Pope Leo Responds as Trump and MAGA Declare War on Catholics

Something strange is happening to Catholic life online: we’re starting to talk about presidents the way we should talk about saints, and we’re starting to talk about popes the way cable news talks about politicians. We kick off with the Trump vs Pope Leo flare-up, then ask the harder question underneath it: what does partisan loyalty do to a Catholic conscience when it becomes the main lens for interpreting the Church?

From there we widen out to foreign policy and the Iran war narrative. When threats, pride, and “crash out” rhetoric dominate the public square, even bad regimes can posture as the calm party at the negotiating table. We talk about why that inversion should alarm Catholics, how U.S. empire politics can invite judgment, and why “stopgap” resistance to reckless leadership can be providential even when you don’t share the same motives as the people resisting it.

We also dig into the growing pressure campaign around Catholic integralism and the attempt to package a palatable, media-friendly version of Catholicism that stays orthodox on paper while staying safe for conservative platforms. That leads into Vatican II debates, Nostra Aetate, evangelization, and whether “dialogue” language became naïve when it drifted from mission. To keep the whole thing grounded, we read Romans 10 and Romans 11 and take St Paul’s warning seriously: don’t boast, stand in awe, and don’t let critique turn into contempt.

If you’re tired of feeling like every Catholic argument is just politics in religious clothing, this one will help you reset. Subscribe, share this with a friend who’s caught in the outrage cycle, and leave a review with the line you disagreed with most so we can talk about it.

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Transcript

Cold Open And Jewish Demographics

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Let's consider the case of your average Jew. We can simply analyze the numbers. We can look at the numbers of Jews who serve in the United States military from the United States versus the number of Jews who serve in the IDF from the United States. We can look at the number of Jews who will often fight and argue for the temporal welfare of Israel.

SPEAKER_02 0:42

That was good.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

That was a gem. That was I like that.

SPEAKER_04 0:49

Zavvy. We love our Zavie.

SPEAKER_00 0:52

He could have called me a little bit more out of context, though. My favorite one was when somebody did this, and I just happened to say, I don't even uh I think it was something like the amount of, oh, it was the one he did with the amount of Jews in North Dakota. Because it's like, oh yeah, no, no, like the Jewish, the Jewish sort of um like bodily constitution does not do well with extreme colds.

SPEAKER_04 1:18

That's why they're the Middle Eastern people. It's the one state they can't make it to.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

So they like North Dakota, South Dakota, it's like 200 Jews. It's it's crazy low population.

SPEAKER_02 1:28

There's a few thousand in Minnesota, but they're all in like a six-block radius in St. Paul. No, they all live in New York with me.

Trump, Pope Leo, And Derangement

SPEAKER_04 1:36

I'm dealing with all of them. Well, okay, man. We um we had quite an exciting past 48 hours, man. It's like I I I went to bed last night. Rob, did you text me last night that the Trump tweet? Yeah, you texted me last night. Like I was off X for the night. I was laying down with my wife, and all of a sudden Rob sends me Trump's tweet about Pope Leo. And I'm just like, holy cow, this guy every single day gets more and more deranged. This crash out does not want to end. It started on Good Friday and it has gone right through the Easter octave. We have had nonstop mental derangement from Trump. And watching the reaction from the Catholic world has been interesting because you have a bunch of the boomer Catholics who are just still on the Trump train. Most of them are sedes. And I have this theory that they have replaced, they have such daddy issues and such hurt from the Pope over the last you know decade or so that they've basically replaced the Pope with Trump, and they see him as a messianic figure themselves.

Iran Rhetoric And Who Sounds Reasonable

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Yeah, I I definitely agree. Uh the last the last week is just well, we can actually, it's been like the last month, actually. No, it's sure it's been. We one could say it's been a solid like two years, three years that he's been going really down hard, but the past month has just been insane.

SPEAKER_02 3:08

It's definitely since Iran started.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Yeah, the the comments about Iran have been like maddening, absolutely maddening. Because you see, you see, like the the there, there's sort of an image that you get of the you know the radical Islamists. Obviously, there's a lot of stuff about Iran that I don't like in the regime that I don't like. You get the image on the one hand of the of the radical Islamists who are willing to you know go out there and chop people's heads off. And they're sounding extremely reasonable and they're like, okay, let's get a deal, let's do this with respect and you know, with a a degree of unity with one another and you know, mutual negotiations. And then on the other hand, you have Trump of just like, I'm gonna blow them the hell up, I'm gonna destroy their civilization, I'm gonna kill everyone. And it's like, okay, well, who's the terrorist here? You know, it it seems like this one one one of these individuals is engaging in you know terrorist threats, killing leaders, bombing schools, and then lying about it, blockading the Strait of Hermuz all of a sudden, blockading civilian ports, threatening to destroy uh vital infrastructure. And the other group is uh, you know, seemingly coming to the table with a lot of very reasonable rhetoric. And I think they're playing Donald Trump like a fiddle. Uh, and unfortunately, I don't know why he isn't being leashed by more reasonable minds, but you know, the thing that you got to realize about Trump is he he's got a huge pride issue. Yeah, that's one of the one of the big things about Trump is he's just addicted to himself, his own image, and he will just lie and lie and lie in order to support it. It's kind of coming to bite him now.

Catholics Trapped In Political Lenses

SPEAKER_04 4:45

Yeah, I'm just kind of sick of it all. And uh he's got a he's got a uh he's got a messiah complex. Like he does he thinks he's Nero. And the things that that are happening are just it's just at a point where I'm I'm kind of just sick of um Catholics who are first of all it starts off with Leo making this like generic call for dialogue and peace, and the and the crash out from everybody was he's a Marxist, he's a liberal. And I'm like, I'm not even like trying to get into like the Pope spleen or thing here, but like this was such a milked toast, like generic statement you would expect from a Pope. Like it wasn't even remotely controversial, and watching people flip out like he's a communist because they only can see things. Um people people only see things through this dialectic of conservative version, and that these people man, I can't do it. Guys are delusional, no Catholics see him as messianic, but you all have serious PDS. It was just a stupid tweet. Get over it.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

You are the people with PDS. Do you not realize that? You're just delusional the other direction.

SPEAKER_04 6:00

Look, people that only see things through uh a political lens are broken because they see everything the Pope does as uh uh a challenge to Trump, and everything Trump does as a challenge to Leo, and it's what the way I see like someone like that woman is she's no different than Christopher Hale. Like Christopher Hale sees Leo as taking down MAGA Catholics, and these people see it this it's just the two sides of the same coin. And what I see coming down the horizon is a coordinated effort against Catholics, and it's coming from the Zionist sector of the like the Protestant Zionist sector, and it's not as simple as just uh you know, like uh uh what's his name? Taffy asked on Matt Gasper's show, he was like, Do you think something like this could actually get the GOP to change tactics and maybe get the Zionists out of the GOP? And I'm like, absolutely not, like, there's no chance. You see everything they're doing, putting up these roadblocks to Tucker, to everything. Like, we are on a collision course right now, and I don't see anything changing.

SPEAKER_00 7:11

Yeah, to kind of get back to your uh original point of seeing everything as political, there was actually a very uh awesome tweet from classical theists that I remember. This must have been a year or two years ago, where he basically made the point that a lot of the weird conversion to something like Eastern Orthodoxy that goes on online amongst you know, chronically online people, it's because they view literally everything in life as subordinated to the political, their political ends, their personal political ends. So for them, you know, obviously I disagree with Pope Leo's practical judgments when it comes to immigration. Like I'm a hardcore immigration restrictionist. I believe this, okay. And there's a disagreement between Pope Leo and I, but when I'm thinking about, okay, what religion am I going to join? It's how am I going to honor God most? How do I love Jesus Christ most? How am I going to become most holy? Like, how am I going to get to heaven? You know, those are the thoughts that I have, not, you know, how am I going to kick out all of the brown people from my country? Like that's not even entering into the thought. Like, obviously, there are political implications to Catholicism, but you shouldn't make a primary question of what is most politically useful. And that's what a lot of these people are doing when it comes to how they're interpreting the situation between Pope Leo and Trump. They're like, Pope Leo is a liberal, he's uh you know a leftist, a progressive. It's like, dude, he's Pope. Like the Pope is the Pope for the entirety of the world. You you can't view the Pope as specifically always tied up with whatever's going on in the United States, you're just gonna ruin your soul that way.

Zionist Pressure And Anti-Catholic Narratives

SPEAKER_04 8:51

Yeah, if anybody, uh I jumped on with Matt Gaspers before the episode tonight. So if anybody wants to go check that out, I we had a good conversation. We went through all the latest, you know, Trump crash outs and some of the other stuff. But yeah, the this what I'm what I'm seeing is that MAGA Catholics, and I say that because these are people that are in a in a like in a cult of worship around Trump. What is coming down the pike, in my opinion, is the the the administration is going to start cracking down on the church in some shape or fashion. And if it's not the administration, it's going to be this Zionist segment of the Republican Party. So it may not be directly from the administration, but Trump is giving fuel to this segment that is very critical of what's going on right now. Rob, I put a tweet up, I just sent it into the telegram. Let's pop that up real quick. So there's this Zionist segment. You had Eric Mataxas, just had um uh what's his name? Uh the woke, the woke right guy, uh James Lindsay and Jeremy and John Zmirak on. Then you just had Jeremy Boring doing the same exact thing, and all of them are discussing Catholic integralism. Before Trump comes into office, you saw the FBI was was checking out traditional Catholic parishes, right? So you see uh Jeremy Boring, is there a plot to overturn the American founding? Uh McGill Patterson joins me to discuss Catholic integralism. These shows they're getting into not they're not even going after guys like Nick Fuentes, they're going after guys like Scott Hahn. Because they under they understand on a fundamental level that a Catholic sees the temporal subordinate to the spiritual. Like that's actually the proper way to view things, right? So they know that we're a problem because you you should view the temporal as subordinate to the spiritual, and we want to make laws that enact that and and play out into the public sphere.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Yeah, there's a good point that somebody made, I can't remember who made this point, but basically that a lot of what we actually see with the mass conversions in America to Catholicism is that disproportionately, this is of the you know, the elite or like future elite kind of class, you know, people who are going to be in some sort of influential position. Uh, you know, when you're when you're looking at these sorts of environments, like when you go to DC, for example, and look at Republican staffers, you know, their rate of conversion is a lot more than if you go to New York City and you look at, you know, wherever Anthony lives, or if you look at, you know, the Jewish borough or whatever, wherever. Like you go to any of those areas, obviously, the there's a disproportionate relation between people in the reins of power, let's say. Um, maybe the New York Jews are in the reins of power, but you know what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 11:46

And uh like all the iron miners up here in northern Minnesota, like there's not that many people.

Conversion Motives And Spiritual Priorities

SPEAKER_00 11:52

Yeah, yeah, exactly. You're not seeing mass conversions amongst those sorts of people. So I think that this is actually uh a very calculated move when it comes to being very concerned as right-wing, you know, classical liberal individuals, being very concerned with the future of Catholicism and how you know the intellectual leaders of Catholicism are speaking that influence, you know, these sort of staffers. I think that you know, they recognize that that has a lot more proximate effect than a sort of mass conversion on a grand scale does. You know, it's a lot more to convert 10% of the staffers in Washington than it is to convert 20% of the U.S. population, as counterintuitive as that sounds for a lot of people, you know, who have uh sort of drunk the propaganda of the way in which they think that democracy functions.

SPEAKER_04 12:42

Yeah. Well, we've seen, we've we're all watching like Catholicism and Catholics in very prominent positions in the culture right now, right? Like you're seeing the vice president is Catholic, and you're seeing uh all the biggest voices, especially the ones that are speaking out against Zionism, are Catholic, but then you have this concerted effort to present a uh a version of Catholicism that is orthodox in its in its theology, but is also palatable for um like I we've been calling it kosher Catholicism, right? So you have Matt Frad going over to the Daily Wire and you have Michael Knowles over there, and the problem is we're like the thing that you see with Trump today, those guys will criticize Trump for putting up the image of you know, the the blasphemous image of him act uh presenting himself as Jesus, and they but they'll they'll downplay the Trump and Leo thing going at each other, and then they'll also still give cover to an avenue where you can be Catholic and still give support to the state of Israel. And it's just this this this branding that they're doing is very, very like thought out before like ahead of time and being presented to us.

SPEAKER_00 13:59

Yeah, yeah, I absolutely agree. I think that you know that's part of the concerted effort of any sort of action group. Uh you're you're not gonna only have you know the sort of behind the scenes that I feel like a lot of people think that um you know, social movements in uh in social media, you know, whoever's getting popular or whoever's getting funding, whoever's getting a lot of attention or clout, that that's very organic, kind of like you know, on on the Catholic sphere of like me or Anthony or you know, other YouTube channels gaining more or less popularity. This is a lot more organic. But in the political sphere, actually the game, the game is completely different. Like the meeting out of popularity, of funding, of support, that's actually very calculated. It's very systematic. So I it wouldn't surprise me if there was some sort of intentional uh move to try to, whether you know these individuals are complicit or not, like I don't think personally, I don't think Matt Frad is uh too complicit in it.

SPEAKER_05 15:00

No.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

Um, but whether somebody's complicit or not, like this it applies that you know, Ben Shapiro is probably thinking of the fact, or Jeremy Boring's thinking of the fact of oh, bringing on uh you know all of these Catholics on a daily wire that probably has a uh a good effect to you know bringing a form of kosher Catholicism to uh you know the people. I I I do not uh I do not doubt that at all.

SPEAKER_04 15:25

Yeah, I I'm seeing a bunch of the comments like look, why did the Pope feel the need to announce? Look, I'm not even going to um downplay. Yeah, that's from Rumble, but I'm not even gonna downplay the fact that there's a very high chance that Leo was elected as an American and made Pope to combat Trump. Like I like that's not a crazy thing to think. I'm not even saying that's not the case. He he probably was, they probably did elect an American as Pope to be the heel against Trump, but that's still irrelevant, right? It's I the what I'm seeing is guys who uh are choosing Trump over their fellow Catholics. And what if there is some kind of effort to cast Catholics as enemies to America, which is what it looks like they're doing, they're trying to cast um Catholics, especially a very certain type of Catholic, as an enemy to America, and they're gonna try to make us an other so that it they they won't feel like I'm like we've seen this throughout history. How many times? You've seen it in every you know, during the Reformation where Protestants went after Catholics, like it feels like you've seen it in America throughout our history, yeah. And I it I can I feel like I'm the only one that really is looking down the road at what's going on here because there is this concerted effort to make Catholics the enemy right now. And when I see MAGA Catholics, whether they're Novus Ordo or Sede, I don't care what like where you land on it, you guys are going to help in the persecution of the church. You're gonna you're gonna be handing your fellow Catholics over to the Sanhedrin when this happens.

SPEAKER_00 17:10

Yeah, I think uh what you said about the election of Leo as an American being intentional. A lot of people in my live chat were uh kind of freaking out about that, like L take, you know, Anthony's crazy for this. But I actually don't think that's crazy at all. Uh when we look at St. John Paul II as a Polish Pope, uh a first non-Italian pope since I think Adrian VI in the 16th century, you know, first non-Italian pope in centuries. The reason for choosing an Eastern European from behind the Iron Curtain was obviously quite intentional, uh, or at least it was providential for the destruction of communism. So is there sort of a uh a parallel choice when it comes to Pope Leo as a figure to counterbalance the American empire and the effect of America on the world stage, especially in light of you know Trumpism, which obviously I don't think there's a single cardinal who's a huge fan of Donald Trump. Maybe I don't think it's the craziest thing in the world. I don't think that's an insane thought at all. I think it's actually quite shocking that we got an American pope, and I don't think it was accidental, and I think that's probably one of the clearest, uh, I guess that would be one of the best guesses if I had to, you know, pull something out.

SPEAKER_04 18:30

Yeah, it was probably to combat Trump. It was also to combat the American media sphere, right? Because you remember what the American media sphere did under Francis, and a lot of it had to do with language barrier and stuff like that. So, but who cares what the reason was that they get him in? So the way I'm looking at it is even if Leo was brought in to go against Trump, like yesterday they had Supic, uh McElroy, and it was like the McCarrick crew came out and went on 60 Minutes, right?

SPEAKER_02 19:01

Tobin Tobin was the third.

SPEAKER_04 19:03

And who was the other one?

SPEAKER_02 19:04

Tobin.

SPEAKER_04 19:05

Tobin's the third, yeah. So they come out and they're going on about how Trump's immigration policy and this and that. And it's like we don't have to agree with that. Like, you don't it could be in God's providence that he put someone in that is anti-Trump for this very for for very different reasons than we'll need someone to be anti-Trump, right? Like, you don't have to dislike Trump for the same reasons those cardinals do, but it is good that there's an adversary to Trump because we're against what Trump's doing over in Iran, we're against what Trump's doing on several other things. So, in God's providence, who cares why these cardinals are against them? It's good that there's a heel to go up against Trump and to try to put a you know put some kind of a stop gap to the insanity that he's trying to pull a year.

SPEAKER_00 19:54

Yeah, I think um to uh to to borrow a point from uh a man that we always talk about, I feel like we always talk about when I'm on here, uh Nicholas J. Fuentes. Yeah, he makes the point that uh the reason why he desires the Democrats to win is as a stopgap to Trump. Not because he agrees more ideologically with the Democrats or anything like that, but simply for the reason that this will kind of kneecap him to have a Democratic majority in the last two years of his term and stop Trump from causing further damage in things like the Iran war. And you can agree or disagree with that logic or the prop or the uh conclusions to that uh point if you want to. You know, you don't have to vote Democrat uh to see the point in action. But I do think there is something to that when it comes to Pope Leo. There's obviously things that me personally, I would like Pope Leo to talk about more on the social action front and the Catholic social doctrine front. You know, if Pope Leo was going hard against uh, you know, a lot of different things that ought to be criminalized, or at least against the general principle, or or for rather, the general principle of the union between the church and the state and his own temporal authority in being able to, you know, pronounce on matters of morals in the political sphere. Like I would love him to talk about those things. He doesn't as much as I would like, sometimes here and there. But nevertheless, this is a it's a good thing. You know, it's a good thing that Pope Leo is out there rejecting the Iran war. It's good that he is talking about the genocide in Gaza or uh the affronts against the sovereignty of Lebanon. These are good things. The American Empire is doing very evil things or supporting very evil things. And I think a lot of people forget that there is a sort of social and political effect to national sin, uh, to the structures of sin that can often reign uh in our nations. So when the U.S. does objectively evil things, objectively bad things are going to Happen to the United States. Like this is a simple principle. You do bad things, you're going to often in this world receive bad punishments to those things. And do you want to be uh you know suffering the divine judgments for uh the sins of our empire? I I don't want to. So I think this is actually a very good thing that this is a stopgap to uh whatever Trump is trying to do in some form.

SPEAKER_04 22:24

It's not okay. So it's uh it's you're 100% right. Like there are the the our this is actually what worries me about all of this is that there's judgment that's going to come upon our nation because we deserve it, right? We've had how many decades of abortion gone through? We've had uh even and and that's what's crazy to me. Like that you'll see the the MAGA Catholics going, well, Trump turned overturned Roe v. We first off, no, he didn't. He put a judge in, and the judges overturned it, and nothing has changed since. If anything, it's gotten worse. Trump's still funding Planned Parenthood, he's pushing for IVF, he's uh for gay marriage. Every single thing that you guys criticize the Democrats for, Trump is for. We've got nothing, nothing for him. And the thing is, what I think a like a bigger part of what Nick is saying is if you think back to when Biden was in, how many people were focused on how horrific the country of a direction the country was heading? Yeah, and when you have Trump in, the same exact things are happening, except the people that actually could put up a fight on this stuff are now like pacified. Yeah, they're satiated because they got their guy in, right? So now all of the things that are really going to bring judgment upon our nation, you have Catholics sitting there and defending Trump, even though he's doing the exact same thing. So Nick, Nick's kind of saying, look, if we get Democrats in, maybe we could refocus the movement and put it back. Because everything Trump said he was going to do, he he lied to us about. He didn't do any of the stuff he said he was going to do. I don't have Trump derangement syndrome, it's Trump disappointment syndrome. And then I'm now I'm just looking at it from a I mean, I see it in an eschatological eschatological sense at this point because as soon as I saw Trump get in and he didn't end the Ukraine war, I'm like, not only is he not going to end that Ukraine war, the whole world will be at war before the end of his presidency. So he goes and starts the Iran conflict, he gets a ceasefire signed, and Israel destroys the ceasefire because they can't let that ceasefire end, right? To Pope Leo's point, Pope Leo put out a tweet the other day talking about the Christian East that's being destroyed. He's, I mean, I want the guy to come out and condemn Israel's actions. Yeah. But he's he's being very vague about it. But he and he's talking about war as a business. He's talking about the industrial complex, the military-industrial complex. I want him to come out and condemn the actions of the Israeli government. He's not going to do that, but at least he's bringing light to the to the situation in Lebanon where the Christian East is being destroyed right now by Israel because they want to expand their borders.

SPEAKER_00 25:03

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that for Trump, it's when you actually compare what he has done with what he has promised to do and the lengths in which he is willing to attempt either of those two things, it becomes quite stark. You know, it in order to satiate Israel's bloodlust and desire for regional domination. He's willing to literally move heaven and earth and sends, he's literally willing to dry out our munition stores. He's literally willing to move half of our Navy across, you know, halfway across the world. He's he's willing to do all of these different things to satiate the bloodlust of the wicked Zionists. But in order to defend America, what is what he is calling Pope Leo out for, you know, not he's not tough on crime, he's not tough on immigration. Really? Is Trump tough on crime? Is he actually tough on immigration? Or is all that he is doing is uh building up the passions, you know, he's building up the anger and the hate within the United States, especially towards right-wingers, where we could actually, you know, we could have a moral front when it comes to immigration and deportations. We can say, you know, we're gonna treat these people well, we're gonna treat them properly, we're gonna treat them with kindness and respect. But, you know, we got to enforce the law for the sake of our people, for the sake of our nation, for the sake of our future. And we have to be on our best behavior while we do it. You know, obviously accidents are gonna happen, obviously there's gonna be unintended consequences and miscalculations, but you know, we just gotta do it. And we're gonna do it in a way that's going to cause the least amount of scandal against our position, right? And that's actually how Trump got the original, uh, the original coalition together, you know, in in 2024 or up to the 2024 election, rather. This is how he did it. He held to all of these different policy choices, but they were careful to state them in such ways that as not to offend the sensibilities of different people. But rather than that, he is not actually achieving the goals. And all these is all he is doing is just pissing people off towards these right-wing positions and possibly destroying them amongst you know your average American for quite a long time in the future. Uh, just like we saw with the invasion of Iraq and isolationism and you know, the the pushback against George Bush and the blue wave uh that happens uh in 2000, I think it began in 2006. You know, just like we saw all of that, so also we're gonna see this snapback against a lot of things that you know we hold dear in our hearts. So it is it is like a historic lost opportunity, and not only the destruction of you know, a lot of our moral consciousness, you know, as Catholics, but also the destruction of our political movement. So a lot of the people crying, oh, Trump derangement syndrome, Trump derangement syndrome, if you actually care about these issues, the person you would be most pissed off at in the entire world would be Trump for fumbling this and bringing bringing against us the wrath and hatred of a lot of those people who were, you know, more friendly towards us, would be more friendly towards us under other circumstances.

SPEAKER_04 28:26

Yeah, I I am no longer see things through a political lens. I I see things through like I don't because a lot of people seem to think that um oh yeah, we gotta we can't forget our ad reads. A lot of people seem to to just view things through this political lens, and I'm looking at it, our enemy is not are not the democrats anymore. Like that that that that train sail that that is such a kayfabe fake thing that they've put in front of us to keep us at war with our fellow citizens. Don't get don't get me wrong, they are the enemy still. They are, but it's there, it's not because they're democrats, it's because they're seeds of the serpent. Yeah, right. So this has to be seen on an eternal, like we are not up against democrats, we're up against principalities and powers. This is this is uh a cosmic war we're in right now. You're talking about the the the the actual the actual fight is between the mystical body of Christ and the mystical body of the devil. Now, the mystical body of the devil resides inside of the mystical body of Christ, partially, because there's plenty of baptized Catholics who are claiming the name Catholic, but are working against the the you know the working against the purposes of the church. So we're we're we're fighting a battle amongst people who are inside the church and outside the church, and we have to find a way to be bring a restoration of the church in the midst of this. Now, the only way to really do that is to have a Nineveh moment, which means we all don sackcloth and ash, beg God's mercy and and do penance. Like that's the only actual way to to to sway God's uh uh justice from us. Because, like you were saying, we uh our nation if God doesn't like what was it? Billy Graham said that, right? If he doesn't if he doesn't punish America, he owes Sodom and Gomorrah an apology. It's a really good statement because the things that we do in the name of the American Empire, it's hard to not see the American Empire as the return of Babylon, like as the return of the Babylonian Empire, the the return of the Babylonian gods. You see, in every in every single uh facet of public life, they elevate the most debauched behavior because that is basically worship to these pagan gods, and Christ the king is relegated to your side chapel or to your to your local parish, but you can't bring them out into the public. And anybody who says Christ is king is accused of anti-Semitism.

SPEAKER_00 31:07

Yeah, I think what's um I think what's I think lost on a lot of Americans, this is funnily enough, when you look at a lot of anti-American uh Iranian propaganda, the one thing that they point out about America, it's not, you know, sexual degeneracy, it's not, you know, immodesty, or it's not the fact that we are uh we're not Muslims or whatever. The one thing they point out about America and the American world system is pride. They say that the Americans are prideful and they try to recreate the entire world in our image. And we could talk about the historical precedents for this, especially during the Cold War and what happened in our fighting against world communism and the antecedents that happened in World War II in the pre-world uh pre-war period. We could talk about all that. But ultimately, what we need to remember is that a lot of empires who had a similar size relative to other nations and other regional powers, there have been many empires who have fallen quite quickly when they overextend their bounds. And I've seen a lot of people saying, oh, we could, we could never lose this war in Iran. We could, we could never, you know, fall from grace in this way. The world could never become bipolar uh rather than unipolar uh due to a loss in Iran. But I would say don't be so quick. You know, don't think that God can't do terrific judgments against us. And we we couldn't lose with even against an objectively um incorrect and objectively evil enemy, an inferior enemy.

SPEAKER_04 32:44

I mean, it's happened throughout history, right? Go back and read the Old Testament. I mean, when God wants to bring judgment upon a nation, he brings judgment upon a nation. And not just that, we've opened the borders to the enemy to come inside the nation. Doesn't even have to be from a foreign army, it could be from within our own borders, from the people we've let in because we've stopped serving Christ as king, and now we've let these foreign gods come into our own country.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Yeah, I absolutely agree. I think that the um not obviously not precluding action. Uh, action is a responsibility of all Catholics to bring about the social kingship of Christ. But I do see something like the immigration crisis and a lot of the impotence of us, of uniquely, uniquely there's an impetus of the uh American hierarchy when it comes impotence rather of the American hierarchy when it comes to the immigration crisis. When you look at certain European nations, they there will be uh bishops or cardinals here or there, or even episcopal conferences, local episcopal conferences or national rather, here and there that are a little bit better on the immigration issue and will be more in line with you know restrictionist policies on it. But the UFCCB is uniquely bad on this issue. Like the American church has in a unique way stood down when it comes to the immigration issue, uh, which could be a moral force for actually, you know, having sway with the people who want to immigrate and with a lot of the American Catholics who are in positions of power. The the church could actually provide a great impetus against uh mass immigration. Like this is something that the church could do. And she has specifically chosen not to do that in the United States. And I think this is a great failure of the hierarchy in the United States. But I do see that, you know, this impotence of the church and also the flooding of immigrants, this is very clearly a divine judgment against our people. Like hordes of foreigners coming in and overtaking our culture, our nation, our safety, our social resources that we have built up in such an excellent way to be the most wealthy and the greatest nation in the history of the world, maybe not morally greatest, but certainly when it comes to material means, the greatest in the history of the world. And I would say that, you know, technology and culture and all of these different things, America has reigned and that it was an excellent nation. And that we are being judged, you know, specifically for the sin of pride, which interestingly, when you look at Donald Trump, he is the embodiment of American pride and of the refusal to humility and of dialogue and of you know concern for others. He is the embodiment of American pride, and I think that it's a bit of divine irony that he will be the one to ultimately fail to uh push back this divine judgment and you know ruin for the remainder of our people's history the ability to push back this divine judgment.

SPEAKER_04 35:47

It's like um man, these bishops, they uh the American bishops specifically, they're just it's a pseudo-messianism that they that they push. It's um it's presenting uh uh uh like a false version of Christianity that there's there's um you you just need to love your neighbor. It's just the easiest way to go to make it appear like Christianity, but it's it's it's really vulgar because what they're doing is opening up the borders and putting your children in situations where they're no longer surrounded by Catholic communities anymore. Now they don't, you know, there's all these other religions around them. It makes it harder for your kids to even believe the faith because they're looking around and they're going, oh well, how who's to say we're right when this one believes this and this person believes that? It's such a a way to destroy Christendom from within that any any remnants of a Christian nation that we once had is now gone because we allowed the floodgates to come in. And uh, yeah, it's it's it really is sad that that's the thing.

SPEAKER_00 36:52

Yeah, I have a little bit more um hope. Maybe I was a little bit doomer when I said that you know, the there's really no hope for us. I do think for the for the majority of America, uh, there is you know hope. I think there are future strategies for certain parts of America to recover from the effects of this chastisement against us. But I do actually have a lot of hope when it comes to uh future seminary uh seminarians, future priests. I I do have, you know, I talk with a lot of these guys uh every day, you know, people who are young priests or seminarians or future seminarians. And it seems like 90, 95%, a lot of them are really great. A lot of them are really on the ball theologically, uh socially, pastorally. So I do see the the seeds are planted for a sort of return uh revival of uh Catholicism around the world and specifically in America. And but I guess to be a better way of putting it, but there is a long time for that.

Ads, Sponsor Codes, And Donations

SPEAKER_04 37:54

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SPEAKER_00 39:13

Like you don't have a message, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:16

If you don't have a black monk rosary, you're not on the team. So and you're gonna we're gonna need a lot of rosaries going forward, especially uh we're gonna need a lot of rosaries and a lot of knick-knacks because the conversation I'm about to get into is gonna be very heavy. And I want to see because Christian, you'd made some comments recently, and me and you disagree on some things, so but knick knack.com, uh knick-knacks are the only Catholic nicotine product on the market. Catholic family that decided they wanted to sponsor us, they are the best. Uh, I'm pretty sure if you buy from them, there's some kind of indulgence attached. I don't know exactly how that works. I think if you buy the the the the the knick-knack lozenges and you put one in your mouth and you visit um a Saint Francis monastery, a Franciscan monastery, you'll get a plenary indulgence, right?

SPEAKER_01 40:07

Isn't it the year of Saint Francis? I think it's the year of St. Francis, right?

SPEAKER_04 40:11

If you visit a monastery and buy, well, anyway, so you're a headache, is what it is. Knick-Knacks are a nicotine product, and nicotine is an addictive substance. And uh you cannot use it. Yeah, nicotine is a good idea. But why else would you buy it if you didn't want to be addicted to nicotine? So go buy some knick-knacks, use code AB25% for 25% off your first purchase. We love knick-knacks, but all right, so to get on, oh hold on.

SPEAKER_02 40:38

Um, my wife has a friend uh who the um young Catholic couple up in Canada. The husband just moved there from the US. You have to get a work permit before you're allowed to get a job in Canada, if you're from the US, apparently. So he's been out of work. Um, so they uh they're having stro uh struggles with rent. So I'm gonna put a link in the description as well as in the live chat. And if anyone is feeling generous, if you can head there and possibly donate, that would be greatly appreciated.

Nostra Aetate, Dialogue, And Coming Persecution

SPEAKER_04 41:05

Yeah, send me that link personally, Rob. I'll donate to that. We'll do our poor Americans stranded in Canada. We must rescue our American American patriots, expats. Um, all right, so yeah, let's get into this a little bit because you are very hopeful. Yes, and I am too, but my hope lies in that the only way through this thing that we're we're going through is Calvary. Like, I don't see us getting through this debacle that we're in between the Trump situation, uh, the situation in the church. I mean, the church crisis, I don't, you know, I I know you and I probably differ on a a few things here, but even Fuentes, Rob, did I send that to the thing? Like, you want to play the clip of Fuentes real quick that I just sent? Sure. I mean uh this is this is Fuentes talking about no shirtate. Did I send it?

SPEAKER_02 42:01

No.

SPEAKER_03 42:02

Okay, hold on, let me send it right now. Uh send it right now.

SPEAKER_04 42:10

Like this is this is and people were accusing him of like even E. Michael Jones came out and told him he was schismatic for saying this. But I think this is just comedy.

SPEAKER_00 42:20

Unfortunately, I think he's a little bit senile right now. I um he's uh he's done a lot for the church, a lot for uh America. He's a patriot, good Catholic, but you know, it's he he's just so just so attached to this one issue. I remember I actually uh I went to South Bend one time and I was able to get breakfast with him. And just the entire time we I would have loved to talk to him about, you know, he has a book on Iran. I would love to talk to him about that. I'm very interested in, you know, Middle East, North Africa, uh Muslim countries, per like I'm interested in all that stuff. I would have loved to talk to him about in his experiences, but just the whole time or anything else theological, but the whole time he was just talking about, you know, Nick Fuentes, Nick Fuentes, Nick Fuentes. Oh, really? It was like an hour. And finally, I you know, I just got up and left and drove home. I'm like, I'm just I'm there, there's no point in me staying here, you know, two, three hours. You know, when I talk to some people like that, I literally would just never leave. I would stay till midnight if I could. Yeah, but with him, it was just such a terrible experience.

SPEAKER_04 43:26

He's got a lot of good thoughts, man. He's had a lot of good books. I mean, the Jewish Revolutionary Spirit, the Logos Rising, all good books. But let's let's let's pop Nick on. There's no, I don't think, I don't think there's any vulgarity in this.

SPEAKER_02 43:38

I love it when you don't check.

SPEAKER_04 43:40

I I mean I did listen to it originally, but you know.

SPEAKER_06 43:43

What is your take on Nostra? You take I am a Catholic, but I do not agree with that. Yeah, I uh find it to be a bit problematic. Ever since they released Nostra Tate, I believe they've put out they put something out like every decade since, correcting it. Yeah. Nostratate, and then 10 years later they like revisited it, revisited it, revisited it, and then 10 years later they they did it again, and then 10 years later they did it again. If you look at the history on this, they they have to basically keep circling back and revising it because the way that it's written, it does sound like perennialism, which is this idea that there's an esoteric truth behind all world religions. So that means that all the world religions are are basically just a cultural expression of the same thing. Because what Nostratate says is it takes all the different world religions and says, um, that's you can kill it.

SPEAKER_04 44:46

I just wanted to just go like he was just critical of Nostra Tate. Now, I I think Nostra Tate is the culmination of a bunch of naive men who came out of World War II feeling horrible about, you know, they they have the Holocaust narrative put on them, and they have the privilege of being in a Christian culture and thinking all people are just good. We can just dialogue with everybody and we could just be nice to them. But I think the the effects of this have become bringing it's basically ended the the um the Great Commission on part of the church. And instead of going and trying to conquer the pagan gods and slay slay the idols, we've brought them into the Vatican and we're now saying we can just dialogue with you guys for the sake of dialogue. I don't think it's heretical, I think it's naive. And I think these men that came out of that um out of out of that propagandized age just don't seem to grasp how how you just can't have peace outside of Jesus Christ. You see, Pope Leo, Pope Leo going today and going to a mosque and talking about dialogue. I just think these men are very naive. And the consequences are going to be in order for us to get through this, there's going to be a walk on Calvary. Like we're gonna have to walk the Via Dola Rosa and we're going to have to suffer before there can be any kind of resurrection of the church to its former glory. Like we're not going to be able to just, oh, we got some good priests uh up and coming and stuff. I think there's going to be some real persecution coming. And I think the only way that you see the church reborn is through the blood of the martyrs.

SPEAKER_00 46:30

Yeah, this is why, you know, when I look at uh nostra tate, I'm struck with the fact, and this is something my friend Hassan brings up, that for the interpretation of Nostratate, uh Nick mentioned the clarifications that come from the Vatican, and of course, those are good. But you really need to read Nostratate in light of the documents on evangelization uh from Vatican II, from St. Paul VI, and from St. John Paul II. And uh ultimately Dominus is a very good document. When you read in light of that, you're able to understand, okay, this is actually, it's not, you know, perennialism. And Nick, I think, caught himself and said, you know, I'm not saying that it is perennialism, but it just sounds like that to a lot of people. It seems like that to a lot of people, which I get, you know, I get that it seems like that to a lot of people. But when you read the clarifications uh that come from you know the church and the documents on evangelization, it says, okay, well, you know, we have these, you know, elements that are you know present in all of these religions. We can actually use them for the purposes of evangelization, which I think everybody in the history of evangelization would agree with. You know, that that's obviously something that you need to uh do in order to effectively evangelize people. But I do see you know a lack of balance, I guess would be the best way of putting it when it comes to a lot of clerics and the hierarchy uh after the Second Vatican Council is that when you look at the documents of Vatican II, you you there are many good practical uh resolutions there of what the church should do. And we're not gonna focus on those. We're not gonna focus on how this could be used in evangelization, the necessity and the primacy of evangelization, the insufficiency, the utter insufficiency that St. Paul VI talks about of non-Christian religions for salvation. We're not gonna talk about all of those things over there. We're rather going to kind of selectively pick out, you know, whatever is most palatable to a non-Catholic audience, uh, basically in order to complement them and to make them feel better and to have a very surface level relationship with these people. So yeah, I think that the it's definitely uh a good take, I would say to summarize a good take.

SPEAKER_04 48:48

I I think that the the the take of these bishops that are doing the exact thing you're talking about, though, what it's going to lead to is they're going to see how naive they were. Because what happened was by putting that document out, it almost gave it was like the it was like the world was waiting for the church to give its okay on something like that, and then religious freedom, and then the the the Western world opens its borders to these foreign religions, they come in and these men are so naive to think, oh, we could just dialogue with everybody, but they're they're mistaking that only we have that privilege of thinking that because we're Christian and we grew up in Christian lands, but these people that are coming in are not from Christian lands, and there's going to be a reckoning from us not guarding what was precious to us, which was a Christian civilization. Like once you don't guard what is precious, it gets taken away from you. And I think that what they did, this has nothing to do with heresy or thinking the church, it's just it was just a naive group of men from that generation, they let their guard down. And I think that we're our generation and the ones beneath us are the ones that are going to wind up paying the price for it. And I think that the church will be reborn, but it's going to be very difficult, and there's going to be martyrdom on the on the road to get there. And I think that martyrdom will convert all the peoples that came into these lands.

SPEAKER_00 50:15

Yeah, there's the the myth of infinite progress that was pretty popular amongst Europeans of that time of basically, you know, there was this idea that we could, you know, forever and ever and ever sort of get better and better and better. And there's sort of the we'll lose the the limits of of our humanity. You know, now it's in the form of transhumanism and ideas like this. But there was a sort of um friendliness to the world that was present amongst a lot of these bishops, and they did imbibe some of this myth, uh, in my opinion, in the practical way in which they went about uh, you know, ruling the church. And I think what was ultimately realized by somebody like St. Paul VI, which I think he's the by far the greatest of the post-conciliar popes, I love St. Paul VI. I think he was uh personal friends with venerable, his personal friends with venerable Pius the XII. And uh he is you know unique in the fact that he will talk about a lot of traditional doctrines of the church that aren't as spoken of as much by other post-conciliar popes. And what was recognized is you know, St. Paul VI, he actually, I don't think a lot of people recognize this, he actually fasted to death, basically, um near the end of his life in looking at around him the state of the church, especially the state of the liturgy. And uh, you know, that this is recognized by some clerics, is just how bad, you know, things things got from the pre-conciliar era. But once you, you know, once you let the once you kind of let the dragon in, it's too late. You know, there's you can't control it without a sort of Gestapo-like control over the seminaries and the universities and you know, over the the different dioceses and the episcopal conferences, and that just wasn't seen as being you know realistic.

SPEAKER_04 52:16

Yeah. Um, all right. I what I what I think what we should do is I do want to talk to you about eschatology. Yeah. Um, because you put out that video the other day, but I think we should do that over on locals because uh I wanna I want to poke at some of the things you said in your video the other day.

SPEAKER_00 52:34

Unfortunately, I'm gonna I I have to go soon. How how much time you got left? Uh 10 minutes. That's all you got? Yeah. I got it with some friends coming out over.

SPEAKER_04 52:47

All right, maybe we'll do that another night. All right, me and Rob will jump over to locals and uh and we'll let you go. But yeah, I don't know, man. I think uh I think the stuff with with Trump is I I hope that I hope that Catholics can differentiate between the political and the religious because I think everybody's got to stop viewing things through such a political lens and seeing Leo, you know. I I think in God's providence, he may have given us a pope that is gonna going to push back on Trump and some of this insanity that we're gonna see.

SPEAKER_00 53:24

Yeah, I I absolutely agree. I um yeah, I think I think we kind of put everything out there except the eschatological stuff.

SPEAKER_04 53:33

Although this that's a good 40-minute conversation because I I definitely disagree with you on that one.

SPEAKER_00 53:40

Yeah, I know it's it's for me, you know. I guess if anybody wants to watch the video, you can just watch the video that I produced. I think it was last week uh that I did it. But basically for me, I I think that there are uh you know, understanding that when it comes to eschatology, like the signs that we are given, they have so frequently throughout the history of the church been been claimed and rescinded. And intrinsically it's so hard to recognize when these things are versus when they're not. So I'm not entirely closed to the possibility of, you know, maybe I'm just misunderstanding the data, maybe I'm wrong, maybe, you know, actually we are in this uh apocalyptic time. But I do think that you know, from my right reading of scripture and tradition, that there needs to be certain conditions met, especially around the conversion of the nations of the world that haven't been met yet. So I guess to give like a minute-long summary. So I don't actually think Trump's antichrist, although I'm open to it.

SPEAKER_04 54:36

Yeah, I don't even necessarily think he is either. I think he might be some type of forerunner or um, you know, a type. At least that he's a type of antichrist for sure, at minimum. Um, but he may be like the chaos agent that comes in and then the antichrist comes in promising peace after and then something like that. But I I definitely think we're way further along the line than you do. But yeah, I don't know. That's a that's a full conversation because I think you were you were focusing a lot on Old Testament scripture and things like that. And uh yeah, I don't I don't, you know, especially conversations Rob and I have had about the conversion of the Gentiles and and the fullness, you know, getting into Romans 9 through 11. But yeah, I got some stuff me and Rob can do over on locals. We'll do that another night, and uh yeah, we'll go from there. So um you if you're well, you're gonna do something with Josh towards the end of the month, but I don't know. I'd like I'd like to jump in on one of those conversations.

Eschatology Teaser And Guest Farewell

SPEAKER_00 55:31

Yeah, Joshua Charles and Gideon Lazar and I will be doing a little bit of an eschatology conversation. I'm supposed to uh I have a few speeches this next week, so I'll be out of town. Um so I I will not, I'll I won't be here for like a week, and then after that, I think we're doing the conversation. So there will be a content drought for a lot of my listeners right now, but we'll get right back into it. Yeah, we're supposed to have that discussion. I'd love to come on again and uh you know discuss the topic further.

SPEAKER_02 56:06

Anthony, maybe if you did stuff like give speeches, Joshua would invite you on for stuff.

SPEAKER_00 56:11

Yeah, maybe I doubt it. Dude, Josh, Joshua, that's a hard, it's a hard get. Joshua's like, I've never been invited on before.

SPEAKER_04 56:20

Uh so that this is I'm thinking about not bringing him back on here until I get the invited history because I'm tired of like plugging his stuff and him him thinking I'm not learned enough for his channel. I'm not a scholar.

SPEAKER_00 56:35

I guess I'm I'm not a scholar either. We're we're down here, we're down here in the trenches, Anthony.

SPEAKER_04 56:40

Yeah, he's like he he wants scholars on his show. So no, we love Josh. But uh, all right, Christian, we'll let you go, man. It was nice talking with you, brother.

SPEAKER_00 56:48

Okay, absolutely. God bless.

SPEAKER_04 56:50

All right, take us out, Rob.

SPEAKER_02 56:52

Yeah, I'm just gonna kill the streams.

SPEAKER_04 56:54

Well, yeah, if anybody wants to join us over on locals, we're gonna go do some fun stuff on locals.

Romans 10 To 11 And Humility

SPEAKER_02 57:01

Okay, Facebook gone, Twitter gone, Rumble gone. Man, Rumble's a dumpster fire when we talk about politics, isn't it? And YouTube is going now. Everyone head over to locals.

SPEAKER_04 57:17

Um, so before the show, Rob texted me and he's like, dude, we gotta stop talking about Jews so much because he accidentally called his son Iggy Israel. Like it just came out.

SPEAKER_02 57:30

Well, I was yelling at him to get ready so I could bring over my moms before we stream. I'm like, but I was you know, I was getting ready to say Iggy, and I'm like, Israel. And I looked at Hope, and Hope looks at me, and I just go, Oh, it's the Jews.

SPEAKER_04 57:43

No, but um, the thing is, like, I I was uh I was reading Romans 9 through 11 the other day again, and uh there's something really important in there that it's so that because we do have to be careful we don't develop like a hatred or because we're talking about things and talking about the Jews, and and you can subconsciously develop uh like an actual hatred towards them, you know. And uh Saint Paul just goes through some stuff in this that I like it lit my heart up the other day, and it's been kind of how I've handled most of it anyway, but but it's good to like remind everybody about it. Um, so I kind of just want to read Romans 9 through 11 and just the two you hold two chapters? Um, maybe we could just go to 10. 10 and 11, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 58:35

I have it on screen here.

SPEAKER_04 58:36

Go to 10 and 11.

SPEAKER_02 58:40

Do you want it in the Dewey Reams, or do you want it in?

SPEAKER_04 58:43

No, no, no, I can never read the Dewey Reams. Do the revised standard version, that's the easiest one.

SPEAKER_03 58:49

Uh yeah, go to 10. Revised standard uh Catholic edition.

SPEAKER_04 59:01

So, brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for them. He's talking about the Jews now, right? So, my heart's desire and prayer for prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. I bear I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but it is not enlightened. For being ignorant of the righteousness that comes from God and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God's righteousness. For Christ is the end of the law, that everyone who has faith may be justified. Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on the law shall live by it, but the righteousness based on faith says, Do not set, do not say in your heart, who will ascend into heaven, that is to bring Christ down, or who will descend into the abyss, that is to bring Christ up from the dead. But what does it say? The word is near you on your lips and in your heart, that is the word of faith which we preach. Because if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. That's something that Protestants always quote out of context. I know. For man believes with his heart and is so justified, and he confesses with his lips and so is saved. The scripture says, No one who believes in him will be put to shame. For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, the same Lord of all Lord is Lord of all and bestows his riches upon all who call upon him. For everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved. But how are men to call upon him? All right, the ghost, let's go down a little further. Um, all right, maybe it's just chapter 11. Yeah. I asked then, God, I asked then, has God rejected his people? By no means. I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin. God has not rejected his people for whom he foreknew. Do you not know that the scripture says of Elijah how he pleads with God against Israel? Lord, they have killed thy prophets, they have demolished thy altars, and I alone am left, I alone am left, and they seek my life. But what is God's reply to him? I have kept for myself 7,000 men who no longer are on the basis of works, otherwise grace would have not bowed the knee to Baal. To Baal. So to at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. For if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise, grace would no longer be grace. What then? Israel failed to obtain what is sought, the elect obtained it, but the rest were hardened, as it is written. God gave them to a spirit of stupor, eyes that eyes that should not see and ears that should not hear, down to this very day. And David says, Let their let their table become a snare and a trap, a pitfall and a retribution for them. Let their eyes be darkened so that they cannot see and bend their backs forever. So I asked, so I ask, have they stumbled so as to fall? By no means, but through their trespass, salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. Now, if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion mean? Now I am speaking to you, Gentiles, inasmuch then as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry in order to make my fellow Jews jealous, and thus save some of them. For if their rejection means reconciliation of the world, what would their acceptance mean but life of the from the dead? If the dough offered as the first fruits is holy, so is the whole lump, and if the root is holy, so are the branches. But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, a wild olive shoot, were grafted in their place, share the richness of the olive tree. Do not boast over the branches. This is where it goes. So pull it up. We read all that to get to this part. Yeah, I I sh yeah, you kind of got to do the preamble. So if you do, if you do boast, remember it is not you that this that support the root, but the root that supports you. You will say, Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in. That is true. They were broken off of because of their unbelief, but you stand fast only through faith. So do not become proud, but stand in awe. Like that right there, stand in awe of what God did. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness of the sovereignty of the severity of God, severity towards those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness, otherwise you too will be cut off. And even even the others, if they do not persist in their unbelief, will be grafted back in. For God has the power to graft them in again. For if you have been cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree and grafted contrary to nature into the cultivated olive tree, how much more will those natural branches be grafted back in? So then go go down and just see where Paul goes with this. Uh, scroll down, scroll down. I think it might be in 12. Um, like, okay, so here it is. Um let love be gentle, genuine. Hate what is eating. Like Paul's Paul's whole point in all of this. Like uh, you got the thing on there. I can't see it. There you go. Yeah, get that out of there. Um having the gifts that differ according to the grace, given us, let us all right. So if prophecy in proportion to our faith, like Paul goes into this whole doxology: let love be genuine, hate what is evil, hold fast to what is good, love one another with brotherly affection, outdo one another in showing honor, never flag in zeal, be aglow with the spirit, serve the Lord, rejoice in your hope, be patient in tribulation, be constant in prayer, contribute to the needs of the saints, practice hospitality, bless those who persecute you, bless and do not curse them, rejoice with those who rejoice, weep with those who who weep, live in harmony with one another, do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, never be conceited. Like all this stuff we're talking about, that's kind of the spirit you have to have. You have to have the spirit of awe in what God did in his plan. And even what's going on with the Jews right now, like it's all part of God's plan. And we should not sit back and be angry at them. It's like God has put a hardness on their heart, and it's part of his plan, and everything we're seeing. And I mean, I just think there's going to be this beautiful reunification at the end of time. I hope so. Look, I'm reading off the screen. I don't know. When I was reading that the other day, though, it was it was like make sure you don't get too proud. And because I see the way we talk about this topic, and it is a dangerous topic to talk about because you can very easily develop this pride against the Jews. And man, like you have to remember how how like how fortunate we are that God has given us the gift of faith.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:46

Yeah, I mean, uh just the way I am, and like with my temperament, like I know if I were to have been born uh you

SPEAKER_04 1:06:00

I would probably, you know, have the same hardness of heart and viciousness towards the Christian. Yeah. Like it really is. I mean, look at even all the people that you know were baptized and fall away from the faith. Like, faith is such a precious gift that you have to nurture constantly. Indeed.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:20

Yeah, for sure. And you know, the more you talk about it, uh when we first started talking about it, like I mean, we you know, we used the the name Amish and and all of it. And we wanted we wanted to be so careful, right? About how we brought up the subject, how we talked about it, the things we didn't want to talk about in regard to it. But as it be something becomes more and more familiar, like you know, that there's that saying, you know, familiarity breeds contempt. Yeah, and like as uh as you talk about something more and more and start to make more and more jokes, like, yeah, you it does you can become very flippant about it. And in it's a serious subject, you know, it's it's the the salvation of a whole people. Like that's that's about as serious of a subject as you can get. And I'm not gonna say I'm gonna stop making jokes because I don't know, I don't know if I'm capable of that, and you know that our goal has always been to keep things lighthearted, but uh we do have to be careful, right? Tonight, yeah, man. I don't dude.

Sedevacantism, Betrayal, And Online Rage

SPEAKER_04 1:07:26

I I'm like I get I get that I I that's why I always do like seeing it in the story because you kind of see this amazing thing God did, and then there is still a plan for the Jews in salvation history, and that's why yeah, I don't know. We just do have to be cautious. Um, so the tonight I I I all right, so originally Rob and I wanted to jump on, and we were probably gonna go in a very different direction with this show than we did when Wagner came on. What Wagner came on, and it's like he he has uh he has like um rose-colored glasses with the church, you know, he doesn't see the crisis the way we do. Like he like he he Saint Paul the Sixth is his favorite post-consiliary. We he was just trolling. I hope so, because we see him as the one who like destroyed everything, you know. It's just I I don't know. I think that's why he can't see the he doesn't see it the way I see it, is because of those those rose-colored glasses he has on. About this, it's it is interesting, but yeah, like I honestly tonight, I really wanted to get into the sets a lot, man, because I see this Judas spirit in the SEDs that is just dude, they are going to hand us over to the Sanhedrin. They have they are such a vile group, and and like recognizing them seeing how they are with Trump is such a crazy like you you see, they replace their daddy with Trump, and they dude, like they Trump could do the most evil stuff, and they just see it in political terms, and it's like they'll find some way to excuse that.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:19

But you know, if if someone uh tweets an excerpt from Pope a you know, a Pop Leo sermon on Poplio's Twitter, and you know, doesn't put in the full context talking about war and you know, just war and not just war, and they missed the part, you know, that clarifies it and stuff. It's like, oh wow, now he's a now he's a vile heretic while Trump is you know literally having the US pay for IVF treatment and killing.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:45

It's crazy it's crazy that the the things that'll excuse for Trump and they'll go, Well, he's not the Pope, but it's like dude, well, you don't think Leo's the Pope either, so what's it matter? But but really, it just goes to show you that they're not even trying, like they don't believe in in the king, the social kingship of Christ the King at all, they don't care about the social kingship of Christ, they can't they all they have is criticism for the novus ordo, they don't actually have any kind of solutions, anything. I watched uh Mario on Stephen Cox discussing the passion of the church, and I'm telling you, he doesn't in his mind he's like, Well, this can't be the passion of the church because the passion of the church can't happen to the novus or church, and it's like oh Mario Dirks he doesn't understand that the novus ordo is part of the passion itself, like come on, but Mario Dirksen, the passion isn't going exactly how Mario Dirksen thinks it's going to go, so in his mind, like he he will hand the novus orto over to be crucified because he sees it as a false church and he thinks it's a good thing for the for the novus orto to to die. Like the this is so much of why I've changed my tune on how we go about talking to talking about the hierarchy and stuff. Like, I'm not going to add my voice to that chorus and nitpick, and because nothing they do is medicinal, nothing, like everything they do is just punitive and poisonous, and they they it's why they hate even the SSPX. The SSPX holds almost the same exact position as them.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:24

They they they do not work to bring people to Catholicism, even their own version of Catholicism. They'd rather just just deconvert those tear down, it's deconstruction, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:36

100%, dude. The the reason they hate the SSPX is people are like, Why does why do they hate the SSPX so much? Because the SSPX grants legitimacy to the Novus Ordo. Yeah, they recognize the Pope, and that drives them crazy. That even though the SSPX, that's why like you can have a conversation with somebody from the SSPX. They you can see them there, you know, the they're not gonna they're not gonna flip out on a person who goes to diocesan Latin mass or something like that. Like they they see it as we're all in this crisis together, like a autistic online SSPX or my, but I've never like met an SSPX priest that would, you know, I mean, like, yeah, it's just there's something about once you separate yourself from communion with the Pope completely, you you you something in you snaps. And the stuff I'm watching with Chris Jackson, like Chris Chris Jackson to me, he like he is a Judas, like he is Jewish to me, he is a converso sent to destroy the church, he would sell you out in a second to the Sanhedrin. He does not care. It is it is I told you better.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:42

I told you that back in September.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:44

Yeah, but I well, like I know what I know what I'm I like keeping people at arm's length, and like I knew I knew where it was going to go, but he is he is like I the Mario Darkson sees like these guys, you have to understand what the SETI's are doing. They see the passion of the church, and they're like they have a Jewish mentality of what the church should be. They they read church councils the way the Jews read the old testament, and they have no like um they have no um no place for there to be any deviation from their interpretation of it. So it's like we're going to find out things over time, over time, things will be revealed. That's just how it works. You don't understand how something's unfolding until it's in hindsight. They just look at it and they go, it's not going exactly how I want. The way Judas saw Christ and said, This isn't the Messiah I want. So he sells them out to the Sanhedrin. And that's what these guys, these guys are going to be worse than any Jew. Like any any persecution that comes from the Jews or anything that comes from the Roman Empire, these guys are going to be the accuser that sells you out because they hate you. They don't just they they hate you more than they hate the Protestants. Like they have they have this visceral hate for any Catholic who loves tradition, first of all. Like, this is look, they hate the Pope more than they hate Paula White. Yeah, it's crazy. Like Chris Jackson posted the Paula White quote on Facebook comparing Jesus Trump to Jesus, and he posted it unironically. You're just like Jesus, you were arrested and falsely accused. Like, that's the quote he posted from Paula White on Facebook, unironically. That's a psychopath, like absolute, absolute psychopath. Okay. Um, and we we gotta talk about Nick's recent video too, because I I hate the way Nick put that video up. Like, I hate the clickbait garbage that Nick is doing.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:52

I don't even know what people. I mean, I I saw the the title, and you're right.

Creator Drama And Conference Optics

SPEAKER_04 1:14:57

Cavazzo's putting the clickbait garbage out, and I got like another dozen phone calls from people telling me, Oh, your boy's gonna leave the church, your boy's gonna leave the church. But in the last few minutes of that video, Nick says, I've come to the conclusion that I'm not going to be involved with radical traditionalism anymore because he's got he's had it with Trads. Like he's totally had it with Trads. And he's like, I've just been going to a Reverent Novus Ordo and just kind of like stop thinking it's my job to fix the church. And I kind of think that's a healthy attitude. So I hate the way he positioned the video and put it up, and I'm not crazy about the first 10 minutes of it, but the last five minutes, I actually think he he did okay. Like he's like, he's just he's like, I've just been going to a reverent novus ordo and working on personal holiness, and I've let go of this idea that it's my job to go and like restore the church to something, and I think that's actually a healthy attitude. Like, you're better off doing that than going to a Cenevacontist chapel. You're better off doing that. It's almost like he actually heard the advice I gave that episode when I think I heard his feelings, but I think he I think it might have settled in, and he maybe because look, it's the same thing with the Nick video. Nick Cavazzos, like cava, I mean uh Nick Fuentes, like Fuentes is a trad at heart, he just hates trads, and it's like kind of get it, man. Like the the the the the angry the anger and the trad spirit that we all have to be on guard for because I don't I don't I haven't had it with tradition. I love tradition, I love the traditional liturgy, I love the traditional doctrines of the church, but the trads like there's some there's something so angry about them that I just want to kind of distance myself from them. And we're mostly talking about like the the online online trad.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:55

Yeah, of course, not your local because I've never met a a trad in real life like that.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:00

Yeah, I'm talking about the online sphere, yeah. Like there's just a bitterness and an anger, and uh uh so quick to call like the the constant calling Pope Leo this and pointing out the sins of the church and and bringing more more more light to the scandals. It's like there was a time where I where I thought that was appropriate. I no longer think that. Yeah, uh Michelle says she didn't click on next video because it's way too much clickbait. That was um wait, what did Molly say? She said it takes serious it, it takes serious issue with the fact that he has to go to a novice order in order to work on his personal holiness. I think she's saying I take serious issue, probably. That's him making it about people and not the liturgy.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:46

I think she's right about that.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:48

Yeah, I think I think I don't think that's I I think that Nick, um, yeah, maybe maybe that's wrong.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:57

Yeah, it depends. It like it depends if he's just able to make it to like daily mass more often if he goes to you know the the super local novus ordo instead of driving the TLM. Like it depends why he's why he specified he's going to uh a reverend novus orto.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:15

Yeah, yeah. I don't I don't know if I I caught it properly. Somebody said I'm getting soft. I'm not getting soft. It's that like I actually believe the stuff I tell you guys. Like I don't I don't just make stuff up, I actually believe the stuff I tell you guys, and I think that where we are, I think it's very important to not to not think you have all the answers, to not be super prideful. Like, I think uh a humility of spirit is very important right now. And like I'm I don't ever want to lose my faith because I think I know everything. And like being being open to being wrong, being open to not understanding everything is important. These guys, they all make fun of me and they say Anthony's a uh a self-admitted that he doesn't know anything.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:06

It's like not that I don't know anything, it's that better than being wrong about thinking you know everything.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:12

Yeah, I'd I just the things that I'm seeing happening in the world and in the church, I think they're very serious things, and I think that we need we are going to need each other a lot, and I'm not I'm not looking to cull that group to the smallest group possible. I want to I want to be able to have all people of good will who believe the Catholic faith know that like you're a you're I'm not judging you if you go to a different liturgy than me. If like if that if that's where you if that's where you're at, like going to the Latin mass should not make you think you're better than anybody, it should have the opposite effect.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:56

Um I was wrong, was but I was mistaken.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:05

Um I hate myself for listening to the video, but I found it irritating. I don't think anyone who's struggling with any sort of crisis of space should be discussing it on. Look, I will say right off the bat, I I think Nick needs to get off social media. Like out of love, I like I I wish he was open to hearing me, but like he needs to get off social media.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:25

He thinks it's his it's his uh meal ticket, man. He's it's he's n uh man. He's got a daily political show now that gets 200 views.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:35

I love Nick, and I think for his own for his own soul, he needs to get off social media. Like he's not cut out for this. It's not it's not good for him. Um it almost seems to me like he got began going back to his old ways prior to converting because of nostalgia uh and because of the hurt. The way he talks now is almost like a solo scriptor of prod. And and not just that, like the the overly pious stuff and the thinking you're you're holier than the other Catholics in the pews, that's the kind of stuff I'm talking about, right? And like anybody who has had any kind of grace in their lives that God helped them get over a sin, like you should never look at it like, well, I overcame it. You should look at it like, God, thank you for getting this sin out of my life. Like you, you you didn't do it on your own. So to sit there and thumb your nose at those Catholics who were mired in sin, it's like, man, and especially and he made a comment about the Catholics using the revolving door. That's like these these sometimes I think autistic Thomas they read Saint Alphonsus, and they like it's like they have no charity towards people who are struggling with sin. And especially in our day and age, man, some some some of these sins are very hard for people to get over, and you gotta have charity towards people. Oh, you're posting the Chris Jackson memes.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:05

I just want to know why the heck did he make me look like Kyle Whittington? That's what upset me the most.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:13

Chris Jackson is such a clown, such an utter clown. All these guys, all these sets. I used to think like, oh, I'd never want to get in a debate with them because they'll do because like you you think like they know everything about church council, they're all idiots, like they're none of them are smart. None of them are smart, they have a few things from a counselor to memorize, like none of them have any, none of them have any insights, none of them have any answers for how we get out of this mess. All they have is criticism and poison for the church. That's all they have.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:45

They can't even get along with each other.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:48

Yeah, dude, they hate each other. You see, like the whole thing going on between like the Bishop Stanborn's group and the other group.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:55

I'm just like, you guys are some of them are like, Can't we just meet and have like eat a meal and talk? And the others are like, No, I hate you.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:04

The other LARPers are like, we're gonna get the traditional clergy to call a council and they're gonna elect the pope. It's like shut up, you guys. You guys LARP at Catholicism. None of you, none of you are Catholic, none of you are really Catholic. First of all, none of you even live traditional Catholic lives. I know it. None of you even believe the traditional Catholic dogma. All you know is the novice order was wrong, and you this can't be the Pope. Like, none of you dude. I've I know trads who who talk a big game, none of them fast on Fridays, none of them, none of them abstain from meat on Fridays. They they're idealists who think a certain way, but they don't live it. None of these guys live it. You think these guys are praying daily rosaries and do like get get out of here. You there's nobody that has a relationship with our lady and talks like those guys. Yeah, absolutely. Let's pray for Nick. I like I love Nick like a little brother. I just I for I know for his own sake he needs to get offline. Like he really does. He needs to he needs to get offline. He's not he's not cut out for social media, he doesn't handle criticism well. Um, and he's too much with the with the clickbait stuff. And unfortunately, I'm not in a close enough relationship with him right now that I think he would take the advice from me from a place of love. I think he would take it harshly, but it would be coming from a place of love. Like, I love him enough that I want him to get off social media. I think he he should just find a different career. Like, there's not even any money in this stuff. No, there's no money in this stuff. I don't know why guys want to even get into this.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:45

It's it's honestly really annoying. Like, the vast majority of the stuff you have to do for this stuff is tedious.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:55

It's tedious, it's a lot of work, and there's a little payoff, like it's not a lot of payoff, and the and in order to make money, you have to develop a real community of people that really like you. And like, I'm looking at some of the other creators right now, and I'm like, ooh, they're not doing too well. You can tell. You could just tell, like, first off, YouTube cut cut cut everything in half. Like, you don't make what you used to make on YouTube, everything's cut in half on YouTube. So the only way you make money is if you have some kind of after show, and the guys that don't have an engaging after show don't have a big audience going to it.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:38

Um, yeah, that and every you know, every single platform takes a third of what you make. Yeah. I mean, unless hold on, I have an idea. What if we paid the Calvinist lots of money to make a platform we could say is professional?

SPEAKER_04 1:25:59

Those guys are in trouble, man. Those guys are in serious trouble. I feel bad for them too, man. Like Kennedy and Kwaznsky, those guys they are in deep trouble. Like, you don't see their stuff anywhere. There's absolutely no promotion of their stuff. This whole fiasco's been going on the past couple days, and Dr. Kwaznski's still talking about the liturgy. Yeah, like that no none of them are mentioning it at all. Like, they don't, I don't know what those guys are doing, man. Like, there's no possible way that that outfit survives, man. I don't even hear about Pelican at all, anywhere. Like, I don't even hear about them. Once in a blue, I'll see a tweet here and there.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:44

Like, I don't know, man. I can't see how those guys last to the end of the year. Yeah. I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:56

And I'm not saying that from a place of like, I want them to fail. Like, I don't want them to fail. I want them to succeed. I feel like I feel bad for the guys that like put all their eggs in that basket. Like when they wanted me and Rob to go there, I was like, uh I was like, like what we would have wound up doing is giving them access to our locals, and all our locals' money would have gone over there, and we would have we would have lost everything. Yeah, it would we would have lost everything because you would have been it would have been a nightmare to try and get it back from them.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:28

Well, if if they wouldn't let us promote on YouTube, which seems to be what's happening, um, we wouldn't have grown from what 50,000 to 80,000 subs.

SPEAKER_04 1:27:42

And yeah, it seems like those guys are not allowed to post on YouTube. Like, that is the most insane media strategy I've ever seen. Like, I haven't seen a Kennedy Hall YouTube video in months, especially when we were when we were there talking with them we're you know looking at the the plan it's like there's no money for advertising right or marketing so you know you and I brought up well how how are we gonna grow this and they're like oh you you'll still just you know we'll we'll use your youtube's and your twitters and just post everything there to drive engagement where what happened with that the the plan was for us to continue the YouTube show and just move the locals portion over there yeah but like none of them are doing that none of them are doing like a YouTube side and then a pelican side and that is the only way it works like I don't hear from any of those guys anymore freaking Tim Flanders for uh one peter five does audio only on YouTube stuff like it's like Eric Sammons must have wanted one peter five to just crash and burn like how how does he have Tim Flanders there I don't know I don't understand the meaning of Catholic is dead but one peter five was a profitable like Eric I think they bought it for like a quarter million bro he spent a quarter million crisis crisis bought right bought one peter five for like 250 grand and then he put Tim Flanders in charge of it and the thing is I don't know what's going on with I don't know what's going on with the magazine side but the podcast had like Steve built up like 18,000 subs when we were back at like 2000. Yeah like that that podcast could have been molded into something and like it should have been something and I don't know what the hell they're doing man. Eric salmons too like I don't know I don't I don't know what I don't know what these guys are doing. I've had Eric muted on Twitter for once I don't I don't know what's going on with that he messaged me the other day and asked me um he's like uh just just a just a question um because I know you don't believe we landed on the moon he's like what do you think of the Artemis II mission I was like to be honest I haven't really thought about it much like at all I I don't know I do think our technology today is probably way more capable of it what than it was back in the 60s um but I just you know it's a lot and it's a lot different to say we had a man mission fly around the moon than to say we landed on the moon and then got back up to the spaceship like it's a very big difference you know I don't you know but our technology today is way more advanced than it was back then but I really just haven't thought about it much and like it's like if it happened like she and I I do think it happened like yeah that's cool doesn't really mean mean anything doesn't matter right it's not making uh anything better here on earth so who cares yeah I I just haven't thought about it much I don't know like I don't know you know what it is they lie to us so much I don't even I don't know like the the the pictures were like oh cool the earth like don't we have pictures of the earth already I don't know like sorry Eric I guess I'm more concerned if uh I'm gonna be able to put diesel in the new van I just bought you know depending on if they let it through the Strait of Hormuz or not yeah Eric and even the like Eric's even his Israel stance man it's just like so generic and uh coming from like the uh the independent uh freaking what is it uh what's his political philosophy libertarian a libertarian it's just like a libertarian take on Israel it's like oh I oppose the government of Israel but he doesn't get into anything of substance with it.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:37

Eric Sammons has never met a milk toast take he did it absolutely right and I don't delete the guy we didn't talk about the Trent the counselor Trent summit oh my gosh dude wait a minute you gotta bring this picture up pull up Trent's picture of that summit oh oh okay I I I was gonna because uh you sent it to the me Jason and Mark right or someone sent it to that and I zoomed in I'm like is this Eric Sammons in the background dude but all of the people there like it's embarrassing um I thought I had it saved but I don't um just look up Trent's Trent's thing trying I try not to pull up his Twitter Trent Horn uh I talked with Joe Heshmeyer the other day you did huh he took all oh it's on the it's not it's on the council maybe it's on the council of Trent one counts council um okay I got it well okay I do got the picture pull up like the the main picture with yeah I I didn't know if like me and Joe were on like speaking terms.

Listener Message, Locals, And Wrap-Up

SPEAKER_04 1:33:02

Yeah but I said did he message you or do you miss no I messaged him and I was just like Joe we uh we reviewed a little bit of your uh Doug Wilson debate I was like you you killed it man you're you're a king he did kill it he really did and uh he just messaged back he was like oh thank you so much man he said uh thanks man I really appreciate that but I just want to make sure like I don't know if I'm on speaking terms with him you know like with him you are with Trent probably not I don't know why I mean uh whatever but no so like zoom out and this is like no uh the with Trent in the front with like all his minions in the back and it's like I love how they put poor short Keith right in the middle behind him. Oh that poor guy wait I put out um I put out a subscriber only tweet yeah I don't even get to see those well uh this is what I wrote uh there are many people in this photo that I like but this whole optic is weird the same optic as their promo material trend out front front and center like a cult leader with all his little influencers behind them like are you sure there was a subscriber only tweet because I did see that tweet did you yes oh no yeah I saw that tweet I guess they previewed that dude it is it is a bad look I don't know man it's just all all the little like acceptable influences hold on behind them is that Eric McCabe right there it is is it oh my goodness I think that's Eric McCabe yeah I think so you got William Albrecht there and Gideon yeah Keith uh there's uh Sachin Joe yeah Satchin Jose Sachin Rose or whatever his name talk about an aggregator that's probably gonna get demonetized on Twitter you think so I don't know is that I don't know I think the aggregating is like people that just get that steal videos from other people like he just usually just he posts like pop culture Catholicism stuff I love that I'm pretty sure this is Franco I thought I was gonna say voice of reason I'm back there I think that's Franco oh man I like I like a lot of the guys here I just this almost looks like Eric's he looks miserable doesn't that is that salmon's yeah salmon's oh he was actually there yeah for sure that's salmon's uh next to next to Trent's wife man that just I don't know man that crowd like I wonder I wonder how people would react if we showed up there I think they'd be I think they'd be cool with us yeah I think they'd all be cool with us and rose is one of the worst accounts he never gives credit or posts links to the stories under poser savage looks dazed yeah I don't know man I don't know what like it's weird because he had a couple of speakers there but then all the other influencers just like went there to be seen is it just me or this room doesn't look very big does it he said there was 700 people there. Okay there was 700 people there but dude when they do a conference they're allowed to do it in a parish like they get they get the parish for like 300 400 bucks and then they can make the ticket prices affordable you know I'd rather go to a church militant reunion you know it would be more interesting for many reasons oh man a church militant reunion no I think that was Franco in the back not to be mean no somebody pointed out somebody bring it back up somebody pointed out that William Albrecht was wearing a black suit with brown shoes they were roasting him look at look at all break with his black suit and brown shoes they were they were roasting him I like how this guy's just ready to like jump off the stage or something like I don't know who half of them are I don't either but all right um all right so I won't be here on Thursday are you gonna do something with uh yeah I'm gonna talk with Ryan if he if he doesn't or can't maybe I don't know figure something out uh Matt Gasper's going to battle with the Setes um so he you said Gasper actually knows Chris Jackson yeah he met him once at the CIC um so listen this guy just seems seems like he came out of nowhere John Salza uh you know salza does all the anti-SSPX debates and stuff he he said this about Cede's he said in the face of this tremendous crisis and having lost faith in the church set of vilify the church with diabolical fervor while liberals and modernists attack the church from within Sede's attack the church from the church their mother from without they expose the wounds of the church not so they can be dressed and healed but in order to mock ridicule and discredit the church their criticism which in many cases are objectively justified are not medicinal in nature but poisonous they end by becoming the enemies of the church just as the unbelieving Jews who claim to believe in the Old Testament revelation were the enemies of Christ like that is exactly what so wild that that's exactly how I have seen it and I never read that quote that is the exact impression that I get from said that I see this Judas spirit in them that they don't like the way the passion of the church looks so they're gonna sell the messiah out what is what is Ryan saying here was a former SSPX at one time I think okay so that's right Ryan wants to talk about the fall of Constantinople oh that'll be fun if you get a word in I'm hoping I can just like cruise hand it over to him let him cruise Ryan loved that he wants a show where he could just go um that'll be good it'd be something educational and then when I come back next Tuesday uh yeah I'm not I don't I'm not a fan of salsa just let's be clear I'm not a fan of salsa but that quote is interesting yeah Ryan Grant's coming on Thursday yeah Rob wants to be Rob Rob doesn't want to have to like lead the thing no no no no um and then who knows what Trump will do while I'm away next Thursday should be interesting though oh yeah oh man so listen to this uh did I text that to you oh let me pull that up listen to this this is amazing uh hold on I don't want to show everyone my email but I want to show everyone my text to you so I'm gonna I'm gonna skip the first portion where he talks about money yeah yeah yeah so so the the the lobster company Nick from shoplobster Nick from shop lobster I believe in the mission of the show and quite frankly you guys kept me from leaving the church for orthodoxy I had stopped attending mass and was going to a Greek Orthodox church for about five months last year but I still tuned into the show here and there. Eventually the frequent talks on the show about the crisis in the church and how it relates to eschatology convinced me to come back. I know I'm not the only one God clearly works through you uh Anthony Father Maudsley and Joshua Charles to keep people in the church at a time when the instinct of many is to flee Rome for greener pastures. I meant to add in there you guys kept me from formally leaving the church I came back to the church about a month before I was going to be current and received into the Orthodox Church. I had even even had new saints name picked out to take on I had gone through with uh had I gone through with that I would have had to formally renounce the Catholic church so he's gonna come on next Thursday and tell us his story. So um how freaking awesome so I like I know I know you guys think I'm dooming and stuff but really the goal was always to give a theological framework to understand the crisis and not to put a time frame on it. It's not that we think like the world ends next year or something. It's this is the passion of the church and to explain what the passion of the church is is to understand it it involves the Jews it involves all this stuff. We don't know how long it's going to take it's been going on for 70 years. Let's pray it's another 70 and that our children's children have a chance to see the restoration but it that is this the theological framework to understand what's going on right now.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:26

Majorian you're late we did the whole show talking about him he's just showing up now I guess so so local yeah so next Thursday he's gonna come on he's gonna come on locals we'll we'll do our regular Thursday show on YouTube and then he's gonna come on at nine o'clock and we'll hear his show on locals and after he tells his story if he feels comfortable on it with it we'll we'll release it on YouTube after so somebody asked to read uh tips chats here on locals so um I can't show him on screen unfortunately but I'll read so from Troubadour photo um I have serious issues with both Pope Leo and Trump both of whom I was initially supportive in my opinion neither are the Antichrist but both um both are in different ways doing damage Trump to the country and global geopolitics Leo to the church faith things will get much worse and soon on all fronts hundred percent agree yeah don't mistake what we're doing for Pope's plain like I don't I'm not I'm not raving about Pope Leo I think Leo is what we've always said he is but I'm not going to take Trump's side in something generic like we should take have peace and dialogue.

SPEAKER_04 1:43:41

Yeah like it I'm just not going to I'm also not gonna say what Leo did at the mosque today was a good thing. Like it's just you know he is what he is I I but understanding that and understand this is why like I I you know Sede Picante put together a clip of me saying I'm not I wasn't scandalized by the Pachamama stuff but he's taking that out of context I'm not scandalized by anything these guys do anymore because I won't let them scandalize my faith they will not be a stumbling block to my faith in Jesus Christ and his plan for salvation. Plus it's 2026 yeah how are we not used to this yeah like this has been going on forever it's been it's been going on for our lifetimes as Catholics so I'm not I those men don't scandalize me anymore none of them can can can separate me from the love of Christ none of them they can do whatever they want and they will not separate me from my faith in the Jesus Christ and the church like I was born in 88 been a you know Catholic my whole life like I have literally not lived in a Catholic church that existed before uh the stupid Assisi things with JP2. Yeah like I'm not gonna let Leo walking through a mosque or destroy my faith yeah I'm not and I'm not gonna obsess on it anymore either I don't like just these guys are what they are they're the Sanhedrin like that's what they are and and when once you grasp that and then what you do is you go God I don't know exactly what you're doing right now but I trust that you know exactly what's happening and that all of this is going to work for your greater glory. That's it like all things work for good to those who trust in God. Like that's as simple as that all things work for good. Let's see we got uh we got one more um if uh this is from Chris man guy if Trump is anything he's the chaos agent that kicks off trouble the antichrist comes and fix things yep you know after people um backlash to the Trump era that's kind of what I think I think Trump's gonna try to extend his term he's gonna pull this Nero crap and it's gonna last years ahead he's gonna be that chaos agent and then there's gonna be somebody that comes and claims to bring peace and unity and that guy just got an email from Nick from shoplobster he actually has a zoom meeting with the founders uh he has a he has a meeting that evening um and then he has that Friday so he wants you want to do Tuesday night he's asking for uh times available in May I mean if he can't do we can either do Tuesday night or just any i don't we have nothing planned so any any night in okay I'll ask him I'll I'll text the email tomorrow. Yeah I'd love to I'd love to hear his story and um it's it's I like it's comforting for Rob and I to hear stuff like that too. You know and like even even though Rob's contrarian sometimes like Rob it's kind of like a role he plays but like he he's working in the same framework as I am too it's just he may not you and I actually agree a lot more on it than it probably seems like we do. Yeah he's just he kind of has to push back and you know he's he's being the the the foil but I mean this is kind of the framework that we're working with and we kind of see it the same way I just am a little more apocalyptic than Rob Rob thinks that you know this is this is a chastisement and something comes after I think it's more the end you know but still the same framework sometimes only on days ending in why all right all right we're gonna wrap this one up I uh I gotta get my my stuff together you got it back for your fancy Cayman vacation my in-laws are taking us away my in-laws taking me and my me and my wife just me and my wife not the kids mean while next month I get a drive 60 hours round trip to Florida with my four kids in a vehicle dude that is a long ride it's gonna be a lot better in this new vehicle than it would have been we we wouldn't we used to drive to Florida all the time and it's a 24 hour drive from New York yeah it's we did it every year it's gonna be about 30 hours one way for yeah you do do it in two days you you you make a pit stop uh we're gonna try to go all the way you're not doing we did it once before 30 hours straight's ruthless yeah so all right let's wrap this up we'll see you guys