Talking Pondo: The Love Witch and Blade Runner (The Final Cut)

 In this episode, Marty gives Clif the movie The Love Witch to watch and Clif gives Marty the movie Blade Runner to watch. 

It’s a milestone episode for Talking Pondo. Hosts Clif and Marty hit 200 movies covered, and for the occasion, they’re finally recording in the same room.

First up is The Love Witch. A visually stunning throwback to ‘60s and ‘70s exploitation cinema. Is it feminist commentary, campy homage, or just beautifully crafted nonsense? Clif and Marty dig into the film’s deliberate style, bizarre performances, and whether the “bad on purpose” approach actually works.

Then it’s on to Blade Runner (The Final Cut) one of the most dissected sci-fi films of all time. With multiple versions floating around, they debate which cut works best, the value of narration, and how the film holds up after decades of analysis.

#TalkingPondo #MoviePodcast #FilmPodcast #TheLoveWitch #BladeRunner #BladeRunnerFinalCut #CultMovies #FilmDiscussion #MovieReview 

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

She, you know, she's doing some of the same stuff that, you know, I feel like a man would do in that situation if it was a reverse story, right?

SPEAKER_01 0:10

It's the presentation. But the presentation's the reverse story is the party animal. To a certain extent. It's all of these love potion number nine. She's kind of a mad scientist. It's almost like, is it really witchcraft? Or is she just drugging people?

SPEAKER_02 0:24

A little bit of both, right?

SPEAKER_01 0:25

Yeah, a little bit of both, right?

SPEAKER_03 0:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 0:27

You can interpret it that way. I'm like, hey, look, it falls into that genre of love potion movie.

SPEAKER_03 0:32

Um, she's welcome to season four of Talking Pondo. Talking Pondo is a podcast where Cliff and Marty give each other a film to watch and talk about them in detail. Some episodes will include a special guest.

SPEAKER_01 0:53

And we're back. Your joke? Oh, yeah. Okay. I know, it's just weird. You're staring at me. He's in the same room. It's crazy. Witch Witch will not be eaten this week, so we may bring you the following sandwich. That's terrible.

SPEAKER_03 1:14

That's uh yeah. Well, you know, they can't all be bangers, right? If they're all bangers, then you know, you're a genius and you leave this podcast to become the next Billy Crystal, right? Do America's Sweethearts Part two.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Part due. Especially after 200 episodes. No, it hasn't been 200 episodes. 200 movies this week. You'd think the jokes would uh sometimes I watch these movies and I forget the joke. Sometimes I watch these movies and I forget the quote. Because you get so wrapped up in the movie and you start recording and you go, where's your joke? Oh shit, I didn't write one. I hear you. And then you end up with the opening of today's show. You could have, you know, Tyrell Company perfecting a love potion will not be seen this week, or something along those lines, or Deckert is put under a spell.

SPEAKER_03 2:09

Yeah, you could do um Sean Penn, Sean Penn, you know, Sean Penn tries out for the love witch or something like that. We accidentally Sean Penn Sean Penn works at Worch Wit or not Sean Penn, Sean uh what's her name?

SPEAKER_01 2:22

Yeah, we accidentally cast uh Sean Penn instead of Sean Young.

SPEAKER_03 2:26

Sean Young, there it is. Sean Young works at Witch Witch, waiting to be cast in the last witch. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Yeah, the same year's Fast Times, so imagine a uh cast swap between Blade Runner and Fast Times at Regemont High.

SPEAKER_03 2:38

Sean Young. Imagine Sean Penn as Spicoly as Roy in Blade Runner. You hear me, AI? Get on it. There you go. Yeah, you you AI geniuses out there that claim that Hollywood's cooked and uh with your 15-second fucking videos off of C Dance 2.0, yeah, shoot us with some of that shit. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 2:56

I dare you. Yeah. Do it.

unknown 3:00

Do it.

SPEAKER_01 3:00

Do it now. Do it. Well, it's Talking Pondo. We're back once again. We're in the same room because it's 200 movies covered. Yeah, that's exactly why.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

I flew out here specifically for the 200th movie coverage on the for the podcast. That's exactly why I did it. It has nothing to do with the fact that we're in pre-production. Yeah. And that we're doing a bunch of other stuff. I'm here specifically for this podcast episode.

SPEAKER_01 3:23

So it might sound a little different. Yeah. But actually being in the same room. It's fucking weird, dude. It helps me not talk when you're talking, because I see you, even though you're on the webcam.

SPEAKER_03 3:34

Yeah. No, no, no. I know exactly what you mean. I know exactly what you mean. Alright, so this week we got a couple of fucking bangers for 199 and 200.

SPEAKER_01 3:43

Yeah. Well, 199 was The Love Witch. Mm-hmm. And 200 was Blade Runner, the Final Cut. The final cut.

SPEAKER_03 3:50

Which is the cut that Ridley Scott says he wants you to win.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

It's like the fifth version. Yes. I personally prefer the narration. I do too. Well we will get into this and our reasons why. I'll bypass the listener mail. I don't want to interrupt the stream. Sure? Yeah, we'll do it next time. Okay. Or maybe the time after, but it's still coming. You know, we still keep getting listener mail, which is good. I'll say that Derek hit me up about sinners.

SPEAKER_03 4:18

I was like, I you know I see how he was hit me up on Facebook and was like, I see you're about to watch this, and I'm wondering what your reaction's gonna be. So I'm very curious to hear what he had to say about our episode. I don't think he enjoyed it very much.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

Eh? It was an episode. What did it? Yeah, I mean, maybe people were just tired of hearing about sinners. It wasn't one of our most listened to episodes. See what we get for chasing that dollar. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:44

I mean, look, it's a it's a it's a it's a cool musical vampire movie. I mean, leave it alone. Good lord. Who cares?

SPEAKER_01 4:50

And then then we switched to weapons. Uh-huh. And then we've switched to the love witch. See, it's all we've gone from vampires to witches.

SPEAKER_03 5:00

And this is two very different witches, because weapons is the whole Ooh, it's a scary witch. Creepy witch. And this is sexy witch.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

So once again, mixing things up, uh, I guess you're gonna have to use your phone to look at the IMDB summary. Crazy, huh? Yes. Who would have imagined? But as one critic said, what is well no. So the critic didn't say what is, I'm saying what is. But I'm paraphrasing one random critic. What is this like a lost hammer film known as The Love Witch?

SPEAKER_03 5:43

The Love Witch 2016 unrated two hours. Longer on Roku TV. With the commercials, you're not kidding. A mod a modern day witch uses spells and magic to get men to fall in love with her with deadly consequences. That's your log line. Uh your storyline. Let's see here, where is it? Uh plot summary, thank you. Elaine, a beautiful young witch, is determined to find a man to love her. In her gothic Victorian apartment, she makes spells and potions and then picks up men and seduces them. However, her spells work too well, and she ends up with a string of hapless victims. When she finally meets the man of her dreams, her desperation to be loved will drive her to the brink of insanity and murder. With a visual style that pays tribute to technicolor thrillers of the 1970s, the love witch explores female fantasy and the repercussions of pathological narcissism. Is that what happened? I guess.

SPEAKER_01 6:39

I was with you a little bit, and then it kind of like went off into its own personal interpretation there, the IMDB summary.

SPEAKER_03 6:46

I feel like a lot like I read uh some reviews on this and a bit of the Wikipedia, and I feel like a lot of people are projecting onto this movie a bit, where they're like, well, it's a it's you know, it's it's a uh female empowerment. And I'm like, uh oh, okay, I guess. Then that means that all those movies back then were right, like every we're gonna get into that a little.

SPEAKER_01 7:05

I mean, we we can jump right right into that, you know. Uh it's funny as as time goes on and you look back at these, you know, Russ Meyer movies or even the Andy Sidera Savage Beach and stuff, and you look at them in modern eyes and you go, wait a minute, somebody considered this like really sexy and scandalous at one time, and now it's like it's so over-the-top ridiculous that to me the only thing left that comes through is the feminism. It's like it's transgressed to like, oh, that's just a Chuck Norris movie, rest in peace, but with the woman with the machine gun instead, like in the Nanny Sederis movie, because there's nothing sexy left because the movie's 50 years old. I I don't even know if I see it as feminism. I mean, I well, it's accidental how it transgresses over the time. It just like these exploitation movies just kind of turn into female empowerment over the years. I mean, I I I guess I'm projecting.

SPEAKER_03 8:06

I guess if you say that that because the the the protagonist of the movie is a woman, yeah, and therefore it's female empowerment. Okay, I I think female for me, female empowerment needs to be more like like when I think of female empowerment, I think of movies like Norma Ray. Oh, of course. Right? And shit like that. Not softcore porn like the love witch. I don't find that female and maybe and look, write in and tell me I am completely fucking wrong. Maybe I don't understand, but to me it doesn't seem very empowering. It just seems like it's a female and protagonist, and that's great. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

I think it's a reflection on those movies that like the Russ Meyer type movies as they've gotten older and then doing a reflection on how they've transgressed and how like that I mean to me, those Russ Meyer movies feel so exploited exploitative, though.

SPEAKER_03 8:54

I have trouble finding a feminist, you know, kind of trope or a feminist thing in it.

SPEAKER_01 8:59

But they become so almost hokey with age. I hear you.

SPEAKER_03 9:03

I hear you that but these other people are we viewing it through the water lenses.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

It was before the age of irony, you know.

SPEAKER_03 9:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:12

When those movies came out. And old men's in trench coats used to go to that, and now it's like people like the director of The Love Witch celebrating these films. I think the audience changed a little. They've become more camp or almost John Waters-esque as the time keeps going.

SPEAKER_03 9:29

To be fair, the Love Witch is definitely it is not a Russ Meyer movie, it is not a hammer film, in the fact that, like, for instance, Beyond the Valley of the Dolls, right? Like, there's so there it goes way beyond what The Love Witch does. The Love Witch dwells a little bit in it story-wise, but it doesn't do the weird wild swings and extremes that things like Beyond the Super Vixens, Beyond the Valley of the Dolls, and some of these other fucking movies, even some of Ed Wood's nudie cuties are in this thing. You know, it just it feels very much of that time period, right?

SPEAKER_01 10:04

It's a mixture.

SPEAKER_03 10:05

It's a very much a mixture. I'll start off by saying it looks fucking great. Right, right. Like she shot it on film. I think she she wrote, edited, produced, uh, directed, did what, the costume work, the set work. Yeah, the only thing she didn't do was shoot the motherfucker, right? Cinematographer, she got a really, really good cinematographer who was who knew how to use this old equipment and this old and get that old style and that look, and she nailed it.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:32

That hard lighting, that the you know, the those great close-ups on her eyes with the makeup, even the makeup is kind of perfect.

SPEAKER_01 10:38

It the makeup usually in these type of movies doesn't look right and it pulls you out. Yeah. This one might be tricked thinking, is this from the 60s? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:48

Do you remember the the you'll remember it? It's the one with Oh my goodness. He was in some of Ed Wood's films, and then of course the other girl, the the vampire woman, but they were in this movie together where it's a it's a witch and she's it's a coven, but yet it's just an excuse for women to come out and dance.

SPEAKER_01 11:05

Oh, that's Orgy of the Dead.

SPEAKER_03 11:07

Orgy of the Dead. This felt very much like Orgy of the Dead at certain points, right?

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Pulling from that aesthetic. That's it. We've been doing these movies lately that the a few of them have been about style over substance. Yet here the style is the substance in a way. It's kind of the point of the whole thing. Yes. Kind of unlike the Heartless Jawbreaker, but you kind of need to be in the bitchy mood for that one. You put that one on when you're like, ah, these fucking assholes.

SPEAKER_03 11:36

Yeah, you had a bad day in high school and put jawbreaker on and think about killing everybody for sure.

SPEAKER_01 11:40

This is a different movie about killing people.

SPEAKER_03 11:43

This one, this one is um, like you said, it's I do think it's style over substance. I think where it fails miserably is in its story. Its dialogue is god-awful. And I and I think on purpose.

SPEAKER_01 11:55

That's incredibly specific, I think.

SPEAKER_03 11:57

Yeah, definitely on purpose. I mean, uh, the acting is a kind of acting called presentational acting, which is a a dead form of acting that nobody fucking does anymore. And it's specifically for you kind of died in the 60s.

SPEAKER_01 12:12

And that's the trick. They make you think that this is an old movie because it even has that style.

SPEAKER_03 12:18

Then fucking stop putting it in in modern cars with cell phones and all of a sudden. Because then that's where I start to go, fuck. Well, she shot the whole damn thing on a soundstage, or a lot of it on a soundstage. It just feels like if she'd gone a little bit further and tried to get that modern stuff out and really made a 70s movie, she would have pulled this really amazing thing off.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

Compared to what a lot of people try with these things, this is a really good job. And she integrates those new things into the story, anyways.

SPEAKER_03 12:47

And we keep saying she, but um, I'm gonna bring her name up here. Her name is um, I'm so sorry about that. Uh, apologies. Her name is Anna Biller. Yeah. And I mean, again I I get it. Like you're trying to emulate this beyond the Valley of the Dolls, these these hammer films, but you've got to give us better dialogue and you've got to give us a better story.

SPEAKER_01 13:11

But the way I look at it, it's like a good Herschel Gordon Lewis movie. And those were never good, but they looked and felt and sounded like this. And I feel it's part of she was purposely trying to make kind of bad on purpose, if you call that bad, the outdated style on purpose, right?

SPEAKER_03 13:32

The outdated style for sure. It but it's the story itself that is lacking.

SPEAKER_01 13:36

Because it wasn't the important part, it was the important part was everything else. I have no problem with that. It's like Tim Burton almost.

SPEAKER_03 13:41

It it took me 30 minutes of watching this movie to go, is this bad acting or are they doing this on purpose? It's totally on purpose. It's totally a choice. It's a choice. So I stopped the movie and I looked it up and was like, okay, presentational acting, that's totally a choice. Because I it vet definitely felt like acting from the 50s and the 60s, and especially from those type of movies.

SPEAKER_01 14:00

Do a better story with that.

SPEAKER_03 14:01

But here they just chose to just not really I feel like if she had done a better story with it, it would have been a it would have had a bigger impact, right? To be one of the last fucking films cut on an inner positive actual film negative. I just I really wanted her to take just one slightly bigger swing, right? And really hit that good story. But fuck, she did pull off quite a kind of uh uh everything else was asked.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

Style of her substance, you know. Um and the style is the substance here. That was the point of the movie, I think. To make it look like the past.

SPEAKER_03 14:34

And and it nails it. I mean, right from the beginning frames, when it opens and she's driving in that little car and that rear projection hits that James Bond fucking Her Majesty's Secret Service fucking Dr. No rear projection, but it's perfectly lit and it's per it looks great. She looks great lit. I'm like, oh, cause this is this is really good. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 14:56

It I I you know, I've talked about male lens, female lens. I don't subscribe to that. This director likes to explore the female gaze, as she calls it. But I look at this and then I look at like grindhouse, and I'm like, see, that's the difference. This is what a guy is gonna make, usually, is the grindhouse, a little more exploitive, a little more gross or body, and the woman's gonna have a little bit more of a sensitive approach to kind of the same type of grindhouse material. You're getting kind of the same type of movie, but I think it's grindhouse doesn't have scenes of men breaking down from overly emotions and also tampons. It depends on the filmmaker, right?

SPEAKER_03 15:38

Like, yeah, I mean, she's she's got she's got her heroin pissing in jars and very specific things here that are a little different.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03 15:46

You go watch some Lydia Lunch from the late 80s, and you're gonna you're gonna see guns and vaginas and weird shit like that, you know. And so there's it it I think it depends on the filmmaker too, right? Like a lot of that's up to the filmmaker male or fan.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

But I think she captures the past movie better than they did with Prime House.

SPEAKER_03 16:02

She definitely honors it. Yeah, like she does a really good job of kind of you can tell that this is a filmmaker who is definitely obsessed with that aesthetic. Oh, yeah. Um, I'm in you know, again, five minutes in, she's like, Well, okay, you know how these movies go. Here's a full frontal cock shot, here's a full frontal tits and bush. Oh, yeah, wait. There you go. They don't wait at all. Five minutes in, boom. Oh, here's the heroine's breast, boom, let's keep moving. You know. So you see what I mean about uh she she has to you have to hit all that stuff in those movies.

SPEAKER_01 16:29

Like we back in the day, we would have the cable on. Oh, yeah, and you had the sound off. Yep, and there it is. And then this movie like this would have come on. Yes, and about halfway through it'd be like, Can you turn a sound up on this? What is this? And you're a little out of it because it's the middle of the night. And I when I first discovered this movie on The Last Drive-in, it gave me that kind of vibe because of the way it looked, where I was like, this feels like one of those weird little bit off kind of movies we would have discovered in the middle of the night, because it's very psychedelic. I think since it's 60s aesthetics.

SPEAKER_03 17:03

Yeah, I mean, she's she's she's got her, you know, she's got her main, you know, she's got her lead drugging men, you know, having sex with them, you know, raping them basically. That's what that's what that is when you drug somebody and have sex with them. Um don't say you know, uh, you know, among among other things. But it's so she, you know, she's doing some of the same stuff that, you know, uh I feel like a man would do in that situation if it was a reverse story, right?

SPEAKER_01 17:29

The presentation's department. But the presentation's defense. The reverse story is the party animal. To a certain extent. It's all of these love potion number nine. She's kind of a mad scientist. It's almost like, is it really witchcraft? Or is she just drugging people?

SPEAKER_02 17:43

A little bit of both, right?

SPEAKER_01 17:44

Yeah, a little bit of both, right?

SPEAKER_03 17:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:46

You can interpret it that way. I'm like, hey, look, it falls into that genre of love potion movie.

SPEAKER_03 17:51

Um, she's she's very close to making softcore porn in this. Like, she if she if she gets a little more nudity into it, it's it becomes a little softcore porny porny, but she stays away from it enough to, again, make it this hammer type Russ Meyer thing, but not in well, even even Russ Meyer is pretty softcore porn at times. This she pulls back from that, yeah, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01 18:12

If you ever want it bewitched or Bell Book and Candle to be kind of a Skinamax movie, here you go.

SPEAKER_03 18:18

Yeah, yeah, that's a good call.

SPEAKER_01 18:20

It gives me Star Trek the original series vibes with the way some of it's lit and it looks like I'm expecting Spock and Kirk to beam down at certain points. I'm like, you are really capturing this vibe right in certain scenes where it's like that's crazy. I have to commend you for that because so many people try, and there's little things that pull you out. And eventually what happens here is you see cell phones and things that do. But yeah, she does so much right. Yeah, absolutely that it's like absolutely it's not like it's my favorite movie. I'm gonna be watching it all the time, but there's a lot I appreciate about it.

SPEAKER_03 18:54

Yeah, it's a it's this color-coordinated 70s aesthetic wrapped in a modern day tale in a modern world. Um the the violin that they do this thing where it's you know that several times during the movie that there's a tense moment and you hear the violin go, you know, and I'm just like, that's that's not scary, that's really annoying, and I need that to stop. But it's also super accurate for that time period.

SPEAKER_01 19:18

You're not watching these through headphones again, are you? Yes. Oh, some of these movies you gotta just let them breathe in the open air. Because I think they're gonna be extra obnoxious, some movies through headphones, yeah. Um I think if a movie's like if a movie's driving you nuts with the headphones, you might through.

SPEAKER_03 19:38

Other than the rest of the movie was fine, it sounded great. It was just those moments where you get the moments like the Yeah, not designed for uh Atmos apparently.

SPEAKER_01 19:48

Well, I guess not, don't spectral recording. No, this is 2016, definitely not I don't look at it at I don't look at it as a regurgitation of old movies, I look at it as more of an addition to those type of movies. Like, I think she wanted to make a movie that fit alongside some of those 60s and 70s movies. Is this a comedy? Uh it's listed as one.

SPEAKER_03 20:14

Okay, I think it's a comedy. And here's why. It's fucking ridiculous. Well, yeah. Like, in and I mean the story is fucking ridiculous. She goes to these men, the the first one she finds is great, and she makes him love uh makes him love her, and then he does fall in love with her and shows him shows her his sensitive side, and she immediately is grossed out and and basically he cries himself to death and dies, right? And so but later um we're in a tea room, right, and we're listening to a heart player sing a song, and this is why I'm glad I had the fucking headphones on because this she starts the song with trala la la la, trala la la la, la di dati da. And I'm just like and then s sings a verse, and then we cut to the the the the tea party discussion, and then we and the end of the fucking scene we cut back to her and she ends the song with trala la la la, tra la la la la, and la di da di da. And I thought, okay, she's doing it on fucking purpose, she's doing this on purpose, and I refuse to believe with this much meticulous care to the rest of the film that this isn't a conscious fucking choice. Completely. And I the more we talk about it, the more I'm realizing, like, oh, you're right. The story has to be bad. Like, it ca if if you told a great fucking story and did all this, it would not be right. It wouldn't fit and it wouldn't be funny and it wouldn't fit. And but it's a wild movie, dude. It's a wild movie.

SPEAKER_01 21:58

Yeah, I I brought it onto the show. So we could look at the way it looked more than anything.

SPEAKER_03 22:03

One of the lyrics is literally, it was so tra la la and so la di da.

SPEAKER_01 22:07

She wrote the songs. I looked in the movie. Or at least co-wrote them.

SPEAKER_03 22:12

Oh my god, she nailed the aesthetic perfect, perfectly.

SPEAKER_01 22:16

That's why it takes her so long to make a movie. She does every part of it.

SPEAKER_03 22:19

But it but I will say, because of the type of the movie it is, and because of her aesthetic, and because of the choices that she made directorily to to mimic a lot of this stuff from these early periods, it's interminably long.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

Yeah, it is very long. And I watched it on what was the Plex channel. Yeah, I think. And it had a lot of commercials, five, six commercials each time. And I'm like, well, at least somebody's getting paid.

SPEAKER_03 22:43

Hopefully, hopefully, uh, hopefully, Anna, you got paid. Um, but yeah, I was just like, okay, this is this is the part of the that I'm having trouble with, is that it's just too damn long. You know, it two hours for this is way too long. This should be an hour forty tops.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

It has a lag in the middle, it's very top heavy. Yep, yep.

SPEAKER_03 23:00

Yep. One of my notes says, I don't want to sound like an idiot when I say this. One of my notes says, this would have looked better on film. But in 2016, I assumed, you know, most theaters had gone digital at that point. I assumed that this was digital. Uh and it's amazing that she, you know, uh did these costumes herself and got the found the money to do this. I don't know what this cost, but it it probably wasn't fucking cheap for sure. Did you notice the steaks? Remember when she cooks the steaks for the guy and he comes, you know, when uh he takes her to the woods and she's like, I'm gonna make you dinner. You remember that scene? And he make and she makes the steaks and the salad? Did you notice the steaks look like dick and balls?

SPEAKER_01 23:46

Oh. I knew there was something odd about them, I didn't catch it.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

They're T-bones with the tops cut off of them and their shapes so they look like a cock and ball. Well, I'm sure it's on purpose. I started fucking laughing my ass off, dude. That was great. That was a good one. It's just yeah. At one point she just she goes to the park and sits down for no reason and just eats a sandwich. Just pulls a sandwich out of a brown paper bag and eats it. There is a sandwich. Yeah. Twenty-seven minutes in, I've got to know this is even with the sex. This is getting kind of tedious. Um yeah, but I at the same time I I really admired his look. I admired what she what she accomplished with it. Um it makes some great, it makes some very odd choices. Um it's kind of like watching two hours of dinner theater acting. You know what I mean? Like it's a little exhausting to watch two hours of dinner theater acting. Um I also notice it's very front-lit, right? To the point you go, we're outside. Why isn't the light on a sunny day, why isn't the light coming from the top? Why is it coming from the side? Right? Like it's very hard lit. It's purposely that artificial.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's going for that Brady Bunch look, but like naughty Brady Bunch.

SPEAKER_00 25:23

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 25:24

I love how she she has that cop sit down on the couch and she hands in that, she pours wine into that giant fucking glass and hands it to him. That glass is like it would hold a gallon of wine, and he's just like, huh? And he takes a sip out of it. Oh yeah. But even at that point, there's still an hour of the movie to go. It's like, man.

SPEAKER_01 25:46

Wow. I think without all those commercials, it probably would have paced a little better. I agree.

SPEAKER_03 25:51

Well, I yeah, but even then at two hours, it's just too long. It's just too it's too long for me.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

What do you give that one?

SPEAKER_03 26:04

Um Well, you know, the weak ass girl fight kind of killed it for me. Um I do I do kind of feel like it might be this, you know, attempt to reclaim the aesthetic um uh in a kind of female manner. Um boy, there was a lot of exposition at the end of it. Like there was a lot of just talking at the end of the movie, right? Like just talking. Um But for the most part, again, I Elaine Girl, you cray cray. Like, I I you know, I I'm in love with you. I think you're awesome. Um she's a beautiful actress. The spell worked, just absolutely gorgeous. It did work on me. Um I don't know, man. I I it's not something I'm gonna watch again.

SPEAKER_01 26:51

See, that's why the scale is difficult, putting numbers on movies, because movies are so complicated. There's things you like and things you dislike, you know.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

Rewatchability is a big deal for me, but also competency and is a big deal for me, right? Well made, obviously well made. It's not something I'm gonna watch again because of its pacing and because of what it truly is. But I think if people that are fucking into that, they're probably gonna watch that movie and laugh their asses off and think it's fucking great.

SPEAKER_01 27:17

It's become a cult film over the years.

SPEAKER_03 27:19

I don't want to play it safe, but I also don't think it deserves a really, really super high rating. I'm gonna go three and a half stars, and I reserve the right to maybe take it down to three during a review.

SPEAKER_01 27:30

Yeah, I'm at three. Okay. I can't give this like two and a half. It does too many things correct. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:37

But at the same time, it it does a few things that are are egregious enough that I can't it's I can't call it a classic.

SPEAKER_01 27:44

Yeah. That's the issue with the ratings system I've been discovering and myself for the especially the last few shows. Like I was telling you about America's Sweethearts, and I gave it a half star because I give movies that a half star that only do maybe one or two, three things right, and then the more things you do right with your craft, the more the score kind of goes up. So I can be a little more objective. But the weird thing about America Sweethearts is one of the things it did right was the cast, and there was a charm to it. And usually those aren't things that are good in a bad movie, so it's such a strange anomaly. So that's why is it is that what they call so bad? It's good. I mean, I think I think we have a different or is that just a crazy movie?

SPEAKER_03 28:32

I think we have very differing opinions on what's right in a film, and I think that that you know, as far as what's tickling your score and what's tickling mine, right? So, you know, giving running time a two and then turning around and giving America Sweetheart a half a star and saying, Well, Running Time got more right than America Sweethearts did to me, to me, is is fucking insane. Yeah, but to you that makes sense, right? Again, I it's like Chris said, I want to read your rubric.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Yeah, taking a swing and doing a movie with your friends over a weekend is is is uh it does more for me than humor that was already five years out of date by the time it hit the screen.

SPEAKER_03 29:10

But I mean, but I mean, if it what's the point of making something with your friends that turns out to not be good? Like, I mean, it's go back to objective.

SPEAKER_01 29:18

You know, if the other movie made a hundred million dollars, so what am I talking about?

SPEAKER_03 29:22

It did, right? That's the thing. It's weird.

SPEAKER_01 29:25

It's nonsense here on Talking Fondo. You're gonna talk about some more nonsense. What is Blade Runner the final cut? Which may be the seventh version if you really get technical with the work print and uh but I'm just gonna call it the uh third version, right? Because you have your theatrical 82. Right. Yes, there is the international cut that has a little bit more gore, but that stuff is put back into the 1992 director's cut. But Ridley Scott didn't edit that one, but he went and he basically made a slicker version of the director's cut and called it the final cut. What is it? What the fuck? It's it, what is it?

SPEAKER_03 30:08

Blade Runner, 1982, Rated R, one hour fifty-seven minutes. A Blade Runner must pursue and terminate four replicants who stole a ship in space and have returned to Earth to find their creator. Your storyline. Your storyline is somewhere here, where in the world did you go? There it is. My apologies. In the early 21st century, the Tyrell Corporation, during what the what was called the Nexus phase, developed robots called replicants that were supposed to aid society, the replicants of which looked and acted like humans. When the superhuman generation Nexus VI replicants used for dangerous off-Earth endeavors began a mighty mutiny on an off-earth colony, replicants became illegal on Earth. Police units called Blade Runners have the job of destroying, or in their parlance, retiring any replicant that makes its way back to Earth. Um it's now November 2019 in Los Angeles, California. Decker of former Blade Runners call out of retirement when four known replicants most combat models have made their way back to Earth with their leader being Roy Batty. Um this is a really long one, and I'm not going to read all of it. Yeah, it's it's Huggo's Huggos lost his mind on that.

SPEAKER_01 31:20

So many details that you make it sound like we see all that in the movie. They just talk about a lot of that.

SPEAKER_03 31:26

Well, you you do. You just you have to I I I think again, this is a movie That's why I say it's a bad description. This is a movie where if you watch it enough, you know, you'll get some of that. But yeah, it's also like you get a lot of that from like 2049 later, and then of course if you read the book, you get some of that too.

SPEAKER_01 31:44

Exactly, because today is the Blade Runner, the final cut, which was as Ridley Scott basically said, uh we retconned the movie so we could make a sequel. I don't blame him. He ain't the first guy to do it. And what I mean is they they emphasize more about the deckard maybe being a replicant so they could make the follow-up. So the follow-up is really kind of a sequel to the final cut. So when you look back at like the the the theatrical one with the narration and the happy ending, that's almost like it stands alone like the original Star Wars in a way.

SPEAKER_03 32:21

You know, I still don't I still after having watched this, I'm still not convinced that he's a replicant in this version either.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

I prefer I think it's a better story if he's just a human.

SPEAKER_03 32:30

Agreed. Yeah, you go get what they're doing with it. He runs off and and she is supposed to live longer than he will, right? Because she doesn't have an expiration date. She's replicant, doesn't have her expiration date, right? So I don't know. Um I mean this is one of those movies where every time I watch it, I find something different about it or so or something new, and it's usually because I've gotten older and my I've had more experiences in my life, and so the movie reveals something else to me, right? Um and so this time around it was, and I think we talked about this earlier, but this time around it was the line that Roy says at the end where he talks about or uh Tyrell says to Roy when Roy says, you know, stop the gr aging, fix me. And he says, That's not how it works. You burn twice as bright, you live half as long. That's the way it works. Right. And you may I immediately flip to Cobain and Hendricks and Joplin and Morrison, and I think, yep, that's exactly how that works.

SPEAKER_01 33:30

Right.

SPEAKER_03 33:31

You know, it's those lame fuckers that stay around forever.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

Only the good die young.

SPEAKER_03 33:35

Only the good die young, right? James fucking Dean, you know, over and over again. You have the Marilyn you know, Marilyn died pretty young. A lot of famous people and and people who were good people, and and possibly bad either way, but they burned very bright, and so they lived half as long, anyways. I found that to be um that was the big one I got out of it this time.

SPEAKER_01 33:54

The thing that I got out of it this time that I didn't completely grasp before was the interesting thing about the movie is the robot doesn't want to take over like they think. It just wants to live. Yep. And it's very angry that it's not gonna get to live. But when Roy gives his speech at the end, hey, well you know we do spoilers here. I'm looking in the mic like it's a like it's a camera. You gotta personify it so you at home feel like talking directly to you. And he lets right before he lets that dove go. See, we're going there's so many things about purple rain that tie into this too. I'm gonna get into even though that comes later.

SPEAKER_03 34:31

Roy never meant to cause you any suffering.

SPEAKER_01 34:33

He didn't. Or any pain. He's redeemed at the end, right? Because he lets that bird go and then he realizes, oh, it's time to die. It is I I am getting the human experience after all. I thought I was robbed because it's short, but in the end I realized this is what it means to be human. Yep. So that's why all of the rest of the storyline about if they were just gonna expire, why are you hunting them? It's almost like a dream like nonsense M night shyan story, like weapons kinda. It's like why? What were they up to? What harm were they causing? They were just killing the people that made them live a short life, but I don't think that's what the movie's about. The movie is about the robot just wanted to live. And you want to have that idea, so you do all this to present that idea. It's like the movie shows us all its brainstorming in order to get to the point at the end, is what it feels like.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

There's uneven, there's a lot of layering to it, and that's that's definitely one of the layers.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

But I'm like, the point is not why. The point is to show the emotion.

SPEAKER_03 35:36

Yeah, and the and you know, the why is that yeah, they are killing people, and you gotta stop that, right?

SPEAKER_01 35:40

You don't really killing people because they were given the short life, they're not killing the people who weren't involved. Humans don't care about we don't care about that.

SPEAKER_03 35:48

Cops don't care about that, they just want to stop the killing. Once I say it's a little flimsy, yeah. They don't care about the the you know, cop doesn't care what your motive is for murder, he just wants you know once you busted for murder, right? So I I agree with you that that that's not the point. The point the point isn't to pull at the threads and the whys, the point is to push yourself in the world and follow really Folly's replicants and fig, you know, as they're going along trying to do what they're doing, which is like you said, save themselves.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Because what robots was Deckard retiring before he was retired? There was more killer robots he had to stop and how long has this been going on, and why are you having a maybe you're having false memories and you're a robot is why that doesn't make sense, right? I think they lean into that with the retcon aspect. It's possible. I think it's a double-edged sword. You can go one way or the other with this movie.

SPEAKER_03 36:35

I think you get it, I think you get a little bit of it when you know there's a lot of implied history between him and MM Walsh. You know, um, I want to put I was gonna point out one of my favorite shots of the movie is when they're sitting together and they're they've got a projector behind them, they're looking at stuff on the screen, and the camera's facing them, right? And the light's going over the camera lens, and they're sheathed in this white light and the blue, but there's blue coming from behind the camera, so they're blue with this white light behind them, and it's just fucking awesome looking. It's just I love this movie also because damn near everything is practical. There, you don't you don't get the benefit of fucking C Dance 2.0 AI horseshit or you know, this type of thing. It's I don't even maybe some blue screen or green screen, maybe, but everything else is fucking practical. They had to fucking mat, you know, the all the old school shit mats, front projection, rear projection, interpositives, all that type of stuff, right?

SPEAKER_01 37:29

It has a lot of light nice miniature work. I just wish it was in a more interesting movie. I I find the movie fascinating.

SPEAKER_03 37:36

I I think it moves well, I think it tells a cool story, I think it creates a world that is very singular and that so many fucking films have borrowed from and robbed from over and over and over again. The idea of the mad Tyrell. I'm fucking Elon Musk desperately wants to be Tyrell from the Tyrell Corporation, right?

SPEAKER_01 37:55

Like, holy shit. Oh, Tyrell. Okay, so let's talk about Tyrell for a second, played by Joe Turkle. You've heard me talk about Joe Turkle before. He was the bartender Lloyd in The Shining. But we know him best as that milkman beat Nick from Tormented in Mystery Science Theater. He shares a birthday with me, so that's why I know this much. And what a crazy career. Bird Eye Gordon to Stanley Kubrick to Ridley Scott. He was all over the place. And he gets into his roles. You're not gonna think that's the same guy from Tormented back in the 60s. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:32

It's good. He's he's um he's good in the role. Um, I like how he's not really afraid of Roy at the end when Roy shows up. He's like, Oh, okay, well, I was wondering when you were gonna show up. It took you this long. And they go through the whole thing where Roy's like, try this. He's like, tried it, try this, tried it. Can't have we've tried all that shit. It's not gonna work. You know, you're gonna die. That's just how it is. And you want to be a human. Yeah, it's you know, and you know, there's layers about mortality in there, there's layers about you know, being forced to, you know, uh you can tell Decker when he kills that first replicant, he goes to grab that bottle and he's just fucking shook to shit. You know, and then James Edward James almost shows up and taps him with the cane and he grabs that cane like he's gonna just take it and beat the shit out of almost until he sees him and realizes who he is. Like he's this this replicant killing stuff isn't easy on him and he doesn't like it.

SPEAKER_01 39:27

But the movie with its double-edged sword does kind of make you think oh, these they might have implanted all these memories in him that he's totally those guys forever, and it's just a trick on him. Have you ever run the test on yourself? I prefer to think of it as he's just a detective. That's why I like the narration. The reason I like the theatrical cut the most, that's the movie I lived with for 10 years. Same so did you.

SPEAKER_02 39:51

Same.

SPEAKER_01 39:52

That's why we wanted the director's cut to compare have a comparison. Oh, without the narration, that's neat. Yeah, but when we get to the final cut, I there's something about the final cut is why I don't I don't like it. Because I used to really like this movie a lot. And then 07 I went to go see the final cut, and I was just like, he did something to where it's so clean that you dehumanized it a little for me.

SPEAKER_03 40:18

Is it the is it the enigma of whether or not he's actually a replicant?

SPEAKER_01 40:21

Because like I feel like leaning more into that helps.

SPEAKER_03 40:23

I feel like you're right, because in the first one he's not, it's it's not super like I don't think there's a lot of super leaning towards the replicant stuff, but like you said, in this one you start to question like, well, did he really is he really a replicant? Did he really have these memories?

SPEAKER_01 40:40

It seems like they heighten it more in this one. I know the director's cut they do as well, but it's a little more subtle. It's more of a suggestion. The unicorn shot's not even as long. This one, the unicorn shot is longer. That's just a shot from legend, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 40:56

Ah, possibly.

SPEAKER_01 40:57

I mean, the same guy made the unicorn. And then you go, is that an implanted memory, or is he just thinking it's ambiguous, it feels completely out of place with the rest of the movie. I almost feel like it would work better with the happy ending, so you at least have something else that felt like somewhere else.

SPEAKER_03 41:15

It's like you said though, he was going for that in an enigmatic ending so that he could do a sequel writing. You know.

SPEAKER_01 41:20

So another reason I like the theatrical cut. Oh, go ahead, go.

SPEAKER_03 41:25

Uh go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 41:25

Uh, is sometimes notes help. I know directors don't want to get notes from you know financiers or studio heads that they feel interfere, but I feel putting that narration in and having that happy ending, sh footage from The Shining, uh, that's the movie we always liked, right? And so I s I feel like those were choices to make an audience be able to connect to it a little better back then, and apparently audiences didn't really care for it that much back then. It grew steam over the years, right? Ah. They wanted another Star Wars. Oh, you got you got Harrison Ford in space. Did Harrison Ford ever go back to space after this? And this isn't really space, but you know what I mean. Another sci-fi were flying around in cars and shit. Cowboys and aliens. He he leaned that took a while. He leaned into the action shit after this, didn't he?

SPEAKER_03 42:16

A lot of indie and stuff like that, yeah. But I mean, look, I think that A, it stood the test of time. B, I remember a lot of people talking about this movie when I was younger. It's one of those movies that that people who like movies talk about, right? Um, it's not necessarily a movie like my dad's got a friend, and he literally said to me one time, if somebody doesn't get get shot or die and blown up in the first five minutes, I'm out. I don't want to watch a movie. And I'm just like, that's your criteria, right? Okay, well, that means you know what you like, at least, right? Um, which is cool, you're not gonna waste your time on something you don't like, but that's a really strange, like to me, I don't know, uh it's gotta do a lot worse than that for me to walk away from it. And Blade Runner in particular is doing a lot, right?

SPEAKER_01 43:03

I think in the final cut, like the stunt work is better. Like that Zora, is that her name? They fix it to where it's not obviously a stunt double.

SPEAKER_03 43:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:14

But to me, it gives this overall diminished effect like what they did with Star Wars. To get the cynical, hey, I did a kind of a sci-fi movie with Harrison Ford. Maybe I should fix it up a little bit and get it ready to make another sequel.

SPEAKER_03 43:28

And I don't blame you. I I don't know. I I it that that doesn't bother me, I don't think, very much.

SPEAKER_01 43:34

It's just I like it, but I don't. I'm in this weird middle on the final cut. I'd almost argue it's not the same movie. Without the narration and a different ending, that's it. It really is almost like a different version of Nah, it's the same movie.

SPEAKER_03 43:48

They're just wanting you to they're wanting you to take a different a different ending out of it, right? So I mean it's still the same movie. I think if if if you were Literally telling a lot of backstory and having him deal with the fact that he's looking into his replicant past and and you know trying to hash out whether he is or is not, because he doesn't at any point in the movie question whether he is or is not a replicant, he doesn't give himself the comp void test, they ask him there's some question about it, and he just is like, don't be fucking stupid, of course I'm a human being. Right. And to him, he's got all the memories that he needs, right? And here's the other thing snaps his fingers back pretty quick. Let me say this if Sean Young, who is absolutely fantastically beautiful in this movie, and I love the way they get her eyes to glow uh in some of the shots where she's smoking and doing the convoy test, it's fantastic. And by the way, what kind of friggin' cigarettes are they smoking? That's crazy. Uh it looks like a half joint, half cigarette. Anyway, where was I going with this? Like and subscribe. My point is, Sean Young, beautiful, got the glowing eyes, all that stuff. She is the top replicant. According to according to um Tyrell. According to Tyrell, she's the top, she's the best that could ever make. She's the one that took three times as many questions to fail the comp void test as any other replicant, right? Decker has been around before that. He's obviously been around before that. So if he's a replicant, he's either a shittier early model or he's some sort of one-off crazy ass model that they put out to go kill the other replicants and never made again. It's it's a big stretch to me that he's a replicant, in other words.

SPEAKER_01 45:33

Then there never was any replicants running around before that needed to be killed. Those are fake memories. Right. But again Or the older replicants were more assholes and they were up to no good and he had to get rid of them, and this badge just wanted to live because they were more advanced.

SPEAKER_03 45:48

But but it's such a stretch, and none of it is even hinted or poked at in the movie that it's just it's just something fun to fucking talk about.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

Well, that's why I don't prefer the final cut as much. That's why it leans too much.

SPEAKER_03 45:59

That's why I don't think it that's why I don't think it leans too far, because again, the rest of the movie isn't isn't supporting that. It's just trying to throw you off a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 46:08

What is the unicorn? Make you wonder.

SPEAKER_03 46:10

It's just trying to make it's just trying to make you wonder. You know, and also unicorns are beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 46:15

What about the hockey masks in the in the club?

SPEAKER_03 46:18

I thought the unicorn was her, the replicant who will never who who can who will live way longer than anybody else. That's what he's happy.

SPEAKER_01 46:26

I guess. But what about those hockey masks? It's the same year that Jason got his hockey mask, 1982, and there's two dancers in that club that have hockey masks on. I thought it was really weird. They're like go-go dancers. Aspects of the movie nobody ever talks about. The symbology of hockey masks in 1982. Uh, the old future. This movie is set in 2019. Yes, sir. They certainly got the zoom calls right. It wasn't a video screen on a payphone, but they really got that close with that technology. What is this movie like to somebody who's like 20 years old?

SPEAKER_03 47:02

Oh, I'm sure it's a weird mixture of old and new tech.

SPEAKER_01 47:06

Does this movie get more gothic and creepy as it ages, perhaps, to them? Because it's it's no longer a futuristic movie, it's an alternate past. Yeah, alternate reality, yeah. And so it starts going off in that direction instead.

SPEAKER_03 47:22

I could swear at one point Decker's holding like a mobile phone in his hand in one of the scenes.

SPEAKER_01 47:27

He's got like a He does have like a little tablet-ish device when he's flying around. Yeah, yeah. But it's very brief. But yeah, I did like the uh the video screen thing there. Also, Los Angeles with rain? Now that's fiction. How many times have they had a drought out there, right? And there's no rain anywhere.

SPEAKER_03 47:47

Rains every rain the winter, I was there like a motherfucker. Um I I feel like this movie has a lot of is pulling a lot from William Gibson. Um, this sort of, you know, Gibson had this idea of of of the sea the uh uh LA, I think it was LA to Seattle sprawl, where the cities had gotten so big that they just basically started connect they were connected, right? And so the entire coast is just one massive city, right? And you just you're moving through as you move through neighborhoods and through different areas, you've moved from uh LA into Northern California and then into Washington and so on, right? And that's a that's a wild idea, but it also gives you an idea of how big humanity's gotten, which it makes sense. I mean they're trying to shove people off of this friggin' planet because it's dead, like it's dying, it's obvious, right? This planet, it just rains, there's no atmosphere, it looks like shit.

SPEAKER_01 48:43

Join the off-world colonies with Arnold and Total Records. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 48:46

Yeah, but way before Total Recall and all that other shit.

SPEAKER_01 48:48

And yet that script was that old, too.

SPEAKER_03 48:50

Stealing so much shit from fucking this movie, it's not even funny. Uh and total I believe Total Recall is also uh isn't that a Philip Kiddick?

SPEAKER_01 48:58

Might be, actually. Jeff, correct us. Yeah, Jeff, you'll have to tell us. I know you're listening to this one. Uh so we've been watching some movies lately that have brought up the question of directors putting questions in movies without answers. And what is what are the varying degrees of this? And in this one, I feel like there's a lot of things that are questions that they don't have answers. They're not supposed to. They're there to set up the getting to the robots having emotions thing. Like all the questions we've been asking. Is he is he human? Is he real? What's this? The movie's not telling me enough. And so it's doing a different way of throwing out unanswerable questions in order to move its story along a little bit, right? Or am I just reaching out?

SPEAKER_03 49:44

I mean, I I think I think adding the doing the making it enigmatic like that adds to its mystique, right? Which adds to its rewatchability. Ambiguity is good. Which adds to its, yeah, it's in the ambiguity allows you and I and others to sit here and talk about it for 40 fucking years and go, is he a replicant? Isn't he? Oh my what if we had only ever gotten the narration? Would we still be talking about this movie if we if we thought there was never a director's cut? I think so.

SPEAKER_01 50:08

We were already kind of into it.

SPEAKER_03 50:09

But would we be talking about it in this, like it's enigmatic? What isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 50:12

No, because you don't have different versions to compare. But that also shows that they ever really get the movie right if you have to re-edit a movie seven times. Obviously, this movie had a lot of troubled production too, as we know.

SPEAKER_03 50:26

So I think the big problem is here's my like the big problem is the big problem is that especially in the late nine in the 90s, directors' cuts and fucking special features and all that shit were big. And if you wanted a Blade Runner re-release, then you need to recut it and you need to do extra special features and blah blah blah. And here's the other problem. The studios, some of these studios are like, sure, Ridley, it's your film, go ahead and recut it. No, Ridley, no Lucas, no whoever, leave it the fuck alone. Because once you release it, it's not yours anymore, it's ours. Like, because we're the ones that are going to see it, we're the ones that paid for it, we're the ones that you know literally have made the film a success and allowed you to make another one.

SPEAKER_01 51:08

Yeah, you're restructuring a classic album again. Yeah. The movies are a representation of the time they came out as well.

SPEAKER_03 51:14

So now I get it if you want to do a director's cut.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

Yeah, but that's going to be a representation of the year you recut it.

SPEAKER_03 51:20

Exactly. That's exactly it.

SPEAKER_01 51:21

It's a whole different thing.

SPEAKER_03 51:22

Having said that, though, I don't mind the director's cut very I don't mind it. I do like the first version better.

SPEAKER_01 51:27

I like the 92 director's cut more.

SPEAKER_03 51:29

But but I don't I don't I don't mind the final cut. Uh I don't mind the loss of the narration. I don't mind the enigmaticness, and it does tend to lend us some questions and and and have some fun conversations.

SPEAKER_01 51:42

Uh like Purple Rain that came two years later, this has an early 80s gritty music video vibe to it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:51

It's got a what is it, evangelist type? It sounds like it sounds like uh Tangerine Dream, Evangelists, Chariots of Fire, Neverending Story.

SPEAKER_01 52:01

It's got that Oh, I think you're right. I think one of the ones you named is actually the which makes sense because they do one of the versions of Legend as well.

SPEAKER_03 52:10

Yeah, that makes sense, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:12

I kept expecting Billy Idol to show up or Sting and Tiny Metal Panties. This is that type of movie. It had that vibe to it. Yeah, it's Vangelus.

SPEAKER_03 52:23

Yeah, it it it also had it made me laugh too, because there's like in a couple of scenes where it's got the and I just watched Lethal Weapon a couple weeks ago. And you know, in Lethal Weapon it's got all that David Sanborn uh saxophone, you know, lonely, you know, painful cop music. That's in Blade Runner 2 in a couple of scenes, and I just it made me laugh so hard because I was like, oh, that's where it okay, maybe that's where it started. I don't know. But it goes from being in Blade Runner into being, you know, you know, uh lethal weapon. Anyway.

SPEAKER_01 53:02

I I think I understand the young film bros a little more now re-watching this, because when I was 16 and I discovered this movie, I thought it was like fucking amazing. And now that I'm older, it's kind of like watching The Lost Boys, and you go, Oh, that's just a toxic relationship. That's not sexy. It has those differences of it where I still appreciate the movie, but I've seen the movies that inspired it now. So I go, Oh, I see what what created this. This isn't the greatest thing ever made, it's awesome. But you know how the film bros are like, the movies from the last 10 years, the greatest thing ever, and I'm not gonna listen and oh, they're still in that mode. They haven't watched enough shit and grown out of it yet. So I went, I remember when I was kind of like that before the term even existed.

SPEAKER_03 53:57

I like the movie's aesthetic quite a bit. I like its production design. Um I like how it handles flying cars, I like how it handles flying blimps. I like that the fact that there's CRTs and flat screens. I like the fact that it's this mix of new and old technology.

SPEAKER_01 54:13

Yeah, I just don't want to see it touched up uh in 07. Well, you know, I want to see the theatrical or the 92. At least you have them all. You can get a set that has all the cuts.

SPEAKER_03 54:22

Yeah, I like it.

SPEAKER_01 54:23

Which is nice that they do that.

SPEAKER_03 54:24

I've been looking on Blu-ray for the first two, and it's they're not easy to find.

SPEAKER_01 54:27

Because it comes in a briefcase, the DVD, and they had the work print, and then I think the international. And apparently they found the work print around the early 90s, and they did a couple screenings as the director's cut unauthorized, and that's what led to the 92 director's cut, which inevitably led to hey, Blade Runner should be making some more money. Let's figure out a way to and they did, they figured out a way to where I'm sure they've completely throughout the years any money they might have lost in the early 80s has been recouped. They have a sequel, they have Funko Pops of fucking the guy who plays uh in Guardians of the Galaxy. What's his character, Sapper, I think, in the sequel? I mean, that's just how much, you know, merchandising and stuff. But there was no Blade Runner Toys back in the day. You know, I saw this on HBO, like in '83.

SPEAKER_00 55:20

Same.

SPEAKER_01 55:21

And I was like, oh, it's okay. I was a little kid. I didn't quite understand it. And then Discovering It Again, I think we were you there when we saw it at the Gallagher Theater? Yeah. The U of A. Yeah. So we saw the theatrical over narration version on the screen then. Yeah. And that's when I was like, oh, this is awesome. And I loved the director's cut. I saw that the day it came out. But then when I went to go see it in 07, there was a little love lost. So watching it again, I went, no, I still like this movie. I just don't care for this particular cut of it as much. So it was good to go back to it to realize, no, I still like the movie. It's just this is the indulgent version. I don't and I don't mind. Why if I was going to watch the sequel, I'd watch this version right before it. It would match better.

SPEAKER_03 56:05

Yeah, I don't I don't mind that. I think uh it's it's not so different that it's throwing me off. I'm I'm sorry, I'm just different with you on that one. But again, I I I really like what it did. I I'm glad that it found an audience and it found its uh its its place because I think it's a very important movie for science fiction. I think it's very, very important. I think it's groundbreaking in a lot of ways. Um you know the production itself was a uh from what I've read an absolute nightmare, anyways. So it's kind of a miracle the damn thing even got finished. Yeah. And to get what we got was pretty awesome, especially especially for that time. My god, dude. For that time, it was just it's such a foreign-looking film. It's ahead of itself. That's why it's way ahead of itself. And you know, of course people weren't ready for it. It's you know, um, and it wasn't it wasn't the roller coaster ride that Alien was. So you couldn't get on board and go, all right, it's a future and blah blah blah. Holy shit, chestburster, here we go. You know, it's a slow burn, and you it's a kind of a think piece, right? To a certain extent.

SPEAKER_01 57:09

That's why we liked it in the 90s more.

SPEAKER_03 57:11

Yep, yep, yeah. Well, I mean, you know, and again, when you're young and you think, well, I mean, uh, you know, I'm a like you said, I'm a Cinebro and I gotta like all these think pieces, then this type of thing you could latch onto, right? But I think it stands the test of time when you watch it later. For me, again, even from watching it at the Gallagher Theater at the U of A in like '91 to watching it five years later, five years after that, the movie reveals more to me every time I watch it. It means different things to me based upon where I am in my life and my age, which I don't know a lot of fucking movies that do. Lawrence is about the only other one that I can really say has done that really strongly. Maybe almost famous.

SPEAKER_01 57:48

And hopefully any um really well done movie should do that, you would hope.

SPEAKER_03 57:52

The yes and no, like The Godfather hasn't done that. Like it hasn't changed for me. Uh well, I'll say this. Other than like when you're a kid and you don't understand fully what's going on, right? Like once you reach the age where you can fully grasp the movie uh and the nuances of it, yeah, it never changed for me at that point, right? So the I like this one because it changes. I I watch it and I go, oh fucky okay, they're talking about that now. Oh, I didn't I missed that.

SPEAKER_01 58:16

I can't say I didn't get a little of that. I just only got a little of it. But sometimes just a few moments are enough to make the movie amazing.

SPEAKER_03 58:24

Well, and if a little is good, more must be better, right?

SPEAKER_01 58:28

And this movie is not without its flaws. It that's part of its charm, too. But this particular version I give two and a half. The other cuts would be four or four and a half, perhaps, but this one they just did something to it where I'm just like, this Why can't I see them go to the better place at the end to go to the overlook? Because isn't it the shining footage? And uh the narration that got laughs in the theater. People liked some of that stuff. So I feel it just adds an extra layer, but I don't know, I still like the movie, but this cut, I I don't watch this version again. I would rather go back and watch the one of the other two.

SPEAKER_03 59:07

I would give this cut four stars.

SPEAKER_01 59:09

I would give it that's totally understandable.

SPEAKER_03 59:11

I would give the original cut, which I can't find, and if I could on Blu-ray, I would I would immediately. I don't know if it is on Blu ray. That's a that's the thing I wanted on Blu-ray, and if I can get it on Blu-ray, that's my five-star Blade Runner right there. I'll take a DVD of it. Or maybe maybe I'll go maybe four and a half. It you're right, it has a couple flaws.

SPEAKER_01 59:26

I love those old effects, and I want them to look like they did. Yeah, I don't want extra lights on the car. It's cool, but I want to see the other one.

SPEAKER_03 59:33

One of the things I also we didn't talk about was the guy who played JF Sebastian, and I I I think he's a one of those one of those great character actors. He ends up being one of the brothers on uh the New Heart show on Bob Newhart. He ends up being Daryl and my other brother Daryl and that that guy. Hello, my name is Daryl, and this is my brother Daryl, my other brother Daryl. Yeah. Um he's a good actor. I like him. He's he tends to disappear into parts. You know what I mean? I like I like those kind of actors, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:02

They're really great. He built his own robot friends. You guys watch Ridley Scott movies?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:08

You guys watch Ridley Scott movies?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:14

Well, what do you got for me next week? What a trippy experiment. Look, we hit an hour and we we're not even doing it a normal way, and we've still got the timing. Next week, hey, hey, hey, do the Pondo shuffle.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:27

That's right. Okay. Folks, get ready for this. So, what we're gonna do is I'm I'm in town for a week. We've got access to uh a large collection library of movies, and we have a shuffle function. So we have dared each other to hit the shuffle button and take the movie that comes up. Now, to be fair, each person gets three vetoes. So this is gonna be very interesting. It should all play out on the show, too.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:57

It should be very, very interesting.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:58

So just tune in for that one. That's gonna be fun.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:01

It will be fun, and and we'll be back the week after that with uh let me see. Uh, that one and uh well, you know, I I think we'll be back to the guests at that point or something, but stay tuned. You wanna get out of here on a quote? I'm gonna give you the rainbow. Something like that, right? Was that the quote? Do you like to ride, Elaine? Later, Marty.