Talking Trees with Davey Tree

Best Big Trees for the Landscape

January 27, 2022 The Davey Tree Expert Company Season 2 Episode 4
Talking Trees with Davey Tree
Best Big Trees for the Landscape
Show Notes Transcript

Sean Zieche from Davey's Glen Ellyn, Illinois,  office shares some of his favorite big trees for the landscape, as well as why it's important to plant a big tree in the right spot.

We are celebrating our one-year podcast anniversary this month with a Davey Bluetooth earbuds giveaway! To enter, head to our Facebook page @DaveyTree or our LinkedIn page @TheDaveyTreeExpertCompany to learn how to enter. This week we're sharing some of our favorite stories over the past year of how our arborists came to find their careers in arboriculture.

In this episode we cover:

  • Big trees (1:03)
  • Planting a big tree (1:56)
  • Native trees (4:35)
  • Hackberry (6:36)
  • Willow (9:15)
  • Trees for birds (10:26)
  • Chicago lustre (11:06)
  • Hickory and oak trees (11:42)
  • Having a professional (13:06)
  • Shagbark hickory (14:37)
  • Black cherry and pecan trees (16:57)
  • Kentucky coffeetree (18:47)
  • How Sean became an arborist (20:24)

To find your local Davey office, check out our find a local office page to search by zip code.

To learn more about big trees being planted too close to the house, read our blog, Buying a House with Big, Mature Trees Near House or Foundation.
To learn more about the benefit of planting native trees,  read our blog, Benefits of Planting Trees Native to Your Region.

Connect with Davey Tree on social media:
Twitter: @DaveyTree
Facebook: @DaveyTree
Instagram: @daveytree
YouTube: The Davey Tree Expert Company
LinkedIn: The Davey Tree Expert Company

Have topics you'd like us to cover on the podcast? Email us at podcasts@davey.com. We want to hear from you!

Doug: Welcome to the Davey Tree Expert Company's Podcast Talking Trees. I'm your host, Doug Oster. Each week, our expert arborists share advice on seasonal tree care, how to make your trees thrive, arborists' favorite trees, and much, much more. Tune in every Thursday to learn more because here at the Talking Trees podcast, we know trees are the answer.

This week, we continue celebrating our one-year anniversary of the podcast. Hooray. As a thank you, we're holding a Davey Bluetooth earbuds giveaway through the end of the month while supplies last. To learn more about entering the giveaway, read this episode's podcast show notes below or head over to Davey's Facebook or LinkedIn page to learn more. To find us, just search Davey Tree on Facebook or LinkedIn to see our podcast giveaway post for instructions.

I'm joined this week by Sean Zieche. He's a district manager near Chicago for the Davey Tree Expert Company, Glen Ellyn and Lombard area. Is that right, Sean?

Sean: That is correct.

Doug: I'm excited to talk about big trees because it seems there's been a trend in the gardening industry and the landscape industry in general to look for smaller more compact things, but give me a big tree.

Sean: I'm right there with you. I totally agree. These big trees will make or break a property. Some people buy their houses based off of big trees. It's one of the reasons I bought my own house is because I have a massive hackberry tree in my backyard. I'm very fond of that tree. It's a native tree in this area, which is even better.

Doug: As I always say when I'm interviewing arborists, I live in an oak forest, and that's one of the reasons that I bought my house was that I love these big old oaks. Unfortunately, oak wilt has snuck in, but we're working on it. When I'm considering, let's say, planting or buying a house with a big tree, let's talk planting first, obviously giving it enough room to do its thing, right?

Sean: Correct, yes. That's always number one. You got to have the space for it. Knowing what you're going to be planting. When you plant that tree and it's young, it might seem like a big wide open area, but you just have to understand that it will grow into that area and that if you impede it by planting other things around, it'll take away from the shape of that tree that it naturally can have.

Doug: Sean, how do you teach that lesson because I've been working on my son's property and every time I go, he wants to leave some little shrub closer to the tree. "This'll give me some privacy." I'm like, "Your tree won't do its thing if you leave that here. I know it's painful to lose this." Talk a little bit about spreading the word, so to speak, when it comes to that sort of thing.

Sean: That's a tough one. Honestly, that's a battle that I'm still fighting today just because everybody wants instant gratification. That's the number one seller, "Plant me that biggest tree that you can plant," and "Let's load up this yard. I need as much privacy as possible." However, you got to be able to work around that. You got to be patient. You have to be willing to know that there's a future outlook here. Education is always number one. You just have to explain to the people that, "Listen, here's how big this tree's going to get. Here's what it needs. It needs to have space."

The biggest thing that I can really tell you if you really want to fill up an area is like you were saying, maybe throwing some small perennials around the tree to fill up the area, but nothing huge or too woody that's going to-- like you were already saying, impeding on the natural growth of this tree. Something like a swamp white oak, they love to have really low-hanging branches. If you have even a shrub underneath there, you're going to take away from those low-hanging branches that trees naturally could have.

I don't know if you guys have been to an arboretum in general, but some of these tree branches literally go down into the ground and come back out again. That's a huge selling point. It's beautiful if you ask me. Just being patient.

Doug: The patience is one thing you brought up, but also instant gratification. I know it drives you crazy because it drives me crazy too when I see new construction and just seeing the planting and knowing that poor person is going to have to replace those in 5, 10 years. On your list of big trees for the east, when you're looking at a site, you've got the right site for a big tree. Talk about something that you're interested in that you like, that you love to get into someone's landscape.

Sean: Native trees. Native trees are always going to be the first go-to. Native trees, they tend to have not zero issues, but minimal issues when it comes to insects. When it comes to diseases, they can naturally fend this stuff off. Native trees is always going to be my go-to. Kind of narrows us down. It doesn't really strangle us, but it definitely narrows us down to certain types of trees.

Typically, when I'm going with a native tree, I'm going to try to go something along the lines of what's in the area as well, like looking in the actual-- like is there a forest-preserving area? Let's take a look at those trees and see if we can blend in with that. Like I said, I live with a huge hackberry tree in my backyard. That's because I live close to a river, so there's a lot of water. There's a huge water source right there. You have to look at the site conditions.

I'd love to be able to tell you exactly, "This tree is going to work great for every single property," but that's just not the truth. You have to pinpoint what the site conditions are. If you're living near some water where your water table is low, I'm going to go with something along the lines of a hackberry tree. I'm going to go along the lines of something. I know I'm not a huge fan of planting willows, but if you're near water and it's far enough away from the house, sure. Plant a willow tree because it's native in the area, but try to keep that away from the house at any point.

Tulip poplars are great near the water as well. Even some sugar maple trees do okay near some water. Again, checking the surrounding areas to see what's going to blend in.

Doug: Right tree, right place, we talk about that a lot here. I'd like to go back to the hackberry. It's been mentioned a couple of times on the podcast. I just don't know anything about them, yet I know since they keep coming up, since a certified arborist is telling me hackberry, it better be on my radar. Again, you've said it, education and having the right place for the tree, but tell me what you love about hackberries.

Sean: Hackberry trees, they can handle a lot. That's one thing. They're a hardwooded tree. They can handle quite a bit. What I mean by that is they might get a broken branch here and there, but then it's not going to just kill them. It's not going to take away from the shape of the tree. These trees have the tendency of growing extremely large, and they also have the tendency of just staying short and squatty. It depends on where they're at.

In my case, like I said, I live down by some water. I live in a valley actually, and my tree is short and squatty. It's actually wider than it is tall. That's because, over the years, the wind has taken the tops out of this tree because of the valley. Where the tree line is at, everything below is perfectly safe. There's no issues with that tree.

Another thing with these trees being native and being disease free, that's a huge selling point because you know what, there's not too much maintenance in that tree. You're only pruning it maybe every 5 to 10 years tops compared to somebody who has an ash tree who has to treat it every year, every two years. The structure of the tree is phenomenal. It's got some smaller leaves on it as well. In the summertime, I don't need an umbrella of any sort. It's a nice shade tree over the top of everything.

What's cool about the tree in my backyard with this hackberry is that I have what's called the mother tree. It's the biggest hackberry in the entire area. Then there's all these little babies all over the place in the backyard that are coming up off of it. That's pretty cool as well. Just know that the hackberry tree, it is near water, they can spread. You do get some seeds out of that annually. The birds love the tree. That's another selling point. I'm a huge guy when it comes-- I love birds. I love putting out bird feed as well. The birds absolutely love this hackberry tree. They attack it when those seeds are ripe.

Doug: If you're making lots of little hackberries, I see a little sign at the end of your driveway "Sean's hackberry nursery. Come get them."

Sean: "Come grab one," exactly.

Doug: Let's talk a little bit about the idea of the willow because, again, it's so important to have the right spot for it. If you're at the water's edge, willow's a great tree, but you don't want it over where your water's draining out the backyard or near the septic or something like that. That's the only worry with a willow.

Sean: Yes. Keep it away from the house. The roots of a willow tree are very aggressive. They can actually pierce concrete, so it doesn't take a cracked foundation for a willow tree to find its way in. It will find its way in. You want to keep those far distance away from the house. A really good rule of thumb is the tree's root system is roughly one and a half times the drip line of the tree meaning, wherever the furthest point of water can fall from that tree, 50% more of that, that's how far that root system can go, so keep those willow trees that far away from any part of your household that could have a drain or a foundation. It's a good option when they're near the water and away from the house.

Doug: You brought up birds and I'm a bird lover too. Is there something else native-wise that we could think about depending on the site as far as something that's positive for the birds?

Sean: On my property, I have mock oranges. They seem to love that mock orange tree, or the mock orange shrub, excuse me. There's some viburnums out there. If you guys want to plant some viburnums, they like those. There's a handful of them out there. I wish I could give you the exact types of trees out there, but I'm not too schooled on the birds and what have you.

Doug: All right. Well, I've got a good story about a viburnum, and it relates to you because it's called Chicago Lustre.

Sean: Yes, sir. I know it.

Doug: Okay. I'm like, "I need something that's deer-resistant, but I want to have it for the birds." I put that viburnum in, and it's filled with purple berries, and the deer ate all the berries. [laughs]

Sean: [inaudible 00:11:26] 

Doug: I had one berry left.

Sean: Your intentions were good.

Doug: Yes. Then, actually, viburnum beetles took that one. That's the first time I ever had that problem. Let's go back to our native trees. Thinking of some other ones, big native trees depending on the site, of course.

Sean: Yes. I'm a big fan of hickory trees. I love a big old hickory tree. However, if you're going to find a big old hickory, it's going to be at least about 100 years old. Those trees are slow growers. That's another one that I'm just a really big fan of. I love myself an oak tree. However, you said it yourself in the beginning of this podcast, oak wilt is a very big issue in our area right now, and it's here. You cannot deny that. We've actually had a few positive test results come back just in the Glen Ellyn area this year alone, so we know it's a problem.

At the same time, I'm not opposed to planting oak trees because I know that they're needed. You don't want to stop planting these trees. All we got to do is try to eliminate or try to stop that spread of oak wilt that's going around. That comes again with education and knowing how to stop it. I don't want to deter anybody from planting oak trees just because we have a small problem in the area, because swamp white oak, a bur oak tree are some of the best trees if you ask me you can have in this area. They're honestly some of the most beautiful trees you can have in this area as well.

Doug: This comes up on the podcast a lot since I do live in an oak forest, since I do have oak wilt. We always talk about the importance of having a certified arborist dealing with your landscape because cutting and pruning that tree at the right time, there's nothing more important than that, what we're talking about this disease. It breaks my heart when I hear some gardeners saying, "Well, a guy came out in a pickup truck, and he cut these," and I'm like, "Now, without an active growth? That's crazy."

Sean: Yes, that's a big problem. We do deal with that. One of the problems as well is sometimes we're almost forced too, though. We get storms that come rolling through and we don't have a choice. We have to make some cuts on some trees to make a tree safe. You can try to protect it, but that only does so much. Another problem is, not only do we have those uneducated people out there that are making those pruning cuts during the growing season, but sometimes people are just forced to get tree work done in the growing season because of budget restraints. That's a battle.

We really try to hold ourselves to a standard here at Davey Tree that we will not touch an oak tree unless there's a danger, or unless it's the wintertime. That's key to eliminating this spread that is very prevalent in this area, but unfortunately, we are fighting that all the time.

Doug: In my forest, I've got plenty of hickories too, and a few shagbark hickories which I really love. If you could just explain to people a little bit about that, I guess shagbark is pretty self-explanatory, but it's a cool-looking tree, right?

Sean: Oh, I love them. I do. I love them, man. They have some character to them, that's for sure, especially when you get a really good mature old hickory tree, a shagbark, man, that bark. The way that the barks sometimes flakes off of it, it's almost like-- man, I swear, I've seen a piece probably 5 to 10 feet long, curled up a little bit, hanging off the tree, but overall no, it's a great tree. It's got a compound leaf on it, so it actually does have a lot of leaves on it. When fall comes around, you're going to be cleaning up a little bit, especially the bigger the tree. You are going to get some nuts on it, okay?

A shagbark hickory tends to be similar to a walnut tree when it comes to the fruit that falls from it. Know that if you're going to be planting this thing, try to keep it a little bit further away from the house because you will be woken up in the middle of the night when those fruits start falling on you. The wood is beautiful. If you have, God forbid, ever had to remove the tree, hold onto that wood. That's some of my favorite wood to have for planking if you're going to be doing anything fancy with some woodwork of any sort.

Then, as for just being an awesome shade tree, being so big-- and again, they can be really what we call spready. It can really extend outwards and then give you a nice, good canopy of shade. It just protects you. Then, again, the wildlife, man, the animals absolutely love those hickories coming from that tree, so it can be a messy tree. Again, I'm going to warn you right now, if you have a massive hickory tree on your property not only are you going to be fighting with the fruit that falls from it, but the squirrels that will be eating it up in the tree and leaving the mess for you on the ground.

Doug: Yes. In my forest, when it gets to fall, I need a bike helmet between those hickories and the oaks. It's so funny you can hear one start to fall from the top of the trees as it comes through the leaves and you're just like, "Incoming. Look out." What else were you thinking about? Anything else on your list?

Sean: I do like a black cherry as a native tree, but the issue with those is that they're considered almost like a weed at the same time. I almost consider that one the same as a willow tree. It's a native tree. It does great in this area. However, I would keep it away from the house if you can. A black cherry tree, they tend to get storm damage throughout the growing season in general, just because they are a softer wooded tree up in the upper canopy portions of it, but overall, it's a pretty tree to have on the property.

Another one would be a pecan tree. We don't see a lot of those at all in this area, but they're native and they do grow in this area quite well. I've started planting those recently, I'd say in the last five years or so just because I have found a nursery that supplies them. That's also an issue, is finding a nursery that will supply these trees for you. Whenever you're planting some hard-to-find trees, you're going to end up planting smaller trees, that's for sure, like whips almost. You're getting seedlings a lot of the time when you're planting these. Again, that instant gratification that people are always looking for, that can be hard to find.

Doug: Yes. It's definitely about patience. That's fascinating though. When I think pecan tree, I think south. Am I thinking of a different pecan tree, or are these pecan trees--

Sean: No, it's the same pecan tree. They can actually survive up here though. They do thrive down south, but yes, they can absolutely survive up in this area.

Doug: Tell me a little bit about what you like about it. How big does it get?

Sean: Not too big around here, maybe 30 to 40 feet tall. That's about it, but they do get spready. Do you know what a Kentucky coffeetree is?

Doug: I do.

Sean: I'd consider it something similar to that in size and the way and structure that they grow.

Doug: Well, you better explain Kentucky coffeetree because I know what it is, but that doesn't mean everyone-- It's such a cool tree, an underused tree.

Sean: It is, yes. Obviously, it has its name for a reason. It comes from Kentucky. However, they do grow very well up here. Again, when I say a tree that's pretty maintenance-free, that's one right there. We don't really ever deal too much with them except for that typical safety pruning every 5 to 10 years. One thing that I do get a complaint about is the size of the pods that fall from it. Every tree makes a mess, guys. You can't deny that.

Every tree is going to have something in it, but this one just tends to have-- it's a pod, I'd say, on average, 6 to 10 inches in length that will fall later in the season. You're going to have to clean those up, but you know what? Hey, there's a payoff for it. It's a big, beautiful tree that requires pretty much zero maintenance. Again, I'm a huge fan of maintenance-free trees.

I know that seems weird coming from a tree guy that stays in business by dealing with your trees, but I'd rather have it be a healthy, sustainable tree than me coming out every year having to fix a problem. I'd rather come out every 5 to 10 years and have a nice rolling supply of work of helping to--

Doug: All good stuff. Before I let you go, I want to know a little bit about you and why this job turned out to be right for you.

Sean: Yes, sir. Well, pun intended, my grandfather planted a seed in my head a long time ago. He was a logger when he was younger up in Wisconsin. When I was about, I don't know, 14 or 15 years old, he goes, "You know what you need to do, you need to become an arborist." I was like, "What's an arborist?" I had no idea. He told me about it, and it just stuck in my head. I was working for a golf course at the time. It was down in Florida, and a hurricane came through. Three hurricanes in about three weeks came through and knocked out 5,000 trees on 1,000 acres.

I was handed a chainsaw and he said, "Here you go. Get to work if you want to keep your job. You're not cutting grass anymore, you're a tree guy." That was my very beginning stages. I was young, I was dumb, I did not understand how safety was, how things really should be working. I did that for a handful of years. We got the golf course up and going again. I ended up moving back up here to the Chicagoland area. I got a job with-- well, it was the carrot trees at the time, but Davey acquired the carrot trees.

Once I got my start with them, that was back in 2009, I believe, it opened up my eyes. I realized how lucky I was to even be alive to this moment because of how dangerous I was working in the past. I had no clue how much danger I was putting myself into on a daily basis until I got to work with Davey Tree to find out how things are done the right way. That's how I got my feet wet.

I came in with Davey Tree, and I had to wipe my slate clean because I thought I knew a lot of things, and I did not. I ended up just coming in. I was like "You know what, guys, I thought I had experience, but I don't. I need you guys to train from the ground up here." I came in with a fresh mind and a positive attitude, and that ended up helping me work myself up. Within a few years, I was a foreman. Within a year or two after that, I became a production manager.

This is kind of like your road to success here in Davey Tree if you're going to become worth the position I'm in right now, which is the district manager. It went from groundsman to crew leader, foreman to production manager, to assistant district manager, and now I'm a district manager for the Glen Ellyn office. I've worked myself up the ladder. It wasn't easy by any means. I was doing tree work. I was climbing trees. I was a Buckethead. I was dragging brush every single day. I've been through it all. I'm also a plant healthcare technician, so I have an Illinois pesticide license as well on top of that. I go out and I do the treatments of the trees, I spray trees.

Once I really got my head wrapped around all of that and I felt confident, I eventually became a Certified Tree Worker Safety Professional with the TCIA, which is another feather in your cap you can put in. That allows you to travel the country to go and do some training, which is another item that I was a big fan of doing. It was fun. I'm not doing it anymore because I'm extremely busy in this position right here, but I did that for a good three to four years where I traveled the country for the TCIA, and I did all these workshops throughout America. I found a lot of joy in that.

My specialty on that was aerial rescue. Sorry, it was aerial rescue, but it was also electrical hazard awareness. When I would go around the country teaching about electrical hazard awareness, it's pretty amazing how much you open people's eyes.

Again, I put myself in that position when I very first started. I had to wipe my slate clean because I thought I had experience, and that's what I had to teach these guys at these workshops is like, "Listen, I think you guys think what you're dealing with, but truly, let me expose you to a few other items here. Those workshops were excellent, and I really enjoyed traveling. You get a lot out of that too. A lot of people come back up to you and thank you afterwards. I really enjoy that part of it.

I'm happy where I'm at now as a district manager here in the Glen Ellyn office. We're doing very well. Got a nice awesome group of guys, 20-25 guys all together in this office here. Number one thing here is just to keep on training people up so you can move on up in the company.

Doug: Sean, that is great stuff. That is an amazing evolution. The fact that you get trained and then are training people, that's awesome stuff. Then thanks too for all the information on the trees. I'm looking into pecan trees, although I might have to come over and see you and buy a few hackberries off you too.

Sean: I got you, bud. I got you. Got plenty.

Doug: All right. Thanks again for your time.

Sean: No problem, Doug. You have a wonderful day. Thank you.

Doug: Next week, we have a very important show all about dormant pruning. For most of the country, this is the time to get that job done. Don't forget, you can win some Davey Bluetooth earbuds just by heading over to the Davey Tree Facebook or LinkedIn pages, or just read the show notes below to find out how to get a pair of those earbuds. Now, tune in every Thursday to the Talking Trees podcast from the Davey Tree expert company. I'm your host, Doug Oster, and do me a favor, subscribe to the podcast. I'm having fun, and I hope you are too. As always, we like to remind you on the Talking Trees podcast, trees are the answer.

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