26 - How To Plan A Child's Funeral And Are They Free?

Planning your child’s funeral is something that no parent ever wants to consider. If faced with this devastating prospect, you can find yourselves under prepared with a vast number of decisions that need making within a short time frame. Mother of 2, and Senior Funeral Director Kate talks openly about how she supports and assists families in these distressing situations, and how there is no right or wrong answer. 

If you have any questions, here’s how to get in touch:
Instagram – @liftingthelidfuneralpodcast
Email – Liftingthelid@gseller.co.uk
Website – www.gseller.co.uk/podcast
Watch the episode on YouTube: Lifting The Lid - YouTube

Transcript

0:00

Hi, I'm Andy Eeley, Senior Funeral Director for G Seller Independent Funeral Directors and we've been serving bereaved families since 1910. I'm sure you're all well aware there's lots of different myths, taboos and misconceptions around what happens behind the scenes within the funeral profession. So we decided to put together this series of podcasts to answer those questions and hopefully dispel those myths. So please do like, share and subscribe and send those questions, send them to liftingthelid@gseller.co.uk and we will do our absolute best to answer them for you. It genuinely is Our Family Caring For Your Family. Hi, welcome to the latest episode of Lifting the Lid. Today we have a difficult subject, it's funerals for children. I have my colleague with me, Kate. Kate is very much a focus for the funerals for children. So first and foremost Kate, how are you? I'm very well, thank you. Good. Now we haven't met Kate yet, so Kate, as always, I'd just like to know a bit about, I know you anyway, but I'd like to know a bit about you and how you came to be that focus for children and more importantly, a funeral director. Okay. So when I left school I was always interested in funerals. Everyone thought I was a little bit strange wanting to sort of get into that industry, but it wasn't really talked about. So I decided to go down the travel industry route. I trained as cabin crew, I became travel agent. I had a child myself, fairly young, so that sort of stopped me from becoming a funeral director as quickly as I probably would have wanted to, or certainly even with the travel side of things from what I wanted to do there. So I found a role at Sellers nearly twelve years ago now, doing memorials, and made it quite clear that I wanted to be a funeral director from the offset. Why? Why a funeral director? No idea. Wanted to be the midwife or a funeral director. It was always going to be the beginning or the end. And funeral directing just seemed to really capture having the opportunity to do the last thing you ever could for anybody. And it seemed really quite a caring profession and I'm just really interested in it. So how long have you been an actual funeral director? Been funeral directing for around, I think it's about five years now. Yeah. Okay. When I started at Sellers, as I said, started with the headstones, learnt as much as I could about different cemeteries, churchyards after about six months, then came into main office and assisted the funeral directors. Still part time at that point, so I again just supported them, started to book internments for cremated remains, did as much as I possibly could behind the scenes sort of thing with them. And then gradually as things progressed, I started to do prepaid funerals, which gave me a real good background into funerals. You've not got the pressure of on the day. Yeah, you haven't got the date and time, but you've got everything else. Or the emotional side of it, I suppose, because you're not at the time of need. So if you weren't too sure on something, you can ask your colleagues and learn as much as possible. So it was a really good basis to start my career and then as a position, came available for funeral directing, went straight into that, did my two diplomas and then here I am now. Perfect. Brilliant. So I mentioned earlier, very much a focus for children's funerals. So how did that come about? How did you sort of transition? Because you've taken ownership of this, haven't you? It's real much a priority for you. How did that happen? Not really sure how. Kind of just happened to sort of fall to me. I think I've always had whether it's a maternal instinct, I don't know, but when we every time the loss of a child seemed to sort of come into our care, I'd naturally kind of go towards it and look after the families. I feel very again, maybe it's that maternal side, but looking after a baby, I kind of take it very much to myself. So I will be the one to dress the child, engage with the parents and the wider family, because we're not just talking of a child that's a newborn baby or a still born baby or whatever. It's a child that could be up to 18. Absolutely. So it's not just the little ones, it's engaging with the siblings of that child or the grandparents. There really is a bigger sort of amount of people that we need to consider in it all. So I don't really know how I came into it, but whether it's maybe a softer approach compared to you and the others. Yeah, okay. It sounds like you sort of fell into it and it sort of evolved from there. Yeah. In a strange kind of way, I kind of feel honoured to do it and yeah, just very proud to be able to do it because it's not easy. I know you've been looking at new information and new products and things that we can offer for children's funerals, and you've been a huge part of that. I know from the workplace that if there is a funeral for a child, we tend to sort of gravitate towards you, because it is something you just encompass and take on and it's brilliant. You do a phenomenal job. And I'm not just saying that because we're on film, it is genuine. You get all huge amount of praise for doing that. I'm just going to talk about the funeral itself. I mean, what kind of funeral would a child have? Could be absolutely anything. There's no limits with the funeral for a child, just like there isn't for an adult, whether that be the venue. It's important to remember that most every parent never has to consider ever thinking that they're going to have to arrange a funeral for their child, again whether they're a baby or whether they're a teenager. It's just not something that you'd even think about. And most parents, by the time they come to us, have maybe even never been to a funeral themselves, let alone arranging it for their own child. True. So it's really a case of finding a bit about the child. I think that's what I do initially, before we even go into arrangements, building that rapport, finding out what was it that they enjoyed to do or they liked, or if it's a baby, engaging with their brother or sister, if they've got one, of course, to sort of draw them into it. And it's still going to still celebrate their life, no matter how tiny or teenager they are, as far as what can be offered anything. So whether that's the venue, whether that's having horses, whether that be talking about jewellery or different things that come as the time goes on, memory boxes that could be quite important from being able to put clothing, make them into teddies, literally loads of different things. The service itself still is going to be the same as an adult funeral, just like you would arrange it's, finding out what was important to them and building it around that. Yeah. Similar sort of structure. Very much similar. I think it's just maybe the way that it's discussed, it's kind of a slower process, being informative as to the different processes that might happen along the way with actually baby funerals and if there's any hospital necessity for different post mortems and things like that. So it's having the knowledge that things might not happen quite as quickly. And that could be more so that the parents want to request that for any future pregnancies or the genetics that they need to know this information. So there's probably a bit more information that has to be given out. But as far as the actual funeral itself, just the same, it could be very simple and just have a few family members. It could be that it's a child that's at school that's passed away and actually they want a big service where the schools are involved and all their friends. A teenager of course, you've got lots of different hobies and interests that they might be involved. Yeah, the football teams. But the families may just choose that they just simply want it to be their close family and have it very intimate, or it could be something big. So it's no different to an adult funeral. What about fees in respect to fees for a child's funeral? I mean, are there any? Very little. So any child under the age of 18; there's a government fund that will pay for certain elements of a funeral, so they will pay for the cost of a coffin up to a certain amount. They will pay for the cost of the crematorium, the cemetery, any grave preparation. So as far as that's concerned, that's nothing that the family have to be involved in. Some families decide, that we want to pay for the coffin. Yeah, okay. Some families choose that actually, we're not going to have Christmases, we're not going to have birthdays. We want to ensure that we pay for everything and that's absolutely fine. That's the option that they can have. It's not anything that's means tested. As far as Sellers are concerned, we wouldn't charge a penny. And that's the same with any, say, crematoriums and places like that. They'll just always claim through the government scheme, as opposed to charging the family. Of course, there are going to be optional things, flowers, orders of service, horse drawn, things like yeah. They're sort of out of our control. So there are elements that are charged for, but predominantly there are no fees. So that include the person leading the service as well, of course. Is that? Yeah, perfect. How do you decide between cremation or burial for a child? That's a good question. Again, say something that you never want to ever consider. It's not. I think it's something that is one of the first questions that we have to find out. And then, of course, then that depends on where the service is going to be. You may find that some families, some parents want to physically visit a grave and there's that sort of psychological aspect of my child is still there and go to visit a grave, have a headstone. Others choose cremation because they can keep the cremated remains at home. Have different keepsakes. Yeah. All the jewellery. There's no right or wrong. Same with an adult. There's absolutely no right and wrong. And it's your own choice. It just takes a little longer, maybe, to consider which is the right option. Yeah. Because I think it's quite important what you said there. It's something you don't want to consider. It's all completely new, completely fresh and incredibly difficult. We've spoken a lot about personalising a child's funeral. Can we just go into that a little bit further? I mean, the different things that we can do. So perhaps chapel of rest visits, do we do anything different with a chapel of rest visit? We try to make the chapel of rest a little bit softer, especially for babies. We've got some teddies that we might put on display if an older child there may be something, for example, if they're into Leicester City so we might put something we just personalise the chapel a little bit more, not only for the child that's passed away to make sure that that room's nice, but for families as well. Yeah. Do you think they find it helpful coming to visit? Yeah, I do try to encourage that. Even if they feel that they have already said their goodbyes and don't necessarily want to come and visit and see their loved one in the chapel of rest, just coming and sitting with maybe a closed coffin, prepares them for the day of seeing the coffin, rather than us just turning up at the house. And it's going to be distressing anyway, but even more so the first time that you see that coffin. So coming to the chapel of rest is something I strongly recommend, especially if there'siblings involved as well. So you feel siblings should come as well. Again, it's personal choice, isn't it? But certainly coming with the coffin to be closed, quite regularly, we'll have it where the parents may come and actually sit with their child initially, but then their siblings they might bring later when we've closed the coffin, so they've still had the opportunity to come and say their goodbyes, leave things that they want to be placed with them in the coffin, so they might just leave them on top letters, cards, teddies, anything like that. And that's something else personalised options of making sure that there is room in the coffin for those items you tend to find with children they want to place teddies and different keepsakes and things in there, so can make a difference on the size of the coffin. You may think that that looks too big. It's not. We just want to make sure they've got everything with them, blankets and things like that. Yeah. So chapel of rest is a difficult one it's not for everybody. I guess it's the same for the actual funeral itself as well, that sort of decision as to who should attend, who should attend. And I think you find sure you've been asked that before, should we bring the children along to a funeral? Again, that's the parents choice, isn't it? And a conversation that they can have with the children that are coming to the funeral, it's totally up to them whether they feel that they should or not. Yeah. What support is there for parents and perhaps siblings as well? Lots of support out there, not only through ourselves. We've got bereavement services, so there's two ladies that we have one to one option, or they've got, I think it's called the angel group, a bereavement group, so they can sit with other parents and there's a children's one as well, so all children can get together and talk, so it's really important. So that's what we do in house. And then there's lots of support out there through different centres, lots of different depending on how the child's passed away, whether that be from stillbirth or whether it be later on in a tragic accident or whatever it might be. There's lots of different bereavement services, but I think initially, those few weeks from our first bit of contact to certainly the day of the funeral, it's really important that our care is there to support them, because sometimes we're the only people they feel that they've got to talk to. And I think that's why it's quite important for you you're that familiar face. You're that continuity constant there and you offer a great deal of support there. Yeah. And quite a lot of times, actually, that we meet up with the parents, they don't necessarily want to talk about the arrangements, they just want to just have somebody there to talk to. So you'd kind of have that little bit of, we're not counsellors, but we're there to support and that's really important. Yeah. Just listen, I guess, in some respects. Absolutely. I'm going to talk about a difficult piece. We've mentioned chapel of rest visits. Now, previous episodes of this, we've met my colleagues Rhonda and Joe regarding embalming. What are your thoughts for a child? Should a child be embalmed? Still has to be a decision by the parents. Any child can be embalmed. I think it's really important to base that on the circumstances of how the child's passed away. So if it's a newborn baby, there might not be any necessity for that to happen. And we don't tend to. A lot of the time with babies if they've passed away in hospital, hospital will not normally discharge the mother for up to a week and the baby's allowed to stay with them in that time, they have like, a cold cot. And so sometimes the parents have already felt they've had that time. Now, in that time, they may have seen a few changes happen. So when we've conveyed the child into our care, it's a decision that then we have to sort of make as to whether that's going to be more distressing. It's a horrible call to have to make, obviously. So embalming with a child that's a little bit older, sometimes that can be something that might be necessary to enable the parents to have a better experience in the chapel of rest. To spend that time with them. Yeah. And suppose you could argue it's exactly the same as for an adult, isn't it? I think each person has got to make that decision themselves. We certainly can do it. We don't tend to embalm children as much as what we would adults, but it's something that we still discuss with the parents. Yeah. So you mentioned that it's sometimes a difficult call to make. So from your perspective, how do you cope? You're a parent yourself. It's incredibly difficult. It's a difficult situation. How do you cope? What mechanisms have you got? I'm my own worst enemy at having a bit of a wall. Okay. So I think the important thing is generally the team with us, because we all understand, we've all been in the same boat of every day we face these challenges, we're all human, and as cheesy as it sounds, we do all support each other. Yeah, it's true. If it has been a difficult arrangement, whether that be that we've gone to the family's house or we've just come back from the funeral or whatever it might be, if we need that support, we'll just kind of say to each other that I just need a bit of time. And we know that then we don't need to talk about it or vice versa we just want to get it off our chest. And it is hard there are times when especially at the funeral, and I think you kind of go on a bit of an adrenaline in a suppose, initially, whilst the arrangements, you want to make sure that this is all perfect, whether that's just for the one that's passed away, whether that's for the parents, the grandparents, the siblings, whoever, you want it to go spot on. And then the funeral happens and you're sat there and it can be really hard to see the parents crying so much. Do you cry yourself? Absolutely. Yeah. Not in front of them. Sometimes it can be we get back and I'll just go for a little walk; sometimes it might be that actually, as we've gone into the venue of the service, that just go outside and just have a few moments just to compose yourself, still be professional, that families don't know any different, but we are human, it can be very hard. It's important, though, to leave at the end of the day and start again the next day. You don't take it home with you as such. Try not to. Yeah. It's difficult sometimes, isn't it? Yeah. And you said there about everything needs to go perfectly, so it's the same for all funerals. We all understand that. Do you think you put more pressure on yourself for the funeral for a child? Yeah. I don't know whether that's right or wrong. I think you just do naturally, as a parent yourself, you'd understand that it's very much about you kind of relate to it, as hard as it is. You don't want to relate to it, but you can't help but think, if that was me. Yeah. If you put yourself in that family's shoes yeah. I think there is more pressure because it's so much more distressing sometimes. Yeah. What's the youngest child that you've looked after? A bit of a random question, but I know we've got the cross section there, so let's have both ends. What's the oldest and what's the youngest? Oldest was 18. Okay. And youngest was I think it was the little boy was about ten weeks gestation, bless him. Okay. Tiny, tiny, little dot. But equally, again, the parents are still going through that loss of they've been so excited planning they're going to have a baby, thinking of all different things, of what's going to happen, and now suddenly they're hit with this. And when it's a baby of that young during pregnancy, it's a different situation in that the mother is carrying this child, their hormones are all over the place, obviously distraught. It's very hard for the father and I think we kind of forget that a little bit that the father's gone through this roller coaster of the excitement, wanting to engage as much as possible, but as a man, you can't. And so the father's there for their wife or girlfriend or whoever, to just support them because they haven't got those hormones, they haven't actually carried the baby or anything. So there's a real difference there. Yeah, I think that's quite important. As a father, it wasn't real until baby was in front of me. I think it's easy to forget that as much as about both the parents. Sometimes we think mum must be so distraught, but dad kind of feels a little bit lost. I don't know how I should feel that. I just know that I've got to support her. And you don't necessarily know how to do that. No. And again, we can offer support with that. Absolutely. Kate, thank you. Incredibly, I said earlier, you do do a phenomenal job and you get fantastic feedback from families that you look after, not just children, I'm creeping now. Yeah, you are. Thank you. Yeah, a difficult episode, but we'll see you next time. Please do like, share and subscribe. Send any questions you have, send them to liftingthelid@gseller.co.uk and we will do our absolute best to answer them for you. Thank you.