The FBI's Sleep Expert Exposes What's Truly Destroying Your Sleep

Today, I sit down with Dr. Leah Kaylor, a nationally recognized sleep expert, trauma-informed psychologist, and former VA and current FBI clinician who now travels the country educating military, law enforcement, and civilians about the science and strategy of great sleep. We dive deep into sleep myths, cultural stigmas, and practical solutions to restore your rest — whether you're a shift worker, trauma survivor, first responder, veteran, or someone who’s just sick of dragging through the day half awake.

Dr. Kaylor breaks down why sleeping with the TV on (a common practice) can sabotage your sleep cycles, how your brain stays active even when you’re “out,” and why so many of us have never actually experienced truly restorative sleep. We cover the neurological impact of background noise, blue light, lyrics, and ASMR sleep videos, and she offers clear, science-backed alternatives for better sleep environments — from blackout curtains to white noise machines and even smart bulbs.

We also tackle the unique challenges of military and first responder schedules, with actionable insights for those working rotating shifts or overnights. Dr. Kaylor explains how long-term night shifts affect our bodies on a cellular level — including their connection to cancer — and gives tips for reducing harm. She shares tools like the TimeShifter app and previews her upcoming book The Sleep Advantage, offering a tailored sleep guide for those in high-stress careers. 

https://www.drleahkaylor.com/

_______________________________________________________________________________

Website: https://coupleonukes.com

Email: coupleofnukes@gmail.com

Instagram: @coupleonukes

Want to be a guest on Couple O' Nukes? Send me a message on PodMatch: https://www.podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/1726279485588093e83e0e007

Sign Up For A PodMatch Account: https://www.joinpodmatch.com/coupleonukes

Exodus Strong Custom Link:
https://exodusstrong.com/?a_aid=ExodusCON

Honor Your Heart- Quit Smoking: Use code 15OFF and the link below for 15% off

https://www.honoryourheart.net?aff=290ca17d55b89391aee43ace59dd7f760656bb652139ba81a02b008b2dac9cc5

____________________________________________________________________________________

*Couple O' Nukes LLC and Mr. Whiskey are not licensed medical entities, nor do they take responsibility for any advice or information put forth by guests. Take all advice at your own risk.

Transcript

 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode, A couple of nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and for those of you listening, not watching, I am sitting in a quaint, nautical themed bedroom. 'cause I am ready for bed, I'm ready to sleep, and I believe that sleep should not I. Be kept top secret.

And that's a reference to today's guest. We're gonna be talking about all things sleep related. We're gonna get into some interesting, a lot of small things that are actually destructive to your sleeping habits that you may not recognize initially and get into a bunch of other things, both physical and mentally as well as socially.

So here today to help us with that. Leah Kaler, so great to have you here. Thanks for having me. I didn't put two and two together that you had the bedroom behind you. That's, that's adorable. You are prepared. I am ready, but this is not an episode you wanna sleep on or during. And uh, the whole idea is that afterward though, you would definitely be able to do so better than before listening to this.

So please go ahead and tell us a little bit about what qualifies you as an expert to tell us how to sleep better. I. Ooh. Okay. Good question. So, uh, many moons ago I worked at the Memphis VA Medical Center in their sleep clinic, and that was, hmm, six years ago. And while I was there, I got a chance to learn all about sleep hygiene, all about obstructive sleep apnea, nightmares, insomnia, and then basically how to treat all of these various different things.

And so, while I was at the va, um. It. To give you a little bit of backstory, I was there for my residency year, and what happens is we have all of the interns and all of the postdocs come together in a room because during your year long experience, there's lots of different rotations, there's lots of different experiences, and everyone's got a lot of different preferences.

So we all go into a room and we don't come out until everyone has rotations and are relatively happy. And I, there were like two rotations that I definitely wanted, and I wasn't leaving that room without them. But after that, I was very flexible with all the other rotations I was gonna get. And I can't remember if sleep was one of them that I actually cared about.

I knew it wasn't my top two. I can still remember which ones those were. But otherwise, yeah, I can't remember if sleep was just one of the ones that I compromise on that someone needed to go to, or if it was one that I felt strongly about, which is just kind of sad that I can't remember that. But I could not be more grateful that I had the opportunity to go and to learn all about that.

And I have not. Always been the greatest sleeper. Now I am. I'm really good. I definitely follow all of my own rules and instructions, but I think that that just goes to show that there's, there's a lot about sleep that we don't know, and there's a lot of things that, I think there's a lot of myths out there about sleep and things to do and things that are gonna help you.

And when I was at the va, I just realized how many people are struggling with sleep and that. People are afraid to wear their CPAP machine. A lot of folks feel like claustrophobic with that on or as I was doing, um. Sleep hygiene. There were a lot of people just falling asleep in my class. Like very blatantly obvious.

Like, there's not that many people in this class. Like, I can clearly see you falling asleep. Right. And it, it kind of is what it is. Like there are just so many people who are sleep deprived. And so, um, after spending my time at the, the Memphis VA Medical Center, then I came to the FBI as a full-time psychologist, and my supervisor had asked me, okay, Leah, you know, what's gonna be your thing?

And. I had at that time, you know, that was 2020 I was thinking. Well, we're getting better and better whenever it comes to stigma around mental health. But there's still a lot of that, let alone, you know, you get into the law enforcement realm, let alone you get into the FBI realm. And so I was just thinking, I imagine that there's not gonna be a whole lot of people who wanna talk to me.

'cause even in, in real life, you know, you say you're a psychologist and people are like, all right, I'll see you later. Like, you know. Yeah, for sure. They're just afraid to talk to you or that you know, they wanna know if I'm analyzing them, they wanna know if I'm gonna write a report about them or a dissertation.

Everyone, the answer is no. That's more work than I need to be doing. But I think people just in general are like maybe a little bit afraid of mental health professionals. So. What I said was, well, how about this? How about we make sleep my thing? Because everybody can relate to having a poor night's sleep.

Whether you are in chronic pain, whether you have a stomach ache, whether you have a dog that needs let out in the middle of the night, everyone can relate to having a crappy night's sleep. And then, you know what it feels like the following day, let alone those people who continue to have a poor night's sleep night, after night after night.

And um, that was just a really great segue for me to do. A lot of education within the bureau and to touch a lot of people who had issues with sleep and then later eventually found out like, oh, actually, like she's cool. She's not gonna make me go, like, lay on her couch and tell me all about her, like your childhood.

So I think that that was really like getting my foot in the door to tell people about sleep and the importance of sleep, and then to build that. Familiarity and for people to then feel that I'm trustworthy enough for them to come and talk about their mental health issues. So I would say that that's where it all started.

And so I've been doing this now for over five years, and I travel all across the country, sometimes all across the world to talk about sleep and to tell people all about how incredibly connected it is to. Everything, really. Everything right. Right. And I know in the VA you definitely got a lot of sleepless veterans there for sure.

But I wanna side pivot too, so I know we all know that one parent who has to show off their kid and I'm like that person, but with my dog, 'cause you said waking up and walking a dog in the night. So I have to show my dog. Oh, hello. I am a dog dad. And. We went to the vet this morning, which is why I'm tired, but at 5:30 AM they decided to empty the dumpster and uh, the loud noises.

Uh, I woke up to a lot of barking in the middle of the night. There's not many things that my dog would bark at. Loud. Yep. Bangs and crashes outside the window are one of them. So I, I can relate to the, um, luckily I fell back asleep, but there are many times where I have not fallen back asleep. And there are many times where the raccoons fight in the trees outside my window and then the dog box all night.

And I cannot fall asleep. So I can definitely relate to that. And I think one of the things we've talked about on the show, which is interesting, I mentioned in the beginning socially some of the social dynamics around sleep. You've mentioned some of the stigmas around it, but yet the relatability, at least I feel like there, there's becoming a trend, at least in the military, and I think in college as well.

I've observed it. This idea of. Less sleep is more bragging rights. It's a competition of who can sleep less, who can have the most energy drinks. I, I had, uh, one of my employees showed up the other day. I had three energy drinks last night. All I mixed them all together and I'm still alive and my heart was pounding.

Who are you bragging to? I, you know, I'm not, I'm a little impressed, but not very, like, you should get your sleep, you know, but it's kind of become this thing where. Also we see, and I've experienced this as an entrepreneur myself, kind of villainizing sleep. Like sleep is for the week. You know, we gotta work, work, work, work overtime, put in more hours.

And I definitely can respect the grind and hustle, but we need to acknowledge our self-care and health as well. So I think there's a lot of social dynamics that play into sleep just as much as. Other things such as, you know, you mentioned lying down on the couch and talking about childhood trauma to a therapist.

But yeah, that can be a cause of sleep deprivation. Trauma. PTSD. Yes. Mental health. I want to start with, as I was scrolling through your Instagram earlier today, you had, oh Lord, a clip about, um, sleeping with the TV on in the background. Yes. Now this is very common for. People advanced in years who, uh mm-hmm are older and they tend to fall asleep with the news on.

But I know plenty of people who require background noise or who just like to sleep with the TV on. Maybe we're sleeping, but what's going on behind the scenes? Are we actually getting a, the level of sleep that we need or is it detrimental to our health? I love your question and the answer is. I recommend that you don't, but let's talk about it.

'cause I think there's various different levels, right? Because I've spent my career with veterans, military, active duty, and law enforcement, like first responders. So I understand that when it comes to those populations, silence can actually feel very scary and it can feel unsettling. And so. Sometimes, you know, when I give my sleep lectures, I try and give people a lot of options.

So I love earplugs. I have a pair that I'm obsessed with. I'm not sponsored. They're called loops. Quiet too. Those are my favorite. I wear them every single night. I travel with them. I have a pair at home and my travel bag and my purse, they're amazing. But for some people, they don't like to having something in their ear.

For some people, total silence is very scary, and so we have other options. So. Let's talk about why sleeping with the television on is bad, and then I'll give you some other options. So first and foremost, whenever it comes to the tv, and I hear this all the time of like, people grew up watching tv, going to bed, they can't fall asleep without having the TV on.

Mm-hmm. Um, I'm not listening, you know, it's just, it's just background noise. I've seen this one a hundred times. Okay. Here's the thing. Your brain. Is wired to interpret language. So when we have the TV on, and it is, whether you've seen it a hundred times or not, your brain thinks, oh well this must be something that I need to be paying attention to.

So even though you may fall asleep, you are not getting into the very. Deep restorative stages of sleep where your body actually is repairing itself. It's restoring your energy. It's doing all those really important functions at night. It's not able to get there because it's busy listening to the television.

Also, whenever we have the television on, there's other things going on too. So this may sound kind of gross, but your eyelids are actually very, very thin. And when they're thin, well, obviously everybody's are thin, unless you're wearing some type of eye mask or you have like the covers up over your head.

Then from the TV we're getting flashing like colors and right motion, so that's also disruptive to the brain too, and that can cause micro awakenings. Also too, sometimes the sound of the television show is like this, but then the commercials are super loud. And so there's just a lot of different ways that the TV can be very, very disruptive to us.

And so again, that's just so many different ways the TV is preventing us from getting into those deep restorative stages of sleep. So what I recommend to people is, again, there will be people who talk to me and they say, I cannot sleep without the television on, okay, if this is you, we're gonna do baby steps.

So we might. Instead of sleeping with the television on all night long. Maybe we'll try and set a timer for your television. 'cause most do have that setting, maybe, we'll, we set it for an hour and then for, maybe we'll set it for 45 minutes and then 30 minutes and, and littler littler amounts of time until we can get to the point where we don't need the television anymore.

And that will take a while for some people, especially if they've been doing this for. Their entire lives. 'cause I think that that's a lot of people who, they just kind of even grew up as kids doing that, but. I think that once you understand the science behind it, and that's really what I'm all about is explaining, okay, you may have heard sleeping with the television on isn't good for you, but why?

Okay, well here's the science why, and hopefully that makes a little bit more sense to you because the brain, I. You know, uh, I think a lot of people think about, you know, whenever you turn off the light switch to go to bed, that you, you turn off the light switch and everything gets dark. But I think a lot of people also think that you turn off the light switch for your brain and for your body, and it's just dormant and there's nothing happening.

And that couldn't be further from the truth, like. What we're doing at night is so incredibly important, and it may even be more important than what you're actually doing during the day too. So if you are shortchanging yourself by keeping the television playing all night long and you're just getting more surface level sleep, you're really doing yourself a major, major, mm-hmm.

Disservice. Now, again, if we've got like two ends of the extreme right, we've got the television listeners and we've got the complete silence. So if you wanna find some type of happy medium, what I would recommend would be. White noise. There's like all kinds of colors of noise now. So picking something like that, picking some nature sounds, and those are going to be fine and they're not gonna be disruptive to the brain.

Usually they kind of stay at a very consistent level. They kind of mask any like little. Creeks or cracks that maybe like an old house might have, or if you've got, you know, somebody who lives on top of you because you're in an apartment building, it can kind of drown out some of those things that might otherwise wake you up.

Um, nature sounds are perfect because those are things that we would actually find in our environment. So like rain sounds, uh, ocean, sounds like crickets. Anything like that, that's perfectly. Acceptable because those would be things that we would hear in an environment. Whenever we get into music again, we're getting into something very similar.

Whenever there's music with lyrics, again, the brain is listening, it's interested, it wants to hear what. What the music is, what's the message? Right. You know? And also too, when we get into music, maybe this song means something to you or maybe it brings up memories. And so again, the brain is busy doing this non-necessary task when it really should be getting into the deeper levels of sleep.

And there's some research out there to show that whenever it comes to listening to music, especially just instrumental music. While it is less harmful than listening to music with lyrics, again, your brain is still interested. It wants to listen, it wants to know what's coming next, what are the patterns, what are the different sounds, and so it's just, it's still interested.

So that's why I recommend things like white noise or ocean sounds or nature sounds because those are things that are. A little bit less interesting to the brain, but can still mask any sounds that may be happening in the environment. So I would say that you kind of have a continuum of various different things that you can pick and choose from, and I recommend just experimenting again.

If you're someone who like thinks that you've slept with the television on your whole life and it's not bothering you, test it out for a couple of nights and I. If you're someone who's been doing this for a long time, obviously it's a very ingrained habit, but one of the things that I've learned in all my years as a sleep expert is people don't know the difference between like a decent night's sleep, which is probably where they're typically at, and much better sleep.

That is definitely achievable. It's just you have to make changes. Yeah, for sure. And there's, there's a couple things I wanna address. So the first is a myth busting 1 0 1 here. So talking about the TV and sleeping. I remember this is a very distinct memory. So my youngest sister had fallen asleep watching Godzilla versus Mora and Batra, and I was gonna turn the TV off and my father stopped me and he said, no, Mr.

Whiskey, if you do that, it'll be harmful to her. Or wake her up. Like if she fell asleep with the TV on and needs to stay on, you can't turn it off. Now, you mentioned a TV timer, so I'm curious, what is the truth behind that myth that my father said if you turn a TV off, it will wake that person up. Is that true or false, or?

I think that this is a myth. Okay, so let's, you know, let's say for example, you've got the TV on and like the volume, the volume might be relatively loud. If you turn it off, it may be disruptive to the person only because they were hearing a level of noise and then you've turned it off. So. It could potentially be disruptive to them, but what I would argue is it's going to be more disruptive to their restorative overnight rest by leaving it on all night long versus just turning the TV off.

Yeah. And that being like a very quick, and then the person would get used to the silence or the ambient noise of whatever's going on. So I would say that feels like a myth to me. Mm-hmm. For sure. And, and, and Godzilla versus Patrick Moler is not the quietest movie you could watch either, as you can imagine.

Well, and again, your brain is listening, right? Like, even though you don't think that you are, like your brain is listening and that's taking that in. And so maybe then we end up with a dream about Godzilla. So yeah, maybe, maybe that's more disruptive than anything else is having dreams like that. Oh yeah, for sure.

And well, and, and then that gets to the point of, you know. You lose control of what's on the TV relatively if you just have like a regular channel on Sure. When you're sleeping and then it could transition show. Let's say you're a, a veteran, it transitions to a a war movie and play certain sounds that are triggering for you.

So I think it's definitely something to keep in mind. And then. You know, you mentioned the white noise. I know my dad was one. He still is one of those people where if not a fan, at minimum, he likes to play ocean wave sounds, you know, seagulls. Um, so yeah, I, I totally understand that, and we've talked about that before.

But what I think is really interesting, and I'm not gonna isolate this to just Gen Z, gen Alpha and, and the new gens, although I don't really see boomers and, uh, gen X and all the other ones taking partake in this, but the A SMR sleep videos, the. You know, and, and it gets pretty strange, you know, like girlfriend files for, or wife files for divorce papers and reads them to you as you fall asleep.

Like they have very, very specific ASRS for sleeping. And I think I. I mean, it's gonna be the same conversation where it's, you're listening to this and I know, but some people, a lot of people in the younger generations are relying on these to sleep. And I know for me personally, I don't like the idea of ever being put in a situation where now I can't sleep because I don't have, I don't, the idea of depend sleep, being dependent on outside factors that you may not have available, I think is not a good thing at all.

Right? You need to be able to sleep anywhere at any time. I agree with you. So I think that it is, we have to find this happy medium. So if it comes down to A SMR videos, that is very trendy right now, and I would say if you wanna listen to that until you fall asleep again, it's the same thing of like using a sleep timer.

I agree with you two. I. I don't ever like the idea of becoming dependent on something, but there will be people who just silence it by itself is not okay, especially when we're talking about our veteran populations or our first responders. And so just finding something that is going to be like the least disruptive possible.

And if that's your ceiling fan, it's your air conditioner, your, your seagulls, or your ocean noise, then that's perfectly fine. We just have to figure out something where you're sleeping, you're getting a good night's rest, and it's not something that's. Actively disrupting your sleep. Something else that we didn't talk about that's also very trendy right now is binaural beats so.

For anyone who's listening who doesn't know what that is, that would be something where you have to use some type of like headphone or like AirPods where one ear is hearing one specific tone, another ear is hearing another specific tone, and they meet in the middle, and they're supposed to be able to kind of.

Influence brainwaves to be able to put you in particular states. So if you do your research on binaural beats, there'll be ones for focus, there'll be ones for relaxation, ones for sleep. You know, you can find a whole catalog of various different ones. And again, I would say just for people to experiment with things like that and what helps them.

And there will be some people who really enjoy things like that. And there will be some people who you know, listen to ASMR and think, what the heck? You know, this is not relaxing or interesting to me at all. So I would just say, do some experimentation. I think that silence is the best, if that's something you can tolerate.

But not everybody can. Yeah. And then in a kind of parallel track to this lighting, uh, I know like for example, some, I know some military guys who need red lights to sleep now after serving on board a submarine or I've met young women who need to have a nightlight of some kind, or some people who need to have the bathroom light open.

So what can you say about, it's kind of the same track with the tv, but a little dis less disruptive to a degree, but in a different way. What can you say on that? Yeah, so I, I've also come across people like that too, for whatever reason, whether it is military or civilian. You know, I've people, 'cause I, before coming to the career track that I had, I still worked with a lot of folks in the community who had been.

Uh ha having a lot of traumatic experiences. And so I think everybody, there's a lot of folks out there, no matter your background, that having a light on just feels safer. And I've come across people who sleep with all of the lights on because that's the only thing that feels for them. And again, it's all about meeting the person where they are.

What does science tell us? The science tells us that the best possible thing is as dark as possible. So dark, that you can't see your hand in front of your face. Is that going to be intolerable for people, especially the population we're talking about? Yes, there will be people who, this is not okay, this is not safe.

I am now so much more stressed out because I'm in this very dark environment that I'm not gonna be able to sleep. So again, I would say there's gonna be a continuum if you can. The darker, the better. And that is when I recommend that, I recommend that people, you know, get rid of electronics or, you know, I've even taken it as far as, there are some things like the, um, smoke detector in my room.

There's a little light on it, like I've just taken a little piece of tape or a sticker and kind of put it over that and I. I like sleeping in complete darkness, but I realize that that's just not going to work for everyone. So if you can, you know, getting rid of things that emit light or putting like little stickers over them.

But if you need something like a nightlight, I. You know, depending upon how disruptive it may or may not be for you, you could get one that's like motion sensor. So if you're someone who needs to wake up in the middle of the night to use the bathroom, then you can have something that kind of lights your way without being on all night.

Or you could have a nightlight that. Is not motion sensor, but you can actually turn it on or off. And so if you need it on all night long, that's an option. And I agree with you whenever it comes to red light, so red light or amber light, that's gonna be much less disruptive to melatonin. And so, um, if you don't know where to find something like that, there are smart bulbs out there.

So that's actually what I have in my lamps, um, all around my apartment. And then I believe that you can also buy those for nightlights now, and so you can turn them. You can either have them permanently on as red or as it gets closer to nighttime, and when you're ready to fall asleep, turning them on red so that it's less disruptive to melatonin, but you can still see what's going on.

So again, I would say there's going to be people who don't have a problem with complete darkness. And if that's you, great. That's what the research tells us, is going to give you the best possible night's sleep. But if you're someone because of. Your experiences, trauma, whatever has happened to you in life and you need a nightlight, or you need red light, or you need all the lights on.

Hopefully we can get towards a place where we can, you know, take baby steps to, maybe the nightlight isn't in your room anymore, but it's out in the hallway and we can kind of still see it. So taking baby steps, but again, I get it. You know, my, one of my other specialties is trauma and trauma and sleep go hand in hand and it's all about just figuring out, okay.

What can we do to help you that is not going to be so triggering that then we're doing more harm than good. Right. And then I wanna combine, you know, that sounded like you mentioned electronic devices, so I wanna get into the phone conversation. Definitely because. We've heard a lot of different things about blue light and, and you know, all that stuff about how many minutes before bed.

We shouldn't use our phone about people waking up and checking notifications in middle of night and how disruptive that can be and all kinds of stuff in relation to our phone. So what can you say on that? Yeah, so I would, again, I am someone who, I've been this sleep expert for about six years now, and so I very much practice what I preach, but I get it, you know, when I'm talking to law enforcement and I'm talking to my agents, and it is absolutely not an option to have the phone outside of the bedroom.

I get it. I understand because you're on call 24 7, so we just have to figure out what's going to work. So one of the pieces of research that's out there tells us that if you can, if you have to have your phone in your bedroom, if you can at least have it arm's length away from you, that that is going to equate to a better night's sleep.

And I think the, the reason why is that it's probably less. Easy to, to grab it and to just check. So you can still have it in your room, but it's, uh, a little bit less temptation to just grab it and scroll if you're having a hard time falling asleep. So let's kind of talk on a continuum again of. If possible, you don't have your electronics in your bedroom.

So let me go back even further actually, and, and what we call the three S's. So the three S's, if, if y'all haven't heard about it before, these are the only three things that should be happening in your bedroom. It's also if you get into the sleep literature called stimulus control. So what we're, what we should be doing in the bedroom should only be three things, and it's our three S's.

It's sleep, sex, and sickness. Those should be the only three things. That are happening in bed. So, because what normally happens, and, and this is a fun game for me to play whenever I go and do my sleep lectures. I started this way back when at the va. I used to have a big whiteboard, and in the middle of the whiteboard I would write bed and then I would ask people, what are you doing in bed?

And you know, like I get like some like. Weird, anxious laughter, and like, you know, what is she asking me? And then people will be like, oh, I'm on TikTok, or I'm watching Netflix, or I'm reading, or I'm paying bills, or I'm doing homework. Like, ba ba ba ba, ba. You know, I get so many people, like the audience really starts getting going.

And then I draw lines from the bed to each of these various different things that people have talked about, what they're doing. And then, you know, ironically, a lot of people don't say sleep. Which is very interesting, but I'll tell people, okay, so if you get into bed and you have the option of doing all these various different activities, what is your, what does your brain think it's supposed to be doing?

Mm-hmm. And the answer is that the brain gets into bed and it's like, oh my gosh, look at all these cool things I could be doing. I could be doing work, I could be doing um, homework. I could be doing entertainment things. I could be doing social media. And so there's so many different options for the brain, the brain.

Is so incredibly complex and brilliant and just the most incredible thing on the planet, but also it can be kind of dumb sometimes too, right? And it can. No, I get you. And so whenever you get into bed and you have all these different options, the brain doesn't know what it's supposed to be doing. Because it's got, it's been trained to do all these various different things.

So what we need to do is we really need to dumb it down, and that's where the three S's come in. Sleep, sex, and sickness. So if you take all those other activities and go do them somewhere else in your home, then the brain starts to learn, okay, when I get into this room and I get into this bed and I get under the covers.

There's only a few options for me. Sleep, sex and sickness. When I say sickness, what I mean there is if you are not feeling well, if you feel like you're starting to come down with a scratchy throat or something, listen to your body, go to sleep. Like the reason why we often feel sleepy when we're coming down with something is the body's natural response to.

Force you to go to bed because that's when it heals. That's when it tries to fight off whatever infection or or virus you're fighting off. So that's what I say whenever, that's what I mean when I talk about sickness is, yeah, if you're not feeling well, if you've got the flu, like go sleep. All bets are off.

Allow your body to rest and do what it needs to do. But otherwise, when we take all those other activities outta the bedroom and we do that consistently, then the brain starts to learn. Okay. This is, this is really my only option is when I get into bed I sleep. So with that being said, that's why I started there because all those electronics should already be outta the bedroom.

I. If you can take the TV outta the bedroom, I highly recommend it. If you can take, you know, your laptop or your work papers out of the bedroom, highly recommend it. Again, the brain can get confused. So if you're someone who, your bedroom, and let me say this, I get it. I used to live in New York City. I used to share a bedroom, so I get it when.

Some people who are listening, your bed is probably your couch, your bed, your, your place where you hang out, your, your library, like all the things. I get it. I lived that once and now I have the luxury of having a full apartment. So if you are that person, there are still options for you. You know, you could maybe sit on the other side of the bed or making sure that you're always staying above the cover so your brain kind of has a little bit of a differentiation.

But if you're someone who does have the luxury of. Doing things in another area of your home or your apartment, then you should be doing everything else outside of there. So if you're someone who likes to like do exercises in your bedroom, stop doing that. Go somewhere else. Because again, we want the brain to know when I get into the bedroom, this is the only thing that I do.

So whenever it comes to blue light, we're gonna hear a lot of different things about blue light. Again, I like to come back to the science. So why is blue light harmful, or why is there so much hype around blue light? The reason is is because blue light is the same wavelength as sunlight. So if we think back to our caveman ancestors, how did they know when it was time to be awake?

Right, the sun came up and how do they know when it was time to be asleep? The sun went down. And so our brain, we as a society have come very, very far and we have so many incredible advances, and we can have light and blue light anytime we want, anytime of day. So our brain still has that circadian rhythm.

It still is wired the same way as our caveman ancestor, but now we are able to confuse it. Very, very easily. So when we're getting close to bed and it may be aligning with the sunset, you know, I'm just thinking right now it's summertime and the the sun is kind of setting where I live, like around 9:00 PM So that's also the time where I'm starting to feel sleepy because I'm very much in a tune with I.

When the sun comes up and when the sun goes down, like that's what I've trained my body how to do. But if I have all of my lights on and I have my TV going and my laptop going, and my phone is like two inches away from my face, that blue light is coming into my eyes, going back to the super charisma nucleus, and it's saying, Hey, turn off that melatonin.

Look, the sun is out. Turn that off. And melatonin is our hormone that tells us it's time to be sleepy. So that's why you're hearing all that hype around blue light now. If I, in a perfect world, you would be turning off your devices like an hour before bed, and I get that that's not realistic. For some people, whatever they've got going on in their life, or maybe their phone or their screen or their television is the way that they like to wind down for bed.

Um, you know, there's, there's a very trendy thing going on right now. So blue light glasses have kind of had their moment and. I think that a lot of blue light glasses, and you'll find this too with the American Academy of Ophthalmology, that blue light glasses, unless they are blocking 90 to a hundred percent of blue light, they're probably just a fashion accessory.

Yeah. Um, normally the ones that actually work are. Unattractive and expensive. Um, and most people are probably getting them for $5 and they look pretty cute, so chances are they're not actually working for you. But another trend that I'm seeing right now on the internet is people wearing sunglasses in their home before bed.

And so if that's what's available to you and that's what you want to try out, go ahead and give it a go and see, um, how that works for you. But the, the best possible thing that you can do is yes, stopping blue light. An hour before bed, and maybe during that period of time you listen to an audio book, you read an actual book, maybe you do, um, some stretching.

Maybe that's when you take your shower, you do your hygiene things or you're, you're getting your lunch or your clothes ready for the next day. So that's what I would recommend for people is to try and get away from screens and, and keep those things outside of the bedroom. Again, whenever we come to our, um, veteran and military and first responder populations, a lot of times the yes, the phone has to be nearby because they may be on call, they may be getting calls all throughout the night.

And so, uh, something that would be worth trying out would be having a do not disturb setting on your phone. But when you go into that, there are more settings that you can get into. So for me, I'll have it on do not disturb, but I may have one person who's allowed to call me who that. Call will actually go through, and so you can work with the settings and see how to make that happen.

Because I don't know about you, but I get like spam calls all the time. Yeah. I get like all kinds of junk emails, junk text messages. Right. And not only will that beep on my phone, but then it also beeps on my watch too. And that's just very, very disruptive. So if we could. At least cut it down to having it on do not disturb and having either like the office number or the supervisor's number, or somebody who would be getting in touch with us who needs us, then that's another way where we can try and disturb our sleep as little as possible.

Yeah, for sure. I, I totally agree. And you mentioned sunrise, sunset. Mm-hmm. And I know there's a bunch of us, especially first responders, law enforcement, military who work rotating shift work. Yeah. What can you say to that piece where, you know, that's probably where most people are suffering from sleep deprivation or a struggle to fall asleep the most.

Yeah, so whenever it comes to rotating shifts, it's hard. Whenever it comes to night shifts, it's very challenging. There are certainly things that you can do to help yourself, but at the end of the day, we are meant to be awake when the sun is up and sleep when the sun is down. Like that's just how we are wired.

So no matter what, when we are doing overnight work, we are working directly against what our body is programmed to do. And also, I know that this. Is not great, but this is a statistic that I want to share, is that we know that working overnights is a known carcinogen, so there's research out there to show that the longer that we do this type of overnight work, the higher the risk.

Of developing cancer and that is, yeah, so that, you know, I, my book is coming out, it's called The Sleep Advantage. It's coming out on October 1st, and so I was really digging into a lot of this research to make sure that. You know, I'm giving people good information and Right. Sometimes it takes scaring people a little bit to get better sleep.

Yeah. And I know that there are a lot of folks out there who maybe don't have control over their schedules, and in the book, I also have an entire chapter devoted to leadership and how to schedule shifts in such a way that I. Are less disruptive to people. So if we're doing rotating shifts, one of the best ways to do it is start with day shift, then rotate forward into evening shift, then rotating forward into night shift because that's a lot easier on the body than going from night shift to evening shift to daytime shift, kind of rotating backwards.

That's so much harder for the body to get used to. Um, also, again, like just in my clinical work, the people who I see who do overnight shifts and for long periods of time. The harder it is for them to eventually flip back into sleeping the way that we were intended to sleep, uh, of being in the, in the nighttime.

So I think that it's important for people to know that, that the longer you stay on a night shift, that it does become more challenging to, to flip it whenever you know your lifestyle changes. You get a different job, you get a different shift, whatever the case may be, but some things that you can do to help yourself.

Because if you are on night shift, when you get off of night shift and you're headed home or wherever your final destination is, is to get those blue light blocking glasses. So those ugly, expensive, like wraparound, like big old sunglasses that are usually orange or red, those are gonna help you because when you're driving home and probably the sun is.

Rising or it's already up, then that is going to be the same thing. That blue light's getting into the eyes, and you should be feeling sleepy when you're going home. But if that blue light is coming into the eyes, then it's telling you that it's time to be awake. It's time to be alert. So we need to counterbalance that.

Also, whenever you get into your bedroom or wherever you're gonna be sleeping. We want it to be as dark as possible because again, it's not in our nature to be sleeping when it's daylight outside, so that might mean getting blue light curtains, or not blue light curtains, excuse me, blackout curtains, right?

Or blackout liners. Just making sure that like any windows that you have are really well sealed off. Another really good tip is. If there's still light coming in from under your door, you could get some weather stripping and that can help block the light coming from under the door. But it also can help with a little bit of noise cancellation.

And same thing whenever you're sleeping in the daytime and most people are awake, then that's when we're gonna hear like traffic and lawnmowers and like all kinds of things going on in the daytime. Yeah. So we might need. Even though people may be kind of phobic of earplugs, maybe you need earplugs and you need a white noise machine.

So you might have to up your game just depending upon how noisy it is, where you live. And also depending upon your living circumstances, maybe you have people in the home, maybe you've got kids. And so it's really important to be able to communicate your needs with those people of, Hey, you know. Daddy's gonna be sleeping from this time to this time.

You know, can you play quietly, uh, over in this room? So it's really important that people know maybe we put some type of do not disturb, sign on our door so people don't knock or just kind of bust in. So those are a few things that I would say, um, can help people. And also one really, uh, cool thing that I have come across is the time Shifter app.

So time shifter. They started out with a jet lag app, and it's really useful to help people move from different time zones. But then they developed an app for people who work shift work because it can be very challenging. And I have an entire chapter in the book about shift work, but I can't cover every single circumstance that may potentially happen.

And so what's very cool about this app is that you can put your information in your schedule, like the various different times, and even if your schedule is changing, and it will tell you. When you should be awake, when you should be asleep, when you should be taking caffeine, when you should be getting sunlight.

And these are gonna be really, really important to get the best possible rest you can, that your schedule allows by having this very custom, tailored, uh, program that's made for you. So that's very cool. And I think that, um, that's just, I hope the future of what we're gonna see more of is if we have to be working shifts, how can we make it as.

Least impactful to our sleep as possible. And I think things like the time shifter app are gonna be, uh, a fantastic way for us to do this. That's definitely a useful tool and something I wish I had in my previous, uh, occupations, 'cause I never heard of it. I would never even think, uh, to be honest as a, as a person working shift work.

Like, I wonder if there's an app for this, although I know a lot of people nowadays say, is there an app for this? You know, so there's an app for everything now. And so I'm, I'm glad to be able to talk about this and, and hopefully there are people kind of in your shoes who are thinking, oh, that would actually be really useful to me.

Um, just depending upon. How their shifts are changing, how they're rotating or like trying to develop, trying to balance, excuse me, social life and the job. And so I think that that can be, uh, really, really useful for folks. So yeah, go check that out. Time shift or app. Yeah. And then you also mentioned your upcoming book a few times there, so I'd love for you to tell us a little more about that, what we're gonna get from it, and really what it covers.

Uh, obviously sleep, uh yes. You go into a little more detail for us. Absolutely. So I am. So excited. So what happened? Let me rewind. I do lectures all across the country on sleep and the importance of sleep and kind of exactly what we're talking about here. And I went to a first responder conference back in October and someone was like, Hey, this was fantastic.

My best friend couldn't be here, but she's the one who really needs this information. Do you have a website? Do you have a handout? Do you have a book? And I was like. You would read a book about sleep if I wrote it. And basically like after having that interaction, I'm like, okay, you know, I've devoted my career to this and I've worked with a lot of people and I've helped a lot of people, but my time is very limited.

I only have so many hours in the day. Right. And that means I can only. See and help so many people. So I thought, all right, Leah, let's do this. Let's write a book. And after about two months, everything was taken from my brain and put down onto paper, and it's a very long book. It's probably about three 50 pages now.

However, what I want this book to be is. Something that is going to be very, very comprehensive. So the first book is called The Sleep Advantage. It's coming out on October 1st, 2025, and this is the first responder edition. Book number two is gonna be the military edition. These are gonna be still very similar, but they're gonna be different.

They're gonna be written through the lens of each of those populations. But nonetheless, you can still, even if you're a civilian, you can still gain a ton of information out of these books because sleep is sleep and it doesn't change. That much. But I do, uh, address very specific things like nightmares and restless leg.

But also, you know, when we're talking about the military population, I talk about sleeping on deployment and TBIs and jet lag. So the, the books are similar, but they are different catering to each of the populations. But what I start out with, and this is how I start a lot of my lectures, is just. A little bit of scare tactic because I think that a lot of people don't realize how incredibly detrimental it can be to, like we talked about at the very beginning, wear this badge of honor of I slept two hours last night and well, you slept one.

Or you know, I think that this is just so incredibly toxic and there's research out there to show us that if you are. Sleeping so little, you are the equivalent of being intoxicated. That's how you're functioning, right? That's how you are coordinated. That's how you're making decisions. And think about it like we would never allow someone in formation or on the job to be visibly intoxicated, and yet people come to work sleep deprived all the time.

Yeah. So I start the book out with that, and then I generally give some education on. Why do we sleep? What's light sleep? What's deeply sleep? What's REM sleep like? Why are all these things important? And then I get into, and this is really what I think is special about the book, is it's a troubleshooting guide.

So I want you to be able to, if you're having a sleep issue, pick up this book and read the chapter about nightmares or read the chapter about night terrors or sleepwalking or whatever it is that you're struggling with, and have some. Actionable strategies that you can use tonight to start getting a better night's sleep.

So that's really what it's all about, is just I wanted it to be very, very comprehensive. And even if you're not someone who's a poor sleeper, but you just think that maybe you could improve your sleep a little bit, you know, I talk about alcohol and caffeine and naps and video games and blue light and all these different things that may be getting in the way that you don't even realize.

So I think that there's just a ton. Of very practical science-based information in there that everybody can learn something. And that's, that's really what it's about. And then at the end, I talk to leaders about what can you be doing? How can you do better? How can you be a model to. Encourage people to sleep and not keep perpetuating this stigma about around sleeping or this badge of honor, about only getting a few nights rest and pushing through with insane amounts of caffeine.

So that's really what you can expect from, uh, the first and the second edition. Right? So not just one book, but two books coming out. Two books, and there might be even more, but that's where I'm at right now. I'm working on number two. Right. And then. You know, you mentioned a lot of stuff that we're not gonna be able to get to video games, alcohol.

Yeah. Drug health. That stuff impacts your sleep. But we are gonna have your website and a description below. So what can people learn more there and, and what, can they work with you one-on-one or how does all that work? Good question. Yes. So I, I really believe in giving out as much education as I can. So I, I'm trying to go out on podcasts and, and tell people good tips and strategies.

Um, I also am working on putting out some social media content so you can get some really quick science-based tips. So you can find me, um, on all the different social media channels just at Dr. Leah Kaler. Uh, you can find me on LinkedIn. I do have a website. Um. Dr Leah kaler.com and then on that website, the book, uh, you can enter your email and you can get updates about when the book is gonna be ready for presale and things like that.

And then also, yes, there is the option to be able to work with me one-on-one. And there are a few packages on there about. Um, kind of the level of support that you need, whether you just need one meeting and you need this really tailored sleep plan. Or if you wanna keep meeting, um, time after time and, and really continue to hone in and focus and make sure that we're getting you to the best possible place that you can be with regard to sleep.

Because sleep does touch every single aspect of your life. So if you want peak performance, if you want to be able to have more clear decision making, right? If you want to be able to dominate in your field, like sleep. Is the secret weapon. It really truly is. And so those are the, the few ways that you can find me and you can connect with me and, uh, yeah, I look forward to it.

For sure. And I wanna thank you for going out on podcasts and promoting these resources to help people sleep better. I think it's so important, like you said, we're not showing up a hundred percent, uh, when we're sleep deprived. And like you said, oftentimes we see people show up to the workplace bags under eyes, or they can't keep their eyes open.

Or they, they, they stumble a little bit and you say, are you right? They're like, I'm fine. Or they just, you know, kind of throw on the bandaid of. You know, energy drinks and caffeine, but mm-hmm. Uh, Tim Thomas, uh, Australia Special Forces Sleep Expert. When he came on the show, he described it as alone. You know?

Mm. It's, it's not, it's not like you're giving money, you know, you are temporarily putting on pause what you, you know this, the rest that you need to get, and people just keep stacking on and stacking on so they're in sleep debt. Yes. So I think it's a very real thing. We do what we can to avoid that or to start paying back those sleep debts by.

Getting a good night's rest, not just decent sleep, but going that level beyond it. And like I said, there's a lot of other small things affecting our sleep that we weren't able to get to into this episode. So I encourage everyone listening, whether it's you or again, someone you know who could use some better sleep, which I think we could all use better sleep, always.

Yes, we can. Uh, please connect with Dr. Taylor so that you can learn more and stay up to date on those books. But Dr. Taylor, thank you for coming on the show today to share what you have already. My pleasure. Thank you for having me.