Take some time to listen in on an excellent conversation with active practitioners as it relates to community involvement. Dave Sawler from Glace Bay, N.S., and Chad Nickerson from Saint John, N.B are interviewed by Jim Molloy, from the Maritimes District Office - They talk about real, practical steps for how we can help our communities navigate this pandemic season and also into the future. They discuss the importance of developing community partnerships, being consistent in your help to your local community, and how to make sure these new community engagements stay with our churches moving into the future.
Take some time to listen in on an excellent conversation with active practitioners as it relates to community involvement. Dave Sawler from Glace Bay, N.S., and Chad Nickerson from Saint John, N.B are interviewed by Jim Molloy, from the Maritimes District Office - They talk about real, practical steps for how we can help our communities navigate this pandemic season and also into the future. They discuss the importance of developing community partnerships, being consistent in your help to your local community, and how to make sure these new community engagements stay with our churches moving into the future.
Transcript of Podcast by Multiply Network
Created to champion church multiplication, provide learning and inspire new disciple-
making communities across Canada
2020 – Jim Molloy, Dave Sawler and Chad Nickerson
Paul Fraser: Welcome to the Multiply Network podcast, a podcast created to champion church multiplication, provide learning and inspire new disciple-making communities across Canada.
Hi there. Welcome to the Multiply Network podcast. This is a special bonus feature for this month. We are providing 2 podcasts with my friends Jim Molloy from the Maritimes District Office, Dave Sawler from Glace Bay in Nova Scotia and Chad Nickerson in Saint John, New Brunswick. They talk about community engagement, some practitioners working through the Covid crisis. The interview was recorded 3 weeks ago but there was so much stuff in there I felt like no, this needs to get replayed and so we’re happy to replay it for you on the Multiply Network podcast. They talk about being community focused, developing partnerships with other community charities, being consistent and not to forget what they are learning in Covid-19 once we return to whatever normal is going to be. We need to make the transition to community engagement and they are going to help you. It’s coming up right now.
Jim Molloy
Q. I want to talk to you guys today a little bit about what you are doing. Dave, you’re in Glace Bay and Chad, you are in Saint John, both of you are in environments where poverty is very obvious, social need is very obvious and you are also in areas where addiction is high, disconnect is high, students who have gone back home are living at home now. The only reprieve they had in the daytime was going to school, then they go back to dangerous homes. So there are all kinds of layers of social need and real world need and real world ministry that needs to happen. I thought we could talk a little bit today about some of the things your 2 churches are doing in particular.
Chad, maybe I’ll start with you and just ask a little bit about your pantry program. What is that doing? What is that and how are you able to execute that even with all these distancing rules and challenges. Give us a little rundown of how you are tackling it.
Chad Nickerson: Really the pantry ministry has been running in our church for around twenty-five plus years. It is the third Thursday of the month. We gather folks from our neighbourhood. They come in. We have a safe place for them to just kind of drop in and hang out. We serve some beverages and refreshments. Doors open at 11:15 and then at 12 o’clock we have someone share an inspirational message, then we have a hot meal that is provided all free of charge. Then we hand out a bag of groceries to each person present. It is a stop-gap measure. We’re not an official food bank. It’s an extra help along the way. Some folks in our church felt to do this twenty-five plus years ago.
So when Covid-19 happened it kind of messed everything up because we can’t really gather. We can’t do that which we usually do. We also serve other folks through the month who can’t come on that day. We’re able to help them and serve them with a bag of groceries. But we were caught just off-guard with Covid-19. We didn’t know how we could proceed so we tried to carefully follow the guidelines of the public health agency and do what we could with social distancing and whatnot.
So on the third Thursday of March we did go forward. We had the event in the church parking lot. We served hot meals for take-out, in take-out containers, and we have fifty-six guests come, some first-timers. It seemed to be really well received. It was a little tricky for logistics. We had to have a skeleton crew and we tried to really bless our guests. The folks that were coming understood that we weren’t in any way trying to make them put out or feel like they have some illness. We wanted to protect them. We were very clear with them on that.
Really, most of the other ministries in our church have actually had to cease because we have so many other gatherings that we didn’t see how we could do with Covid-19. We have some online Bible studies and other things. There are other groups that are trying to connect through Zoom and other ways. But pantry is the one we have really put the time and effort into trying to continue to do that.
Q. How are you paying for it?
Chad Nickerson: Well, that was the other challenge because when we don’t have regular life rolling along we don’t have the normal donations and donors that are contributing and so we are doing the best we can with the donations we have. We were contacted by the United Way in Greater Saint John and they were participating in something called the Atlantic Compassion Fund. So charities could apply for funding from that so we did that and we just heard a couple of days ago that we have received some funding, $1,000, to help us for the next month. They were also a great resource to help us connect with other community groups, other initiatives that are happening and some things I didn’t even know existed, even though I’ve been here for sixteen years. There are groups that are helping in other ways so we’re able to partner together and try to still support and help people.
But the funding from the United Way is really going to help us for the next month to continue to serve folks in a very special way.
Q. Right. I know in Calvary Temple in Saint John where you are there’s often a lot of people who just come knocking on the door asking for help because your church is known as a generous and helpful church. Has that changed now for you? Do you just do this thing or is there a volume of intake that you are still trying to process?
Chad Nickerson: We basically are pouring all of our efforts right now for that type of benevolent ministry into the pantry program. Because of Covid the building is closed to the general public. The office door is not answered because we are trying to protect the staff. So really for us we are on social media. We are connecting with folks that have reached out to us through phone or social media in our neighbourhood that needed support in other ways. So we’re trying to help them the best way we can but yes, we are not able to help people like we always are known for because of Covid right now.
Q. Dave, you’re up in Cape Breton, my home, which has some of the highest poverty rates in the nation, in North America and addictions rates are through the roof. As you have adjusted, your church is fairly digital, you are fairly capable with digital stuff anyway, so you shifted quickly into responding to need. What are the things you are seeing there? What are the needs presenting in front of you now?
Dave Sawler: I would say our main one right now is food security. So every community, like in Glace Bay alone we have five hundred kids who eat at school every day who are not right now. Every community is the same. New Waterford has about the same numbers and we’ve all been trying to figure out how on earth do we get food to kids. And it’s not just kids. I mean, our senior population is almost in the same boat but we just have a high percentage ---
The system we had for kids is just gone. So we’ve been spending really the last 2 ½ weeks working with a lot of groups on how to address that. The complications of social distancing have been extreme trying to figure them out. Basically I have been in meetings every single day for hours trying to figure out how on earth we are going to do this not just for kids.
We have been quite successful though in rolling out some plans. Most of our stuff is getting rolling this weekend with several groups across the CBRM.
Q. One of the things we’ve been hearing from our churches is they have solved the online problem and now they want to solve the other problems. Some communities don’t have the levels of poverty that your 2 churches are having; i.e. the social issues. But what they are really coming up against is we want to reach them, we want even with youth ministry, we want to connect with students, we want to care for students. For students the one safe place was youth group and now they’ve lost that. But what they are bumping up against of course is the social distancing regulations. They want to be the feet on the ground but they are not allowed to move their feet so it’s a real challenge.
How are you navigating that in the Lighthouse?
Dave Sawler: Well, it’s because we have partnered. For example, our lunch bag program, we’re working with the school board. It is actually teachers who are calling the homes and trying to find out what kids need meals, etc. Tomorrow we’re doing deliveries of meals. So public health is the one giving us the guidelines on how to do safe delivery. It is only because we are reaching out and partnering with the groups who are allowed to work that has made that possible. So with us it has been the United Way, New Dawn here, Inspiring Communities, the Health Board. I’m actually forgetting some groups. And the school board are all working together to make that happen. So it’s been a huge challenge.
For those who think it’s not possible though, it is. In a short period of time we’ve been able to pull together some substantial amounts of funding. I don’t know, part of it may be because we’re in Cape Breton and already have these high poverty needs, so I feel like Inspiring Community is using us as the pilot project because New Waterford and Glace Bay, for example, have the highest child poverty rates outside of our Aboriginal communities in the Maritimes. Anyway, they are throwing some money this way. But it is only because we are working with all those groups that it is possible. I think that is the key. If you are trying to do this on your own I think you will get shut down really fast. I think the Health Board may shut you down. But there is a way to do it if you’re willing to work with some partners.
Q. Chad, any advice to churches who are sort of saying we just can’t solve this problem of social distancing. There are some churches who just said what we’re going to do is we’re going to deliver online content because the restrictions are so challenging. And of course the make-up of their church is challenging. Some churches have a lot of seniors and to put them out doing deliveries, for example, would be a real unwise thing to do.
Any suggestions for our churches on how to leverage the resources they have to meet real social need?
Chad Nickerson: I’ll echo what Dave said a minute ago. I think it really is important at this time to network with other organizations. We so often want to be solo silos, do our own thing. But it really is important that we work together and try to accomplish the most we can. We have a lot of senior citizens in our church and we’re encouraging our folks to be – following guidelines from public health – be good neighbours. If you are out for your walk keep your six-feet-plus from others but say hi. Ask if anybody needs anything. Do you need a box of milk? Do you need whatever that I can drop off at your door?
We are using some of the online means to connect with folks because I didn’t realize a lot of our clients in the south end of Saint John are online. I didn’t really realize that as many of them are as they are. So we’re able to have really great meaningful conversations there as well, where people I’ve never got to talk about spiritual things with are now saying: “I need hope. I’m really discouraged. I don’t know what to do.” That’s another great avenue to serve and help.
I think some churches could have some teams that do contact in that way intentionally to chase down some folks and just love and encourage people.
Q. Yes. What are the next problems Chad that you are having to solve? There are a thousand small ones, but are there any other ones in front of you like ‘we’ve got to figure out how to do’ or are you feeling like you’ve got your lane, you’re doing the pantry and you are doing relational ministry, do you have any glaring problems you see coming down the track for you?
Chad Nickerson: For me I think it’s when all the chips fall back into place once some normalcy of life picks up again. We were just starting a building project for our roof. The roof has to be redone quite urgently at the church and we were just starting the campaign to fund raise for that and then this summer have it done. That’s all totally off the rails. It is going to be tough to pick up the pieces once we get back to some normalcy whenever that is; weeks, months, whatever. It is going to be tough to get back on track then.
But to be positive, I see a great opportunity where for us here in a more traditional church once we get back to whatever normalcy there will be, we will continue some of these things that we’ve started to do with the phone calling, the connections on social media, some of the broadcasting that we’re doing, even some of the Zoom groups. We’re going to continue that stuff because we had not used that a lot, a little bit, but now it’s become more common in people’s lives in our group. So we’re going to continue to try to utilize that as we go forward.
Q. Right. People have become very comfortable with Zoom technology very fast. I’ve been in multiple conversations. It is actually becoming ---
Your first Zoom meeting you feel very distant, you feel distant. But after a couple you just feel like today we’re talking together. I feel like you guys are in the room and it’s comfort now.
Chad Nickerson: I’ve been shocked at how many people who are eighty and ninety years old are totally online. They love it. They are just having a ball.
Q. It actually has increased the ministry for those who are perpetually going to be isolated because of their age or because of their health, unrelated to Covid, they now have a new way to engage with their church that has forced them to become comfortable with. That’s important.
Dave, Lighthouse does so much in terms of meeting real community need. We could spend the whole time probably talking about the things that Lighthouse puts out in the Cape Breton area, beyond Glace Bay even. The question that comes to my mind though is how do you make it all happen with funding and also human resources? How even post-Covid, how do you drive these programs?
Dave Sawler: Human resources is always tough. I’m trying to figure out how to do everything. If I turn my camera around you will see our sanctuary is actually filled with boxes that almost all came from Sobey’s this morning. So we have to get 2 people to come in and pack lunch bags. That’s it. Just 2 people. Then tomorrow we’re going to do deliveries and only one person can pick stuff up at a time. So, you know, trying to figure all that out on the human side.
We’re actually trying to do everything now with fewer people, which is interesting because this morning I made a post. We needed a truck to come pick something up and I had like ten people message. Well, the truth is I can only have one person, right. This is a new --- Anyways, it’s new.
So right now this crisis has actually made all these people available who are super-bored. It’s funny. How can you use them to do one thing? It’s more that. There are actually more people right now who are looking for something to do and so we have to manage the people.
As far as resources, I’m not sure this has happened over the years. We’ve been here doing this for fifteen years. Right away when the United Way posted they are doing something we made the application. We got quite a bit of money for food, Breakfast Canada, we got money right away. New Dawn is doing something. The grocery stores here are all donating. I think because we have been persistent in doing good in our community that people now think if something is going to happen maybe Undercurrent or Lighthouse is the way to make it happen.
So anyways, we’ve always been pretty fortunate in that way. The levels of government are always really good to us; the city, the province and the federal government. People always hear when we get this grant or that grant. I don’t think it is by accident. I think it is because I’ve stayed in one community for a long time and we’ve been consistent with serving. And because we’ve been consistent with serving, people help a lot.
It doesn’t mean our church has money. People always confuse those 2 things because sometimes ---
This week we had cash donations of maybe $5,000 for food. Well, our Sunday offerings for our church are terrible. We’re going in the hole and yet we have all this donated money for food! Anyways it has just been being consistent.
But the other shift we have to make and I realized when I was in one of these Zoom calls last week with some of the youth workers from all over the place. And you know what one of the things that really struck me was everyone was talking about how they are streaming their Sunday School or streaming their youth services, etc. In the middle of the conversation one thing that hit me was what is the biggest need of our kids and youth in our community. Everyone was talking about how they are streaming a service. And I said right now we have the highest amounts of abuse ---
Actually, in one of our mental health and addictions meetings for the province yesterday and their big concern is the highest amount of abuse that is going on. We have kids – Jim, you already mentioned it – the highest amount of kids ever who are in homes with abusers right now. We have the highest amount, maybe in our lifetime, of kids and youth who are going to be hungry, who have the highest levels of anxiety. One thing that struck me, I was in this meeting and everyone is talking about how they are doing Bible studies and streaming their services, which are all good, by the way. But it hit me that none of them were talking about what are the biggest needs surrounding their churches and it reminded me we could fall into that trap as a church in general by doing services and we’re surrounded by lost people and broken people and incredibly needy people.
You’re right, we did spend the first week or two trying to figure out how to get online. But what are the biggest needs in our community? I have realized that we’re trying to do a lot of stuff online but it can’t just be for us. So how can we use our online stuff to address what issues are in our town? I think that is a big challenge to make that shift.
Some people think I’m very unspiritual just to be talking about anxiety or depression but these are the real needs of people around us so how can we use what we’re doing online to try to meet those real present needs. And as this goes on, the longer this goes on the more prevalent those needs are going to become.
I think that’s our challenge. How do we use our people? We all have a lot of people who maybe this is the time we can actually address some of those.
Q. That’s good. Let’s talk about that. Let’s sort of climb up to 30,000 feet and talk about that for a minute. I’ll ask you the question first Dave, and then I’ll turn it over to Chad.
It’s a little bit like ---
Churches in North America weren’t ready to go online so they had to scramble to go online because they weren’t doing online. But in the same way a lot of churches aren’t community engaged. It is as much a learning curve for them now. How do we get online when we weren’t online before and how do we get community engaged when we weren’t community engaged before? That’s not an indictment. Some of our churches have aged. They have been in existence for a while. The main effort of the church was to deliver a Sunday morning experience. So actually they have 2 learning curves; the online learning curve and then how do we become community engaged now when we weren’t. So one of the benefits you have had is you have had pre-existing relationships so you are a natural outlet for ministry. People are coming to you because that has been your plan the whole time. What are you seeing as maybe the ---
This is not every church of course and I don’t want to sound negative. But what do you see as the misses? When you look across the landscape of the churches responding to the Covid crisis, where do you see the misses? I’ll go to Chad after you but we’ve got you here unmuted so let’s go with you first.
Dave Sawler: The big one is what I just mentioned. I think we’re trying to do what we do online for what we normally do inside for our own people. But we now have a different audience and we’re trying to stream the same thing. For example, I’ve been looking at how many people watch our Sunday online stuff. Honestly, it’s 10 times the amount of people that come on a Sunday. But I don’t know if anybody has thought through who the heck is watching. Say it’s 90% of people from your community and, well, so your audience has completely changed and I think one of the challenges that we actually have as a church we don’t know how to speak to people in our community. We don’t know how to speak to people who aren’t Christians. Yet now we’re streaming and putting all this stuff out and people may just think it is odd and strange because we’re not even speaking –
Are we speaking a language they even understand? So we’ve all jumped to try to stream our services because the first need was to meet so the people who already come to our church have a connection. But what we need to realize is that maybe that’s only 10% of the people who are now watching what we’re putting online. So our audience has changed. Our community is now watching and so I think that is going to be a challenge for us. How do we take a message ---
Maybe this is a positive that is going to come out of this. It is going to force us to speak in a way that the world understands.
Q. Right. Sure.
Dave Sawler: You know, it is going to take the church needs out of a lot of things. This is a huge opportunity but I think that is one of the changes that needs to happen when we think about what we’re putting online is if our community really is watching, do we just keep focusing on the people who would normally be here on Sunday, because right now our audience may be ten times more than it used to be. If you have the opportunity to speak to your community I think that is how we need to view our online things. Maybe not the Zoom Bible study that is just our thing, but what we are putting out on Sundays I think it changes how we need to speak.
Q. Like I was saying to some folks, if you are a church of fifty and your audience is usually fifty but all of a sudden on a given Sunday 250 people show up to your service on top of your fifty who don’t know anything about Jesus, what kind of message, what kind of service would you deliver. It would be drastically different. That is exactly what has happened. The audience has shifted. Of course it is going to take a while. The first Sunday you are going to do what you always do. You don’t have time to think.
Chad, what do you think? What are you seeing, your observations, as you live in a real raw ministry there. You have a church where people have been serving Jesus for a long time, yet you are in a real if I could use the word ‘dark’ area of the City of Saint John. Anything you are seeing unfold as you watch the church in North America respond?
Chad Nickerson: I think it really is important to remember our neighbourhoods, where we are, who lives around your church, your organization or your ministry. You know, those are the folks I think, I believe, you really want to try to reach and to love and to serve and to care and to share. I’ll say it again. I find a lot of people today in our world are hurting. They are searching. They are scared about this illness. Will they get it? Will a loved one of theirs get it? How do they get it? A lot of people are really, really lonely because of the social distancing. It has really put a wedge in there where some folks used to always get together. So people are, I believe, and I find from my interactions are really open. So what Dave said makes good sense. We need to be really really extra aware of what we’re communicating, how we’re speaking in our online presence and in all of our things that we’re doing as the church. Even running into a neighbour as you walk 6 feet away from them down the street, you know, being very hyper-aware that folks need hope and they need love and help. So everything that we’re doing we’re trying to come from all the serving that we have been doing, all the different things that we’ve done in the past through different days, through normal life, through events and different things to serve our neighbourhood, now how can we do that with the current parameters that there are. I think it is important to know your neighbourhood and to be real today. People don’t need a pre-packaged fake approach to God. They need reality and genuine care.
Q. Right. And I think that is important what you said about meeting the real need. But you are still making the links to the gospel. You are still making the links. They don’t feel a spiritual need -- well maybe they do a little bit, but the economic, the lonely, they are feeling that need and then to meet that need and yet still link it to the need, you know, it’s Easter weekend, the need for salvation, making that critical link.
Making that critical link. You can meet all kinds of need and not make that link, and we can, but also to be able to strategically link it to the gospel so that people actually have their needs met and they turn their lives over to Jesus. To live in that sweet spot is a real challenge. It takes a lot of thinking. The learning curve ---
What I’m learning is that so much of what we do, so much of what I do, you just do it by rote. You don’t even stop to think about it. You have your lane. You get in it and you run it. This has been a real good plucking out of that rut. Okay, everything I do today has to have real value, it has to have real value, be of real help. It’s challenging.
Q. Dave, anything else on your mind?
Dave Sawler: You know what, there are a lot of positives that are going to come out of this. I was thinking like even for the church in general, I’m a pastor of a church. We have salaries, we have staff and all these things. Just to think 90% of the churches and pastors in the world are either bi-vocational or volunteers and we’re in a panic. But the truth is that 90% of the churches operate without all the stuff we have in the first place and they’ve been fine. As a matter of fact, they seem to be doing quite well.
We’re all worried about the loss of certain things. But the truth is the majority of the church in the world operates without all the stuff we have and are doing a fantastic job. Throughout this whole thing I hope we actually get stripped away from some of the stuff we may think is of benefit to us. But it may be a lot of stuff that holds us back. Because the rest of the church is doing fine without all the stuff we have.
Q. Yes.
Dave Sawler: I think people are more receptive to the church. There has been some hostility to the church but when people see the church go forward without all the benefits, it does prove the authenticity of the church. Like our pastors are being laid off and yet they are still doing the work of the ministry. It just shows everybody these people weren’t in it for the money. They were in it for the mission. It has become quite significant. I think you are right. I think as we lose some of the trappings that we have we will accelerate.
I just read an interesting book a while back that drew a direct correlation between the tough times the church was in, could be persecution, could be the lack of resources and in the book in every case there was a flourishing of the church. Christians were being slaughtered in the early church but they were accelerating, even though they were being exterminated they were actually accelerating. And then through history, the parallels between the tough times and how the church accelerated.
An interesting thing and this is off subject. But in the book the correlation between the mobilizing of the young, where young people grab the mission and they move from the sidelines, letting the adults do it, they move to the field. I haven’t thought that through yet what that might mean for us. I think it was quite significant.
Q. Yes.
Dave Sawler: One of the highlights of the Christian faith throughout history, in Europe when all the plagues hit, some of the most incredible stories of Christianity, about the people who stayed and helped and served. A lot of them gave their lives to do it. Those are some of the stories, when you think about all the bad history of Christianity throughout the Middle Ages and stuff, you have these highlights of when the church gave, sacrificed and served. Those are written in history and everyone thinks that is an incredible time for the church.
That’s where we are right now so if we decide, even if we don’t know exactly what we can do or how to do it, but we find ways to serve, that is what people are going to remember throughout this and afterwards.
Q. Yes. Exactly. And that gives us such cachet for future ministry and to have a voice. The reason you can do what you’re doing now at Lighthouse and what you can do in Saint John is you have ---
Before Covid you put some deposits in the tank and now you have leverage and people willing to work with you.
Chad, I don’t want to put you on the spot here but any encouragement for our Maritime churches, our Maritime pastors who might watch this interview and think what do we do here? Do you have any encouragement?
Chad Nickerson: I would just say that I am learning. I’ll speak for myself. I am learning of the faithfulness of God and his provision when life doesn’t ---
You can’t even say this is a speed bump. This is a gaping hole in the highway, a huge sink hole that showed up here along our way of doing church and life the normal way that it has been. I’ve been totally astounded at the doors God has opened and the things I think God wants us to do as the church today. I’ve reminded our people of that old time Bible verse in Esther 4:14, where it was said of Esther, maybe the Lord has raised you up for this very time right now as a deliverer for your people, as an influence for God. I believe that is for us today. It can be daunting. It can be in some circumstances you can say, gee I don’t know how to serve. We have so many regulations and rules. What can we really do to reach out and help?
I think we just need to look next door. Who is living next door? Who is walking by right now on their job? There are all kinds of opportunities to just gently, humbly serve and help. I think those opportunities are going to go far beyond this current health crisis and there will be greater relationships as we go forward as well.
Q. I think you are right. When we ask the spirit of God what does he want us to do, he does give us something to do if we actually take the pause ---
It may look different for every church but we ask God to give us a step of mission, he always gives us a step of mission. It might be very different from what every other person is doing or church is doing.
What I’m finding I’m saying to pastors a lot is God knew this pandemic was coming. He knew what 2020 was going to look like. And when he was assembling the leaders, when he was picking who was going to be alive and leading the churches in this, he picked you! Right or wrong He thought I’m going to assemble this crew. I’m going to put these people in charge of the church at this time. So we have to step into that and realize that God has placed, like you said, God has placed me even though I feel so ill-equipped but yet I have to believe that in his wisdom and even in my weakness, he’s aligned it that I’m not a pastor in 2048. I’m a pastor in 2020. It doesn’t make sense to me but He seems to think that was a wise decision.
That’s what I tell pastors. You are supposed to be where you are in this.
Dave, the last word goes to you. Any insights?
Dave Sawler: This is a huge opportunity. Chad mentioned at the beginning he reached out to the United Way. One of the great things was connecting with other people that are doing things in your community. Even if you can’t figure out what to do, we actually have an opportunity to connect. That may be the way to meet some new friends right now, some more people. Just in the last 2 weeks I have met so many people who are doing stuff in our community I didn’t even know about. It’s actually been wonderful.
One of the other things I was thinking about. A couple of years ago when we did that Hemorrhaging Faith Study, all these people were interviewed about what they liked about church and all that stuff. We’re always under such pressure to present all this very fancy stuff online. I was thinking about this the other day. One of the things that I remember about it which no one ever talked about why they liked church or didn’t like church, none of them, out of the five thousand people, all the fancy stuff we do in church never came up. But that’s in the rush to live stream, everyone is trying to do all this perfect job. It was never ever an issue. It was not anything that anyone said I go to this church because of that or I don’t because of this.
What it came down to was did they feel part of it. The heart issues. I think it should be encouraging to everyone it is not about all the fancy stuff you can put online. Do people feel like they are loved and accepted? How can we build community even in all of this? That’s what matters.
I think sometimes when I get scared I can’t produce what someone else is producing. Listen, no one cares! What they need to hear is you and have that connection with some people in your community and with each other. Let’s continue to be community and be a loving family to one another through this.
Q. That’s all that matters. Showing people they are a part and valued. My little church I grew up in in Port Hawkesbury, I mean, it was clumsy as far as services and stuff goes but I stayed serving Jesus through all that because I was connected there. We didn’t have all the offerings that churches could have. Some of our churches are doing really great. Some churches, all they are doing, people in the church are making phone calls because their complete Covid-19 strategy is phoning people and praying for people and saying hello. That’s fantastic! Right. Especially in some of the communities that they are in. Because that is what people care about.
Thanks for your time.
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