Confessions of a Recruiter
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Confessions of a Recruiter
Mastering BD: Blue Collar | COAR S1-EP2
How do you build Australia's fastest growing manufacturing and logistics recruitment agency from scratch in just two years? Sam Hope and Jory Humphreys the dynamic duo behind H People, reveal their remarkable journey from startup hustlers to recruitment powerhouse.
The secret to their meteoric rise? Relentless outbound activity. When launching their blue-collar temp agency, Sam and Jory weren't waiting for AI to generate leads—they were grinding through 50-100 cold calls daily. Their disciplined approach to "market mapping" specific geographic territories created a systematic blueprint that they've successfully replicated across multiple locations.
"Activity breeds activity" isn't just a catchphrase for these recruitment entrepreneurs; it's the foundation of their business model. Their consultants target 30 connected BD calls daily while implementing the ingenious "five up, five down" door-knocking strategy that turns single client meetings into multiple business development opportunities.
What sets H People apart from competitors isn't just their hustle—it's their strategic focus. Rather than promising unrealistic outcomes or compromising on margins, they've built enduring client relationships through honest communication and consistent delivery. Their integration of offshore resources with Australian consultants has created a powerful operational model that frees up 30-40 hours weekly for revenue-generating activities.
Whether you're launching your own recruitment venture or looking to supercharge your existing desk, this episode delivers actionable insights on geographic targeting, maintaining margins, relationship management, and building a sustainable recruitment business. Connect with Sam and Jory on LinkedIn to continue the conversation and learn how consistent activity can transform your recruitment results.
· Our Website is: xrecruiter.io
Recruiters, get ready to be inspired. Today we're joined by two absolute BD weapons Sam Hope and Jory Humphries the powerhouse duo behind H-People.
Speaker 2:If your client in Brisbane is saying, hey, when are you opening down in Melbourne? Doesn't necessarily mean that the company in Melbourne is 100% going to use your services.
Speaker 1:In just two short years. They're Australia's fastest growing manufacturing and logistics recruitment agency, with over 350 five-star reviews, and have placed over a thousand candidates when we first started the business, we were doing 50 to 100 calls a day. They are on track to make the AFR fast starters list in 2025. Join us in this episode as we dive into mastering business development in a blue-collar temp agency setting. Discover key lessons, actionable insights and the secret sauce to success.
Speaker 3:Activity breeds activity. So many recruiters will promise the world In what way my candidates will definitely show up.
Speaker 1:Gents, thanks for joining us, Thanks Avner, Thanks Ed how was that pump up? That was a good pump up.
Speaker 2:That was good, I like that a lot.
Speaker 4:I enjoyed seeing it how good, let's start with the AFr and growing your business being. We don't know where you'll land, but just looking at the numbers, it'll be somewhere on the top afr top 100 fastest growing companies list. So if we just walk back two years, when you sent your inquiry on linkedin, you're you're wondering you know what it'd be like to start your own agency, and surely we can is when you sent your inquiry on LinkedIn to Akira Love it. You were wondering you know what it'd be like to start your own agency, and surely we can do this ourselves. Did you ever think that maybe you would potentially land on that?
Speaker 3:list. Jeez, I think two years ago when we launched, I think it was just the stress and the panic of hopefully we can make this work to support the families Fast forward. In two years I don't think we ever thought about being on a Fast 100 list or where we're at in the actual space.
Speaker 2:I think the idea was there. I remember when we sort of sat down before we started and wrote down our business plan about sort of where we were at, where we wanted to try and get to, and sort of set a bit of a I guess, a one, two, three-year goal. The numbers were definitely there. Definitely didn't really think that it would last us on any sort of land, us on any sort of fast lists or anything like that. But yeah, it's been an awesome journey today so far and, yeah, grateful for everyone that sort of joined us along the way. Yeah, it's been awesome.
Speaker 4:And I think the list comes out November. Is that right?
Speaker 2:I believe so I think so, so it'll be exciting. Numbers are in. Numbers are in. That is good.
Speaker 4:So what's been the most rewarding moment over the last two years of starting your blue-collar?
Speaker 3:temp agency. Probably one of the highlights that jumps out to me was at the X Recruiter Annual Awards when we got recognised as the top performing agency. That's probably that one hit home. Getting sort of recognised in front of your peers. I would say that would be the top one for me, For sure, I think definitely as well.
Speaker 2:Like a fair few people have joined us along the journey now there's myself, jory and six others in Australia at the moment along the journey. Now there's myself, jory and six others in Australia at the moment and watching those guys come up and become high performers as well, like one standout for me at the moment is definitely old Hazza.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Hazza's sort of been in yeah, he's just come on board green to recruitment, taken everything in like a sponge, had probably the hardest job out of anyone at HP, started in a cold desk and sort of seeing him get some really good wins on the board now, um, that's something that, yeah, I definitely get a lot of, a lot of reward from that.
Speaker 4:and seeing, seeing, I guess, uh, the staff underneath us begin to achieve some some great results as well, there's a lot of fulfillment when you can get a green rookie recruiter in and they go through the trials and tribulations and then they start seeing the success of their labor. It's actually like a really nice feeling to go fuck you. I helped him 100%.
Speaker 2:Yeah, learning a new craft. I don't think you ever master it. You're always learning. But he's like a sponge and hats off to him. Got the right mindset.
Speaker 1:That's it absolutely.
Speaker 2:It's all mindset and attitude and how well you absorb what you're being taught and I guess the repetition, putting in the training and the coaching and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so this episode is all about business development, and so a perfect topic for you boys to talk about, because you're in the trenches. You were in the trenches, you'll still be in the trenches, moving forward. So I think BD was one of your key strengths when you first started, your agency started from scratch, and I think you placed 80 contractors in your first 90 days, or something like that, which was pretty remarkable. So I guess I just want to start with the most reliable method in generating new clients. Like what is that? If you're starting from scratch, what is the most reliable BD strategy to go from zero to where you want to be?
Speaker 2:For sure We've. I mean, we replicate this over and over and over again. When we started HPeople, we, you know, we lived by what we do and then, as HPeople has grown, we've basically split different geographical areas and we've just repeated what we know works in certain areas. So you know, we've done it north, south, east, west Gold Coast, done it down in Melbourne as well, and you can't get away from outbound cold calls like I know that a lot of recruiters don't like it.
Speaker 4:You don't have an ai prospector that gets all your leads for you. No, no, no we?
Speaker 2:we definitely don't. It's um. You know it's definitely outbound call volumes, cold calls, um being, I guess, targeted with um, with who you're calling, where you're calling and and, most importantly, it's what you're doing with, targeted with who you're calling, where you're calling, and most importantly is what you're doing with the data that you're obtaining from all of them, cold calls as well, and, along with door knocks, it's just a combination of almost all outbound prospecting.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's just lots of activity. That's the biggest thing. It's always just been activity breeds activity. It's something that we'll both drill it in into us when we're at Hayes and I think that's a mantra that we've carried on with H people as well, so anyone that's coming on board. It's just all about the activity and the reps that you're putting in and making those little micro wins and continuing to push the needle throughout.
Speaker 4:So? So what's the activity look like? Are we talking 20 outbound calls? Are we talking 10 client visits a week? Like, what is the magic number if you have one?
Speaker 3:I don't know about the magic number. I would say that when we first started the business we were doing 50 to 100 calls outbound prospecting calls a day to really get things off the ground. Obviously, as the business matured and evolved over time, it's definitely changed a bit of Sam and I's focus. At the moment the guys are really trying to push 30 connected BD calls per day, so 150 a week, which is a very high number.
Speaker 1:It's huge, but you remind them that you need 100 a day.
Speaker 3:And then obviously they've got to link in with all their candidate activities as well, which definitely helps them having their own resource that supports them. But I think the magic number would be anywhere between 10 and 20 connected BD calls per day. And then you're mixing in your other prospecting activities, such as your cold door knocks or your client visits and so forth.
Speaker 2:For sure, I'd say like 10 a day is a very good number, mixed in with, you know, going out on discovery meetings every week, you know I'd say a minimum of three client meetings a week. And when you go to these client meetings we use sort of a five up, five down rule, which is just door knocking businesses, literally next door to the business that you're going on a meeting to speak to and have that discovery with, and then just going up and down five up, five down and letting them know you know you're you're potentially going to be working with their next door neighbor, introducing yourself. This is what you do finding out key, key contact information within those businesses and then going back to your crm and making sure that you file all of that information, all of those contacts, in prospect BD lists within the CRM so that you can consistently reverse market out to those lists as well. We see a lot of results coming from reverse marketing to targeted prospect lists. And do you?
Speaker 1:blitz and call parts of the day, or is it just 10, 20 throughout the day? Run your own time, what's most effective for you guys.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think we've really tried to change it up a little bit throughout the course and figure out what the rhythm is. I know that a couple of guys in the office now are segmenting dedicated BD blocks, so they might do say from 9.30 till 11 in the morning and then bang after lunch again they'll do another 90 minutes. So that is no other activities apart from business development calls and cold business development calls.
Speaker 4:Yeah. So, sam, you mentioned about geographies before, so I'm just trying to paint a really clear picture in my mind. If I was to start a blue collar temp desk right now, the first thing I'd need to do is figure out my industry and you guys do manufacturing logistics, manufacturing logistics.
Speaker 2:So if a company makes things or moves things, that's our target client.
Speaker 4:Okay, and so, to start with, you would build a BD list on Google.
Speaker 2:I don't know.
Speaker 4:How are you building out a list?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I mean we call it mapping the market in a specific geographical area. So say your patch, let's use Harry's patch, for example, because we've been through this process, been doing it for the last sort of six months or so. Google Maps is a great tool if you're at home on the weekend or if you just wanted to have a look on Google and see who's in that area, or if you just wanted to have a look on Google and see who's in that area. Otherwise, if you're on site or if you're actually in the suburb itself, driving around and actually noting down all of the businesses that you want to work with essentially in that area. When I'm doing that, I'll more often than not pair up with one of our VAs overseas as well, be working off of a shared spreadsheet. So I'll be driving around. Potentially there'll be someone in the car with me. We'll be writing down all the business names.
Speaker 2:By the time we get back to the office, all of the data has been entered into the CRM, with phone numbers, sometimes contacts of who we need to speak to as well, and I think especially with BD, if you're going in prepared, if you've got a list of, you know, 300, 500 target businesses that you want to speak to in that geographical area. It just means that when you do pick up the phone, you know at nine o'clock in the morning and you know that you've got that one hour, 90 minute block, two hour block. You're not floundering around and wondering who you need to call or spend wasting time, Um, and you're being highly efficient because you've already. You already know who you're going to call, you know what the?
Speaker 2:outcome. You're looking to gain data and information of who, um who you want to speak to Um and, after you've spoken to them, people. It's about, um putting those people into lists, so so that's really good.
Speaker 4:So some of the blockers for people doing BD is one finding the company to call.
Speaker 4:Two, finding who to speak to and then three finding their details so they can actually reach out to them. So what you're saying is you'll drive around super manual, but you just want right off a day to just get all the data together. You go back to work. You write out the 400 businesses that you saw. How do you know who to speak to specifically? Is it just your best guess, or do you just go? I don't have it yet, but you know, here's their Google number.
Speaker 3:It's 0736.
Speaker 4:I'll call and I'll ask for the person Like how do you build out that information?
Speaker 3:I think, especially over the last couple of years, that has definitely changed and it's gotten a lot better. It's gotten a lot efficient.
Speaker 2:We used to just call the reception and ask you know, introduce ourselves and ask who's the right person for us to speak to, and then you know, more often than not you'd get a name and an email address and you know we'd build lists like that. Then people would then move over to the next stage, which would be, you know, the clients that you're trying to warm up and reach out and speak to, sort of on a monthly basis.
Speaker 3:Yeah, where I think these days we've got some technology and a bit of tech that we use, that we can actually find that decision maker a lot quicker. So if we've got the business or the target business that we're looking for, we can actually plug in if it's an operations manager, a general manager and operations leader and then being able to identify who that is through the software and then be able to get a phone number or an email and speak to the person immediately, rather than going through the gatekeeper, which everyone enjoys.
Speaker 1:Was there any challenges getting through the gatekeeper in your industry? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I think everyone did Any sexual tricks, I used to just get the number wrong by one digit at the end and you end up getting through to like finance. They put you through straight away. What's?
Speaker 2:a cut through Now. I mean, I just approach it quite softly in all honesty. I just say that I want to introduce myself to the person on site and it comes across a lot, I guess a lot less salesy if you like, like. I hear some people going in there and saying like you know, I'm a recruiter, this is what I do. I want to speak to the person that does that, and then you know, it's an easy out for them because they'll just say I've got no immediate need, it's all good.
Speaker 3:Yeah, if I was going through to a gatekeeper, it would be connecting with other business leaders in the business.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's interesting, because that was going to be my next question is when you do have this icy cold. You saw them down the street, you've put them details in a list and then you're just calling up to talk to them. What are you actually calling them about? You're calling them about potentially catching up for a meeting, Are you just? You want to get on their radar and send them an intro email. Then maybe it's the next call. You kind of go in for the meeting or like how, how are you?
Speaker 3:approaching it. I think that depends on how icy that person is. I think, at the end of the day, not everyone will do business with you regardless and I think that's important to know. But again, like if we're we're finding out that person is my. My sort of barrier to get into that is if I can give them a bit of information, like whether that's an email or whatever it might be, and then get them to sort of agree to receive a bit of information from me. Following that maybe lead into another. Hey, is it all right if I was going to pop out there and say g'day, or introduce you or bring a, bring a coffee, or five minute conversation, If you see any, any benefit of us connecting?
Speaker 4:interesting. And so what's your strike rate? Is it five percent, two percent, thirty percent, if you're doing?
Speaker 2:on all outbound cold calls. Yeah, yeah, if you're doing, if you're doing, you know 10 connected, 20 connected calls a day are you?
Speaker 4:getting one appointment, no appointments it.
Speaker 2:Just it honestly depends on the time of year, the day, right place, right time, I believe. Like I mean, I I made know probably 15 cold calls I think it was early last week and organized you know four discovery meetings out of those you know. So that was a fairly good success rate to get in front of them. I just get a micro win and I find out you know the contact information so that I can sort of, you know, get them in my list and add them on LinkedIn and, you know, start that outreach sort of process to them to sort of familiarize themselves with myself and H people. So yeah, it's a tricky one to answer that, isn't it Absolutely?
Speaker 1:You did mention that you talk about people, other companies, you're working with in the local area. Is there a particular um tactic that you have that works better? And the reason I asked that when I used to do cold calling a long time ago now, um, we'd always start with a name drop, like working with somebody else in the business, and then if you didn't have that, you could say a competitor drop.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you have some information, so, yeah, those kind of rules, yeah, you have a similar, similar yeah, I think so, like there's a few industries that we're pretty well known in, especially in Brisbane, and being able to drop some of those company names or, if it's machinery, being able to plug some of the machinery that that company might be using, and it instantly builds a little bit of credibility and there's a little bit of cut through that way as well. And then if you're speaking to an operations manager and you're able to rattle off a bit of the machinery that they're working with, or competitors that they've got, or particular people that you're working with in the industry that they know, then they know it's like oh, this person's better than your average recruiter he actually understands a little bit about my business yeah, yeah, that's half the thing, it's
Speaker 2:just getting credibility and yeah is there?
Speaker 4:is there a timing window that you feel people are more receptive to? A call from a recruiter like this is one thing that comes up all the time is like, oh, I call people before they start at seven 30 or I do all my BD calls at five o'clock, you know when everyone's ready to go home and they're more likely to pick up the phone, or is it? Is there any timing window that you feel works best?
Speaker 2:I mean, I was always training your core hours.
Speaker 4:You know what I?
Speaker 2:mean I was always training your core hours, sort of get your BD done between sort of 9 and 11.30, smash it out. But I think that sort of changes industry specific as well. Like you know, harry's been proper deep in the trenches and he's been doing BD like 7 am, you know, because a lot of our clients are at work at 5, 6 o'clock in the morning. So you know they're primed and ready to go by 7. They've had a couple of coffees, they've got their emails out of the way and they're ready to sort of accept and receive that phone call.
Speaker 2:You know he also is seeing success doing he's broken his down into two 90-minute sessions now rather than smashing it all out in the morning so that he can get some, you know some candidate stuff out of the way in the morning as well, and you know he's mentioned that he's having great success between sort of 1 and 2.30, which is surprising to me. So I think it's all sort of a bit of trial and error, but I've always stuck to my core hours, personally between 9 and 11.30.
Speaker 4:Okay, what's the one biggest mistake you see blue collar recruiters making when they are prospecting or trying to build their desk?
Speaker 3:I think over-promising is probably one of the biggest things. I think in the blue-collar space you don't want to get it wrong. Regardless of whatever you do, candidates are going to let you down, especially in the nature of the game that we're working with, and so many recruiters, especially in the blue-collar space, will promise the world In what way?
Speaker 4:What do they promise you, my candidates?
Speaker 3:will definitely show up.
Speaker 2:Everyone's going show up, everyone's gonna work out yeah, first time sort of thing. Like it definitely doesn't work in our space. And I guess you know we we sort of sell that, that communication piece where, like you know, we've been doing this for a number of years now you know, some of us over a decade and we, we know we know not every single person is going to work out first time. But you know, what we can do is we're going to act as a sounding board between not only you but also the candidate. So if the candidate, for whatever reason, after the first day shows any signs or indication that they might not want to work within that business long term, why would we persist with letting this candidate waste your time by you pumping training into that candidate for two weeks, knowing that you know he's looking for another opportunity or something like that. So that's sort of a piece that we sort of sell.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think, as we've become more experienced as having I suppose it's a responsibility to let the clients know as well and having that communication and setting those expectations from the outset rather than after the fact. So if we can set some expectations with clients from the outset to say this is going to be the experience and this is what the challenges will face when we come into those challenges, we've already pre-warned them rather than sort of trying to handle them as they come.
Speaker 4:Could just playing devil's advocate here. Let's say I'm a rookie recruiter and I'm up against H people. You're taking the really sensible approach of like, hey, not everyone's going to work out, but we'll work through it. And I'm just trying to get a new client sign my terms and I'm just, hey, yeah, like, I've got like 10 guys ready to go right now. They'll start tomorrow morning, 100%. Yeah, what trap are they leading themselves into by doing that, are they, is it? Yeah, you're risking the client relationship in a month or two months are you?
Speaker 3:Especially when I start check your candidates and they haven't worked out and then, like I'm, giving the client a call.
Speaker 2:Do you?
Speaker 4:know, that.
Speaker 3:Oh like, if a client's going to let me know that, oh, we've been promised by another recruiter, it'll be my responsibility to start check those candidates oh, I didn't know that was a thing.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. Yeah, okay, absolutely, we can do that in Perm.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they will trip up yeah absolutely, and it just becomes a bit of a regular follow-up process from there, like if another recruiter has beaten you to the punch and they've gotten some candidates in front of them, then you can start check that person as well, making sure that person has started that and like I've done it for Perm as well and then you're sort of managing the life cycle and if something does drop out along the way then you're in prime position to put your best foot forward.
Speaker 4:That's smart. Okay, so you're keeping a sense check on competitors. If their candidates ever drop off, you're going. All right, we might have a shot here. Let's go for it.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. And that goes as well for not only candidates or recruiters that put candidates into business, but it's recruiters that have gone with ridiculously low margins and then the clients decided to go with that recruiter because it's a lot cheaper. We've we've learned over the time is like we'll hold our ground and we'll wait for that recruiter to fall over or they can't supply, and then we'll be able to keep our charge, rach's charge rates the same, and that's that same sort of thing as is following along the process to make sure that, because when a recruiter's going in at $1, $2 margins, there's going to be something that falls over. At the end of the day they can't service that long term. And then, when they can't, then if you're there to pick up the pieces and you don't need to drop any margin, then you win.
Speaker 4:Awesome, I love that. Talk to me about branding. You guys are pretty good with getting in front of the camera branding.
Speaker 2:Weren't always.
Speaker 4:I used to be absolutely terrified. Well, talk to me about branding. What impact has that made for prospecting specifically?
Speaker 3:Has it made any difference?
Speaker 2:You've got a couple of good stories on this one. Yeah, I mean, it happens almost definitely on a monthly basis. I literally went to a discovery meeting on Thursday.
Speaker 4:Sorry, what's a discovery meeting.
Speaker 2:Discovery meeting essentially is where you know you've had some commitment from the client. They're open and interested in talking to you about. You know your services, so you're going out there to understand what their problem is and whether you can or sort of can't, help them. Going for a bit of a discovery about what that would look like.
Speaker 4:Gotcha.
Speaker 2:Okay yeah. But yeah, thursday last week got a phone call from a business left a voicemail from me because I couldn't take the call and it was a general manager from a company in Rockley who had been referred to Ring Me specifically from just another recruiter that's been watching our journey and story on LinkedIn and you know just saw sort of some of the um, some of the results we're getting and you know five star reviews and thought we must be doing, must be doing a fairly good job. So you know, we, we we've genuinely been referred business from people we've never met before and I wasn't even connected with the bloke either.
Speaker 2:So Another recruiter, another recruiter, so I connected with him and, you know, hopefully going to catch up with him for a beer or a lunch. I said I'd love to take him out and appreciate the referral and just sort of goes back and forth. You know he plays in the civil and, I think, renewable space, which is somewhere that we don't. You know one of his clients that you know builds retaining walls out on these solar farms.
Speaker 3:I can only assume or a good friend of his needed help Done door knocks and clients have know who you are as well, which is pretty cool. Yeah, I was just out in Hendra.
Speaker 2:It's probably going back 12 months now. That's actually when I got on that big tyre company as well. But I did a door knock and a lady come up to the door and before I could say me, hello, it's Sam Hope from H-People. She was like I know who you are. I've been watching you on LinkedIn, oh you're a celebrity. Yeah, oh, wow, I was like oh, I don't really need to tell you what I do.
Speaker 4:Here's my card and give me a ring when you need so that's really interesting because I don't know if I'm naive, but I typically wouldn't associate personal branding or branding or marketing with a blue-collar labour hire business. Generally any blue-collar labour hire business that I've ever seen online or website or content it's almost non-existent. Like half their recruiters aren't even on LinkedIn because there's really no point.
Speaker 4:No one does it, so there's like this empty void of void of blue collar temp recruiters that don't value personal branding or marketing or do the videos because their candidates might not be on there. Maybe their clients aren't on there, whatever, but you guys have seemed to have lean into it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, definitely, I think, like for us as well as is. We don't want to just be known as a blue collar recruitment company as well, like we've got a white collar division as well and it's important for us to share that story, because a lot of those clients are out there as well, and be able to share a bit of the story in the white collar space too. But, yeah, something that I've never really was was into as a personal branding and got a bit of help from from from big Dave and lean into a few of those things which has been really cool and like sort of Sam touched on, like that personal branding pieces.
Speaker 3:You don't see any immediate wins but it's just the brand. Yeah, compounding brand recognition, people understanding your brand, whether that's clients or even recruiters like we'll have recruiters reach out to us as well and interested in a bit of conversation about a potential opportunity with HP people. So for those that are actually in a hiring space as well and interested in a bit of conversation about a potential opportunity with H people so for those that are actually in a hiring space as well it's super critical because you need to sell your brand as well.
Speaker 2:It's that familiarity piece as well. Like you know when, whenever I'm doing a business development call or I find out some information about a hiring manager that I need to connect with, I always connect with them on LinkedIn. You know not not everyone is on LinkedIn as much as a recruiter, but you know, even if they check in on LinkedIn, maybe once a month or you know if they see a piece of content from me my face doing a video you know something from our team or something like that. When we do reach out to them again in a month's time, they'll subconsciously know a little bit more about HP people and who we are.
Speaker 1:Just those touch points.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's it, that's it. It's just that familiarity.
Speaker 4:I saw a stat once it was probably about six months ago Once someone consumes 15 pieces of content from you, they're a raving fan and they're essentially guaranteed to buy. And so apparently this is not my stats, but apparently they usually see one in four or one in five times that you post Righty-o. So sometimes people think, oh, I'm just like smashing people with all my posts. Everyone's going to see every single one of my posts, but in reality they might see one out of five posts because their feed's full of other stuff.
Speaker 3:So technically it means that you need to post like 60 to 70 times for someone just to see your stuff 10 to 15 times yeah, I suppose, on that sort of logic, it's going to take at least three months for that person to be consuming your content if they see it, say, once per week. So, um, it's, it's very much the long, the long game with personal branding we've found and, um, I think, in this space and as it continues to evolve, um, it's super, super, super critical. Just consistency as well, isn't it?
Speaker 2:like I'm proud proud of you.
Speaker 3:You've got excellent recently, but that's just your stuff all the time yeah, but it's still.
Speaker 2:It's targeted like you know exactly the the image the message that you're trying to portray and I guess dave's helped quite heavily with that like and he opened my eyes as well, like, um, you know, I've always been quite active on social media, like only linkedin, I guess, more recently, but just being a bit more structured now with like certain. Like you know, I've always been quite active on social media, like only LinkedIn, I guess, more recently, but just being a bit more structured now with, like, certain pillars and you know certain things that you want to sort of, you know, get across.
Speaker 4:What's some advice you would give to a recruiter trying to get?
Speaker 2:their social media happening. I'd say segregate, maybe two hours a week, you know, doesn't have to be during business hours if that's going to affect your billings or whatever you want to do and this is just something that you've implemented, isn't it? I'll just post on the fly. Something will cross my mind Sometimes I will schedule. But if you're not consistent with doing that, definitely segregate. A couple of hours a hours a week can be on a weekend or an evening and we're just chilling at home. Come up with, you know, three posts a week. You can schedule your posts as well, and then it's done and then it's out of your head space. You don't need to think about it anymore. I was a huge procrastinator, you know. I'd write a post, I'd do a video and then I'd literally spend like two hours. Oh, I said um too many times or oh, you know I winked or blinked funny or so, and I was just like what am I doing?
Speaker 2:So I literally scrapped it. And then one of my mentors just said look, mate, no one cares, just get it up, you just need to start posting. And then I was just. I never stopped, essentially, and now I'd say I post consistently at least three times a week, sometimes five, depends on the week, depends how I'm feeling, and predominantly LinkedIn.
Speaker 1:Because I see some Insta posts.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, we actually hired a social media manager that looks after all of our HP people social accounts. So one of her KPIs is to post one piece of content on all platforms, monday to Friday, essentially. So she looks after a lot of the H people stuff Like. She comes up with a lot of the content. We have a lot of ideas as well that we sort of put forward to her. She works quite closely with the team in Australia, so I think they're going to do some funny videos and some humor and things like that that we're going to pump out soon.
Speaker 1:Nice Love that. Well, we've kind of dipped into a bit of the market mapping you were saying at the start, but I want to just spend a tiny bit of time here because you touched on going to Google Maps and very much geography related. But, was there much science behind it in terms of where you go, or was it like, well, we're not there, let's go there? What was your thought process when?
Speaker 3:you started. I think that the thought process behind it was because we'd been doing it for so many years that we had an idea of what areas we wanted to go to first, so we had a bit of a leg up on potential other rookie recruiters. So we knew certain areas that we wanted to work in initially and then say, for instance, it might be Richlands, out in the western suburbs of Brisbane. So from there it'd be mapping out all businesses in Richlands and then going out to Darragh and then going out to Acacia Ridge and then to Rockley, and then slowly your circumference is getting bigger and bigger and then your market, or your mapped market, your list is getting larger and larger and you're starting to get those contact decision makers.
Speaker 2:From there we do keep it completely geographical though. So that's how our desks are split. So there's literally roads that will have a desk essentially, so like a road will separate one desk from another desk. Okay, and the reason behind that there is some science to it as well is, if you're recruiting forklift operators, production workers, in a geographical area, you finish a recruit. You've got, you know, four, five, six candidates left over that you've potentially submitted through to that client that were unsuccessful for whatever reason.
Speaker 2:If, then, you've got to you know, turn your attention and then go and recruit somewhere on the north side all of those candidates are, then, you know, obviously going to get a job elsewhere and then when you come back down to the south side or wherever it was, to find another job, you've got to basically start the whole process again.
Speaker 2:So it's all about really concentrating your time and effort in your candidate pooling and sourcing so that when you finish a recruit here, you can then reverse market candidates out to that prospect BD list or your warming BD list essentially, which adds value to that company as well. Because you know, if they regularly recruit, say, store people, and you've got an experienced recruiter consistently adding value and saying hey, mate, you know this just crossed my desk. This guy's, you know, had great experience ABC. That's better than somebody just giving you a call and saying, hey, mate, you need any staff? Yeah, you know, do you need any staff? It's like, you know, it's easy to say no, but if you're really struggling and you do need staff and somebody puts a candidate in front of you for you know one of your reverse market channels, you know it's all I'd say. Every time we do a reverse market, we get a positive response from somebody and every day we're doing business development and we're adding more contacts to our prospect BD list. So our lists are just continuously growing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I reckon if, if recruiters are going from one area to another, it's really hard to build a bit of momentum, and I think that that's where recruiters can definitely get unstuck. Um, we made a very, very conscious decision not to go outside our geographic locations when we started the business build up an area, move to another, build up that area, move to another. Whereas if we say, launched in Gold Coast too early, then I don't think we would have had anywhere near as much traction as the northern suburbs of Brisbane because we'd have been spreading ourselves too thin, going to different areas. So that would probably be another tip, especially in temp recruitment into different areas. So that'd probably be another tip, especially in temp recruitment. I know Perm's a little bit different, but I think in temp recruitment it's super important to see if you can stay in your one geography and then expand from there when, like people that are going from one area to another, to another, you can't build that momentum, you can't build that candidate pool list and I think you start to fall under a little bit.
Speaker 2:You hit a ceiling yeah absolutely.
Speaker 1:I think that's from a candidate experience as well. Right, you've not placed them somewhere but, you can still work with them.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, yeah, definitely yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1:So, what makes you decide? You know, we should put more resources, more time, into a certain geography. Is it just the number of people.
Speaker 2:I guess it's how it's performing if you like.
Speaker 2:You know, if an area is really really going off and pumping, like you know, three of the desks at the moment are sort of leaning, getting towards a point where they're going to need additional support and those sorts of things and that's where you know we're going to be able to create opportunities for, you know, promotions and things within our team and management opportunities and those sorts of things. But, yeah, definitely be around the opportunity in that geographical area. You know we had a couple of opportunities presented to us, which is why we expanded interstate as well. Well, that's going to be my next question. There you go, there you go.
Speaker 1:Keep talking, Sam Keep talking.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, you know we build up a great reputation, we have awesome relationships with our clients and I guess you know one of the benefits about our space is a lot of our clients do have a presence nationally. So if they're in Brisbane they're more than likely in Sydney, melbourne and Perth. You know a couple of objections we're getting more recently as we get a bigger name in the industry. You know a lot of these big companies want one invoice point. You know they want one company to look after them on a national basis, which you know we can't do at this stage because we don't have a physical presence in some of the states, which was why we wanted to expand, obviously into those sort of four key locations. So, yeah, that was why the opportunity arose. A number of our clients personally reached out to us and said look, we're really struggling down in Melbourne. You know, is there anything? When are you guys establishing yourself down there? When are you establishing yourself down there?
Speaker 2:So, essentially, sort of, you know, 12 months ago, or so we sort of made that decision that that was what was going to happen, and then we put everything in place to ensure that. You know, we made that happen and we opened the office in February this year with a big Arthur down there.
Speaker 1:What are some of the learnings you've taken from that experience of going interstate, because that's obviously yeah, there's been a few oh. God, how long have we got Serge?
Speaker 2:Each state is just completely individual in how they operate. You know what I mean. Like they all come with their own relationships. Like, even if your client in Brisbane is saying, hey, when are you opening down in Melbourne, it doesn't necessarily mean that the company in Melbourne is 100% going to use your services which we have found, which isn't an issue because there's plenty more companies out there.
Speaker 2:I think another big one as well is the competitiveness. In some other cities, I think someone's just driven the margins down and this is quite widespread we're finding across Melbourne specifically at this stage. You know, some recruitment companies out there are doing us all a disservice by offering, you know, $1 and $2 margins. What a haze is it.
Speaker 1:Do you know who that is? We shan't bad mouth anyone.
Speaker 4:But do you know not to call them out, but do you know the agencies that are out there? Are they big?
Speaker 3:agencies, little agencies. It's actually a bit of a mixture of both, to be honest. There's some large national agencies that are driving margins down across the board, but there's also those little agencies that have got small overheads that it's like I'll do it at like $1.50 or a $2 margin. They'll get the work they won't be able to deliver. And then the client has an expectation of I'm only going to be paying X when you're charging Y and I was like, oh, and they'll send you charge rates.
Speaker 2:You're like, oh, can you match these? Yeah, no, we can't. You know we've walked away from so much more business down in Melbourne than we have accepted due to that. You know Right, you know I can only assume.
Speaker 4:Why do you think that is why?
Speaker 1:do you think Melbourne's like that, just the scale of? Yeah.
Speaker 3:Obviously, recruitment's a very competitive market, regardless of what state you're in. It's definitely a lot more in Melbourne we've found and that's probably a key lesson in ourselves is we did have clients that were interested in using our services, but we probably could have done a lot more research into the market and got a bit more market-related feedback before we made the decision to launch. I'm sure we still would have launched regardless, but probably a bit of a key takeaway from us is you can't just copy-paste. Can't copy what we did in brisbane and just expect it to take off in melbourne at the same rate you do explore it from brisbane first, like have somebody going into that market or just hire straight into oh, you did a little bit of recruitment for for melbourne.
Speaker 2:Um yeah, previous company we essentially sort of took this same path um and and before.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but short answer, no Like. For us, it's super critical that we've got boots on the ground. We want to make face-to-face relationships with all of our sites, whether it's white or blue. Collar is be able to go shake the hand of the decision maker and get a feel for the site. And when you're dealing in a temp space as well, like you need to be able to accurately describe the workplace and the location to the candidates, make sure that it's safe for them to work in, and I think it also builds your credibility when you're doing your health and safety onboarding as well.
Speaker 1:Okay, final question for me around positioning in the market mapping side, you kind of touched on meeting somebody within renewables, I think you said, but you're not in that space yet. Yeah, within renewables, I think you said, but you're not in that space yet. Yeah, what's your approach to new areas to go into, or are you just going to go deeper into what you are now?
Speaker 2:As in within our industries.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Any kind of slightly aligned industries that you might just go into, I think, like I'm not opposed to it, but we're I don't want the shiny ball. Nah, we're going to stick in our lane.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't want the shiny ball. Nah, we're going to stick in our lane.
Speaker 2:There's so many more specialisms within the two industries that we can explore into. Like you know, fergus Cox has just come on board leading our white-collar permanent division and I guess his background is heavily around industrial, fmcg, supply chain managers, procurement. That's one area ofM within manufacturing and logistics. We will have another specialism that just focuses on freight forwarding industry and white collar, specifically project coordinators and those sorts of roles within that space.
Speaker 3:There's a lot more expansion that we can do within logistics and manufacturing before we consider yeah, I think if you start to go down and like say I was, I'm going to do construction, now I'm going to do finance, now I'm going to do sales, or whatever it might be, is you start to lose a little bit of your focus. Um, and we've gotten to the position that we're in now by sticking to our lane and doing what we do well. Um, and I think if we start to diverge and go into a different industry or a different vertical, then we might lose a little bit of the focus. So it's super important for us to stay within our lane and for us, we want to be Australia's best manufacturing and logistics recruitment company.
Speaker 1:I think that's good advice, even for a recruiter. I know when I was doing sales recruitment I was doing FMCG predominantly. I remember thinking, hey, I want to try a bit of that because there's loads of money over there.
Speaker 2:You can water down what you're doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you might place it, but then you've got 100 candidates that will never get here. Absolutely 100%, that's it.
Speaker 2:And we can leverage off of our existing client base as well. We've got such a huge presence in that blue-collar space, especially across port logistics, that that entry now, which we've already started, into the freight forwarding space, is just a natural evolution, because we're already building relationships within these businesses. We're just basically cross-selling within that company. We're finding a new hiring manager that looks after a different division within that business and then we build a relationship with them. We help them build their teams as well.
Speaker 4:I want to move into relationship management. Build their teams as well. I want to move into relationship management. As a perm recruiter, I've always found it fascinating for temp recruiters on how they manage the relationships with their clients and their candidates. So I guess firstly, how do you position yourselves as a trusted partner in recruitment rather than just another recruiter?
Speaker 3:recruitment rather than just another recruiter. Yeah, I think this has probably come over years of evolution and like it's probably this a bit of a natural evolution of from when we first started to where we are now. And I think it's the conversations that you're holding with the decision makers and it's more about the risk for the business and especially at Sam and I, we're looking at more of a higher level when we're speaking to the decision maker or speaking to a senior leader and trying to give them the benefit and the return of investment of what they could be if they're partnering with a specialist agency such as us.
Speaker 4:Can I just dig deeper into that for a second? So you said a few keywords there. You talk about ROI, you talk about risk, you talk about these terminologies that are really important for hiring managers, business owners. Did you ever use that language when you were working at Hayes?
Speaker 3:Absolutely not no.
Speaker 4:No, not at all and so just out of curiosity, now that you're running a business and you truly understand ROI, risk and these decisions. Do you feel like you've got more context?
Speaker 3:on.
Speaker 3:I think I know what this guy's fear is and why he stays awake at night. Yeah, definitely, and that's from the mentors that we've been able to surround ourselves with and the personal development that we've put ourselves through, and super important to identify these areas for us and we're more looking at it as a partnership rather than a transaction. So if we can partner with a business and help them with their staffing requirements, then awesome and getting through the problems that they're facing Rather than I know that when I was at Hayes, it's like let's try to win a deal. I'm worried about my commission for the month.
Speaker 2:Now it's taking a different lens and more of a longer-term opportunity and partnership with businesses Shout out to the cost dog who helps upskill and train us in that area. Well, that was going to be my next question, if a recruiter is sitting there thinking what the hell does ROI mean?
Speaker 4:What the hell? What are you talking about? Risk here? We're talking about risk here. We're just trying to fill some jobs. Yeah, how can? How can a recruiter? What's the takeaway a recruiter can have right now on upskilling themselves and risk and ROI and, ultimately, the language of? Leaders what they look for like is there a course? Is there a person like who do you? Who could you potentially upskill yourself with to learn?
Speaker 3:yeah, I think that we're in a very fortunate position because we're surrounded by so many people at all levels above us. But if it was someone that might not have the same sort of group that we do have around us is finding some people online would be a starting block. There's some amazing authors out there and some amazing books that I've read over the years that have definitely helped shape me and get to a position where I'm comfortable to have these conversations or start to lean into different opportunities. But there's always people out there Like if you find someone in your space that's levels above you, then reach out and ask them if you can take them for a coffee and pick their brain. Most of the time people will give you the time of day.
Speaker 4:Love that. What's the mindset shift that temp recruiters need to go through to be able to become a successful temp recruiter? Is there a specific frame of mind? What should they be thinking about when they wake up out of bed? How should they be thinking and framing themselves before the day starts? Is there anything that you guys have implemented that helps create this level of kind of executive presence to build a temp?
Speaker 3:I think one of the big things is ownership. Like you need to own, own the process, so that's owning the mistakes as well, and I think if you can start to own the process, own the mistakes, own the relationships, then that's going to put you in a good stead moving forward. Ownership is a big one for me personally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely Just getting yourself into a bloody solid routine as well. I would say, with all of your activities that you get done every day, because that's going to put you in a good mindset. If you go into every week being prepared rather than floundering around, the outcome that you'll have at the end of the week is a lot stronger. Like just this financial year, we've implemented outcomes that matter and what a good week looks like, and that's all around mindset of the team and just knowing what outcomes we want to have achieved. You know what does a good week look like. What do you want to hopefully have achieved by the end of this week? Is it closing this deal? Is it getting a response from this client? Um, and then the outcomes that matter in our space are, you know, temp, uh, temp numbers, net increase, client interviews, cv send.
Speaker 3:What are those?
Speaker 4:numbers like what? What are the outcomes that matter? Do you have like a general ballpark of if you're hitting this metric, this metric and this metric? You might not be successful right now, but you just keep hitting that metric and it will get you to where you want to be.
Speaker 2:I mean like to give you an example, like one of my. What a good week looks like for this week is myself and Jory are targeted to fill one. You know a few perms a year ourselves, as well as a number on our head, and I've always recruited heavily in the transport allocator space. So one of my outcomes that I want to have by the end of this week is to connect with 20 new hiring managers that would hire a transport allocator. So that's an outcome that I want to achieve by the end of the week. I've said it, I've written it down and then, when it comes to you know if it's not going to happen by Wednesday which it will happen you know I'll have a word with myself and turn it around and make it happen. But yeah, that's just one of my outcomes and you know every week we want them to sort of essentially change as well. What a good week looks like.
Speaker 4:So it's a moving, growing, evolving.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think if you continually to push the needle a little bit forward and you can set some goals from the outset. If you hit 80% of your goals each week, week in, week out, then by natural evolution you're going to become better in all areas of life, whether that's in recruitment or your personal. So it's been a big focus of us and again shout out to Matty that he's sort of helped us get aligned on this particularly is how we're going to drive the business forward, and a lot of that is to do with mindset and a lot of that is to do with goals and keeping everyone accountable to their numbers and keeping everyone accountable to what they're looking to achieve, whether that's on a financial year, from a GP target standpoint, whether that's personally. So for us it's getting those triggers in place and making sure that everyone understands the journey that they're about to go on and making sure that everyone's moving forward. We've got performance pillars for this year and one of them is about momentum. So continually moving forward.
Speaker 2:Love that I think you can get lost in just the day to day. You know and and just operating, and then you know that you, you risk not being a high performer and just operating. So you know these little things that you can anyone can implement them.
Speaker 2:It doesn't matter whether you know your, your manager or whether the business is sort of driving them down, like if you're a recruiter and you want to really elevate yourself and become a high-performing recruiter. You know, implement a few of these things that you know we're learning about now that have proven to push the needles in other businesses.
Speaker 4:My final curiosity around relationship management is the frequency on how often you talk to your current clients. So do you have like a routine? Is it like once a week we'll just dial in and say, hey, what's up Like? What is the frequency and the rhythm look like when maintaining relationships? It?
Speaker 2:depends on the size of the account. I would say Our whole team. Get into a habit as a minimum, even if it's a small account with one person working there religiously. We call them every Monday, every Monday, every Monday, every Monday. What do you talk to them about? Ask them how that person's performing, how they're going? It's a good chance to check in. Do you connect with them every Monday?
Speaker 4:or maybe you don't speak to them for a few weeks? Yeah, I'd say. Most of the time they do, they should be answering our calls.
Speaker 2:That's the relationships. Just to say, you know, is there anything happening in this week that I need to know about? Is anything happening? Have you heard anything coming up in the next few weeks that you know we need to start preparing for? So, basically, just, yeah, just finding out whether there's any upcoming jobs or people that they might need in the near future.
Speaker 2:On your larger accounts, it's not uncommon to speak to these people on a daily basis, depending on how many people you've got in there, because you know if you've got 10, 15, 20 people within a business, you know there's always going to be things going on, things happening. There's always, you know, potentially going to be the requirement. You know you'll always be hiring more, more positions as well. So it might be submitting a candidate, you know it might be following up on an interview that happened yesterday. But yeah, sometimes there there can be very, very high touch accounts that that we look after. But because our consultants look after a geographical area, it naturally means that their desk is filled up of small, medium and large clients. So, depending on the size of the business and the requirement, yeah, definitely as a minimum on a weekly basis.
Speaker 3:And that doesn't necessarily just be the recruiter that's calling the account or the client contact in there as well. Like we've got a resourcing team as well that will reach out and they'll speak to the hiring managers as well. Build relationships so that hiring manager is getting relationships across the HP people business and whether it's from Sam and I or one of the consultants or one of the resourcing team, they're building key relationships across the board.
Speaker 1:For sure, nice. I want to get into value proposition and how you pitch yourselves. Yeah, um, I remember coaching consultants when you're in big, big agency, like you guys both were, we'd often coach on the scale of how big we were and what we could cover and all that kind of stuff. I'm curious as to how you coach your consultants now to differentiate themselves when you're two years in doing very well but and you might be competing with these bigger agencies.
Speaker 3:I don't think it really matters going against a big agency these days, Not as much as it might've might've had previously. Like people buy off people they like. Um, I don't think typically that that companies are buying off because of the brand that you're working for. We're really heavily invested in personal development for us as well as our team, so we get all of the guys to go through Swiss training. They're all on board in high-performance coaching through XRecruiter, so everyone's got a bit of a different pitch of what they're going through to the line managers. A lot of the guys have got experience from working in the industry as well, like Lenny.
Speaker 3:Like he's a trade qualified person in a prior life to recruitment, so that leans into his pitch when he's speaking to clients Depends on everyone's personal story Like everyone pitches and talks completely different, like whether they're an introvert or an extrovert, and I think that's leaning into what works for them depending on the sales training that they're getting. So Swish has been awesome in that space and obviously the high performance coaching with Matt everyone's sort of getting a little bit out of it or what they want to apply when they're going through to their pitches with prospects.
Speaker 2:For sure and I guess to pitch on the business like HP would just specialize in manufacturing and logistics recruitment. All of our consultants specialize on a certain specialism or area within those industries and we also only specialize in a certain geographical area. So you know, if you're a business on the south side of Brisbane and you're talking to say Lenny, lenny is consistently interviewing between sort of four, five, six, sometimes eight people on a daily basis. So when he understands the requirements of your specific warehouse be it a CRM you use or a system or a machine or something along those lines it's quite handy that you know Lenny's got an army of you know, a candidate pool of you know maybe 100 compliant candidates that he can handpick somebody that matches your business requirements and lives extremely local to your site. In addition to that as well, love it.
Speaker 1:Um. I want to talk a little bit about overseas employees. You guys have um done an incredible job. What I can see of um integrating overseas employees yeah business very quickly. Can you talk to us a bit about that? How it's um, how it's gone? What's any areas of challenge?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean we've sort of been integrating overseas employees for about four years or so. It started at a previous business where I guess we were sort of figuring out how it worked.
Speaker 3:Like.
Speaker 2:I see some companies that try and outsource tasks specific like this is your task for the day, and they don't really get much interaction with the team and naturally we see that you know, potentially it doesn't work out. The staff get disengaged, they don't see value and they tend to leave. And I guess over the years we've I guess we didn't realize we were doing it, but we've just developed like a bit of a blueprint about how we do it and essentially the best way within a recruitment firm we get the benefit is to partner them one-on-one with a consultant. So say, kurt, for instance, looks after the north side of Brisbane. For us Kurt is now partnered 100% full-time with Kaz, who works remotely from the Philippines. They essentially, you know we treat them as staff of H-People, they are no different. We have morning huddles every single morning at 8.30 in the morning. Every single person within the business is on those calls. 8.30 in the morning, every single person within the business is on those calls.
Speaker 2:You know Kurt and Kaz will give a joint rundown of their desk priorities and wins and things that you know they want to have an outcome for for the day. But essentially it's taking a consultant and partnering them up with someone remotely so that they can work in partnership to achieve an outcome for the desk. So, whether that be, you know, a financial target, um the, the split that it always starts off being is um, the consultant will focus majority of their time on business development activities and the resourcer will focus their time on, you know, candidate sourcing activities. While they're doing their them, candidate sourcing activities. While they're doing them, candidate sourcing activities, they also work in partnership with the business development because they're speaking to, you know, sometimes 70 candidates on a daily basis, so they're speaking to 70.
Speaker 2:The resourcer is speaking to 70 people on a daily basis and interviewing between four to eight on a daily basis. So, while they're speaking to them, that's 70 people that are working for our competitors and are working for other agencies. So you know, we have a lead spreadsheet where we'll put you know a traitor client, a client that's using another agency, and then we'll have the agency that they're using.
Speaker 2:And then Kurt, tomorrow when he's ringing, he can actually ring that company up and say hey look, I interviewed a candidate yesterday and he mentioned that he was working, you know, at your site through this company. Just thought I'd introduce myself. This is what I do, so they sort of work hand in hand. It goes well with reference checking as well. You know we're taking a reference check. You know our remote staff do a lot of our compliance tasks, so they take a lot of that heavy lifting off of our consultants as well when they're doing a reference check from a business.
Speaker 2:We've just added in a very soft question at the end, you know, which is do you use the services of recruitment company? Have you ever utilized the services of a recruitment company within your business? Yes, no. Would it be okay if someone from our business reached out and spoke to you? So we've added, like you know, two questions at the end of every reference check, which is a task that you know our team in the Philippines perform, and then that flows into potential leads for our consultant to follow up on the next morning. So they just work 100% in partnership and you know I definitely would not change it for the for the world.
Speaker 3:No, I think the key, the key word that Sam's mentioned there is partnership. Um, like they're they're definitely an integral part of the business and we work with them on, like, on an hour by hour basis, so it's just like having a left-hand man, essentially. Um, but yeah, like, like Sam touched on, I definitely wouldn't change it. I think the reason that we've been so successful is that integration is a wider into the actual business, as opposed to outsourcing tasks that a recruiter may no longer want to do. It's about how do we win as a team? What do we need to do to win as a team to achieve the outcome that matters? And like the resourcing team as well, like, they're rewarded with commission as well. So they're all high performers. So, along with them, working in partnership with the consultant, it's in their best interest to get great candidates for the consultant to interview, to then place into employment, so then they can also receive commission, so they're incentivized by that too, for sure.
Speaker 4:So you've mentioned a few things there that I probably want to just get some clarity on. So the first thing was what outcomes you're looking for from these remote resources? So the first thing is are you saying that they're calling candidates and they're interviewing candidates.
Speaker 4:Yes, okay, so they're on the. Yes, yeah, okay, so they're on the phones to your candidates. Yes, was there any insecurities around? They've obviously got an accent, but was there any insecurities that you had around your brand, your reputation, how this is going to come across to you. Know a candidate getting a call from someone overseas? Does it feel like they're getting?
Speaker 3:a call from someone overseas.
Speaker 4:Does it feel like they're getting a call?
Speaker 3:from someone overseas. I think maybe initially there might've been that hesitation or that in the back of your mind, but absolutely not now. Whether that's them speaking to candidates or them speaking to clients, they're all high performers as well, like they've got targets that they're looking to achieve and they're all degree qualified. They've all got experience in recruitment. They've been doing it for a number of years. They're excellent on the phones. In terms of an accent, a lot of them have a bit of an American twang, but in terms of like, the actual communication piece, like, I don't think anyone would know if they're from the Philippines or if they're from Australia.
Speaker 4:That's really interesting. So they reference check they. Yeah, that's really interesting. So they reference check. They call potential references yeah, they call candidates. Yes, what else do they do?
Speaker 2:Yeah, they do a lot of pre-screening, so they'll pre-screen candidates every morning and then actually line up and organise interviews for the afternoon. We're actually starting at the moment. They're like Kaz Selma. Yeah, a few of them are actually starting to hold the interviews themselves where the consultant isn't actually even going to be a part of it. At the moment, the consultants are sitting in with their camera off and actually listening and observing and training and making sure that there's no gaps, that absolutely everything that would have been covered in an interview that the consultant would hold is being held in the same interview, with the same notes and those sorts of things and whether that's being covered off, like we have one-on-ones with all the resourcing team as well and identifying areas that they might need to improve upon or areas that they're looking to upskill in.
Speaker 3:A lot of them want to get more involved in business development as well, so that's the case of how do we integrate that into some of our existing clientele. So they would be liaising or speaking with existing clients who we're working with warm or hot clients of H people and starting to build a relationship with those hiring managers as well. So they're starting to look a little bit more of the end-to-end piece for us and compliance as well.
Speaker 2:So they look after a lot of our compliance, like before we can, before we can send a candidate to work, there's like a number, a number of checks that we've had to go through, you know registration form, sometimes police checks, sometimes medicals, reference checks, validating tickets, checking licenses, you know it. I was chatting to someone from another recruitment company and they mentioned that it can take up to three hours for them to get a candidate compliant of the consultant's time.
Speaker 4:That was going to be my next question. How much time back have your consultants got now to focus on revenue generating activities?
Speaker 3:100%, I'd say, at least they've gained an extra 30 to 40 hours. Yes, easily Wow.
Speaker 2:Especially when you're working in such harmony Like obviously it takes a few weeks to sort of get into that groove so that they each know what they're supposed to be doing.
Speaker 2:But we just communicate constantly. It's almost like they're not in the Philippines, it's almost like they're just working from home. You know, we're, we're. You know, I'd say in a day I'd probably have more than 10 video teams calls with the team. You know, just give them a quick call, have a quick face time with them. Run through, run through, um, you know a few questions or something that I had, um speaking to the, messaging them constantly. Yeah, so know they really do feel valued and they know how much of a difference that they are making. You know to the desk and you know, working with their consultant to hate people and the lives they're changing as well by finding people. You know their forever jobs.
Speaker 4:It sounds like you've really nailed the process, the rhythm, the KPIs of a VA, and I don't want to load you guys up with extra responsibilities, but if someone's listening and goes I like the sound of that would they be able to reach out to you and pick your brain?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely yeah. We always welcome, you know, anyone within the industry. Reach out to us, ask us how we've done it, what hasn't worked. We're always here to share and those sorts of things. I think yeah.
Speaker 3:I think for that because we've been fortunate and we've reached out to mentors or we've spoken to people that are further ahead on the journey than we have been and they've given us the time that um, it only makes sense that if anyone wanted to reach out and and um have a bit of a conversation or ask what has or hasn't worked or any fears that they might have for us, we'd certainly welcome to help anyone that's on that journey.
Speaker 1:Nice, just another excuse for some overseas trips, I'm sure as well. Yeah, we actually just got back from the Philippines. Yeah, it was our first time over there.
Speaker 2:I think we've been back. What three?
Speaker 2:or four weeks now and it was such an amazing trip to actually actually go over and and meet our our whole outsourced or our remote team over in the philippines, and we're fortunate enough to spend a week with them in in mccarty where we had an office and we had videographers come in and you know you'll start seeing a lot more sort of content from awesome from our remote team being published on on our linkedins at the moment and those sorts of things. So, yeah, so excited to share that with everybody.
Speaker 1:Big shout out to them yeah, it's been an amazing job, a hundred percent. Yeah, that's it, that's it. So if recruiters could take away one key thing from today, we've covered a lot of ground, I think. But what do you think it would be? I'll ask you both independently, I guess, jory, what do you think it would be? I'll ask you both independently, I guess.
Speaker 3:Jory, what do you think? I think persistence is the big thing and momentum, I think the big thing is especially when you're in the early stages. And I'll probably reference Harry here again is when Harry came on board. We said, mate, the first year in recruitment, especially in your desk you're about to get into, is so difficult, and we could see about that sort of six month mark that it was really having a bit of a drain on him. As I made you this need to keep pushing, because the activity that you're putting in.
Speaker 3:Now you're about to see rewards and when you don't have any rewards and you can't see him coming, you can't see him coming through. Then it can be a bit of like an empty promise. But now he's sitting. He's like oh, thank God I've held in there because he's now seeing so many rewards come through, so many new clients come on board. He had nine starters yesterday. He had 11 client interviews yesterday.
Speaker 2:Oh, he is absolutely flying. You know, his desk has doubled in three weeks. He even said three, but it's not because of what he's done in that three weeks, because I had my one-on-one with him yesterday and he couldn't believe that he's doubled his numbers in three weeks. Because he honestly doesn't feel like he's doing anything different to what he's been doing. He's just like mate, I feel like I'm doing the exact same thing, but everything's just like falling into place and there's, just like bro-ish, consistency. It is discipline.
Speaker 3:The mantra of activity breeds activity.
Speaker 3:That's it. Anyone that's starting off, whether it's blue collar, white collar, temp or perm, it's just about putting in the reps and it's this consistency. I think any rookie recruiter coming in and like we've all been around the space for a number of years, there's so much turnover in that first year especially and you haven't sort of spent that time understanding your craft or understanding your industry or your new role to actually get those rewards coming through. So it's super and me and Sam is super juiced up about it because we can see that Harry's starting to get these rewards coming through. And that's just about the momentum and the consistency 100%.
Speaker 2:Anything different from you, sam. Oh no, I was going to say, yeah, consistency and discipline. You know, be disciplined with making sure that you know who you're going to call next week and don't go into the week sort of floundering around not really knowing. I mean, I work really heavily off of BD Spreadsheet. So I got my market mapping spreadsheet, I've got my warming client spreadsheet and then I've got my deals tab as well. So I sort of work off of three different sort of platforms. But consistency with your business development is so easy not to make the calls. You know, if you're out on meetings at nine o'clock and that interrupts your morning BD scheduled window, do one at one o'clock till two 30. Just keep you know. If you, if you keep that consistency going, if you're disciplined with with what you're going to do, you will succeed and you'll run over everybody else that's not doing that, because they'll just have their certain clients. They're certain. You know the hiring managers might leave, they might lose clients and they, they, uh, they'll flounder around. But yeah, consistency is key love that.
Speaker 4:Awesome insights. Um, are we ready to move on to our game?
Speaker 1:I'm not loving this game anymore. I lost last week, did you yeah?
Speaker 4:The game is are you smarter than Ed?
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 3:Yes, that's the game.
Speaker 4:Okay.
Speaker 3:All right good.
Speaker 2:Now I am the. The show host.
Speaker 4:The host. Yes, I'm the show host.
Speaker 2:Can you do us like an intro? I'm Peter.
Speaker 4:Welcome to Ed. How are you smarter than Ed? Maybe we've got. Do we have like a sound on this?
Speaker 3:Oh, you know how it sounds like you have just pressed that button.
Speaker 2:All right, now we're smarter than Ed. You've just cancelled the podcast and deleted everything. Huh.
Speaker 1:You just pressed the button, it everything, huh, you just press the button. It might be mute. There we go.
Speaker 4:Oh, usually you can put sounds on this, Don't touch anything. Bt. And then when you transition, you go transition. Yeah, okay, are you smarter than Ed? So we've got, we've got a bunch of questions here and it's best of 10.
Speaker 3:You're so competitive, best of 10.
Speaker 4:Best out of 10. Best out of 10.
Speaker 3:Best out of 10.
Speaker 4:Best out of 10.
Speaker 1:Hands on your legs. Hands on your legs.
Speaker 4:One winner takes all, while the losers face a mystery challenge they won't see coming.
Speaker 3:Okay, righty-o, all right.
Speaker 4:Hands need to be on your knees, in your lap, just to make sure it's fair for everyone. Is it 2v1? Again, it's 2v1.
Speaker 3:You got this big fella.
Speaker 4:Okay, Question one. The quote life is like a box of chocolates.
Speaker 1:He's quick, forrest Gump? Yeah, ed's off the board.
Speaker 4:I need a pen to keep track of this Sergio.
Speaker 1:Just keep two piles. Yeah, good thinking, oh okay. Yeah, good idea, all right.
Speaker 4:That's Ed All right. Good idea, all right, that's Ed All right. Next question One zero.
Speaker 1:What industry do many regional? Recruiters in Queensland and WA focus on Resources mining of resources, oil and gas, things like that.
Speaker 2:Paul Ed, I think he knows the question. You give him the questions. Okay, I reckon he took the name last night.
Speaker 1:All right, next question he's pressing the button before you've even said it. I know Run Steph.
Speaker 4:Okay. Third question what is the average global fee charged for a permanent placement by recruitment agencies? A 5% he's done an edge. B 10%, C, 20% to 30%, D, 5%. B he's done an ed. B 10%, C, 20% to 30%, D, 50% I'm going to go 20% to 30%. That's right, that's correct.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:Page people's on the board Fair enough. You just ring it and then, get the yeah, okay. Should we?
Speaker 1:just say we've got to hear the answers before you ring it. No, I didn't even realise it was multiple choice. Yeah, it is multiple choice, all of them. I don't read out the multiple choice because, it gets buzzed.
Speaker 3:All of them are multiple choice, oh, okay.
Speaker 4:I've never had a chance to go through the A, B, C, D yet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've noticed.
Speaker 4:This will be an interesting one. What professional networking site is most commonly used for recruitment? Linkedin, yeah, shit All right, it's 3 Ed, 1 H people. This isn't fair. Okay, which Australian city is closest?
Speaker 3:to Antarctica. It's A Darwin B.
Speaker 4:Melbourne C, Sydney D, Hobart, Hobart.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's H people Mate you gave it to him.
Speaker 4:Mate.
Speaker 3:I was going to go with a state and I was like Hobart or Launceston.
Speaker 2:Wait for the answers. Okay, cool, I got this.
Speaker 4:All right, we should definitely get this one, we yeah.
Speaker 2:All right.
Speaker 4:It's three to Ed, 2 to H people, which Australian city is famous for hosting Olympics. That's incorrect.
Speaker 1:Sydney Alright forfeit.
Speaker 4:Which Australian city is famous for hosting the Australian Open Tennis Tournament? A Sydney, b Melbourne, c Brisbane.
Speaker 2:Let me get one in Melbourne.
Speaker 4:Melbourne, that's it. We need some tighter rules around here. Oh, this is an interesting one. I want another recruitment one. Is it one that I wrote, or?
Speaker 1:not Okay.
Speaker 4:Okay, okay, which Australian state typically has the highest volume of recruitment activity?
Speaker 2:Who got that, who got?
Speaker 4:that A Queensland, b Victoria, c Western Australia, D New South Wales.
Speaker 1:I'm going to go for New South Wales Correct. That's what I would have gone for. All right, it's 4 Correct.
Speaker 4:That's what I would have gone for. All right, it's 4-3. That was just those two.
Speaker 3:That means if he gets this next one, he wins no the best of 10, so he needs two more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sudden death we both have five All right.
Speaker 4:Which recruitment firm coined the phrase shaping the world of work?
Speaker 3:Hayes.
Speaker 1:No, randstad, you had a buzz.
Speaker 4:Randstad, Randstad, right Hayes diesel.
Speaker 2:I got technicalities.
Speaker 4:Okay.
Speaker 2:I like the recruitment. We need to get these two. This is going to be an easy one for the equivalents.
Speaker 4:We need to get these two. This is going to be an easy one for the big fella. The big fella to my right. Okay, michael Page, is part of what global parent company? A Page Group?
Speaker 1:Page Group, you've got to get this boys.
Speaker 4:Oh God, Okay, who won the most Formula One World Championships?
Speaker 1:Lewis Hamilton.
Speaker 4:Correct.
Speaker 2:Eddie's got us. Congratulations, Ed.
Speaker 4:You are now officially smarter than HP.
Speaker 2:Yeah, these are tailored not well for us.
Speaker 4:All right. So what does that mean for HP? Oh God.
Speaker 2:Oh you've got to do.
Speaker 4:How hot is it? A shot of hot sauce, oh God.
Speaker 1:Maybe you can just choose somebody to do it, Sam you're up, I'll pour it out.
Speaker 2:I need some milk.
Speaker 1:It's actually not too bad. I'll give you a better number I did last week.
Speaker 4:Mate, look I'm going to bring in some hot sauce from home mate, we're going to have to really ramp this up. Is it hot or what sauce is it?
Speaker 1:It's like Tabasco yeah there's a lot of arborist effects I found with that.
Speaker 2:Or burn and ring a fire. Yeah, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 1:But listen, guys, thank you so much for joining us. I know we've kind of touched on it, but if anyone listening wants to get in touch with you, is there a good way to do it?
Speaker 2:Send us a message on LinkedIn, probably the easiest way. If we're connected, you will more than likely have seen our faces and videos. So, yeah, don't be shy, feel free to reach out Better together. Always our faces and videos. So, yeah, don't be shy, feel free to reach out better together. I'm always always happy to help out the recruitment community Love that, thank you. Thanks, lads, no worries the end.
Speaker 4:The end.