A Slice of Bread and Butter
The voice of The Bread and Butter Thing - with stories from the frontline of the cost of living crisis from one of the UK's leading food charities.
A Slice of Bread and Butter
A Slice of Life Special: “I lived off beans so my son could eat” says Carer James
As part of our Slice of Life campaign and our mission to make life more affordable for working families, this week’s episode focuses on James. James is a support worker and devoted young dad doing everything he can to make sure his little boy is well fed, “I’ve lived off beans for two days to make sure my son eats properly”. Even with two incomes and careful budgeting, James and his partner still find themselves struggling to cover the basics. A situation common for so many of our members at the moment. Join Mark and Vic as they chat about what poverty looks like today, being under constant financial pressure, the juggle of work, expensive childcare and trying to stay afloat.
Welcome back to A Slice of Bread and Butter with Mark and Vic from the Bread and Butter Thing. We're a charity that delivers affordable food to the heart of struggling neighbourhoods, to help nourish communities and act as a catalyst for change.
Speaker 2:We provide access to a nutritious, affordable range of food, which means our members can save money on their shopping, feed their families healthily, as well as access other support to right in the heart of their communities.
Speaker 1:And this is where we share a slice of life of somebody involved in bread and butter and hear how they connect with us, and this week, am I right in thinking it was James?
Speaker 2:It is, and living legend, one of our carers.
Speaker 3:And let's have a listen to james my name is james, I'm 26, I'm a support worker and, yeah, that's pretty much it. Supporting adults with disabilities and autism who don't have capacity to meet their own needs and to do daily activities, have exceptional medications, so I support them with that in a team and it's really good. Yeah, really good job.
Speaker 2:And is that something you've been doing long?
Speaker 3:yeah, it's my ninth year now. As soon as I left college, I did health and social care, so I knew I loved supporting people, how I struggled myself with the diagnosis of autism as well and dyslexia in school, so I did know a lot about it anyway.
Speaker 2:So I guess you were part of the caring community then during COVID. How was that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was difficult but you definitely bring the best out of people and, I think, the connection and the team. We had a big team back then. You were just bonded and you worked 14, 15 hours every day for weeks and weeks and weeks and it was hard but we got through it and yeah it was good.
Speaker 2:Tell me a bit about life in general for you. Then, james, you can obviously tell me. If you don't want to answer any questions, but tell me about home life, family, where you live, and tell us about how you got involved with bread and butter as well so, yeah, born in cheshire, I had a difficult childhood, I'd say in a few parts, um, and as we all do, and bad experiences and stuff.
Speaker 3:And during the beginning of the covid moved out of my parents, moved with my partner and crew cheshire and yeah, and we both both did the same job. So that was great. We've got a young child, four-year-old, who's doing fantastically well. I'm just a, yeah, young lads were quite athletic before covid and since covid stopped and but trying to get back up back out there on runs and stuff. So I love running, my sports.
Speaker 3:And then bread and butter was just out of nowhere. I think it came off the crew facebook community group. I just said, look, next week, uh, this charity bread and butter thing it started. They'd come into the academy and obviously at that time that's when prices obviously skyrocketed and it was ridiculous. Yeah, with a child and partner who works part time and I work a job who doesn't pay that much. So, as everyone, we struggled to get by. I think as soon as I started using bread and butter it just changed. It was brilliant and it helped so much. We don't use it as much we used to. We normally about once a month when times are getting a bit tough near the end, but it helps a lot. Yeah, I can't say how much?
Speaker 2:don't worry, we're not looking for a promo, but it's you, you and your partner both working, both holding down the job and still struggling to get by. That that's what we just hear all the time as well yeah, it is ridiculous.
Speaker 3:It is even during covid, my partner. She struggles herself and mental health and she wasn't able to work that much and we were able to to cope and, like you said, it's skyrocketed and you just can't cope. Now you have to work, all of you have to work endless hours. We barely see each other as a couple. We barely get around as a family because every day I'm off, she's working, every day she's off, I'm working. You know, and that's how it is. Is that because of child care, james? Yeah, child care, just getting every shift, every hours that you possibly can, you know, in care, as you know, doesn't pay much at all. You get free childcare for 30 hours and then you've got to pay if you want extra hours. You've got to pay hundreds and hundreds on top of that to have him in all day, you know, until six or whatever it is.
Speaker 2:It sounds really tough. Actually Sounds like you're just passing ships. You don't really see much of each other.
Speaker 3:No, we don't really see much of each other. No, don't see each other, don't? You know? Don't go out. This saturday's the first time we're actually going to go out, for it, I have to say, about four years three years.
Speaker 2:I normally ask what do you think is a luxury nowadays that you used to see as an everyday thing?
Speaker 3:but given how young you are and how covid's hitting everything, it doesn't sound like it's a relevant question for you guys yeah, I mean luxury in terms of you know you're paying for, or let's go for a nice meal together as a family, or let's go for a nice day trip to the zoo, or you know, and you're looking at about 40 quid, and it's either that or prioritizing eating for the next two weeks. You know holidays you can't do a holiday. Or you know I've got petrol, or I've got to feed my child. What do I do? Oh, I'm obviously going to feed my child. No petrol for the next week. It gets that difficult.
Speaker 2:It's dreadful, it really is what's the biggest stress, you'd say or cost, in your lives at the moment?
Speaker 3:um apart from debt. I was silly at one point and then I had to grow up very quickly, obviously, when I moved out. In order to do that, I had to get a credit card, as you always do, as everyone eventually sometimes does silly enough to get to, and it got ridiculous in a ridiculous amount. So that's one of them. That's probably the biggest one. So you're still paying those down, yeah, still paying that. I got a loan, so I'm paying the loan back, which is quite a big low. But the other big cost is a car, gas and electric council tax now just gone up and rents has just gone up. So they're the main things, I think. Food obviously I try and try and do put that in a pot savings, but I've had to dip into that sometimes do you know how much you normally try and have for food each month?
Speaker 3:yeah, I'm very part of my autumn. I'm very, very routine, very set, very. I need to work it all out and it's finished.
Speaker 2:You would hate me. I'm the polar opposite, oh yeah I'm organized.
Speaker 3:I work it all out every month before I get paid and how much I get paid and how much is left over, etc. Uh, food, my pot has gone down. It used to be. I used to put away 200 pound a month for food. That's one of the luxuries I used to have. A good, it's a good tesco and aster and you know, do a nice big spend 40, 50, 60 pound for a week or two and, yeah, I had money left over. I can't do that anymore. That you know. I can't afford. Just 140 pound a month for all of us, for the three of you. Yeah, it's tough, it's tough. I've got, I think, about £50 left and I've got three weeks left.
Speaker 2:It gets that tight, so it's just about £1.55 each per day, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not much, you know, and sometimes you like to have a takeaway, so obviously you've got to take that out of your niceties money, as you say. So you've got a nice pocket as well. Not really. This can be ranged between 50 to 100-ish, and that's a month.
Speaker 2:Is it the debt that's changed, or have your circumstances changed?
Speaker 3:Circumstances, yeah, bills, like I said, food All of it added together is so much more than what it used to be. Yeah, my bills has gone up from about 800 a month all together. That's everything included. Food, whatever it is before, just before covid and now he's up to 1300 pound. That soon goes, you know, after a week or two. If you just wanted to live a little bit or you wanted to give your son something or buy clothes that he needs or shoes you know he's growing up quick, yeah, and that all comes out in a nice pot, does it? It all comes out the nice pot and then you're left with the food pot, left with three weeks left. As fair. You're like I've got to use some of that for to fit something, to buy something, you know, and it it goes down so quick we're just scraping by and it's. That's not good.
Speaker 2:Not good you're doing 50, 60 hour weeks, your partner's doing the best at 25 hours a week. I think a lot of people will be really shocked to hear how little money you've got because you're doing all the right things, right yeah we've had to cut, like I said, loads of 90s, loads of things that we just would like to enjoy.
Speaker 3:Go out for a meal once you can have a takeaway, maybe once every two weeks, you know. Go to the zoo, or go to a nice day out together or a holiday. You know, this summer we've got a holiday coming up and we've planned it, we've saved for it for so long and we finally got it coming up. So that's, you know, first holiday in four or five years.
Speaker 2:When I've talked to other people your age, james, some have had help from the bank. Mum and dad, I'm guessing you guys don't. Don't get me wrong.
Speaker 3:I have, of course I have. You know, it's either that or it's a debt with a credit card. It's a debt with something. You know. The car broke down a few weeks ago. My dad helped with that. I pay him back, obviously, and for me to ask that, and that means that I've not managed to deal with it or I've not managed to prioritize I get that.
Speaker 2:It's uncomfortable, right? Yeah, you want.
Speaker 3:You want to stand on your own two feet all my bills are paid for like, but that means some months we're not going to eat properly or I'll eat one meal a day because I've had to give you know, I've lived off of beans kind of bloody beans for two days to make sure my son eats properly when you do that sort of thing, do you think he's aware, or is your partner aware and is she okay with it?
Speaker 2:she's aware.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't think she understood completely what situation we were in, how things have gone up that much and how much we were struggling until that situation happened. Well, like I said, I have lived on a can of beans.
Speaker 2:What do you see going forward then, James?
Speaker 3:You know we can't stop, basically because we'll be on the streets. Yeah, I get that. Things are better. I've not lived on a tin of beans for two days, so things have improved slightly in the way that I got a new job. My partner has got a little bit more hours, we're a little bit better in in prioritizing what we actually need, and so things are a bit better.
Speaker 2:Things are a little bit better james, I'm gonna ask you a question, and I don't know whether you'll have even ever thought about it, because I don't think people do. I can hear how hard you're working and I hold you up genuinely on the highest pedestal because you're bloody amazing at what you're doing. Just to keep going, but do you consider yourself poor?
Speaker 3:well, first of all, I appreciate that. That's. That's lovely of you to say, um, yeah, I do. Yeah, you know you could be. I could be earning 35 000 a year. Do, yeah, you know you could be? I could be earning like 35 000 a year before tax and still be considered poor now a few years ago. If you're in 35 000, not bad, is it? That's, you know, just above average really. Yeah, I do consider us poor, even with my partner working. If she worked full time, we then have to pay for them extra hours for my son to be in nursery would still be worse off than we are now, and that's a false economy, right? Yeah? So, yeah, I, I consider we are for. Yeah, obviously, I appreciate we are not as bad as anyone. It's just like autism.
Speaker 2:Right it's on a spectral, 100%.
Speaker 3:Exactly, that's a great way of putting it actually. So I do, yeah, on the borderline, I think we're better, we're doing better. Like I said, things are looking up slowly, very slowly, but, yeah, things are better. So that's the most important thing really okay, um, let's get it out there clearly carers, hard working, long hours, underpaid yeah, no one could disagree with that.
Speaker 2:I don't know what made me ask james whether he thought he was poor or not, but the conversation was going that way because everything that James was saying to me just made me feel like him and his partner were trying so hard and I just didn't know whether they actually thought that they were doing well or not.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I just feel for the guy, I feel for all of them because they're struggling and I hope the struggle came through because it's a classic of somebody working so hard and yet just running faster and faster to stand still.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, james came across as a real dude, not only for the job that he's doing and the fact that they did it through COVID and they kept the world going, didn't they? They did they kept the world going, didn't they? They did, working so hard in work, but then also financially, to keep the head above water.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it must be tough to um keep us upbeat and forward looking isn't he amazing just how positive he is when we're talking about the budget? I loved his nice budget. He had a nice time budget which was was great, but it quickly eroded.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, because that was the bit that was really the contingency plan. That was the buffer for life, wasn't it? And if life was going brilliantly, oh look, we might be able to get a takeaway. But how often does everything, you know, do you not get that unexpected bill? Or the kids need new shoes or new clothes, or it's constant, isn it?
Speaker 2:it is, and it's a really interesting one, isn't it? Shall I do the curveball already, because I normally leave it till a bit later, but what do we think being put means nowadays? Because it's really complicated and difficult to see, isn't it?
Speaker 1:yeah, it is because james was a little bit shocked when you asked him that and he had to think about it like, oh, let me consider this. And many of our members will always say, oh, there's someone worse off than me, my life's not as bad as somebody else's, I'm actually okay. It's tough week in and week out and you're constantly thinking about money like it's at the forefront of James's mind. He knows how much all the bills cost. He's constantly thinking do I have to take that bit of money out of my nice time pot?
Speaker 2:do you think it's um appropriate to say there's like a spectrum of poverty?
Speaker 1:yeah, I think, I think so.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:We support people that aren't in crisis, but then there's also people in crisis, so there's a range, isn't there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, Never know, because when you're chatting to people like James, you kind of come up with things that just pop out of your head and you're just like, oh, is that the right thing to say? I think there is a spectrum and it's definitely more than just people that are feeling insecure and people in crisis. It's such an array because, like you were saying about our members, they'll always be able to tell you somebody worse off than them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it wouldn't be fair, like our members don't like being put in a box.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:So it's not fair to say, oh, if you've got this much money or this much disposable income, because we don't understand people's situation. Everyone's completely different. And you look at the spring budget statement that came out, what does that mean to anybody Like? Does anyone have a clue where that makes them be financially? I don't think so.
Speaker 2:No, I don't think so either. I don't think so at all, because it was definitely opaque, I couldn't see through it and again, you've got to wait for the detail to follow yeah, but it's got to go through parliament as well yeah so there's going to be lots of debate about it.
Speaker 1:So it's just more uncertainty, isn't it, and more everybody thinking about money at the front of their mind constantly yeah, I think this, being poor and the spectrum is a really interesting space.
Speaker 2:Talking to James about not being able to afford what used to be normal life. Yeah, holidays was a toughie for him.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think they've got a holiday book for later in the year though.
Speaker 2:They do.
Speaker 1:That was really exciting to hear.
Speaker 2:It was lovely to hear, wasn't it? Yeah, but it's tricky that so many of these things are so far out of reach. Yes, and yet there will be people that will say, but they've still got a phone right and they've still got a computer or something it's like. Well, you can't actually operate and function your life, admin, nowadays without both of those things. Really, Absolutely.
Speaker 1:A phone is 100% essential. Yeah, and nobody has a landline anymore, so really it's just a swap. Yeah, but everything's digital and to apply for all of your benefits you need a government gateway. Yeah thing, yeah, that stresses me out, the government gateway. So you've got to do that on a phone, or you go into the library to use the computer or something. And who has time for that and where is the local library?
Speaker 2:yep, and then lastly I guess james was going on about his partner she tried working full-time and putting their son in child care, but it didn't add up.
Speaker 1:It was too expensive the child care thing is really something that needs fixing, because there's free child care spaces but they're not well, he mentioned those, didn't he, james?
Speaker 2:he said they did use them, but then you've got to pay for the rest yeah, they don't cover it all and they're only term time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what do you do in the holidays when you've got a job, because I don't know many employers that other than schools. I guess that will allow people to be term time no, no, not at all so it's not a proper fix, is it?
Speaker 2:no, and I guess that, looking at it, there's two sides to that coin, isn't it? Is it that his partner's not being paid enough, or is it that the support is not enough, or is it somewhere in the middle?
Speaker 1:Absolutely both. I would say yeah, yeah, and we see it, because we uplift the holiday activity food program. We did it last year through Comet Relief funding and then we're doing it again this year and we provide spaces for people that wouldn't ordinarily be eligible, and many of those is parents that are saying I can't afford child care. My child has to come and get this provision, and if they don't, I'm going to lose my job. So if you'd like to know more about the bread and butter thing and what we get up to, you can find us at team tbbt, on instagram, tiktok, twitter, linkedin or online at breadandbutterthingorg vick harper.
Speaker 2:I'm impressed, I did it and did the tiktok thing, and if you have any feedback or thoughts on the podcast or you'd like to be a guest, just come and have a natter. Drop us an email at podcast at breadandbutterthingorg.
Speaker 1:Lastly, we're always open to new members at all of our hubs. If you or someone you know would benefit from our affordable food scheme, you can find your nearest hub on the Become a Member page of our website.
Speaker 2:And please do all of those things that podcasts ask you to Like us, subscribe, leave us a review, share us with your friends and chat about us on social that nearly was take us to the zoo. That's really weird. We can't take you to the zoo, but I guess we could do a podcast from the zoo. We'll see you next time.
Speaker 1:Bye.
