Stop Acting Like a Girl: Lessons in Leadership from Dr. Stacee Santi

Today's guest on Vet Life Reimagined is veterinarian, entrepreneur, and author Dr. Stacee Santi, who shares lessons from her journey—from founding Vet2Pet to writing Stop Acting Like a Girl. She opens up about leadership, courage, and fighting for your future self when others can’t see your vision. 

Resources:

• Video version on YouTube
• Links to Dr. Santi’s book Stop Acting Like a Girl and her other projects are in the show notes.
• Follow Dr. Santi's writing in Today's Veterinary Business

👉 Follow the podcast, leave a review, and share this episode with someone who could use a reminder that courage and possibility go hand in hand.

Transcript

Stacee Santi: [00:00:00] I wanted to take a bet on myself, but I was also really scared to give up something very secure. I thought about that and then I thought about what is the best thing that could happen? I mean, what if this idea scaled what would that look like? It was so exciting to me to think that there was a chance that something could happen.

Megan Sprinkle: What if the person standing between you and your biggest dream is you? Welcome to Vet Life Reimagined. Today our guest is a veterinarian, entrepreneur, angel investor, author and founder of Vet to Pet. Dr. Stacee Santi. Stacee's story is one of courage, creativity, and breaking the mold of what's supposed to be possible. From a small town girl who wanted to save her puppies from a lethal disease that had yet to be discovered to general practice veterinarian to tech founder who transformed how practices connect with clients.

Stacee learned what can happen when [00:01:00] you stop letting others define your limits. In this conversation, she opens up about the emotional lessons of entrepreneurship, what it means to stop acting like a girl, and how women in veterinary medicine can lead boldly without losing who they are. If you've ever questioned whether you're capable of something more or needed that reminder, that courage often starts with a single step into the unknown.

This episode is for you, so let's get to the conversation with Stacee Santi.

 When did you know you were interested in veterinary medicine? 

Stacee Santi: I don't know that I knew it was a career option when I was a little girl, but I mean, obviously my love affair with animals was the first clue.

And , me and my little brother got baby schnauzers, um, gosh, it was 1979, so I was a about eight years old. My little brother was six and my parents bought us these little schnauzers, our first dogs, and they both died, [00:02:00] within like a few months. And they both had bloody vomiting and diarrhea.

And that was before Parvo was a known entity. T he doctor didn't know what was going on, and they both died and, we ended up getting new puppies. I don't know how they didn't die, but they didn't. And, uh, I, I just so desperately wanted to save them, and I saw the doctor working so hard on my puppies and, I thought, wow, I, I would like to try to do that one day.

Yeah. Yeah. It was parvo way back in the seventies when it first came out. Nobody knew what it was. That's crazy. We have come a long way in, I know. 

Megan Sprinkle: A short period of time. 

Stacee Santi: I know when you think about it like that, it seems like we've always known what Parvo was, but uh, yeah, I just loved animals. So I started collecting them, picking up random cats on the way home from school.

I won a duck at the fair and with the little coin toss and uh, my dad was so [00:03:00] good. He let me have any animal I wanted. My mom on the other hand, she didn't think it was such a great idea, but what could she do 

Megan Sprinkle: that was same in my house. , Well, so did you grow up in Texas?

'cause I know you went to Texas Tech when you were an undergrad, but is that where you grew up? 

Stacee Santi: I grew up right adjacent to Texas in New Mexico, about five minutes from the Texas state line in a small town, uh, Clovis, New Mexico. And my whole family's from there. I was born and raised there, and, , I don't know you, the normal thing was to just go to college and if you, you could either go to a and m or UNM or Texas Tech, and that was about 90 minutes from my house, so I just went to that one.

And, um. Yeah, it was great. They had a mall and they had trees. I mean, these are all new things for me. So 

Megan Sprinkle: you just don't appreciate like what's around you until you go somewhere so different, even in our own country. It is funny. [00:04:00] Um, so was it in college where you started to realize that veterinary medicine was a career?

Or how did it start to kind of come together? No, 

Stacee Santi: I mean, I, I was, uh, one of those people, I think you could say blessed in knowing what I wanted to do. I mean, I was on a trajectory. I, that was the only option for me to be a veterinarian. So I went to tech. I got in, I applied. At that time, you could apply after so many credit hours.

So I made my application at the beginning of my third year and I got in to CSU, with three years of undergrad. And then I went on to CSU, but I was kind of freaking out at one point, 'cause I thought it didn't ever really cross my mind, what if this doesn't work out? And I just fulfilled all the credits to go to vet school.

And then I'm scrambling thinking, oh crap, if I don't get in, what am I gonna do? I gotta scramble to get a degree in this fourth year. And the things that were available to me [00:05:00] were like feedlot manager and some sort of weird ag thing. And so I just crossed my fingers and it worked out okay that I got in.

'cause I didn't have a backup plan at all. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. Did you apply to multiple schools? What, what was it about Colorado? 

Stacee Santi: No, I, well, there was a western interstate, collegiate, higher education witchy, it's called, I think it's still around, and residents of New Mexico. You could trade out students from Colorado State for pharmacy students and pay in state tuition.

So I put all my eggs in that basket as a plus. It costs money to apply. I didn't have all this money sitting around to even send in my application, so I sent it to CSU and that was just always where I wanted to go. And I don't know how that worked out, but , I realize now how lucky I was that worked out.

But I got in when I was 21 and I [00:06:00] graduated when I was 25 with A DVM. And, Got my first job at a ER practice in Portland, Oregon. And I would say clinically I was right there with everybody else. Not knowing what you're doing, but emotionally and like just being a grownup. I was still a baby. I mean, I was 25.

I didn't, I don't know. It was, it was hard at first for sure. 

Megan Sprinkle: Do you mind saying more like what, what part was the hard part emotionally? 

Stacee Santi: Well, I think the hard part was, one of the biggest parts was I grew up in the small town and I never lived in a city and I, now I'm living in Portland downtown, like in, in a ER setting, dealing with all kinds of the general public.

And I, it was there that I learned people lie to you. I, I had never really been around people that just boldfaced lied and said things like. They could pay the bill when they [00:07:00] couldn't. , I, in fact, I got called into my boss's office about, I don't know, six months after I was hired, and he's like, listen, we got a problem.

You have a huge accounts receivable going here with these clients. And I'm like, let me see. You know, and he gives me their names. I'm like, oh no. He was getting some money from his mom and he was waiting for his tax return and he had a lottery ticket. I literally said this, he has a lottery ticket that is coming in soon.

And I realized at this moment that these people were just lying to me. And it was a pretty hard, I, I didn't know that happened. I was really seriously from a small town and people just did what they said they were gonna do. And I still like to believe that in most people. But, you know, and that's where people started saying things like, you're just in this for the money and I'm.

Wait a minute. What are you talking about? I, I have no idea really what you're talking about. I, [00:08:00] me in this for money. You gotta be kidding. I just kind of always set the attitude with it. Like, I didn't try to get defensive. I was always shocked that you would say such a thing. 

Megan Sprinkle: You should have been like, you should see my accounts receivable.

Stacee Santi: I know the first time I asked for deposit, like the full deposit after I gotten in trouble with the boss, this guy's like, you just care about the money. I'm like, oh no. Actually I don't. I was just in the boss's office last week, was getting in big trouble. 'cause I don't care about the money. 

Megan Sprinkle: It sounds like you, you know, you're realizing things about the world, which, you know, most people do probably just in this setting. But I mean, what did you decide to do kind of as your next step? 

Stacee Santi: I love the ER so much. I mean, it was like my own private residency and um, it was about 13 doctors and most of us had less than five years under our belt.

So it was really kind of fun looking back. We got to do some crazy things: crazy surgeries, [00:09:00] like, torn renal arteries and colectomies just 'cause we didn't know better. We, me and my girlfriend, she's a vet too. We were just talking recently, like we just figured if it was in the book, we were supposed to be able to do it and we didn't realize we were doing kind of advanced procedures, you know, but it was trial by fire.

We had a good run, but I wanted to be closer to home. And I ended up getting married to, uh, one of my clients actually, and we moved to Durango, Colorado, which is closer to New Mexico. And I could be pretty close to my parents at that point. And, yeah, started a job here at a kind of your more traditional AAHA type, four doctor practice.

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. Well, I'm sure you still had cases of where people didn't fully tell the truth. Mm-hmm. But maybe it was a little bit more of a, a culture that you were used to. 

Stacee Santi: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I got good, you know, I had to develop my skills [00:10:00] in reading people and talking to people and trying to understand how much can you pay and what are your goals for your pet, and how can I help you do better here?

Like, what are we gonna do together for your pet? I started getting pretty good at that kind of communication because if you wanna help the animal, you gotta go through the human. 

Megan Sprinkle: Mm-hmm. Yep. Everybody's involved, mm-hmm. So, I, I remember in our previous conversation, you, you talked about that you loved being a veterinarian.

Sorry, you love being a veterinarian. I didn't mean to make that in the past tense. Mm-hmm. So, as you're in general practice, which you were in general practice for a while, what was it that you just started to really love about it being a veterinarian in practice? 

Stacee Santi: You know, I definitely, the sweet animals for sure, but a couple of things.

I do very much love the adrenaline high you get of saving an animal or doing something really [00:11:00] like you were able to make a difference and maybe you made this pet live or you made them feel better. I get such a high off of that and I, I mean, I've never done drugs, but I would imagine it must be similar of walking out of the OR on a GDV and just feeling like, wow, I, I did something with my brain and my hands and I don't know, I've always loved that part.

And then I really started loving the clients. I, not all of them for sure, but a lot of people, were really good to me. And in fact. I was recently, online, I think I was in the moms with the DVM group, and , there was a veterinarian saying something about how this client was railing on her because she was going through something traumatic, I think something serious with her kid, and maybe she wasn't fully present at work.

And they wrote some scathing review. Like, if you can't fully be here, maybe you shouldn't be [00:12:00] here. And this veterinarian was really upset because, you know, she's doing her best to hold her life together. And it made me think about when I got divorced and I was here in Durango and I was a hot mess, man.

Like I was really on the edge and, uh. In fact, a lot of the clients thought maybe I had cancer 'cause I'd lost so much weight. And I caught one of the receptionists telling the clients once, no, she's got a parasite and she's undergoing an extensive deworming process, which was a pretty accurate description of the marriage.

Um, but uh, I had so many clients that took care of me during that time. You know, one lady, she brought me red fingernail polish and she goes, just paint your nails red and paint the town red and get rid of this guy and you're gonna be all right. And I still have a, a lot of clients that I think of fondly that cared about me [00:13:00] personally.

So I, I really do enjoy those relationships. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. 

. Well, and then you, I, I don't know if this is innate in you, but you're also really good at, at observing and, and kind of challenging of, well, how can we make this happen? What can we do better? And that's kind of the start of how you ended up creating an entire business.

Mm-hmm. So do you mind sharing the, the start of what you were seeing as a gap with, you know, just talking to clients and, and seeing that they, they needed some help in doing very basic things that could be huge, going back to your puppy, right? Like, you know, remembering to, to do these kind of preventative, processes.

Stacee Santi: Mm-hmm. So, yeah, it was, I think it was around 2010. I was just super frustrated during this one afternoon of appointments because I was telling people it's time to get your summer of heartworm prevention. You know, here in Colorado, right or wrong, we recommend April to October [00:14:00] is the key months that you get.

And just so happens, that's a six pack of heart guard at the time. So I'm like, you gotta get your heartworm prevention. Oh, Dr. Stacy, I still have some from last year. I'm like, what? You're supposed to give it all? And so I told my office manager, Karen. I'm like, Karen, I would like you to send an email.

Can't you use our system or whatever? I didn't really know how it worked, but use our system to email our clients that are dog owners on the first of every month and tell 'em to give their heartworm prevention. She's like, not possible. If they wanna set up a reminder, they can log into their pet portal and set it up themselves.

I'm like, do you even know how to log into your pet portal? I personally do not even know my pet portal. So I'm like, why does it have to be so hard? Why can't you just send an email? And she goes, it's just not possible. And I thought that was absurd. I really was troubled by this. [00:15:00] And at the same time, I'm getting the beginning of these push notifications.

You know, this started around 2010 and I'm in between rooms and a Domino's push push notification comes up telling me there's like two for one pepperoni pizza tonight. And I'm thinking, oh, maybe I should get that after work. And then it dawned on me like. Wow. That message just made me think of something, changed my thinking behavior.

Why can't I send a push notification to my clients to give their heartworm pill? Like, how hard would it be? So that started the journey and I just started Googling and that led to one thing, which led to another. And I, you know, again, like I didn't know not to, I didn't know it was a possible, so I just kept trying till I realized this wasn't happening in the profession and I needed an app to do it.

And so I started working on that. 

Megan Sprinkle: . So did you just Google like app maker or creator or, yeah, [00:16:00] 

Stacee Santi: I googled how to get an app for my business and it led me to this company. It was called Mobile App Loader is just a random online company.

Another point in my life where, I got so lucky and I found this guy. H e built apps for like hairdressers and automotive dealerships and realtors. And I said, can you build it for a vet hospital? Change some of the words. He's like, yeah, I don't see why not. So I started working with him and he helped me get a app for my practice in the app store.

It was branded for my practice. I could tell my clients, go and download the Riverview Animal Hospital app. I think at that time, literally there were maybe five to 10 animal related apps in the app store at all. This was the first one I had seen for your own practice, and my clients could download it and once they had it downloaded, they could do things like, Call us, find us on the [00:17:00] map, receive the push notifications, request an appointment. Those were kind of the limits of it at that point. But I could send a push notification and oh my gosh, I started doing a kind of regularly, I, oh, there was a plague outbreak here in Durango. You know, us in South Africa, we have the bubonic plague here.

So, give your flea medicine and oh, there's a pet food recall, and, oh, we have a cancellation this afternoon if anyone needs to get in. And people loved it. And so I just started adding features. I started looking around my clinic and saying, what other stupid work things are we doing that technology can maybe do for us.

And the next one we went after was the, medication refills, because that was a big bottleneck for us. People would call or walk in at the most inopportune times, usually lunch and end the day, and need us to go count all their [00:18:00] 180 thyroid pills. So I said, you know what, I'm gonna put it in the app. They could make a request through the app.

And I made this whole program, if you use our app to request your meds and you give us, you know, 48 hours, we'll give you $5 off your prescription. And I raised my prescription, a handling fee, a dollar across the board to offset that. And it started working. The phone would ring less, the people would start being retrained because they were getting a perk too. It turns out it is easier for them as well. And that was kind of where it took off. And then I, I started telling other people, veterinary colleagues, what I was doing and they'd say, can you build a app for me? I'm like, maybe, do you have a logo? I'll try.

That's how it got started. 

Megan Sprinkle: That's really cool. So, I mean, it sounds like the pet parents were really liking this feature and I mean, I [00:19:00] just, I love how innovative you were, , about the different things, like the, um, like we have a cancellation. I, I wish my dentist did that. Like, because sometimes it's really hard to get in and, you know, if you, and that's a great way to keep your schedule full where you want it.

And I mean, this is kind of blowing my mind. I think this is really cool. So, I think you also, you did some other features too that was really intriguing and one was, a loyalty program Yes, too, because we're in a, a pretty competitive area. , And so that, I think is what was really starting to intrigue other people too.

Mm-hmm. Uh, so what was the loyalty program? 

Stacee Santi: Well, I, I had had this experience where I needed my oil changed. So on my one day off of like, you know, I get one day off every eight days or something crazy. I would drive all the way to Jiffy Lube, which I live outside of Durango. So driving to Jiffy Lube is a good, [00:20:00] solid 30 minute drive.

And I'd sat there and waited and had my oil changed, then drove home. And I was noticing my behavior because literally two doors down from my clinic, , is a, a oil change shop. I could have just had him do it while I was at work and I'm like, why am I wasting my precious time on my day off doing this?

Well, it's 'cause I had a punch card. And after you get so many oil changes, you get a, like in maybe four years I was gonna get a free oil change. And I'm like, wow, this really works. And I thought, can I put a loyalty thing like this in the app for my clients? So I worked with that company and they made a little punch card in the app and you just would scan a QR code and it would put the little punches in your app.

So I came up with this thing like every a hundred dollars you spend, you get a punch. And after you get, at that [00:21:00] time, I said 12, only because the iPhone four was the size and it would only hold 12 punches. People thought I was very crafty or, you know, analytical about how I came up with that number.

I'm like, no, it was just the size of the phone. It was all that could hold. And I said, once you get 12 punches, we'll give you a hundred dollars credit. And it went off the rails. I can't even tell you how addicted people became. And that actually is when I decided, you know what? I think I'm onto something. I'm gonna quit my job and I'm gonna go Shark Tank all in on this and see if I can make a go of it.

Because it was a way for me to use positivity to drive more business to my clinic. And it was a, a triple trifecta win, right? Like the patient got seen more. The client was happy, and we were happy making [00:22:00] more money and, you know, staying busy at the clinic. This was also during kind of the recession where clinics were slowing down.

We were blowing up. 

Megan Sprinkle: Well, I mean, , you weren't an owner at this clinic, right? 

Stacee Santi: No, I, I was not a owner. I actually moved here to become the owner and then, um, you know, right. We decided I'd we'd, I'd work here a year for the doctor and then we'd decide if we like each other and then I'd buy the clinic and we got along great.

He is one of my most valued mentors in my life, but at the one year mark, I was getting divorced and NVA came in with a huge offer. And he sold the corporate, which I don't blame him, I get it. But he sold, ended up selling me the land and the building. So it worked out better for me. Another one of those things where you, you know, you have to go Garth Brooks and thank God for unanswered prayers [00:23:00] because it worked out better for me and I became after he left the medical director, the managing veterinarian.

Megan Sprinkle: Wow, okay. So the reason why I was going there is, you know, what did they think when you came to them and said, Hey, I wanna do this app for our, our clinic? 

Stacee Santi: You know, they weren't super excited, to be honest. They didn't really care about it. They thought it was, honestly, I told them at this one big meeting at corporate mothership headquarters.

We should be building apps for all of our practices. And a few of them were of the opinion that smartphones will never become a thing because they're too expensive to have the monthly subscription for data. And I'm like, whatever. We're all sitting at this boardroom and every single one of us has our phone here.

Like it's gonna be bigger than you could even imagine. But I had a really great regional boss and he kind of gave me , a lot of leash to do things. plus I had a [00:24:00] very high performing practice during the recession, and I think sometimes you can be a little crazier if you're performing for them.

If you're underperforming, you probably get called to the office. But I, I was doing well at that time, thankfully. So I got a little bit more room to try things. 

Megan Sprinkle: Well, that's fantastic. And, you got to the point where you're like, I see that this works. There's a need, there's a win-win win.

I am ready to go full in on this. So what was that transition like? 

Stacee Santi: It was kinda scary, you know, and, in the book I wrote, "Stop Acting Like A Girl,". I, a lot of this came from the, I, I wanted to take a bet on myself, but I was also really scared to give up something very secure. I mean, I was making good money.

I had great clients, a comfortable life, and uh, I'm like, what should I do? And I just did a lot of soul searching and I [00:25:00] thought, you know what? I'm not burning bridges. I can always go back. And, oh, I know I take a chance on myself. What's the worst thing that could happen? Okay. I thought about that. I could, maybe we have to sell our house and downgrade.

Maybe I can't, you know, go shopping or go to Starbucks as much. Maybe I could, could I stomach these things? How far could I take it? Before I knew it was time to throw in the towel, I thought about that and then I thought about what is the best thing that could happen? I mean, what if this idea scaled and what could it even, what would that look like?

It was so exciting to me to think that there was a chance that something could happen. So my husband was like, you know, , you seem very excited about this idea, so I'm game if you're game. So we went for it. 

Megan Sprinkle: Now did how many clinics did you have as clients at that [00:26:00] time? 

Stacee Santi: So when I first started, I got, , I also consider this a, a sign of the universe is when I turned on my website for my app company, I really didn't know how to launch a company at all.

So all I did is , another dad on the, uh, soccer, the kids' soccer team, we'd sit in the bleachers and watch the kids play. He designed websites. So I'm like, Hey, I need a website. Can you build me this website for this little app thing so people could know about it? He's like, okay. So he did it and I turned on the website and the next morning I had a customer, can you even believe it?

A guy air drinking animal hospital. This like a Dr. Dave in Canada signed up and I just. Could not have gotten a bigger sign from the universe that I was on the right track. Now, it was months before I got another customer, but I, , just started speaking at little local events for my Zoetis rep and I, every [00:27:00] time I'd speak, I'd get a handful of customers and I just started growing.

I think after the first year I had 12, and then the second year it doubled. And then, I mean, I'm still working at the vet hospital. I didn't decide to fully quit until I had about a hundred customers. And then I quit the vet job a hundred percent and I started building a team. 

Megan Sprinkle: I think it's, you gotta get out there sometimes and, and people have to see what it is and the value that it brings because, you know, at.

I don't know if we love this term, but an influencer in the veterinary industry, Eric Garcia. Mm-hmm. Kinda , pushed out a, plug for you at a conference one time and, and that also seemed to drive a lot of people. Did that happen before or after you had decided to go all in? 

Stacee Santi: Um, I think it was.

When was that? It was in the very early stages. I mean, I saved after two years of savings, I got enough money to go to [00:28:00] my first trade show, right? So I got a booth at Western Veterinary Conference. I thought things are gonna start happening now, right when you're new. You get the booth at the very, very back.

And I didn't have enough money to get a professional booth, so I sewed my booth up with my sewing machine and my husband made me a little podium and my girlfriend came with me. And, , we were standing there and , they opened the trade show floor and here come the people we're way back there.

So it takes like 30 minutes for the first person to come. And this guy walks up and he looks at it and he's like, what are you doing? And I'm like, it's an app. Your clients can contact you, you can contact them. And it was so excited. And he's like, this is the dumbest idea I've ever heard. And my girlfriend, total mom moved.

She puts her hand in front, her whole arm in front of me, like when you're stopping the car rapidly. And she sort of pushes me behind her and she tells that guy, move along, please move [00:29:00] along. Off you go.

Well, it was around that time Eric got wind of what I was doing and he was always on the forefront for cutting edge things. And he was working with a practice, his old practice in Florida and I built an app for him, right. He was in the first 10 I ever did. And uh, he loved it and he started telling people.

And Brenda Tassava, she was the same one, another big influencer telling people about little me and I don't know, they really changed things for me. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah, 

Stacee Santi: well that's a 

Megan Sprinkle: message to go all the way in the back of the conferences. Mm-hmm. Um, actually do explore those things 'cause some pretty amazing things are up there and, and, uh, be careful what you say is a, a, a dumb idea.

'cause I'm sure there are a lot of people who are like, kicking themselves that they, they do not see what you saw so well. Very cool. So vet to pet is, is kicked off, you know?, I think it was official around [00:30:00] 2013, but you're in it for a few years. , You're growing, things are going well. Are you thinking that you may one day sell? What, what, what's your future look to this? 

Stacee Santi: Yeah, I'm not good at that sort of thing, really at knowing. I just go with what's fun. So I was having a blast building a team. I had like, I don't know, a dozen engineers working for me in Serbia.

Who turned out to become some of my greatest friends. I was building a team here of veterinary, , managers, technicians, veterinary people to help me on the ground here with the company, with sales and training and implementation, and really enjoying it. Well, , I'm quite naive. I didn't realize you could raise money until later on, on in the way later in the program. I was just using my own money and , my mom and dad had given me a little money, and one of my clients actually had given me some money right when I quit my job to, to afford payroll and stuff. [00:31:00] But at this point, I needed some real money.

Things were heating up. We had Pet Desk on the scene, Vitus Vet, Ally DVM, like things were happening. So I gotta get some real money. So I ended up trying to raise money and during the course of that, Vet Source said, well, we kind of wanna buy your company. And I, I like, couldn't believe it really.

And I thought, okay, well let's go then. And I brokered a pretty robust deal for myself that had to, it was a three year acquisition and, um, yeah, so I ended up. Selling it in 20, it was from 2019 to 2022, which again, like pretty blessed is during the pandemic when things were going to shit, you know, and who knew how it was all gonna go.

But they bought the company and they took it under their wing and then they've tried to take it further with [00:32:00] their home delivery service. But I worked for them for about a year. Was no big shock to any of us that I don't work well for corporate, like big companies. I, I'm a small team girl. So I decided to quit and, retire and.

See what the world had to offer me after that. . 

Megan Sprinkle: Yes, based off of your story, it makes sense that, I mean you even said you kind of follow the fun, and it seems like it's done very well for you. And. So, sometimes there's, there's people along the way that help us out. And, and again, I I wanna talk more about your book.

Like I said, you said you got a pretty good deal from Vet Source. Did you talk to people about how to do that? Because , I'm trying to, I like to put myself in people's shoes sometimes. Like what? I know what to do. Would I like, have the guts to, to like make a bold offer or, I don't, I'm just curious, like, did you get help from lawyers or, or at that [00:33:00] point, had you gained a lot of self-confidence to put forth a pretty good offer for yourself?

Stacee Santi: I mean, I think for me, the major theme of my life is I have no idea what I'm doing half the time, but I have learned that almost everybody is willing to help you if you ask and you find people that know the information you're lacking. I have just had the best luck of finding people that are Oh, sure.

I'll talk with you, or I'll tell you what I know. So some key players for me were, my buddy Martin Traub-Werner, who ended up being my business partner in Vet to Pet, he had started Vet Success and sold that to Vet Source too. He's a brilliant businessman. I had other key advisors like Beth Green at, Brief Media and Dan Holland at Patterson, and just a handful of people that were always so nice to help me think about things.

And, [00:34:00] you know, one day, I write about this in the book, early on at this company I was having breakfast with Martin and he's like, well, what's your number? And I'm like, what are you talking about? And he goes, well, what's your, your number for your life? And I'm like. I've never heard any, like, I have no idea what you're talking about.

Break it down for me. And he's like, well, everyone should have a number of knowing how much money they need to live out the rest of their life in the way they want. I'm like, you're supposed to have this number. I didn't know. So he's like, it's just math. Go home and do your homework. Like you have a company now.

If someone were to buy it, how much would you sell it for? That's your number. And I'm like, well, it's worth nothing. I just started it. He goes, but someday if you play your cards right, maybe you get your number. You should always be having know what your number is. So I went home and I did my homework. I'm like, okay, what kind of life would I live?

Where would I [00:35:00] live? How many vacations a year would I wanna take? I'd wanna pay off my parents' house. I'd wanna help put my nieces and nephew through college. I have a couple of great step boys. I wanna make sure they're covered for. My husband, what would he want? You know, we just did this math and I came up with a number.

This is roughly how much I would need today to get me to the end of the line. And so when they asked me, what would it take to buy your company? I'm like, I guess it would take this amount of money and I have my number. And you know what? Once Martin turned me onto that idea, I can't recommend it enough for everybody, but especially women, to have some idea of how much money you need to get to the end of the line.

Because, it just helps you when you're negotiating, when you're making decisions for your life, you know, how am I gonna get a little bit closer to that number? [00:36:00] And when you're fighting for your future self, it's a little easier I found to ask for big money. I 

Megan Sprinkle: like that. Fighting for your future self.

I, tell people all the time to be thinking about your personal values and all those things so that when things come up, you at least have done that introspective work and you can be able to answer confidently and make, good decisions.

But, uh, from a financial side of, of things too, I think it's a very good principle to have because that way you've done your homework, that you're not like, oh, I don't know, mm-hmm. You, you do know, , I think that's great advice that I really don't hear people talking about in our industry.

Stacee Santi: I know, I don't know if it's a girl thing or just a vet thing, but, . If you think about how old do I wanna be when I retire? How much am I gonna owe on my house? How much will I have in my 401k at that point? You can do all this. It's just math and spreadsheets. [00:37:00] And then you figure out, all right, I got X.

Maybe I got 20 years left before I hit that age. This is how much I need to be making every year. Now, if you're in a job, you're not gonna make that much every year. You gotta figure out, okay, do I need to work on some investments? Do I need to find another job? Do I need to freelance a little bit? you've got to figure out like, do I need to scale back my dream?

But the worst thing is to get to that age of retirement, and now you're just like, well, what do we got to work with here when your earning years are past you? So you like, gosh, if you're in your thirties, you know, thirties, forties, this is the key time to be thinking about that. Well, that was, that would be me.

Megan Sprinkle: So, uh, well, you know, it's, it's good to, again, good to think about that. And you were able to sell your company, , at a time where probably it was before you thought [00:38:00] that maybe you would retire. , That's fantastic. And I know you said you don't, you didn't really forward think more than, more than I guess of retirement.

But what did you do after that? Because I love listening to entrepreneur stories and everything, and I hear a lot of people say that once they sell their business, that they feel very empty. Mm-hmm. Like, they don't really know what to do. So I'm, I'm curious what your experience was. 

Stacee Santi: Yes, I was prepared for that.

It's called Founder's Depression. And there's a lot of stuff written about it. So I had read ahead and I was kind of okay bracing myself. Like, I should be prepared for these feelings. I should be prepared for the urge to jump back into something There's a few things to watch out for on myself that I need to, , be nice to myself about and not put pressure on me to do something.

You know, the first thing you think is like, I'll go back and get my vet job tomorrow, and I'm, I've always worked, I've had a job since I was 14. You know, I've never really [00:39:00] not worked. So I decided, my plan for me was to give myself six months of no decisions. I said, I'm just gonna give myself time to kind of percolate, kind of simmer on the stove a little, kind of see what comes out of this.

You know, people were offering me different jobs and I had, I have like always ideas of, oh, I could make this company or that company. And, um, I decided, okay, I'll write all these things down in my notebook, but I'm not gonna make any decisions for myself for six months. I'm gonna be quiet. I'm just gonna rest here.

I've never, I've actually never done that. I've never just sat and, try to figure out, , what to do with myself. it became quite apparent. I have no hobbies. I have no ability to talk to anybody about anything other than pets or technology. Um. I am not a [00:40:00] well-rounded person. I had lost some friends in the shuffle, just like they were still there, but I hadn't put time into building those friendships or visiting people or calling people good friends.

You know, those relationships had kind of fizzled a bit. So I just started putting some time back into that and figuring out how to relax, how to, not be a type A controller, how to maybe let myself off the hook on, some of my, pressure I put on myself for being some kind of producer. And, um, yeah, I, so after six months, I renewed myself for another six months, and I, so far have renewed myself like six times.

So that's where I'm at. I decided though, because I can't do nothing, . I decided to write the book in the first year called Stop Acting Like a Girl. These were just ideas in my [00:41:00] head that I had been nurturing for years, years, and years of managing women and working with women. And so I, with the encouragement, my mom, I, I decided to try to put these things down on paper.

So that was fun. Currently I'm working, I've got a substack, I just started the other day for cooking. I'm trying to just publish five star recipes for everyday people. Uh, I love creating, even if it's in the kitchen. So, yeah. And I work a lot with the Street Dog Coalition here locally. I found that is enough for my little veterinary heart.

Yeah. You, 

Megan Sprinkle: I mean, you did a lot of things, uh, just knowing you and hearing some of them, . You've been a host on multiple podcasts. Yeah. That ranged everything from veterinary to entrepreneur to beyond. , I know that you've, , started to work with VANE which for those who don't know what that is, that's the Veterinary Angel Network for Entrepreneurs, which is really cool.

I know. [00:42:00] That's a really exciting group of, of individuals who wants to support people that are doing cool things like you mm-hmm. In the animal health space. , And then I Yes, you did say that, , you love being a veterinarian and, at that point, going to a full-time position didn't really feel like that was the right decision either.

Stacee Santi: It's so hard. Yeah. It's so once you get away from day practice. Or ER practice, but even day practice, it is so taxing. I, you know, the irony of the whole thing is I ended up making the bulk of my money on this startup that lasted about 10 years. But I have never worked a lick as hard at that company as I did at being a veterinarian.

Like I worked, and to all the vets out there, I worked just like you. We work our butts off and [00:43:00] it is the most underpaid profession. I think maybe, maybe next to being a teacher, I, I don't know. That looks like a really hard job too, managing all those kids, but, yeah, I, I can't for the life of me figure out why we aren't making as much money as a software engineer.

Mm-hmm. 

Megan Sprinkle: And I bet you've, you've met quite a few of them at this point, so you, you know that world. 

Stacee Santi: I know that world and I mean, it's , a hard job. It is, even being a founder and entrepreneur is nothing compared to being a, a day veterinarian, a regular GP vet. Like it is the hardest job. And, I couldn't go back to it because I actually know how much you have to give of yourself to do it.

And I'm like, okay. I, I can't. I did it for 20 years. And it took me some personal reflection to let myself off the hook to say, I don't have to do it [00:44:00] forever. 

Megan Sprinkle: . And. I'm sure that there were so many different skills that you learned as being a veterinarian that supported you in every other step of the way as being an entrepreneur.

The creative aspect of it, the, hardworking aspect of it. The, you gotta be passionate about it or you, you just can't keep going, kind of part of it. But, 

Stacee Santi: well, and also the, I mean, for me, failing a startup, okay, whatever, no one's gonna die. Like I've had patients die, like from my own actions. I have caused patients to die from mistakes I've made surgically and otherwise.

And the gut wrenching heartache that that brings to you. Is nothing compared to like a startup feeling, whatever. I mean, I can get past that. I've gotten through. What I'm trying to say is I've done harder things. Being a veterinarian is [00:45:00] really, like, that is the hardest thing for me. So I knew what's the worst thing that can happen and oh, it, it closes.

We lose money. Okay, fine. Nobody died. 

Megan Sprinkle: , There is a book we do hard things and, uh, . You have to be careful with that phrase because you don't wanna use it like a flag of, um, you know, martyr is, or martyrdom or whatever the word is, um, being a martyr. , But, you know, speaking about book, let's, let's go back there.

'cause it's, you said you wrote the book pretty soon after you had sold the company. So you've been thinking about these things for a while. Mm-hmm. So do you mind sharing, what was the story? What were some of these things that you had been seeing? Maybe it was yourself, maybe it was another people that started, you know, bringing these thoughts on this topic together.

Stacee Santi: Well, you know, , I was the first class in 96, , at CSU. That was where they [00:46:00] crossed the line, where was more women than men. And so I, , I've been around more women there. I get my first job in Portland, it's like 80% women. I get my next job in Durango, it's like 90% women. I start my tech company.

It's, we're 95 plus percent women. , I've just always worked with women. I don't know, it's just my comfort place, I guess. Not by any resistance to work with men, it's just our field is mostly women. And then when the clinic, sold to NVA and I'm the managing veterinarian, I am suddenly interacting with men on the monthly level with my clinic reviews and I'm traveling to corporate mothership where it's mostly men , in the executive suite roles. And then I start my company, I start raising money now I am like literally the only girl in the room many times at these [00:47:00] meetings in Vegas and at VMX, you know, or trying broker deals. I'm like, where are all the women? Well, there are a few in there.

And I started really paying attention to what they do. Like what are they doing that's different than the other women? Because if you think about just the math of the situation, if we're predominantly, I don't know, how many women do you think, what do you think the percentages are for women in, in the work field for veterinary medicine?

Like 75, 

Megan Sprinkle: 80%? I think we're, I think we're maybe not quite 80 yet, because that's close to what it is in vet school. So I think we're still a little lagging, but yeah, it's in the, the seventies for sure. So don't you think at. 

Stacee Santi: 30 to 50% of the executive roles should be women for our own profession. Like where are the women?

And so I started really, I'm an observer kind of in a weird way, like Seinfeld, and I'm like, , what are these ladies doing that are [00:48:00] different? Well, they are making decisions, they're not being wishy-washy on stuff. They're saying, this is what we're going to do and here's the timeline. , They know their numbers, like they are very well versed on the financials of the company and the industry.

And , they know , their information, they share their opinions. They're not sitting there quietly in the corner letting other people talk over them. They are, , asking for what they want. Like, here's what I want , for my department, or Here's what I am going to be lobbying for this year.

They're just calling it straight up and they're really not apologizing for being there. You know, they're not being meek. They're not being like, oh, I'm sorry I, is this an okay time to talk? They're just holding their head up high and walking in and doing it, and I noticed like that [00:49:00] seems to be , the recipe for success if you want to get up there and the women that are struggling to.

Not so much feel confidence. 'cause confidence is a weird thing. You know, you don't get it till after you've done it. But the, the belief in their self that they can do it, that they are okay to share their opinion, to say what's on their mind, to ask for what they want to ask for the money. Like these are the women that are held back.

Megan Sprinkle: Hmm. Well, and on the flip side, 'cause I know the, the two big things that you said, uh, I would really love to talk about was, was this mentality. And I actually see the second one is being part of it too, is also the ability to say no. Mm-hmm. Because , if you know what you want, like, if you know your number, If you're able to ask what you want. At the same time, you can also be able to confidently say no to things. So did did I completely like bring those together [00:50:00] inappropriately, but I No, you're right. 

Stacee Santi: You're right. Like we are so women in general, I think are so bad at saying no.

And it's because , we're actually exceptional at saying no if we don't feel we're qualified. But if we're qualified to do something, it's almost impossible for us to say no because we know we can technically do it. We know, yes, it's possible I could do that. And we just are so empathetic.

I find to everyone's plight and we also have this, undying need for people to like us. , It seems to be quite different on the male side of the world. Like my brother, he's a, a international business guy, my husband, he's like, they're all like, yeah, whatever. You don't have to like me.

This is what I think. And I'm always trying to be more, in that mindset because, you know, you aren't pizza. Everybody isn't going to like you. And if you've, [00:51:00] if you wanna really get what you want, there are going to have to be some things you say no to. 

Megan Sprinkle: I wanna challenge this justice smidge and, and not necessarily challenge, maybe it's just to kind of bring it to the right level of where people can think about this.

'cause again, I was listening to a podcast, that's how I start a lot of things. Um, and the individual, they were having this conversation about like, where are the women in leadership? And this is not just veterinary medicine, this is in other areas. Everybody world too, right? And, you know, one side, and both of them were men.

I will just say that. So I think that's kind of funny. But, you know, one of them was all women was like, where are the women, women should be leading this country? And, and then we were talking about, , how they can do this. And, and so there is that perspective of well, you know, be more confident.

Like, like the men, right? The, like the men. And what this other person wanted to highlight is what I'm saying is yes, I [00:52:00] do think women need to be In leadership positions because they're women. And some of the unique things about women are really, really important in leadership. Mm-hmm. So it's not a hundred percent copy what man does.

No, 

Stacee Santi: no, no. 

Megan Sprinkle: It, it is, yes. Like, know your worth, get some confidence. Yes. At the same time we're not saying be a man. Correct. It, it is be confidence in who you are to bring the value into those important places. Does does that make sense? 

Stacee Santi: Yeah, it does. But the, where we're at right now, if you, in many of these situations, you do have to act a bit more like a man just to get in the door And once you're in there, then you can use your, you know, female powers, which I find to be, . A lot around intuition, a lot around reading between the lines. A lot around getting what you want by, [00:53:00] manipulating the situation. We're very good at these skills as women. Like, we're like, the guys don't stand a chance to be honest, but to get in the room, I find you have to play the game a little bit and um, you know, it's not easy.

Right. I know a lot of my girlfriends are like, I want no part of that. And I get it, but if you do want a part of it, I think you have to be a bit bold. You have to put yourself, uh, put your crown on and walk in the room, and you have to speak with certainty, shed all those demons in your head about, I'm not smart enough, I'm not good enough, I'm not, , as, , knowledgeable or as savvy as the other people in this room.

Because what I have learned, you guys is like, they're no different. , They are not thinking more brilliant thoughts than anybody else. They, they are just showing up and they're saying what they think. [00:54:00] And, , I really am encouraging the ladies to, to do it. I, I will say though, there are downsides to doing this.

There are some downsides. You're not gonna be as well liked as you might be. Some people might say you're bossy or bitchy or demanding or emotional or, I've been called, what's the other word I've been called? Irrational. Very demeaning words for behavior that if a man did would be probably praised, um, dramatic.

I think that was used on me once by a upper person. Whatever, . I'm here, I'm, I'm gonna keep doing what I'm doing. 

Megan Sprinkle: Yeah. I, and I think, you know, a little bit of some circles back to understanding what is important to you and. Hopefully, especially when you get older, when you get older, this is a little bit easier to do.

I will go ahead and say that [00:55:00] is, it's a little bit easier to realize what your values are, and you learn over and over again that there's no way that you're going to make everybody happy, and there's no way, even if you were the sweetest person on the face of the planet, that everyone is going to like you.

So you learn that lesson, hopefully learn it quick and get over it. , And then you, again, , you know your values, you know , what your goals are, and so hopefully those things are easier to overcome and, and those are the things that can guide you into being confident. Get into the room and make a difference if that's where you wanna go.

Stacee Santi: And surround yourself with people that love and cherish you for exactly who you are. Like those are your people, right? The people in the boardroom are probably not who you should be looking to, to validate who you are. Hmm. You know, you've gotta find that somewhere else, close to the heart, close to the home.

Like you, you give yourself a super strong network. So you and I like to personally think of [00:56:00] all the women that have gone before me that have done hard, much harder things to get us to where we are today. I think of them when I'm in a situation that is challenging and I'm having to really be bold. I, I think of what would, what would those ladies think of me?

I better do my part. 

Megan Sprinkle: You make me think of a, a story. I'll say it real quickly 'cause I know we're almost outta time, but my husband and I had taken, , my stepdaughter to one of those, , military air museum. So it's all, all the old planes and everything, and when you walk in, there's that welcome table and there's an older woman that's sitting there and we start talking with her about the museum, and she sees Alannah and she asked her, uh, you know, what she's interested in and what she wants to be when she grows up.

And Alana [00:57:00] was like, well, I, I'm actually thinking about being a pilot. And this lady said. You go, girl. 'cause when I was your age, I thought the only thing I could do that was even remotely close to that was in chemistry. And so like, just thinking about the women who worked really hard to get to where we are, and just think of the possibilities that are out there for everyone in general.

But, but especially, you know, for those that have had to fight along the way, , it does kind of also broaden it to where, like you were saying that you were fighting for your future self. You know, you're also, you're fighting for your family. You're fighting for more people, the people that love you and support you and know that , your work is gonna impact a lot of people.

And so I think that's also that bigger picture that come, comes into play that helps us fight a little bit harder. 

Stacee Santi: Oh, you said it perfectly. 

Megan Sprinkle: Well, I, I do like to end on one final question [00:58:00] and, uh, I love to hear after this great conversation where you go, but what is something that comes to mind when I ask you what is something you're really grateful for right now?

Stacee Santi: Hmm. I am so grateful for my family. I have a great family. I know not everybody is , as lucky to say that, but maybe your family is the one you were born to, or maybe they're the ones you created that are not your birth relatives. I, I think that's equally powerful, but I have a great support system that has given me the freedom to try things when they seem crazy and they've supported me and they've also held me accountable when I've gotten off rails a little bit.

You, those people? Yes. Those same people. But, um, yeah, it means the world to me to have friends and family, mostly family that is, is there with me. 

Megan Sprinkle: [00:59:00] This was a very thought provoking conversation. I'm very curious to hear your reflections. Feel free to text your thoughts and questions with the link in the show notes. Also in the show notes, you can find the links to her book, stop Acting Like A Girl, and other references from the episode. I'm very excited to read her book myself, and if you wanna learn more from Stacy, she has a column in today's veterinary business, so you can watch out for her writing there.

There were so many great takeaways from today's conversation, but three big ones that stand out to me. One, be careful who you let define what's possible for you. Not everybody sees what you see, and that's okay. Keep fighting for your future self. It can be challenging to stand up for ourselves, so think of it as fighting for your future self.

And finally there's a beautiful quote by Nelson Mandela that I think kind of summarized this take home, his quote is, "I learned that courage was not the absence of fear, but the triumph over it. The brave man is not he who does not feel [01:00:00] afraid, but he who conquers that fear." So courage doesn't mean never feeling afraid.

It means doing the thing anyway because growth lies on the other side of fear. Thank you for listening and being here with me today. I wanna do a special thank you to Dr. Kelly Cooper who supports us on this platform, buzz Sprout, and you can too through another link in the show notes. Definitely check out those show notes.

And if you enjoyed this conversation, please follow the podcast, leave a review and share it with a colleague or friend who could use a reminder that their next chapter might be bigger than they can think. And as always, let's keep re-imagining what's possible in veterinary life.