How Dance And Movement Heal Trauma And Unlock Ageless Living

Today, I sit down with Diana D. Devi, a clinical pharmacist, Argentine tango dancer, instructor, and founder of An Ageless Life. Ms. Devi combines her background in healthcare, nutrition, yoga, and dance to help women—especially postmenopausal women—reclaim their energy, set boundaries, and rediscover what makes them feel alive again.

In our conversation, Ms. Devi shares how movement and oxytocin are essential for connection, healing, and joy. We explore the transformative power of Argentine tango—not just as a performance art, but as a social dance rooted in presence, boundaries, and the experience of movement. She explains how tango became her lifeline during seasons of grief, divorce, and career transitions, and how dance continues to be a powerful tool for resilience.

We also explore the concept of living an ageless life: choosing vitality, momentum, and connection over the limiting narratives of age. From the science of movement and neuroscience to the cultural richness of tango, this episode blends practical advice with inspiring stories of how embracing new experiences can lead to lifelong health, confidence, and joy. Whether you’ve never danced a step or you’re looking for ways to reignite your own passions, this episode challenges you to move, grow, and step into life more fully.

https://anagelesslife.com/

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*Couple O' Nukes LLC and Mr. Whiskey are not licensed medical entities, nor do they take responsibility for any advice or information put forth by guests. Take all advice at your own risk.

Transcript

 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode. A couple of nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey. And today's guest I met on the new media cruise, formerly known as the Podcasters Cruise Podcasters at Sea, and almost a year later, I have managed to finally get back to recording together.

In preparation for, we're actually about to be on the cruise again pretty soon here. Excited for that. And, today's guest performed in a talent show that we had on the cruise. And we had chatted in passing a few different times. So I'm excited to sit down today, get to know one another a little bit more, and bring forward some awesome insights for all y'all listening.

So, Ms. Diana Devi, so great to have you here. And could you please tell us a little bit about yourself? Great. And I'm excited to be here. I am a little bit of a strange combination because I'm a clinical pharmacist by training. I'm an Argentine tango dancer and instructor. I've studied nutrition and yoga and all of those things.

But find that being able to share that, especially with women. And I work a lot with postmenopausal women. That really are at a point in their lives where they're trying to figure out what it is that's going to make them feel good again. And when I say feel good, that's a little bit of a, of an understatement because what happens with a lot of us, and it can happen with change, if you have a big change in your life, or it happens with hormonal shifts, is that you start to pull back and you say, who am I?

What am I, what, what do I wanna be? Where is it that I'm in the world? What I knew before is not working for me now, and where is it that I need to go? So I pull all of the tools that I have from my background and my own experience of going through that and help women be able to enjoy life, feel good, be strong, rather than being small and.

Enjoy the freedom that they have worked so hard to get.

Right. And I know earlier today when I was scrolling through your Facebook, a lot of mention of oxytocin. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Yes. Oxytocin. Okay. So it is a hormone, it's my favorite hormone, if you wanna know. And it's called, some people call it the love hormone, but it actually is produced naturally and gives us that sensation of feeling connected and loved and supported.

Primarily people talk about it or understand it with mothers when they're holding or nursing their baby. It happens with touch. And that's for me, when I really needed that oxytocin boost the most, I found dancing and dancing literally changed. How I felt about being connected. I mean, I was doing all of the other stuff too, but oxytocin was really something that is a lifesaver.

And for many people it's, and it doesn't have to, you don't have to go out and dance in order to get it. There are other ways. It's just that's my chosen modality. I kind of think it's nice because in Argentine tango we basically spend nine minutes, that's how long the three songs are hugging and moving on the dance floor, and then you get off the dance floor and you do it with somebody else.

So you mentioned finding dancing. How did you find dancing? I was at, an event and they had a couple that was demonstrating Argentine tango. And in other parts of my life, I'd always done some kind of dance, but it was primarily things that were solo. So it was like ballet tap I did some East Indian dancing, some ballet dancing, those kinds of things.

But you can't really go out and socially dance, those kinds of things. It's just. Right, no, no opportunity. So I saw Tango and I'd wanted to do it for a while, and so I just jumped in. I didn't know anybody, I didn't know where to go, but decided that, that's what I wanna do. And here about 18 years later, I'm still doing it and I love it.

One of the things that I feel like we can all agree is the biggest blockage for people getting into dance is, like you said, not knowing anyone and going out there. It really is putting yourself out there. Everyone's worried they're gonna judge every move, any slip up. And so when you talked about, going out there for the first time, did you struggle with self-conscious thoughts like that?

I did. To a certain extent, but what I decided was, anytime you step into something that is new. Approach it as somebody who is new and not expecting it to be perfect the first time. And I had lots of struggles with that when I first started dancing because I'm like, I did ballet for a number of years.

I did jazz, I did this, I did that. I should be able to get this. It's totally different. But having that compassion with yourself, and I'll tell you quite honestly. Most people aren't watching what you're doing because they're dancing too, and they're enjoying the experience of dancing and how it feels for them, rather than judging what it is that you're doing.

And after talking with enough people at some of the dances that I went to that really became apparent that we're here to dance. We're not here to watch for most of us. Right, right. I think one of the issues too is people never really start, and then it's even more intimidating when you're an adult.

I feel like if young people had more events where they danced, they would grow up feeling a lot more comfortable doing it. All we really have, at least from my perspective growing up, is you have at some schools, maybe you have a homecoming dance, and then at other places you have prom. Some places do like a eighth grade dance.

That's about it. And typically the only time people get on the dance floor is for the slow dance, part of the event. Yeah. And then maybe you have some people kind of doing the, the group dances, the Chacha slide and that kind of stuff. But the type of dances you're talking about, I feel like unless you kind of go outta your way to find those events, they're not very commonly found, at schools or other public gatherings.

And one of the things I wanna know too, is. There's a lot of different types of dancing and most people are familiar with tango. But you mentioned a very specific kind of tango. Yes. What kind of is the difference there with, you mentioned, is it Argentine Tango, correct? Yeah, it is Argentine tango and I chose Argentine tango for a reason.

There's American Tango and then there's tango, and those are more in the ballroom area. I chose Argentine tango, and the reason I chose that is because it's about the experience of dancing rather than the experience of performing, and it is much more accessible. I mean, I've danced on four different continents.

Jumped into places and, gone dancing. And it's a really nice social network that you develop with Argentine Tango. So it has a lot of different aspects to it, but I preferred it because. It really is about you connecting with your partner, feeling and moving with the music, but also you move in a counterclockwise motion around the room, so you're dancing with everybody in the room as well as your partner and the music and it's just magical.

And in the beginning it felt a little bit intimidating. Absolutely true. But there are things that you can do as a beginner. And beginner lessons, beginner dances, those kinds of things that will minimize some of the angst that people have about moving and about doing it in a public setting.

Many communities are very accepting of new people because, they know their community won't survive unless people come in and join it. Right. So when you talk about more dancing rather than performing, can you kind of, expound on that a little bit? Yeah. In Argentine tango, they're not competitions like, there are, I should say, they're very few competitions associated with Argentine tango versus what there is in others.

So we don't have the silver, gold, bronze, platinum, whatever it is. All of those different levels of dancing. It's a social dance and it's it's social on the dance floor, but also social because you go there and these people become your friends. So it's an extended network of people that you know, and people with different backgrounds people that are interested in different things, but come together with that common focus of wanting to dance and connect.

Right. And I was thinking too, like you mentioned, if it's the whole dance floor is moving one way and part of it, then the competition has to be like a whole, dance floor at a time. That's a lot of people. And so obviously that's your favorite, but do you do other dance in like bachata or salsa or other dances as well?

I've done some of the others, I actually tried out salsa and I didn't like it because I, I didn't like it. When the leaders push you to turn, the way that they do that, I, I can't do seven turns and not get dizzy. So I think throwing up on your partner that's fair is probably not something that you really wanna do.

At least if you wanna dance for more than one. So I found Tango and I liked the music better. And also liked just the setting is a little bit different. A lot of the places that I found for salsa. In bars and people were drinking a lot and that kind of thing. Whereas most of the time when I go to tango events, there may be wine there, but generally it's in a studio or in a other place that's just for dancing and there's less of the focus on alcohol.

I personally don't drink, but. Even if I was drinking, I don't know how you could drink and keep your balance and move and do all of the things. I enjoy it as an art form and so I want to be, dance the best that I can and enjoy it. So, I think that's also a little bit different setting as well.

And there're also practice places. So there'll be, I think there's four different ones here in the Twin Cities where you can go and you just. Work on whatever it is that you want. It might be the way you do a certain turn or other moves within it, and you kind of practice with somebody. So that's really helpful too.

Is that kind of that safe space to be able to do that. For sure. Like you said, if you had to turn seven times and you've been drinking a little too much, that's definitely a bad combination. I can see that happening. I would not be good. Yeah. And so have you competed at all for anything in solo dancing or partner dancing?

I didn't, I did when I was dancing ballet, I was in an opera and then had done some other stage performances as far as that's concerned. But the competition aspect, not so much performing. I like performing. And the reason I like that is because you work on your skill and you spend a lot of time developing it, and you really get to play with the music and with your partner and those kinds of things.

So I enjoy that aspect of it, but I don't do it a lot. And usually it's just for. Six minutes, nine minutes, and then go from there. So, for me it's much more the social aspect. If you want to do performance or competitions, those exist. My Tango teacher lives in Buenos Aires. And he is competing in the world championship, and Buenos Aires is going on right now.

So he's in the, I think he's in the quarterfinals. I think that's where he is. And so he does it because it's fun for him and he gets to dance with his friends. So even then, it's very social for him. Right. For sure. And so in what ways, you've mentioned a lot about the social aspect internally. In what ways has dance really changed your life or impacted you?

When I came to dancing, I had been through a lot. My mother, my best friend, and my uncle who was my godfather. My mother died the day we buried. My mom, my uncle, who was a last remaining member of her family died, and then two months later, my best friend died. Followed by the next year. I went through and started an ugly divorce and a child custody battle.

And then the company that I worked for decided that they had been purchased by somebody else and decided to just get rid of the entire department that I was in. So you can say there was just a little bit of change going on in that period of time was a lot to process. A lot to process. And. I knew I needed to do something to get out and to, I just needed to do something. And for me, after seeing that and seeing the way that the people move together and how it made them feel, and I'll take just a second here. One of the things about dance that's really amazing is that even watching dance impacts the way that you feel and the way that you think.

So your body physiologically takes on the motion and the movement, and it does that in sports as well, at least for some people. But experiencing that kind of got me to the point and it was only like 10 minutes got me to the point where I'm like, I wanna do that. That's something that I could enjoy and I can step out and do that.

So. It was, and I, it was frustrating at first. I'm not gonna say it was an easy path and, but I decided that because I felt so good when I did it, even when I was learning that was enough for me to overcome the frustration associated with it. You mentioned children. Is this something that you've tried to introduce to your children or get them to do as well?

I my daughter happens to live in California. She does love dancing. I have taught at the university, there's a university in Minnesota, has a Argent Tango group, and I have taught with a friend of mine there for the past, I don't know, three years or so. So really having that reach out program for.

People to younger people to be able to do it. The thing that I think is really great about that is that in Argent Tango, we teach people to set boundaries because it is a close embrace stance or can be, which means my body is right up next against my leader's body. And for those of you who are just listening, my hands are together so you can kind of see they're touching.

There are other options. You can pull and create space, and either party has the option to make the choice, so it's not just one person decides and the other person has to go with it, which again is establishing boundaries. If there is somebody who asks you to dance and you're not comfortable with it, or your feet hurt or you don't like the music, it doesn't matter what it is.

You can say no. So that part I really like about helping people establish boundaries regardless of what their age is. I do some West Coast dance as well, west Coast swing, which is a lot of fun. And they also talk about that in that group as well as something being important because you're not gonna do something if you don't feel safe.

And having that much physical contact with somebody, even if it's just through the arms in the embrace, can be intimidating for some people. Could you elaborate a little bit on, because I, at least I'm not familiar with a lot of dancing styles. You mentioned West Coast swing, so what kind of differentiates that from other dance styles?

I like West Coast swing because it's a real kind of chill, relaxed. It's got this super cool vibe associated with it. It is very improvisational, which is one of the things that makes Argentine tango so great for your brain and for stimulating the pathways that make you feel connected. And those kinds of things.

West Coast Swing has some of the same things. The difference is the music is radically different because it's more of the modern music. Typically people, the followers don't wear heels, they usually wear flats. Whereas in Argent Tango, I'm walking backwards. Two and a half inch heels usually impressive, and it's a slot dance, so it's just back and forth in one particular row and they dress more casually.

So that is something that I think if somebody feels like Argentine tango is too much, it is more complicated than West Coast swing is. West Coast swing is a great, I call it a gateway dance because with people that I know and Tango started in West Coast. Okay. And then they progress into Argent Tango.

So interesting. And that is the Argentine tango, is that? Like, does Argentinian culture have anything to do with it? Or why? Do you know why it's called that? It's called that because it did originate in Argentina and there was some discussions about how and why and all those kinds of things, but it did originate in Argentina.

The current folklore is that the sailors that came into port in Italian primarily learned to dance. They originally started dancing with ladies of the evening, but would practice with each other, and then it kind of ballooned in this whole subculture that. Has been around since 18 hundreds, late 18 hundreds.

And it then spread significantly through film. And it was a big thing in the art deco, and that's where the American Tango and the other kind of tango, the one with the, where they have the rose clutch between the teeth and the dramatic movements from side to side. That kind of came out of this whole thing.

But it has been in Argentina for many years and it kind of goes. Up and down as far as that goes. But it's a very rich culture based on things that have happened and the whole vibe of the Argentine people. Okay. And so have you gotten into the culture through the dancing a lot more? Has it like kind of connected you and created a curiosity into the culture beyond the dancing?

Yes. So when I went to Argentina, I stayed in one of the oldest neighborhoods in Argentina where a lot of the beginning aspects of it had cobblestone streets. On the weekends, they'd have musicians out on the streets playing going to recto, which is the huge cemetery that has. Beautiful marble sculptures and very, is very rich in the culture and the way that people thought about people that passed on.

And it, I really enjoy the cultural aspect while I'm there and the people are absolutely wonderful. And they are very open about, well, we may not like your president, but we like you.

Which I thought was really funny, but you know, yeah. But it, it too is undergoing its difficult times from an economic perspective and the people, there are struggling with inflation and all those kinds of things, but they're still very sweet and very kind. Last time I went was back in 2023 and I spent time just going to neighborhood coffee shops.

I don't speak Spanish very well. I don't speak a lot of it, but. People were genuinely, you attempt to speak a little bit and they're, they smile and they try to help you out. And it was just I like the country and I like the people. I think you're being overly modest. I heard you when you were talking about your instructor earlier, like the pronunciation and all the accents.

It sounded perfect to me, but I don't speak Spanish, so I mean, maybe don't take my word for it, but it sounded really good, so, yeah. And what I'll say is do you know how to shag shag dancing? No. Okay. That's, I know I haven't met any young people who do it. Really. It's like a, I don't actually know how to do it, but one of the podcasters I listen to, he does it a lot in Myrtle Beach and , it's an OR style, it's also a group dance, which is why I brought it up and I know, I don't know if it's.

I'll say it's a part of Carolina culture. Okay. Fact check that everyone, but it's a group dance too, so I was just curious. Just 'cause I think it is a much simpler, slower dance. I know. 'cause I know. I don't know if older people like it because it's from their time period growing up, or if it's because it's so much easier to do.

It's a lot slower and more gentle, but it can still be a pretty in intense thing from what I know. I was just curious if you had heard of it or not. Well, I'll have to, I'll have to check it out. There's one of the really nice things about being in the Twin Cities of Minneapolis St. Paul is we have a lot of different cultures.

So there, there are Morris dancers, there are modern dancers. There. Are ballet dancers. There are, tango, salsa, bachata, west Coast, east Coast, I mean, just a whole grouping. So I'll have to check this out 'cause it, we have Morris dancers that go out on, on Mayday and do a, an event at the by the River Bluff.

So, yeah, I'll have to check and it probably is here. I just haven't heard of it. Yeah, it's definitely something new to try and I haven't be shotted in a long time, if that's a real verb. I haven't be shotted in a long time and, Okay. So you better, you better brush up on it because I will have by the time we go on the cruise.

So yeah, my plan is, I told all my friends, I was like, listen guys, I. This is like the easiest way to be cool. Almost no guys, at least on the cruise. I, we, we went on, I was like, none of the guys knew how to dance at all. So if you just learn a little bit, all the women were asking like, do any guys dance here?

We need a lead. And I was like, man, I wish I knew anything. And so like I told them, I said, by next year when I go on that cruise again, salsa, bachata, tango, like all of those need to be under my belt. I don't need to be the best. But if I'm the only one who can do it, then at least. Yeah. And I will brag a bit about Dawn she was one of the women in our group and she won one of the salsa competitions.

And so seeing the little trophy and it's it's a little trophy and it's shape of the cruise ship. I was like, man, all I if like, yep, that was my goal. Like I saw that and I got that bugging me as like, no guys knew how to dance. I was like. I've gotten into performing comedy, into singing, and it's slowly getting more and more worse in terms of my self-consciousness.

So speaking aloud, that's fine. Doing comedy, I was like, oh boy. Singing. I was like, this is way worse. Dancing. That's probably like top tier self-conscious for me. I been told, well, I, I'll tell you what I told my nephew, if you know how to dance, you will never, ever be short of women that are interested in you, ever.

It doesn't even matter what you look like really, because I know some of the, some of the guys within the communities that I've been in, you would look at 'em and you would think, eh, you dance with them. Totally different thing. So yeah, I agree with you. Well, to me it wasn't even just about being a, a chick magnet, but just the fact, I, I found it so sad that none of the guys knew how to dance.

And I feel like that that's part of toxic masculinity of that culture of like shaming man for doing stuff that quote unquote is, is more effeminate. And, so I, I definitely want to dance and my hope is that. Through my actions, my friends, especially my more, manly friends will be like, you know what, let's, let's, let's do it.

We see him doing it. It's, it's a good time. So I definitely do wanna make an impact through it. Like I said, never been quite the dancer in, I was enthusiastic for it. So when I was in middle school, seventh, eighth grade, we, during gym class, we did a thing called Dance Ember. So every December. All the kids hated it.

'cause instead of gym class, we would do dancing only. But I was like, you know what, this is something different, yeah. We do gym stuff the rest of the year, like least you just, instead of hating it and making it this dreadful month, let's just have a fun time with it. I got a little too enthusiastic and I rolled my ankle doing the electric slide.

My ankle just went and they had to take me out in a wheelchair. So that was that kind of killed my dancing spirit. And I, later on. About a year ago I went to a prom at an American Legion and youngest person there, full disclosure, everyone there was like these, these veterans, and they knew how to dance.

They'd been doing it for a long time. And I was just like a tree, like if you've ever seen a tree, try to dance. Like that was that. And I remember I bumped into this one older gentleman and he got so mad and he was like, you're, you need a, he gave me lessons right there. The mil, the old military way, like.

He's like standing at attention thinking he is like a, a drill sergeant. He was like, you need to move and be you're just standing there like a tree, and he was like, I got a, I got a little bit of a scold for that, but I was like, okay, definitely need to learn to dance. 'cause I don't want angry old military guys yelling at me anymore, I can't be, yeah, it's just, it, it is funny, you see it historically. You've got this young woman who's so excited to dance, polling some guy reluctantly by his arm. He is like, I don't know about this. So, yeah, I definitely wanna I've been watching YouTube videos, but I need to get out and get some real experience.

And I, I think, like I said, it's. Everyone needs to, I think everyone should try every type of dance at least once in their life. 'cause you never know what you'll fall in love with. I say the same thing about sports and all the creative arts. There's been a lot of things in my life that I would've never expected I was good at and I kind of had to do them for.

Some kind of thing, and I'm like, oh, I actually really love this. And it's like, even like in your case, I, you weren't going into dance expecting it to become the love of your life, right? You were just like, not at all a social event, so yeah. What advice would you give? I know you gave a little bit of advice, but like, what would you say overall to anyone who wants to get into dance but is feeling intimidated or.

Is nervous or worried about it, or is especially, you mentioned the frustration when you're first learning. Yeah. What, what could you say to that? Because I know with singing trying to learn and become a professional singer, I mean, the frustration emotions are so strong because you want to be good at this, you really love it, but you know, it's like.

If, if I'm, I'm dancing bad or I'm singing bad, it's like it's my fault and I just get this, self-hatred builds up and then those emotions physically translate into getting tense, getting stiff, and then just getting worse and worse. So what could you say about those frustration and, and self frustration emotions?

So a couple of things. One is putting yourself. Being kind to yourself in the way that you would to someone else. So if you are helping somebody to learn something new, you are not gonna say to it, oh my God, you did this terrible, you did this wrong, you did that wrong. You need to do this, you need to do that.

So taking a breath, and for me it was a habit pattern that I had to develop to say, how would you talk to your best friend? If you wouldn't say this to your best friend, then you don't say it to yourself, right? Mm-hmm. You find a different way. So that's one is kind of the whole thing, and give yourself kudos for trying something new that you're not an expert at, because it's easy when you're an expert at something to then uplevel and do it very, very quickly when you're starting out new.

It is, you have a lot of things to learn. You have a thousand more things that you're trying to figure out and interpret and bring 'em into your body and understand how that feels. So rewarding yourself for doing something new that you're not an expert with is something that's really important. It's like when you learn how to cook, you're not gonna make a 12 course meal with the souffle and all of those kinds of things in the very beginning.

No, you're gonna start out boiling an egg, make it, so start with things. Set your expectations of what you can do, and that helps immensely. I like to have people dance with themselves. That sounds weird, but even putting on music and just moving and, and people say, well, dance like nobody's watching.

I say dance to feel your body. Because once you start establishing that connection with your body and feeling, and I put on Alexa in the morning, we dance for three songs and then I'm off for the day. But connecting back to your body. So when you actually want to do something, your body is connected enough that it can do it.

And take a deep breath. When you start to get all up like this, take a deep breath. I created or I had. Another thing that I do is I had exercises that I did to build the muscle memory, and I just took some of the stuff that I was learning and just did it for five minutes a day, twice a day in my living room, and it was just like, oh, I understand how to move better.

I understand how it feels. So any of those things can really help by having compassion for yourself. And the fact that you're brave to step into something that's new that you've never done before is big for sure. I like that you said dance to fuel your body. 'cause I think when you do the dance, like no one's watching you, you almost like lose control of your body.

You kind of just doing it to do it rather than being aligned with it. And. I agree a lot with the, with the self-criticism. We are our own worst critics. And I, I was thinking as you said that like the looking at the way I talk to myself compared to coaching others is like. Right. With another person.

Always so lenient, like, no, you're doing a good job. Right? Like I'll say, you're new to this and stuff with me. It's like, why aren't you a professional already? Come on now. And it's like, we do hold ourselves to such, been in five minutes now. Why aren't you? Right. I, I was thinking about that and looking back in my life and I was like, wow, I'm, I'm very guilty of that.

And I think, I guess it depends on, on, on personality ties. This piece of advice is either. Set goals or don't? For me, I know that I like to set goals, so like I have a dance that I wanna learn and achieve. It's very oddly specific in the in the, I believe it's Hindu culture specifically.

Shiva destroyer, the worlds has this dance that he does a dance that is supposedly. Will destroy the world of dance that he does so fast and so fluidly that his body catches on fire. And the anime record of Ragnarok paid homage to that where he does that dance. And so I like a lot of cultures and a lot of religions have dance heavily incorporated into it.

Absolutely. You look at almost every, religion or culture you find has their own dancing styles and stuff, and I know in a lot of folklore about giants, they dance to feel connected to the earth and stuff like that. So it's very interesting and I know for me, like being able to do different types of dancing that are based off martial arts.

'cause I think it's really cool when I see people blend martial arts and dancing. For me, I want to get to that stuff. So I think for some people setting a goal and, and setting up the path there is good. But I think if you're someone who. You just want to, just dance to dance and, kind of find it along the way.

I think that's good too. But I know for me personally, like setting a goal, like, I, I, I want to learn bachata, I wanna learn now I gotta learn Argentine tango specifically, and yes. This Shiva, world destruction dance, for me that helps. And I think, and I'm sure you could agree to this.

In the same sense of like, I don't wanna say if one dance, you, you know them all, but they definitely build off of each other. I would, I would say if you probably experienced that yourself, like once you do one dance becomes a lot easier to learn more. And like you said, there's different layers of complexity.

And I, I think, like you said, starting off with stretching, with footwork, with, like you said, that muscle memory. And I think the dancing alone is definitely good. 'Cause I think most of us get caught up on the, all right, I gotta just go out there and find a partner and, and start dancing with them.

But I think dancing with ourselves and getting connected with our own body and feeling comfortable in our own body is definitely very important. And so you've been dancing for, you said about 18 years. And did this have any role in what you do with helping women and their, the knife and, and post menopause?

Or was it kind of separate? It movement is integral. It absolutely is a core part of it. We, the way that we move our bodies impacts the way that we think, the, our brain development, how we age our stress level, everything. So I add a lot of movements in, and many of them are based on, because I did yoga for years and I did have done breathing techniques and all of these things.

And all of these are about moving the body and I've studied a lot about neuroscience and how. The way that you move your body impacts where the brain develops and how it works. Clearer thinking, being able to have better memory. Just overall quality of life is associated with moving. Your body is happy when it moves because it was designed to move.

So stress levels go down. Tons of other things happen that are good. And who doesn't wanna feel good in their body? I mean, nobody wants their body to ache and hurt all the time. So the stretches and all those kinds of things play a key role. I also talk about finding a movement that you love because a movement that you love is something that you will stick with for the rest of your life.

And oh by the way, most of us will do exercises or whatever it is to build strength or flexibility or whatever it is in order to be able to do that thing better. So movement is really, I prefer dancing as a movement. I have clients that pickleball, they'd love to do pickleball 'cause they can do it with their kids, they can do it with their parents.

So it's something that is, but. They're doing training in order to build up strength, hand eye coordination, all of those kinds of things. So pick what it is that you find, and that's why it's important, like you said, to try different things. I have got, I was learning the fan dance, the martial arts fan dance, and, i'm, I'm getting ready to go back into that. And besides that, you get to do the fan and it makes the cool voice sound and All right. Which it's great, but martial arts is, is another thing. It's physical. You don't necessarily have to be into the heavy duty sparring and hit people, but the whole elegance associated with it and the groundedness and the intentionality and the fact that you have.

A series of movements that are put together for you to practice, and you get to the point where your body just does them. You don't have to think about them. You're moving with grace and ease and it impacts the other parts of your life as well. For sure. And so you run an ageless life. And I like that phrase because, I actually just posted yesterday on social media about, I had Tin Thomas Australia's.

Special Forces member, the oldest member in terms of, he was the oldest gentleman ever joined, and he said when he was 25, people said, you're too old to be a professional fighter. He did it anyway. When he was 30, they said, you're too old to join the Special Forces. He did it anyway. And he talked about a lot of people He.

Project stereotypes and, and their limitations onto your age. And I agree with that a lot. I get told all the time, you're too young to know this or to do that. And yesterday what I, I wrote about in my social media posts was with youth, typically people who associate you're too young to be successful, to have wisdom, to do knowledge, and with age, the older people, they tend to say you're not physically capable anymore.

And I think, I just know for a fact that's wrong because even just on my show alone, I have had 70-year-old men who hike mountains, who throw axes, who climb ropes. Like I always say, life is about momentum. The more you do and the more you stay in motion, the longer you live, because I feel like a lot of the older people that I've worked with or seen who it's.

Once they stopped, they just didn't, couldn't start again. It was too hard to start again. But all the people who stayed active and kept going, kept going. They just stayed so much younger. I, I really believe life is, like you said, about movement and about momentum, and that's why I worry with how much of a sedentary life.

People are living nowadays. Like I said, I always get up and walk my dog every set amount of minutes to make sure that I'm not sitting for too long. I always go for runs and different stuff, like, and if I have a week where I'm sitting even longer, then I go out, I run even longer. I, I even when I'm sitting, people ha sit next to me at the movie theaters 'cause I just move my leg up and down the whole time.

Like I just. Hate sitting still. I believe that life is about movement. And so why did you decide to, to call it an ageless life? Like when did you feel ageless, so to speak? So I started it I started looking at, at how I felt when I was in my fifties and I was tired. I, had difficulty thinking clearly, and I was just like, this is not my body.

I don't know what's going on. And, being a pharmacist, I went to a, a physician and she ran a budget test. I was super excited because I thought she's gonna tell me exactly what's going on here. She came back, she sat down across from me and she said, you're getting old. You need to get used to it and stop trying to be young.

And so I'm like, yikes. What? Needless to say, I was absolutely devastated and then I got mad. I got really mad because it's like, you know how you do the hands on the hips and you're like, you're not gonna tell me that whole thing. Yeah. And so I started investigating doing things and while I was doing all of that, I started teaching.

I was still teaching tango. I had some private students that were coming to me and some of the women were like, I, I know I'm here for a Tango lesson, but you've done some stuff where you look totally different than what you did before. So can you teach me how to do that? And from that it, it to me was, especially after about the third one.

I'm like, hmm, there's, there's something that the, the universe is telling me here. And that's when I went into starting an ageless life because I. It is not about how old you are, it is about the way that you live your life. Because I know people that are in their early thirties that are old, and I know people in their eighties who are young.

So it's, it's very much a personal decision that you make, and I'm not ready to blend into a beige couch. I'm just not, not happening for me. Right. I am helping people that maybe don't understand or know what they can do. And I have had clients in, in their, early, late thirties, early forties, because there's something that they need to figure out.

So a, an ageless life is really the way that I wish for us all to live. I think the issue with, when we all feed into that narrative, it becomes an excuse. I've had some episodes on my show where people shared that their doctors called 'em out and said, you keep saying, well, I'm old. This is supposed to happen.

This is supposed to happen. And he goes, honestly, you're just making excuses. You're using your age as an excuse to say, oh, well I'm old now, so I don't need to go for a run, or I don't need to do this. Right. It's just, it becomes an excuse. Same, same with youth saying, I'm, I'm too young to, take on such a project or such an endeavor.

It's, it becomes an excuse. And so I think it's important we don't feed into that narrative, or like I've, I've, I've met some people where they say, how old are you turning? They go, I don't know. I doesn't really matter. I'm still me. I'm doing what I do. So it's definitely interesting.

For me in my head, I'm 32, right? So I don't know why 32, but in my head, that's where I am. So when people ask me how old I am, I'm like, oh, I, I don't think I'm 32 anymore. But that's funny because when I, 'cause really mad when I turned 23 and people ask how old I was turning, I also said 32. 'cause people kept.

Saying they thought I was 30 when they listened to my show, or 32. And so when I turned 23, people were like, how old were you turning? I was like, I think 32. And then I realized, I was like, no, actually that's wrong. I was like, I just aged myself quite a bit there. I was like, I'm doing the opposite of what everyone always does, which is they always say years younger.

And I said, you older? So I said. I hope I'm not living like I'm 32, maybe mentally, but I hope physically not, maturity wise. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't wanna, I don't want my knees to be 32 when I'm 23, but when I'm 53, I do want to have 3-year-old niece, that's exactly right. Yep. That's for sure.

And you can do it. Yeah. And we'll see. Well, I'll figure out how good my knees are once I start my dancing lessons and dancing at home here. But I, I think. I really like your advice of dancing at home first. I'm definitely gonna do that before I just go out to a studio or a place. And how would you recommend for people to find the, like do you follow events pages?

Do you just look up, Argent Tango near me? Like how have you found success in finding events and locations? So, I, I use, social media to find places. And then sometimes I will also connect with another person that I know. For example, if I know somebody who is really into the dance scene in Denver, I'll send 'em a message and say, Hey, what's going on there?

I'm gonna be in town if something happening. But social media seems to be the easiest way to do it. You can do a chat, GBT or a Google search to figure out what's around or what is there. But then I always. And many places, especially here in the Twin Cities, will give you your first lesson for free.

'cause they want you to try it out. Hmm. Okay. So you go, you try it out and. If you don't like that one, that doesn't mean you don't like that genre. Try another one. Because I've tried, when I was trying out West Coast, I went to three different places before I found one that I really liked the energy and, and how it felt, but being able to just take a breath and say, I'm gonna enjoy this.

Walk in the door and go from there. I agree. Really social media. Yeah, I agree. Because, sometimes like the, the environment in the, in the studio just isn't for you or that teacher, i'm just gonna say patient. I'm thinking of the doctors teacher dance, or, relationship maybe isn't the right chemistry.

And I. What would you say about finding the right dance partner for you? Like do you have a main partner that you go to with all the events, or do you just go and partner up with, with whoever? And if so, how do you kind of choose? Is it, it just happens, they're like, everyone find a partner and you just get, booked with someone or do you kind of have something you look for or?

So, as far as. When, when I first started and now when I go, if I go for a class, I generally don't have a partner. Okay. I might, if, if there's something very particular that I wanna learn and I have somebody who I know, 'cause I switch roles, I lead some of the time and I follow some of the time. So I'll, I'll look for somebody who can switch back and forth.

Other times I'll just go as one role or the other and I won't necessarily have a partner. I will tell you, you will learn. To dance much faster if you dance with a bunch of different people, because if you just say to one person all the time, you begin to compensate for each other's. Skills or lack of skill in certain areas.

So dancing with as many people as possible works really well. When I go to a dance now, because I have so many friends, I'll text people and say, Hey, are you going? I'm gonna go, I'll be there at this time. But when I first started, I didn't. I just showed up. Whoever was there I would dance with. In Argentine tangle, we do this thing where we make eye contact and then you nod your head.

That's the more formal way. In some other communities, they'll actually just come up and ask you to dance, but it's, part of the excitement of it is you never know how that three set dance group is gonna go. Right, because the music is different. The way the partner is feeling is different. The way the movement on the dance floor is different.

So there's this little excitement associated with it, and I guess some people could call it dread, but I prefer to use it as excitement because right, it's like this is something wonderful is gonna happen. Having that kind of feeling and build up to it and understanding that. Especially if you are a woman.

Generally there are more men than there are women and men tend to take the role for leader. Women tend to take the role as follower, but don't be afraid to learn the other role. I can dance whenever I want because I do both roles. Hmm. And it's a lot of fun. I go to events out of town and if the leaders see me leading as well as following, I get more dances than if I don't.

Because they know, you know how to dance. All righty. Be fully versatile, fully, knowledgeable. In, in, in both. And I'm gonna add waltzing to my list of dance styles. 'cause I do like very classy events. I think waltzing is definitely. We could call it tame tango, maybe, it's I think it's a little bit slower, a little bit classier, but still some nice dramatic movements.

And it is, I think that I'll add that to my list. I guess I, I'll just try, one of everything that was the device I gave is the device I gotta follow. And the thing is, is when you do that, then you can find out what you really like. Because I did, I did chacha, I did bachata, I did, three or four of the other ballroom type dances, tried them out before and even during the time when I started doing tango and I, tango was the one for me.

Yeah. So ladies and gentlemen, I recommend finding what dance is for you or having that dance find you and then. Ageless life.com. We're gonna have that in the description below. Who should really work with you? What kind of women should reach out to you and kind of what do you offer? So I work a lot with postmenopausal women.

I also have worked with several women who are under a tremendous amount of, of stress. Usually they're, they're in their fifties, but primarily it's women that are menopausal or post. I have worked with men before, which I thought was kind of unusual when I have that is my thing. But and I have a couple of different ways that they can work with me.

One is. I'm actually launching it a little bit later. This in September is a three week reset course, which is a self, it's basically an online course. I have a one-on-one as well that I work with people. So if you're ready to make that kind of really significant leap in how you feel and look and able to really figure out what it is that your body can do for you rather than what it's stopping you from doing.

I'm your gal. Oh, awesome. Like I said, we're gonna have that website and description below where people can check that out. And Ms. De just great to have you here. Glad we finally connected. Like I said, I, you too have a bad habit of the in person people. I don't know. It just like, it's just like, all right, I, I, I'll get to them and, and then somehow it just never happens.

And, hopefully we'll record. Someone will record us dancing together on the cruise. Absolutely. A video of me on the dance floor and you're like, I don't know how this happened, and you're trying to pick me up. And hopefully, hopefully I won't post that one, maybe as a bloopers, but hopefully I'll learn by then.

But thank you so much for being on the show today and, and sharing. I think it's a beautiful message and I hope everyone listening that you were encouraged to try something new, to step a little bit out of your comfort zone and, and really expand your comfort zone because once you step outside of it.

And you start in practice, like we said, frustrating in the beginning, but once you get good of it, then you can really expand it more rapidly and more extensively. So whatever it is, wherever you wanna start, whether it's at home with an instructor watching some videos online first, get comfortable and, and get into it and, and try some different things.

It's fun.