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THE SJ CHILDS SHOW-Building a Community of Inclusion
🎙️ Welcome to The SJ Childs Show Podcast! 🎉
Join Sara Bradford—better known as SJ Childs—as she bridges understanding and advocacy for the neurodivergent community. This podcast shines a light on autism awareness, empowering stories, expert insights, and practical resources for parents, educators, and individuals alike.
Brought to you by The SJ Childs Global Network, a nonprofit dedicated to supporting autistic individuals and their families worldwide, this show is your weekly dose of inspiration and actionable ideas. Visit sjchilds.org to learn more about our mission, find resources, and connect with our growing community.
Catch us on platforms like Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Goodpods—or tune in Fridays at 8:30 AM EDT on the Helium Radio Network’s Life Improvement Radio (Channel 1). Together, let’s foster a brighter, more inclusive world! 🌟
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THE SJ CHILDS SHOW-Building a Community of Inclusion
Episode 315-Cooking Without Sight: The Blind Kitchen Revolution with Debra Erickson
What happens when you're passionate about cooking but can't see the ingredients? For Debra, founder of The Blind Kitchen, vision loss became the catalyst for culinary innovation rather than limitation.
Debra's story begins unexpectedly – she wasn't a natural cook, growing up as one of twelve children with limited kitchen experience. When retinitis pigmentosa claimed most of her vision in her fifties, she made a remarkable decision: instead of abandoning cooking, she enrolled in culinary school as their first legally blind student. There, she developed adaptive techniques that have since transformed kitchen accessibility.
The Blind Kitchen now offers approximately 100 specialized tools that make cooking safer and more approachable for people with vision impairments. Remarkably, about 90% weren't originally designed for the visually impaired but work perfectly with slight adaptations. From cut-resistant gloves that prevent injuries while grating or chopping to simple bump dots that create tactile markers on stove dials, these solutions bridge the gap between culinary arts and accessibility.
What makes Debra's approach revolutionary is her focus on practical, affordable solutions. A rubber band around a conditioner bottle distinguishes it from shampoo. Specialized whipped cream makers allow children to participate safely. These techniques restore kitchen independence for older adults who've lost vision due to conditions like diabetes or glaucoma, while opening culinary possibilities for those who never thought cooking was within their reach.
The Blind Kitchen's website exemplifies digital accessibility with clean design, audio-described videos, and comprehensive resources. As Debra beautifully puts it, "Food is a bridge. We all have to eat. That's something we have in common, regardless of our ability or disability." Her work reminds us that cooking isn't just about nourishment – it's about identity, connection, and the universal joy of creating something delicious.
Explore The Blind Kitchen at theblindkitchen.com and discover how adaptive tools and techniques are transforming lives one recipe at a time. Want to make your own spaces more accessible? Start by considering how simple modifications could make a world of difference for everyone who encounters them.
The SJ Childs Show is Backford's 13th season. Join Sarah Brafford and the SJ Childs Show team as they explore the world of autism and share stories of hope and inspiration. This season we're excited to bring you more autism summits featuring experts and advocates from around the world.
Speaker 2:Go to sjchildsorg.
Speaker 3:Hi and thanks for joining the SJ Child show today. The wonderful amount of guests that we can, you know, gather information from and really learn how to accommodate a wide variety of viewers, listeners and as well as our friends over in the Water Wellness Center. Thank you for your sponsor earlier, you know, in the month. We want to give them a shout out. So thank you so much, debra, for being here today, through all of our difficulties, and to those of you who might be watching this on the YouTube channel yes, it's going to look a little bit different because we're using Zoom instead of our normal StreamYard, but anyways, it's going to be a wonderful conversation and I'm really looking forward to the value you guys are going to find from this. Debra, thanks so much for being here. Tell us a little bit about yourself and what brought you here today.
Speaker 4:No, thank you for having me. Yes, I am the executive chef and founder of the Blind Kitchen and I do happen to be blind. I have retinitis pigmentosa and I was the only blind student in culinary school, so I had to solve a lot of problems and that's what the Blind Kitchen is of problems and that's what the blind kitchen is. It's a. It was my answers to the problems and my now sharing of that information with other people with vision loss that want to cook.
Speaker 3:Wow, that's amazing. You basically went in and created a template for those who you know love to cook and want to are more interested, but might be afraid or or not sure how to start. If that's you know something that you come across, that's really fascinating. Tell us about your, I guess, love of cooking, because obviously, what sent you to culinary school? Why did you start there?
Speaker 4:You know, I did not love to cook and I was not a good cook. I was a tomboy growing up, one of 12 kids. So we, the seven girls, didn't get much time in front of the stove with mom. But even as an adult I cooked from cans and boxes because that was really the only way I knew how and I wasn't judging myself, that's, I thought all people did.
Speaker 4:But I have taught adults in the past, and when I was at the Oregon Commission for the Blind, I lost the major portion of my vision in my early 50s, and so I still wanted to work and I was under doing a meal prep class with my dear friend now. She was my teacher at the time and I thought I'm having fun, I would like to teach cooking, maybe, let me think. And then that light bulb went off because I thought you don't know how to cook and you don't know how to teach cooking, so what in the world are you doing? So that's what sparked the idea for culinary school, because the best place to learn, to teach cooking and learn cooking, is at a cooking school, and it was a wonderful experience. I don't regret it one bit.
Speaker 3:Oh, I love that and I love to cook, so I'm coming from that other. I'm always have my I. My mom was don't be listening, mom. My mom was no dad, though he he was a spectacular cook. So and and he.
Speaker 3:They were divorced, so I lived with him, you know. So we had that one on one where we did everything together in the cooking and stuff. So I really took a lot of what he did and share it with my family. And things more accessible, especially, you know, for our family who are all autistic, especially our son who has profound autism, finding ways to create number one meals that he won't eat anyway, you know, items, food items. But also how do we teach him how to do some of these things and the skills that you need to follow through, and so I think that the idea of just having all types of accessibility for cooking is just brilliant. What is like a major step, that, a tip that you give to start kicking.
Speaker 4:Okay, so I first of all, a lot of the time I have two different groups. I've got people like your son who have difficulties getting into the kitchen, who might have some challenges. Mine, of course, focused mainly on vision loss, but we have about 100 tools now in the blind kitchen, all adaptive, all geared towards vision loss, but about 90% of them are not made for people with vision loss. So, for example, we have a thing called a cut glove and I have done many, many demonstrations where I put the cut glove on my hand typically thin you can't read Braille through it or anything like that, but it's relatively thin and I put my palm of my hand, palm side up and I run a very sharp knife back and forth across it and it does not cut through, it's cut resistant. It's used level five, used in commercial kitchens. So that's good for anybody, especially if you're grating food. I don't know of any cooks that have not left their knuckle skin with a box grater, because they're weird, they're angled, they've got different blades and different number of blades. So I always use that glove when I'm grating, because you just don't know when you're going to come in contact with it and when you do. I'm just going to stop when I feel unexpected contact. If I hadn't been wearing the glove it would have been too late. My skin would already be in the middle. Extra flavor, extra protein, I guess, but it's so.
Speaker 4:Those are the kind of tools that we have so they can be used. So children a lot of parents want their children to help and that allows them to like do grading. That's a simple one. Even if you're very young you can do that, and we have size extra small gloves. But the other population we have are older adults, older adults who already know diabetes related diseases, advanced glaucoma. They don't know how to get in the kitchen without cutting themselves, so they lose a huge part of their identity. And so that is the other group of people that we meet are people that don't know because of whatever disability they have and I don't address all disabilities, but mine certainly can apply to quite a few across the board to help them get back into the kitchen and be able to cook again.
Speaker 3:Oh, I love that. I think that's a fascinating idea. One idea I had, you know, the come on brain, simon Munjambar, that's his name. He's a. He's a judge for one of the cooking shows and I had interviewed him once and we were talking about how could you make your cooking um show more accessible. You know, and we had come up with on, you know, for especially children and things they could see the process that was happening and the boiling water and that kind of kind of get the idea of what that was. And I just thought, oh gosh, these are, these are such great ideas to do. What should a person do to maybe get their kitchen ready? Like, how do you get your kitchen ready if you are going to go? You know you're interested in doing this but you might be, like you said, going through any type of vision impairment, disability. How do you get your kitchen ready?
Speaker 4:So depending on the disability there will be different answers for it. I can speak to vision loss, things like knobs on your stove if they don't click where you can count the clicks, a lot of them don't. A lot of them just kind of freely rotate. They have little things called bump dots which are little tactile bumps. They're literally like a half of a circle with a strong adhesive on the other side and you can, if you can, either mark the tip of the dial or a lot of times you can feel that it comes to a point, there's a specific feel, and then put a bump dot on the stove itself at 300, 350, and 400. Now you just line up the tip of that dial with the first, second or third bump dot, or maybe halfway in between if you want 375. The first, second or third bump dot or maybe halfway in between if you want 375. Very inexpensive and if you're renting and now you want to move out, it can be removed invisibly. But the other good thing is you can use for children that can see. You could use high contrast, certain colors. You can say the red one is for this or the yellow one.
Speaker 4:But most people don't start with the stovetop for cooking with kids. You might want to do the oven, and then there are of gloves to keep your hands safe and never stick your hands in the oven. Just pull the rack out to you. I mean, there are so many different ways to be able to cook safely. And we have some stuff for kids too, that, like we have what we call an aerator and you put in a half a cup of heavy whipping cream, a tablespoon of confectioner's sugar, a little bit of vanilla, and then it gets closed up in the tube and the kid just pumps up and down. So no mess, it's all enclosed in the tube and they don't have to open it because as the yeah, it gets thicker, as the air gets incorporated and into the fat it gets harder and harder to push. So there's quite a few things that you can.
Speaker 3:A frosting maker. It sounds like Like a.
Speaker 4:What A frosting maker it sounds like yeah, a whipped cream maker, yeah, that sounds delicious Wow. It's a wonderful little tool. Oh how fun.
Speaker 3:And you know, when they're little there's so much fun to be had when, if they're interested in doing that, I remember my little one wanting to do you know it was kind of funny because she was like I'm going to go onto the chef, you know kids chef thing. But she didn't actually like to go into the kitchen and make the foods. She didn't really like the competition. So I remember that being on one of her little like vision. We did like a vision boards, you know, for the future it was going to be on the chef's, you know junior chef, kid bakers or something?
Speaker 4:Love that yeah.
Speaker 3:I think that getting anybody excited about what they can do for themselves for cooking because, you know, for my mom, right now especially, she is just widowed and I think that I'm trying to say, hey, find some new recipes that you've never done before, instead of her just feeling kind of, like you said, she has to just eat out of a box or something, because it's just her, and I'm like, no, let's use this time wisely to really invest in all of the things you wanted to do, especially trying those new recipes and things like that, and really, like you know, because she likes the kitchen and I think it's good to encourage, encourage.
Speaker 4:I agree, yeah, and food is a bridge. Food is a bridge. We all have to eat. That's something we have in common, regardless of our ability or disability or whatever. We all have to eat and that's where stories and sharing and history come together. Just being in the same room celebrating events and stuff like that, I have a good industry to be in because it makes people happy.
Speaker 3:Isn't that the truth? And do you do in-person classes there? Well, I'm not even sure where you're at in the world anyways.
Speaker 4:I am in Portland, oregon, the business is oh boy. Next time you're here, come visit. I spent about 10 years there, so I yeah, I'm on a floating home on the Columbia river.
Speaker 3:No, kidding, it's very cool. I'm coming down. Sorry Shutting down this now, starting to drive this afternoon? No, I love that. Wow, wow. What a lucky life.
Speaker 4:That's amazing. It is, it is, but I lost my train of thought.
Speaker 3:I know I got so excited, sorry about that.
Speaker 4:We're all good.
Speaker 3:Where? Oh, I had asked if you had, if you did physical classes there yeah, I do.
Speaker 4:I do workshops where I I go. I've traveled out of state many times and, just like a group of eight people, depends on if their age, their experience with cooking, yeah, but there are a lot of agencies out there that are interested in exposing people to the possibility of returning to the kitchen or perhaps getting in there for the first time. But so, yeah, I do workshops in public speaking and everything else is online now.
Speaker 3:And how did the culinary school accommodate and what did they learn, do you think from your experience in moving forward for other students?
Speaker 4:Well, I went to McCloskey Culinary Institute in Vancouver, washington, and the chefs could not have been any better. They had to treat me like the other students. I was allowed to have a sighted guide for the first month or so because it wasn't a good use of the chef's time to teach me where things were at, but she couldn't do anything for me, so the challenge was always time. I'm a slower cook than other people and I'm the only one using a cane, so when it came time to the practicals just like your daughter, watching those cooking shells, people are rushing around like crazy.
Speaker 4:It was not a safe place to be, because communication in a culinary kitchen is very good. It's part of the culture. Yes, chef, no chef, corner, sharp knife, hot pot, I'm behind you. When people are stressed out, that goes out the window. I'm not complaining, but it is. You're just concentrating on. If you didn't and I wasn't the only one, but I was the only one that never finished on time but they would say you know, if you can't finish on time, finish strong, and I lost. I would lose more points if I messed up the seasoning or the presentation or portioning than if I was a little bit late. So that's the way we went Prioritize Exactly.
Speaker 3:I love that.
Speaker 4:I love that.
Speaker 3:The least amount of pain and I really like that, were you the first student that they had had with vision impairment. And then were they excited to kind of invite more people in. How did they market for something like that?
Speaker 4:Well, I was the first legally blind, for sure, they had a person. So I went through the cuisine side of the wall and on the other side was baking and pastry and they had a deaf student in there with an interpreter. I don't think that person finished. I don't know what that story was, but they send people with visual impairments to me and to talk with them and say what do I want? To go to colonoscopy, what do I need? So I love those kinds of calls where I can really be very honest and say this is it's not easy, it's a lot of homework, it's a lot of memorization, but it is so worth it, yeah.
Speaker 3:Mentorship is so important in all sorts of areas in your life, whether it's, you know, just education or career, just mental health, really all the kind of mentors are wonderful to have, and people were there for me, so it's my job to pay it forward, that's part of it.
Speaker 3:No, I love that. I love that so much. I think that's one of my favorite things, too is helping people find resources just like this. I'll be able to, you know, give anyone that wants this resource an amazing resource to have now, so I'm thrilled about that. What can people find when they go to the website, what does that entail and how do they work through that process?
Speaker 4:Okay, the website is very clean. The way I use my computer is I use a keyboard only. I don't use a mouse. I don't use a screen. I have a screen reader. It tells me what's on there, so it's very screen reader and magnifier friendly.
Speaker 4:But what they'll find is a lot of tools and tips. The tools are the bread and butter of the blind kitchen, but the library is the heart of it and there's a whole lot of free information to help make cooking easier, really for anyone. Focus on vision loss, but a lot of those tips are really helpful. The other thing is there's video tutorials for a majority of the tools and if we don't have a video, then it's a written description that's very accessible and detailed, but the videos are audio described, which means there's no silence. You're not going to have music. It's going to be when I'm not talking, describing what I'm doing in my environment. Then we have a professional voice come on and he says Deborah's crossing the kitchen right now she's near the sink, and so that way anybody, regardless of your level of vision, has access to that information.
Speaker 3:That's so fascinating. You know, I'm going through the since I've started these wonderful accessibility episodes, figuring out that my website wasn't, was not, um, accessible enough for for viewers uh, screen readers rather and so I'm really excited to take that, you know, to be able to offer that as well to anybody that that needs or that wants those, um, and being able to know even that it exists and teach people. These are the things that you need to do in order to be accessible to everyone, for the whole community. So I really, I really like that.
Speaker 4:I appreciate that you looked at your own website and there are companies out there that can help you make your website accessible. It's really not that difficult, but if you don't know how to do it, you don't know how to do it, and so there are companies, but in a lot of people think of ramps and wheelchairs and stuff when they think of accessibility, but me, having access to the internet is huge. I could not run a business without access to the internet, and so when I hit an accessible website, it's very frustrating. It's like what? Why Button button, button button? I don't know if it's a checkout button, a back button, a cancel button. It can be a pretty frustrating experience. So I appreciate that you looked at your website and would encourage others to do the same.
Speaker 3:A hundred percent, no, and I you know, and I, let's be honest, some of us running around out there don't know that it even is a thing that we need to look at, or to do. So I love that we can bring this awareness to help people, because I think that accessibility is so, so important. You know, I obviously want it for my own children, which is my passion. Behind, you know, finding all of the access and resources that I can for the community at large. And where can people find information to come visit you.
Speaker 4:Yeah, just go to theblindkitchencom. That's the website that has all the information on all different aspects of cooking, including ways to label things. How do you identify items in a closed container when you can't smell it? You can't touch it? The two cans of soup look exactly alike. How to clean if you can't see? How to organize? How to access and read recipes if you can no longer read large print? There are like 12 different answers that are correct. It depends on your budget, your comfort with technology, and sometimes as simple as a rubber band around one can of soup and not around the other, or shampoo and conditioner. That's another one. Conditioner has the letter R in it. Put the rubber band around the conditioner and then you've got a little mnemonic device there to help you remember every time you go there. And so some of them are really inexpensive. And those bump dots they're very inexpensive, love that.
Speaker 3:Those are wonderful tips and very practical and easy to do and I can see the value in them, like you said, not only for vision impairment but for other accessibility as well. I think that those are really really wonderful, valuable tips. And are you on social media? Is there anywhere that people can go and find you and follow you and those things?
Speaker 4:Yes, we're on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn and, in full disclosure, I don't do any of that. I pay people to do that Because, you know, I'm also a big fan of doing what you love and I do. Blind people do Facebook and LinkedIn. Absolutely, they do, and they do it quite well. I want to cook and I want to teach. Those are the two things I want to do, and I don't want to learn to do that part of it. So, if there are any budding entrepreneurs out there, do what you love and find a way to pay people, to find a way to get paid for it, and then pay other people to do the things you don't love so much.
Speaker 3:I love that. I think delegation not that I'm good at it I think it's a fantastic idea and I'm going to be getting better at it and I think it comes kind of with times in your life too, and maybe positions that you're in, how much you need to do that. So definitely finding the value in what delegation can bring for my life. So I love that, especially when I found out I didn't know how to fix my website on my own and I had to you know, get ahold of my website designer and say, and you know the, the woman I had previously learned it from said I'll, I'll walk you through it and everything.
Speaker 3:But I really just wasn't comfortable with that. So I'm really glad that there's people that can, um can, do those things. So please, listeners, check your websites, go, make sure you can. Even I think I ran mine through chat GPT. I think it was as simple as me saying hey, chat GPT, is my website accessible, are there things that I can do? And it said, no, there, you know there's. You need to update your website. Here are the things. And so I emailed that to my website designer and said hey, these are the things I need help with, but you know, try to do it.
Speaker 4:That's fabulous. I learned something here. So the next time I get to a website maybe it's it's gonna I can run it through and send it to someone at that company you use it for you know really positive intentions and and uses it can be such a helpful tool and I I recommend it to to everyone you know use it correctly, Um, and it can be just a fascinating fascinating and and so time-saving oh goodness, and it can be just a fascinating.
Speaker 3:fascinating and so time-saving.
Speaker 4:Oh goodness.
Speaker 3:And it's brilliant? Yeah, it has all the information.
Speaker 4:Meta and Ray-Ban hooked up together and they made these glasses with a camera on them. And so I say, hey, meta, look and tell me what's in this can in my hand, and I'll hear it snap a picture. And then I hear the AI whirring in the background. Well, that's a can of kidney beans. And you know how many ounces, meta 15 ounces. I can be in an airport. Hey, meta, can you see a door in front of me? No, there's no door in front of you. Or, yes, there's a door in front of you. It's amazing. It makes me way more independent. Ai, I'm not smart enough about it to be afraid of it, I'm just loving it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm just I and I, my husband kind of teases me cause he doesn't really, he just uses his cell phone. That's the only technology, isn't even you have an email address. And so I kind of he teases me and I say, well, I'm, I'm really friendly with it. It's like when anything goes down, they're going to be like Sarah is our friend. So, yeah, you know, I heard an interesting thing that they it actually costs time and so much money for please and thank yous. I, yeah, and I't know, I would have never thought that, because it's only, you know, written to do tasks. It doesn't, um, it doesn't it has to take extra time to deal with the emotions that us humans have that we put into it.
Speaker 4:No, no to self sound like a robot?
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly If you talk to it like a robot, it understands better.
Speaker 4:No, that's pretty good.
Speaker 3:Oh, this has been such a wonderful conversation, Debra. Thank you so, so much for your time today.
Speaker 4:I've enjoyed it as well. Sarah, Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I hope we can stay in touch Definitely.
Speaker 4:Agreed, agreed. I think we're both trying to make the world a more accessible place, and so we have a lot in common and we like Portland Oregon.
Speaker 3:Exactly, exactly. I love that. Well, it's so nice to chat with you and, yeah, let's stay in touch, for sure.
Speaker 2:Sounds good. In the heart of the city, she's shining bright. Oh yeah, stories of love and courage. All throughout the night, her voice resonating An anthem for all. Through the trials and the trials, she answers the call. A mother and a fighter, breaking barriers and strife, with love as her guide. She'll never hide. She's changing the world for you With her heart and speech and strong Empathies and melody. In her journey we all belong. Followers gather Like stars in the night. So bright, 44,000 voices Sharing in the light. She stands for family, advocates them all. Movement of compassion. Ways we'll soar Podcast together. Symphony of support In life change and rapport. She's changing the world for you With a heart that's fierce and strong, empathies and melodies In a journey we all belong. Through her eyes, a vision clear. Together we rise, shedding fears in every heart. She plants the seed of understanding and love for dearly me. It's changing the world for you With a heart that's fierce and strong, empathies and melodies In a journey we all belong.
