The Child Care Business Podcast
The Child Care Business Podcast
Episode 4, Season 10: How to Find and Keep Insurance for Your Child Care Center with Samantha Phillips
Samantha Phillips is an insurance broker who specializes in insuring child care centers, a job that is especially tough this days as ECE businesses struggle to find and keep insurance.
Costs are soaring. Samantha said she has a client in Massachusetts whose insurance DOUBLED, from $25,000 a year to $50,000 a year .. and the client had never filed a claim. And paying that amount was the client's only option.
That's just one example Samantha shares during this podcast. She also gives examples of court verdicts and settlements stemming from cases in child care centers that are affecting premiums, as well as how licensing inspections are playing a role in skyrocketing costs.
Samantha also gives tips on how to keep your current insurance, which is getting harder and harder to do, as well as what you can do to shop around to try to find lower prices. One such tip is to write an insurance narrative to show that you have a strong management team and that your approach to protecting your property is proactive rather than reactive.
To get more advice from Samantha, check out her Facebook page or visit comployhr.com.
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast, brought to you by ProCare Solutions. This podcast is all about giving childcare , preschool, daycare, after school , and other early education professionals. A fun and upbeat way to learn about strategies and inspiration you can use to thrive. You'll hear from a variety of childcare thought leaders, including educators, owners, and industry experts on ways to innovate, to meet the needs of the children you serve. From practical tips for managing operations to uplifting stories of transformation and triumph, this podcast will be chock full of insights you can use to fully realize the potential of your childcare business. Let's jump in.
Speaker 2:Hello everyone, and welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast. My name is Leah Woodbury. Um, I'm our head of content here at ProCare Solutions, and I'm really happy to have you all join us today. Um, we're thrilled to have Samantha Phillips with us. She's an expert in a topic that we really don't talk enough about enough, but we know is constantly on the minds of childcare center owners and directors, and that is childcare insurance. And she's one of the rare people out there who specializes in insuring and helping insur helping childcare centers find insurance. So, welcome, Samantha. Thank
Speaker 3:You so much for having me. Um, trying to ensure childcare centers seems more appropriate these days.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that that would be a better description, wouldn't it? <laugh> . So before we jump into that , um, we always like to start these podcasts, getting a little bit of background on our guests , and your story is particularly unique. So you were an insurance agent, your son got hurt, it was at his preschool, I think, and Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> . And what, what happened and how did that, that motivate you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so my, my first , um, my first role at an insurance agency, I started out as their receptionist, and there was a preschool, literally right down the street. It was less than half a mile. And my son was enrolled there because it was really convenient to be able to work at the insurance agency. And his preschool was so close. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> . Um, and then I get a call one day that he'd been hurt. He was running in the classroom, shocker. Um, and ran into the cubbies that were hanging on the wall and gashed his forehead open. Um , when the director called me, you know, our , the directors have such a, a skill with their words , um, and are very finessed and keeping parents calm whenever they relay news like that. And so I always laugh now because I finished my email that I was working on before I left to go get him , because the way she explained it, it didn't sound as , uh, as , uh, pressing of an injury as it was. Yeah . Um, but anyways, so it, that ended up being a, a really traumatic experience for he and I both because he needed stitches. And I'm literally in this doctor's office curled up in a ball in the corner with my ears plugged in my eye or my ears, yeah. Ears plugged, eyes closed because the numbing medicine that they used to inject around the site where he needed stitches so that he wouldn't feel it did not work. And he was screaming bloody murder for mommy to rescue him. And I couldn't because he needed the stitches. And if I were to stop what was taking place, there's no way that he was gonna let them touch him again. And it took my husband, who is a, a very solid guy , um, and four other staff members to hold this little human down to be able to stitch him up with as much as he was wailing. It was awful. Um, fast forward , the director was very concerned. You know, she had called and checked on him while we were at home, just loving on each other next couple of days because we both needed that reassurance like, mommy is there for you. And when I took him back, the director asked me, would our insurance cover this? Because the agency that I worked at at the time insured his preschool. And it was like a light bulb went off in my head because I realized in that moment that if an agency, or if we are the agency that is insuring this preschool and they are right down the street from us and they don't know if the coverage that we have in place for them would cover a scenario like that, then we're not doing a good enough job educating our clients on the types of coverages they have and claim scenarios that they could protect them against. And so that really was what set me on this trajectory of, well, I'm gonna rewrite that narrative and be the one that educates educators. Um, and so I've been looking for different ways to do it ever since.
Speaker 2:Well, you have a ton of really, really great knowledge, so I'm really excited to jump in and and pick your brain. Thank you. And shift to today. So like I said earlier here at ProCare, we're hearing a lot of our customers talking about renewal premium skyrocketing. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> . Is this happening? Is this happening everywhere? What's the reason? What kind of, what kind of insight can you give us on what's going on?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. Um, definitely happening nationwide. Some states are experiencing it , uh, a little bit rougher than others because of catastrophic exposure, like tornado prone states or hurricane prone states, wildfires , um, those sorts of states, the property premium increases are hitting them just as hard, but nationally, all childcare , um, programs are really experiencing a shift in the liability. Um, what companies are willing to offer, what they're looking at as far as underwriting guidelines , um, the premiums that they're willing to renew if they're even willing to offer renewal. Um, I started seeing red flags that we were headed in the direction , um, or headed towards where we are right now last September. And so I've officially been talking about the childcare insurance crisis for a year now. Just trying my best to make people aware of, look, this is coming. Um, there are some things you can do to lessen the impact, but it's gonna be painful and it's gonna get worse before it gets better. And we are definitely in the thick of the suck right now. Um, it's, it's pretty bad. Premium increases are higher than they have ever been. Some programs are experiencing as much as five times what their premium was just last year and without having ever filed any claims. Um, so that's the reality that programs are facing right now.
Speaker 2:Well, I saw you posted on your , um, Facebook page, which we will link to in the show notes 'cause you share such good information. Um, you were comparing this year's renewal premium cost versus last year, and
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 2:The one that jumped
Speaker 3:Out, and that was back in December last year. Yes . So it's gotten even progressively worse now.
Speaker 2:Oh . I mean, the numbers were just staggering. One, it was a two site center. It went from like 15,000 up to 22,000. So I mean Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> $6,500 increase. I mean, it was just wild.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And that, you know , the whole purpose of that pose too was to let people know sometimes it's easier to see a number form Yeah . What it is that I'm talking about when I say childcare insurance crisis, what does that mean? Um, and so that was the best way that I could think of to provide a visual for things aren't good right now. Um, you know, I've got a client in Massachusetts that went, single sites , went from paying around 25,000 a year to 50,000 a year and had never filed any claims. Well, established business had been in the industry for 25 years, and that that $50,000 option was literally our only option for her. So her choices were pay it or operate without insurance, which is not, you can't do that in Massachusetts and nobody would want to anyways.
Speaker 2:No, no, no. And then the , when you were talking about no, no claims, could you, could you give us some examples of recent verdicts or settlements that are, that are maybe affecting these premiums on claims that have been made ?
Speaker 3:Yeah . So I actually got some insurance companies are very tightlipped whenever it comes to sharing claims data. Um, which doesn't help us on the risk management side when we're trying to figure out, well, what can we do to keep claims from occurring? Well, if we don't know where the largest majority of claims are happening, then it's hard to figure out how to keep them from happening. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> . Um, but I did have one company that shared some information with me on some of their recent verdicts, an abuse molestation claim where a male employee had had improper contact with several children, paid 2.8, just under $2.9 million , um, had a child slide down. Um, it's hard to wrap my mind around why a rope would be anywhere near a slide, but the child's neck got caught in the rope, ended up choking them. That paid out $1.5 million. Um, a mother of a child fell when she slipped on bubbles from a birthday party that they had on site that paid $863,000. Um, an infant died from SIDS while taking a nap that was $846,000. So, and that's just a handful of, of claims examples, but when you add in also property losses, I've seen water damage claims from sprinkler systems, the fire sprinkler systems that are designed to te protect your property from fire. I've seen them cause so much water damage from temperatures outside freezing and causing those pops to burst because they weren't , weren't properly winterized. Um, and those claims are several hundreds of thousands of dollars and a long time for repairs .
Speaker 2:Repairs . Oh . So, and because of this, some insurance companies, they're just leaving childcare , right? They're just saying, we're not, we're not messing with this. Is that, is that what you're
Speaker 3:Saying? Yeah , they're like, peace , I'm out. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> .
Speaker 2:Yeah. Oh ,
Speaker 3:And there was, there was always a small pool of insurance companies to begin with that would ensure childcare , I would say at any given time, no more than about 15 companies , um, in the, what we call the admitted market. And , um, we lost about half of those in Q4 2023. The about half of the ones that are left now are only regional providers, which means they don't insure every state. They only insure anywhere from 10 to 20 states across the us . Um, so then you've got a very small selection, especially for those , um, providers operating in states that don't have access to the regional providers because they don't, they don't insure in that state. Yeah . And then also with the companies that are left, we're seeing just drastic changes in what they're looking for and what they're willing to insure . So it's really like trying to find a suitable insurance provider for every program. Now. It's like looking for a needle in a haystack. You have to check all the right boxes in order to be accepted into the few programs that are left out there.
Speaker 2:And how are , um, licensing inspections playing into that? Um, and I honestly, I think very
Speaker 3:Heavily,
Speaker 2:This could probably be an entire podcast in itself. So they're , so these insurance companies are actually digging into inspection reports, like at the state level? Yes . Or
Speaker 3:Yes, they are going online. They're reviewing the , um, the state inspection reports. They're looking at the violations. Um, repetitious violations really shows that either you don't care about the problem or you don't care about fixing it. Um, any violations that could pose harm to a child, such as broken playground equipment or , um, background checks is a big one. Um, access to hazardous chemicals, things violations like that. The insurance companies look at those as, okay, if these are the types of things they're cited for in their inspection reports, they're obviously more of a risky program because they don't have the right systems and balances in place to make sure that these violations aren't occurring. Um, so they're really on the lookout for those inspection reports and using them as a means of determining, is this program worth ensuring they're not because they have safe operations, or do we want to decline to wrap them just simply based on what we see in the inspection reports.
Speaker 2:Okay . Okay . So before we, before we move into what centers can do, and I promise that's coming, I'm sure everybody's waiting. <laugh> , I'd love to pick your brain a little bit about the recent NACI liability insurance survey , um, naci National Association for the Education of Young Children. I'm sure all, all our listeners knew that. Um, it's def one step that you mentioned, or that you highlighted, I should say from the report, is that 62% of respondents reported that their program had difficulty finding liability insurance or finding affordable liability insurance. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> . And that the top named reason for non-renewals is the insurance company is no longer iur childcare . And you talked about this before, but I just wanted to see if you could go a little bit deeper into how that those figures jive with what you're seeing and hearing. Is it more in one part of the country? Are there regions where things are maybe better than another or, or any other insights you might have on those stats?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Um, definitely in line with what I've been seeing. And I was very fortunate to get to work with Nay . They had reached out and asked to pick my brain on helping them curate the questions so that they could collect the right information. Um , so I got to play a really, a really heavy role in that. But there was almost a validation in it because I'm like, finally, finally we have official data. I've had so many people reaching out about advocacy initiatives, and we didn't have firm data other than, you know, just individual people's stories. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> . And here I've been saying all along that, you know, this is an issue. Um, so to actually see in number form that 62% of providers are experiencing difficulty was, it wasn't really alarming to me , but it, it was alarming, if that makes sense. It does. Um, and it does . And then the, the top reason being that insurance companies are exiting. I mean, that absolutely made sense because I personally, I mean, I'm still insuring clients and my team is, our bandwidth is so stretched thin because we are really struggling to try and make sure that our current clients stay insured, and then we get calls regularly with people in desperation because they can't find insurance. Their agent hasn't been able to find them replacement coverage. I've never received so many calls, messages, text messages , um, from providers that are now uninsured because their coverage lapsed when their agent couldn't find them anything. Um, and so for us to be in that state, but see numbers that reflect that, I'm really hoping that the data, and I attended Nacey's webinar yesterday where they kind of went over that , um, that final review or that final draft. And most of the advocates that were on that call talked about, they are hoping as well that this data will help us , help us advance advocacy initiatives forward. Because, you know, anybody in a position of power wants to see firm figures. They wanna see is this truly an issue? They don't wanna just hear stories, show me the data. And that's where we're at now with that , uh, survey.
Speaker 2:Oh, well that is, that is good news that yeah, you have the data to back up what we know is happening, so that's amazing. Yes. Okay. So we've gone through what's going on. Let's talk about what childcare center leaders can do. So if we could start with how to keep insurance, that would be great. How do we, how do we keep it, if we're at least for the most part, happy about it? <laugh> ,
Speaker 3:Um, this is, this one's very simple, but , um, pay your bills , uh, very, very easy. Just make sure that your premiums get paid. Insurance companies are looking for reasons not to renew problem accounts. And if you are a client that regularly non pays , um, or you're late in paying, don't give an opportunity for a declination or a , or not necessarily a declination. In that case, it would be , um, refusal to reinstate due to nonpayment of premium. So don't give an extra reason to be dropped by an insurance company for something as simple as not paying your premium. Stay on top of that. Make sure the premiums are paid by their due date . Um, that's the biggest one. If you've got it, then you can keep it. Just make sure you pay your bills. Um , other things, if you do get dropped, most people are facing non-renewals. You know, we're seeing that a lot. So for the people that don't have a renewal bill to be able to pay and they don't have that luxury, you've gotta start early. Um, and I would not wait for the non-renewal to come either, because most states, the legal , um, the legal requirement to send you notice by the insurance company is anywhere from 30 days to 60 days. It is taking my team no less than 30 days to find insurance quotes. And that doesn't even count the process for the applications we have to collect the loss runs we have to order. So I would say at minimum, it takes us right now, 45 days to even try and get quotes. And that's still with us maybe getting quotes trickling in right down to the expiration date. So if you're waiting to receive a non-renewal thinking, well, this isn't gonna happen to me, or it hasn't happened to me yet, that's because the insurance company is not legally required to send you notice until 45 days out or 30 days out, depending on what your state requirement is. So I would recommend as a Plan B, just in case, reach out to an insurance agency that specializes in childcare and get that ball rolling just in case you don't get the renewal offer and you open your mail one day and find the non-renewal. Speaking of that, I think a lot of people are sitting on their , um, insurance company mail, because right at this point, they're expecting that renewal offer to come, like it usually does, and well , it's just a bill that needs to be paid. So if they see a , a letter on their desk from Philadelphia, for instance, well, they might be thinking that is their renewal premium invoice. And so they'll get to it when they get to it . They know they typically have to pay it before they , um, policy expires. But what might be in that envelope is a non-renewal notice. And if you set on that mail and aren't aware of it and can't start acting on it as soon as you're aware, well then it further delays the, the process and you not, you potentially not being able to get replacement coverage in time .
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 3:Um, um, there's also, you know, proactive things that programs can do , um, as far as showcasing that they've got it going on. I have an insurance narrative template that I created to help pro providers show that , um, you know, they have a strong management team in place that their admin team knows what they're doing, that the , um, the approach they take to protecting their property is proactive, not reactive. Those sorts of things are valuable to an insurance company, and they wanna know they're looking for the right partners right now. They don't wanna insure any and every business. So it's our job to paint that picture to the insurance companies. We've got to show them, and you've gotta help us by providing that information. That narrative template is a great way to do that, to help show why your program is worth ensuring and why you are a smart , a smart risk for the insurance company.
Speaker 2:What about, are there any services or that, that might leave a childcare center exposed that might make an insurance company go, eh , I don't know that you should be doing that?
Speaker 3:Yes. Um, the ones that come to mind right off the top of my head, birthday parties, any kind of special events. Um, and you know, that's, that's difficult because that's an additional revenue stream for a lot of programs. And when you're facing infl , like, trust me, I, I get it to all the providers that are listing like, I get it. Um, but that is a , um, that is a sore spot for insurance companies because it's an additional exposure. And that bubble incident that paid $850,000 wouldn't have happened had it not been for a birthday party on site . Um, another one that is a sore subject for providers is , um, to employees in every room at all times for accountability purposes. That is not required in every state and not always mandated by ratios. So , um, a lot of insurance companies now are making that a mandate in order to be able to offer coverage. And for programs that don't have the ability to incorporate that, that leaves them out of one less insurance option that might have been available to them . Um, the other one that comes to mind is field trips. The types of field trips that you go on. I had a declination because there was a rock climbing picture on the website, the indoor rock climbing , um, and you couldn't see the ground and there was no harnessing involved. So the picture on the website made it look like this child is 30 feet up in the air at the very top of the rock climbing wall. And in the full picture, they are two feet off the ground. Um, but the insurance company looked at the website, saw that picture, and they declined over it. So the types of field trips that you go on, if they involve , uh, all the fun stuff, you know, trampoline, park , <laugh> , uh, yeah . Poles , uh, anything involving water slides, rock climbing, like all of your, your high risk or high injury prone types of field trips are also a con a concern right now.
Speaker 2:So get those photos all that off.
Speaker 3:Clean up your Facebook, clean up your website. <laugh> .
Speaker 2:Yeah. All right . So let's say, oops , I lost my spot. All right . We've gone <laugh>, what about insurance shopping? Can you talk us about that? Talk to us a little bit about that. Let's say you've done everything you can, you've kept your insurance, but you wanna know what else is out there. How can a center go about getting a good policy? I mean, for a, for a fair price?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Um, good policy and fair price are hard to find right now. Yeah . Um , you really have to check all the boxes we're what we're seeing, even for the, the best programs. Um, the coverage options have changed quite a bit. We used to be able to get a million dollars in abuse liability coverage very easily. And now , um, my team and I are running into sub limited amounts 500,000 or less very regularly. Um, so really finding an agent that specializes in childcare is gonna be your your best bet. Um, there are several of us out there. Um, it's not a large pool , but find somebody that specializes in this industry. And the reason that's so important is those companies will have the best access to markets that cater to this industry. Most generalist agents, the local guy down the street might have access to a , um, an insurance company that can insure a lot of different types of businesses, but not necessarily multiple companies that can insure childcare businesses, because his job is to ensure anything that walks through the door that might contact him for business insurance. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> a specialist has companies , um, specific to this industry. So start there and then be willing to complete the, the paperwork there is, the application process is really time consuming and tedious, but it's so important because that application can literally make or break whether you're gonna get a quote or not. And how you answer those application questions can also make or break whether you get a quote, I had a client accidentally answer. Um, and mind you, I have a full-time person in addition to myself that screens these applications for red flags to make sure that there aren't questions that might be answered in a way that is gonna cause the insurance company concern. And if there is, we're gonna have to reach out and get additional insights. Um, we missed the corporal punishment question in how they answered it. Uh, they had answered that yes, they do allow corporal punishment, but just below or no, they said no, they don't allow corporal punishment. But the question just below that said, have you ever had any corporal punishment liability claims made against you? That they answered yes, it was by accident. I didn't catch it. Oh . And I was getting declination after declination after declination and couldn't figure out why. Finally, one underwriter told me, we don't have any markets , um, that will accept that corporal punishment exposure. None of my clients allow corporal punishment. What do you mean the corporal punishment exposure? At which point I found out it was the way that that question was answered on the application. So now it looks fishy. If I were to go back to all of these insurance companies and say, oh, by the way, that was an accident. So really pay close attention to the applications, fill them out thoroughly. Yes, they're a pain in the butt, but it just, you've gotta do it right now. You've gotta embrace this up and do it and be careful , um, how you're filling them out.
Speaker 2:And then you talked too about , um, getting a lot of data together, like even a , about the type of building, even if you're leasing the building. Oh , like what's on, what's on that list? Should you be able to, to rattle off for a , for a application
Speaker 3:Application , there are four main pieces of information years specifically that you're gonna need to know whether or not you own the building. That is the year the roof was last updated plumbing, HVAC systems and electrical, or wiring, plumbing, roof, hvac, electrical. Those are the four things that you'll be asked on every insurance application, even if you don't own the building, the reason that information is necessary is you're still running a childcare program in that facility. So what the insurance company is looking at it is through the lens of, okay, well if you are , if you've got a hundred little human bodies running around in here, but 60-year-old wiring and it's an electrical hazard waiting to happen because that old wiring hasn't been brought up to modern building code, then that's a potential fire hazard with a hundred little bodies in the building that would have to be evacuated. So that's why it's a concern. Same with the roof. Um, if it's a landlord situation, if that roof is not in decent shape, well your contents inside that the insurance you are asking the insurance company to insure , um, would be exposed to whatever water damage from the, the leaky roof plumbing. Same situation. If you've got old corroded plumbing, then you're exposing your contents to water damage. Um, what was the other one? Plumbing, HVAC roof. Oh, and then heating and air conditioning systems. That's more , um, that's more of an important , uh, need to know in states that are prone to very high heat, like Texas and Arizona. But regardless, all programs, if you own the building, if you lease the building, you'll be asked for those four pieces of info.
Speaker 2:And then you touched on this earlier, like , um, telling a better story with a narrative. Can you give us a couple tips for, for how to do that on these applications?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so what you'd wanna do is highlight anything that makes your program look less risky to an insurance company. That's really all it is. Um, we wanna think of it from a risk management standpoint. If your management team has been with you for 10 years, going strong, if you have , um, if you've had a clean licensing report , uh, the last three visits that they've come out that's worth mentioning. If you're involved in any indi industry associations. Um, I had , um, this was a few years ago, but a client, when I mentioned that they were part of the Association of Early Learning LE Leaders, A ELL , um, it saved her $5,000 on her liability premium. So it was a pretty significant discount. But letting insurance companies know that you're part of industry associations teaching you how to be better and do better at what you do is valuable information. Same thing about , um, your property. Property is a really key piece right now. Um, do you have water leak detection sensors that will alert you early so that it helps prevent future a hundred thousand dollars worth of , uh, water damage claims? Um, no, no child left behind. Auto alarms on the buses shows that you're taking an extra step to make sure that there aren't any children left unattended on the bus. Um, what else,
Speaker 2:What about as far as like compliant , like explaining violations? Is there a way to, to do that, to kind of tell your side of the story too?
Speaker 3:So the, the, I just revised the template , um, to create a whole section , um, for licensing violations. Oh , okay . Which you really want to key on, on both for licensing violations and if you've had prior claim history, what you want to paint there is if it happened, it happened, what did you do to keep it from happening again? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> , that's how we're gonna control the perspective there. Same with the claims situations. If you had a claim happen, how did you learn from it? What did you change? Like if you had a, the fire sprinkler system league , did you get on a winterization contract after that? Did you install the water leak detection sensors that shows that you learned from that and implemented change to keep it from reoccurring with licensing violations? Did you retrain staff? Um , did you implement new policies and procedures? Did you implement one place compliance software? Um, things of that nature help it . One, it shows accountability. You are accepting, you know, this, it is what it is, this happened, but we used it as a learning opportunity and we're doing these things differently now to keep it from happening again. Mm-Hmm . <affirmative> that is really valuable to the insurance company.
Speaker 2:Did we cover everything? Is there any, anything else that you should go over in the narrative?
Speaker 3:Oh , we could probably go on for <laugh> another hour. <laugh> .
Speaker 2:Okay. Well, we are wrapping up our time with you. Is there anything I didn't ask you that you think I should have or that you think child childcare center owners, directors, leaders should know, or should, should really take away as they and as they stop listening to this podcast?
Speaker 3:The , the biggest takeaway that I have right now is don't be one of those people that thinks that this is not going to happen to you. And then be stuck in a situation where you are worried about if you can open your doors tomorrow because you don't have insurance yet, your policies have expired and you can't, y'all, it is hard. It is so hard right now. Um, I'm an agent that fights for my clients, that fights for the industry, and it is, it's brutal right now for us. So , um, do yourself a favor and start early, as early as you can. Just have a plan B, even if you don't need it. It doesn't hurt to have a plan B. That's my biggest thing. Start early.
Speaker 2:Okay. Well thank you Samantha, so much for coming. Could you please share where our listeners can find out more about you? Like a , a website or any way to contact you?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Um, I'm pretty flexible. I've got lots of methods that you can contact me. Okay . Um , I know you said Joel, you'll reference the Facebook page, but I do Yep . Post a lot of updates there. Um, that's Sam Phillips Comma Childcare Insurance Agents . Um, you can also reach out through our website. It's employee hr.com . Um, and yeah, those are probably the two best methods. I don't think I wanna give my cell phone on here.
Speaker 2:<laugh> . <laugh>, I get that. Well, again, thank you so much and thank you to everybody who took the time to listen to this podcast today. Um, we know how busy you are , um, dealing with things like insurance and also <laugh>, also educating young learners. We're so grateful to support you every day here at ProCare. Um, thank you everybody, and we will see you next time.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to this episode of the Childcare Business Podcast. To get more insights on ways to succeed in your childcare business, make sure to hit subscribe in your podcast app so you never miss an episode. And if you want even more childcare , business tips, tricks, and strategies, head over to our resource center@procaresoftware.com. Until next time.