Getting Financially Smarter: Tom Seeko & CJ Burnett

In this episode of Vet Life Reimagined, Tom Seeko and CJ Burnett, financial advisors and hosts of the Smarter Vet Financial podcast, discuss the importance of financial clarity in the veterinary profession. They share their personal journeys into finance, emphasize the significance of financial habits and behaviors, and how these play a role in veterinary careers. The duo also highlights common financial missteps, the evolution of financial mindsets in the veterinary field, and the importance of matching with the right financial advisor. Additionally, they stress the value of planning for career and personal success while managing finances effectively. Their new book, 'Unleashed: The Financial Clarity Every Veterinarian Needs', offers guidance for veterinary professionals. 

Resources:

• Episode on YouTube
• Florida Veterinary Advisors YouTube channel
• Florida Veterinary Advisors website
• Megan Sprinkle's episode on the Smarter Vet Finacial Podcast
• Book _ Unleashed: The Financial Clarity Every Veterinarian Needs

00:00 Introduction to Vet Life Reimagined
00:04 Meet the Financial Advisors: Tom Seiko and CJ Burnett
01:55 Tom Seiko's Journey into Finance
04:50 CJ Burnett's Path from Music to Finance
08:29 The Importance of Financial Habits and Behaviors
13:13 The Evolution of Financial Mindsets in Veterinary Medicine
20:06 Advice for Veterinary Students and New Graduates
24:34 Understanding Financial Statements
25:03 Financial Strain on Veterinary Technicians
25:49 Lifestyle vs. Income: A Vet Tech's Dilemma
26:33 Increasing Your Value in the Veterinary Practice
29:01 Balancing Lifestyle and Financial Goals
35:13 The Importance of Financial Conversations in Relationships
39:19 Final Thoughts and Gratitude

Transcript

 Megan Sprinkle: [00:00:00] Welcome to Vet Life Reimagined. Today we have a little bit different of an episode. We have two guests, Tom Seiko and C. J. Burnett. They are financial advisors who decided to focus on supporting the veterinary profession. In 2020, they started the Smarter Vet Financial podcast and this year released a book called Unleashed, The Financial Clarity Every Veterinarian Needs. 

I was a guest on their podcast, which I can link to the episode in the show notes, and they wanted to share what they have learned here with you to help us re imagine the possibilities of our lives and veterinary careers. So let's get to the conversation with Tom Seiko and CJ Burnett 

from Florida Veterinary Advisors. 

, welcome to Vet Life Reimagined. I'm very excited to have you on the podcast. And on this podcast, we really talk about possibilities in veterinary medicine and a lot of it coming down to how do we create these career paths where that people can really thrive. 

And when it comes to making decisions about your career path and what you want to do in vet med, very [00:01:00] often I see people Bring finances into that decision. So I think this is a very relevant topic to support people and understanding finances a little bit more and how it applies to them and their career. 

Because, some people will say, Oh, well, this clinic has this huge sign on bonus, or this company is offering some repayments for student loans and all of those things that seem really flashy. So I really want people to understand a little bit more about how finances work and how they can implement that into part of their career. 

And of course it's the bigger part of life as well. So very excited to have you both as finance experts and dedicating a lot of time to specifically supporting people in the veterinary industry. So thank you so much for what you do. And I would love to learn a little bit more about you individually, Tom and CJ, on how did you stumble into finances and decide to make that your career journey? 

So Tom, let's start with you. Why finance? How did you get into [00:02:00] it? 

Tom Seeko: , I have the, the very long version that I could share, but I will, I'll keep it kind of short just for the sake of anyone wants to talk with me on what side it is. , I grew up, throughout my childhood, my dad was entrepreneurial. 

He used to always teach me about financial stuff. Uh, I remember every month he would have a sheet out that, , would have all of his bills and expenses on it. And , he was on his own business owner for a while. And, I feel like it just kind of got ingrained into me , for a minute. I learned how to do currency trading when I was, younger. 

, and it's the currency trading, like the, the pound versus the dollar, and there's, you know, there's actually charts and things you can do day trading with it. And I did that when I was like around 15. Until I was about 18, and I haven't spent a lot of time doing any more because I devote a lot of my attention to the veterinary community and our business that we work on. 

And from there, I know I went to college. Initially, I was going to do graphic design. Surprisingly, I loved design around graphics, creating websites, [00:03:00] advertisements. It was a thing that I really liked. But then I went to go apply for Flagler University. And they told me that I needed to have like a 20 page portfolio created within the matter of a week. 

And I had absolutely nothing. And I was like, I guess that's not, that's not going to happen. So, uh, I changed gears and I was like, what would be my second interest that I have here is finance. And, I started, I didn't really have an idea of what path I wanted to go down with it. And I know when I was graduating from the university of South Florida in Tampa, Florida, I, I had the option of either going towards becoming a personal banker with one of the bigger banks out there. 

Uh, one of the people that you'd meet when you go to open a bank account and some other things, you can work your way up, or start working within the financial advising world. And I decided to opt towards that direction. And it just felt more of a, more opportunity. And I actually spent a good portion of my career for the first three years working with K through 12 teachers, with their 403b in retirement, , just found that that wasn't the industry that I wanted to work with. 

They all need help. But [00:04:00] then I was like, I shifted out of where I was from a company standpoint. They just didn't align philosophically with me and my values and my vision that I wanted. And then that's when I started, over after three years in the business. And, uh, that's, I had a chance to meet CJ and we, we started working in veterinary medicine, without any connections, knowing zero people. 

It just, it was an industry that it felt hungry for education. Then we did more research and just found out like, yeah, , there's really no one here supporting it to that level. And I think that's been a huge motive and it's been 10 years now being in financial planning, with veterinarians. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, and I definitely want to talk about some of the evolutions that you've seen over that 10 year time. 

I can only imagine that could be probably its own podcast, but interesting. Yeah, right. So very fascinating. And yes, CJ, how about you? How did you get into finance? Because I know you also had some other interests too. 

Chris Burnett: Yeah. When I was 16, I ended up having to take high school online because I was playing [00:05:00] out as a musician. 

I was a fiddle player. Ended up majoring in violin performance, even in college. But when I was 16, my mom got me really into stock trading. She took me out to an investor's business daily symposium, uh, in California. And she booked tickets to go. She was like, do you want to go? I'm like, sure. 

I'm 16 years old. During the days I didn't really have much to do other than, you know, practice or schoolwork or whatever, dual enrolled in college. And I was 16. So I was still able to kind of. You know, continue my education as if, you know, so it didn't get interrupted, but still being able to play out, play music, make money that way. 

And then also being able to get into stocks. I got heavily into stock trading. By the time I was, legally able to own my own custodial account. Whenever I turned 18, I opened up my own account, started doing, , trading then. And then, um, as I'm majoring in violin performance in college, About two years into it, I had a huge awakening. 

A lot of my friends who were very successful musicians were still struggling [00:06:00] financially and they were all older than me. I think everyone that I played music with were most probably at least three to four years older than I was. And so I'm sitting there at 19 years old thinking these people are, you know, in their mid twenties now and still struggling. 

I don't, I don't know if this is for me. I don't know this career I want. And so what's the next thing? Well, obviously finance, because if you're in stock trading, then that's kind of an easy thing. People think even music to finance is a, is a big stretch. It's really not. Especially if you're analyzing pieces like a Beethoven piece, you're finding that can be out as the appoggiaturas, you're looking for cadences, you're looking for chordal, structures and how keys change over time. 

I mean, it's all analytical. I think one thing that I, I share with VetMed is I am a recovering analytic. you know, we're, we're all very deep analytical thinkers. And oftentimes we forget that other people like the general public, when they bring their pets in, we've, you know, we forget that we're thinking up here and we have to reduce our language down to a place where people understand. 

And I, I've, I've [00:07:00] always found that to be a challenge for me. , but then, you know, I, so I go, I switched my major to finance, graduate with a degree in finance, and then literally started, as a financial advisor. First, like I've been with the same company, been with the same broker dealer, my entire career have not changed once. 

So, probably two, three years into it, Tom ended up joining us and then that was it. We started looking for markets to serve. Tom was like, he loves animals. He was like, Hey, you know, maybe we look into this, uh, this market. I started investigating and looking at, burnout rates. And, uh, you know, I think growing up, I had several friends that I lost to suicide, so even that really hit me hard as far as a community that I, I really wanted to serve and be available for. 

So. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. Oh, goodness. Yeah. And that's some questions that I'll have to is that the last Merck study that they looked at with veterinary well being that some of these mental well being pieces actually are linked to [00:08:00] finances. So again, I think this is an extremely relevant topic. And before we leave your personal journeys. 

Because I, I think this would, this is just interesting to understand about you guys as well what has been maybe one of the biggest aha moments that you have learned for your own personal finances diving in so deep, you know, making this your career? What have you learned personally that you think might be also really relevant to a veterinary audience? 

Tom Seeko: The first thing that comes to my mind is that finances are, are more than investments and. saving, it's more about , the psychology and the habits and the behaviors that are created, in our lives. And, I always believe getting into planning initially, it was like, I, I have to invest money and I have to buy all these different things, but then realized that, people talk about goals. 

And goals are one thing, but then it's being able to actually understand [00:09:00] what I'm personally doing to help achieve those. And most of the time people go into these mindsets of, I wouldn't say mindset, but it's more of just an autopilot because of life being as it is. And be they're told that if you do this, then you're going to be fine. 

And I think that was one of the biggest aha moments for on my side, because especially coming out of school, it was like, I hear this all the time as well from veterinary medicine. That's, it's not a thing that's really discussed. It's not something that people talk a lot about, even creating a spending plan or understanding how to save money and, but then being able to take it to that next level, behaviors and habits and being able to understand the core ones. 

And I think the biggest, behavior is like savings. Savings is always going to outweigh trying to earn high returns and investments purely because like your savings, is something you have a lot more control over in your financial life. 

Chris Burnett: I think for me, it's, to kind of piggyback other than habits and behaviors. 

Cause I think that is, that is the main thing. I think secondarily, uh, hiring [00:10:00] the right people for the things that you're laying in that, that goes for pretty much everything. I think even small things, uh, like who's going to mow your lawn. Right. Cause usually, I don't know if anyone's ever hired somebody to mow their lawn. 

And then that person like really royally screws up their lawn. Right. It's like you, you would think it wouldn't be that hard, but still sometimes you hire people who are not going to do the job correctly. And I think, especially in the finance industry. one of the reasons why I was so hesitant to, I was really actually hesitant to become a financial advisor is cause my have a brain as an analyst, but a heart as an advisor. 

And when you have two of those things working against each other, you know, most of the time, advisors who are out there, they get in the industry. For a lot of different reasons. And sometimes people end up going to advisors and not really understanding what makes a good financial advisor or what makes a financial advisor, someone that is, going to work well with them as an individual based on their personality and their, and their needs and the things that they want to accomplish. 

So I think, you know, the other thing is hiring good people. I [00:11:00] mean, it's, it's really critical to make sure that the person that you're hiring is not only knows a lot and sometimes, and they should know way more than you. They should know an infinite amount of, stuff beyond what you'll find on Google and they themselves should also be aware of when you ask them, Hey, what is X, Y, Z? 

Then they should know what's on Google about X, Y, and Z. So. 

Megan Sprinkle: that also makes sense on how maybe both of you are attracted to the veterinary industry. You talked about your analytical thinking and your interest in animals. And so all of those things, I think it is important to really be able to match appropriately your right advisor who not only understands your situations, but cares, um, A word that I learned a a while back is fiduciary too. 

Not everybody has a fiduciary, background when it comes to financial advising. And so that's also something really important to look for. 'cause they are, tied to making sure that they are doing what's in your best interest as well. [00:12:00] And, to go back to the, the behavior aspect of things. 

I'll say one of my big aha moments was around the psychology, the mindset around money. I remember I'm a 10 year vet. So this is my 10 year reunion. And Going into vet school, at least what surrounded me and in my mindset, going into veterinary medicine was when you go into vet med, you do this because you have the love and the passion and your heart for these animals, and it's not a financially, lucrative profession and you've committed to it. 

You're just going to do it out of the love of your heart and just like never retire. You just die. And so this mindset around that you aren't going to be profitable. You, you know, this isn't something that you do for money and. While yes, I think we do have very passionate people. 

That doesn't mean that you have to be a popper [00:13:00] and give your services away for free and be broke. that's not a good mindset. So hopefully that's changed. I don't know, but that's kind of like what I remember going in and I still kind of hear those types of things I think today. So going back to the, one of the questions I kind of hinted at earlier, you've also been 10 years in finances specifically with veterinarians. 

So what have you seen as some evolutions of money mindsets and things like that when it comes to the veterinary industry? 

Chris Burnett: So, I think the shift that we've seen in financial stuff is really a shift in culture. I think especially 10 years ago, people give us a lot of canned answers when we ask about goals, right? 

It's like, well, I want to make sure my college is paid for for my kid. I want to plan for retirement. Right. And there's all these like, I call them the Bible study answers. Like, I don't know if you've ever gone to a Bible study and, and whatever question they ask, someone's like, Jesus. And you're like, yeah, you're right. 

It's like, [00:14:00] you know, we're asking for goals and we're just getting a lot of this, the same stuff and it's not very custom. And I think our culture has shifted over even over the last decade where the, Distractions have compounded where everyone's pulling at us, trying to get a piece of us. 

Marketers are marketing to us to get our dollars, right? we've got phones now that are so distracting from our kids and from our spouse and from, this things that we want to do in our life, that the distractions are such that people are even not spending time thinking about what they actually want or what's going to fulfill them. 

And so as we, over the last 10 years, I've had a noticeable change in when I get in a meeting room, I used to get canned answers. Now I'm getting less answers. Now I'm actually getting more of like, maybe one to three things that they want. And then I'm like, Hey, what else? 

And it's like, Well, what else is there? Right? Like they, like, they've never had the, time to contemplate what else there may be. [00:15:00] And I think money, our business and it's our culture as it's gotten busier. And as it's gotten more distracting, it's also become harder to find the information that you actually need. 

So information is way more than you need, but how are we getting the translation of that information and how it affects us as individuals? Because we can't go on Google and Dr. Google and type in here are my symptoms and get, get an answer. Right. And even they they're trying to make AI be able to do that. 

So maybe one day we will be able to have that. But for the most part, I've seen a lot of people just, they get an initial meeting. And nowadays it's like, it's almost like, well, I want to pay off my student loans and, uh, go on a trip next year. And that's the extent of their goals. And I think oftentimes you said you, as you said something a few minutes ago, about, you know, not living like a pauper, if people can really start thinking about dollars as thank yous, cause that's really what they are, right? 

Someone's paying you for a service that, that [00:16:00] service, they either couldn't have done themselves or you do it faster than they could have done it. Which then they get arbitration because it's, less expensive for them to give you money than to invest their own time into doing that thing. And I think if veterinarians can realize just how valuable that is, then I think if they usually feel a little bit more comfortable collecting the dollars for the services that they provide, knowing that one, that person will never be able to do what you do and two, they'll never be able to do what you do as fast as 

you do it. 

Megan Sprinkle: Tom, 

Tom Seeko: 

I will say with the. 

Advancement of financial information, how quickly it's accessible out there. I believe it's, it is creating a lot of that noise that CJ was even alluding to, like with the, the information that's out there and understanding what we should be getting. And, uh, it makes me think back into like the sixties and the fifties where. 

there wasn't a lot of ways to understand like how a company [00:17:00] is doing or investment options that are out there. And, I find that where we've had to really put ourselves in the equation here is that we're having to communicate to people that, , advising is more than just, , working with someone on your investments. 

And I think that's where over time, you know, people will say, well, I have a financial advisor. I work with someone on my finances. And, there has been a little bit more of a shift, I think, or people have become a little bit more receptive to it from, from what I'm picking up on, because, you know, one thing it's student loans is, is a super, uh, Heavy subject, which I'm sure you've talked with many people about this, Megan. 

And, over time, it's just like, it seems that it becomes such a huge spotlight to that, where that's like the main emphasis that people are focusing on. So it go over the last decade. it was kind of a thing where people would just be like, yeah, whatever. Don't even really care about it. 

Or they go to school and they. I, I don't know if the cost, I haven't really paid much attention to it at all, but , the amount of loans that people would have actually coming outta [00:18:00] school, it seems like, with everything going up in cost these days, schooling, , I think there's a couple we'd met not too long ago that I had combined a million dollars of student loans it's a mountain that they're gonna have to try to overcome over their careers and. it's that shift of like, you know, instead of just being able to view, people that are out there with regards, again, going back to habits and behaviors, it's like, there's more to finances than just, Hey, I've, got someone that I'm investing some money with. 

And then I talked to all the time. It's, you know, am I actually doing more for myself? That's putting me in a spot to where I'm getting more control, having a lot more flexibility of, and this, the information that's out there. I think it's making it a lot harder for people to still make that choice, but, you know, by us plugging ourselves more into the mix of it all, I think people are finding a a place to kind of go to to be able to talk more about these things. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, and on that information, I think we are in a time where there's tons of information, but it doesn't mean that it. Aligns with your personal [00:19:00] goals, you know, as you were saying, CJ, it's really important to know what, success means to you and what you want in life to be able to build towards that. 

It's very concerning for, for me to hear that people haven't thought about that or know, and maybe it shouldn't be too concerning, but all the more reason to be able to sit down with someone and talk that out. And. Understand how to individually prepare for that, because the people that have a million dollars worth of student debt, maybe it's slightly different in the way they need to approach finances than somebody who's coming out with very little debt or something like that. 

And so when it comes to individuals. And trying to figure out what is best, this is also why I encourage people to find financial advisors very early on. , some of these financial things do impact people's decisions on where they go to school, what job they get, what specialty, like if they [00:20:00] go into a specialty, like it can really impact them because finances can feel like a very heavy burden. 

So, I mean, yes, I know you guys are biased, but, but what are your thoughts about, getting that support as you do, you mentioned the importance of working with somebody, the right person, right, to help you with that and to help make these career goals and decisions. 

Chris Burnett: Well, let me just say that a lot of the things 

that we work with people on the day that they graduate from vet school are oftentimes not available to people who are in vet school. So I think probably within that last year of vet school, that's when you start thinking, that's when it's probably time to start thinking about starting meeting with advisors. 

It's that last year before that, it's really the, the financial principles are the same and they're pretty consistent, right? , protect yourself with the proper insurance. Right. And these are all things that I think we, I'm sure our podcast probably has enough stuff where if, if vet students just listen to our podcast, they're going to get enough from those things to know exactly how to do it. 

I [00:21:00] don't even think they need to necessarily have an advisor per se, , before, before that last year of vet school. But, good general financial principles of budgeting, making sure you don't spend a ton of money while you're in school. So that way you reduce the amount of student loans that you're gonna have whenever you get out of school. 

Those are all great things to, to focus on, specialties, all that kind of stuff. That is definitely more of a. Uh, a conversation to have about, especially when it comes to potential, um, a lot of that data is available for people to find generically, but generally, I would say for new grads and I think new grads in particular starting the savings habit now. 

Right. Starting, starting to recognize that tracking your money is, is a necessity and you won't have to track your money after a few years after graduation, when you're making enough income to be able to pay your bills and save, but I think at first working with an advisor is really going to be something you're going to look at probably that last year. 

, and then into the time that [00:22:00] you go to start accepting your first contract, because That financial advisor should also be helping you navigate through understanding what's being offered from the contracts that you're actually given 

Tom Seeko: Well, it's something that comes to mind as, CJ is talking about this, because there's a level of like, not knowing that a lot of. People who are coming out of school going into a career. I think it's it's not even just in veterinary medicine. It's just across the board and there's this level of like, you know, trying to find an advisor while you're in school while you're also trying to keep your head above water. 

you know, you're learning, taking tests, third year, going into, you know, clinics and fourth year, you might be going on rotations, whatever the case is, it's like, there's a lot of demands that are being put on you and, you know, finding someone towards the latter part, of course, with contract negotiation, making sure you're making a good. 

Moves from, what kind of income you're going to be taking, maybe set things up properly, choosing group benefits that are right for you. Those are all great things. What I would, it would say , just even having a [00:23:00] general level of curiosity. 

I always like to call it YouTube university, especially when we would speak at the schools. just pull up topics and just research them some, learn about them. be like a sponge. So that way, when you actually go and start having conversations with a professional, I've just I've found that there's a lot of people we've had conversations with. 

They have no experience. They have no understanding about it at all. now we're having a conversation to where they're super hesitant to make any moves because they don't have any baseline knowledge. To even work off of. So like, if they're at least spending some time just trying to get like prime, their brain about what's out there. 

that would probably be what I would encourage even from like the first or the third year, because it's just, at least you're coming and stepping into the real world, like I already, I've heard about this and , I have some ideas around this. So then when it's being brought up, it doesn't feel foreign to you. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. And I'm sure a lot of those principles, not only will they be helpful in personal finances, but veterinary medicine has a business component. And so those money concepts also can [00:24:00] apply to a business situation, which I know is still intimidating to some, but. They're applicable, and I think that can actually help across the board, and I know you, you're personal financial advisors, but I'm sure you've probably, I saw some shaking of heads. 

So, so maybe that also makes some sense to on how it can apply very directly to your career as, you know, being part of a business. 

Chris Burnett: I think the money in general and financial statements, financial statements in general, it's just good to know what's a balance sheet, which a cashflow statement, what's an income statement. 

You know, unless you have a C corp, you're not really going to have too much of a difference between a, between the income statement and the cashflow statement. But just knowing that those things exist out there, if, especially if you plan to own a practice or you plan to own multiple practices, starting to get some , familiarity with that I think critical. 

To your success long term doesn't mean you need to know everything coming out of school. It just means that you got to, you know, some baseline idea of what a balance sheet is and what an income [00:25:00] statement is would help. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, absolutely. And then also we've talked a lot about maybe more veterinarians, but also on the vet tech side, , I mentioned the Merck study and when they separated the vets and then the veterinary technicians for veterinary technicians, definitely. finances was even more so a strain on mental wellbeing, and they also even looked at credit card debt and the amount of credit card debt that was for, veterinary technicians. 

again, back to the knowing some of the, the saving and the other behaviors that are helpful, hopefully it could be really helpful to the entire veterinary team. Anything that you've experienced, around like veterinary technicians or, you know, how to get ahold of your finances, no matter what your position is in the veterinary hospital. 

Chris Burnett: Yeah. So I think sadly people really have to recognize, so there's, there's two parts of the equation. The first one is our lifestyle. The second one is our income. [00:26:00] And some people say, you need to spend, , within your means. Like I've, I've heard a lot of. Especially financial entertainers say, you know, living within your means. 

, and that phrase is to me kind of condescending because like sometimes we don't have the option to replace tires, I mean, uh, so I think for vet techs, especially kind of looking at the first part of the equation of their lifestyle, like is the credit card debt. Out of control because of lifestyle or the other part of that equation is, are you not making enough? 

And if we're not making enough, unfortunately, a lot of the market forces dictate what our income is. And so if you need to make more income, then you've got to start figuring out ways. How, how do I make more income? How am I going to make myself more valuable to the vet clinic? So that I can ask for more income, right? 

What kind of other things can I do outside of what is traditionally within my role in the business to make myself more valuable? Sometimes it's as easy as asking the owner, Hey, I'd really love a raise. What do I have to do in order to get a raise? What do I have to do in order to get 20 percent more income? 

[00:27:00] Like given absolute crazy number out there, because you're not asking for a raise. You're asking for what Would need to qualify for a raise. And now that owner can actually sit back. They're probably not going to have any answer for you immediately, but they can sit back and go, huh. Um, I don't know, like, give me some time and more than likely an employer that you're working with should be able to come up with some ideas or have some creative things to make your services more valuable, because at the end of the day, that's what. 

We're doing the, the market decides us how valuable our services are. And so as a vet tech, like how do I make myself more valuable to practice to be able to increase revenue or, or decrease the cost of the practice? Or in other words, how am I going to add to that profitability of that practice to ensure that that practice continues serving the community that it's trying to serve? 

Because if, if, if we're not profitable. We don't last long, right? That's that's any business. So we have to be profitable and we have to recognize that our, [00:28:00] our own individual piece within that organization to serve, to make that organization profitable and sustainable over time so that the community can continue to be served is critical in order to get a pay raise. 

Megan Sprinkle: Very good tip for anybody in any business is if you want to raise is approach it from that perspective is learn what the business needs to be more profitable, because if they make more money, then they can pay you more money. So it makes complete sense. 

Chris Burnett: One last comment. Sometimes if, if you have a, uh, an employer that can tie what you're doing directly to that revenue, then it gives you even better incentive because now you're able to really drive that line and then you're able to make more money. I mean, a lot of people think commission sales, like I've heard a lot of vets, they recoil from even commission sales. 

Now I'm not saying that you're in commission sales. Right. I'm not saying vet tech should go to commission sales, but I'm saying it's like, like, think of the same concept of, you know, what do you have to do in order to make, more income and become more, 

more, more valuable. 

Megan Sprinkle: Tom, any thoughts? [00:29:00] I believe 

Tom Seeko: expenses are real. I will say in the, in the recent economy, things are getting expensive. I mean, I go to the grocery store and things. Are more than they used to, they used to cost in the past. And, I will say that being in this business for, you know, over a decade there, sometimes people have, there's that, again, it's coming back to that mindset to where the way people are approaching things, like, you know, what, there's dollar and cents of like, if rent is X and my car payment is Y and I'm living is, as practical as possible with based off of the circumstances, I'm not driving around in a brand new BMW and, you know, I'm actually living a life that's, you know, pretty conservative in a certain degree. 

and you're struggling, then I think a lot of the stuff that, you know, CJ is definitely referencing here, like all of us want to have, you know, decent lifestyles and want to be able to live and and do the things that we would like to do. I mean, even going out to dinner or enjoying some of those, those [00:30:00] opportunities, I've seen on the flip side here from conversations I've had just with other consultants and people in the industry where, you know, there are places where it's just the way people view their money instead of being using it in a way to where they're using it meaningfully. 

they show up every day with a new Starbucks in hand and it's like, you know, you have the ability to either save money or go put a new tattoo on. It's like the choices that people are making. I think it's just the decisions. And going like something that CJ and I were talking about earlier, it was so funny about 401ks. 

It was a conversation just around, like, you know, I have a 401k somewhere. and I move jobs and then I go to transfer it into, why don't I ever transfer it in another place? Um, and I just leave it where it's at. It's because it just has like no, immediate impact to my current situation. And a lot of the times people are living in a position where it's just like, I'd rather enjoy and have the instant gratification now versus trying to plan for other things that maybe are important. 

And worry about them later. there's two [00:31:00] sizes and I, I mean, I've seen people, it's incredible, like they're the same more money, more problems, like you can make more money and you spend more money and still be broke. And then there's people who don't make as much money, but they're just, they're able to strike a really good balance. 

And I remember reading some stories that like people were in like the postal service making, like. 40,000 a year or whatever it was. And that had, when they passed away, they had like $6 million that they transferred over to their family. And I'm like, how'd they do that? And of course, the costs were slightly different during that time period. 

But of course, things are rising veterinary salaries. I mean, just even put a note on that. I mean, I've seen them rise 10, 20, maybe like 40 or 50% from what they were. Five years ago. So it was like, I think technicians are going to rise as well with, with the mix of all of this, but there still is like that, that balance in society of how much things cost versus what people are making . 

Chris Burnett: It's funny to me because our, probably our most wealthy client, Tens of millions of dollars of net worth. He drives a 14 year old [00:32:00] Tahoe and like never has paid for coffee in his life. and I think that there's something to be said. I remember something on Instagram where it was like, it's like, you know, in order to get strong, you have to do the things that make you feel weak. 

In other words, right. If you want to get stronger, you got to go to the gym and break muscle tissue down, which then makes you feel weak, right? If you want to get rich, you have to feel poor. Right. In the process. So it's, it's like anytime you have a goal you're trying to do, you recognize like there will be an uncomfortable feeling during that, that interim time period in which you're trying to get wealthy or you're trying, right? 

So managing income is pretty important. And sometimes people have a lifestyle addiction that, that removes their ability to. To actually accomplish the things like what Tom is saying, what are the priorities of the person? Where is that stacking up? Especially when it comes to money. 

Megan Sprinkle: it's a lot more than just what you make on the income side. 

Because if you look at a lot of athletes, they make tons of money, [00:33:00] but they don't really have good money sense, so they spend it all and then they have nothing left 

Chris Burnett: we've, we've had multiple NFL players, even as clients that, you know, some of them, they create good money habits. 

Some of them don't, most of them don't, but I think money habits is secondary to the priorities in which what they're going after, right? Like, are they trying to distract themselves from the life that they really want, or are there things in their life that, that take them away? From really being able to, like what I was saying way earlier in the podcast of culture, right? 

Taking us away from having space in our minds and in our life long enough for us to reflect on what we truly want and want to enjoy life. And if we can't, if we keep distracting ourselves, , those money decisions are secondary, right? Cause there's something else that I'm trying to fill with the money that I'm getting, right? 

Getting Starbucks every day. If that's something you can't afford, then do it. So , I think it's just kind of important to recognize that there is, there is two parts of that equation [00:34:00] looking at your income and making sure that you are getting paid. 

the right amount, but then also recognizing that maybe perhaps reevaluating what your, your lifestyle costs you and where money's going. 

Megan Sprinkle: back to the whole, how do I make career decisions too, I recommend people sit down, take the time to understand. Who you are as a person. 

What do you really want in your career? I've had people who left big C suite jobs to go be entrepreneurs. You know, they left the C suite paycheck because they needed something different in their life. And that corresponded with their career trajectory . 

Chris Burnett: The cost benefit analysis too, , because sometimes the cost benefit is not purely financial. 

So, , it's like what you're saying, what's your personality? What is this really going to be something you want? I think is, is critical to investigate. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, the finances is, it's a tool, understanding the other part of things, your life, what you want, , that's the primary part, the finances part just help [00:35:00] you fuel that, so yeah, if Starbucks is that is your one thing that you need to just have a wonderful day and make it through, and you can afford it, by all means, go for it. 

 And then the only other thing I want to, and not to stir the pot, but I, I, I just have to laugh because this came up when you were, you guys were talking is also, cause we talked about, you know, the people that we surround ourselves with. 

When you get married, it's also important to understand that other persons, idea of success and what they want in life, preferably having those conversations as soon as possible, like before marriage would, you know, just my little marriage tip there. but that, that's also a big factor into it because like your spouse's goal, like maybe that's a lot more important to you than your Starbucks or, you know, like that, that sounds like very trifle, but that's the other thing too, is we, are not usually doing life alone, which is good. 

I think that's, [00:36:00] you know, enhances life, but they also have, ideas and feelings around these things too. So I think that's also, just something to slide in there as well, because that can really make life miserable or fun. 

Chris Burnett: Absolutely. Well, I I know that the statistic out there is that more than 50 percent of marriages end in divorce and like, what is it? 

90, something like 70 to 90%, depending on who you're, who you're listening to say that it's over money problems. 

Tom Seeko: Yeah. Yep. 

Chris Burnett: But I would actually peel it back and say underneath that it's less money problems and probably more value disparities, right? What do you value in? And I love how you're saying, have that conversation before you're married because the money conversation will always lead to what are you valuing? 

What's important to you? I'll be married for 17 years here in a few days. And I mean, looking at 17 years and all of the things that go in between there. Really recognizing how do we get money, money married. We actually have whole series around how to get financially married, [00:37:00] webinars and podcasts and things like that. 

And I love even like you mentioning that because it's, it is pretty critical to become one. And now you have one shared financial pocketbook, if you will. And I know John Gottman. I think he's a really good resource. I mean, he is like, I talk about all things conflict because in the conflict is the opportunity for connection. 

And I think if we can keep that to be our main thing, especially in a marriage, life goes a whole lot easier. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, for people who don't know the Gottmans, they're kind of like the gurus on, on marriage . So yeah, they're definitely a good one to follow. They're also very fun and humorous. 

So they are. Yeah, I know. Yeah. 

Chris Burnett: I, they, I find them very entertaining as well. Yeah. 

Megan Sprinkle: Tom, any other thoughts? 

Tom Seeko: I, I know the, the thought of the divorce side of it, when CJ was saying her separation is yeah. , money stuff tends to be a big part of it. 

Megan Sprinkle: And I think this is a great kind of place to come back to because , The finances is, the [00:38:00] tool the thing that helps the, the big thing to really understand and CJ, you even started with this is, is understanding your values and then getting the people to help you make those a reality. 

And that includes the financial team as well. for people who really worry about money is. let's step back a little bit. what is the most important thing? Be able to put some words with that. And it's okay if that takes time because I do understand that you don't necessarily have to go into the financial advisor and have your entire life planned out on how you want it to look like things happen in life. 

You know, I think that actually could be a bad idea if you have the whole thing planned out. But, understanding the fundamental values of what you're looking for, I think is really helpful. And it sounds like it's also helpful to the financial team as well. I 

Chris Burnett: think, I think as long as people realize too, that a good plan has a plan when nothing goes according to plan, 

you can 

plan to your heart's content, but don't spend forever doing it because at some point you got to take action. 

And at some point you might be overanalyzing. I know I, myself, I have to [00:39:00] constantly check myself on overanalyzing. Right? Like, am I going a little too far with this or can I just like, what are, let me narrow down the one or two things that I can control because the vast majority of the things that we worry about, we can't even control. 

And so it's wasted energy expenditure on things that we're never going to be able to change. 

Megan Sprinkle: Exactly. I also do not want to forget to mention your book Unleashed, which is brand new and we've talked about, finding resources and this one is going to be more targeted as well because it is designed for the veterinary professional. 

So what would you like to share a little bit about why you decided to write it and some of the key takes away is that would encourage people to read it. 

Chris Burnett: There were so many times that we'd speak at conferences and do presentations and talk with clients and everyone would always ask, Hey, do you have any books about this stuff? 

And Tom and I would always look at each other like kind of. but so we were like, you know what? Why don't we just write a book? Like, why don't we put all of the [00:40:00] things that people ask us into a book? And a lot of it's compiled from a lot of information from our podcast. Um, and that, that was kind of the genesis of, getting a book that we could write because then now every time asks us, Hey, what else can I be reading outside of our meetings in between our meetings? 

While they're looking at whether or not they want to sign on with us, like , what else you got? And so , that's probably one of the biggest reasons why we start, why we actually wrote that book. 

Tom Seeko: Yeah, the book, what is Unleash the Financial Clarity Every Veterinarian Needs. 

And, yeah, it's, a lot of it, again, goes back to, we wanted to provide a different way of thinking that people can, you know, people love consuming things in audio, some people love watching videos. There are some people that love nerding out of our books is actually a paper copy and a kindle. 

So if you want the paper or if you want to read on a device, you can. And, we just, we want to provide people with a different way to view finances instead of the traditional way that people usually look at it from a, Put money in 401k, buy insurance, you know, call it a day [00:41:00] type of thing. And, really diving into those habits and the behaviors and that psychology behind, money. 

And it's, I think it came out really well from all the preparation that we put into. And I hope a lot of other people that do grab a copy of it, really enjoy it. 

Megan Sprinkle: I can't remember who mentioned it, but talking about how the veterinary professionals are learners and eager for more information that we are. 

So the more resources that are easier to understand are a little bit more targeted. Like we say, you know, not every, Resource is exactly what you might be looking for your current situation. So I think that's really helpful as well. So any last tip that you have that you feel like we should definitely talk about before leaving today? 

Tom Seeko: My final thought that I have for people is just if you're not currently doing anything in your finances, or if you've been thinking about it, or, you sort of feel like you're good with what's happening right now, , get comfortable being uncomfortable. And just jump [00:42:00] into start trying to learn more, talk with people, because the last thing you want to do is let so much time go by. 

And then you realize, oh, shoot, I should have done this or an event happens. And you're like, wow, I wish I had planned better for that. Because we, we hear that so much with people and, you know, talking about finance is a taboo subject. Uh, and I feel like this is something that doesn't go away. So, the more you talk about it, the more comfortable you get with it, the more you'll feel like you can have interactions with people. 

And I, I mean, just even to speak on my own behalf here, I remember getting into the financial business. we call it, mental trash where we tell ourselves things that cause us to just interact and do things in like, you know, CJ and I, we'd have like, lack confidence to talk to people about stuff. 

We're trying to help them with their finances and then we don't want to talk to them about certain topics. And then it's like, the more we talk about it, it's like, there's a level of confidence that you start building and a more understanding that you start having to it. And, there are people we meet that are, you know, in, in their fifties and sixties. 

And they've never [00:43:00] really, Address their finances before. And they've just kind of skirted through life. And then a lot of people are up to a rude awakening. So, yeah, I think just , getting comfortable, being uncomfortable is how I would leave that. 

Chris Burnett: there's proof in that finances can sit are oftentimes considered taboo, because if you're listening to this, just ask yourself, do you know your parents income? 

A lot of people never would know their parents don't tell them anything, but their parents told them everything about a lot of other things growing up. Right. There were, there were almost, there are some parents that I know , we've had clients where they're like, yeah, my parents talk to me about everything in the world. 

But the one thing we couldn't talk about was money. And so recognizing that since it is taboo, it's probably something that you want to talk to a lot of people about. It's like they say, whenever you go to a party, you don't want to talk about politics and religion. Right. I get that. But the funny thing is no one talks about money either. 

And so the more comfortable you get talking about money, and even though it feels like a different language, remember that if you want to [00:44:00] learn another language, the best way to learn it is through submersion. So submerse yourself, get comfortable being uncomfortable. Like Tom saying, just start with one little thing and maybe 10 minutes a week, just spend some time learning, listen to a podcast like this one. 

 Listen to a podcast like ours, read a book, do, do the things , that you otherwise wouldn't have normally done because the goal is to live a regret free life. So you don't get to your deathbed or even the day before you retire and realize, wow, um, I'm going to have to work for another 10 more years. 

Because I don't have enough money to retire 

Megan Sprinkle: such great points on the cultural aspect of things as well. So maybe an idea for a topic, a future topic for you guys is how to talk about money with kids. Cause I think that has been a trend for a while. Like, I don't, I don't think that's overly different. 

 I don't remember my parents really talking much about money, which is actually my, my dad always thought it was funny. Cause I was [00:45:00] so nervous about money and nobody in the family was like they spent with no problem. And he's like, where did you get that? And I don't know because they didn't really talk about money. 

So I don't know. so it would be interesting to know like some ways, cause I think both of you mentioned starting with something financial Even in your teens. So it would be interesting to have , your thoughts on some good ways to have conversations around money with kids to set up like a better mindset and culture. 

So that one's for yours though. 

Chris Burnett: Thank you. Yeah. We, that's probably going to be our next podcast. 

Megan Sprinkle: Well, awesome. And I always love ending the podcast, talking about gratitude. So you mentioned, you know, not having regrets. So I think it's great way to end is talking about things we're really grateful for in life. 

So for both of you, what is something that you are really grateful for right now? 

Tom Seeko: I'm, I would say that I'm, I'm grateful that I'm in the position that I can help, people within the veterinary community. And I'm, grateful that I had actually, [00:46:00] met CJ for us to be able to, do what we do. 

Chris Burnett: It's fine. 

I think right now, just because my 17th anniversary is coming up, I'm insanely grateful for a marriage and a partner that is, um, she's solid. Not everyone, I've got a lot of friends even right now that, I say a lot, I think I have three friends right now that are in the middle of really bad divorces. 

And so, you know, just kind of know I'm, I'm really grateful for, for that. 

Megan Sprinkle: I hope you enjoyed this fascinating veterinary story. We can make an impact in so many places. Check out the show notes for lots of resources. Please make sure you are subscribed on your podcast app, subscribe on the YouTube channel and follow me on LinkedIn, where I hang out the most. You can contact me on LinkedIn, on the website at vetlifereimagined. 

com. And brand new is that you can text me to send me a text message. Find the link at the top of the show notes below that says, send us a text message. I want to thank our longtime sponsors, fire consulting, and we'll use who support the podcast over on our [00:47:00] hosting platform. Buzzsprout. You can support the podcast to just check out the show notes for a link. 

And I hope to see you next time on that life reimagined.