This week, I'm unveiling the unthinkable: Prepare yourself for a gripping journey into the harrowing world of human trafficking. In this shocking episode, I delve deep into the heart-wrenching story of Lurata Lyon, a survivor who defied the odds stacked against her. From the chilling moments of her abduction to the unimaginable horrors she endured, Lurata's story will leave you on the edge of your seat. I uncover the staggering truth behind the global epidemic of human trafficking. From heart-stopping moments of survival to the agonising choices forced upon her, every twist and turn will leave you speechless. Lurata courageously shares her experiences of captivity, torture, and ultimate escape.

TIMESTAMPS
0:00 - Intro
1:08 - Introducing Lurata Lyon
6:02 - How many people are Trafficked each year?
8:29 - Where does the story begin?
11:59 - The War - Surviving Execution
27:12 - Temporarily Rescued by Peter and Brian
31:37 - Getting Kidnapped for Trafficking
41:54 - What does grooming entail?
44:57 - Where were you during grooming?
46:53 - Were you always supervised? What was your mental state like?
48:31 - The Day Before Getting Shipped Off
51:59 - The Choice of 2 Evils - Give Yourself to a Monster or Be Shipped to Probably Worse?
53:39 - The Next 24 Hours
01:08:33 - Reuniting with the Parents
01:10:28 - Serbian Military Taking Her and Torturing Her
01:18:39 - "I became their toy"
01:22:44 - How did you get out of captivity?
01:31:15 - Getting Smuggled into the UK
01:34:17 - How much did your dad pay for your release?
01:34:53 - Reconneting and Reuniting with the parents
01:36:00 - Even with British Citizenship, did you not fear going back?
01:37:19 - Do you still go back now?
01:38:48 - When were you able to look at a man again without fear and hate?
01:45:35 - Talk Perspective
01:52:33 - Conclusion

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Who Is Matt Haycox? - Click for BADASS Trailer

As an entrepreneur, investor, funding expert and mentor who has been building and growing businesses for both myself and my clients for more than 20 years, my fundamental principles are suitable for all industries and businesses of all stages and size.

I’m constantly involved in funding and advising multiple business ventures and successful entrepreneurs.

My goal is to help YOU achieve YOUR financial success! I know how to spot and nurture great business opportunities and as someone who has ‘been there and got the t-shirt’ many times, overall strategies and advice are honest, tangible and grounded in reality.

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Tell us what you like or dislike about this episode!! Be honest, we don't bite!

Speaker 1: 0:00

Flip her on her back. I want to watch this rape.

Speaker 2: 0:03

Larrata Lyon. Welcome to the show.

Speaker 1: 0:05

Thank you, Matt. I was really excited to meet you as well.

Speaker 2: 0:07

I don't know where you want to start.

Speaker 1: 0:09

The war had started in the early 90s. The whole country was in lockdown. They put us in this crease of the mountain and got ready to execute us.

Speaker 2: 0:17

How does that come about?

Speaker 1: 0:18

The soldiers took us from our houses Did everybody survive.

Speaker 1: 0:21

Nobody got killed that night. Then, days after, I didn't know what was going to happen next. I got shoved into the van. They dragged me from the car into this building To have grown up men stripping me like that and pinning me down. I don't think I have ever felt the kind of adrenaline they brought girls unconscious in. I was made to just sit and watch these girls be raped and I couldn't do anything about it. Mate who just stood and watched this girl be raped and I couldn't do anything about it.

Speaker 2: 0:49

Hey, matt Haycock's here with a quick interruption just to say I hope you're liking the show, but please, please, like, subscribe or comment. That's how we can bring you better guests, that's how we can make the show better each week. So, please, please, that's all I ever ask of you. We never charge, we never ask anything else. Just please give us a few moments of your time. Guys, matt Haycox here and welcome to another episode of Stripping Off with Matt Haycox, where we metaphorically strip off our guests and get down to their story, their mindset and everything they can teach us about life, money, business, motivation.

Speaker 1: 1:30

And today I've got an unbelievable guest with a story, quite unlike anyone who we've ever had on the show before. I have with me Larrata Lyon. I said that good, I've been practicing it I get so nervous.

Speaker 2: 1:38

She is an author, an author of Unbroken. She's a motivational speaker, but I guess, most importantly, she is a survivor of human trafficking, and a survivor, I think, not just once, but twice, which we will dig into shortly. So, very much. It almost feels wrong to say that I was going to say very much looking forward to hearing your story. I am very much looking forward to hearing your story, but obviously it's a horrendous story with an inspiring and motivational end, I'm sure. So, lourata, welcome to the show.

Speaker 1: 2:08

Thank you, Matt. I was really excited to meet you as well.

Speaker 2: 2:11

Am I all you've expected?

Speaker 1: 2:13

You are better in person.

Speaker 2: 2:14

Thank you.

Speaker 1: 2:17

I don't think anybody should feel like they can't say they're looking forward to reading the story, because for me it means so much that anyone so far has taken that time to read the book, because what they find surprisingly is educational, which I'm not patronizing anyone, but just it's a lot of content about history that is not very old and people can still relate to countries that they go and visit still and you know they're like holiday sort of places and to to put that in perspective with what where we are now and then.

Speaker 1: 2:48

I think for people it's really nice to see how far maybe the country has come or what's happening now, but also they learn a lot of inspiration from it and I think they take it, they put themselves in the shoe and say, oh okay, I actually have it pretty good right now, so I better be grateful for what I have. And it's really nice to hear people say you've inspired me and you've just changed my mindset and you know I can do this or I can go through whatever I'm going through, so it's really brilliant feedback.

Speaker 2: 3:16

Well, I mean, I think when you, when you look at, you, know the experience you've suffered compared to and listen, I'm not trying to diminish anybody's problems but when you look at the, the problems that people think nowadays are problems, or the things that they're anxious of or scared of, which you know are are not, are nothing really, are nothing at all really in in anyone's walk of life. Never mind when you compare it to something like this. I think it. It takes a, it takes a very, let's say, awkward or stubborn person not to look at your story and take a massive wake-up call from that. If that's what you've been through and come through the other side and you can tell this tale and be this inspiring person and be happy and positive and upbeat, then they sure as shit can too. Thank you, matt too.

Speaker 1: 4:00

Thank you, matt. I just think even people in the office world, for example, in corporate world, when they have a time, like ladies that I have reached out to me to say you know, I was having some tough time at work, or just after COVID, or during COVID, people heard the story and they said, oh my God, you know, just made me think differently about what I was facing and he helped me overcome my obstacles that I was facing at work and things like this that are, you know, feedback like this that I'm really surprised to get, because I don't, I didn't expect it. All I wanted to do is write a book so I can raise awareness on human trafficking. That was my main focus.

Speaker 1: 4:38

Little did I know that I was reaching people that are facing, you know, battle with cancer and writing to me directly saying, oh my God, I can beat cancer. If you can beat that, I can beat cancer. I mean, how amazing is it to get a message like that? It's. I cry with every message I get. Excuse me, I've been doing too many interviews and I keep the tissues handy.

Speaker 2: 5:02

I do, I do because I know myself.

Speaker 1: 5:05

But yeah, thank you for having me on the show.

Speaker 2: 5:07

I'm really excited. Well, I now know as well that if any of my staff are telling me that they've got it too tough in the office, that they're under pressure, I'm going to give them your book and say shut the fuck up.

Speaker 1: 5:16

No, but it will inspire them and it will actually what it does. Is it sort of breaks this limitation in your, in your mindset, that what we because, look, everybody's story and experience is valuable, so what they're going through, it's amplified to only what they know. You can't expect them to be able to relate to my extensive of what I've been through and to say, oh well, mine is less than hers because they don't know any difference. So we have to respect that. We have to respect that people don't have to go through war to actually have struggles. They genuinely, we all are struggling one way or another. So it's just about being open to reading something that could potentially, you know, just unlock that block within your mindset and say, actually, I can do it too, this is okay. So that's all I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 6:06

Well, look, I'm very much looking forward to, I guess, going back in time, uh, and hearing the story. But just before we do, just to set a bit of context for numbers with people, uh and I don't want to say any numbers because I will completely get it wrong, but I once, I did actually once have, um, a guest on the show. I forget his name. I should have, I should have checked before we started. He was a who. He was one of the finances or producers behind. Is it the Sound of Freedom? It's called. Yes, if you told me his name, I'd remember.

Speaker 1: 6:31

I should know as well.

Speaker 2: 6:33

He's done a lot of podcasts. I think there's been something a bit untoward going on as well, actually, but we did a podcast together and he was talking to me about two things which I found utterly staggering. One was the frightening number of people that actually are human trafficked, which, if you'd have asked me how many people are human trafficked, I'd say 2,000 a year and I'd probably think I'm being top heavy, and it was literally millions or something, wasn't it?

Speaker 1: 7:00

150 million people, and this is statistics. Last year, just before I published the book, it was a cia agent that told me 100, 150 million.

Speaker 2: 7:10

What? Like people worldwide over time or per annum oh, yeah, yeah a year 150 150 million people.

Speaker 1: 7:18

That was when we were talking in 2000, 2000, because the book was published last year 2003, sorry. 2023, 2022, these statistics so madistic. I mean, it's just an unthinkable number.

Speaker 2: 7:32

And the second thing I found so staggering because I was thinking how does that happen to so many people? And he was telling me that the vast majority, or certainly a big number of these people are actually basically given off or sold off by the parents because they want money or because they want to get rid of the kid 100%, so I don't know whether it's the biggest majority on that, because I have so many different feedback from agents that I work with, but it's a huge number anyway.

Speaker 1: 8:00

It is when I lived in Asia, because I lived in Asia for five years in Singapore and I got involved with the charities and embassies to raise awareness on human trafficking. I have to say that majority of the children we dealt with, not directly but with through the safe houses and stuff, was kids that have been sold for marriage at a very young age or for sex so the family can support, uh, their their living.

Speaker 2: 8:28

it was sick well, let's, let's take it back to your story, um, and I guess you know to tell. Tell me, I don't know where you want to start, uh, but tell me, tell me how, how it began for you and how, how you fell into this world I'll take you on a nice journey and all the viewers. I mean this already has to be a display of positivity that you're absolutely you are smiling your way through the about to tell me, tell me this story.

Speaker 1: 8:52

So well, matt, I was a kid. I was always very happy and luckily I managed to regain that again at this point. But I was a happy kid wanting to help everyone, just wanting to make a difference in the neighborhood. I was the only child my parents couldn't have children. They really struggled and all the details are in the book. I won't spoil it too much. But why do I take you to my childhood? Because I want the viewers and the listeners to go back to, maybe around the age of 17. Were they at 17? What were they trying to do? Was it that they were doing their GCSEs, a-levels, or you're thinking about university, whatever?

Speaker 2: 9:33

I have a 17 year old daughter up in Leeds, so I can I can come completely parallel yeah, and also yourself, you know.

Speaker 1: 9:40

Remember that time when you were 17 or 18, for example, around your teen years, where you are thinking about dreaming of the future that you want, like my kids now. One wants to be a pilot, the other one wants to be God knows what I mean. They just have these massive dreams. I had dreams as well, but my dreams were more based around to what I witnessed, more based around to what I witnessed. And what I witnessed was that my parents were both in well. One was in education, the other one was a doctor. So my dad is a doctor and my mom a professor of languages.

Speaker 1: 10:21

I admired them both. They were both activists on human rights and they struggled to find jobs. It was so hard for them, and I just watched the way my dad helped everyone. He was doing his job, paid job by the government, as he does, you know, just a GP, but then anytime anybody needed him, as an emergency or there was like complications of any kind, he did it all as a charity. He helped everyone and he lost sleep sometimes just to help people, but his passion to being such a dedicated doctor, to saving lives, to want to help I mean, a man was born to make a difference in the world. He really was my real, true inspiration and a hero.

Speaker 1: 11:00

And I was like dad when he asked me one day. He said so, loretta, have you thought what you want to be in your life? And it was a cheeky question from him. It wasn't really in a positive way that he asked me, but I think he's he was rather trying to prepare me for the disappointment that I was never going to achieve my dreams, that if I wanted to be, I don don't know, a nurse or something. And I said to him look, dad, I want to be a doctor, just like you. And he was a bit shocked because he didn't expect it. And he said why? I said because you know, dad. I said you're also. You know, you're so good with people and you're helping people, so I too want to be in that position to help others.

Speaker 1: 11:48

He sat me down with this real kind of deep energy heavy. He said Loretta, I just want to say something. He said I know you want to be a doctor and I see now I understand you want to help people, he said, but as you can see, our country is already at war and the war had started in the early 90s and it was in Bosnia and it was a huge massacres going on. He said the war is really reaching us slowly, slowly. So he said it might mean that you never go to university. You might just lose those years just by in hiding. Or, worst case scenario, he said we might get executed. And I just remember looking at him thinking what like really, I mean I can see the worries coming, but I thought maybe my dad just doubts my knowledge. I'm becoming a doctor.

Speaker 2: 12:30

I still was so naive so to interrupt the story, and maybe a naive question from from my end. But if, if there was a real prospect of that coming, what? Why? Why do you not leave the country? Or is it just not a realistic proposition to be able to leave?

Speaker 1: 12:45

Matt, you wouldn't believe this, and I say it on my speeches. The whole country was on a lockdown. Nobody was allowed to leave or enter. The whole Serbia, the whole nation. We were like in a frying pan, so hence why the numbers of it's just what's happening now in in the news. I try not to get into the whole news and stuff what's going on now, but we see that the borders are shut and so on. So you get into a frying pan and it's nowhere to go. So you are literally fried to to to the bone, and uh, that's why nobody could leave, we couldn't't leave, and eventually, though, so so sorry, go back to your story.

Speaker 1: 13:27

I mean I'm just because there's going to be lots of questions, I'm sure, but just to, this is the longest I have taken to say about my passion to wanting to help people. He said, look, you might never become a doctor, but you'll find a way to help people if that's what you want. And he left me with that and that stayed on my mind and I thought, oh gosh, what am I ever, if I ever, make it alive out of this? What am I gonna do? What does my dad mean? And university was very important to me. And now I look back and with everything that I'm doing, my dad was right my, my doing, my, my calling was to help people and that's what I'm doing now. So he was completely right in preparing me that I was never to go to university back home.

Speaker 1: 14:16

But yeah, then, soon after that, the war really hit us badly. Our town got singled out for, I say, ethnic cleansing, but it was really a religious kind of focus, because the majority of the people, if not all, in that town were Muslims and the next town was mixed. So the soldiers took us from our houses and it was really quite a terrifying night. And the readers will find the book quite interesting because it's very detailed of what happened.

Speaker 2: 14:43

So they put us in this crease of the mountain and got ready to execute us, to do the biggest massacre that's ever been and when you say us, your family, the whole town and and just to pause and just, I guess, take um, just just to understand that a bit more, because I mean, I guess it's a kind of thing you sometimes see in the movies, where you know, I don't a person's been taken off to be executed or a village is about to be hanged in front of everyone else.

Speaker 2: 15:11

I mean, how does that come about? You're at home, the doors get kicked in, the army, or whoever it is, are rounding people up and they load you into a car and take you to an execution place and you're stood there with your family.

Speaker 1: 15:24

Yeah, so they come into the garden. We just heard a big knock at the door and it wasn't just us, it was the entire army going to every single door. Yeah, they already started at the top of the because the village goes sort of into the crease of the. We are surrounded by mountains, so the village started in the field and then it sort of and towards the, the actual crease of the mountain. So they started in the fields and then it sort of ends towards the actual crease of the mountain. So they started from the top and they were getting people to move.

Speaker 1: 15:50

We were the last ones because we were like on the outskirts and we joined the crowd. So when we walked out of our house onto the road, my dad was very keen to reach to my uncle's house to see if he can reach his brother, because he wanted to be together, and so we sort of all shuffled in. It was very crowded, the roads were crowded and the small roads were super crowded, with women, children screaming, babies, elderly limping. It was horrific. We all were marching to our death.

Speaker 2: 16:24

It was no. The entire was no.

Speaker 1: 16:25

The entire village, the entire village like every single person, and the army is just at the back like pushing us along and asking us to shush. And then eventually we managed to read my uncle's was. My uncle was waiting for my dad, so he was quite um near us and we got together with him, his family, his kid, his wife, and we all just marched into the crease of the mountains and then once it was like a long walk, what seems very short place, like a distant wise. It's not that that big, but because everyone was shuffling it was a huge crowd. It's like imagine a football stadium being released and then it's all into the small rows. They're all like um you know, hurdles of sheeps just being taken into their death and how were you feeling at that point?

Speaker 2: 17:17

what's going through your mind? I mean, I presume you all think the end is. The end is here now.

Speaker 1: 17:23

I was still young and naive. I was scared, but I wasn't analyzing too much. It's just the echo. It was daunting to have this echo in the air, this sort of this kind of noise and this weird. I don't know how to explain that. It's very hard to describe it with words and what you feel. It's just very it's like a's, it's end of days kind of thing. You, you, just you are scared, obviously.

Speaker 1: 17:51

And um, my dad was really concerned because he knew we were going to die. And once we reached the crease of the mountain, everybody was, you know, really scared some crying, praying, it was just all sorts happening, kids screaming. And my uncle whispered to my dad something and my dad's like don't do that, just stay. What he was saying is brother, I'm going to go and negotiate with the army because, come on, I've got so much money, surely I can save the town. I don't know what prompted my uncle to do what he did. I mean, he was the wealthiest man in Balkan. He's very well known to this day. Everybody back home knows what he did for that village or that town. So he really is a real hero and we still get thanked for what he did that night Are you going to tell us?

Speaker 1: 18:42

Yeah. So what he did was he went and spoke to the army and he said look, I mean I'm not even going to describe him, but in the book I go all details. He goes you're going to be hunted down. I've got so much wealth. If you do this massacre, you'll be hunted down. They will not stop the UN, will not stop the United Nations or Hague. So please, listen to me, we can do a deal. Save the town. They haven't done anything wrong enough with massacres. You've done so much in bosnia. Please, just, we beg you.

Speaker 1: 19:12

And the soldiers like, oh, stop it, old man. And so they push him around and he's like listen, I've got so much wealth. If I give you all my wealth, you can even escape yourself and you don't have to do this. And so the soldiers thought that my uncle was bluffing. It wasn't bluffing, he was completely serious. And they said, okay, then come on, show us. And my mom was like, oh, I'll come with you and help. And I was like mom, I didn't want her to leave me. And my dad is like why is she always getting involved? Oh, it's so sweet. And she went with my uncle and I really thought that was the end of our separation and I started crying and holding my uncle's son near me and they'd been gone for a long time. We really thought that maybe they executed them or what. We didn't know what was happening.

Speaker 2: 20:00

Hours.

Speaker 1: 20:01

Hours. Because what happened, matt, on those those days? My uncle didn't trust the banks. They were corrupt. So all the gold he had cash he had because he was a big farmer farmer like at a very sort of high tech kind of level for that time. He had huge farms and loads of help and he traded all sorts of different animals anyway, and and in the ground in his garden, which was covered usually with grass and just normal stuff, you'd never think anything of it.

Speaker 1: 20:34

When we eventually got saved and we got back to see where my uncle was and my mom because the soldiers backed away, we found them. They had dug out so many holes in the garden and inside his house and all these different secret places. We were shocked. We didn't know. It looked like a open graveyard. It was so many holes so they had to dig to to get this gold out, this cash out that my uncle had buried. And we found them, my mom and him sitting there literally on the steps and just crying because they thought, ok, the wealth has gone, we've been left to see the biggest massacres I've ever done to witness it and because nobody was coming for them. But when they heard the footsteps and we walked into the garden where my uncle and my mom was. I never forget the joy that we felt the relief. But I was just scared because I saw so many holes. I didn't know what had happened and they ran to us and we had a reunite. You know, we reunited after a few hours of being separated and my dad, I remember asking my uncle he's like what happened here.

Speaker 1: 21:41

He said oh, brother, I had so much wealth, it was all hidden. He said oh, brother, you've lost everything. And he gave. He was so cheeky, he looked like John Wayne, so everybody can that knows John Wayne as an actor. He looked like him, he spoke like him, he just like really spitting image of John Wayne and he he just like brother, listen, do you really think I gave them everything? I mean, he had kept some behind and it was just that relief of not having been massacred was a huge relief for us.

Speaker 2: 22:14

And did everybody survive? That Did nobody get killed.

Speaker 1: 22:17

Nobody got killed that night. So the whole town was Muslim-oriented, they were all Muslims. So we got saved that night. Orient, they were all muslims, so we got saved that night. And um, and then days after things really were getting really bad and my dad came from from the main sort of center of town and he, in panic, is like, oh my god, she needs to go. Come on, pack. I'm like what's going on, dad? You know? It's like what do you mean? Pack me. It's like, yeah, you've got to leave, you've got to cross the borders. Because we were on the border with kosovo and he said you need to cross the border from serbia to kosovo and seek for shelter, like red cross or whichever charity that is set up there, because by that point united nations had entered Kosovo for peacekeeping and it was all the UN troops from all sorts of countries, british, you name it, everyone Americans, french, italians, like all the nationalities, really, that they're combined on the UN kind of umbrella.

Speaker 1: 23:21

And yeah, long story short, I didn't want to go back and forth with my dad. I just said, okay, dad, I'll listen to you. So I said goodbye to them because I didn't know what was going to happen next and I was made to trek through the mountain on my own, not knowing which way am I going I mean scared of, because we we have, you know, wild dogs and anyway I managed to get to the other side eventually, a little bit, you know, cut and and bruised and, because I didn't know where I was going got lost. But when I reached the other side, I immediately, from the mountain, as you walk down this little field, a slope, I went into this road and luckily there was a bus coming. And now it was really helpful because I speak Serbian fluently, because I was born and raised in Serbia. But I also speak Albanian fluently because the school I went to, we spoke both languages and all the people in the town I was raised in are Albanian speaking Muslims. So when I reached the other side, it was fairly straightforward. I spoke with a dialect so they couldn't tell that I was from this side because we have different dialects, spoke in Serbian, sorry in Albanian, and I said I just need to get to the capital of Kosovo. They said we're not going there, it's far away, but we can take you to the next best thing and then from from there you can take another bus. So the driver was friendly and I sat there and I just kept myself to myself, completely petrified because I had just left my parents. And then I reached Kosovo and I reached sorry, I reached Pristina, the capital of Kosovo, after changing the bus and I was really thirsty.

Speaker 1: 25:08

It was nighttime, it was reaching six, seven o'clock at night and the night had fallen, completely confused where I was going, I saw some lights in the bar, nobody on the streets, which was like a ghost town, quite scary, and I decided to go into this bar and when I walked in, I opened the door and I just I have this vivid picture in my head still. I opened the door and every single person in that room was with uniforms, different uniforms, with different helmets, different colors, and I was almost shocked and scared at the same time. But I really needed water and I thought this doesn't look like uniform back home. So I'm going to go through it, went through it, asked the barman for water. He said what are you doing here? What are you doing? I said I just need some water. So he gave me some water, tap water and I went outside and I didn't know where to go. So I collapsed just outside of the bar, outside the door, cold and just sort of scrunched up, and I started crying, just feeling sorry for myself because I thought what I failed like how am I going to find the Red Cross or any shelter?

Speaker 1: 26:21

Luckily, two American police officers that were UN police officers at that time, peter and Brian, which are both on my book that I dedicated this book to them for their kindness and care they noticed that I was young and I shouldn't have been out because it was after police hours. So they came out with a translator. I couldn't speak a word in English and they said ask her, what's she doing here? So back and forth, I said I'm from Serbia and they said you can't even be here, whatever you know. They were there. They were puzzled that I was even there because we were not supposed to cross borders. I said I just need to go to the red cross. They said we can't take her to the red cross, we need to take her somewhere safe and then we will talk tomorrow about where we go next with her why can't they take you to the red cross?

Speaker 1: 27:17

unfortunately, what was about to happen with me next is that the red cross, the people, not the actual red cross itself. I can't fault it because I don't know them very well. I think they do well good stuff, but during the war, when they set up a camp somewhere, they have local people running it and the local people were corrupt and the UN has noticed that something's really not right about what's going on. But they can't always interfere because they have to keep, they have to stick to what they meant to do and they knew that. If they took me there because I've crossed borders and I'm serbian, I don't fit the profile of someone that should be given shelter in kosovo, considering I was from serbia and they were involved some of the people in the actual that were running the Serbia and they were involved some of the people in the actual that were running the Red Cross. They were involved in human trafficking and so they didn't want to take me there. So they took me to their apartment with my permission.

Speaker 1: 28:17

I said, okay, well, I needed shelter. So we became best friends. So I was with them for quite some time and we became best of friends. I had the most. Um, those memories I sometimes really long for that time, bizarrely. I just want to go back, have them there in their apartment together again. I miss them.

Speaker 1: 28:46

Sorry, you might be wondering how could somebody miss somebody that's not related to you, nothing to do with your background? But I miss anyone that's shown me kindness and care, and they were so respectful.

Speaker 2: 29:10

They were so respectful how long did you stay with them?

Speaker 1: 29:17

oh gosh, the timing is just all over the place with me, but I was with them for more than a month. I was for quite some time with them and they decided to keep me there until things calmed down in Serbia because they didn't want to risk putting me somewhere and they really enjoyed having me around. Peter had children in Florida. He was really missing his kids, brian. He didn't have children but he just grew really fond of me and we were very close in a sense that we became family for them. I think they were doing to them. They were risking their safety, obviously, for doing what they were doing. They were risking their positions. But everyone that I knew through them in the un, they were in agreement and they, the UN, knew that I was with them and it shouldn't be that way because they're not supposed to have, you know, people just randomly staying with them. But they all knew how fragile I was and how dangerous it was for me. So they agreed to keep it under the radar and just keep me there until I actually am safe to return home, when they thought it was safe to return home. So, yeah, stayed with them. You know we did so much together, every little event in the evening they had with other United Nations friends. They took me with them. So I got to know most of the uh, most of the teams and, and you know, some of them reminded me of my father and my grandfather. They were so nice to me and just everybody looked after me. Literally I was just precious. They all tried their best to keep me safe and for that I'm really grateful, because so many nationalities were involved to keep me safe with them British people, people, you know, troops, italians and all sorts. They all knew and they were all keeping it, making sure they kept watch.

Speaker 1: 31:13

But you know, things didn't go that well after a bit. I used to clean and do things around the house because when they were doing their duties I couldn't just be with them on the van because it's dangerous. So they would leave me home and they said when we're off duty we spend time together, but when we're on duty you have to stay home and don't ever leave our apartment. And that was very clear. But this one day I'd finished all the chores. Not that they asked me to do the chores, but I really wanted to do it because I was getting bored and it was nice to help them around the house, around the flat. I thought, okay, I've done everything. There is no electricity. The electricity cuts were quite regular.

Speaker 1: 31:56

I thought, what do I do? I'll just go outside. There is a stand there. I can buy a magazine or a newspaper with some change that they left around. They didn't mind, they're like, just take it if you need anything when we go in shopping. I never took it, but that one day, on my own, I decided to take you know 50p or something to go buy something, and it just turned into a crazy experience. So, um, I went outside, I left the door open behind me and just about to go to the stand to buy a thing a magazine or a newspaper I had this van squeaking wheels onto the pavement in front of me and it sort of made me jump because I didn't expect a van to be coming onto the pavement and, as I always say, I was about to tell them off because it scared me.

Speaker 1: 32:46

I didn't have a chance. I mean, I didn't even have a chance to do anything. That was a split second and I had this thing over my head. I got shoved into the van and they said, oh, we've got the spy, we've got the. You know, they were calling me names, the B word, and I'm there like pinching myself Please wake up. This is surely a dream. You are not going. This is not happening. I was really trying to wake myself up from a nightmare, but unfortunately it wasn't a nightmare, it was literally. It was happening and it's nothing I could do about it.

Speaker 1: 33:17

And they took me to the boss, which wasn't very far away, didn't take far to get me there, to where he was waiting, and and they dragged me from the car in into this building and, uh, uh, they got me on my knees, holding me sort of a bit like a hostage, and they flipped this thing off my head. And when I opened my eyes, I saw this, this, uh, maybe my dad's age guy, maybe a bit younger, and he's looking. He said, oh, this is the one, and I'm thinking the one. Am I that famous? I mean, who knows about me? Like, what do they mean? The one? You know you talk to yourself, don't you? You're always talking.

Speaker 1: 33:59

And he said, okay, guys, look, she's the spy, right? Okay, she's with the Americans, right? And they're like, yes, boss, we got her Finally. She's vulnerable. Anyway, it's like, flip her on her back. I want to watch this rape and I couldn't believe what I was hearing and at that point I'd gone onto my back. They were like wild monsters. They're on top of me, me stripping everything off me like funny enough, strip off with sorry, we're just bringing a bit of light humor to that's a gentle strip yeah.

Speaker 1: 34:36

So, um, as they stripped me off, literally, um, and this guy's on top of me and you know he's getting himself prepared to rape me, I was crying and I was screaming and I don't know why I said what I said. But you live in Dubai and I don't know how it is now, but maybe some of the viewers can relate to this, being some of the Muslim viewers. Perhaps I was born and raised as a Muslim and to marry a decent guy on those days, you had to be a virgin, you had to be decent, especially in a small kind of community where everybody knew your business and, in all honesty, finding a guy didn't interest me. I wanted to study, I wanted, I wanted to the world. I didn't want to just marry and that's it. That would have come eventually, of course, but there wasn't anyone remotely that you know. I would have wanted to have been at that time. I was very young.

Speaker 2: 35:36

You were still 17, 18.

Speaker 1: 35:38

Yeah, so I was just like you know, a modest girl going to school, that kind of stuff, but I was still a virgin, I have to say. And nowadays it's different. I think everything has changed so much, but we are talking about mid to late 90s. So, yeah, you know it's. It was different story back home and, um, when the boss heard the sentence of please don't do do this, I'm a virgin. When I said that, he screamed, he shouted at the guys because they were all so frantic. He shouted he's like stop, we've stumbled across a huge cargo. So he literally had to come and drag the guys off me because they were like animals.

Speaker 1: 36:22

At that point that stopped the the x stop. And I was just like trembling. I mean, I don't think I have ever felt the kind of adrenaline. It was just I was shaking so much and crying, obviously, and just felt completely destroyed and every modesty I had was stripped away. I just really felt so weird to never been with a guy, never had a boyfriend, to have grown up. Men stripping me like that and pinning me down. It was, yeah, very, very scary experience, at least to say.

Speaker 1: 37:00

And then they just covered me and the boss said we've got loads of work to do with her. We need to groom her because she hasn't got a clue what she's doing, because when we sell her to the highest bidder, they were talking in Albanian so I could hear and understand everything. And they said oh well, you know, when we sell her to the highest bidder, she needs to know she's a virgin, but she needs to know how to do things. So he said get me my lover over. They got this lover, they. I had her with me the whole time. She was vile, she was so nasty, she so manipulative. I will never forget her face and her energy and um, and then my grooming started. And oh my god, I mean, and oh my God.

Speaker 2: 37:51

I mean, this is just one-on-one with you and this lady, this lover of his, you're not part of, you're not grouped together with lots of other girls who have been kidnapped at this point, this is just a one-on-one thing with you.

Speaker 1: 38:11

This thing was just one-on-one. I hadn't been so. Just to give a perspective, all the girls I think they had they were already shipped over to the markets. This wasn't the the sex trafficking stuff. It wasn't happening in kosovo itself and I've done my research ever since and I've asked my two american police officers and I've had proper chats ever since to understand I've done my homework, basically. But I also get gathered while I was with with them things they were saying amongst each other and me understanding everything.

Speaker 1: 38:45

So this was their plan. They took people from kosovo. They couldn't keep them in kosovo for too long because it's a small place and you and were there. So when they were ready, they would then transport them into kosovo, from kosovo to albania, which is on the border. Once they are in Albania, that's it, they're gone. Nobody can find them Through Albania.

Speaker 1: 39:11

Then they went through to all the markets. Their aim was to have any healthy human being for sex exploitation, for any kind of needs, and you know market it's very sick. And then what they did is they took the organs of all the victims when they were done, using these victims. In that sense they were valueless to them. They couldn't just set them free into the world and they didn't want to keep them because they're unwanted. So they knew that the organs were still vital. So they took the organs.

Speaker 1: 39:45

Organs and most of the operations that happened were without any anesthetic, based on reporters and everything that I've read so far on these people. And there was one person that gave some kind of a interview to say what he witnessed. He thought he was doing a legit job with the surgeons in albania, thinking that they're doing some kind of legit, kind of their proper surgeons but they would be in a special house doing these operations. And this guy that was helping these surgeons when he he escaped, he gave an interview. I think he's been executed since, but it is online for people to go and read. It's crazy.

Speaker 2: 40:34

And forgive me if I missed it, but the people who actually kidnapped you and this boss that they took you to. I don't know if I missed you saying who were they. Were they people from authority, army, police? Were these just local gangsters?

Speaker 1: 40:50

They claim to have served in the army in Kosovo during the war on this small period, and I'm sure they did, because, although I haven't named them in the book because I don't want to start a war, it's like once you name them, it's a threat. I'm focusing on doing good in other ways. But yeah, they claim to have been from the Kosovo army, but actually a lot of people do see them as gangsters and fear them and they are just at large and they're just very threatening. So people that are on the same category as them. Of course they're going to support them and see them as heroes and this. And some people don't actually understand what they've done. So people that don't know they're still shocked like no, they haven't done anything because they eliminated the whole witnesses and when I actually escaped them eventually, they told me that I was the only witness, so it gave them enough content to arrest them and they got arrested after I escaped.

Speaker 2: 41:54

And just going back to where we left off from then, obviously you'd started to be groomed, and I hate to bring back these memories, but I mean, what does grooming entail?

Speaker 1: 42:05

This is what happened to me. It was, for example, there would be different scenarios. He had a lover, they would do sexual acts and different things in front of me and I was made to watch.

Speaker 1: 42:21

I was made to watch. I didn't want to watch, but the gun was always on my head and I had to watch while I was crying and being sick at the same time, because I've never seen anything like that but I could almost digest that. But there was times where they brought girls unconscious into the apartment and, for the sake of me learning what to do, they got raped and it's like a gang rape and I was made to just sit on the seat and watch these girls being raped and I couldn't do anything about it and it was really heart-breaking because that was someone else's child. Sorry, man, take your time. When I talk about other people that I saw or I witnessed, really, I break down so much, but when I talk about myself, not so much, because I've become immune to it. You know, I've just uh, I've learned to cope with it, but I still feel the guilt that I couldn't do anything to save these girls or to do anything and what?

Speaker 2: 43:47

why guilt?

Speaker 1: 43:48

I don't know. I just felt like I know that was going to happen to them anyway. I know the way they thought, the way they were, but because they were doing it so I could learn and watch, and that's I knew that's what's going to happen to me. And I'm watching this girl, you know, lying there lifeless on the floor, completely unconscious. And how could you do that to an unconscious body or even conscious body?

Speaker 2: 44:19

And how long did this go on for?

Speaker 1: 44:21

How. No, how long this watching, watching this grooming process out well, this I didn't, I don't know time, just for me time has become really mad. I've become a bit like with time and stuff, a lot of senses have gone a bit, but it would go on for like 20 to 30 minutes and take a break, sorry, I meant um.

Speaker 2: 44:43

I mean like how many days or weeks, or you know was was the grooming.

Speaker 1: 44:47

Yes, I was with them for a month or six weeks, something like that, until they thought I was ready to crack on and the conditions you, you were living in during this time.

Speaker 2: 45:01

It's in in a, in a kind of a hostage house or something no, actually to.

Speaker 1: 45:05

To everyone's surprise is this apartment that I had. It was in the in the center of uh pristina, literally so central because I was never covered up or anything at that point. Once they decided to groom me, they would take me out with them wherever they went, so they wouldn't leave me on my own town yeah, yeah, yeah, but everybody greeted them with.

Speaker 1: 45:25

I mean, people could see me with them, but they didn't care. There was I, it just was like. But they mostly went slightly on the outskirts for lunches and and whatever they had to do. But I was with them most of the time. I was hardly ever left on my own and if I did, I had lots of guards with me. But it was an apartment. It was as you walked in, you'd have a bathroom on the right, the kitchen on the right and then straight ahead to the right it was the bedroom and on the left, straight ahead, was the living room. So it's only a one bedroom apartment and it was like three of us in bed.

Speaker 2: 46:07

Disgusting, um, I always laughed three of the girls was in like so his miss mistress, myself and then him.

Speaker 1: 46:17

He would always sleep towards the window and I was always where the cabinet was like for leaving stuff and she was in the middle. So it was like three of us in bed for that period, um, sometimes just her and I when he was in there, but mostly like that. And then, um, yeah, it was a really nice, like decent apartment. It wasn't like uh, run down or anything, they they kept it in good nick, it was their apartment, I guess.

Speaker 2: 46:45

And uh, it had a wooden door and uh, like a prison door from the outside so nobody could break in or nobody could break out and obviously I know you said they took you around town and stuff, but when you're in the house, in the apartment, were you ever, um, not under under supervision you? Did you ever you in the room on your own, you sitting around, or there was always somebody looking at you?

Speaker 1: 47:08

Always someone around. All the doors open, there's always someone around.

Speaker 2: 47:14

I was never on my own and four weeks, five weeks, this this goes on for what. What happens after?

Speaker 1: 47:22

so once um, they thought I mean I was um, I was really in bad shape psychologically because I I saw so much and I witnessed and my sleep was on good, I wasn't sleeping. Obviously you can't sleep with three people in bed and also I was just disgusted by the whole thing and I really was feeling homesick. I just wanted to run away. I really had that desire to run away.

Speaker 2: 47:45

Did you think or want to die at this point? I mean, did you think death was imminent, or was this always just a sex thing?

Speaker 1: 47:53

Yeah, death didn't cross my mind. I just wanted to escape this In my head. I really, really desired to escape. I wanted to see my mum and dad. I just constantly thought of my mom and dad. It's what kept me going. I was like I really need to make it through. I never really accepted it in my heart or in my mind that I was going to end up in what they were saying. I'm going to end up into, you know, the whole market. I, just in my head, I was eliminating all those thoughts. They were saying it like in my head. I was eliminating all those thoughts. They were saying it like in my head. I'm like I need to see my mom and dad. I, I really need to go to my mom and dad.

Speaker 2: 48:28

So this was the battle that I was having in my head and at this point, and, but you still hadn't had sex or been raped yourself at this point. They were, they were, they were saving you, they were just making you watch yeah.

Speaker 1: 48:40

So they saved me. And finally the day of taking me to the other side, from Kosovo to Albania, came, and that day was quite an interesting day. We we approached. We came into this nearest town that reaches Albania on the other side. I've mentioned them all on the book it's a full-on detail. But the boss has a night in that particular town and he goes oh, loretta. He said, boys, leave me with Loretta now.

Speaker 1: 49:24

And so we were in this other strange apartment, just two of us, the boss and I and he opens a bottle of wine and here I am. I remember it was the door and it was a like a sofa, kind of not not sofa, like a chair with yeah, it's like a armchair, and then a little sofa. And I sat there because I didn't want to be on the sofa. And he's like drink. I said I don't drink. He said, oh, come on, join me on the drink. You know, he was being so nice and weird. He said I need to tell you something. It's like look at me, look at me. I was like, okay, I didn't want to look at him. Just his face to this day haunts me. And yeah, he said um, you know what? He said um, I have feelings for you. Can you imagine this? How sick is? He said I've developed feelings for you. And he said we can make a deal. He said tonight, you and I, we spend the night together. The plan is to send you to Albania tomorrow. You have been sold to the highest bidder. Everything is waiting on the other side for you to be shipped to wherever I was going. Everything is waiting on the other side for you to be shipped to wherever I was going and he said but if you give yourself to me and these words, really, if somebody was to say to me, give yourself to me, I'll probably punch him now or her, because it's like you know, you relate to the scenarios he said if you give yourself to me, then I'll make all of this go away.

Speaker 1: 51:05

Then he I was like, oh my god, I was so scared he sort of grabbed me at my arm and he sort of led me to the bedroom just outside of the room. It was on on the left, just sort of behind, and he laid me in bed. He's like come on, give yourself to me. He was like so pushy and I just turned around. I turned away from him onto my right hand side. I said I really can't do this. I feel so sick. And he was still going on about it until he actually pleasured himself and then, because I was naked, he was naked and I was just curled into a ball. I I didn't want him near me. It was disgusting. And when he reached his pleasure he shouted at me. He said look what you've made me do without any help. If you had just given yourself to me, I would not even ship you. Why can't you just give yourself to me? I'm in love with you. You know he was saying all these things and I'm like oh sick giving myself to a monster.

Speaker 2: 52:04

Tell me all these things and I'm like, oh, sick giving myself to a monster. Tell me, give um, given that you knew what was going to happen anyway. You know what? Why I'm trying? I'm trying to think of the words to use and there's probably no, no good way to ask or say but why could you or did you not do it, if you, if you knew that, if you didn't do it, you were about to get sold off to do it anyway, and and who knew what the ending was at that point?

Speaker 1: 52:28

you see, matt, if I said yes, I made a choice to be raped by my kidnappers and I had still a say which, which is looking back now. I didn't think it that way. I just couldn't get it in me to say yes because either way, I didn't want to be with him. I didn't want to be his girl that he carried around. I knew what he was capable of, what they were capable of. I'd much rather die. So, either way, it was going to end up bad. So I decided to not be, not give him the authority that he can. I don't know how to explain, I don't know what you mean, you know.

Speaker 2: 53:09

I just don't want Not give him the satisfaction.

Speaker 1: 53:11

Yeah, I didn't, because it I don't know how to explain. There was no better outcome for me. Either way. It was something against my will and I was hope. I was much rather prepared to save myself and and then just hopefully buy myself some more time and then, before the next thing happens. It's really weird. But um, I couldn't find it in my heart to say yes to him and yeah, so, um, so you didn't give him what he wants.

Speaker 2: 53:43

Uh, what happened did he? Did he then go on to sell you?

Speaker 1: 53:46

oh yeah, the next morning we got up he's very angry got in the car, the gang came, his gang, his guys and uh, I sat at the back of the car again with two guys each side holding guns on my ribs he's in the front, the driver and uh, when we reach the border, it's like these mountains are so high. I don't know if you've ever been to montenegro and albania, but as you reach the border with kosovo and albania, the mountains, they've got waterfalls and it's really high and really quiet. It's like Lord of the Rings kind of mountains. It's quite creepy and beautiful at the same time. I could just look around. We got stopped. It was very narrow the road and the actual border was very small. It was just like a little cabin and a couple of officers and there were United Nations and one local, I think, and they said you can't cross, the border is shut. They had barricaded the border and the boss said to them why can't I cross it? I want to cross it. Now we have to cross. They said, no, you need to go, and the troops that were bordering this thing was they were Italians. Because of the flags. I always was fascinated with travel, so I used to remember flags and I saw his flag and they looked inside the car. They saw me, they just looked, didn't look anything suspicious, I don't know. I was just, you know, staying still and the guys were literally like if I had to do a peep, I think they would have killed everyone. And so we turned around. There was no other way to take me into Albania and the boss said let's drive back, boys, we need to drive back to our main flat because I've got other. He didn't expect not to go to plan, obviously, so he had other things to do. And on the way back I was quite relieved. I thought oh my god, we're still in Kosovo. This is good. You know, it's a bit more time for me to just.

Speaker 1: 55:53

I had this desire to make it out and the hope just never left me of seeing my mom and dad, this huge hope and positivity deep in my heart, the longing to see them, and we drove back. We stopped in few restaurants because he needed to do different things and I said I need to go to the bathroom. Every time we stopped I needed to go to the bathroom and they would never stop me. But what I was doing now, the other way around. I was causing a scene, so as I would go to the bathroom, I'd walk towards the waitresses or the bar and the guard is with me. So as I was to say something, because I wanted to say can you help me, or it's not anything, the guard would come and just push me around and like literally very vicious, because they were irritated by that point, and so the staff of different places we stopped at, I think they realized something really wasn't right at all with these guys and me there.

Speaker 1: 56:51

And by the time we reached their apartment, which was midnight at this point, the same apartment where they helped me the boss get a call and he was on the hallway and he just goes, yep, yep, oh, really okay, and he gets really angry, he goes. She is more trouble than she's worth it. And I'm now looking puzzled, like what have I done? Like, like what am I trouble? You know I was so scared, I was shivering and like looking at them like, oh my God, you know you're in constant stress and we're all standing on the hallway and I remember, because the bathroom and the kitchen was behind me and it's a small hallway like as wide as this, and he's standing there with this real fierce face and I was like, oh, oh, my god, I'm in trouble.

Speaker 1: 57:43

He said to one of the youngest team. He said you come here, rape her killer and get rid of her. At that point I went from. You know, I don't know what's going on. I didn't get shipped, but at that to literally rape a killer. Done so, my life, my life expectancy came to a close. It was like, okay, now this is minutes oh my god, what am I gonna do?

Speaker 1: 58:12

I was so scared of dying. That's when I lost hope. That's when I thought, oh great, this is happening. And I really wasn't ready. Nobody's ever ready to die, so so he left, they closed the doors and the guy was like come on, you heard and he's got the gun. And then I started like like really, he was older than me, but not too much older. He maybe was in his early twenties and I just remember begging him. I'm like, please, let me pray, let me pray. I'm so begging him. I'm like, please let me pray, let me pray. I'm so scared. I said I'm so scared.

Speaker 1: 58:43

I said, if I can just pray? I said we're both Muslims, can we just pray? He's like okay. He said I haven't done this before, but I think he was new to this. He said I need to pray. So he went to the bathroom. I was on the floor already. There was a, a TV on the left-hand side, the sofa here. This is in the bedroom and by the TV there was an empty kind of slot, and in Islam you have to. You can't have anything in front of you. So you have to find the right place to pray.

Speaker 1: 59:17

And I just collapsed on my knees and put my head down and I really, really prayed for forgiveness and that I really wasn't ready to go. And if only the words that I said to God, to Allah, I said, if you could only just tell my mom and dad what had happened, because I'm about to die and they're never going to find out what happened. And these were my thoughts in my head. If only I could tell them what happened. And I'm not scared then to die. But this loyalty, this them needing to know rather than I don't know, it was this great need of me, them needing to know rather than I don't know. It was this great need of me them needing to know that I was going. I just couldn't live with my. Not live, but I couldn't die with myself, I should say, knowing that my parents never knew that I was about to die or I was dying or dead.

Speaker 1: 1:00:15

And so something really magical happening to, to the people that pray, that will say is the power of god. To the people that believe in universe, they say, is manifestation, whatever the belief is, I had shown I, I got shown. There is beyond what we see, beyond what is sort of known to us. We can't explain things. Same as we say, oh, it's fate or what a coincidence nothing ever is a coincidence that moment in time I have been shown that there is something beyond our understanding the power of the mind and the prayer, or the meditation as some people may know it that are not religious is so powerful and for me I believe in God I thought God saved me that night. He literally created a miracle for me the guy that had gone to wash himself he hadn't gone yet while I was praying, but these were like split seconds, this whole thing. I'm telling you minutes but it's actually seconds because it happened so fast.

Speaker 1: 1:01:30

As I'm praying on Sajdah with my head down, this guy leaves the gun and leaves the keys. I didn't see it, but I heard a cling on this glass table and I thought what is this? So I? I was praying, so I didn't want to break my prayer, but I was also encouraged to look to my left shoulder. As I looked, I could see the keys and the gun, and then I turned around and it's as if I'm talking to God. I'm like I can't touch the gun, but something said to me but you can take the keys, and I was like talking to myself in my head. So I got up and I said sorry, it's like, it's almost like I was breaking the praise. I'm like so sorry, I have to stop this. So I got up, took the keys and I'm thinking okay, two keys, one is smaller, one is bigger. I can see which one is which.

Speaker 1: 1:02:21

So I went to the wooden door all creeping and the adrenaline had gone so high. I was really shaking with those keys and I just felt like I was never going to make it out. So I opened the wooden door and then, as I opened the metal door, it's a slightly longer key. It opens the opposite direction to the usual door. You have to tilt it. So I was like it's a slightly longer key. It opens the opposite direction to the usual door. You have to tilt it. So I was like fiddling because I couldn't tilt it. I didn't know which way it goes.

Speaker 1: 1:02:47

So as I was fiddling, I was making so much rattling noise and the guy heard from the bathroom. He's like what the heck is going on. So he's screaming and the door opened and I went flying onto the sort of tiny bit of hallway before I hit the stairs and I've never ran the stairs downstairs so fast I was missing steps. I wasn't touching the floor. I felt like something had lifted me up and I was just flying through those stairs. At the same time I could hear his footstep behind me and his heavy breathing and his voice swearing at me, but he was way back so I was ahead of him as I reached the end of the staircase. It was straight onto this door that didn't have a door. It was like open kind of door frame, but the door wasn't there. He, he catches me and he punches me so hard that I ended up flying onto this main road which, luckily, at night it wasn't busy, but in the day when we left the apartment, it was always busy. It's really central.

Speaker 1: 1:03:49

But lying there on the floor like not knowing what had just hit me first punch ever in my life, I turned around to look because I saw some flashing lights and as I was turning to get up, I thought, oh my God, that's a Jeep, similar to the Americans, that had white with red, very significant, and I just decided to scream because I knew whoever it was. It was a person. So I needed to scream. To my luck, it was a Italian police officer. Un had just finished his shift and he was parking his car on the pavement it was like a parking slot and he heard me so he started walking towards me. I'm crawling towards him.

Speaker 1: 1:04:34

This guy obviously had gotten the gun, started shooting at the police officer. The police officer is defending himself, so he's shooting at him whilst obviously I am still crawling towards him. So when I reached him, he immediately stopped shooting. He grabbed me, dragged me back behind his car. He opened the door of the car.

Speaker 1: 1:04:54

I remember everything. So he opened the door. We were sort of behind the door. He reached in because the steering wheel is on this side, it's not like in England, it's the other side. And he got this walkie-talkie thing that it was all cabled in I don't know how they are now, but it was like huge cable and he started calling all units or something. I don't know. I was just like so scared and in in like seconds we were surrounded by un, all sorts of different jeeps, different nationalities, lights, translators, and at that point I'm just crying and screaming because I had. I had this huge adrenaline. I was dying. And then it was the release of this. Like you know, when you're angry and you just want to break something, I had that thing that I needed to release. I was just screaming and they had to calm me down. Took me to the station, gave my interview.

Speaker 2: 1:05:48

What about the guy who was chasing you? Did he get shot? I?

Speaker 1: 1:05:51

don't know what they did. I just said the police knew where I was coming from, so I just pointed to the albanian translators. I said it's over there on the fourth floor. You can see the apartment. You can go and search. I was just giving information, like they there. They're all there. What took you so long? I was like throwing a tantrum because I was so in distress and they realized that I wasn't okay. So they, they got a blanket over me, took me to the station and I don't know what happened there.

Speaker 1: 1:06:17

But I was in the station and this albanian police officer about my dad's age, he, I remember him walking towards me. He said um, can I give you a hug? And he started crying. I said please don't touch me because, like he said, no. I said you are the only survivor. We've been wanting. We know of this, but we just can't ever find survivors to testify against them, to give us this. He said you know your interview tonight. He will get them arrested. I'm like I don't care. I said I just want to make it home. I want to go see my mom and dad. I'm tired of this, I'm scared. And he was just looking at me.

Speaker 1: 1:06:57

So I was at the police station just after midnight till about three o'clock in the morning. They made sure you know I was OK and looked at me and interviewed me over and over again just to make sure the storyline was right and all the information, descriptions. So they wanted to make sure what I was saying was correct and places that I remember, number plates, anything, people. So I just said everything. They gave me a case number and then they said do you know anyone in Pristina? I said only the two Americans, peter and Brian. I said I'd love to see them.

Speaker 1: 1:07:33

So I got reunited with them at 3.30 in the morning around that time and Peter was waiting outside the truck with police officers dropped me off. Peter hugged me, grabbed me and he stayed up with me the entire night that night until morning. And then Brian woke up becauseeter didn't wake him up and brian was so in shock to see me and so pleased and hugging me and then peter was explaining because there was no translators but peter had been debriefed by the un already and the moment brian heard all of this from peter, brian changed. He became very cold and almost depressive. It was just he went from this amazing, like funny, loving to literally almost like he hated me or something I felt, but he was feeling resentment and and guilt that he couldn't keep me safe.

Speaker 1: 1:08:33

So they said um translator came in the morning. He said, loretta, you need to leave now. So, um, they got me on this bus and that took me back to where I came from, near the border with serbia, and then I crossed back into serbia back to where your parents are yeah, same way.

Speaker 1: 1:08:49

So I remember roughly what it was. Looked around, there was no UN checking me out that I'm about to climb the mountain, because it was all you're not supposed to do. That. As soon as it was clear I was like up that mountain into the woods and then that was it. I just had to worry about patrolling in the woods and stuff and um, long story short, I think it's pretty long as it is. I made it to my parents and I found them hiding in the ground in the basement. My mom wasn't happy to see me and my dad. They were like why did you come back? I'm like I have so much to tell you. For me it was like I have to tell you I've escaped death, you know.

Speaker 2: 1:09:29

But because your parents knew nothing.

Speaker 1: 1:09:31

they, they knew nothing, they didn't know what was going on in Kosovo at all. We had no contact. They just didn't know whether I made it. Nowadays we can't have our children just wandering off the world without knowing where you are. But then you didn't have phones, you didn't have anything, there was no way to communicate, it was just trusting God kind of thing, and the rest is history.

Speaker 2: 1:09:53

So you just go back to your parents? They, they didn't know what was going on. I mean, I was going to ask you that as a question anyway. Um, I mean, what did you start to tell them immediately what had happened?

Speaker 1: 1:10:05

I was on the process. I'm like, but, mum and dad, because they were like, oh, why are you here? What are you doing here? You shouldn't be here. You know, they were like literally like panicking. My mom is like, I'm like, what's going on? I know they were underground hiding because it was bombing and all sorts happening. I said, mom and dad, I have so much to tell you. You don't know what's happened to me in Kosovo. And they're like what? And we didn't really have time, I didn't have time to tell them anything. And we heard a van like a truck pulled, army truck pull into our garden. We have a huge garden back home. And my mom's like, oh, my god, they are here. I'm like mom is fine, who's here? I'm thinking who like the soldiers? So what?

Speaker 1: 1:10:46

I was ready like mad what I witnessed in kosovo. I was ready to die. I didn't care anymore. I was with my parents. Whatever happens, happens. And um, they came and, uh, they dragged me from my parents. They said she's come back in Serbian. And my dad is like, please forgive her, just leave her. And I'm like what, forgive me? What? Like? I'm thinking what have I done? Oh, yes, I've crossed borders. But surely once I tell them the story, I said mom and dad in Serbian, don't worry, once I tell them my story. I said mum and dad in Serbian, don't worry, once I tell them my story, what happened to me in Kosovo, they will release me because, you know, I just I was naive, still naive. I mean you don't grow overnight, grow up overnight. So put me in the van and I was still so grateful that my parents saw me being taken away by the soldiers.

Speaker 1: 1:11:40

And it's very valuable information to mention that during the war in Yugoslavia, serbia, the armies that were formed, so it was the regular army and there was numbers, kind of games army.

Speaker 1: 1:11:50

So the Serbian government recruited prisoners of war, killers, robbers, you name it to make the numbers to fight with Kosovo and just to fight generally, and so they needed to know the difference between the real soldiers and the ones that were not real soldiers for their own sake sake. So the soldiers that you'd imagine that wear boots and normal uniform, and the ones that were recruited with uniform, but on the shoe side they didn't wear boots, they wore trainers, white trainers, and it was really weird to see some the soldiers dressed up in uniform and then white trainers. Those were the same soldiers that took our town to be massacred and the same soldiers that took me in. I mean, not maybe the same people, but the same kind of line of soldiers that took me from my parents and on the actual track. I'm thinking it's fine, mum and Dad, you know they saw me this time, so surely I'll get asked some questions and I'll come back and and this is literally on the day you've arrived home.

Speaker 1: 1:13:00

Literally minutes of arriving, because the borders were being watched and the town was being shot at, and so I just went through all of this just to get to my mum and dad's house. So we reached this abandoned building in the mountains, not far from my parents. Actually, we didn't drive very long and I know roughly where that is, and they put me into this building. I was thinking, gosh, this is not the actual army base. But okay, and into this room, bright lights, really bright lights. And there was a soldier there waiting for me. And these other two soldiers brought me in. They interrogated me.

Speaker 1: 1:13:42

So they were asking me tell us where you've been, what you've done? Did you spy? Are you telling them about what we're doing here? And I told them this is all in Serbia. And I said I have just escaped because you guys were about to massacre us. So I'm just repeating the story.

Speaker 1: 1:13:59

And then I told them what happened in Kosovo. They're like no, you're lying, who are you spying for? And they would hit me. And they punched me and hit me. I lost a couple of teeth, they broke my nose, ripped my ear, they, they did so many things to me physically and then, the last thing I remember before they locked me up from that interrogation room, by that point I was already bleeding, I'd lost teeth, which are still missing, and my nose had been broken.

Speaker 1: 1:14:28

My eyes were so swollen I couldn't see from being punched on the face. My ear was bleeding and this ear had gone all like. I couldn't see from being punched on the face. My ear was bleeding and this ear had gone all like. I couldn't hear. And they said the guy said the main soldier. He said, okay, hold her down, let's see. Now she will tell the truth. And they pulled out this, the cattle branding thing for the cattle and it was a hashtag shape, like we know hashtag now, and I could just barely make out. But I couldn't see. But I could feel the heat as it's about to go on my calf, at the back of my calf and when I got the direct contact with the heat I passed out.

Speaker 2: 1:15:14

They did touch, yeah, yeah, I had a huge scar.

Speaker 1: 1:15:17

I had it laser removed in the uk when I started working on sorry my eyes, since I've been crying um when I started working and earning money, I had a lot of things fixed because I was unrecognizable. I mean, I wasn't, I didn't look right, I broken. But yeah, that was one of the things that I fixed the scar on my calf, because I wanted to be able not to remind myself of everything. I remind myself now anyway, but scars and things like that do remind you a lot.

Speaker 2: 1:15:45

Where were your parents at this point, by the way? Did they get taken as well? No, they'd gone left behind. They were still at home.

Speaker 1: 1:15:49

Yeah, still at home. And so, yeah, I fainted, I blacked out, and the next memories of that period was me. I don't know how long he had been since I blacked out, waking up, couldn't really see because my eyes were so closed and swollen, I couldn't see anyway, but I was feeling with my hands to see where I was, and it felt really cold and concretey, with only something that seemed like a blanket that I was lying on. It smelled so bad, it smelled so rotten and it's like really weird. Plus my blood, plus I couldn't smell properly. But can you imagine? Because my nose had been broken. But can you imagine?

Speaker 1: 1:16:35

Even through my broken nose, I could tell this place was so, so bad to be in. So I started panicking. I got slowly up my my car was throbbing, started banging at the door and I realized that the space is really small. So if you were to sit at the corner of it, you could just touch the walls and then, not far away, like this sort of space here, maybe a bit tiny, smaller, maybe this actually it's uh, that was it. That was my space, a bit narrower than this, and I could barely just lie down and and stand up. I could feel it.

Speaker 1: 1:17:10

There was no windows because, as my swelling went down, I realized and I'm skipping through the story but there was no windows because, as my swelling went down, I realized and I'm skipping through the story but there was no windows. I could just see the crack on the door. The door was metal like pure metal and didn't have any window or anything, just the crack on the door and I initial reaction it was claustrophobia and freaking out. Where I was, I thought I had been buried alive. Then I calmed down, then I started becoming really crazy, like hitting the wall, screaming, asking to be let out. And after so many screaming and shouting I exhausted myself and plus, I was so injured I kept drifting in and out of this. I don't know I was asleep or whatever was happening, but it really. This period turned from that one day of me knowing that I was completely locked up to a six months of solitary confinement by these soldiers.

Speaker 2: 1:18:15

And where was it? Was it in a location still near to where your home was? It's quite near, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:18:20

Yeah, it was an abandoned building where they used for this kind of stuff, I guess. And my time in that small, dark place, goodness me, it was like a. It's almost like I had gone to learn lessons for the lifetime why were they keeping you? Oh, I became their toy, so there was no thought of spying or anything at this point this was just pure vicious they just turned me into a toy.

Speaker 1: 1:18:55

So then, after my first uh encounter with them, with rape, uh, that was really quite um, I didn't expect it and I didn't know what I was expecting, but but that was heartbreaking, and once that happened I just it didn't matter to me anymore. My whole innocent and everything moral was stripped away and it was just. I starved myself, I didn't want to drink and I just wanted to die because I didn't see where it was going. You know, six months in a solitary confinement with no interaction with human beings outside of these walls and those soldiers.

Speaker 1: 1:19:49

How many of these soldiers were there Rapes mostly happened, three at a time. They were changing. It was different ones.

Speaker 2: 1:19:58

And any other girls there as well.

Speaker 1: 1:20:00

No, girls, just them. And this is the problem that happened during the war. They recruited prisoners of war to serve the army. You know, my people are good people and so are the kosovans, but I believe that there is good and bad in every culture, in every religion, in every nationality, in everything. So I love my people. I have always admired them. We've been through so much as a country. I love my Serbian friends, I love my Albanian friends. I have both and it pains me because we are so good to others.

Speaker 1: 1:20:45

Everybody that meets me says, oh, my god, the Serbian people are amazing, and that makes me so happy. I'm like, yes, we are amazing. Or they say, oh, I've been to Kosovo, they're amazing people. I'm like, yes, we are amazing. Or they say, oh, I've been to Kosovo, they're amazing people. I'm like, yes, they are amazing people, because I know that this minority of monsters it doesn't identify the majority, which are really nice people, and they've been through so much. Both the Serbian people have been through a lot. Serbian and Kosovans have been through a lot. Serbian and kosovans have been through a lot because civilians never wanted war, it was just the government. It was all about power and seats at the right table authority, that kind of stuff. But deep down the the civilians never wanted war.

Speaker 1: 1:21:32

I mean, I have met people throughout since I made it out saying, oh yeah, I'm from Bosnia and I'm Orthodox Christian and I was put in an army uniform Like this actually is a particular guy that I met in Singapore.

Speaker 1: 1:21:47

He's very well known in Singapore, he's my friend and he's been my rock when I lived in Singapore because, you know, I just wanted to connect with people from home and he happened to live in Singapore. He had escaped Bosnia during the war because he got put in uniform and they got asked to go and shoot your neighbors that he used to play football with as a kid or as an adult, because he's, he used to be an Olympic, a very well-known guy, and he said no, I'm not killing my neighbors. So he took the uniform off, left everything and ran to Australia as a refugee and eventually in Singapore. Now he lives in Singapore. But he said the same. He said we never wanted to kill the Muslims, they would force us. So a majority of people have been put in uniform, civilians at a certain age. Here's a gun, go shoot your neighbour. We killed each other.

Speaker 2: 1:22:45

So yeah, so going back to you in captivity at this point how did you get out?

Speaker 1: 1:22:54

Oh my God, the six months were months, were so important for the viewers to understand. The six months were a real molding time for me. I went through resentment, through hate. They taught me everything Because, whatever they were towards me, I was feeling towards them, until I had to stop myself letting the anger rub on me. Instead, I realized I wasn't dying, I was. I realized I wasn't dying, I was tiring, I wasn't dying and I thought, okay, maybe it's not my time.

Speaker 1: 1:23:19

So I then decided to do something about it, which I didn't decide like, oh my god, let me write it down. But it was more like you know, I'm going to start feeling sorry for them because and I did I was feeling sorry for them that they are so vicious and I was seeing myself as kind and this person that hasn't done anything wrong, which I was. But I needed to give myself that credit because I knew that unless I did that, they were taking away my mind, my, my, everything, my um. Obviously they took everything else away, but I didn't want them to take the power of my mind away and turn me into a complete nutcase did you?

Speaker 2: 1:24:00

did you believe you would one day get out, or did you think you were in there to die?

Speaker 1: 1:24:04

I I did. I never thought I'd escape that. That was so like heavily, uh, locked down kind of thing. I I didn't have hope of escaping it. But one thing that I was more relaxed about being there relaxed, I mean more calm psychologically about I didn't have this thought of, or if my mum and dad knew what was happening. It's more like they know I have been taken. At least they know that now, if I never return, and if I least they know that now if I never return and if I die, they know that something happened like this. I didn't abandon them because before in Kosovo, my fear was that they would think I was. I abandoned them. I just vanished because I didn't want to be part of their I don't know part of their life or something.

Speaker 1: 1:24:49

I don't know this, but this time I was okay. They know I'm with the soldiers and whatever happens happens. And yeah, and then eventually my dad I didn't know this then, but I found out ever since he'd gone and during the war he had just decided to go and search for me because it'd been six months and he got really worried, obviously, as you would, and initially he'd been going doing his homework for a long time, but eventually he got to the police station that he knew a few guys there. As a doctor, he knew a lot of police officers and he said listen, I know we're at war with each other, but could we, could you find out where's my daughter? Because if she's being held, I I want to know why. You know she's under. Well, she's 18 or whatever.

Speaker 1: 1:25:36

I was then 19 almost. And the police officer said to him look, I can do the research, but I can't interfere because I'm a police officer. If he's taken by the soldiers, then she should be at the base. He did the research, asked a few soldiers legit soldiers and they said look, we're not happy with what's happening with the soldiers they've been recruiting. They are, it's all well and good, like to to follow the rules or fight and do this, but what they are doing, it goes against of what we are taught as army. We can't it's, but we can't interfere.

Speaker 1: 1:26:17

And so these soldiers were raping and and taking. I wasn't the only one, but I don't know who else went through what I went through and, uh, they were just doing this to a lot of people. My dad said how, how can I get her out? And the police officer said, the only option is here to bribe them. See if you can get some money, bribe them and then maybe you get her out for 24 hours and then I'll help you get her out of this place. Because the borders were still shut. My dad had gathered some money, the police officer and the legit soldier helped him locate this abandoned building small abandoned building and my dad came in. I didn't know this, but they came and opened the door.

Speaker 2: 1:27:03

You were inside, he was at the door.

Speaker 1: 1:27:05

I was still inside my room just lying there. I was drifting away a lot because I had lost so much weight. I was skin and bones and I was infected. I had because I had lost so much weight, I was skin and bones and I was infected. I had infected ear, infected nose. Nothing was being looked after the wound on my and it was not clean in that place. So I was and that was my toilet, my, everything. It was like it's all happening in this tiny little room. So the bacteria was really high, I was really ill.

Speaker 1: 1:27:33

And they came and opened the door. They're like come on, uh, there's somebody here to see you. And I didn't believe them because they did this before and they would hit me and they play mind games and they used to put mice and rats in my room to torture me. It was just horrific, like a, like a horror movie, and they dragged me because I couldn't walk. At that point I'm really weak, and so I could hear my dad's voice, but I couldn't believe my ears. And as I walked into this room, bright again, where they interrogated me, my dad is there and I remember when my dad and I met our glaze, my dad's face just dropped as a doctor seeing me in that condition. And I just remember saying to my dad what took you so long? In Albanian, and my dad started speaking in Albanian. He said I'm going to look after you, and they're like shouting at us speak in Serbian. Anyway, my dad had done the exchange.

Speaker 1: 1:28:35

I didn't know what was going on, I just followed. I didn't have how can I say? I was hopeless. I just whatever people wanted me to do, I was doing. I had zero emotions left. I was just completely like a zombie. So my dad grabs me, covers me, and then he's dragging me and I'm just shuffling and emotionless.

Speaker 1: 1:28:59

And when we went out I couldn't look at the lights. So immediately I said to my dad I can't see because I'd been in the dark for so long. Oh, he said okay, because he didn't know I was in a dark room, he didn't know the conditions I was in. So he threw something over my head just to get me into the car, laid me at the back. I was lying there and I said dad, tell me something. Isn't my mom dad? He's like no, no, she's alive, she's at home, she's waiting. I'm like okay, because I thought he's coming to get me, because she's dead. I don't know why I was thinking this. She wasn't there. So he said no, I'm just taking you home for 24 hours, come on. And I drifted off asleep in the car, the back of the car lying down, and when we got home, my mom, like she, was sobbing and she knew what was going on.

Speaker 2: 1:29:47

She knew your dad had gone there to look for you yeah, she.

Speaker 1: 1:29:49

She knew she was expecting me and she'd cooked and stuff. She took me straight into. My dad said she needs a shower. She said okay. So they took me in the bathroom. My mom washed me and my dad said look for any wounds that are somewhere that I can't see. And she said I'll dress those, because I had gotten all so many wounds of lying on this hard floor. You know, I had wounds on my body. Everything had to be dressed and addressed with antibiotics and injections and stuff.

Speaker 1: 1:30:20

My dad gave me the whole nine yards of medication and they made me eat because I needed to eat a bit but I couldn't eat and I said, Mom, I just want to lie on you. So I lied on her lap and I said, mum, I just want to lie on you. So I lied on her lap and for the first time in all this period I felt if I had stayed there because I fell asleep, but if I had stayed on her lap a tiny bit longer, I think I would have gone, because I was so tired, exhausted. I was so tired, Exhausted. How strong was I as a kid? If you put me through that now, I don't think I can make it. Please don't test me. But wow, I'm so grateful of my younger self was so strong.

Speaker 1: 1:31:15

And then my dad just walked in towards the night. As the night fell, he was shushing around with my mom. I said what's going on, guys? I said in a slow voice. I said what's going on? My dad, it's time to go. I'm like I'm not going anywhere. I'm exhausted, dad. I said I can't do this anymore. He said the last time and we're going to say goodbye. This is our last time as well. And I said goodbye to my mom and I just never forget that last hug.

Speaker 2: 1:31:47

Sorry, why is it last time?

Speaker 1: 1:31:53

My dad had the police officer and my dad the police officer of Serbia that my dad had gotten involved to find me had managed to find a truck that was still doing import export in the country oh, this is how they were going to get you out.

Speaker 1: 1:32:05

Yeah, to smuggle me out and he was waiting with his truck on the side of this road which was walking distance from our house. We lived in the fields of the town and, uh, my dad had to walk me so I had to say goodbye to my mom. The dark had fallen, so it was perfect timing not to be seen. I walked with my dad slowly and I'm like dad, we shouldn't be doing this. It's like, it's okay, it's the last time.

Speaker 1: 1:32:34

After a short walk, we got, we reached this, the truck. The truck was parked there and the guy is waiting, foreigner, I think. He's spanish, so clearly he I don't speak english, I don't speak spanish and he doesn't speak my language. And I'm looking at him, thinking another man. You know, at that point my, my thing was like not another man, like on my own, because I I I've been through a lot, so I was really scared. I didn't trust anymore anything or anyone. So got on the truck and I said goodbye to my dad and I gave him a big hug, made sure I could smell him and remember that, you know, because for me that was the end of us as a three-year-old and got onto the truck and did you know where you were going no.

Speaker 1: 1:33:23

My dad said look, everything is given to. The driver is explained, don't worry, he will look after you. And I was like, oh god, if my dad knew. But I was just, I'd had enough, man, I was ready to die. Even I didn't care anymore. It was, it was beyond. It had exceeded like water had overflown, kind of from a glass. I was just over everything. But I was going to make the last wish come true, so I just went along with it. I was always smuggled in the truck so I didn't see the path or which way or what happened. But I just remember when I got dropped off in the UK.

Speaker 1: 1:34:05

Oh, that was where you landed the UK. Yeah, all in the truck we did stop to toilet breaks and stuff and he was feeding me, but I never saw where we stopped. I didn't know.

Speaker 2: 1:34:18

How much did he pay for your release?

Speaker 1: 1:34:21

To the guys I'm not sure, actually, I'll ask my dad.

Speaker 2: 1:34:27

I've got a new question for your story there.

Speaker 1: 1:34:30

Yeah, because every time I want to speak about this, he doesn't want to talk about it. And what happened after? To them as well. It's their story to tell, but they just don't want to talk about it. You know, and they're very proud of me, they're actually alive still, because people wonder if they made it. They made it, but they might as well have died because they suffered a lot.

Speaker 2: 1:34:53

They're still in where you were from originally. Suffered a lot. They're still in in where you were from originally.

Speaker 1: 1:34:57

Yeah, they're still in serbia, although when we got reunited after five years the government here were very kind. They, my lawyers and stuff and the the people that I was still in you know in contact with. From looking after me. From the governments they said you're the only child, so you know they they contact with. From looking after me. From the governments they said you're the only child, so you know, they're most welcome to come here and then we'll consider them to join you because you're the only child. I did ask them and they refused to come. They decided to stay. They didn't want to be a burden to me, they wanted to just crack on with my life. But this was five years after. We reconnected over a phone after a year of me being here, but we reunited properly with a hug after five years.

Speaker 2: 1:35:43

In England no.

Speaker 1: 1:35:45

I flew into Macedonia to meet them. I was already a British citizen, because up until that point I waited for my British citizenship. I couldn't, I didn't want to be getting near that place, just in case even with the British citizenship, did you not fear?

Speaker 2: 1:36:02

fear going back there, that you know you could be kidnapped again?

Speaker 1: 1:36:06

yeah, the first time I actually went back it was, if I'm not mistaken, around 2006 or 7, and I was already a British citizen for quite some time, for at least um five to six years. And um, I said to my dad please find out if you know anyone in the in the police. Could they go on the system and just check am I on the wanted list? So he asked one of the main guys at the police station. He was the head, one of my dad's friends, a Serbian guy, chika Peka we call him Uncle Peka, that's what it means. He said look, she's not on the wanted list because she was not legally held. It was by the army that was formed during the war, which then all those guys went back to prison anyway. But so I wasn't on the system. But I'm on the system in Kosovo for having been kidnapped. But this one they didn't put me on the system, which is good, because had he had been the other army, I would never be able to go back and do you still go back now?

Speaker 1: 1:37:22

with with a lot of struggle. Yeah, I don't. I don't enjoy going back. I don't sleep when I go back.

Speaker 2: 1:37:29

I have nightmares do you only go to see your parents?

Speaker 1: 1:37:32

I go to see my parents. But you know what it's made it much easier for me now because before I used to think, oh, but you know I could be. If somebody you know remembers or finds out, it can get me, you know, get my children, or all this paranoia and I don't like living paranoid, but it's just. I'm sorry, it's just part of it, because I have memories there. So much of this.

Speaker 1: 1:37:54

But having told, finally, I have told my cousins that are older than me or my age, I have had the time to reconnect with people that disappeared during the war or were missing or joined different armies and stuff. So I have told them my story. And so because I've told them my story, I feel I have protection by because I don't have brothers and sisters and I'm still quite feminine. I need that kind of male protection. I quite like that. And when I'm not traveling with my husband I feel quite vulnerable. Even though I do martial art, I I still feel vulnerable. I'm a woman. So it's really nice to have my cousins knowing my story and they're sort of always on our lookout, or if there's something not right, they always say tell us.

Speaker 2: 1:38:44

How long have you been married?

Speaker 1: 1:38:46

2008.

Speaker 2: 1:38:48

And what I mean. Obviously, after losing your virginity and that experience and losing your innocence, I mean, when did you ever be able to look at a man in a relationship sense again and not, I guess, be scared and hate on anyone near you?

Speaker 1: 1:39:07

It was really tough. I didn't want to be with anyone. I didn't know what gender I wanted to be with. I really didn't know myself. I was clearly didn't want to be with men. Obviously I didn't feel like I wanted to be with women either. So it was just that.

Speaker 1: 1:39:24

But then, um, I became a personal trainer. This is way back because I realized how much fitness was helping me manage my emotions. So I wanted to help others and in the gym the first job I got I met like job in the gym, rather because I was training people freelance. But to get a job in the gym it was in Leicester Square kind of area was a fitness first in Leicester Square and my husband was training there on his work break and I didn't know he was going to be my husband, but I saw him, we noticed each other and he was just so nice and gentle. I felt like I have found. It was that instant connection. I felt like I found my best friend. But I still didn't.

Speaker 1: 1:40:12

Trust issues was so big for me at the beginning. He then, he was very slow, he didn't rush anything and he made sure he knew he definitely had found someone he wanted to pursue. So to him the whole act of sexual act. It wasn't his first priority when he came to me, I guess, and he didn't know my story. So slowly, slowly, I was opening up to him in terms of in a sexual way. And then once we sort of started living together quite soon, because he said, oh, do you mind if we just move in together? And I was like, oh, my god, this is happening too soon. He said you're having loads of nightmares, are you okay? And I'm like, yeah, well, I said there is a history. I said I've been through war and he still didn't know. And then he said I'd love to marry you soon and I knew he was going to propose. And he did propose and he took me to Florence and I said, okay, this is all well and good, but I need to tell you something. And then I told him my story. He's like, and he said babe, I love you. He's like it doesn't change anything. He said I have seen as a challenge. He said you're going to get better with time. He said I will help. So he's been my rock ever since and I literally deleted everything that happened to me in the past.

Speaker 1: 1:41:40

So when I did, finally, at the beginning of our relationship, I was intimate with James, my husband. I treated it as my first time because he deserved for me to be that vulnerable and relax with him, that I didn't want him to feel guilt or something that he's doing wrong or that I'm feeling like I'm being abused. So I tried to delete everything that had happened, just so. And then that was the turning point for me. Obviously, it just, you know, things flourish from there, but it was him. And then I also would like to say to your viewers which I haven't actually said it much in podcast, considering all the stuff that I've told everyone right now you and your listeners and your viewers about men please don't ever think I think less of men than women. I absolutely adore the male gender and I think we I as a woman appreciate the alpha in a man and their gentleness at the same time and their sensitivity, because the, the very gender that broke my trust in humankind, is the very gender that had regained and established that trust.

Speaker 1: 1:42:59

For example, my husband, my dad, my mentor, gil gil agoni. He's been my mentor for a very long time, 20 years of mentorship. Without him, I wouldn't even do the, wouldn't have done the book. It was his vision for me to have a book, his vision for me to do motivational speeches, everything I do now. It was his vision, so he's been my rock. Um, I love my father-in-law. He's my, like my dad. I have two boys and I've been gifted with two boys and so many other people.

Speaker 1: 1:43:35

Peter and Brian, Is that what you asked?

Speaker 2: 1:43:43

me. Yeah, it was.

Speaker 1: 1:43:44

So they're really good boys. They know my story. They don't know the details, but they know.

Speaker 2: 1:43:50

They understand.

Speaker 1: 1:43:51

They understand it really well because they did the sexual education at school. And one of them just he's very inquisitive and asks questions, but on that lesson he just withdrew himself. So I got a call from the school. They said is it possible that maybe maybe he's been molested or something, or is there something going on, something bothering him? And I was really shocked. I said what do you mean? They said because we did this lesson, we think that maybe something's going on in his head. So I said let me speak to him. I sat him down. I said you know, we always speak truly and whatever you say, I'd much rather handle the truth than the lie.

Speaker 1: 1:44:35

He's like I said what's going on? Why are you withdrawing yourself from a lesson? Why are you feeling? Oh, he said it was about sexual abuse. Mommy, and I was thinking about you and what they were saying and the traumas that people have and mental issues and mental health, how he affects them. In that sense they were talking, talking about the depth of it, and I was just thinking about you and how you might be feeling. And that really made me realize that he hasn't scarred my children. He has made them really gentle human beings and he's made them resilient and more caring. So I don't think it's too early for children to understand that there is evil in the world and to be educated in the sense that it exists, but if you identify it, to move away from it, and also it teaches them how not to treat women. You know, for me I've been very open with my kids and they definitely are little gentlemen so I'm so proud of them.

Speaker 2: 1:45:36

Well, listen, it's been a very different podcast for me.

Speaker 2: 1:45:39

This Obviously a unique story, but I guess it's been much more of a storytelling episode than, I guess, a kind of a back-and-forth two-way conversation, and I've wanted to interrupt as little as possible, which I'm sure those who know me all know is a very difficult thing for me not to do, and I don't really want to detract away from the story and go off on any other kind of directions or tangents, but I do always like to have some kind of actionable takeaway for my audience or some way that they can benefit.

Speaker 2: 1:46:11

And I guess, for the people who can't see for themselves taking your negativity to positive, sorry, your negative story to positivity, um, talk to me about perspective, because you could. You could look at your story, um, and, you know, live the rest of your life in, in of taking your own life, of taking the whole story to negative, negative, negative. Or you could be, as you are, a glass half full, absolutely more than half full, and taking it as a perspective that you know everything from now is better and you know I'm here to live life to the fullest. Maybe you wouldn't have used exactly the same words that I've used, but I'm sure you know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:46:57

No, I get it. I'm sure the listeners are getting your point. I think it's a matter of choice in life. So, regardless of what you've been through it could be domestic violence, could be struggle, injustice, racism you name it because we have been divided over the years by different things War divides us, religion divides us, color, all of these things so people have they can relate to struggle. So if they're struggling, that means they have been a victim of some kind. So being a victim of something I believe is definitely 100% not a choice because nobody wants to be a victim. But I soon realized that 100% not a choice because nobody wants to be a victim. But I soon realized that I really had a choice. It was a choice. We can stay a victim or we can be the survivors.

Speaker 1: 1:47:45

Once you're a survivor, you can't stay just on the survival mode and say I'm just the survivor. Then you have to thrive and succeed from it. Really everything in life I believe that we face it's not really meant to, it's not really meant for us, just to be punished and that's it. It's a lesson. So if you fail in business, you learn the lesson, so next time you do it differently. If you fail in marriage. People often say I've learned from it, it's a lesson. So, whatever it is that you are facing, it's really just a lesson for me. It taught me that monsters, for example, like we know it as children in movies, they're not they. They're not like we assume. They are actually walking amongst us, within humans, and you've got bad and good in everything. So it's about seeing good in everyone until someone proves you they're not that good thing that you saw. Then you have to remove yourself from that situation. But you always have a choice.

Speaker 1: 1:48:49

And somebody said to me how do you go about life? I say, well, if it, if it's meant to be, it will be. If not, I'm going to make it happen anyway. It seems like I think that's what was going on through my head and if it's meant to be, it will be. But I'm going to make it happen because I really wanted to escape. I didn't think it's going to work, but it's just a mindset thing, what really helps me and helped me at the beginning, and I try to make a kind of it's like a ritual now, and I say to my clients as well that, like, for example, in the UK, you wake up in the morning and this happens so much. You meet people. Oh my god, it's horrible today, isn't it? The weather? It's rainy, is this and that? I'm like, yeah, it's rainy, or it's snowy, it's windy, oh, it's too sunny. So I'm just taking it as something that people can relate to. Now you've already started your day with a complaint. How do you expect to go any other way if it's raining? I acknowledge it's raining. Do I enjoy rain? No, because my hair goes curly tops, but it's nature, I just get on with it.

Speaker 1: 1:50:00

So try to eliminate as many of the so because we are internally speaking to ourselves at all times. So being aware of the verbal, what are we saying to ourselves, is really important. Because you you, if you had a friend that spoke to you, the way you speak to yourself sometimes oh, you're this and you're that. You don't look like this today and this and the weight and or without makeup, you don't look good. Can you imagine if your friend said that to you? You'd be like excuse me, don't, don't be rude to me.

Speaker 1: 1:50:30

So I always say why do you think you have permission to put yourself down that like that? Because if you really go into your internal dialogue, you're quite nasty to yourself. That's really cruel. You are always listening, so make a habit of, every time you notice you've been nasty to yourself, just say I take it back'm beautiful, and then replace it with something that it's a good affirmation I'm beautiful, I'm grateful, I deserve this. And so, starting your day, for example, I said to you this when we walked in what's really important is and I learned this from my experience when I would wake up in the morning, and every morning I wake up from nightmares, and every morning I wake up from nightmares. So this is like day in and day out. I am feeling so tired because I haven't slept well and I've been reliving everything in my dream. So there is a choice I wake up and I feel sorry for myself for the rest of the day. Or what I've noticed that really helps me is stay away from the news. Listen to a podcast that inspires you.

Speaker 2: 1:51:33

Like Matt, yeah, listen to a podcast that inspires you.

Speaker 1: 1:51:35

Like Matt, yeah, listen to a podcast, but for me, what I do is I listen to music. Put the music on. Either I go for a jog or I just I just want to listen to something that uplifts me. So try on this first period of your time in the morning, when you wake up, to set your day right by listening to positive stuff and and then the rest will follow. And if you're already feeling positive, that's great. Just keep it up and just be aware of anything that comes your way or people treat you unkindly, or they whatever. You know, there's always stuff happening around us. I always say the way people treat you is not a reflection of you, it's just a reflection of them. You can only listen, observe and and and just let it go, because you can't change, you can't make everyone like you, you can't win everybody. You're not here to to do that. You're here to follow your calling and find what's your calling and and make a difference in the world well larata.

Speaker 2: 1:52:34

It has been an absolute pleasure to have you here to hear such a frightening yet inspirational story. I'm going to go and tell myself how beautiful I am and listen to a favourite episode of my own voice.

Speaker 1: 1:52:46

How beautiful.

Speaker 2: 1:52:48

But before we go, I guess just give everyone watching and listening a clue where we can find you online, where they can buy your book, how they can find out more if they want to get in touch anyone that's listening can actually reach me on Instagram or LinkedIn.

Speaker 1: 1:53:04

They're most welcome to connect with me or message me. I try to get back to literally everyone, believe it or not, and if they read the book, which is available on amazon only kindle and hard copy, then um will be great to hear the reviews on it. It's called unbroken surviving human trafficking by loretta lion and um. Feedback is always welcome. Reviews are always welcome. Please share online and then tag me and I'll reshare. I always reshare because, it's really, it's just.

Speaker 2: 1:53:37

It means so much to me when people reshare stuff we'll put all that in the show notes and the links and stuff anyway, and I'll look forward to reading my signed copy. So once again, lorada, thank you very much my pleasure man.

Speaker 1: 1:53:48

Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2: 1:53:48

It's been a pleasure thanks for listening to stripping off with Matt Haycox. I hope you've enjoyed listening to this week's episode, but please remember to subscribe or to follow and please, please, leave a review, if you can leave a review. That's how we move up the algorithm, that's how we get to the top of the charts and that's how I can keep bringing you bigger and better guests that you'll love each week. Have you got any suggestions for guests? Have you got any burning questions you want to ask? Well, slide into my DM.