Classroom Caffeine
Classroom Caffeine
Special Edition: Pursuing Purpose Across Borders and Becoming a Literacy Leader
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In recent years, we've seen a strong and steady increase in graduate education for teachers and school leaders. Nationally, more than about 40% of practicing educators now hold a graduate degree, and those who do often report expanded career opportunities, higher salaries and deeper professional enjoyment. Even as some other graduate disciplines have declined in enrollment, colleges of education continue to see educators invest in advanced study to strengthen their practice and broaden their impact. Welcome to this special series of Classroom Caffeine, where we're talking with friends, old and new, about their journey to and through graduate school. I'm your host, Lindsay Persohn. This special series, produced in collaboration with the University of South Florida's Literacy Studies Program in the College of Education and USF's Innovative Education, explores the question what is the value of graduate education for educators? In each episode, we hear from faculty and teacher leaders who share how advanced study and education shape their thinking, their work and their professional lives. Whether you're considering graduate school or guiding others on that path, this series will help give you insight, encouragement and real stories from the field.
Lindsay Persohn:Dr. Patriann Smith is a professor at the University of South Florida. Dr. Smith's transdisciplinary research considers how literacy teaching, research, assessment and policy are influenced by the intersection of race, language and immigration. Dr. Smith examines specifically how different languages, Englishes and English education ideologies affect Black Caribbean students' immigrant literacy practices as they cross cultures and languages between their home countries and the United States. Thanks for talking with me today, Dr. Smith.
Patriann Smith:It's great to be here.
Lindsay Persohn:Yeah, so could you tell us a little bit about your path through higher education? Where did you study? What led you to pursue graduate work in education?
Patriann Smith:So I started my undergraduate degree in the Caribbean. I started straight out of homeschool in my college of education, which was back then at the University of the Southern Caribbean in Trinidad. At the time it was called the Caribbean Union College, so the Caribbean Union College really was a tiny university in Trinidad and Tobago and at the time I was doing my teacher training diploma. So I came out of homeschool, headed to teacher training and that was two years and then moved on to my graduate degree here at USF. So I did my reading education degree here at University of South Florida, and that happened because I was doing literacy back home, had done my undergraduate degree there and figured, oh, I want to learn more about how to teach literacy, I want to learn more about how to support the reading clinic that I was supporting in the Caribbean. So it's just very motivated about becoming an expert in literacy, becoming an expert in supporting students and adults back in the Caribbean.
Patriann Smith:And that was how my journey at USF began and I probably took about a year to complete my studies here at USF. At the time. It was very, very much an exciting journey. Some of my classes were face-to-face, others were online, but I believe it was probably the most pivotal moment in terms of my career, my life, and making that decision really changed my entire journey in education.
Patriann Smith:Since then I went on to do my PhD in literacy studies here at USF, and the rest is history. I ended up staying in the United States, even though I had not planned to. So that gives you sort of a brief overview of how I got to the literacy, the reading education program here at USF as a master's degree student, and really now I get to teach master's degree students here as well.
Lindsay Persohn:It's really full circle isn't it. Yeah, to come back to the program, to teach in the program that you learned from.
Patriann Smith:Yes, very fascinating and just very fulfilling.
Lindsay Persohn:And you know, I also think that that's to me that's an interesting thing about the University of South Florida. There are actually several of us who got our degrees here and I think that that's a bit atypical, and I don't know if that's just because of the wonderful people, the connections that we've made here. I've wondered at times what that's about, because I think we do have a little bit higher rate of folks who've come back to USF to work here after being students here.
Patriann Smith:Definitely I would say that it's the people, it's the heart. When I was a student here at the University of South Florida, the graduate school, I mean I still remember Dr. Jenifer Schneider, you know, and the way that she engaged with me as a student coming from the Caribbean, coming from St. Lucia, and really seeing her heart for supporting an international student, even when there were not as many structures just very clearly laid out in the college. So you had that commitment on her part. You had the commitment on the part of Dr. Jim King, who also was my professor at the time and probably was your professor as well. We had Dr. Janet Richards who would come visit me in the hospital.
Patriann Smith:I mean, there was just so much humanity in this program that I think that when I left and went to you know, I went to Texas Tech University, I worked at University of Illinois the first thing I thought when I was going to leave is where, where will I go back? And it just it just happened to be, yes, definitely, USF, go Bulls. And so it was never a question for me of, oh, would I want to be able to work there, because I knew what I was going to get back here in this program in the college was the kind of people dedicated to that ethos, and that's exactly what I found coming back here, working with colleagues who have the ethical responsibility, moral responsibility that allows them to treat international students and all students with the kind of care that our students now experience under this wonderful administration. So definitely agree that this has been something that really characterizes our program and I think we're really better off for it.
Lindsay Persohn:Yeah, no, I totally agree. I think all of those attributes that you mentioned that make someone an exceptional teacher has also made them exceptional colleagues as well, so-.
Patriann Smith:Yeah, because then you have the expertise is also there. Very, very strong knowledge base by all of our professors who were in the program back then, and you have seen how that has continued to be a part of our hallmark, characteristic of our program. Even today just having all of that expertise which does not take away from the humanity. So I think that makes us the best.
Lindsay Persohn:Yes, yes, yeah, I think I would agree with that. So I want to pick back up on something that you sort of mentioned and ask you a follow-up question. So in what ways has graduate study shaped how you think about teaching, learning and leadership?
Patriann Smith:I would say that let me start with teaching. Graduate study here at USF really was about engaging in hands-on activities, being apprenticed into the work of teaching literacy. There was never a moment where I thought, oh, how am I going to do this? Because the modules, the activities, the pedagogy always built in the structure for doing things in a way that showed us how. For instance, when I worked with Dr Janet Richards in my graduate school program here at USF, we were taken over to the university area community center. There we spent a lot of time creating the lesson plans, the units for teaching literacy, for teaching strategies, comprehension strategies, for working with students from the community, for actually recruiting a student, as I did back then, and sitting with him and crafting an entire summer program of studies so that he could benefit from a certain set of skills that he needed with comprehension, and so I sort of remember these exciting opportunities, like going to the Joshua House and being able to tutor students with lessons that I had worked on in the program and being online, for instance, with Dr Cathy Lacroix. We actually had specific hands-on activities for technology that we did, and so there really was never a sense of, "oh, I'm getting all of this knowledge but I don't know how to integrate it into what I'm doing," because that really was built into the systemic creation of modules and also the support of instruction. For instance with the practicum course, really opened up so many doors for me to sit down and learn how to truly teach reading in a small group environment, and doing that under the guidance of Dr. King. I mean just absolutely remarkable opportunities for pedagogical scaffolding and for support. So I think for me, teaching, I would say that those are the biggest pieces
Patriann Smith:In terms of learning, I would say that the content pieces were probably what I remember the most in terms of having a very robust breadth and depth of content knowledge provided in ways that were not too overwhelming, so just really well paced.
Patriann Smith:But also you felt like you had so much knowledge of the field, for instance, the history of reading taught by Dr. Jim King probably my first class in the program, just a whole plethora of articles on who actually helped to create the field.
Patriann Smith:We had books from individuals all the way back then who had started this process and I felt that when I got to this program, I was just so much in awe of how much I did not know. I had taught for years in the Caribbean, in St Lucia, in Trinidad, but I had not had an idea of how much I did not know about literacy, teaching, and for me, that learning piece and being able to absorb so much knowledge but then become a critical thinker of that knowledge really set me up for success, not just in the graduate program but in my dissertation work that followed, because I then went on to the PhD and since then I have really been able to use such a wide range of knowledge and apply it to how I critically engage with the world. And so the teaching, the learning piece, the teaching piece, and then there is the leadership piece I think you asked about, I would say, with the leadership. Let's see there are so many things to say about leadership.
Lindsay Persohn:You have certainly become, I mean, a true leader in the field of literacy, and I think, yeah, I'm really interested to hear what you have to say about how your graduate studies have helped to sort of shape you into that leader that you've really so quickly become or at least seemingly quickly become.
Patriann Smith:Yes, yes, it seems like a very, very, very, very. I don't know how to put it, but I know that sometimes I do look back and wonder how did I get here? But yes, when I think back to my time in graduate school, I will say that USF prepared me more broadly, even more broadly than just my program, through the specific opportunities I got for the Graduate Student Success Fellowship. The Graduate Student Success Fellowship was a house in the graduate school but they liaised, I believe, with the College of Education and so there was this sort of partnership which I think was absolutely phenomenal because I got to become a fellow for three years and learn about leadership through that graduate student success fellowship. The late Dr Rod Hale he probably was not a doctor, but I'm attributing titles that do not belong here, but Rod Hale was absolutely, he changed my life when I got into that fellowship. He was the director of that program and he introduced me to a book by Dale Carnegie and that book really encapsulated my theory of thinking about leadership, even though I did not think of myself as a leader at the time.
Patriann Smith:But I believe that it came to inform a lot of my logistics of operating with the world in the graduate program, for instance, things like becoming confident and taking the lead and showing initiative and being able to present at conferences even if I had no idea what the hell I was doing, and going out into a United States world where I had only barely been for a year or two and engaging with people that I barely knew all over the United States.
Patriann Smith:There was just so much that was packaged into that program that I think that that opportunity that the graduate school here at USF, in collaboration with literacy studies, just really did such a huge job of helping me to get to see myself as someone who really was an introvert- introvert I've told people this before. They've never believed me but very introverted- introverted I think you were in some of my classes, so you know this, this and you know to become someone who spoke out and who was able to talk to people and lead in the way that I have, you know now, becoming the vice president of the Literacy Association and just doing so many amazing things that my colleagues have trusted me with. I think that that really came out of USF's investment in me,, and so those three pieces together that you so just very rightly mentioned came together, I think, and coalesced around preparing me to become the person that I am today.
Lindsay Persohn:Yeah, no, and I think one thing you mentioned that I really connected with is this idea that continuing your studies helps you to see yourself differently and I think it helps you to understand the world.
Lindsay Persohn:You also mentioned learning how much you don't know. I think that you know. That to me is sort of a it is a hallmark of graduate education. It really does help you to see, even when you think you know some things about your field, that there is still so much more to know. There is deep history, there's rich history, there are ideas for the future, and graduate studies gives us an opportunity to connect with all of those things. I also think the other thing you mentioned that's really important is this idea of these kind of unintended or even unintentional connections that we make throughout this path that lead us to things we may have never been able to anticipate, these brand new opportunities. Like you said, you're now the vice president of the Literacy Research Association and I can imagine yes, having classes with you early on in the doctoral program that that might have been something that you never anticipated would be a part of your path.
Patriann Smith:It was the furthest thing from my mind. Furthest thing from my mind.
Lindsay Persohn:And here we are, and here we are. But, yeah, I think that that is to me, it's one of the best things about continuing your education, is it's the path you didn't know you were on. You know it's the. It's the not knowing that. Like you mentioned the community center, the university area community center. I also taught there as a part of my graduate work and it has led to opportunities that I engage with now through a mutual connection. I now take my students to a community center and it is because of that work. Oh, so many years ago at the university area community center, you mentioned the idea of that. You know that hands on learning, and I just think that those kinds of opportunities, like I said, we could never. We could never anticipate them, we could never see them coming. And the path unfolds and here we are.
Patriann Smith:Yeah, I think that you know when you say path unfolds.
Patriann Smith:I think what that graduate school program gave me was an opportunity to allow my path to unfold in ways that I could never imagine.
Patriann Smith:If I had stayed in St Lucia, I would not have done not even a quarter of the things that I have done today. I would not have known that I was capable of doing them, because I would have just been teaching, which is good and a really great and noble profession, but I would have probably taught for 20, 30 years and then I would have retired. And so I think allowing the path to unfold for graduate school is something that we each owe ourselves. And taking my daughter out of St Lucia at five years old and bringing her to the US, even though I was a single mom, really, I think, was an act of bravery, but it also was an act of how am I going to give this gift to myself, even though that's not what I asked myself at the time. But you know, for those who are hopefully listening, this really is a giving of a gift to ourselves to allow the path to unfold in ways that we can never imagine.
Lindsay Persohn:I could not agree more. Yeah, yeah, absolutely so. Can you tell us what is your current role at the University of South Florida and how did your experience in grad school influence your career choices and opportunities? Kind of kind of extending what we were just talking about. I know you have a new role coming.
Patriann Smith:Yes, yes, I serve as a professor here at USF, but I've just recently been appointed as Associate Dean of Faculty Success and Excellence, which for me is mind blowing but also so exciting. I have not fully grasped just this whole opening up of possibility in the universe to me, but I really have just been so thrilled to say yes to this opportunity because I know that being able to support faculty, being able to mentor the growth of faculty, is something that I have been doing for so many years in so many ways, through my USAID-funded RISE Caribbean project, to the LRA Literacy Research Association, to the International Literacy Association committees, TESOL, so many spaces and places that I've worked on supporting faculty and emerging faculty and established faculty, and so I think this gives me the opportunity to get into that next stage of giving back to my community here at USF, because USF has given so much to me. So, yes, my transitioning from the role of professorship to administration never could have envisioned this. But absolutely delighted, absolutely delighted.
Lindsay Persohn:You'll- It seems it's just sort of formalizing some roles that you've already been doing for quite some time, so I think we're all really excited about that. So, Dr. Smith, what do you think educators should consider if they are deciding if a graduate studies is the right next step for them?
Patriann Smith:I think the biggest question is do you think that you are deserving? That you are deserving enough of the opportunity to allow yourself to unfold into the places and spaces and to the person that you were meant to be? That is the ultimate question. I think there's often the tendency to ask ourselves do I have the money? That was my biggest question as a graduate student. How will I survive in the United States? When I got here, I was living with my cousin in a one bedroom apartment. How will I eat? And I think those questions are good questions, but I don't think that those are the big questions.
Patriann Smith:The biggest question is how important is it to give myself, to give oneself that opportunity, to allow oneself to meet one's destiny? Let's put it that way. And so if you ask that question and you envision just even for a moment the possibility of allowing yourself to do that, everything else starts falling into place. You then figure out how you're going to get the money, how you're going to get the point of care for the child or not. You might have to take them to school with you like I did with my daughter, you know and you might have really great professors who let them sit in the back of the class with their iPads for days on end. But then they graduate and then you realize the world continues, right? And so I think, you ask the big question to yourself.
Patriann Smith:It goes beyond a sense of the daily impediments to getting things done and it gets right at the heart of the purpose that you're here for in the world and I know you know me, I talk about purpose all the time. What is my purpose in the world? How am I giving myself this gift to pursue? Maybe not today, but maybe next week, and maybe I can't do it next week. Well, maybe I'll start in the fall and I'll call Dr. Persohn and tell her how excited I am to join the graduate school or the literacy studies program in the fall, right, and so that, really, I think, is what we want our prospective students to be thinking about this gift of giving oneself the opportunity to become, to become what we haven't seen and then to one day learn you're an associate dean and you're like, well, okay, great. But I think that everyone owes themselves this. You know, we owe ourselves the opportunity to, to let ourselves become what we were meant to be, even though we don't know what that is.
Lindsay Persohn:I love that message also because I think there will always be at least a dozen reasons why we shouldn't do something, and they're usually based in logistics. Right, like you said. How will I pay for it? Well, we know there are funding opportunities available. Right, how how will I I pay for it? Well, we know there are funding opportunities available. Right, how will I figure out childcare? Well, you know, you just do. You know what I mean.
Lindsay Persohn:I think that when it unfolds day by day, we as humans are so adaptive and so used to figuring out how to manage those logistics. It just does right, it just works. Or sometimes you do have to bring a kid to class, you know those kinds of things, but you take it day by day. And you're right. I think, if we don't look at the bigger picture, the what is it all for, what could this potentially lead to? Or what kinds of opportunities am I maybe not even aware of yet? I think, when we focus on the really big stuff, the rest of the details, they the really big stuff, the rest of the details, they do tend to fall into place.
Patriann Smith:Yeah, everything I have learned in my very short life falls down to faith. I know it sounds very up in the sky, but faith really opens up the door because you basically are believing that something is possible that you haven't seen, and then everything that you need to get it done emerges in that moment. And I think that we are in that time when we need to exercise faith, because with faith comes hope, and we do need a lot of hope in these times.
Lindsay Persohn:Absolutely. I think we're going to end on that note, because I think that's a really powerful message, and I just really want to thank you so much for talking with me. I've learned a few things about you today, Patriann, some things that I didn't know as well. So, as long as we've known each other as you said, sometimes we don't know what we don't know you know, there's always more to know, even if it's when chatting with an old friend. So thank you so much.
Patriann Smith:Yes, Thank you for giving me this opportunity to share and I'm looking forward to our prospective and incoming students. Thank you so much.
Lindsay Persohn:See you soon. Bye-bye.
Lindsay Persohn:Thanks for joining us for this special episode in the special series of Classroom Caffeine, in collaboration with Literacy Studies Program at the University of South Florida's College of Education and USF's Innovative Education. If today's conversation sparked your curiosity about graduate education programs, you can learn more about USF's Reading, Masters and Literacy Studies programs by visiting www. usf. edu/ education/ areas- of- study/literacy-studies/programs literacy-studies
Lindsay Persohn:So again, that's
Lindsay Persohn:www. usf. edu/education/areas-of-study/literacy-studies.
Lindsay Persohn:If you haven't already, subscribe to the Classroom Caffeine Podcast for more energizing conversations with inspiring educators and education researchers. Until next time, stay curious and keep
Lindsay Persohn:learning
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