's lost its sense of love and gentleness and sweetness and art. You know what our world?
Speaker 2:would be if we would stop, you know, stop being such manipulative, controlling people, and instead become curious, loving people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that would be amazing. I came upon a quote this week.
Speaker 2:The key to happiness is letting each situation be what it is instead of what you think it should be. The key to happiness is letting each situation be what it is instead of what you think it should be. Imagine a world where people aren't so consumed with trying to control the things which are beyond their control. I think that's one of the most compelling things, because we're we are so concerned with the uh, with other people that we often fail to really look at ourselves carefully. You know what is the thing the guy says when you point your finger. You know you've got three fingers pointing at you.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, pointing back at you, yeah.
Speaker 2:Again, I think anger and being mad and cross oftentimes are wrapped up in our projection of our own disillusionment with self onto a world around us that is so broken and so it's very I mean, that's your cognitive behavioral therapy.
Speaker 2:Again, if you sit down with a therapist sometimes and you start saying, you know, my dad was like this and my best friend let me down and I had this grief in my life and I and you have your long list and your therapist will kind of look at you and and they'll say well, tell me, tell me why this bothers you. What is it in you that gets revved up when you start talking about this thing and this thing and this thing and next thing, you know you've suddenly realized that all the things that you're mad about that are out, there are actually things that are deep down inside your own heart, and so the therapist is like so you now realize that you're not angry at the world, you're disappointed in yourself, and so that's transformative and that's a metaphorical way of cleaning the temple. If your body's your temple, this is Jesus cleansing the temple. He's saying let me wash away all this junk that's living in your life and give you the.
Speaker 2:You know it sounds terrible like the cleansing colonoscopy of the faith you know to give you this new possibility of living a life where you're not just ticked off with the world, where you can find joy and happiness, because I think that's the general gist of today's podcast is to say I'm tired of being what is it? I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired is to say I'm tired of being what is it?
Speaker 1:I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired.
Speaker 2:I don't want to wake up in the morning and turn the news on and doom scroll on my phone and I want something that's going to bring joy and happiness to each day.
Speaker 1:And so that's kind of where I'm coming from today.
Speaker 1:It's really helpful, it really is something to think about, and I was just thinking as you were talking as well. I find if I'm feeling angry or even you know you experience anger around you it makes you so inward looking and consumed by either yourself or just what the, what the emotion is doing to you, and I love the invitation that you've just said about actually let's be consumed by the joy, the happiness, um the truth of who god is rather than who he isn't, and I think that's's a lovely invitation for us as a ministry and for anyone listening that you're just feeling very consumed, by feeling sick and tired of feeling sick and tired.
Speaker 1:That invitation is there for you. There's also a really great little quote that, chris, if you could read it. It's the one on the page.
Speaker 2:So imagine reading a book with no way to turn back the page. How carefully would you read it? And then it says that's life at the bottom. Imagine reading a book with no way to turn back the page. How carefully would you read it? Because I'm terrible, I read fast and then I'll just skip things. And I think sometimes I live my life that way too and I think, oh gosh, did I, did I miss out? Um, when I I was on on the train, uh, coming back from Dorchester on Saturday, I went to visit our fantastic hub in Dorchester. We and I just say, if you live in the Dorchester Poundberry in particular area, poundberry is beautiful. Uh yeah, king Charles did an amazing thing with the design- and the architecture there.
Speaker 2:It's fascinating, it's beautiful, but in the middle of it is this little quiet space and the hub that we have there is wonderful. It's just really probably the epitome of a perfect acorn hub, and the people that are there are just fine, fine, fine people, and I got to go to Ann's house and visit her little pet tortoise, which was fun.
Speaker 1:I loved her little pet tortoise.
Speaker 2:I managed not to step on him, but he kept trying to bite. She kept trying to bite my socks I had these bright colored socks and she would sneak under the table and nip at my, at my ankles. But, um, I think the train ride there. It it's long, but it's so beautiful.
Speaker 2:And you think to yourself if if I was so consumed with something on my phone in front of me, I would miss the beautiful you know, the Dorset Hills and the just the rolling landscape around South Hampton. And then, better than that, I was on a train with all these kids who had just finished their GCSEs and they and they were off to have a big party. And I don't know how old a GCSE student is like 15, 16 years old and so they were all excited they go. It was really quite funny because immediately they go, you American you. American, where are?
Speaker 1:you from in America.
Speaker 2:And so you know, I'm like my go-to conversation is always well, my daughter does a Tik TOK. You know, my daughter has a Tik TOK and uh, oh, we do Tik TOK. So immediately they whip out their phones and they uh, and they find my daughter's Tik TOK account and so I think, okay, this will be funny. So I record like a selfie, and then all the girls on the train, all these wonderful children, it makes me feel old though because they're so young.
Speaker 2:And I got them to say hi to my daughter, and so we recorded a Snapchat and I sent it to her and she's on a little holiday at the moment and they sent her this and, of course, she then writes back.
Speaker 2:Dad, you're so weird I'd rather be weird than angry and and and to see the beautiful dorset countryside, rolling by, with the foreground of these happy kids who've just finished their exams, and they're so happy, um, sending a message to my daughter, which makes me happy. And, of course, as they were ready to leave the train, I looked at them like the good dad that I am and I said look, be sensible tonight, don't be stupid. And they're like okay. But I had to get that in, because I know after GCSEs they're off to meet their mates and I imagine there's a few pints of lager that are going to be consumed somewhere in South Hampton.
Speaker 2:But it's a beautiful thing to think that that was my afternoon and I had this grateful day of experiencing the work of acorn and the prayer hub there and, um, seeing some actual ministry that that was happening. And then to ride, to ride back, and and I, when I got back, I thought, am I tired, am I exhausted? And I I really found myself coming. I was walking up the street to the house and I thought it's been a long day.
Speaker 2:It started like five, 30 in the morning and uh, and I thought I'm not tired, I'm exhilarated because, because this is this is living in the spirit, this is living for God, and there was ministry um happening through that that whole time, and so um yeah happening through that that whole time and so, um, yeah, so sharing it here is my way of like sharing cause.
Speaker 2:I feel quite selfish when I have such a wonderful experience to to not share that with the wider world and say where can you find God in your ordinariness today? You know your train ride your, you know you're, you're in the grocery store shopping and you see somebody that needs a can off a higher shelf. I mean there's an opportunity there not just to give them the can but to give them a little bit of yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that was an American. I was going to say there was an.
Speaker 2:American on my train ride. I had multiple train rides and I had an American on one and somebody was getting on the coach on the train and the other American and I both spoke to them and then we looked at each other and we laughed and we went American and she went yeah. At each other and we laughed and we went american and she said yeah, she went yeah, and and and then we laughed and we said never lose the instinct to kindness, because there is a temptation sometimes to to fall into that disconnected rut we were. You know, we were heading from woking up toward london and and, uh, sometimes you get into the l the London commute mode of operating, where you don't speak to anybody and you don't, don't interact. You know, stay in your lane. But then there was a moment where, being nice to a young mother who was struggling with bags and a push chair and all this stuff, and um, but it was kind of nice to be affirmed by another person, and and again, I think, when you do nice things.
Speaker 2:it's contagious and it's like paying it forward. People see people doing nice things and they do nice things, and wouldn't that make the world a less angry place and a happier place?
Speaker 1:Oh goodness.
Speaker 1:And so if only it would change the temperature outside and make it cooler, but at least I had a lovely experience the other day, though, where, uh, I was in the shop our local shop buying some bits and pieces, and I, um, hadn't transferred money into our account, so we keep it in a separate account and uh forgot. I went up to the till and they said oh, it's been declined. I thought, oh, what a wally, let me just transfer the money, and as I was doing it, the woman behind me said, oh, I'll get that for you. And I said no, no, no, I've got the money. She said, no, no, I want to get it for you, and, honestly, it stuck with me until I went to get that.
Speaker 1:Because I was just like there are some good people out there and it just, it changes the atmosphere, the, the, yeah, everything changes Cause you think, wow, I don't know this person, they've shown me love, they've shown me care, and actually I think that's probably how some of those kids would have felt on the train, having a nice experience with somebody they don't know. And that's, that's a part of what we do in this ministry and life, and they realize that there's a whole lot more to America than Disney World.
Speaker 2:You know, it's kind of because they look at you and say I've been to. America. And you say where have you been? Oh, we went to Disney World. And then the one girl looked at me and she goes. I just want to go to LA and I went. Why, why goes?
Speaker 1:I just want to go to.
Speaker 2:LA. And I went why? Why do you want to go to Los Angeles? Well, I've always wanted to go to LA. And then she looked at me and says where would you go? And I said, well, I'd go to Pigeon Forge, tennessee, and go to Dollywood. I'd go to the world's happiest place and see Dolly Parton. Or go to the shows and Pigeon Forge or something, and they said the food. And next thing you know, they're all pulling out their phones going oh, dollywood, look at that.
Speaker 2:It's lovely it's lovely, but I, I, yeah, I feel like the temperature has gone down just while we've been talking, so I hope whoever's listening today feels encouragement and they feel a little boost from our coffee pod.
