The REAL Reasons Why Men Feel Lost | Shane Winnings

Men aren’t just lost — they’ve been slowly erased.

In this episode of the Rise Up Kings podcast, Skylar Lewis sits down with Shane Winnings, CEO of Promise Keepers, to unpack the REAL reasons men feel lost today.

From the rise of modern feminism to the cultural rejection of masculinity, we’ve gone so far left that men don’t know who they are anymore. We've traded leadership for passivity, purpose for comfort, and truth for tolerance.

This isn’t just about politics — it’s spiritual.

Fatherlessness is rising. Marriage is crumbling. Boys are growing up without a map. And men? We’re told to sit down, be quiet, and stop being “too much.”

But God’s design for manhood hasn’t changed. It’s time to return to it.

If you’ve been feeling distracted, numb, or unsure of your place in the world, this conversation will give you clarity, conviction, and the courage to lead again.

Shane Winnings is the CEO of Promise Keepers, a global men's ministry committed to raising up godly men who lead with courage, conviction, and purpose. He’s a former law enforcement officer, military veteran, speaker, and content creator reaching millions across social media with messages of faith, truth, and masculine leadership.

🔗 Connect with Shane Winnings
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@shanewinnings
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shanewinnings/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@shanewinnings
Website: https://www.shanewinnings.com
Promise Keepers: https://promisekeepers.org

For more information on Rise Up Kings, go to https://riseupkings.com/youtube

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Transcript

00:00:01:13 - 00:00:25:25
Unknown
When men don't know their role in the home. They're just like adult males, but they're not stepping into their calling as men. The reason women stepped up was men weren't stepping up. We were causing a lot of damage by our own unhealed, unrighteous selves. Proximity doesn't equal intentionality. Proximity doesn't equal presence. My kids will not feel my presence if I'm sitting up in the playpen while they're playing and I'm on my phone.

00:00:25:25 - 00:00:42:29
Unknown
But if I just put it down and I just look at them and I play with them, it's a whole different story. We're seeing now, a resurgence of men that are like, I'm ready to lead the right way now. No one ever became great because they were comfortable. You guys know what it takes to get to the next level at your job, in a sport, in the gym.

00:00:42:29 - 00:01:02:19
Unknown
Why are you not applying that same mindset spiritually? All right. Well, Shane, welcome to the podcast, brother. Thanks, man. Appreciate it. Been wanting to chat with you for a while, so I'm excited to be on here. Yeah, excited to have you. I'm going to dive straight in. We got a lot going on in our country, depending on when people are listening to this podcast.

00:01:02:21 - 00:01:25:14
Unknown
We are basically, stepping into war with Iran. And so I wanted to hear your, take, on what is, on our, I mean, we're going to go straight into the controversial topic. Yeah. So what is your take on our involvement with Iran? You know, I understand from the perspective of an ally. You know, I was talking to my wife.

00:01:25:14 - 00:01:47:18
Unknown
It's kind of one of those situations where it's like, you know, I remember when I was in the world when I was not, following Jesus. And you go out with your buddies, and if someone starts messing with your buddy, well, you got to step up. Well, there comes a point where if your buddy is the one kind of instigating things, you're like, dude, we have your back, but you're getting us involved in a bunch of junk.

00:01:47:20 - 00:02:18:05
Unknown
And I just say that to say, like the the dynamics of, standing with your allies can be very messy. I think people in America are looking at this and they're saying, we don't want, you know, blind allegiance to Israel or to any country. We want to see America first. And, I will say what I appreciate about, President Trump today was that, you know, as of today, June 24th, Israel and Iran both broke the, you know, peace treaty or whatever you want to call it.

00:02:18:12 - 00:02:39:28
Unknown
And Trump came out and said, I'm mad at Israel, too. And I think America needed to hear that because there was this kind of narrative going around that, like, we just support Israel and whatever they do. And so I think when it comes to America's involvement, yeah. We don't want to see, state sponsored terrorist, you know, country with a nuclear bomb.

00:02:39:29 - 00:03:00:06
Unknown
We also don't want to get sucked into another ground war for decades. I see both sides. It's messy. And my advice is like, we got to get used to navigating these waters because it's a result of sin. And it should further convict us to preach the gospel because, you know, it's a sin problem. It's not a war problem.

00:03:00:06 - 00:03:24:20
Unknown
It's not a land problem. It's a sin problem. That's good, that's good. And that may tie in to, directly into your involvement with Promise Keepers. So you're now in charge of what was, I believe, one of the country's largest kind of men's organizations and men's movements. Yeah. That kind of faded. Faded out. So it had some amazing heights, right?

00:03:24:21 - 00:03:47:18
Unknown
Hit that. Hit the mountaintop. Yeah. And so. And our country is in major need of more men stepping up. I found, for me personally, there's there's a lack of strong male leadership that, that I didn't have access to follow. My dad's an amazing guy. And there's an opportunity, for all of us to continue to step up as men who are leading our families effectively.

00:03:47:18 - 00:04:12:20
Unknown
And so this strong male leadership, is, has become weak inside of our country. And so Promise Keepers was was a way to bring love and connection and community. And they put on events all over the country, and they hit this mountaintop peak, and then they they faded away. And so you are now is a big deal. You are now the CEO and have been full of Promise Keepers, kind of this revitalized Promise Keepers.

00:04:12:23 - 00:04:37:05
Unknown
So a couple questions around that. What, what happened with Promise Keepers? Right. I have some, I have some thoughts, but then, and then and then what made you interested in taking on this role? So what happened? And then why were you interested in taking on the role? Yeah. Great question. You know, I often compare it to Vietnam, where we learned when you don't have war aims, you know, it's like a man without a mission.

00:04:37:07 - 00:04:51:10
Unknown
You're like, what do I do? And so in Vietnam, we would we would capture a hill. And when you go to capture a hill, like you're at a 3 to 1 disadvantage, fighting uphill so we would lose a bunch of guys, we capture this hill, we would know what to do with it. And so we'd give it up.

00:04:51:12 - 00:05:11:20
Unknown
And there were hills that we recaptured 2 or 3 more times. We're losing all these guys for what it's like. We get to the mountaintop and we don't know what to do. I think that was one piece of Promise Keepers, you know, specifically after the stand in the gap event in 1997, largest gathering in U.S. history on that property at the National Mall, there were 1.4 million men.

00:05:11:25 - 00:05:29:15
Unknown
Yeah. Incredible gathering. And it was all men. And it's like, where do we go from here? I think that was a piece of it. I know another piece of it was, you know, just like, you see, and in many organizations and unfortunately in ministry, people come in, they don't have the best interests of the organization in mind.

00:05:29:15 - 00:05:50:18
Unknown
They're looking to serve self. And, you know, so without blasting anyone, I'll just say that we had a lot of that going on. And, the organization almost completely went under. I mean, it was in a very bad spot about 7 or 8 years ago. Just getting off mission, you know, some some bad decisions being made. But praise God we're back on mission.

00:05:50:20 - 00:06:15:03
Unknown
We know why we're here. And that's the reason I stepped in, is because having been former, you know, military, former law enforcement, having been a man in the world myself, I see the need for like, godly men to rise up and lead, because if we don't, our country is in trouble, our families are in trouble. And so we need strong, godly men in this nation.

00:06:15:06 - 00:06:46:08
Unknown
Yeah. And there's a stirring in men's hearts right now. Specifically, I'm. I'm regularly talking to men who feel called to the men's movement and to men. The men's ministry. And I've also like like we are we are having an incredible amount of people that are coming through our events right now, and it's building significant momentum. And so there's this stirring in men's heart, like people are hungry to, I would say they're hungry to break free and step into a new level of freedom as men and a new level of power.

00:06:46:13 - 00:07:07:04
Unknown
Yeah. There's been a level of confusion and I would say suppression, that has happened inside of, men's hearts and their minds and their roles. And so men are they're hungry for they're hungry to step in and to leadership positions. Right. But really, what we're what we're seeing is I mean, and a lot of this, a lot of this stems from.

00:07:07:06 - 00:07:30:16
Unknown
Right, especially the whole feminist movement that's stemmed from men not stepping up like the reason women stepped up was men weren't stepping up. And so we were right. We were causing a lot of damage, by our own unhealed, unrighteous selves. And so at a certain point, women were like, hey, I'm going to take this into my own hands, which was not the right path at all.

00:07:30:18 - 00:07:51:25
Unknown
And part of Satan's plan, actually. And so we're seeing now a resurgence of men that are like, okay, we're I'm ready to lead the right way now. Yeah. Well, in it's in us like, God, you know, we're we're equal with women, but we have different roles. And we saw, you know, the pendulum always swings now, I'd say in the world, but definitely in America.

00:07:51:25 - 00:08:20:11
Unknown
And so I think the pendulum was swinging from like, you know what they saw as hyper hyper male to, okay, we want, you know, equal rights for women and all that stuff, which we, we should advocate for. But it went far beyond that where it was like, okay, anything you can do, I can do better. Okay. Now I can actually do what you do and I can replace you to, you know, now we're living in a day where, like, women are becoming men in their mind and they're getting surgeries.

00:08:20:11 - 00:08:46:13
Unknown
It's crazy. And it is the result, like you said, of men not knowing their identity and not knowing their mission to be a priest, provider and protector of the home. If I'm trying to be those three things, I'm not going to let my wife be those three things, because that's my job. And, you know, when men don't know their role in the home, they're just like adult males, but they're not stepping into their calling as men.

00:08:46:13 - 00:09:02:14
Unknown
And, that's why I appreciate the work you guys do, too, because we got to charge these guys up to lead. Let's talk about that priest provider and protector, to spend, spend a short amount of time on each of those. Right. So we have guys listening to this podcast, and there's always so many things to work on, right?

00:09:02:14 - 00:09:25:29
Unknown
Secular personal development. There's so many books. There's so much stuff that that one can focus on. So I love like we have something called the four pillars faith, family, fitness and finances. That's what our whole foundation of like what we teach and preach inside Iraq is like. There are all I started tracking habits and behaviors years ago. Probably ten plus years ago, I had a spreadsheet of like 60 different things I was tracking every day.

00:09:26:06 - 00:09:47:18
Unknown
Wow. And I was gathering guys up like, hey, let's go track our workouts, let's go track reading the Bible, let's go track all this stuff, because I really believe in tracking. But man 60 was too much. So I eventually narrowed it down to these four things. And like, if we can track a daily investment into our faith investments, to investments, to to to hit points or two spots per, per pillar, that's a faith.

00:09:47:18 - 00:10:07:13
Unknown
If we can invest every day with our wives, every day with our, with our children inside that family pillar, if we can do every day in our fitness, our nutrition, and every day in our finances, if we can make those and do it every single day, those pillars will become strong to the point where God has the ability to put some pressure on that kingdom.

00:10:07:13 - 00:10:29:21
Unknown
You would say so, like a lot of us, like, hey, I want to go build this epic kingdom business community, family influence. But man, if we have a weak pillar, like if our family and our marriage is cracked and that pillars weak that day, that will not hold what God has in store for you. And so if we want blessings and we want to be men of influence, we got to keep working on those pillars and strengthening them.

00:10:29:21 - 00:10:47:10
Unknown
So I love men. Yeah. So I love that. I love that idea of of of simplifying it. So priest provider and protector. Yeah dude I agree. And the word we've been using really, I feel like the last eight months with our men is intentionality. And when you're tracking your intentional, you know, you're not letting things slip. Priest.

00:10:47:10 - 00:11:09:12
Unknown
Provider. Protector. Yeah. You know, number one, priest, you are intentionally leading your family in the ways of God. And that's not just like driving him to church on Sunday. You know, it's it's being the priest of your home. Are you actually raising your family and your kids in the ways of the Lord, or are you subcontracting that out to someone else once a week, you know, are you leading prayers in your home?

00:11:09:12 - 00:11:38:22
Unknown
Are you teaching the Bible, reading it with them like praying over them, praying with them? Protector. You know, we all understand that keeping the bad guy from coming in the door. But what about protecting from bad theology and bad ideology? There's tons of that out there. And so whether that looks like limiting your kids screen time or pointing out, you know, some wrong ideology and teaching them the biblical way, we've got to protect the minds and the hearts of our family and, providing as well.

00:11:38:25 - 00:11:54:01
Unknown
You know, the Bible says that a man who doesn't provide for his family is worse than an unbeliever. I don't fully know what that means, but it doesn't sound good. And so it's like we've got to provide not just food and clothes on our back and a roof over our home, but a man's presence provides a stable household.

00:11:54:01 - 00:12:14:21
Unknown
And so we've got to provide that intentional time with our kids. Because I heard this earlier, I didn't fact check it, but it's like by the time your kids reach, high school age or whatever, you've already spent 75% of the time that you will spend with them in their life. So these years are flying by, man. And and we've got to be guys who are on mission.

00:12:14:21 - 00:12:33:00
Unknown
And I think if we're priest provider protectors on purpose, if we're following the four pillars, right, we're going to be great, strong men of God doing the best we can. And that's really that's what God asked for our best. Yeah. Man's role, as I see it, is to be the oak tree right. So the oak tree is rooted.

00:12:33:00 - 00:12:55:04
Unknown
It's grounded hopefully in Christ. And it provides a covering of protection over the family. Right. And so I see us as that role man. We're that oak tree. We're stable when the storms of life come were that were the grounded, were the grounded source of, of of protection and provision that they can always come and sit under verses.

00:12:55:04 - 00:13:13:19
Unknown
There's a lot of men that are, that are, kind of just like a palm tree. They're just swaying whatever direction is needed right now. Hey, it's it's business right now. We're. Hey, it's it's it's, Hey. So when the storms of life come, they are they're are all over the place. Yeah. Because oak tree. Right? It's stable.

00:13:13:19 - 00:13:29:27
Unknown
It's grounded. It's it's, it's strong. And so part of, Yeah, part of my mission, man, in alignment with yours is seeing more men that can be that oak tree and, and be intentional. And so what happens is we we need those we need good leaders and mentors to kind of get us to that place.

00:13:29:27 - 00:14:06:17
Unknown
Yes. Hopefully that have an, an ideology that aligns, with Scripture. Yeah, that's getting harder to find, honestly, in today's culture. You know, I see a lot of people professing Jesus, but that Jesus doesn't look anything like the word. And, so you've got to navigate and sift through all the junk. And I think, like, pointing out what you said about being that tree, you know, or being that pillar being the lighthouse or whatever you want to call it, that also provides stability for the man because like, dude, if we're doing what God has called us to do, like, you're going to feel like the weight of the world is on your shoulders

00:14:06:17 - 00:14:29:28
Unknown
when you're providing for your family, when you're trying to lead them, when you've got something going on and you yourself don't want to have anxiety in your heart because you're being tossed to and fro like waves in the wind, right by every doctrine that comes along. And so when we know for a fact, like, man, I'm walking in the lane that God has put me in, I'm taking care of my business, right?

00:14:29:28 - 00:15:00:01
Unknown
I'm honoring God and stewarding everything in my life. Well, you have this solid foundation, even within your own soul, within your mind, within your heart. And and I think part of the reason a lot of men waver is because with their family and these other things is because they're wavering on the inside. And so I know our heart both is like, we want to see the man strengthened, you know, because we have a great responsibility and you can't do that if you're if your foundation is like, fractured, what would you say?

00:15:00:03 - 00:15:38:07
Unknown
What would you say is an area that you, struggle and right now, when it comes to intentionality around, either those four pillars or family. Oh, man, that's a good one. Honestly, I would say, with my with my family, like, being intentional and the, the, I think the thing that can become, like, deceptive is that I do try to spend a lot of intentional time with my kids and with my wife, but then I can just as easily get distracted with something else, and I'll think, oh, because we spent some good intentional time here.

00:15:38:10 - 00:16:02:17
Unknown
Like, I'm good. You know, I've, I've checked that box and and the two maybe they don't balance. Like, it's actually way more disproportionate than I actually think of times that I'm sitting around, you know, and I'm, I'm doing one of these and I'm, you know, just a quick to, you know, I just got to send a quick email and it's like hours can go by where you're just doing that one little thing.

00:16:02:19 - 00:16:24:16
Unknown
And I would say that's my weakness is like being able to shut it off. And because proximity doesn't equal intentionality, right. Proximity doesn't equal presence. My kids will not feel my presence if I'm sitting up in the playpen while they're playing and I'm on my phone. But if I just put it down and I just look at them and I play with them, it's a it's a whole different story.

00:16:24:16 - 00:16:40:24
Unknown
And so for me, I think that's definitely my weakness. Is, is and I think for a lot of guys like us who don't go to a building, maybe to work or report to a 9 to 5, it's just easy to always kind of be getting into something. And I would say for anyone in ministry, especially in ministry, man.

00:16:40:29 - 00:16:59:27
Unknown
Yeah, everything you're doing is for the Lord. So it can always take precedence. And it's like, dude, I'm I need to be with my family because I've been called to biblically as well. So I can't let work Trump that. And so yeah, that's that's probably my biggest one. Yeah. There's a great, there's a great app called App Blocker, man.

00:16:59:27 - 00:17:14:18
Unknown
It's cool. You can set schedules and it can literally lock your phone to where you actually cannot access it at all. Like, there's no way you can get into it. So, like, I have it set at a certain time at night where social media completely turns off and I can't click on any of it and there's no way around it.

00:17:14:24 - 00:17:33:03
Unknown
Wow. And so it's, Yeah, it's been effective for me because I. Yeah, I can get caught up a little bit too, too, too often and not being, and just lacking presence around around the kids. My wife luckily holds a high standard, though, so she, she's pretty on top of me, man. If she if she notices me on the phone, she'll she'll call it out and go.

00:17:33:04 - 00:17:52:00
Unknown
Yeah. Good. So I can catch it. And I gave her permission. I'm like, hey, babe, feel free. If I first start slipping in this area, feel free to call me up in it because. Because I want to. Man, I, I realized I think Jessica mentioned my wife. She said we only have. Oh. Is it? We only have, like five more summers.

00:17:52:00 - 00:18:08:07
Unknown
Like with my oldest, we have a 12 year old boy, so it's like five summers. So as I'm thinking through the summer, I want to do some fun stuff with them, but I haven't. I don't have a epically planned summer with the family. We had a couple little vacations and things, but I have five summers left with my with my little guy.

00:18:08:07 - 00:18:24:24
Unknown
So I'm like, you know what? I gotta make this thing rock. I can't make this summer so freaking fun that I like. He'll remember this summer forever versus me. Just kind of, hey, I'm at the pool with them. Like, I want to make it really special. And so that was, that was a good little reality check. Oh, that's cool man.

00:18:24:24 - 00:18:43:28
Unknown
Dude, my wife's name is Jessica also. And, yeah, yeah. And same deal. Like, there's, no phones at the table rule, so, you know, and I have a, I have a Garmin watch. And so it's nice because I can't text from it or anything. I just get the, the text itself so I can read it. And sometimes I'll get a text, I'm like, oh, that's important.

00:18:43:28 - 00:19:04:06
Unknown
And I'll start to pull my phone out and it's like, hey, not at dinner time, you know? And I appreciate that. Even if I think it's important, it's like, look, if it's really that important, I'll step away and I'll go make a phone call. But at the end of the day, like, is it that important? And I think for me, I've had to redefine like what is important versus what's right in front of me.

00:19:04:08 - 00:19:22:17
Unknown
You know, what am I showing my kids when they're watching dad at dinner, you know, constantly, you know, just just one more thing I like. I want to be a man of my word, too. And that that isn't just for some of the things that we all, identify with as being a man of integrity. I want to be a man of my word.

00:19:22:17 - 00:19:41:14
Unknown
That's like. Man, you know what dad said? Dinner times for the family. And every time he sat down to dinner, like his attention was on the family. And I think that's another way where when they grow older, that consistency, it's been modeled to them. They'll appreciate it. And I hope they will replicate it in their families. I love it.

00:19:41:14 - 00:19:59:01
Unknown
Yeah. There's a book, The Intentional Father by John Tyson. I was talking to him a couple weeks ago, and, he, he talks about that. Just the modeling that takes place right? When your kids see a dad that went, like, all out. And that's part of my. Why? Like, I want to be the version of myself for my kids.

00:19:59:01 - 00:20:25:13
Unknown
See, a man that went all out in his faith, all out in each of these areas, and was committed to being the best version of himself for Christ, the best version of Christ, you could say. Yeah. And so, like, I want to I want to be that like I want them to see that and so, yeah, it's interesting part of my journey right now with my son, Brandon, he's getting into the teenage years and he, he's starting to want to disconnect a little bit, like less less about intimacy.

00:20:25:13 - 00:20:49:06
Unknown
He's a little bit of a harder kid. Meaning, this guy kind of got it. He's more protection. He's like, he protects himself a little bit more than my nine year old. Jeremiah. And so, like, my intentionality now is, how do I, bill? How do I create vulnerable moments and opportunities where I can lean in with Brandon and like, I had a, I was, I was, I was we were reading, you know, Jocko books.

00:20:49:06 - 00:21:07:07
Unknown
The way of the warrior kid. Yeah, I've heard of those. Yeah, they're pretty cool. So I read I read one of the books, and I was, and I, I had a, a conversation with them because he was like, we all did push ups, like, after we read a chapter. And then as we did the push ups, like, he kind of gave up and he, like, wouldn't do any more just being stubborn.

00:21:07:07 - 00:21:23:23
Unknown
I'm like, dude, you're being a wimp. Come on. And then as I as and then I, we, we ended up going to bed. And then I sat there laying in bed thinking interesting. Like, because I know we do that we, we're, we're one of the largest Christians. We may be the largest Christian personal development organization in the country.

00:21:23:23 - 00:21:54:00
Unknown
So meaning like the amount of seminars like we do really deep transformational work, healing work, mindset stuff like a lot. And so I know the power of words like a or level. And I know that, about 80% of our belief systems, are locked in by the time we're 12 to 13 years old. For the rest of our lives, what we got ourselves God, people, money, relationships, all this stuff is, like, locked in unless we go through and reprocess through it, which is what we do in Iraq.

00:21:54:02 - 00:22:12:03
Unknown
And so it's locked in. So I'm like, you're little, you know, you wimp. And I thought about it. I'm like, crap. I started to feel guilty. I'm like like, that's horrible. Like, I don't want him to ever think and remember that memory forever. The time that his dad just like, straight up called him like a wimp. And so, yeah, I got up out of bed, walked over to his room.

00:22:12:03 - 00:22:28:03
Unknown
He was almost asleep. I said, hey, dude, let's talk real quick. And then I had a conversation with them. I'm like, hey, man, I said that because I love you. I want to push you. But you know, I know you're not a wimp. You're a super strong kid and had a really good. And he got super real as I started watering and he got real vulnerable with me.

00:22:28:05 - 00:22:49:14
Unknown
And now with like a real intimate moment. So I want more of those not intentionally right, causing some pain, but I walked right. Intimate moments I, I feel like I don't get to experience those as much as I would like. I want to keep that bond really strong through his teenage years. Yeah, man. That's that's powerful. And I think I see myself already.

00:22:49:14 - 00:23:08:10
Unknown
You know, my oldest, Elijah's, going to be for this winter. And my youngest, Micah, is going to be to here soon. And I already see myself with Elijah, the oldest. Like starting to think the mentality that I had when I was in the military, you know, whether I was training with, you know, a lead organization or whatever.

00:23:08:10 - 00:23:31:29
Unknown
I served with the first Special Forces group. I've been through really hard military courses, and I remember the things that changed me. But I have to remember, like, dude, I was 18 years old. I was 20 years old. I was 22. I was training for war. I was training with the nation's elite. Like, I wasn't for, you know, or I wasn't six or however old you know, he's going to be when we have these conversations.

00:23:32:01 - 00:23:52:26
Unknown
And I just have to remember or when I was a cop, I was a field training officer. I trained rookies, you know, and it's life or death out there on the street. And I have to remember, like, these are my boys. Like, I want the the toughness, but I can't act like that was me at that age. You know, I didn't get any of this real toughness.

00:23:52:29 - 00:24:12:21
Unknown
And I wrestled through my whole junior high and high school career, but I did not get that mental toughness and begin to understand breaking through barriers until my freshman year of college doing ROTC training, where I really got pushed a few times to to where I wanted to just cry. But I kept going and I learned about overcoming.

00:24:12:24 - 00:24:31:07
Unknown
And I think, you know, guys like us, we've got valuable things for our kids. But the thing I got to keep remembering is like, dude, this is my this is my boy. And like, he's going to be a man. But right now he's my sweet little boy. And you know, I want him to be tough. If he falls on his bike, I'll say, hey, buddy, you know, dusted off and yeah, we're going to keep going.

00:24:31:13 - 00:24:49:27
Unknown
But I also recognize there's times when he's going to cry over something. And I got to say, you know what, buddy? Just come here like, just give me a hug. I love you. And, that has been a real, place of, I don't know, it's like we're walking in attention of, like, what do I do? I don't want to make him weak, but I don't, you know what I mean?

00:24:50:01 - 00:25:10:22
Unknown
So I feel that when you say that, bro, I'm like, I feel that. Yeah. What, hard kind of hard shift. I'd love to get in. You've been showing up to some college campuses lately. I believe that college campuses. Right. Then you show it up. So what's your, pull on some, Charlie Kirk? What's, what what's what's your what's your reason for going out there?

00:25:10:22 - 00:25:36:01
Unknown
Like, what's your intention. Yeah. So I've, I was doing work with like, TP USA faith, the faith branch of Turning Point for several years before I took over Promise Keepers. And, you know, during that time, I saw the effectiveness of, like, what Charlie does on campuses. And if you really think about it like, this is what philosophers back in the day used to do, you know, they'd show up in a, in a public area and they would just have these debates and it works.

00:25:36:04 - 00:25:57:27
Unknown
And not only does it work in person, but like the content goes viral as well. And many people engage to the content. And I'm just like, this is such a great model to have hard conversations. And so I'm like, you know what? Instead of trying to get college kids to cram into an arena because there's already people doing that, and I can't accomplish what I really want to accomplish.

00:25:57:27 - 00:26:15:28
Unknown
Like, you can't go deep with 10,000 people in an arena. Not like you can if you show up to a campus and you've got a sign that says America needs godly men, prove me wrong. Right? And you have these hours of open discussions back and forth. You know, why do you believe what you believe? Give me the reasons.

00:26:15:28 - 00:26:34:21
Unknown
Give me the facts. Give me the scriptures. Whatever it is, man, we did three stops is like a test run in the spring. And it was. It was incredible. I mean, we had a lot of people come out. We had these amazing conversations. We had professors come out yelling at me, you know, getting upset. And so we're just like, we got to keep this thing rolling.

00:26:34:21 - 00:26:56:09
Unknown
And so come fall, we're going to hit it hard and just go all around the country. Man, I love it. It's so good. It's so good. It's so needed. Our culture has been so shifted from college campuses on the liberal side of things. Right. And so we need more men willing to step into that. Firing squad right there.

00:26:56:09 - 00:27:15:25
Unknown
Just you. You're asking for it. You really are, man. Yeah. See, I don't know everything. And I was nervous, man. I haven't been nervous in a very long time. But last time I was legitimately, like, nervous was we were kicking a door in in, like, 2019, and we knew there was a guy on the other side with a gun and I'm just like, I don't know how this is going to go.

00:27:15:27 - 00:27:34:12
Unknown
I haven't been that nervous since the first college stop I went to do because I'm like, dude, I'm not Charlie Kirk. Like, I can't debate, like, I don't I don't know what this book says on page 323, like, but I just remembered, you know, I'm I'm not here to just debate anything. I'm here to talk about being a godly man.

00:27:34:17 - 00:28:01:07
Unknown
I believe I know how to do that. And so I just can't get sucked into every other argument. And I think when I had that confidence of just, hey, remember why I'm here? What I found was like, we had some really fruitful conversations. It helped me grow because people are putting me in a corner and I'm having to defend my beliefs, and I feel like I came out every time, just like, man, I I've doubled down on why I believe what I believe.

00:28:01:10 - 00:28:26:20
Unknown
Because you go to these college campuses, man. And I've been asking like one simple question does a child deserve a mom and a dad? And overwhelmingly, I'm hearing from college kids. I don't think so. I don't think so. You know, as long as they have two people who could fill that role, it's like instantly college kids are showing you where their heads are at, that they don't respect the roles of a mom and a dad.

00:28:26:20 - 00:28:46:24
Unknown
They think that it could just be done by anyone. And I think as a society, when we've gotten to that place where the next generation does not value the presence of a mom and a dad, it's pretty revealing of what's going on at the heart of our culture. Yeah. I've watched, watched a couple of those videos where that was the that was the core question.

00:28:46:24 - 00:29:06:05
Unknown
What's, and what, what do you, what's typically your reply. So when they, when they, when they say hey no I don't think and there was one guy you were talking to where he yeah. He was saying, yeah. He, he was basically saying, like, one, one parent would be fine. And you're like, would you, would you want one parent, right?

00:29:06:05 - 00:29:24:22
Unknown
Or something like that? And he's like, well, no. Yeah. Or they didn't. They had both parents, but they don't think someone else should. Yeah. I just go back to, you know, I try to put them in a corner to be honest. And I say I set them up. I say, look, there's a mom, there's a woman, have a specific role in a home.

00:29:24:22 - 00:29:42:09
Unknown
Is she valuable? Is her presence unique and separate from men? You know, as a mom? And they say, well, yeah. And I say, what about a man, you know, as a father, this and that? Yeah, I believe that. Okay. So should a child deserve, you know, to have the opportunity to have a father and a mother in the home.

00:29:42:09 - 00:30:03:25
Unknown
Well, and I go, look, you already said they both have inherent value. They have unique roles. And they say, well, it can be fulfilled by anyone. And so I kind of just poke holes in their argument, like, look, you're either denying, women or you're denying men, but like, you're taking the position that you're actually arguing against, which is not inclusive, right?

00:30:03:25 - 00:30:24:01
Unknown
It's not seeing people as equal. It's actually saying men aren't important or women aren't important because two men can do it, two women can do it. And you kind of just point out like the hypocrisy of their arguments. But at the end of the day, I do believe it's a spirit. The Bible says that there's a spirit of truth and a spirit of error.

00:30:24:04 - 00:30:46:08
Unknown
And I think a lot of these kids that they've just been raised by the world in a spirit of error. And so we have to remember as Christians, like, I'm not just here debating ideas, but I'm here bringing the gospel. And sometimes it's wrapped in a prove me wrong style debate. So we're seeing the truth get out there and we're, you know, you watch some of these videos and these kids get stumped.

00:30:46:13 - 00:31:04:03
Unknown
And that's what I'm going for, is I don't care what happens there. I don't care if they yell at me. I don't care if they drop the mic or whatever. I want them to go home and lay down in bed and go, man, that guy said something that I just can't, I can't reason with. And, that opens the door, I believe, for the Holy Spirit to speak.

00:31:04:05 - 00:31:25:29
Unknown
What would you. And as I go to my next question, I'd love to hear that. What were the results? So why are you going to going to continue to do that? Yeah. I mean, the first campus we went to, we went to UCF. We had a pretty decent turnout. But the second campus we went to was Florida International University, and we did no prep.

00:31:25:29 - 00:31:55:02
Unknown
We didn't do any flier drop or anything. And we had at one point we had a crowd of probably 60 people and hundreds came through over the few hours. But then the social media side of that, we're talking millions of views from these clips. And so I'm like, dude, you look at the engagement. If you even look from a CEO perspective, the ROI on like how much it costs to go to a college campus and set up a table and just debate kids for hours, it why would I not do this?

00:31:55:04 - 00:32:14:13
Unknown
And also just people saying, man, when are you coming to this campus? It's like they want to feel heard. I think the, the, the setup itself, just like setting a table up in the middle of campus. It's very inviting. You know, when you just have another mic out there and it's just like, step up to the plate and give me what you got.

00:32:14:16 - 00:32:32:09
Unknown
Kids want that. And, so it's it's exciting. Yeah. My, my social media guys listen to this thinking he's been wanting me to go out and do that. I'm like, dude, not gotta write me out. A couple of them. What was that? You might have to join me at a few of them. Yeah, I love that. That would be actually a lot of fun.

00:32:32:09 - 00:32:47:18
Unknown
Let me go away. Are you coming out to Dallas anytime soon? I'll. We'll we'll go. We'll go everywhere we can, man. I'll keep you updated. Yeah. Let me know. That would be. That would be a lot of fun. I love again I love what Charlie Kirk's done and how he's he's really shifted a lot of people's thinking. Yeah, I agree, dude.

00:32:47:18 - 00:33:10:24
Unknown
Just from doing that, what, and what is, Promise Keepers like mission. So you're a younger CEO, I believe, from what they who they had previously. So it's a whole different shift and feel like you've kind of revitalized it. So what's the mission moving forward? So before was large events and, looking to create community through these large events?

00:33:10:28 - 00:33:32:08
Unknown
Yeah. What's the vision for Promise Keepers and and the vision for execution? Yeah. I mean, you know, our mission statement now is, to help every man grow in Christ, becoming better husbands, fathers and citizens. So everything we do is going to be, you know, funneled through that while we don't have the pull that we did in the 90s.

00:33:32:08 - 00:33:49:14
Unknown
And frankly, there's not a lot of people that are filling up stadiums unless you're a massive worship leader or it's like an ongoing or recurring event, you know, like, passion or something like that, like guys are doing it, but it's not happening at the level it was in the 90s. And I think that could be a good thing.

00:33:49:20 - 00:34:10:27
Unknown
There's just there's a lot of stuff for men, but there's also not enough stuff for men. So we're kind of living in that tension of like, PK is not unique anymore. And in terms of like, we're not one of the only men's organizations, there's tons, which I'm grateful for, but we've pivoted a little bit. And so we will keep holding men's conferences.

00:34:11:00 - 00:34:29:23
Unknown
But we're also we've got a, weekly zoom Bible study, which has been awesome. I mean, last week we had a guy on there from Nigeria. He was up at 3 a.m., so he could be on the zoom. And I'm like, why are you on here? And he said, I don't have this kind of brotherhood here of guys who want to, study the scriptures.

00:34:29:26 - 00:34:48:26
Unknown
And I'm just like, man, you know, I see the power in that. So we've got the zoom, we've got our ambassador program, which is guys that are leading groups across the nation, and connecting with other ministries because unfortunately, like, you know, one, there would be two churches across the street from each other, and they'll never talk.

00:34:48:28 - 00:35:11:21
Unknown
Right. It's these, like, little kings, little kingdoms thing. Yeah, yeah, but they both might send their men to a Promise Keepers thing, you know, or to a rise up Kings thing. And so I see the advantage we have as being like, quote unquote para church. So we'll continue to do that. But yeah, that's really our goal between the campuses, the conferences, which, you know, it's the same style of conference.

00:35:11:21 - 00:35:38:09
Unknown
It's just not 80,000 men. And then I am excited to, you know, I'll kind of draw up here that we're in the very early stages of the 30 year anniversary of stand in the gap, which was that massive event I talked about in, in 97 where we're we're working with the I think the Parks Department right now to lock in a date for hopefully, October 2027 for that 30 year anniversary.

00:35:38:11 - 00:36:07:25
Unknown
Be powerful to gather a ton of men again and just, you know, solemn assembly. Beautiful. Yeah. What, let's let's go into, a conversation around Marxism. How does that contradict, biblical values and a biblical worldview? So it's important there's a lot of people that I know that are men of faith. However, they're not clear on their ideology as far as where they stand, either from more conservative values, more liberal values.

00:36:07:25 - 00:36:44:17
Unknown
They're there. They think it's the they think anything goes right. So let's talk more about that. Yeah. I mean, you know, Marxist at its core. It's looking at people through economic stance, you know, eliminating free market, private ownership, private property. It's really just counter to the gospel. Even Billy Graham said that, it was Satan's religion. So, you know, I think, basic, economics class or just look on eye of like, why is Marxism bad versus capitalism?

00:36:44:19 - 00:37:09:05
Unknown
That's the one thing, you know, but what we've learned through history is that the strongest opposition to Marxism, because it's never actually worked anywhere. It's been implemented. The strongest opposition to Marxism is a strong family. Any nation where there are strong families, Marxism does not work. And so men are supposed to be leaders of those families.

00:37:09:05 - 00:37:26:04
Unknown
So I think as we're talking to our men, it's like, look, you've got to step up and lead because believe it or not, you know, not everyone has your best interests in mind. Not everyone in the government has your best interests in mind. And we're only one generation away from the freedoms we understand being taken away from us.

00:37:26:07 - 00:37:54:16
Unknown
And, that is something that we can't take lightly. I mean, what is it? What do they say? Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it. Yeah. We can't think just because we are born or live in a free nation that, you know, it's guaranteed for the rest of the existence of America. And so I do think when it comes to some of these political things, some of these economic decisions that are being made, we've got to understand what's happening in the world so that we can press up against it from a biblical perspective.

00:37:54:24 - 00:38:25:27
Unknown
But yeah, I think it would be hard for me to understand any Christian that could advocate for Marxism, which paves the way for communism. Yeah. There's a, Are you familiar with the term sage comm? I'm not actually. So sage cons are, Well, so I'm working with, so one of our pastors that's on staff, we have a couple on staff pastors and, JC and so he is, he's actively working with different, political figures to support their election and them getting elected in a certain offices.

00:38:25:27 - 00:38:51:19
Unknown
And so sage cons are a key part of his, strategy. So sage cons are spiritually active, governmentally engaged, so sage spiritually active, governmentally engaged conservatives. Okay, that's a sage con. And so sage cons, they hold 9% of the voting rights. There's about 20 million of them. They're very politically active. They're interested in politics. They believe they believe in Christian values.

00:38:51:19 - 00:39:18:04
Unknown
They attend church, they support, they pray. And then they have a very they have the highest, voter turnout. So over, about 94%. And so great. Can't win an election, presidential election. So he was involved on the, yeah, involved in Trump administration. He was actually involved with the VEC and him, stepping into the Ohio governor, even though Bhavik is not Christian, he's going to be supporting Christian values.

00:39:18:10 - 00:39:39:27
Unknown
So you can't win an election with, with sage cons, but you can't you can't win an election without them. I see, so it's a it's just a it's a, it's important. And I think this is a growing space where as, the left is, has continued to gain momentum. There's more and more Christians that are realizing how important it is to have conservative values.

00:39:40:04 - 00:40:11:24
Unknown
Yeah. To step to, to take a stand for those values. But that sounds like city elders. Have you heard of them before? Yeah. City elders is like another organization like that. They, you know, they feel like they've cracked the, the model for, like, biblical, campaigning and and running a biblical platform. And I'm probably butchering the numbers, but I heard it somewhere, like, you know, they've they've, put up 50 people for election, and only five of them have lost, like, they they've done a great job.

00:40:11:27 - 00:40:41:15
Unknown
Spoken at one of their meetings before out in Oklahoma. And same kind of principle. It's like it's all rallied around. What does it look like to be a governing official from a biblical perspective? Because people can say like, oh, we shouldn't be in politics. Well, politics, if left to its own devices, will be completely worldly. And, you know, politics is really the highest form of love, as a government, because politics is how you take care of people on a macro level.

00:40:41:18 - 00:41:00:22
Unknown
So it's like, why would I not want to have a say in that? And the Bible is highly political. If you read the Old Testament, you know, you look through the Proverbs, it says when the wicked rule, the people groan. And yeah, like we've certainly grown in America with, with different leadership. And, so I, I support it entirely.

00:41:00:22 - 00:41:23:17
Unknown
I think that we need to have godly people who are serving in these positions of government who are ultimately submitted to God. And if that's the case, I think our country will flourish. I will say, too, that any nation that's turned their back on God, it's never worked out for them very well. So, we don't want to fall in line with that either.

00:41:23:19 - 00:41:43:07
Unknown
Yeah. I love your hat. Make that. Thanks man. I wore it in Seattle this weekend. I got a lot of, I got a lot of double takes people. We're glaring at me. And then they looked like repentant Lee after they saw that it didn't say America. It's great. It's great. I think, yeah.

00:41:43:07 - 00:42:00:19
Unknown
It's such an important cause due to helping fathers step in to, start to step into being because, I mean, I have a saying you can change a man, change the world. And so if we can shift one dude that is a better father and better husband and leads his family different like that ripple effect is gigantic because then his kids grow up differently.

00:42:00:21 - 00:42:25:08
Unknown
They they treat other people differently. And if you can go change a business owner or an entrepreneur, which is where we're heavily engaged in the, entrepreneurship space. You go change a leader that leads his, you know, 20 employees or 300 employees, and you shift the way he operates. Like, we had one guy, he, is about 300 plus employees, and he came through one of our events, and dude completely shifted his entire life.

00:42:25:09 - 00:42:50:08
Unknown
He's running Bible studies in his company. He's had. Wow, 16 guys come through this event. He, So, like, when guys get when a fire gets ignited, there is so much like, with what you guys do, there's so much opportunity for transformation, outside of himself. When a guy gets on fire, like, we are powerful leaders, when we allow God to rule inside of our lives.

00:42:50:12 - 00:43:13:29
Unknown
But there's got to be that ignition. There's got to be fire that gets ignited because there's a lot of, men that are in a sedative state right now that are sedating with alcohol, with drugs, with social media, with the news. They're just a they're sedative state. And so, like, man, we gotta we gotta awaken them and reignite a fire that just where they realize this life is short.

00:43:13:29 - 00:43:39:19
Unknown
And then they have an impact to go make, either with their family, their employees, their community. And so yeah, man, I just want to see more men on fire. For Christ and on fire to go make a difference in this world. Besides, living a life of, I'd say mediocrity, but even even worse than that of of, of numbness and carelessness and just being, yeah.

00:43:39:19 - 00:44:10:11
Unknown
Where they're just stuck. Yeah. Or they're just live and comfortable, you know, they, they don't want to rock the boat. I've got my routine, I've got my thing. And it's like, no one ever became great because they were comfortable. And it's like, that's just a basic principle. Whether it's in, your job or in sports. Like we all know, I was telling my guys this last week during our zoom, I'm like, you guys know what it takes to get to the next level at your job in a sport, in the in the gym, like, whatever.

00:44:10:13 - 00:44:29:11
Unknown
Why are you not applying that same mindset spiritually? You know, like, why are you not saying like studying it? I remember when I was first starting to play golf, like I pretty much don't play anymore. I play pickleball now because it's, you know, it's it's fun. Pickleball. We have a board at our house, so yeah, that's epic.

00:44:29:11 - 00:44:47:29
Unknown
We'll have to play. But like, when I first started golf, I was like, dude, I want to get good. And so I'm watching YouTube videos. I got lessons, I'm out there practicing, I'm tracking, you know, I'm videoing my swing, I'm making changes. And I remember just thinking like, dude, I know how to analyze and do whatever I need to do to get better.

00:44:48:01 - 00:45:03:11
Unknown
Why is it easier for me to do that on the golf course than it is in my spiritual life? Like, how often do I sit down and I go to prayer and I go, father, show me the areas that I need to grow as a man, you know? Or let me reflect, let me let me watch, you know, and look back.

00:45:03:11 - 00:45:24:13
Unknown
How how have I treated my family? How have I spent my my time with you? You know, have I been entertained by lesser things and, like, having this moment of reflection and then asking the Lord to help me, committing to to bettering myself in those areas? A lot of guys I feel like aren't doing that. And man, like, we need to be those men.

00:45:24:13 - 00:45:48:01
Unknown
We've got to model it and we need to charge other men to do it too. Because here's the other thing, bro. If the world is going, it wants to go to hell in a handbasket. I want to be the guy that is shielding my family to where they're not feeling the effects of that, like maybe others would. And I mean, I don't know about you, but like, I know as a kid, we went through a lot of stuff in my 18 years, in my parents home.

00:45:48:07 - 00:46:10:12
Unknown
But I was shielded from a lot of that. I didn't know, you know, a lot of times if my parents were going through financial problems or they didn't know where this bill was going to come from or whatever, I didn't know that stuff. Like they shielded, me and my sister from that. And I just think about, man, they created a home where they protected us and they they showed us the ways of the Lord.

00:46:10:14 - 00:46:38:04
Unknown
And I have to do that on purpose, because if we don't wake up and try to become more like God every day on purpose, by default, we're going to become more like our flesh and more like the world. So intentionality, man, I think that's that's my word right now. Yep, yep. Spiritual intentionality around spiritual formation. Right? We, a big, who someone I consider a mentor didn't meet him, but through his books is a Dallas Willard and spiritual formation.

00:46:38:06 - 00:46:58:28
Unknown
It's a powerful, having spiritual disciplines and a regular intentionality around our faith can transform a human being from the inside out. And so, Yeah. Love him. In other. What, man, as we're coming to an end, where, where can people find you? You built a great YouTube channel you got. Right? You've reached millions of people through all your social media.

00:46:58:29 - 00:47:15:16
Unknown
You're killing it. Wow. Thanks, man. Where's the best place for people to follow you and and get to know you more? Yeah. Well, you could follow, Promise Keepers on Instagram. We do have a YouTube. We're becoming more active there. You know, just search for our name there. And then my personal channel's just Shane. Shane Winning's on YouTube.

00:47:15:16 - 00:47:36:19
Unknown
And I do teachings, you know, throughout the week. And we just launched an app last month. So all our teachings are on there ways to connect conferences, you know, want to join our team, become an ambassador, lead a group, or be a field rep in your area? All that's on the app. So like you said, man, we just want to help play a part in sparking that fire in a man.

00:47:36:21 - 00:47:53:27
Unknown
Because I know for me, and I'm sure you'd say the same once that fire got started, like nobody's putting it out, I and my wife will tell you, I'm one of the most stubborn people in the world, and that can be a great quality. It can be a bad one. But like, if my mind is set on something, that's it.

00:47:53:29 - 00:48:12:10
Unknown
I'll. I'll run through a wall to get it done. And if we can help these men just for a moment care about what God thinks, and they get that fire, they'll be different for a lifetime. And, so that's what all our content is geared towards. And and hopefully people will check us out. Love it. Appreciate your time, man.

00:48:12:10 - 00:48:23:06
Unknown
I know we got a lot going on right now. So you do too. So thanks bro. Yeah, thanks for being on the show. Heck yeah. This is great. Thank you.