In this episode, ADJUSTED welcomes Greg Hamlin. In this special episode of ADJUSTED, Greg shares how he got his start in the insurance industry.
Season 3 is brought to you by Berkley Industrial Comp. This episode is hosted by Greg Hamlin and guest co-host Scott Fink
Visit the Berkley Industrial Comp blog for more!
Got questions? Send them to marketing@berkindcomp.com
For music inquiries, contact Cameron Runyan at camrunyan9@gmail.com
In this episode, ADJUSTED welcomes Greg Hamlin. In this special episode of ADJUSTED, Greg shares how he got his start in the insurance industry.
Season 3 is brought to you by Berkley Industrial Comp. This episode is hosted by Greg Hamlin and guest co-host Scott Fink
Visit the Berkley Industrial Comp blog for more!
Got questions? Send them to marketing@berkindcomp.com
For music inquiries, contact Cameron Runyan at camrunyan9@gmail.com
Hello everybody and welcome to Adjusted. Welcome to season three. I'm your host Greg Hamlin coming at you from Berkeley Industrial Comp and with me is my guest and co-host in a way. Scott Fink. Scott, you want to introduce yourself to everyone?
Scott Fink:Hey Greg, how are you?
Greg Hamlin:I'm so good. Scott. Where are ya? I am in.
Scott Fink:I'm in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Nice to talk to everybody. Again, Greg and I did an episode last month and excited to be back.
Greg Hamlin:Excellent. What's the weather like in Milwaukee?
Scott Fink:We got snow on the ground and about 30 degrees. So I'm guessing it's a little nicer down in Birmingham, Alabama.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah, we had we get a cold snap where they you know, down here, whenever it gets cold to do a weather alert if it gets close to 32 degrees, which I always find funny. Having grown up in Indiana and Michigan, it's like weather alert weather alert. It might freeze.
Scott Fink:Funny story, Greg, I spent some time in Birmingham several years ago, and they had an ice storm. And I learned it shut the whole city down for days. And as a Wisconsin boy, I don't kind of think twice about having salt trucks. And I learned there. They don't have salt trucks in Birmingham, Alabama. So just the thinnest of ice shuts everything down. It was very, very fascinating.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah, it's a different, it's definitely a different world. So most of the time, it's been pretty nice stuff. So we usually get about four weeks, four to six weeks that are called. So we're in that. But even those weeks are like 32, 36, 40 degrees. So not too terrible.
Scott Fink:I'd take that.
Greg Hamlin:But you probably wouldn't take our July and August. So we're gonna do an interesting thing today. I got some feedback as we wrapped up Season Two from a previous producer that they thought it would be nice to start Season Three off and have a meet the host episode where we reverse the roles. And so I asked Scott to join me today and we're actually going to switch seats today, I'm going to take the backseat and let Scott do the driving. So it's going to be a little different, but it should be fun. And it'll get people maybe a chance to learn a little bit more about me if they haven't. So far. We're sticking to the first 40 or so episodes. So Scott, I hand the baton.
Scott Fink:Thanks, Greg, I appreciate it. It's exciting to to get to interview the esteemed host of Adjusted. I know you've talked to so many people. And I think everyone's pretty excited to learn more about you. So just kind of jumping in. I mean, tell us a little bit about how you've got into the industry.
Greg Hamlin:Great question. So when I was in college, I was doing nonprofit fundraising. And I'm crazy enough that I got married while I was in college. And we actually had our first baby, my daughter who's 17, while we were in college. And so, we had Ally in between semesters. My wife didn't miss any school.
Scott Fink:Oh, my god.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah, we and then I just built my classes around hers, because that was far enough along that I could kind of just take electives to finish off. But I knew then being a dad, that I definitely needed to find a career that was going to be able take care of my daughter. So a mentor of mine at the Indiana University Foundation had told me to look into business and I had a degree in criminal justice. And I was like, I don't know. And I had been doing nonprofit fundraising. And so he encouraged me to go down that road. And I literally went to a career fair at Indiana University walked around, and I just met people and I ran into Liberty Mutual. I didn't know anything about them. I knew nothing about workers comp or insurance. But I saw what the starting salaries were back then, which was like 37 to$39,000. And I thought, well, I could probably take care of my daughter and my wife on that if we were careful. And so so that's how it ended. That's how I ended up there. It's kind of a crazy, crazy twist and turn.
Scott Fink:That's wonderful. I did not realize you guys had Ali in college. It's impressive that your wife didn't miss any class. But that's more than impressive.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah, she's a champ. So she she graduated a 4.0 and never missed a class her entire I've skipped class and then
Scott Fink:oh my god
Greg Hamlin:never missed a class and then she was pregnant with our second child Chad . While she was student teaching. She has her degree in teaching. So she had him just after she graduated. So basically two babies while she finished her degree and we are that's amazing.
Scott Fink:So tell me more about your experience and time at IU Indiana University would love to hear more.
Greg Hamlin:So, you know, I was I guess what you call a non traditional student by the time I arrived at university. After high school, I went out west and spent two years on the Navajo reservation in parts of Southwest Utah, as a missionary. And so by the time I came to Indiana University, I was 21. So it's a little older. And I thought for sure I was going to be a business major, I had my mind made up that this is what I was going to study, I got through my first semester of classes with all A's feeling very good about it. Indiana has one of the top business schools in the country. So you have to apply to get in, maybe it's that way everywhere. But pick your top 20 Or maybe top 10 Business School, and need to take certain classes to get in. And so my second semester, I took those classes, out in classes, different business classes, and I share the story because I think I think it's important for people who go through it, I took those classes, and none of it connected, I could not make sense of accounting, I couldn't make sense of some of the classes. I stayed up studying late, and work my tail off. And I remember I realized I had a problem when I left my calculus exam. And was sure I aced it. And then when I got it, I failed it. Oh, no. Like this is this is where I think I know what's going on. I had no idea. Yeah. So that was a reset moment for me. I withdrew from school before the grade set in, which was a huge decision. And I was working at Indiana University at the time doing nonprofit fundraising. And I reset, and I just asked myself, like, what did I love, and I love the criminal justice class I took totally switched my degree graduate with a three five so did well in school and learned from that experience that it's okay to fail. And not only that, here I am today a senior vice president at an insurance company. And the dream that I had in college actually still kind of came about just in a roundabout way. So I guess what I would say is don't give up on yourself.
Scott Fink:What a great message. Absolutely. And you've told me before you spent some time working for the IU Foundation, is that correct?
Greg Hamlin:I did. So my parents, the deal was for them that they would help with my school as long as I paid for my living expenses in my apartment itself. So I had to work all the way through school. And so one summer, I was working at Barnes and Noble, during all summer, and I got a flyer on my apartment door that was still like, I can't remember $8 An hour or something, call people and ask them for money at IU foundation in those like flexible hours, you can work any day you want. And I like that sounds great. So I thought I could do both these jobs. I'll do the one during the day. And I'll do this one at night. And so I started that calling people. And the turnover rate was crazy. Because it's really hard to ask people for money you don't know, and not give up.
Scott Fink:I bet, talk about failing.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah, but like, I think because of the experiences I've had previously, I learned how to build relationships with people, all different kinds of people. And I love the feeling of making an impact in people's lives. Because if you're raising scholarships for students, they get an education and thats a game changer. So I love the way did within three months, they promoted me to be a supervisor, student supervisor. And when that happened, I decided to quit my job at Barnes and Noble and just stay at the foundation. So I worked there teaching other people how to do it, doing trainings, doing interviewing, hiring, eventually ran up the stage all 40 stations and public supervisors. And there wasn't a lot of money in it. But there was a lot of experience that I think have been gone over the years for sure.
Scott Fink:I bet and what a service and mission to get and achieve scholarships for younger folks, I could see coming in every day, how that could drive you.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah. And I think it set me apart when I started looking for business opportunity looking for a job. And I had three years of experience doing private fundraising. And so I knew how to look at statistics, I knew how to look at measure measure results. And I knew how to achieve them as a team. And you know, I think the biggest lesson I learned there, learned a lot of things, but one of them was we had a really diverse team of people with very different backgrounds. And with that there was a lot of strength because all of us looked at problems different ways. And that's something I've thought about throughout my career is the importance of being open to people who are different than you because they may have a solution that you would never even consider.
Scott Fink:Absolutely well that, backup just real quick something I did not know about you is that time spent on the Navajo reservation so it can you speak more to that what did you learn out there?
Greg Hamlin:I look at though that time was probably the biggest thing that changed everything else in my life. So I did that for two years and I did not have anything during that time. I was really removed from a lot of the distractions that I think normal 19 year old guys have, you know, there were no girls there was no parties, you know. Everything was focused on helping other people. And it gave me a lot of time to think about who I wanted to be what I wanted to do with my life. And what would come next. And you know, and I learned out there, serving with the Navajo Nation, that people don't care how much, you know, though, they know how much you care. So obviously, I'm Caucasian. So I'm from a different background and the different cultures and they were. And what I learned was looking at Bear dances, shearing sheep, bringing water to people who don't have running water, that when I did those things, and people knew where my heart was, then there was opportunity to serve in other ways. And so that's something I think that I've taken with me everywhere I've gone is to make sure that people know that and that you can find ways to show that and there's just a lot of ponder time, because you're out there by yourself. And if you've ever been out in the base, or in the desert, there's nothing so you know, there's a lot a lot of time to think, which is good.
Scott Fink:I bet. Did you travel? How much? Were you pretty much there?
Greg Hamlin:No, it's very strict. The time that I was there, I could call home twice a year for Mother's Day and Christmas. And other than that, I wrote letters on once a week. So I guess I learned how to write letters, because it was before, email was around, but it's still really new. I did a lot of letter writing. And again, I think there were some times that were lonely, but it also forced me to grow up. Because by the time I came home and went to Indiana University, I really knew what I wanted, who I was and what I wanted on a life. And I'm still I guess that's evolving. But yeah, that was that was big.
Scott Fink:I bet. So you went to IU. And then you talked about the job fair Career Fair and running into Liberty Mutual. So tell us about that. Tell us about those first steps at Liberty was that directly into the claim side?
Greg Hamlin:It was my first manager who I credit for a lot of things. She always first was the hardest on my entire life who had worked work. So she was tough. And she demanded excellence. And she pushed me and pushed me and pushed me sometimes to the point where I almost felt like I was gonna break. So that sounds negative. I'm still friends with her today. And I still think highly of her. And I am what I'm grateful for those first two years were hard because I was learning everything. I did not have a medical background, and didn't have a financial background. My background was in criminal justice. So the investigation side was easier. But there was so much to learn, a different manager could have not taking that extra time. And she did. And she demanded excellence. And you either made it or you didn't. But there wasn't going to be any in between with her. Later in my career at liberty as I went to other teams, I always felt like I had a head start on everybody else. Because I'd been pushed so hard. I know you had talked about in our previous podcast about the Marines on shirts, nothing like that. But in some ways, you were pushed really hard. I think you mentioned that. And that's that feeling where you're like I want I would have quit, I think I would have quit. But I had two kids and a wife or a baby on the way. There was no quitting. There was no way I could quit. What is he going to do I have to take care of these people?
Scott Fink:That's a great experience that I you know, I'm sure she was a great teacher and mentor and you make a really good point. The next job was easier because you went through the hardship to begin with. And I think that's really important. I didn't know that about you either. I learned a lot today, Greg.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah. So she's tough. And I would say, No, we have a couple of people on our team that have worked very closely with her, Carol worked for her and was trained by her to who's on our team. So her impact is felt even in our company today, because of the kind of leader she was in is I think tough stuff can be good for you and not quitting and not giving up when things get hard. Maybe I was in a situation where it would have been harder to do that. But I'm glad that I was because I think that the next steps came after that because I went through it.
Scott Fink:Yeah, she sounds like a great leader. So then how did you take those next steps to become a manager and ultimately a leader from where you started today?
Greg Hamlin:So I had been at leadership at different times when I was on the on the mission on our reservation and had been what's called a district leader, zone leader and we've been Assistance Commission President. So one point I was helping oversee the 200 or so missionaries with the president. And then when I came home at the Indiana University Foundation, I'd been a floor manager and then we end the whole session so I had I had those opportunities but you can't leave until you know um, so the the problem What was hard I think about the original first steps at Liberty is I couldn't lead something that I didn't understand myself. Even though I knew how to lead. I didn't know workers competent, didn't know claims. And so I had to learn those things. And as I got better and better at handling claims, I felt, by the time I've been doing it for about five or six years, I started feeling like I'm ready for the next step. And in our office in Indiana, there was not a lot of turnover. So there weren't a lot of opportunities. A lot of the managers have been in industry for years. So it wasn't hard for me to see that I may not have an opportunity for a while. And so an opportunity opened up in Cincinnati, Ohio casualty, which was two hours away from where I live. And they were owned at the time by Liberty, stilI are. I saw that job, and I applied to it, this will be a good experience. Ask Molly, my wife, I said, are you okay? If you if I got this job? Would you need to Cincinnati with me to do this? And she's like, oh, yeah, the whole time, though. She was thinking like, this is just going to be a good learning opportunity. He'll go, he'll interview, they'll learn when he needs to grow. And then you know, so when I got the job, she was like, what we're moving? Well, you said, like, we were all right. I was like, but I didn't think it would happen. And that's how I ended up there. And I was a worker's comp leader, with a car supervisor. And I did that for about a year at first day on that job. One of my employees came up to me and said, asked me when I was born. And because I was young. I told him, I didn't care. And he said, Well, he shook his head. And he said, I've been working for this company longer than you've been alive. And if you think you're gonna tell me how to do things, Oh, yeah. Okay, if you think you're gonna tell me how to do things, you got something else coming. And so that was my like, first week there. And I remember thinking like, Okay, this is going to be interesting. But by the end of that first year, we became good friends. His performance is excellent. And, again, going back to the people don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care. I just, I really got to know them as a person, what needed life and what was important to him. And then over that time, we both really help each other out in different ways worked out well. What was what was challenging, though, was I did that job for a year. And then the company went through a reorganization, which they tend to do every seven years. And so I remember sitting in a meeting and realizing that there wasn't going to be a workers compensation presence in Ohio. And I didn't know what that meant for me. And I got a call that I was being switched to commercial liability. And I was going to be supervising a team in Boston, Massachusetts,
Scott Fink:And possibly have to move to Boston.
Greg Hamlin:Well, I didn't know. And it was right before Christmas, they said no, I asked that question. And I actually moved to Boston. So great, you know, had to move my wife once, she's not going to love this. And so they said, No, you can manage them remotely. If you want to get a plane ticket, fly out to Boston and meet your team. And I said, Well, I don't know anything about commercial liability. I've only been with this cop. And they said, Okay, well, here's some online classes, go and do these over the next week. And then you'll have your team in Boston. And I said, Well, how do I supervise people remotely. And I said, figure it out, that I bought myself a book on managing people remotely read that on the plane. And that was the beginning of that adventure. And I you know, they did that for three or four months. And then they changed their minds. And one of the claims moved to Ohio. So then I moved to 1600 claims from Boston to Ohio and built the team in Cincinnati so and they ended up with a new assignment with something different with the company. But that really taught me how to pivot and learn something new.
Scott Fink:I bet I assume there's a challenge in pivoting from top to GL coverage on the claim side quickly, in one week with an entire team I'm sure that was not the easiest thing in the world.
Greg Hamlin:It was crazy. It was crazy in that I you know I remember the first month I was supposed to audit my team. I literally had them sit with me while I audited them. Because I said I'm not I don't think I'm qualified to audit your files right now. Like let's do this together. So the for the first couple months, we did it together. And the more I did it, the more I got it. Well, I would not say I'm an expert in commercial liability. I do understand the fundamentals and the principles having, having supervised that for that year.
Scott Fink:Sure.
Greg Hamlin:I think what it did though, is it gave me confidence in myself that I didn't have up to that point because I realized that I could do something different and to do well at something different and that I didn't need that somebody teach me how to do everything. I could figure it out on my own. I learned how to that was before zoom was a big thing or video conferencing was a big thing. I had to learn how to video people every morning and talk to my team remotely. And so I think I learned so much about just digging in and figuring things out. And that gave me confidence in what I could do next, because of that.
Scott Fink:That's a great lesson, there's such a reward and just having to dig in and learn on your own and finding success or doing that. Sounds like you were ahead of the pandemic, by by several years, remote world, the Zoom Society of ours, and then they correct me if I'm wrong, but you went to the state fund of Kentucky, right? At some point. So what led you from your comp team? GLP? You're in Cincinnati? Yeah. How do you get to the state funding Kentucky?
Greg Hamlin:That's great question. And so I had an opportunity that presented itself go to Kentucky, the recruiter reached out to me again, and at that point in my career, you know, I was enjoying my ability, I was rated very highly as a supervisor doing it. But I missed my roots of worker's compensation. That's where I started. And so the opportunity to go back and do what I knew, in the image challenge at that point was really intriguing to me, I was running a team of about six people, six to eight people, when I was with Liberty as a supervisor, this was the opportunity to manage an entire Department of 60 employees. And that was something totally new. And the focus on one state, you know, the state of Kentucky, rather than multiple states, been able to really become a specialist in that. It was certainly a challenge. But that's what attracted me to that was, was just the idea of one that was a huge opportunity. And two, it was gonna get me back to what I started doing all along, which was workers comp, and you know, the problem with GL, and I'm sure there's people who love it. But what was hard for me is, at least with workers compensation, you're helping somebody who's hurt, who has a relationship with your insurance. They're, they're the employee, when you're doing commercial GL is often people who slipped and fell on someone else's premises or someone whose house got ruined because the plumber didn't put in the equipment correctly. And so you're dealing with a lot of angry people, and a certainly an important service. I don't want to belittle it. But I really enjoyed the feeling of helping people in worker's comp?
Scott Fink:Absolutely, that's a very interesting point. I know, we've talked about this in previous episodes, where we have this empathetic claims resolution model, and I know your passion, your team's passion, so I could see why going to the State Farm and getting back into calm would mean a lot to you. And that's a huge team, 60 employees.
Greg Hamlin:It was big, and there are a lot of challenges.
Scott Fink:So what yeah, what I mean, I'm curious about that. So 60 people, you know, can you talk to us the one or two big challenges from that, I'm sure just the the people side of it, versus the operation side had to just be huge.
Greg Hamlin:I think, you know, one thing that was big, and that was challenging, it's just being an outsider, right? I wasn't from Kentucky, most everybody else was from that area. A lot of them had known each other for years. So I was the new guy, which wasn't that different to my experience in Ohio when I showed up that first day. So I'd been there before. So that was a big one, building trust and building consistency with people and building a team that really had each other's backs and cared about each other. And I'm proud about what we were able to accomplish together. They're doing that. And I felt like we had a group of people who are really trying to work together for the same goal. And we did some really crazy amazing things while I was there for that five year period, in almost a year. And Wipro manager could be a director. And so I learned a lot about some of the next pieces of leadership strategic thinking that I hadn't had exposure to, which was good. But most of all, I made friends that I still have today. No, and there's multiple people there that if I'm in Lexington, we're going to do at lunch, we're going to spend some time together. Because we grew together through a lot of challenges. And so definitely a good experience.
Scott Fink:That sounds like it. And you know, you touched on trust, I see that at Berkeley industrial comp and WR Berkeley, it's like, Hey, we're not always going to make the right decision. We're going to find success. And along the way, we're going to have each other's backs because we trust each other. I think that's that's a huge lesson for the audience. And fascinating to hear you talk about that with that team at the state on. I mean, that's a very different world, I would assume a fortune 100 Liberty Mutual to a state fund and, you know, local KenruckyWhat was that like?
Greg Hamlin:Good question. So there are a couple of huge differences. So obviously, fortune 100 company is focused on profit, namely right, not to make it some cold, but at the end of the day, they have you know, they're trying to be profitable, a state funds a little different and the, there's different variants across the United States, I can't speak to every one of them because some of them are privatized. But the one that I was part of was clausi-state, meaning it was created by state government to solve a problem, which was how do we make sure everybody has access to workers comp, because some people, some businesses, nobody wants to, write. And so the government created a particular state farm by statute, to provide workers compensation benefits. And so we weren't able to say no to somebody, if they want to work on coverage, as long as they were willing to follow the rules as far as participating in the audit and all the other pieces of that. So that meant that we had a lot of challenges and opportunities. What I learned from that is, we ensured everybody, we ensured everybody from the mom and pop store down the street, to you know, somebody in a coal mine to some factory in Cincinnati. So or something in Louisville, so Louisville Slugger. So, you know, you just get to see every type of industry, and every type of injury from somebody who's having a hold my beer, watch this to somebody that's, you know, got a great safety program and has a bad accident. So I think just seeing the many variants of that was huge. And then also, just understanding it was a little bit different purpose than maybe a for profit insurance company, a fully for profit insurance company.
Scott Fink:Absolutely. I was gonna say, I mean, as you were talking that diversity of claims when you can't say no, and you write everything under the sun, your team and yourself, you must have just seen a myriad of different injuries and industries, etc. That's, that's fascinating.
Greg Hamlin:So it's great experience and experience to learn from that. And it's really those experiences that eventually led me to where I am today in that Berkeley Industrial Comp used to be American Mining. And I had had the opportunity to look at a lot of claims that were co related, and then having been in Kentucky, then underground and aligned before, understand the different types of jobs and how it all works. And while we don't write coal mining anymore, we do still have legacy claims from that time period. And so those experiences brought me this opportunity. Were now I'm Senior Vice President of claims for Brooklyn, Industrial Comp. So without that, I don't get here. So I'll always be grateful for that. Absolutely. You know, it resonates from the standpoint of what while we certainly have the ability to say no at Berkeley Industrial calmComp just submission, you know, we write a lot of stuff that a lot of other folks won't or don't want to write in a lot of ways like like the fund we're not we're by no means are we a state fund, but it's very tough business, tough industry, and there's not a lot of capacity in the marketplace. And so that leads to a lot of severity claims, which is a huge topic I know through the podcast, but I'm sure that experience has really set you up well for Berkeley Industrial Comp which which brings me to kind of the the last stop on the on the Greg Hamlin train. If you've gotten to Berkeley Industrial Comp, so you are director level at the state fund. Any make a move to Berkeley industrial and you bring your family to Birmingham, Alabama. Tell us about that. So that was a crazy time. So for me myself during that time, you know, State Farm went through a series of layoffs through the number of people who lost their jobs in leadership roles, and I was one of them being completely transparent, which is hard. Anytime you go through something like that, that's hard. And so, yeah, that's summertime. Again, I have no hard feelings about that situation. But you know, you have to figure out well, what comes next. And I remember that summer, in fact, my wife and she said, Well, we're going to sell our house. And so we literally put her house on the market and moved in with my mom, my father passed away six months before that, sold our house in 10 days, put everything in pods and started hitting the ground figuring out well, what's the next adventure going to be for the Hamlins and,
Scott Fink:Wow.
Greg Hamlin:, I had a friend of mine at the time he said you know, you're not going for he goes, if you're if you're thinking about a basketball game, and one shot would would send you an overtime, you're like, now I'm taking the three we're gonna win it. And, and that's the approach we took was just like, it doesn't matter what happens, I can only control myself and what comes next. And so we were all in and I interviewed a number of different places that had a number of choices on where I wanted to go. But what impressed me about Berkeley Industrial Comp were the people I'll never forget my interviews with Chan and Dave and Alison and that Greg Pierre. Those that know I met those people and I thought these are the kinds of people that I want to do the next thing with, you know, they're they can be trusted. They are looking to do something totally new?
Scott Fink:Absolutely.
Greg Hamlin:And so when I, when I looked at a couple of other opportunities and had some other choices, what really funny Mike, one of them was possibly to work with Disney World. And my wife was like, we could have had family passes for life. You know, with all our kids, that would've been fun, but what? Beyond that, it's just the people work, the industrial cops, people were great. And I was impressed with Chan's story started this company 30 plus years ago, and having the guts to do that, and then having the guts to realize he needed to reinvent himself by first selling the company to WR Berkley, and then remaining president, and then later realizing the laws with coal didn't make it profitable. And it was time to reinvent ourselves, again, is Berkeley Industrial Comp. That really resonated with me in that here's a leader who's been through so much, who started this himself, but also realized when he needed to check his ego, and do what's best to keep everything moving. And that's hard.
Scott Fink:That is, and what a great point. And he talked about the people in the leadership and Chan and you know, harkening back to what you said before about trust and building teams, I think there's a very real trust that we all have been shared, and then the leadership so I could absolutely see why that would make a difference to take that over Disney World. And, and honestly, Chan's risk to make that pivot to reinvent the company. You know, if that's a three point shot in itself to win the game, you know, he took a risk there. I will say, putting that putting the house up for the market and selling it and making that pivot. That's a that's a big three point. That's like a Steph Curry halfcourt. Three points. Yeah, that's at the buzzer. But it absolutely worked out. And, you know, I don't just say this, I mean, this, everybody is so glad that you did pick that and that you did come to Berkeley Industrial. So. Yeah, go go ahead.
Greg Hamlin:No, I appreciate that. And, you know, I just think that people underestimate the power of having a vision and having a dream and committing to it. And when you commit all the way to something, good things happen, whether that's your marriage, whether that's your kids, whether that's your job, whether it's your faith, pick what you want to commit to, and then commit, and then when you commit, just go all in, because, you know, I think I learned that from experience on a mission. You know, when I was out there, I was all in. And it's like, well, I'm gonna sign up for this and be out here for two years that I'm going to figure this out. And I'm going to do this 100 All the way. You know, it's easy to say it, it's harder to do it. But that entire experience probably did more to define me than a lot of other things that have happened in my life. And, you know, it could have been hard on my family, and it was moving to here with my kids moving to Alabama was an adjustment. But I think in the end, we're stronger for
Scott Fink:Yeah, you know, just jump in both feet, cannonball and whatever it is, and to some of your earlier points on making mistakes, if it's not the right fit, you can always get out of the pool. But you can't, you can always jump in twice. And so I think that's amazing that you did that. And, you know, I would say to on committee, not put a shameless plug in here for Berkeley Industrial Comp, you know, Chan is and we are very committed to this high hazard construction, industrial appetite that we have. And we see a lot of carriers go in and out. And we're in it, you know, we're committed to this, this is what we want to do, we want to be the stable market, it allows us to, to create and maintain the team that you have to deal with the severity and the CAT losses and be the best partner in the marketplace. I think that commitment really matters.
Greg Hamlin:I 1,000% agree. And you couldn't have said it better. And it's it's important. You know, when you decide you want to do something, when you commit to it, good things happen. And I know we're doing that today. And I look forward to how we're going to grow going forward. Because there's so much more to the story of Berkeley Industrial Comp that we're gonna see play out over the next five to 10 years. So it's gonna be a fun ride.
Scott Fink:There really is. Well, let me ask you this real quick. And you know, something you asked me kind of taken this outside of the of the career path just just in general, what drives Greg Hamlin on a day to day basis?
Greg Hamlin:That's a great question. I think one of the things I realized maybe another for a while, but I think it's the core of what I want to be when I grow up, is I want to be able to, I want to be able to look back when this whole thing's done, whether it's my career or my life. If there is stuff after this, I want to go look back and feel like I made an impact other people's lives. You know, there's plenty of opportunities to make money. But I guess when I was at my dad's funeral three years ago, nobody talked about his 40 plus years at Dow Chemical, work that same company from the partners a security guard company until the time he left.But what every single person talked about were the relationships he had and the way he served other people. And so I guess what drives me at the end of this is, if I always try to think about all the choices I make through that lens, then when this is done, whether that's Berkeley Industrial Comp So when all those things happen, right, I hope I can look back and know that I made an impact and that maybe somebody's life is better, because I existed, because I did something
Scott Fink:hat is such a deep point and to to look at an experience your dad's funeral, and the folks that spoke there about about his life, and not to talk about the career but about how he touched people and impacted. That's, that's a great lens with which to look at life through. That's, that's impressive.
Greg Hamlin:Yeah. And I think about that with my team. So I think that change that change the way I lead since then, that I really think about the people who I'm with, and I think about are the decisions I'm making making their lives. Sometimes we have to make hard choices, that's part of leadership. And I know and I will shy from making the tough decision if it needs to be made. But at the same time, we should be going back to where I talk a little bit about empathy, trying to help other people. If we try to put ourselves in other people's shoes will better understand what they're feeling. And maybe we can help them, whether that's helping them with their career, helping them with their personal life or whatever.
Scott Fink:That's a good point. You know, you talk about your team, we've talked about the company, then we talked about what drives you on a day to day basis? What are you most excited for? Going forward? You've touched on the, you know, the future of the company, but and maybe that's it, but what is it that just you're so excited about whether it's your team, the company personally.
Greg Hamlin:So I have a couple of big ideas, and they're big, and whenever you have big ideas through always a little rough. So we'll see how it goes, it may take more time. And its possible, they may not work the way I want them to. But the two things that you know, along with just seeing Berkley Industrial Comp grow into ideas that I'm excited to see how they grows. One our empathetic resolution model. And we talked about that in a previous podcast. So I don't spend a ton of time on it. But it's just this concept that if we treat people and put ourselves in their shoes in econ, and listen, really, you know, it's really funny when you think about it. We have speech class in high school, we don't have listening class, right, we give peace talks, but we don't want peace listens. So there's lots of emphasis around what we say, and not a lot around how we listen.
Scott Fink:Yeah. And, so true, wow.
Greg Hamlin:So I envision my big vision is that we would spend more time listening to our injured workers in showing empathy. Again, that does not mean that there are going to be accepted requirements. In fact, we're dealing with one now that, you know, there's going to be partial denial because of some of the things that happened. But that adjuster is still listening. And that industry is still showing empathy, and still saying boy I can understand how difficult that would be. So we don't have to turn off the human side of us when we administer benefits. And so my big vision is building that out in a way that we can make an impact, do what's right, for everybody involved, whether that's an insurance worker, and find that balance, and at the same time, be profitable. And I think when you do what's right, it can be profitable. So that's, that's the one big idea. And I'm excited to see where that goes. I spoke about spoke about it at conferences, and I'm looking forward to talking about it and conferences this year as well. So that's one. Number two is our concept of business engagement grow. We created a whole new department in our company called business engagement, where we're having underwriting claims people enter in it's kind of a laboratory for them to develop the skills that will turn them into great adjusters and green underwriters. And I'm excited about the future of that, because I think we're doing something really unique and cool. I think others will follow as they see the success we're having with that. And I'm just excited to see how our see our future leaders grow from that department as they see the entire business understand how everything connects before they take the next step into which path they want to take. And I think that holistic view is going to really pay off five years from now when we have people in claims and underwriting roles that know
Scott Fink:That yes, that team is such a great pursuit. It's such a wonderful service to our customers are insured and our agents and the folks on that team. We really appreciate them, that they really make a difference for our company and Luella Alcorn who leads that group, under under your leadership is just absolutely wonderful that that that team has been a great creation for our company.
Greg Hamlin:I think it sets us apart and sets us apart is something different. So again, I just encourage people, if you haven't checked out either of those episodes, we did an episode of both of them. So I'm excited to see where those things go, I'm sure there's going to be modifications and changes to them as we go as we learn what works and doesn't work. But I'm excited about where both those places can take us and, and I'm excited for the ideas that we haven't yet dreamed up. We've hired a really fantastic group of people. And I expect that we continue to learn from each other, that we're going to have other great ideas that come out of this team that we haven't even thought of. And I'm excited for that. I mean, even just the title of the podcast Adjusted came from our intern at the time, Justin is now a full time employee started out in business engagement. And now he's in claims. He came up with a name it wasn't me.
Scott Fink:I did not know that. Wow. Yeah.
Greg Hamlin:So we put it out to the employees. And we had everybody enter and we got a ton of ideas. And and I saw that one I was like, That's it. That's it. It says everything I want to say. I guess my point is, I'm excited to see the ideas other people dream up, and what we're able to do together as we work through that, That's so exciting. So exciting. Well, I hope that that the audience has gotten a chance to really get to know you today. It is a long, promising career. You know, we're excited to keep watching it grow with you here at Berkley, Industrial Comp. And Greg, I really appreciate your time today answering all the questions putting up with me as a co-host. Any final thoughts on on your end?
Scott Fink:No, I would just say stick with our motto from adjusted that says do write think differently. And don't forget to care. I think that really says it all says everything that I've said today and little phrases. I appreciate you, Scott, thanks for joining me and switching switching roles and nice to be able to tell my story a little bit and just encourage others if you want to listen to more. Check us out on Apple's podcast platforms and also want to express Special thanks to camera and other intro and outro music. So thanks, Kerry. If you want to contact him, you can get ahold of them through our show notes. So appreciate everybody and hopefully join us next week for more fun thanks, guys.