A Slice of Bread and Butter
The voice of The Bread and Butter Thing - with stories from the frontline of the cost of living crisis from one of the UK's leading food charities.
A Slice of Bread and Butter
The Benefits Labyrinth: Tracy Finds Her Way Through
When Tracy moved from Working Tax Credits to Universal Credit, nothing about her circumstances changed – she was still a single mum working as a support worker on national living wage. Yet suddenly, she found herself without access to free prescriptions, dental care and glasses that she'd previously relied on. "I had emergency dental treatment more or less as soon as I migrated over to universal credit... and I had to pay for it."
Tracy's story reveals the hidden complexities in our welfare system that can leave working families in precarious positions. Despite working in the same care role for 20 years, she struggles with an income that fluctuates month to month based on sleep shifts, childcare challenges, and a Universal Credit system that penalizes her for earning extra one month by reducing her benefits the next.
What stands out in Tracy's experience is her resilience and resourcefulness. The Bread and Butter Thing has become more than just a source of affordable food – it's a weekly highlight where she connects with volunteers and neighbors while getting creative with whatever comes in her food bag. From making Irish champ with excess spring onions to sharing surplus items with her community, Tracy ensures nothing goes to waste while building supportive networks around her.
Her journey through severe OCD alongside financial challenges highlights how mental health and economic hardship often intertwine, impacting work capacity and daily functioning. Yet through it all, Tracy maintains perspective: "I suppose I still feel really grateful that I am getting at least something, because a lot of people don't."
Want to join a community that's making food more affordable while creating connections that matter? Find your nearest Bread and Butter Thing hub on our website and become part of something that's more than just food shopping – it's a catalyst for change in communities across the UK.
Welcome back to A Slice of Bread and Butter with Nina, Vic and Mark from the Bread and Butter Thing. We're a charity that delivers affordable food to the heart of struggling neighbourhoods to help nourish communities and act as a catalyst for change.
Speaker 2:We provide access to a nutritious, affordable range of food, which means our members can save money on their shopping, feed their families healthily, as well as access other support too, right in the heart of their communities.
Speaker 1:And this is where we share a slice of life of somebody involved in Bread and Butter and hear about how they connect with us.
Speaker 2:And this week it's our Tracy Love. Yeah, I'm not doing that again.
Speaker 1:But do you know what? Our Tracy doesn't sound like that either.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I bet she doesn't but this is Tracy.
Speaker 4:Number three. My name's Tracy. I'm 54, I work as a support worker. I support people with learning disabilities. I've been doing that job about 20 years now. I live with my 11-year-old daughter. I'm a single mum.
Speaker 1:I like doing painting and arts and crafts in my spare time, reading and stuff. So you moved from working tax credits to universal credit.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that was, I think, the migration. I was one of the last people to migrate over.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:I do get about as much as I did on working tax credit, but other things have stopped as in I no longer get free prescriptions or free dental treatment or free glasses and stuff from opticians. From working tax credit I was entitled to all these things, yeah.
Speaker 1:So have you heard of something called the low-income scheme? Is it?
Speaker 4:for the prescriptions yeah, I did apply for that. So I had to send them, like my wage slips and my universal credit awards, so they could calculate how much money I was getting each month. And they said I didn't qualify. And was that because you're just earning too?
Speaker 1:much Yep. So so they could calculate how much money I was getting each month and they said I didn't qualify. And was that because you're?
Speaker 4:just earning too much.
Speaker 1:Yep, so let me get this right. So you're on national living wage and you get a top up through universal credit. That used to be working tax credit. So your circumstances haven't changed. But now, the way the government looks at you through the universal credit lens, you don't anymore qualify for free prescriptions or NHS help.
Speaker 4:That's right. Yeah, you know, these things always happen, don't they? I had to have emergency dental treatment more or less as soon as I migrated over to universal credit.
Speaker 1:And you had to pay for it.
Speaker 4:I had to pay for it. Yeah, in a way I would say I am resigned to it, because I just think I'm not going to say that I was ashamed to go on benefits. But until my daughter's dad we split up, which was about eight, nine years ago now, I've never been on any benefit whatsoever. I didn't know anything about the benefit system. So when I was on working tax credit, I was just absolutely so grateful that they were giving me something. So I suppose I still feel really grateful that I am getting at least something, because a lot of people don't. I would say I am quite savvy of the benefit system now, especially for my job as well. I am quite savvy of the benefit system now, especially for my job as well, helping people navigate it. It's not easy sometimes filling in a form and not putting the right thing and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Well, you are the first person that I've talked to on the podcast that's actually known about the low-income scheme.
Speaker 4:Oh, really yeah Right.
Speaker 1:But it's clearly your background as a support worker etc. Tracy, it shows that you know your stuff I have never seen it advertised anywhere.
Speaker 4:A lot of these things I don't think they tell you about because they don't want people and maybe that's a cynic in me saying that they don't want people to claim it but I've never seen that. No one's ever told me about it either. I think I've just, yeah, picked it up from doing research for people I work with so we have a little saying that hidden help doesn't help yeah, that's right yeah because I think we're quite cynical about it as well yeah, do you not?
Speaker 4:have you heard of uniform exchange? No as well, oh, if you're not uniform exchange educate me.
Speaker 4:Basically it's free uniform. You know there must be so much uniform going to landfill every single year because everybody runs out and buys. You know well if you can in september. But there's a scheme in huddersfield called uniform exchange and you just email them, you tell them what school your kids going to and then they'll give you like basically a shopping list or do you want a blazer, p top, trousers, trousers, skirt, whatever, just put your kid's size in and yeah, they send it to them. They don't drop it off at your house, they'll just drop it off at hubs like libraries, like show start centres and stuff like that. Because my daughter's going to high school next and I'm already panicking.
Speaker 4:I've just received a tie, a blazer, some trousers, all in great condition.
Speaker 1:So you're working. We talk a lot to working families. What do you think you have as a weekly or monthly budget for food and other stuff when you've paid for your energy bills, for the flat and broadband, I guess after that Like?
Speaker 4:whatever I've got spare over. It all depends so at work I do sleep shifts at work, which means I'm at work for 24 hours and I'll get an extra 60 quid if I do one of them shifts, as well as an hourly rate. If I do more of them in a month, obviously I get more money, but then the more I do of that, the more money I earn, the less universal credit I'll get.
Speaker 1:So it's a bit of a quandary, isn't it? Out of interest, then what do they take off if you do one of those nights?
Speaker 4:just still getting my head around universal credit, because with working tax credit I will get the same amount every single month, regardless of what I earned, and then at the end of the year, like in April, they get my p60 and if they see that I've earned too much money, then they'll say, oh, you owe some money, or they'll take it off the next year's payments. But with universal credit, I mean, I don't know what happens, but they know what I earn every month because it goes up and down and your reward changes if you do a sleeping shift, yeah, you end up with the month after, I guess, a reduced universal, yeah and then to do a sleep shift.
Speaker 4:It absolutely I mean, I'm 54 years old now and it physically and mentally absolutely drains me for about two days I was gonna say do you actually sleep much? Not really because I'm supporting four people with various needs, so I sleep very little. I usually do about two or three of them a month, and it's childcare as well. I've got to sort out my childcare for 24 hours.
Speaker 1:I was going to say where does she go?
Speaker 4:So she goes to her dad's house when she can, yeah.
Speaker 1:That's quite a tricky thing to budget as well, then, isn't it? Because if you think you've had a bump a month, because, you've done three shifts or whatever overnight, but at the same time you know the next month they're going to take it back off you really.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:In Universal Credit. How do you manage that?
Speaker 4:Well, I don't know, it's just kind of work it out. I always seem to know roughly how much I'm going to get, so like I act accordingly. I know you asked me the original question and I do talk a lot. Sorry, always saying how much I've got left over every month. Yeah, but this is how we went down this rabbit hole right.
Speaker 1:Because it's fascinating to me You've not got a solid foundation because you think you've got more money. One month, let's just say you did four or five sleep shifts. You get a nice little extra in your monthly packet, but you know that Universal Credit have seen that as well and you know they're going to cut it off you the following month, do you think? I know I've had a good month, but I now know there's a bad month coming, so that good month I've got to put that away.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, I always know it's going to be a bit tight. Oh, I always know when, when I've got extra things to pay for, there's always something, and I try my best. My daughter does go to dance classes and stuff and then, but there's always something extra and that that's when things like uh, bread and butter thing. Honestly, I just love going there. It's like a real highlight because I absolutely just love seeing what I'm gonna get, got to know what volunteers there as well, and it's like hiya hiya what you doing.
Speaker 2:It's like oh a bit of mother's meeting.
Speaker 4:Oh, oh, what we got this week. I hope it's not four jars of peanut butter again. You know I can't get rid of it, but it has been a godsend really. I'm not a cook but I'm always googling. You know, like I said, I've got about 20 bunches of spring onions. Like I am never going to eat all these, I need to. So I made some champ which is like Irish mash in it with spring onions did not know that oh, it's an Irish recipe.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and spring onion soup with potatoes and stuff like that. I'm always making some. I draw the line when I get like offal. That's the only thing I don't know what to do with.
Speaker 1:The trotters.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I've had that trotter, but my mum and dad lived in Spain so they were like, oh, we can do something a bit Mediterranean with Trotter. There's absolutely nothing goes to waste, because the offal I give to my neighbour, she's got a dog If he's not too quick, keen on corn stuff, but one of my friends is a vegan, so she gets it all. So then I just go to work and give it to my colleagues at work, Like if there's anything extra, if I've got a load of bread or whatever. Everybody gets something. There's not one thing I've ever thrown away and my daughter absolutely loves it. She goes. No, you're going to Jess Nuts Centre because there'll be like stuff in it that I don't normally buy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you met people, like you say. You know the volunteers and the regulars, you see the same people.
Speaker 4:They always get talking to them in queue and everything. But my neighbour texts me. I'm very lucky she only lives on there. She didn't even get on. But she still took me last week, which was really kind of her. It was calmer for her because we went and you didn't have to get on. But they'd set up a load of surplus food outside. So she was like oh, there were loads of potatoes and carrots and tomatoes and spring onions, onions crisps and loads of stuff outside just for the local community. You didn't have to be on.
Speaker 1:Just giving them out.
Speaker 4:Just giving them out. Yeah, they must have had loads. I went past an hour late and it were all gone.
Speaker 1:That's nice to hear. So a little bird tells me as well that you suffered with quite a lot of OCD in the past.
Speaker 4:Yeah, quite a few things happened, so I am only part-time now, because that's as much as I can cope with.
Speaker 1:Is that mentally cope?
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, my job's extremely stressful. I absolutely love my job. If you're doing this job and you don't like it, there'd be no reason to do it. It's minimum wage. You have to work every day of the year, you know you don't get Christmas off. I really love my job, but I would say I'm quite stressed at the end of it From like a mental health viewpoint. A lot of things happened at the same time and that just sent me into a bit of an OCD spiral, really.
Speaker 1:A lot of people would say, oh, I'm a bit OCD, I'm a bit tidy, but you don't mean that, really, do you?
Speaker 4:No, ocd too means like I don't know, my doormat's not quite straight. Some of the worst symptoms have gone now, but it could be if I'd, maybe I'd be washing my hands six times and then I'd accidentally touch the tap and so I'd have to do it all again. Maybe six, seven, eight times tap, and so I'd have to do it all again, maybe six, seven, eight times. If anything fell on the floor like laundry this is quite extreme I'd have to throw it away. Yeah, this is when I'd let my mind win, really, if I didn't't. I mean, this is what you're supposed to do. The therapist tells you the cbt is kind of all. You don't give into it, but then the anxiety is just too much. There's just so many things I couldn't do just stops your functioning, yeah it's and it makes everyday things just so hard.
Speaker 4:Like just going to work. It would be like a major. It wasn't just like I could just get up. I'd really have to psych myself up for it kind of thing, because obviously you've got so many interactions with people. It is a lot better now. It is a lot better, thank God.
Speaker 1:Vic. Why are there so many Tracys in Yorkshire?
Speaker 3:I don't know. I was thinking this. I'm thinking I might do a little research to see if Tracy was a particularly common name in yorkshire. I don't know huddersfield and tracy who knew who knew?
Speaker 1:who knew, well, speaking of who knew, uniform exchange, who knew?
Speaker 3:you didn't know about the uniform.
Speaker 1:They do amazing work, amazing work so I did know about uniform exchange, what I was trying to get across with Tracy. I thought she was referring to it as a government scheme and it's not, is it?
Speaker 3:No, it's not.
Speaker 1:That's what I meant, because wouldn't it be good if this was a national thing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think lots of areas do have something, but it's yeah, it should be something that's nationwide for sure. It's so expensive to buy uniforms these days.
Speaker 1:It's not only that is it, you know, uniform for sure. It's so expensive to buy uniforms these days. It's not only that is it, you know uniform.
Speaker 2:It doesn't get the life it should if only one kid wears it yeah, with the advent of all these other swap sites and places you can sell your clothes, it just feels like a no-brainer really, especially as kids grow so quick yeah, tracy also did the.
Speaker 1:Uh, why is it also complicated, all this hidden help? I mean, she's been there, it and it just doesn't work. What's going on?
Speaker 3:It's a problem everywhere. It's a problem for everyone. I don't understand why it feels like we're the only ones getting on our soapbox about this.
Speaker 1:I don't understand that. Why is that, he says, introducing his early curveball to Vic?
Speaker 3:Hit me with it, then the curveball.
Speaker 1:Why is it only us talking about?
Speaker 3:this? Why is no one else going out there talking about how bloody hard it is to actually get this help and why is no one else marketing it? Okay? So I think there's a few things there. Lots of people are focused on obvious stuff like go and get your universal credit and things like that, and they're they're not seeing the value of the other things. I think that the government don't promote it because if I was going to be really cynical, they've probably not got the budget to meet the needs if everybody went for it. So I think that's a challenge and I think it's very expensive to help people fill out a 20 page form that needs all of the information for the low income scheme that it does, and it's hard it's hard life admin to do to fill out those forms. So who's available to be able to support people with access in it? And actually there's no answer to that. There isn't anyone other than Citizens Advice that could be using their skills in a better way than filling out a form. There's not people there.
Speaker 2:Why is the form 20 pages long, though that just seems bonkers. We've got access to online forms and easy surveys that you can do online. Now Make it easier for people. It's not hard.
Speaker 3:No, my final point on this is that actually I think there's lots of people that are just looking at a welfare support thing and trying to bash government and say, just look, it's all not good enough. And I don't think there's very few people that are trying to, or organizations that are trying to take a more pragmatic approach that says, actually some of the stuff that people need exists, it's just that they're not accessing it. It's a tougher message for governments here to say, well, it's all rubbish, start again, and we're kind of finding the line between that.
Speaker 1:Okay. So to answer your question, nina, if Meta or TikTok did government forms, do you think they'd be as difficult?
Speaker 2:Oh, probably.
Speaker 1:Because I've got this view that actually you make forms difficult if you don't want people to fill them out.
Speaker 2:That's true.
Speaker 1:So how easy is it to become a member of meta or to sign up to tiktok?
Speaker 2:right versus we'll just sign up any newsletter online.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, because because they want you to right. Yeah, this is my cynical elevator view. You start from a position where you build a system to say well, do I actually want to make it really easy because I want everybody to access this, or do I actually want a system that is going to probably put quite a few people off because I can't actually afford to give everybody everything that they allegedly should have? I don't believe that government wants to build a system that is easy access, purely and simply because, frankly, it's a budget problem but when they do do campaigns about, you know, are you getting the right benefits that we have seen on tv?
Speaker 2:they do them well and you just want to see more of that, don't you?
Speaker 1:couldn't agree more. More of that, more accessibility is exactly what we need. And I think also they should be engaging employers with that stuff as well, to say, you know, if you've got low paid workers, then you should be fully informed with this stuff well, the fact she's being penalized for earning more money more than once, yeah this one was one that triggered me about recent preschool meals as well, because everybody in universal credit is getting preschool meals.
Speaker 1:Now, however, if you keep going up and down and in and out of the thresholds and you you end up not having universal credit one particular month, it could jeopardize your kids free school meals. If you build everything around one system, like they want to do with universal credit, then you've got to make sure that you think about all the permutations that working families, particularly if that's where you want to primarily focus that benefit. It's got to work for everybody, right? Yeah, we've actually got one of our volunteers in one of our hubs. It was one of the original civil servants that designed the initial universal credit.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:They said it looked very different to how it's actually ended up and they believe that the five week delay and the monthly payments was not originally designed into it.
Speaker 2:Why is that?
Speaker 1:It became a political football and people started to think about well, I've always earned a monthly wage and therefore they should. If we're trying to get them used to working right, they should get a monthly pay. But actually loads of people that are on low income pay. Low paid work is typically paid weekly.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So another blind spot.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the only bit, as I understand it, that was meant to be built in was the one waiting week, and that was about red tape and then processing. But the other four weeks was like a system change after. I mean, it was all flawed because even how they stopped people being on legacy benefits and put them onto UC wasn't seamless. So even if you were on benefit like forget that I was in work and now I'm not even when you were going from legacy benefits to this, it still wasn't seamless and that was entirely within DWP's gift to make it so right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but it's another engineering, political machinations problem where it's the DWP designing it, whereas to get it sanctioned by Treasury they needed to do certain things.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but I also think, going back to the free school meal debacle you only come off universal credit when you're in work, after you've not needed a top up for six months. So within six months you've got a live UC account. It'll flip in and flip out. It's after six months that it wouldn't. So I think people are safe for the six month period okay, good to know.
Speaker 2:I don't think it's like week on week or month on month that people would be stopping and starting yeah so can we chat about spring onions yeah, I mean, there's some really good recipes, like a sort of Japanese pancake with spring onions in it. That could be really nice. Can you tell that I love cooking.
Speaker 3:I didn't know you loved spring onions so much though.
Speaker 2:I actually really do love spring onions yeah, charred, they're really good. And Irish champ, yeah, amazing, and any leftover Irish champ can be made into potato cakes.
Speaker 3:Ooh, or I was thinking bubble and squeak. I've not thought about bubble and squeak for ages.
Speaker 2:Bubble and squeak is one of the best things that comes out of Christmas dinner every year, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Yeah, what's a veggie bubble? And?
Speaker 1:squeak look like Mark. I suppose it's similar but not the same. So I'd say a Christmas bubble and squeak. For us looks very similar to yours, but we make sure everything's veggie, so it's all the trimmings. You'd still get mash, but I'd still chop up some roast in there and some sprouts, maybe some carrot and mash in there as well. Parsnips, yeah, but you see I like them too much. They're never leftover.
Speaker 2:That's the problem.
Speaker 1:You've got to have leftovers in the first place Parsnips with a honey glaze for Christmas dinner.
Speaker 3:Got to be Can, I gotta be can I just point out that we are chatting about christmas in the summer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, turning into a retailer or something so if you'd like to know more about the bread and butter thing and what we get up to, you can find us at team tbbt, on instagram, tiktok, twitter and linkedin, or online at breadandbutterorg and if you have feedback or thoughts or anything like that, or you just want to come and have an atter with us, drop us an email at podcast at breadandbutterthingorg lastly, we're always open to new members at all of our hubs.
Speaker 2:If you or someone you know would benefit from our affordable food scheme, you can find your nearest hub on the become a member page on the website and please do all the things that podcast asks you to do.
Speaker 1:Like us, subscribe to us, leave us a review and share us with your friends and chat about us on social please do goodbye, see you next time see ya, thank you.
