The Terrifying Gambit Combo | Why Sandstorm is a Sleeper Hit | The Snap Chat Ep. 172

This week, Alex is joined by Marvel Snap OG and deck-building maestro: Bynx! The duo kicks things off with a catch-up on their physical TCG adventures (Pokemon and Riftbound) before diving into the brand new Marvel Snap Developer Roadmap. They discuss the promise of bug fixes, Alex's hilarious "Red Pip" conspiracy theory, and why Bynx is terrified that Second Dinner might "overcook" the highly anticipated Draft Mode.

Next, they break down the latest OTA Balance Patch, debating whether the power nerfs to Star-Lord, Alioth, and Fin Fang Foom are enough to fix the uninteractive meta.

Then, it's a massive Season Preview focusing on the brand new "Objective" keyword! Alex and Bynx review all the upcoming releases:

• En Sabah Nur (Apocalypse): Is the Season Pass card a competitive staple or just a fun mid-range tool?
• Isca the Unbeaten: Both hosts agree this Super Premium card is an absolute 5-Star powerhouse.
• Gambit: Bynx reveals a terrifying Day 1 synergy using Mysterio to wipe the opponent's board.
• Sandstorm & Ozymandias: Bynx drops a massive hot take, claiming the 2-Cost Sandstorm skill will be the secret star of the rock archetype over Ozymandias.
• Juggernaut, Caliban, Selene, & Ramu: Previews and ratings for the rest of the month's wild releases.

Finally, they open the Mailbag to answer whether Snap needs an "Energy Cap" tech card, which prompts a passionate rant from Bynx about why he fundamentally hates cards like Mobius M. Mobius and Super Skrull.

You’ve been listening to The Snap Chat. Keep the conversation going on x.com/ACozyGamer and x.com/AlexanderCoccia. Until next time, happy snapping!

Transcript

Welcome Back Bynx

Alex 0:00

Hey everyone, and welcome to the next edition of the Snapchat. And this week, once again, we're joined by one of the OGs of Marvel Snap. And when I say og, I mean it. Binks was one of the first content creators out there for Marvel Snap. And I know because I wasn't even making content for Snap, I wasn't even playing Marvel Snap. And I was subbed and watching Binks content just like you should be subbed and watching Bing's content. My man. It's great to have you back on the Snapchat. How are you today? Dude?

Bynx 0:25

I'm doing great today, man. It was great having our little catch up as we do beforehand. Always happy to be here back and, uh, just having a, having a great chat with my buddy Alex. Man. How are you doing today?

Life Beyond Snap

Alex 0:35

I'm doing good. I, uh, we're just chatting before, it's funny, like, we go like, Hey, we got to get started early. It's gonna be a late night, and then we end up chatting for half hour about random things. Exactly. Whether it's, yeah, like we were just talking about how, uh, you know, I, I competed in a, uh, riff bound tournament today, so I was, I was doing that and then, uh, you know, I'm, you'd think I'd be burnt out from talking about cards and doing things about cards, but for some reason I think Tcgs and CCGs. I don't think it's ever gonna leave me. I think it's gonna be one of those things where it's like, I'm gonna be talking and playing card games for the rest of my life. And, uh, I don't think that's a bad thing. I think that might actually be a good thing.'cause uh, I mean it's endlessly enjoyable and I know for a fact that you yourself play other card games too.

Passion Over Views

Bynx 1:14

Yeah, man. Yeah. I, uh, speaking of that, I know you've been playing, uh, riff Bound and really enjoying that. You've been top cut in tournaments, like an absolute stud like you were just telling me. But, uh, but yeah, last August I, I picked up, uh, Pokemon, TCG after watching it at Worlds, I, you know, I tried Pocket and it just really wasn't for me, but something about the Pokemon TCG kind of struck me. And, uh, yeah, man, it's, it's kind of just been a, a weekly thing, going to card shops, meeting people playing. It's been an absolute ton of fun, man. Like last weekend was, uh, Pokemon Day, and there was. Like a bunch of raffles and a lot more people came out to tournaments. I ended up, I won a ton of packs. I won like this mega Venus so Box. It's been really, really good. But yeah, it's been so cool. Um, you, you know, before Snap I played a little bit of Hear Stone, but I really didn't mess with too many other Tcgs. But after getting so involved with Snap, having one that's, uh, that not only, different where you can think about the game a little bit differently, but also like the physical aspect of it is just so cool, man. And, and just like, like I said, getting out there meeting really, really cool people. Like I've made some awesome friends uh, through it in the area. It's just been really, really fun. And I, I a hundred percent agree. I definitely think it's something that's gonna, uh, stick with me for the rest of my life, man. Hun. Hundred PI

Alex 2:26

like the fact that we're starting a Marvel Snap podcast by talking literally about every one of its potential competitors all at once. Yeah, but it's, uh, it's funny'cause you mentioned like Pocket, right? And I remember playing Pocket when it first came out and being like, I made a bunch of videos for it. The videos performed really well. Like statistically views wise, I'm like. Yo, I don't love this game. Like, I just don't like it. And a big part of what I want to do with content is I just want to cover things I love. Like you can chase viewership, you can chase all that stuff. And I feel like for me, it's like, that's not what I want to be doing. I wanna be covering things I truly am passionate about, believe it or not, still passionate about Marvel Snap. They've tried to beat it outta me. Damnit. But somehow, you know, I'm still passionate about Snap, but like, that's why I started playing Riff Bound. I'm like, I checked the game out and I, you know, I was like, damn, I actually really like how this plays. And I was doing a podcast for Riff Bound is called, uh, as well, called into the riff with, uh, Joe Curley. And it was one of those, like, it started slow. And I'm like, I don't care. Like, I don't care that it's not getting as many views as maybe you'd wish or liked, but I'm having so much fun. I'm keep doing it anyway. And now we actually had our first podcast outperform the Snapchat, which is wild, right? And you actually, behind the scenes, this guy congratulate. He's like, Hey. He's like, congrats on the awesome pod pop. What a gentleman. Banks. Like you're just, just building up the community from the viewers to the creators just doing your, uh. Your work to just spread some love and you know how rare that is in this world. Man, I just appreciate you so much.

Bynx 3:45

I appreciate you too, man. Like, like I said before, man, like seeing, seeing my friends and awesome people I've met through streaming be successful is like my absolute favorite thing to see. And I do try and reach out to people because I know not a lot of people do, you know, and a lot of times it can feel. Thankless sometimes some of the things that, that you do. So, uh, it, it means a lot that, uh, that, that, um, that you were happy to see that and that, and that you, uh, you, you know, you mentioned that when we first started talking, but, uh, I also think it's a little bit weird because I think that it's a bit of a, uh, misconception that I feel like people look at content creators as people who do just kind of like chase views and just like kind of go and play, uh, you know, whatever's popular or just like Chase whatever's popular. And I'm sure there's people that do that. But for, for the most part, almost everyone I've met has like that same thing that you were just saying, where it's like, if I'm playing a game and I just. Don't like it, it doesn't matter how good the views are. It doesn't matter what's, what's happening. Like once you stop enjoying what you're doing for work, like it becomes like work, man. Like we have like these really cool jobs where we get to play video games and talk about things that we really, really like as a living. And I feel like there probably are some people who do get trapped like that and, and kind of like just go towards, uh, you know, chasing what is higher viewership or chasing anything, no matter how much they care about it. But, uh, the best content creators that I've met and and the most awesome ones, almost exclusively have the same opinion that I think me and you have of like, it doesn't matter how good something's doing, I just wanna play something that I really, really like and share with people. And you hope that it catches on?

Dark Times and Roadmap

Alex 5:14

No, there's no question about That's absolutely true. Right? I think that if you're playing something you don't enjoy and you're just going through the motions, it shows in your content too. Like people can feel that energy. You can't fake it. And we've all seen like YouTube videos. Like I, my my kids will put YouTube videos on and I'm walking by and I'm like, they're like the fake excitement and like the rant. They're like, you can read through that so easily. Right? Just like a human being can detect a, a, a real laugh from a fake one, right? It's just like you feel that emotion. And for me it's like I'm lucky that Snap still brings those moments out of me, but there have been times where it doesn't as well. Right? There have been, we've had some dark times in Marvel Snap. Yeah. We don't listen. If you're watching and listening right now, you've survived the Dark Times of Marvel Snap. In fact, the amount of people that come by streams knock up

Bynx 5:58

Woodman, knock up wood.

Alex 5:59

No, I know you're one of the few left everybody. It's kind of crazy though because a lot of people have been like, Hey Alex, like, don't play Snap anymore, but like, still like watching the videos to keep up with what's going on, right? So it's um, here's the hoping 2026. You know, they, they committed to fixing the bugs. That was cool. It's actually not one of the topics, but they talked, they sent like a little kind of, not a roadmap, but like an idea of like, hey, like, yeah, we're working on draft mode. Hopefully that looks cool, but they're gonna try to fix like the, uh, the actual bones of the game. They're gonna actually try to make the game more responsive, better, and, uh, shore up some of the code that might be holding them back. Actually, why don't we talk about that first? It's not an official topic, but they did release, uh, that kind of roadmap. And, uh, the major part of that is like, we're gonna fix this game up. Like we recognize there's too many bugs and, uh, and I think the actual code is, is holding them back to some degree. So we'd love your take on that.

Bynx 6:52

Yeah. For me, I'm a, I'll believe it when I see a kind of guy.'cause people, people have been talking to me about draft mode and being like, oh, did you see they actually did draft mode? It's like. They haven't done anything yet. You know, I'll believe it when I, when they, you know, show off like the preview of it. I'll believe it when they give it a date because I do feel like one thing that Snap does whenever they put a date to something, it pretty much always happens. Like a lot of times they'll like talk about stuff like that might be coming and then it either gets pushed down the road, but once they put an actual date to something like. Pretty much has universally like went through. So I'm someone who just kind of holds a bated breath. I'm, I'm cautiously optimistic with stuff like that. Uh, it does, it is really cool to see that they're addressing like the bug issue. But again, you know, we've seen things. They had, they had the one that really got to me was when they put out the thing that they fixed the red pips and then the red pips were worse, like right afterwards. Like they, they said that they were gonna adjust and change all these red pips. I hate'cause I'm just a DD and I will, like, whenever there's red pips, I'll click them and then it doesn't do anything and it freaks me out. So then they announced that I was so stoked, and then now it's been, now it's a little bit better. And they did some things to fix it now, but like, after they first said that it was that in a patch, it was actually worse for, for a little bit. So I'm cautiously optimistic. I, I like that they are, uh, acknowledging things. I think that acknowledging things is, uh, really good. And I think as, uh, you know, as a community member, I really like seeing, seeing things be acknowledged. I think that's an important step for like building trust with stuff like that. Uh, but really, you know, it's gonna, I'm cautiously optimistic. I'm excited that they're admitting it and we'll see when it actually comes or, or when the changes are. I'll have my takes on it then. You know, I, I've just heard too much. I feel like in not, not only Snap, but just in, in games in general, that they'll say a lot of really great things and they'll pepper it up and they'll make it really flashy and sound really good. Really all that matters is what they end up delivering. So cautiously optimistic, happy that they, uh, acknowledged it, but I'll wait to see and, and have my takes on it once I actually see the improvements.

Bugs Red Pips Conspiracy

Alex 8:51

Of course. And I will link the blog post, uh, in the description so anyone can read it who hadn't seen it. They did mention that they wanna improve card acquisition, which is cool. I think that, uh, they have actually made some improvement. I've been giving'em their flowers. Like they were releasing what, like 13 cards a season or something. They definitely dialed that back a little bit. They started incorporating more cards into the limited tie game modes. Those are generally acquirable for 800 gold, which I thought was really good. They actually jumped it up to 1200 gold, then brought it back down to 800 because I think you guys voted with your wallets, which is exactly what has to happen. But before we get lost in the sauce on that, I gotta tell you, you bring up the red pips. I have a conspiracy theory. You wanna hear it?

Bynx 9:27

Sure.

Alex 9:27

Okay. If red pips are broken as hell, we know that they barely work. I don't like that. The fact that they have like red pips on like the token bundles for like variants and stuff, like, don't show me that I don't care. Like, and every day it seems like it resets, but there's one red pip that has been mysteriously absent for some time. Do you know which one it is?

Bynx 9:46

No. Is it the one that like, grab your tokens or grab

Alex 9:48

your hole? Hell, yes. It is interesting the grab your tokens pip has not been working for me for a long time and I thought to myself like I, I bet you I've forgotten multiple days where I log in, get my credits and I don't remember if I got my my tokens yet. Conspiracy theory is that pip intentionally absent.

Bynx 10:04

That's interesting. That would, maybe you're getting, maybe you're getting ab tested, you know, because it still shows up for me and, and I, I still have to click it. So maybe you're in the, the B group of the AB test and they're trying to see, hey, if we don't show'em this red pip, how much less are they actually gonna click it and claim this free stuff? I've, I feel like it could be true. I feel like it could be a true conspiracy theory right there.

Alex 10:25

Yeah. So they get Ben Brode into a room for the first time in seven months, and they're like, yo, what are we gonna do about Marvel Snap? And he's like. Make it so Canadians can't see the te the BIP on the token shop. They're like, that's genius. We got'em. The

Bynx 10:36

Canadians are, they're too consistent at

Alex 10:38

clicking that

Bynx 10:38

pit man. They're consistent. They're clicking it three times a day every single day. We gotta slow

Draft Mode Hype

Alex 10:42

it down. Gotta get'em off it. No, the credit one's there. I'm telling you the token one isn't in the second page. But anyways, that's a whole other conversation. But, uh, yeah, I'm glad they're gonna be fixing stuff up. And uh, they got the new game modes coming. They actually gave us a whole indication of what the seasons are gonna look like, which is kind of cool. They're, and again, they did mention that, uh, I'm gonna quote them'cause I don't wanna be misquoted, quote, it's too early to get specific, but are, but we are working on new game modes, including one that people have been very loud about wanting draft mode. The big difference between these as they're built around new beck uh, deck building rules that haven't been possible in Snap before. So banks. I am personally excited for that. Draft mode has obviously been something that we've been looking forward to for the longest time. And if we're gonna give second dinner, any credit at all, they do cook with the draft. The modes, the new modes are good. Like I've, I actually like, pretty much all of them, I play, if a new mode is out, I'll play that over ranked all day long. Like I'll play Sanctum Showdown, uh, this, this time around I played nothing but like 2099 stuff, which is kind of cool. Like, I'm just gonna get, let the Doom Bots win for me, bro. And, uh, I became a believer in Moon Dragon, uh, but anyways, yeah. I'm interested, uh, any closing thoughts on this, uh, coming update to Marvel Snaps, uh, ecosystem?

Bynx 12:00

I, I, no, I will say I am very excited for draft mode. You know, I know I'm saying, you know, I'll be cautiously optimistic. I'll, I'll see you when I see it's,'cause I don't wanna get myself too excited if it's still gonna be eight months down the line. I per, I really think that if draft mode comes out and it's good, I'm gonna probably try doing like a month of pretty much only doing draft mode. Because I really, really love the idea of draft mode. The one thing that scares me about draft mode is that I'm scared they're gonna overcook it. Because in some previous things where Glen was talking about draft mode, he said he doesn't want it to just be Hearthstone Arena is where you basically get an option of three cards, you pick one and then you go onto the next one. And for me that I feel like that would be perfect. That's like exactly what I wanna see. So I'm a little scared that they might overcook it and add too much to it to make it a bit too, uh, convoluted of a process.'Cause I, I personally think the simpler, the better. I just think the base game of Snap is so good and so solid that having games against people that aren't running Medex and you're just kind of like. Playing piles of cards against pile of cards. I'm at a whole live in playing piles of cards, you know, I'm gonna be in my zone, man. So I'm really, really excited for it. I hope that they don't uh, overcook it. So that, that's my thoughts on draft one. And then as far as like overall limited time modes, I would, I would generally agree with you that I, that I do like, uh, a lot of the offerings that they have, especially sanctum showdown, because pretty much all the other limited time boats are just like very just variations of normal Snap. Whereas like sanctums, like they made a completely new and different game. But that's so similar, but so different to how you win in, in normal Marvel Snap. And that shocked me. Like that shocked me the more that I've been thinking about sanctum in the, the last couple of times that it's come out. So, uh, you know, maybe that should give me a, a bit more of, of being open to draft mode and letting them cook a little bit more and being a little bit more, uh, weird with it because it, it's just crazy that sanctum like functions and is so interesting and cool using all the same tools that regular Marvel Snap has and it makes it feel so completely different. Uh, so specifically I would say like sanctum, I, I think they absolutely crushed and I would love to see more limited time modes like that as opposed to ones that are just like very slight augmentations to just normal Snap.

Limited Modes and Snapping

Alex 14:18

Yeah. And um, I guess the other thing worth mentioning is that with limited time game modes, it gives'em a chance to like test. Things like ideas that maybe they wouldn't wanna put in ranked ladder yet, like asymmetric snapping, which was introduced in Deadpool's Diner, which I think is kind of a cool idea now. I think that obviously symmetrical snapping like what we have now makes sense and it's been what we've always had and what we've always done and like, especially in competitive circumstances, the stakes raise is important. But I'm starting to wonder if like just on the regular ladder, pre infinite, if like. Is is maybe infinite only just gonna be the snapping we have now and un climbing to infinite? Maybe it's asymmetrical. You know what I mean? Like, couldn't that be interesting? Raise the stakes, make more of a differentiation between infinite and non infinite by having that different snapping mechanic, that adjustment. Um, maybe that makes the, uh, the ranking up experience a little less tedious for some people. Um, because you Snap and then they just leave. It's like, uh, what was the point of rank getting into this? Right? But once you're an infinite, you're actually climbing individual, uh, like ranks, trying to get to rank one or whatever, then the snapping mechanic adds that tension that a more competitive player would be looking for. Whereas most casual players, I think would be satisfied with like ranking to infinite every season. That's their goal. They're not trying to be number one. I don't know, man, there's so many ideas and, uh, you did mention the, uh, the pick three from. From Hearthstone. I like that too. But at the same time, don't you remember in Hearthstone where they people used to like install, like was it Overwolf or whatever and it would just tell them like exactly what to pick anyways. And everyone was just playing like the same stuff and I felt like that actually beat me out of that mode, like arena a little bit. I like the idea of like pure jank, like when I play, uh, we're gonna talk about it again. Like when I play Sealed modes in other card games, like in Riff Bound, whatever, I like the fact that I opened six packs and I pieced together like a complete hodgepodge of cards. And I know my opponent is playing with a hodgepodge of cards and that like we have cards that are so not met at in that deck and like I know that they can't prepare for it and I can't prepare, prepare for what they're gonna do, and games are won and lost on the most bizarre place with the most bizarre cards because that's what you opened in your packs. I like that spirit. Maybe that's just aish em, I don't know. But um, you know what I mean? But I kinda like that spirit too. So, uh, anyways, I'll get your thoughts on that before we move on to the reviews of the new cards.

Bynx 16:28

Uh, yeah, I mean, uh, like I said, man, I think I, I do think that it would be a bit more spread out than that. I think that no matter what happens, people will optimize it with stuff like overwolf or using things to figure out exactly what the best cards are. Everyone's just gonna optimize to try and like, certain people will always just try to optimize to, to find things and try and get the best possible thing. But that doesn't mean that everyone's gonna do that, and that doesn't mean that you have to do that, but, uh, yeah, I. I do agree that I really like, like sealed stuff. Like there's, uh, gonna be a pre-release for Pokemon next weekend where you basically get kind of like a, a made up deck that they have of 40 cards and then you get to open a few packs and then you get to like, uh, add those cards in. So everyone kind of has like different decks even though there's four different, like, starting decks that everyone has. So Pokemon doesn't have very much as far as sealed format, especially'cause like evolutions and stuff like that, you kind of need like multiple of certain cards for, for things to really make sense. But, but that's like the closest thing that they have. And I've also like always really, really enjoyed that. So maybe like, yeah, maybe you just get 30 cards thrown at you and you get to pick your favorite 12 out of them or something like that. Maybe there is some way that they can give it a little bit, uh, less of a optimization route. But, uh, either way, man, I'm just excited for a different way to play Snap and I'm excited for other people to play random piles of cards like I've done by choice for, for so long.'cause maybe even the, the playing field a little bit, you know?

Card Reviews Kickoff

Alex 17:49

Yeah. No question buddy. All right. It is about time that we actually cut to talk about Marvel Snap, because I was about to go down the rabbit hole, by the way. Taught about Pokemon. First of all, there's people out here probably thinking like, wait, you can play Pokemon carts, how you just collected them. Not to mention how, like, honestly not that expensive to get into. Like you can get a pretty decent star. Like not the starter decks, but like, do you know those decks they released, like the tournament ones? Like you can buy, uh,

Bynx 18:12

yeah. Yeah. League battle decks.

Alex 18:13

Yeah, the league battle. They're pretty legit, man.

Bynx 18:15

Yeah.

En Sabah Season Pass

Alex 18:16

Bound the opposite problem, I think. Uh, not quite as inexpensive as Pokemon, but, uh, anyways, let's talk about n Saba. Nor would we be talking about in Saba, nor in review ISKA the unbeaten and review. Juggernaut Review. And then we're gonna be doing our previews of both Gambit and Sandstorm. Binks and Sabor. The season pass card, the four five that reads objective, have a full front row at each location, transform into Apocalypse Celestial's chosen, who will then. On Reveal. Swap the lowest power card in your front row at any location with a card from your deck. So I'll give it to you. Do you think en Saba Apocalypses Celestial's chosen is worth the purchase of a season pass?

Bynx 19:02

Yes. Well, I mean, first of all, I think if you're ever gonna spend money in Marvel Snap, I tell people this all the time, yes, you should just always buy the season pass. It's just always, always the best way to, to actually spend your money. But, uh, I think in, so I think it's a really, really solid card that people haven't figured out yet. Uh, I was actually, I was, I was, um, really interested in this because I made a really weird just pile of cards that was like S lock and za and just a bunch of really solid four drops'cause this and Isca released at the same time. And that ended up actually becoming like the third most played deck on Untapped. And I was looking at the top five decks on Untapped playing this card over the first like three or four days. The five decks that are running this card are. As different as you could possibly see. There was like one that was this like Thanos like lock jaw style deck that's using like this blink and lock jaw to try and, flip the stones into the deck and get big cards. There was a deck that was, um, it was a really weird like ccy ccy style deck that was running like white tiger and all these like really weird things. There was my weird deck, which is just like a good card style deck with six four drops in it. Just trying to play like efficiently. Every single turn. There was like a full zoo arc type and then there was a full Aurora arc type. And I've never seen a card come out like this. And have the five most played decks be like completely different from each other. So like, first of all. I love that aspect of it. I love that. It just seems like to be a very powerful tool that can go into a variety of different decks. I really, really like cards like that. I feel like there's a lot of room to like play with them and try and like find, find their strengths. But overall I just think that this card is kind of like a glue card for some archetypes.'cause it's just, it's really powerful. You're getting a four eight, like, let's be honest, pretty much every game of Marvel Snap you're gonna be filling the, the front row. Uh, almost always. It's very, very rare and sometimes locations can make it a little bit funky. But, um, just a really, really solid card, a four eight that will flip your lowest power card into your deck and sometimes give you something really good and almost always give you an upgrade because it is targeting that lowest power card. But just overall, like having this card at Iska come out at the same time, like they're. Being open to just making good four drops for the longest time. I feel like when Zbu Shang Chi, like back when Dark Hawk was forecast, like there were so many decks that would just basically run Zbu, Shang Chi and two other four drops and that was like, like over half the meta it felt like at certain points. So I feel like they really pulled back on how much power they were serving to four drops for that reason. And this is like the first time they've like released multiple cards, uh, in a row. They're just really good high value four drops and I'm really, really excited to see that because I think that that's cool for mid-range decks. But yeah, just overall this card would be great in draft. This would be like a draft all star type of card. Just very, very solid. A good card that you can try on a lot of decks and something we haven't figured out yet. I would say

Alex 21:51

it's kind of interesting to hear you talk as positively as this for Insur.'cause I'm actually, I think a little lower, but. I did like the card. It's exactly what you said. Getting to play in a whole bunch of different archetypes was cool and that where I played it most was actually in Thanos because I made a Thanos deck with en Salor because I'm like, I'll be able to fill the front row easy and get one of those stones out there. Who cares, right? En salor. I played juggernaut in that deck as well.'cause a lot of stones of different powers and everything I had was different powers. And then I actually played, um, ISKA in that deck too because I'm like, why not have all three? So I was playing games with all three, which was so fun. And I even did that in like zoo as well and then eventually cut Iska from the zoo.'cause it didn't quite make sense, but it was kind of cool how they came up. This was the first time I think, in Marvel Snap's history because there released three cards on one day and I played with all of them for the entire stream that I was doing it across a bunch of different decks altogether. And then over time was like, okay, this deck is actually better without juggernaut. This deck's better without isca, which is rare, but anyway, and Saur is good here and stuff like that. It was actually really fun. I had a really fun couple days of like playing the game and like checking out this particular new card. I did have some circumstances though, where in Salvador absolutely throttled me. Like I made, I made a deck with like, you know, I had um, you know, the void and sentry with Ccy and the hood and I'm like, oh, it's gonna get rid of the void for me and stuff like that. But I had a thing where like it pulled a card like juggernaut before it did its objective. So it took a completed objective juggernaut. But because of the play order I played in, I played apocalypse first or in Sodor first, then Juggernaut it checked this this objective first. The two power juggernaut was the first one there, uh, was like the last of the two played, but also the lowest power'cause it was two, pulls it off the location, it would've been a two eight, pulls it outta the location and puts hood there instead and completely throws the game. I was like, no. And meanwhile in my deck I had like double dinosaur or something like that. I don't remember what I had in my deck. No, I wouldn't have been in that deck. I was playing double dinosaur in my Thanos deck, whatever. I had something that was not that. I was like, no, you scam artists. How dare you? So I almost wondered if, like, it would've been cool if it had like a blink text or something like that, but then that'd be so overpowered probably, right?

Bynx 24:02

Yeah.

Alex 24:03

That'd be dirty, overpowered. But

Bynx 24:04

anyways, I saw people on the Reddit saying like, oh, it should, it should just make the card that it's someone's plus three power. It's like, what? What do you mean you just like, give a card three extra power with its ability and it's like, oh, it should just do this. It's like, what? I don't, I don't know, man. It's just like the card's like really like be, I think the fact that it, if it didn't target the lowest card, this card would be trash. Right? And then maybe you could add the blink text, but the fact that it always targets the lowest card, while there are some, some bad things, like you say, and like, you know, especially if you run Hood decks, which is a really good card with this, because it's almost always gonna be one that it's gonna slot in, can still sometimes hang out in the deck and then, and then you gotta pop it out. So it's a bit of a risk reward thing. But, uh, yeah, no, I, I'm, I feel your points definitely.

Alex 24:45

So in terms of untapped based statistics taken just before recording, this podcast ranks 82, rank one infinite. It's currently running a 53.3% win rate at a 13.5% popularity, which is good, but not nearly as high as what we saw. With like shall Lao, for instance, or what we saw with Star Lord. But star Lord took like a week to really start cooking like Star War, star Lord, almost like looked g he looked good for sure on the first few days. And then like the really cracked stuff that started getting solved and he started ruining everything. Do you think En Banor can get to that point? Like do you think it has the potential to reach the levels of Sha la and of um. Of star Lord.

Bynx 25:28

Uh, no I don't, but I think that's a good,

Alex 25:31

dammit.

Bynx 25:31

I think it's a good thing.

Alex 25:32

Yeah,

Bynx 25:33

that's a good thing, a good thing. I, I think that, uh, I think that I thinks Lau and Star were obviously too high on the, the power level. You know, you saw that they got, they got nerfed within a month, both of them, and they were both kind of like redefined archetypes. I really like, I like whatchu lau brought to the game a lot more than what I, what star Lord brought to the game.'cause like, I don't know, star War just kind of feels like a bit of a. Degenerate type of card where it's just like, okay, well you have 14 energy, like how am I supposed to play around like the, the million different things that you can do. And then, you know, it's like juggernaut, cosmo decks now and all these things to like completely shut you out. Whereas Ens inside Manu, it's just a, it's a very, it's a powerful card. It's a card that could be used in a lot of different ways. It's not really gonna define its own archetype, but it's a really, really great tool to have access to. Especially, like I said, I feel like four drops have now kind of gotten below the power curve because they were so hesitant with how dominant Sabu and Shang Q were for so long. So having like a new four drop that's really high on the, the power level, I think it's just a really, really nice tool tool to have. And it's definitely gonna have a much different impact than like the shoe Laos or the star Lords of the world are. But, uh, for me personally I'm much more interested in a card like this that's not so clear in how to use it because like. Even though like Shule has like some different decks and star Lord I, I think is actually a lot more interesting than people give it credit for because it, it can make some really, really cool decks. It's just like the most optimized way to play. It just seems to be play as many of them as you want and then play two fumes and then win. So like for me, I, I'm much more I'm, I'm much more interested in cards like en saur. That's just powerful and it's like a bit of a puzzle to figure out where he is best. And it's another option to always think about as your deck building as opposed to these things that are more like mandatory archetypes where there's like five cards you kind of already know that you want to, to run with them. And it's kind of like taking care of some of that process for you. Someone who really likes to build decks. I, I think n Subor really speaks to me a lot more.

Alex 27:30

The thing that I was thinking about though, and tell me if you agree before we get into the star ratings for N Subor, I don't think. That this card outside of this season will see much play as it stands, like if you're trying to be as competitive as possible. I don't know if this card en Salor ends up making decks that are like gonna be meta defining. I don't know if we're gonna see you know, tournaments being won on en Salvador. I just wonder if the randomness of it in the four eight tagline, which is, is good but not great will ultimately get it like punted from some of the most competitive 12 card shells that we see. That's the concern I have despite the fact that like, I generally like the card, I'm coming in at approximately three stars because I think the card is worth getting for the season pass. I think that like, it's fun to have, but I don't think it has the competitive legs behind it. Like, I don't know if it's gonna be a card that passed this season will be meta defining and it's def no, I don't think it's de definitely not meta defining. That's for sure. I don't know if it'll make many decks after this season. Like I can see it being in like some B and C tier stuff by like the a and s tier. If you're trying to be competitive or, I don't know, like do you think I'm wrong? Like, do you see more upside or like, I'd be curious what your thoughts first on star rating, of course, on, uh, whether or not pass this season if you think this is gonna hold up.

Bynx 28:52

Yeah, I think I'm gonna rate it at, I think I'm at four stars with this card. Uh, I really think that it is a bit underrated right now, and I think it's a, it's a very similar reason to why I think Drax is very underrated still. It's starting to, people are starting to understand how crazy strong tracks is, but it took a really long while and I think it's because of the meta that it appeared in, right? Like, we're right after Schule and Star Lord, which were just so dominated by these like high tier decks that present this threat to you that's so hard to beat that it kind of feels like for a while you either like, have to play that archetype or you have to play something that directly counters that. Uh, whereas like cards, like Drax and ura, I think are just very good, high value. Tools that you can add into a deck and in a meta where those cards are continued to like push down and the the meta becomes more something that's competitive and has lots of different things that, that feel like they can be super successful. I think that's where cards like Nubbin or and Drex can, can really, really shine as these tools to expand and up the power level of different existing shells that people are messing around with. So I think that, I think that insura, I, I actually think that it will continue seeing play after this season. And I think that it's gonna be because, uh, the power level of this card at a base level, I think is very high. And I think that, uh, right now we're in a very interesting meta and we have for the last couple of months that's a bit restrictive on being able to feel like you can just play a card that's just like pretty solid and good value.

Iska The Unbeaten

Alex 30:23

Alright. Two differing takes. I mean, generally speaking we both like the card. Binks a little higher on it, Alex, a little lower. But regardless, definitely a fun design. Definitely a cool, fun design. And, uh, if you're looking for a season pass card that like people of all different collection levels can play. Like if you're a new beginning player and you're playing zoo like squirrel girl in this does the thing almost right. So it's like, it's kind of cool from that perspective. So, uh, yeah. And Saba, and this is not in, this is Drs the avatar of life. It's time we talk about Iska, the unbeaten, a fitting name for the super premium season pass card that, uh, is running a 56% win rate and a 30% popularity rating according to untapped basis. Uh, statistics ranks 82, rank one infinite. That is a very high number. In fact, it is double the play rate of Un Salvador as a super premium season pass card. You know what, I'm gonna give you the floor here, ISKA, the, it was my five star last week going into the season. And I don't wanna say Alex was right, but also Binks, I think I might've been right.

Bynx 31:32

Oh yeah. Easiest five star card. You, you can imagine, man, this card is an absolute beast. I think that a lot of people are trying to do too much to this card and they aren't just realizing the value that this card just as a singular card that this thing has, man, if you play this in a lane with negative, with that, you're down by seven. It's pretty much gonna guarantee jump to 12 and then you're threatening 24 at the end of the game. That's crazy, man. I do think that there are more, I think people are gonna get a little better at understanding how to play around it because I don't think people understand how to play around this card at all right now. And also I do think that there's a very. Interesting that they release this right now because one of the best ways that you can counter this card is with objectives because the end of turn step happens and then the objective step happens. You can use cards like Juggernaut to be losing that location by two iska checks. He says, oh, I'm already winning. I'm not, I don't gotta get bigger. Boom, juggernaut flips at the end of the game. You flip that lane and she just sticks there at three power. So I really like that. If they were gonna release a card like this, they release at the same time as objective because this card needs something like that. Otherwise it's just so, so ridiculous. But yeah, people are just using it as just a, a great singular value generator that can go in almost any deck. But also, man, the invisible woman decks are using this and it seems so hard to compete against when this triggers, like they play it on the final turn and it triggers like four or six times. Like it can literally flip a lane that you're losing by like a hundred power if they get like six triggers of this. It's really crazy, man. Doubling is a very, very scary thing in Marvel Snap. And this card does it better than almost any other card.

How to Counter Iska

Alex 33:14

So that deck you're referring to, again, according to Untapped, nearly a 62% win rate. Seven, six cube rate and just under 10,000 games. It is the number one right now. It's crazy. And I mean, the writing was on the wall. Like, this seems so obvious too. It's like you look at you like, yeah, this is gonna be crazy. And I agree that I think buffing its bait because the more you buff it, the less it's gonna prock. Like you just let it do its thing. Like going out to the four three is absolutely fine. Like it's gonna be fine. To the point where like, I was even playing azabu, you mentioned Za BU's second time mentioned this week, let's go. And I brought it down to three, but then I, I wasn't able to reliably even pick locations or battlefields to player in.'cause I was like, oh, I don't know where they're gonna be. I want be losing that spot. Start getting the ramp going, and then I would play it. And then we didn't even play there. So now she's just sitting by herself and I'm like, well now they're gonna play out her on turn six and she's gonna only be six power. So now it's scuffed, but. What I tried to do, and you're right, there's ways to get around it. First of all, there's the obvious, like if you're gonna really, if you just want to like hate punch Iska in the face, then you can just, you know, cosmic ghost rider and that'll get it done right. You cosmic Ghost Rider.

Bynx 34:17

You're playing ghost dude. People are playing ghost right now. It's crazy.

Alex 34:22

That surprises you. What do you expect people to do?

Bynx 34:25

I, that's what I'm saying. It's like, it's, it's in the card's so strong that it's making people play Ghost this card. That has been a joke for so long since it got changed. That, that's nuts, man. That really speaks to how strong it is.

Alex 34:36

Wait, you think Cosmo Ghost Rider is a bad card?

Bynx 34:39

No, no, no. Ghost.

Alex 34:40

Oh my God. I thought you were just Shorthanding, ghost cosmic, ghost rider as ghosts. We can talk about ghosts too. Oh my God, I went back.

Bynx 34:49

Yeah, people ghost. We can talk about ghosts like ghost. Man. It's crazy. Dude, I've, I've never seen this card since it got changed and for the first time I'm finally seeing it because people are using it to try and counter it and it's pretty good at it. I mean, it's like a pretty efficient card if there's a lot of those under turn decks, especially if that deck is really good. The problem is, is that invisible woman deck can just play those cards at the very end and it is just like, it's could just win one lane, just something goes for another one. It's tough, man.

Alex 35:11

Yeah, so like I was talking originally about Cosmic Ghost Rider. You are right. Ghost is seeing play, but like Cosmo, ghost Rider seems like a very natural inclusion. Mm-hmm Because it's a good catch all turn off Isca. It'll turn off Yo Costa. It'll turn off a lot of those things because you get like the Prodigy stuff too. You swipe it Prodigy's often being played on turn five. So then like as a result, like you're like boom, see you later. You copied like whatever. It's like

Bynx 35:32

probably not. Nice vanilla card. You copy there.

Alex 35:33

Yeah. Congratulations. Hopefully you're playing Patriot. So like I think that Cosmo Ghost Rider is a good call here. What I was trying to do, and I know that this is like, this was kind of like cook a little bit, right? And I know you'll get behind this here. I was playing Captain Marvel. I was playing Lau Captain Marvel and I was juicing ka to like 20 power. I'm just like, you win the lane, you win the game for me, Kap, I'll win one and you just win the other. I'll make sure there's space. I'm gonna win this lane and it's your job to win the other. And like I had some wild games with Ka flying around because Ka didn't care about disk. This is like, I'm gonna win the game, or I'm not gonna win the game. Um, I still think this card could use a little bit of love. This is probably one of the cap, Marvel's probably one of the most powerful, superheroes in Marvel and is one of the worst cards in the game. And I try to cope so hard and I listen. The only reason I bring this up'cause if someone's gonna cope alongside with me in deck building, I know it's Binks, Binks can feel like you, you know what I'm going with here? If anybody knows trying to be creative in a deck, it's you. And so, like, I try to make Captain Marvel work and stuff like that, but like the idea of like trying to move around her pros and I, I think it's worth, it's worth mentioning that a, like it's possible counter play's possible. Mm-hmm. But B, there's only so much counter play because at the end of the day, if you're gonna be doubling power, then like this is just stupid. Like it's still just a stupid card. And if the card is so strong that you have to like actively play around it, come up with new strategies to not prock it card is broken. It's a five star.

Iska Misplays and Counters

Premium Pass Power Debate

Bynx 37:03

Yeah, it's like, you know, giga Chad just plays iska and like, lets you spend the whole game, like figuring out how to beat that lane and then just wins the other two lanes while you're doing that, right? Like there's, uh, it's just, it really is that it's just like this terrifying inevitability of a card. And I do think people are gonna get better at playing it because I think people are not very good at playing it right now. I see so many people playing it on lanes that they're winning by a bunch and playing it where it's not P ping immediately, which is by far the best thing you can do is get the first P proc of ISCA down. Uh, because it just makes the car every time. It pros, it gets so much like, it, it's a scaling threat that gets so much more threatening every P pro, right? So like, I feel like, uh, people are gonna get better at playing it while people are gonna get better at playing around it. Like I said, I think objective is a really, really cool counter play. I don't know if you've had some really good feeling like en Saban flipping and, and winning an ola or a juggernaut flipping and, and winning an Escalade feels really, really good to play around this card, but I definitely see this card being a Nerf target and uh, you know, speaking of super premium pass. I do not like having those cards be such high power level. I feel like it happened initially with Fantastic Car and then they've been pretty good with it. And all the, all the super season pass cards that they've released have been cards that are interesting and fun and cool, but not necessarily something that you feel like you need. Like man you feel like if you're trying to play a lot of good decks right now, you feel like you kind of need this card. And I don't really like that being on that, that, you know, additional level of the paywall, even though now you can, buy it through tokens after the, the community, uh, response to the first one. But I do hope that this doesn't become a trend where cards that are as powerful as ska find their way in that super premium pass.

Alex 38:43

So we were actually gonna talk about that in the mailbag. We had a question or a comment about that, about us to discuss that. So maybe we'll just cover that right now. I think it's an interesting topic while we're talking about Iska. It actually came from Andreas from Copenhagen, and Andreas said, Hey guys, love this show. And I usually agree a lot with you, including that Iska will be a problem. But I feel like the criticism of it being a problem, that the super premium season pass card is better than the regular season pass card is a weird one. The super premium card can usually be obtained with tokens, and the regular pass card is only available via ping. So I would think that the other way around is more of an issue

Bynx 39:23

that is, that's interesting and that is pretty valid, especially after the, uh, the original change. I, I think that there's maybe two, two things to it. One, it's maybe a conditioning thing because I, I think that with live service games like this, I just have an understanding that there's usually going to be like. A pass and then something that's exclusive for it, right. So I feel like I'm kind of conditioned to that whether that's good or bad. That is something that's like a known and something that I feel like is kind of accepted because, the games do have to make money. They're a business. And, uh, I, I feel like that's just something that's been like the standard for so long. So my concern with it is like, I think that that's a very valid argument that, there is one that's gated and while they tried to gate the super season pass, they have made it, uh, so that it's available. So I can understand that criticism. But I do think that to me it comes down to more, I think that consistency and kind of like doing the same thing and not getting blindsided is, is really important. That's why I was so mad when the Fantastic Car thing happened and with no, they didn't say anything about it. They, you know, they weren't allowed to, you weren't allowed to talk about it until it actually happened, and it was like in front of you to actually pay. Like, stuff like that I really, really hate. So maybe it is a conditioning thing, and maybe that's something that I have to analyze with myself and say like, oh, maybe you're just being conditioned to this thing that actually is worse, but it's not. But for me, whenever I'm playing a game, I feel like there's somewhat of like a unwritten like agreement between me and this game for what's gonna happen. And what really upsets me is when that agreement feels like it gets broken or it, or it gets changed, or it gets adjusted, especially with very little warning communication. So for me, I can understand that being a pretty valid criticism, but, uh, I personally think that to an extent, I think that it's okay to have this, you know. Special card that comes out, but then having more of it and then having an additional one be there, which is really pushing you to, to spend direct money even though you can buy it for tokens. I personally just don't like that aspect of it. I interested to hear your thoughts on that too, because that is an interesting thing to think about.

Alex 41:29

Yeah. The thing that comes to mind for me is like, I don't, I love playing games. I can't stop, I'll never stop. I don't know if my wife married me thinking like, ah, he'll eventually stop playing games. It ain't stopping. I'm playing games, stop. It's never happened. We're all playing games to the bitter end man. And, uh, I'll tell you, mobile games I have a hard time with because first of all, I, I play games. I like them. There's a lot of really well designed mobile games and like some of them are more free to play friendly than others. The thing that really drives me nuts. Are like the subtle manipulations, right? That really start to add up and like, listen, I get it right, I get it. You know, oh, we're gonna, instead of just paying us money for the stuff we got like this for this weird currency you gotta spend, which makes it hard to track how much you're spending. And like that, like mobile game monetization theory really bothers me. And that's exactly what you're talking about too, right? The idea of like, well, yeah, it's technically there with tokens, but if you actually just pay the extra money, look, you get this variant and all this stuff and a they didn't make Snap Hack,

Bynx 42:30

you get a little extra Snap hack too,

Alex 42:32

you know? Yeah. Oh, I know. Like they definitely have made improvements, right? Like the original, you're right, it was original version of it was awful and it was because of you guys stepping up and voting with your wallets that they made those changes. Right? I don't like that mobile game space for that reason. The same reason why I stop playing FIFA Ultimate team. Like I just, and I, I, I play Madden every once in a while with my buddies. My buddy will come over. And like, we're not playing Ultimate team.'cause I don't want to engage with that kind of system. Um, you know, my buddy will pick, you know, the Bears and, uh, I'm just saying that'cause you know, you love the Bears, he'll usually pick the bills and I'll end up picking, uh, the dolphins, which is never fair. But, um, but like, I don't like that side of mobile gaming and I know that we've, it's so many times we talk about monetization stuff. We talk about, oh, Marvel snap's a mobile game first. You have to accept some of that. Yes. Alex, yes. The Wi Fu variant's gonna cost$140, right? Yes. It's gonna like, yeah, but I can go to my shop right now. My shop is ridiculous right now. Like, you, you think I'm joking. You think I'm making, look at this. Where is it? Look at this man, look at my shop right now. I know. You can't really say, look at this. This is, we weren't prepared for this con like, that's okay there. Boom. Right? There's number one. Okay. Number two, like, you guys think I'm making this up. You don't think they know what they're doing? Banks, you don't think they know what they're doing? Oh, they know what, what, what they're doing,

Bynx 43:54

man. They know what they're doing very well.

Alex 43:56

So for me, it's like, and by the way, uni ironic, it's actually grayed out. I dunno why it's not loading. I guess we gotta fix some bugs around here. Uh, this is$140 Canadian, one 40 plus tax. So is that like two bucks American? Yeah. Not inexpensive guys. Not inexpensive at all. So yeah, for me, I find the like, manipulation tactics of mobile gaming, very frustrating. To the point where I'm like, listen, just let me buy a game. I don't care how much you cost Boulder's Gate three, let me just buy it. No. The best money you could have spent, like, what, seven years ago was what? New? Uh, no Man's Sky, right? Let me just buy the game. I'll give you the money.

Bynx 44:35

Hits.

Alex 44:36

You

Bynx 44:36

like that? I, I do love, I do love really good VA value games like that where it's just like, I'm gonna pay this much and I know what I'm gonna get and it's gonna be amazing. Like, eugenics came out very recently that I think is like packed full of content, really, really good price. Like Slay the Spire One is a game that I've bought, I think three or four times now. I think I've bought it on, on PlayStation, on pc, on mobile, on all these different things. And I've put like almost a thousand hours into that. So excited to play the second one. It's, it's really good. But I agree, man, there's something too, just like knowing what you're gonna get and getting delivered a really good product and yeah, it's, it's just a different world than the, than the mobile gaming and how they make it. A hundred percent.

Juggernaut Surprise Value

Alex 45:14

The games that I have installed everywhere, just for fun, I have. Vampire survivors installed everywhere. And I, and now I have Hades too installed everywhere that is possible, which is basically just my switch and pc, but I'm like, no, I wanna play Hades too as well. But yeah, so, well we went off on a bit of a tangent there, but Iska definitely, absolutely broken. And, uh, super pre season of pass, still maybe a little suss off for debate. Would it be very interested in your conversation down in the common section below? And Juggernaut came up a bunch of times. We talked about juggernaut and, um, this was a card that I'm willing to admit. I think I came in low on, I came in in preview as a two star juggernauts. Better than that, this was a card for me that didn't read as good as it actually is. I honestly binks, I dunno about if you feel the same way. I wasn't trying very hard, if at all to get this to go and it just did it itself. Getting six different powers in play if you're just playing cards and playing at least six cards wasn't crazy. It doesn't include itself naturally, but I found this to be surprisingly easy. It is regularly a two-way for me, and I think this card's actually way better than I thought. So I'd be interested in your take.

Bynx 46:25

Yeah, I also came in a little low on juggernaut when I did kind of like my review of all the cards at the beginning of the season, I actually messed up and, and pulled some previous versions. So when I was actually judging juggernaut, I thought that it had to be seven different powers. And when that came out, I was like. That's kind of hard to do. Like, I don't know. Yeah, that was the data mine ion. Yeah. Know how, I don't know how easy that's gonna be. Six is a lot easier. Like you said, I do think you do have to build your deck towards it a bit because I was trying like a stech kind of style deck. It's just like this two drop that you can just play out and it'll get bigger later. It was actually was having quite a bit of trouble, uh, getting it online. I think it's'cause I was like using things like Killmonger that would like clear up like different rocks and like the hood that I was playing into the deck. And so there's some problems with that. So I do think that you have to be smart about your deck building. But um, yeah, the fact that it's a two eight, like two eight is just really, really good value for a two drop. It's like. Pretty outstanding value. And then I do think that it probably is gonna be something that people are gonna start looking at more and more to counter isca or, or some of these other end of turn or turn decks because of how the, the interaction works. So I think I was also probably around that two star level When I saw it at seven, I might've adjusted it up, but I would personally call this card a, a a three star card. I think that it's not something that if you don't have this in your collection, you're gonna be super upset about. I think that there's lots of different things that you can play instead of it and get a very comparable amount of value from. But, uh, I do think that it is a very interesting card. I think it's a good showcase of the objective mechanic. Uh, and once again, I do think it, this card in particular, I think might be the best iska counter in the game. That's not like a direct turn iska off, but like an actual way to like outsmart and outplay iska players is with a card like this.

Alex 48:12

So according to unap based statistics 53% win rate, which is gonna be the lowest that we've discussed thus far in a seven, uh, percent popularity, which is also the lowest. It's kind of funny'cause Iska had, what, 30? And then you had Salor, which had approximately, what was it, scrolling? 13, 13 and a half. Yeah. So, so almost like Iska and then half of that, then now half of that, so they're like on this very steady step. I like to, to

Bynx 48:38

be fair, you will always kind of get that with season pass cards though, right? Like cards that you can buy directly from the season pass are almost always gonna be pushed a little bit more than the series five that comes out at the same time. So there's probably some of that in there too.

Ranking the Season Cards

Alex 48:49

For sure. And I think that juggernauts not necessarily like a deck build consideration, I think Iska very clearly had a deck, a very strong deck that kinda just fell out of the zeitgeist that, immediately it benefited. And Juggernaut doesn't have that, like, it doesn't have like a, it almost makes me wonder, like I'm just throwing it out there. I'm just throwing out there. Again, Aurora, I know Aurora's sick, but does Aurora buff objective cards too, or is that just too much of a buff to Aurora? I don't know. But I guess as we move on to the next topic of discussion, Binks, I'll ask you to, uh, rank the three. Where would you rank Iska, juggernaut and n Subor? One to three ranked order ghost,

Bynx 49:24

uh, ISKA. Very large gap.

Alex 49:27

Yes. Agreed. Then

Bynx 49:28

en Sabin juggernaut, pretty close to each other.

Alex 49:31

I would say massive gap, like from here to the sun Isca. Right. And then I would say I would take juggernaut over insur right now. Like I'm not, and I'm not slating insur, I just think juggernaut in my test. I'm like, I think I like this cart better. I don't, maybe that I actually had this thought too. I wonder, maybe it's just because I'm playing Cosmos so much right now. Does this have to be an honor reveal? Does the apocalypse celestial's chosen effect have to be on reveal? Can it just be a thing that just happens? Like, because I've seen, I've done it myself twice and I've seen people do it where like the on reveal side of this actually is used like, and it, it's, it's on Cosmo or something negative happens.'cause if it's on Reveal, I had that thought. I don't know if that's a buffer or a nerve.'cause technically you could put Wong under it or something. But

Bynx 50:20

yeah,

Alex 50:21

we don't really consider the on reveal aspect of this card, whether it's good or bad or just neutral.

Bynx 50:25

I don't think you can just remove the on reveal, right? Because like on reveal is, it happens when it flips and like you couldn't just have like a trigger, I guess you could say, like when this transforms, but then like if you're putting that on the card, then it's already transformed. So I feel like there's actually like some weird things where it kind of has to be an on reveal. So someone did uh uh, make the suggestion that this is a end of game that happens where you flip it immediately to a four eight and then it says end of game. Do this, which I thought would actually be pretty good. It would get around Cosmo would, would again be another, another better way to, to go around isca and, and it stops some of, some of that from happening. But maybe that makes it worse in some, some cases too, right? Because maybe you wanna flip it like on turn five or something like that. Uh, there's, I'm sure there's certain game plans and stuff that would do that. So I do think it would take some adjustment. I do think it kind of has to be an on reveal with exactly how it functions right now, but I do think that there's probably some room to adjust it to either like an end of turn or end, like this being end of turn actually seems kind of sick, right? Like where if, if like you get it on four, then it just happens multiple times. Like that could be really good. It probably makes the card too strong. I'm not a game designer, I don't know. But, uh, yeah, there, the on reveal aspect of it is, uh, is something that can hold it back to an extent and I don't think it, I think it rarely makes it stronger, uh, the fact that it's there.'cause like you said, it's, it's probably pretty rare that you're doubling it.

Gambit Objective Preview

Alex 51:48

Yeah. Okay. So both Binks and I high on Iska and then, uh, Binks and Salvador myself at number two. I'm putting Juggernaut and those two, but they're much closer. But there is a definite clear winner amongst the three. And that my friend is gonna take us to the preview of gambit, the horseman of Death. The three three that reads objective play five total cost of created cards. And that will create, that'll not create, but the objective will then resolve, randomly destroy up to four total cost of enemy cards. That might be the worst I've ever read card text, but also it doesn't read particularly well. I gotta be honest with you. It's

Bynx 52:30

a little, it's a little wordy. Yeah.

Mysterio Breaks Gambit

Alex 52:32

Yeah, it's a little wordy, A little weird. But, uh, anyways, gambit. I am like, I don't like coming into the podcast and being like, I don't know, but this is the one this month where I'm least sure about how I wanna rank it. My instincts tell me this is a four star card. That's my instincts telling me. But then it's created cards. How good are gonna be, like how good can I make created card stacks? And it's like, well we got Victoria Ann. Like there's, there's good decks there, right? Man, I'm being honest with you. And I say that like I am still up in the air in how I wanna rank this, so I'll pass it off to you. But I do think that gambit is timely considering what this, the end of the season might look like with some of the new releases coming out. Might be lots of rocks to pump. So like, I don't know, man, I'd be very interested in your thoughts.'cause I'm still, as I sit here speaking, unsure of how I wanna rank this card.

Bynx 53:23

Yeah, when I, when I initially looked at it again, I, it was the same thing that happened with Juggernaut.'cause the data mind version had six total costs to create cards. So I was a little bit off with my, uh, original looking at this. But like, it seems like it's pretty hard to get done, right? It's kind of hard to play that many created cards'cause you have to play the cards that create them and then actually push them out. And then there's also things to look at with like, oh, destroying up to four total cost of enemy cards. I feel like there's gonna be so many times where that's gonna happen. You're gonna clear out like two power, right? And you're, it's gonna feel terrible until someone pointing out that card that makes this card one of the most terrifying cards I've ever seen in my life. And that is Mysterio. Because Mysterio, when you play, it plays three different created cards that all are two cost. Because the cards that get created by Mysterio are all created cards when they come onto the field. So if you play Mysterio and then you play this. Objective complete and you can literally just gobble up basically everything they did the first three turns. So that is what terrifies me about this card. Maybe that interaction is not something that's gonna go in that route, but before I thought about Mysterio and how it works with this card, I was like, it's probably pretty good. I'd probably put it at like three stars if it works well with Mysterio. Like basically now if you can play Mysterio on two, you can either play Sasquatch or Mockingbird or this card to follow it up. All of which like directly on curve and all of which punishing your opponent in a different way. And to me that's freaking terrifying. Mysterio works so good with every objective card in the craziest way ever. And that's what really scares me about these, uh, these new objective cards coming out, is how that interaction is gonna work.

Alex 55:08

So I had not considered Mysterio. I thought that you were gonna bring up Valentina. Who theoretically I believe this card will check the total capital C cost.

Bynx 55:19

Mm-hmm.

Alex 55:19

Which means the OG cost of the card played. So you play Valentina and then you play the now discounted six drop. But this will see it as a, as a six. I thought you were gonna say Valentina. And I'm like, hell yeah bro. Mysterio game place. Mysterio Sasquatch. Is Mysterio Sasquatch coming back? Oh no. I mean, oh no, it's, the card's been irrelevant for a bit. That was actually, remember when it used to be a two five Myster used to be a two five. They it Yeah. Man. Way. It was one of those surprises way back, yeah, way back when. It's like, we're like, we're old guys talking like, oh, do you remember two guys sitting around

Bynx 55:50

talking, naming old football players type?

Alex 55:53

Yeah. I know. Do you remember when the, the, the refrigerator ran for 45 yards against the bears, all that? Yeah. I, I'm just gonna keep bringing up the bears. What? I'm talking to you. I can't help myself.

Bynx 56:04

Uh, but yeah, man, like, like I said, man, I, I was pretty medium on this card and I, I even thought about the Valentino thing and I, I do think it will work because it does use the capital C costs.'cause that's usually how they, uh, differentiate them unless they just wrote it wrong, which has happened multiple times, unfortunately. But, uh, yeah, this, the interaction with Mysterio is absolutely terrifying for me. Mysterio completes this objective, and then I think there's two other objective cards that are coming out that it completes on its own. And if that interaction works as I'm expecting it to, because those, they do count as creative cards when they're put out there, like they will get buffed by Valentina until they, they flip back. It's very scary. It's very, very scary. Uh, if, if that ends up happening and I, I really think that it's going to cause problems. So maybe that's something that they'll adjust or maybe that's something that they'll look at, or maybe the way that Mysterio cards are played will be changed to be a little bit different so it doesn't complete all the objectives. But yeah, Mysterio scares the, like, you can basically run Mysterio this card and Valentino, like you said, you just have two really clean, easy ways to, to get this car activated. And you don't really have to have a big deck building requirement. And that's what's scary to me because this like, destroying up to four random cards when you could do it on turn three is horrifying. Like if it, if it's the very end of the game that it's kinda just random and it's not really that impactful. But like if you play like, one drop, two drop, uh, that are kind of like, build around or like, or like ones that are meant to grow or like extend your game plan and then your opponent just plays gamut and just gobbles up everything he did, like. That could feel really toxic. So that's what I'm worried about with this card. It's like the earlier you play this card, I feel like the more dangerous it is to be a real nasty meta card. Whereas if it's a card that pretty much only gets the objective cleared on like turn six, I don't think, for me, I don't think it's that scary. Mm-hmm.

Sandstorm and Rock Decks

Alex 57:48

So like the fact that it's random, it could cook itself too, right? Like if you have a three and a two on the field to play, it can't destroy both.'cause that's five total costs. It's gonna random roll between three and the two. So yeah, I don't know. A very interesting card. And I think, as I said, and kind of in the intro there, going into it, this is gonna be very interesting to see how it's the release valve going into the, I mean we may as well talk about it now too, but the next card to talk about, it's gonna be the start of the. Rock synergies, right? So coming out in the, uh, the season, not the season, the limited time game is gonna be sandstorm. Now, I don't think sandstorms are gonna be relevant on its own this first week because you do have other cards coming out. I don't know how to say the name. OSUs. Is it EDUs? How would you say

Bynx 58:31

Ozzy? Manus.

Alex 58:32

Ozzy. Manus.

Bynx 58:33

That's what I've been saying. I might not even close.

Alex 58:35

Yeah. So let's take Sandstorm, let's discuss Sandstorm in conjunction with what it's eventually gonna be.'cause as a standalone, it's like whatever still has maybe some, uh, some applicable uses. But sandstorm as a two cost, uh, skill. The art here doesn't necessarily demonstrate as a skill. It's on reveal. Add two rocks to your hand. Give them plus one power for each of your front row characters. Potential insur synergy here, you're gonna have people in the front row. These rocks are gonna be chunky. BX what do you think?

Bynx 59:06

Dude, you wanna hear my crazy hot take?'cause you mentioned that you don't think sandstorms gonna be that good. I think Sandstorms gonna see a lot of play. I actually don't think Ozzy Manus is gonna be played in those rock style decks. I think they're gonna opt to play a card like Patriot because five is just really expensive, in my opinion. I could be completely wrong about this.'cause giving plus three is like pretty big. It's very rare that they'll allow a card to give plus three to something. Like that's always kind of been something that causes problems. But when I look at this card, I think that this is like the best Victoria hand card they've released in a real long time.'cause if you're playing this card on turn four, turn five, and, and it's also like how you have to play this card, right? Because this card is so much better when you play it on turn four or turn five. Like you can't really curve into this card. Like you might be able to just want one, one rocks and like maybe you have to play it out. I think that the power level of this card in a deck like Vic Hand is how. How easily you can hold this card until turn four and turn five. But if you're playing Ozzy, Ozzy, Manus, you kind of have to play'em on five, right? Because you then you wanna burst out your cards, which means you have to play this on four earlier, which means maybe you don't or aren't able to fill that out as much. But to me this card is horrifying. This is like, basically Cape Bishop that doesn't take up a board space and very often is just gonna be stronger as far as the cards that you get out. And, uh, I think that, uh, the way that the rock stack is gonna be isn't gonna be relying on on Ozzy Manus. I think it's gonna be like a Victoria hand patriot style deck.'cause both those cards can also work with moonstone, which is really, really powerful. Just getting some random rocks like this moleman hood which gets buffed, the demon gets buffed by both Patriot and Vic hand. Now you have all these different ways to get these one cost value cards. You build up your hand, you kind of get out your buffers onto the field, and then you burst out and you play like five one drops. They're all like one twelves. And then how the heck do you freaking beat that? So I am actually, I, I think I'm very contrarian on this and I think that I could very well be wrong, but I'm of the opinion that Ozzy Manis is actually gonna be too expensive to see play with how a lot of these cards like work and the order that they wanna be played. But I think that sandstorm is so much more powerful than people are giving a credit for.'cause like, if you have a full front row, you get, it's a two cost, get two demons, right? Like you're getting a one six vanilla card. Like a card that's a two cost get two demons would be insane. Right. And that's what the card does almost always on turn five. So I'm really, really excited for Sandstorm. I had it ranked under Ramat and Iska as my third strongest card coming out the whole month. And I think that, I think that people are not ready for how powerful this card is gonna be and how it's gonna supercharge Vic hand.

Alex 1:01:46

So I actually I ranked it 3.5 and um, I agree that it's good. And now I had not considered it being completely separate from, uh. Ozzy Manus. That's what I'm going with. Is that right or wrong?

Bynx 1:02:01

I have no idea, man. Asking me to how to pronounce things is actually very funny.'cause I'm very well known as someone who says things wrong on purpose and then also is just terrible at pronouncing things.

Alex 1:02:11

Let's just say Ozzy.

Bynx 1:02:12

Ozzy

Alex 1:02:13

give him, oh boy. Ozzy. Ozzy, okay. He's Ozzy, our boy. Ozzy. So I think that it's likely they see played together at least early on. Plus three power's always been so good in Marvel Snap. However, you're right though, like if you talk about Patriot Patriot's, probably enough. If you talk about like a Victoria Ham, Patriot Moonstone deck, like, and then like, okay, you scroll girl. Then like, like, you're right. Like the front row fills. These cards are massive. They're getting juiced outta the wazoo. Yeah. Like I can absolutely scary. See that working? It is a terrifying. I'm just thinking could also be good in zoo, right? Mm-hmm.

Bynx 1:02:47

Because

Alex 1:02:48

they're gonna be one drops. You got the Larvas, you got the Zas. They're gonna be green power for, uh, for Gilgamesh to slam. You can squeeze a two drop into that mix, right? Um, yeah. It's like, okay, I'm feeling it and I believe this comes out on, uh, with Team Clash, which is gonna be cool. Very interesting. What, uh, yeah, if, if my notes are correct, it's team Clash. Okay. I think that you, I, I don't think I'm gonna move off of 3.5 stars. I think 3.5 stars is still a solid rating for a skill that's doing a thing that should be kind of collaborating with another card. For the record, Ozzy, I had given four and I felt like those two were definitely gonna be played together. But you're right, the sequencing of it, right, the sequencing of it is something we're thinking about. What is your star rating on, uh, on Sand Star?

Bynx 1:03:32

Four and a half. I think this card is four

Alex 1:03:33

and

Killmonger Protection Tech

Bynx 1:03:34

a half. I think this card is terrifying. The, and I was like, one aspect of it is like, yeah, but with Kate Bishop, you get the two three with it, but like. Sometimes you don't want that taking up space on your board in like a weird way and you want more flexibility to be able to burst. But yeah, man, I just look at this card as like if there was a two cost skill that just said, add two demons to your hand, everyone would lose their mind and say, why the hell would anyone ever make that? And in many ways, that's what this card is Now. Uh, it's gonna depend on if the timing of. Having to play it on turn four or five is important. I think that's a really important thing that some people have don't look at as much when, when like assessing Marvel Snap cards, like, um, like a card like Sage for instance, right? Like when you play Sage and it's, it's massive. It's really good. You can't curve out sage almost ever. No, you can't just play Sage on three. It's a card that you have to not play proactively. So I do, I do think that there's a buff to card so you can play proactively and this card, you can't really just play early. It's just a setup card most of the time.'Cause you're just not gonna get nearly as much value out of it. But if you can construct a deck that's very happy and very Okay. Like, and that's why I'm, that's why I'm thinking like Patriot because you can play like Patriot that card on, on five, you know, you can play Vic Hand Hood this card on five and then like, yeah. I just think like the way that you're gonna be able to burst out your hands, I think that. The other thing that scares me with like the rock style decks as to where they might not be as good is because Killmonger is still a card in the game that you are allowed to play and just will absolutely destroy you. And that's kind of why I'm thinking like it might be better to burst all of these cards out at the very end of the game as opposed to like being a little bit more proactive with them to dodge any level of counter play and be really unpredictable on that final turn.

Alex 1:05:15

And which is probably why you're gonna see a lot of Kyra and a lot of armor. And I almost wonder, I almost wonder if Kyra and Armor are going to, uh, see changes. I wonder if Kyra, could it afford to go to a 3.5? I don't think they buff. I think they let people experiment with it. I saw a suggestion. Oh, I'm trying to think of where it was. This is not my suggestion. Someone else said this and I was like, that's genius. I love it. They suggested armor as a one, two. Because if you think about it, armor as a one, two, goes right into the zoo. Decks. It's meant to protect, for the most part. Also a nice release valve for Shanxi and some other destroyed mechanics. Not a bad idea. I just wonder.'cause like kyra's a nice catch off of the rocks, but could armor see some play? Especially in, in consideration that like, you're gonna want to protect those things if you're committing to it. I don't know if you just retreat on Killmonger games anyways, but with Gambit coming out, who's also gonna destroy things? Does armor have to be more viable than it is right now?

Bynx 1:06:14

That's really interesting. I actually don't mind the idea of One Two Armor. It really sees almost no play right now. Right? It is one of the few cards. I did do a thing on Binks Pants recently, which is cards that have somehow never been changed, and Armored Armor is one of those cards. It's on a list. This card has never changed. It has always been the exact same, and I think that that's so interesting that there's still cards that are like that. But you know, this card I feel like has never been played a lot, but it's probably in like the last year, been played significantly less than it ever has, especially with Shang Q not being as popular. I personally wouldn't mind Armor going to one, two or maybe two four. Like, this does seem like it's the problem with it going to one two is maybe that it's, it might become too easy of a tech and it might be really. Disruptive to destroy ever being a decent archetype ever again. If like this is like just a cheap card that you can throw in to just smash, the 15% of players will never stop playing destroy and will play destroy every season no matter what you do. So maybe that, that's kind of the fear is that, um, when, when the card becomes that cheap and that easy to play into your deck and just squeeze in as a one, two, that it kind of might destroy that archetype that so many players love. So I'd be, I'd be interested in seeing that. I also, in my opinion, I don't think armor's a very good counter to Killmonger because only per defends one lane. Like I, I've never felt like armor really improves my decks that rely on one cost like Kira does.'cause Kira is just a catchall and kind of hits everything. Whereas like Armor, it's like, okay, well I'm gonna play the armor in this lane and then. Well, I guess I have to play all my one drops in that lane and then like o okay, well maybe I'll play some cards outside of, I'll play some one drops there, and then you still get killed longer and then you're just like, why the hell am I running armor in my deck? So it's, it's, it's interesting. I think that RA will probably see play. It just depends on how strong the decks are because the decks aren't that strong. People just won't care about it and they'll just beat it through other means and not counter it. But if k monger does see a big rise, then I think Kyra will be a, a much better solution to try and fight back against that, which then lowers the power level of those decks because Kyra is a three four that you have to play out and spend three energy on to put onto your board. So it's all gonna be kind of like a, the levers moving up and down back and forth. Uh, but it'd be really, really interesting to, uh, thing to see, uh, with that. And I actually don't mind that that changed armor. I, I think they'd have to be smart about it. But I do think that's a cool suggestion too.

Mobius Max Energy Rant

Alex 1:08:32

I love what you've said and you know what? Before. Before we go any further, I want you to know that I pulled a discussion from the Snapchat mailbag that I was like, banks is the only one that can answer this question. Banks is the only one that can, we can have this conversation with. Now, I know you're smiling, but that smile is gonna turn upside down because we need to talk. Look at that. I knew it. I knew it. I knew immediately your demeanor was gonna change. As soon as I brought this card on the screen, Mobius and Mobius, now I Vix is like, why are you doing this? Like, we had such a good night together. Alex, why are you doing this? But don't worry, it's Mobius is a and and Mobius is only a part of the equation here because call me caution for the Snapchat mailbag said, do we ever need to see a card like Triple M for max energy? Your opponent cannot increase their max energy and yours cannot be lowered. Kind of a thing for star Lord purposes. So Bink, I'll throw it your way. Do we need a Mobius and Mobius? For additional max energy?

Bynx 1:09:37

Absolutely not. I, for me, and I, I did a whole thing again. I'm, I'm big span talking about my least favorite card designs, uh, in the whole game. And it's, this card and super scroll are really the two cards that I just, I hate with such a burning passion because like, I don't know. It's, it's something about, I feel, and I could be completely wrong, I'm not a game designer, right? And maybe like there is really good positive things that Kevin cards like this in the game to have those safety valves. But to me, I don't think the solution to a deck being too strong is to just make a card you can put into your deck that auto beats it. I think that's, in my opinion, I find that to be bad design for a couple of reasons. One. I just think it's a little lazy, just like overall, I just think it's a little lazy as like, okay, well now here's this card that if you can put into your deck and just always beat that deck. I don't really like super scrolls like that too, man. When like tribunals all over the place and people start just throwing super scroll on your deck and then you're playing like a spectrum deck and they just play it against you. You're like, okay, why did I even, why did I even sit down and play this three minute game if you were gonna draw that card and just play, Hey, this card does everything that your entire deck does. Except for, only for me, except for every other game when it's just a four two that sticks in my hand and I never play. But, um, I just really, I fundamentally dislike this style design of just having a kind of catch all your cool thing that your deck is doing. It just doesn't get to do because I have this tech card I really, really dislike it. I personally think that things should be balanced and adjusted to not need cards like that. I think that that leads to things being, uh, a lot more fun. And what I always say about mobi in particular is that my. Fun that I have in the game is inversely proportional to how much this card gets played. Well this card is getting played all the time. I feel like it usually points to really degenerate metas where decks can just run cards like Mobius or run cards like super scroll where their deck is strong enough as is that they can just throw this extra card that they don't even play. Sometimes that just wins them certain matchups and they could just kind of throw it out. I think that that leads to the least fun betters and the least fun that I personally have with Snap. I like the idea and I think that it's something that people are being reactionary towards Star Lord in my opinion. They should just Nerf and adjust star Lord to get him back in level where other decks can compete with him in a, uh, healthier way as opposed to just throwing out a catchall tech card that will just win you that matchup and kind of do nothing in other matchups.

Alex 1:11:58

Alright, we got the full Binks Mobius and Mobius rant here on the Marvel Snapchat and that is where we gotta end it. We can't ask for, that's the sendoff we needed guys. And down to the description and in the pin, comment down below and have the social links for banks follow him on Twitch. Absolutely phenomenal streamer. You must know him on YouTube, but use the subscribe button down below to make sure you are subscribed to B links to all his content. Bink band is awesome. His, uh, his deck design is phenomenal and banks, once again, just wanna say thank you so much for, uh, for joining us here on the Snapchat. I'm sure we'll have you on again,

Bynx 1:12:33

dude, I'm always here, man. It's always a pleasure being here. It's one of my highlights of the week whenever we get to sit down and, and have a great chat like this. So I appreciate you buddy. And uh, yeah man, I'll be back.

Alex 1:12:45

Thank you so much for listening, everyone. We appreciate each and everyone. Thank you for supporting Marvel Snap and of course for supporting the content creators that cover it. Have yourselves a wonderful day and we'll see you on that next one.