Elevating Your Parenting: The Power of Understanding Temperament

HAPPY NEW YEAR! Happy Season 5! Happy 2 Year Podcast Anniversary! Happy Birthday to your host, Jacqueline Baird! The podcast is back after a brief end-of-year hiatus and there is a lot to celebrate...

To kick off a new season of the Motherhood Intended Podcast, Jacqueline welcomes onto the show Wendy Gossett, a parenting and relationship coach, author, and host of the Not So Normal Parenting Podcast. Wendy discusses the significance of understanding children's unique temperaments to tailor parenting effectively. She shares insights on using brain mapping and temperament testing to identify individual strengths and challenges in children. Wendy emphasizes the impact of realistic expectations and personalized parenting on fostering better parent-child relationships. She also explains how understanding and leveraging these temperaments can help in family dynamics, sibling interactions, and even in resolving conflicts more empathetically.

ALL THE THINGS:

• Motherhood Intended website
• Join our FREE Motherhood Intended Community
• Follow @motherhood_intended on Instagram
• Download Jacqueline's FREE Habit & Goal Tracker
• Leave a review for the podcast
• Apply to be a guest on the show!

Shift from reaction to understanding, smoothing the rough edges for a more connected and harmonious home...
--> Connect with Wendy and find all of her resources HERE!

Transcript

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Hey friend, welcome to season five of the Motherhood Intended podcast. It's been a few weeks since you've heard a new episode from me,  and I'm excited to be back. I feel  Well, I was about to say I feel recharged and energized and I do in general, but today I woke up with a cold, a head cold. So I am stuffy and congested and battling that, but you know what?

Somehow I got through all of December without even feeling remotely sick. So,  I'll take it. Maybe it's just my time.  But when you're hearing this, it's my birthday.  It's my birthday. I'm 37.  But that means it is the two year anniversary of the podcast, which is very exciting and I'm just super proud to look back and know that we've done almost 90 episodes.

 I've interviewed so many different people. We've had so many guests on. I've shared so many bits and pieces of our story, some of it in real time, as you know, with our surrogacy journey. But it's a really awesome and fun reflective time, and I hope you'll celebrate with me,  to celebrate my birthday, like a lot of people do I am supporting a non profit I posted it on Facebook and on Instagram, so feel free to check it out But I'm supporting one of my prior guests on the show with her initiative the gift of surrogacy foundation and this foundation helps provide The resources and education and making surrogacy accessible for other women who have experienced a medical diagnosis that prevents them from carrying their own pregnancy. Every year they have a surrogacy soiree and it raises a bunch of money and then they do other initiatives throughout the year, , all to raise money to gift the gift of surrogacy to one lucky family.

So please consider celebrating my birthday and the two year anniversary of the podcast by donating to them, or, you can send me a coffee, which, really, I don't need any help with my coffee habit, but  anything that's donated will go to the production of this podcast,  so I would appreciate it.

But most importantly, the best gift you can give is to follow the show, if you haven't already.  Over your favorite episode to somebody in your life, introduce them to the Motherhood Intended podcast, write a review if you haven't already, and last but not least, if you are interested in sharing your own personal journey to motherhood, maybe you have a story of a unique diagnosis, or maybe you have a parenting story to share, or know an expert in the field of hormones, IVF, reproductive medicine, whatever it is, Maybe consider nominating yourself or somebody else to be a guest on this show.

I am always looking for new people who can share Wonderful insights and who are wanting to be brave and share their own stories no matter how hard it is I've said this from the very beginning and I promise you it's still true to this day sharing my experiences has been so healing for me and I am a completely different person than when I launched this podcast two years ago. So I encourage you as the listener to consider sharing your story as well. 

I hope everybody had a great break.  My holiday season was busy and amazing and fun and festive. So much going on with family and friends. And I really just love this time of year.

Of course it can get heavy too, you know? For those going through infertility, the end of the year, the holidays can be just an extra weight that you're carrying, you know, you're not in the place that you thought you'd be, maybe you're grieving a loss.  It can be a difficult time and I've spent many holidays in so many different mindsets  I can honestly say that this year was the lightest for me in a long time. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with my daughter being with us.  Lorelei's first Christmas was so amazing to witness, but also just  really working on myself in the last year and changing my mindset. So, stay tuned.

I have a lot in the works. to help you do the same. I really want to help you have a positive mindset to go after the goals that you want without having to sacrifice your own personality, your own, well being and thoughts. I don't want the experience of something you can't control, like a diagnosis or infertility to weigh you down, to make the experience like that much worse.

You know, I want you to be able to control what you can't control, which are your thoughts. So stay tuned. I've got a lot on that topic coming for you. We are also starting a book club. I mentioned it at the end of the year. But that will be launching soon. So join the Motherhood Intended Community group on Facebook if you haven't already.

That's where I'll be posting the sign up and we are going to be reading  Cathy Heller's Abundant Ever After book. I am about halfway through now. I absolutely love  Cathy. You've heard me talk about her all the time on the podcast, um, but it's a really great read, especially for the beginning of the year.

The book really provides tools for creating a life of prosperity and ease. And no matter where you are in your life right now, we can all use a little ease, right? I don't, I don't think anyone would want to deny prosperity and ease. So that sign up will be coming soon. Join us. All these links are in the show notes. So be sure to check that out before you click out of your podcast app.  

Okay. So today's episode. I had the pleasure of chatting with Wendy Gossett and she is the host of the Not So Normal Parenting Podcast.  she's also an author, a speaker, a parenting and relationship coach, and yes, she's also internet famous for embarrassing her kids. We connected when she came across my podcast episode where I talked about parenting a neurodivergent child and kind of chatting about diagnosis to understanding it all. And the ways that I've had to adapt and provide support tailored to my son's needs, Which is very similar when with her and it resonated with her. Her coaching practice came out of her own experiences as she struggled to understand her daughter, which you'll hear more about.  Wendy spent her career in education, working directly with children in the classroom, and training leaders in Fortune 500 companies.

Then her parenting journey led her to spend the next decade researching and writing a best selling comprehensive parenting textbook applying the temperament psychology she used for building cohesive teams to build cohesive families. So over the last 12 years, she served thousands of families, contributing to her podcast top 2 percent ranking.

And I'm super excited for you to meet her today. She's passionate about helping families build connections where there was once disconnections. Take a listen.  

Hi, Wendy. Thanks for joining me on the show today. 

I am honored to be here. 

I'm so excited to pick your brain today. We're going to be talking about parenting kids according to their temperament. And as I was telling you before we hit record,  I am just amazed with every passing year, how each of my children are so very different. Especially, you know, my boy is  one just turned five and one will be seven soon. And For a while, I felt like I could kind of categorize them in like the same, I'm like, Oh yeah, the boys are doing this. The boys are doing that. And as their personalities develop and we get to know them even more as they get older and have different interests and temperaments, it is becoming more and more difficult because you're, I'm very aware now that I am parenting three very different children. So I'm, I'm super excited to pick your brain on this topic.  

Before we get started though. You have a podcast yourself.  Your podcast is called not so normal parenting. And I have to ask in your intro, it says you went viral for embarrassing your kids. Do tell us more.  

I am in Denver, Colorado, and you know, people think it's snowy here all the time, but it's, it's actually not.

It's snowy here today. It snowed for Thanksgiving, which was so nice.  Cause my kids are both grown and flown. Now I have,  one that's about to graduate college and one that's can't come back home again. Now he's studying pre med. but we were driving to grandma's house. It sounds so crazy. We're driving to grandma's house and we got stuck on the interstate in a blizzard and we were stuck for four and a half hours and it was like a parking lot.

And my son who at the time I think was, he was about to graduate high school and it was his day off and he was so angry. And, and this is my kid who's usually super mellow and chill. And he was so upset that he was stuck in this car. And so I thought I have to cheer him up. And his favorite movie was La La Land at the time.

So I am. Getting out of my car, getting everyone dancing in the blizzard on the interstate, and so I cranked up the radio and it just happened to be the Backstreet Boys singing, Everybody.  So it was a total mom jam and I got out of the car. I was doing my, my bad mom dance moves,  get out and join me, but it just being me and my daughter was filming it and it was a headline in the BBC, like, 

Oh my gosh. 

And, and then the Backstreet Boyd themselves were tweeting about it. Bono wrote about me in his autobiography saying he wants to be an embarrassing parent too.  

That's awesome. 

Cause my son was like, his, his reaction was so classic cause he was so mortified and embarrassed and he was already cranky. And then I did that. So, 

 oh my gosh, I love that so much. That's hilarious. Oh my goodness. 

It wasn't by choice. 

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like that's how it usually, well, you know, people are always trying to go viral, but it's the times when you just are living your life and it just, it catches on. That's, that's too good.  

Might've been  a very slow news time.

I don't know. That would cheer me up. I mean, slow news or not. That's  So many questions for you. Let's start by  talking about your family coaching business. What inspired you to start this? 

 Well, my daughter, I thought I had these expectations, you know, I expectations get us into trouble a lot of times. And we did this over Thanksgiving. I shared my expectations  and it just really, really helped. So my expectations for parenting were that my daughter and I would be close. We would, you know, go shopping together. We would do these mother daughter things. And I had a daughter that would decapitate her American girl dolls. And she wanted rats as pets and would run them through a obstacle course gauntlet. She was like, Darla from Finding Nemo. 

Yeah. 

And so we were so different and you know, she didn't, she's monosyllabic. When I would pick her up from school, she wouldn't want to talk about her day. You know, to this day, she thinks it's a chafe. 

She calls it small talk when I'm like, how was your day?  Now my day, she calls it small talk  because it's really difficult for her. And so,  she wants to teach me something.  Because she has this brilliant engineering mind, like she loves quantum physics and, and I didn't realize this when she was little.

I just thought she was. Kind of  unappreciative and not a very demonstrative kid with her emotions. And, and I honestly really had a difficult time even liking her. Of course I loved her, right? Right. She was just a very salty, independent.   Child.  And so we were completely different. And I had been doing, corporate training and I have a master's in education.

And I thought, I wonder what her temperament is. Yeah. As I do this with adult teams, I wonder if I could figure out her temperament as a child, if I could understand her better  because that's what I did all the, all day long with corporate teams. And then being a teacher in the classroom, I kind of. 

different patterns in kids. And so I started kind of interviewing adults and matching them up with, with kid behavior and because it's very different. Child  temperament is very different from adult temperament. In fact, my daughter has done such a morph in her personality that  if I were to test her now, She would test completely different as what she did as a child, but I know that her brain wiring is what it is.

Those are her natural behaviors. Now she's learned behaviors, but that's what I help parents do. I help them test their children based on their natural behaviors, not the learned behaviors because that is how their child's brain is wired. And so it helps the parent understand. What their child is naturally good at and what they're not good at.

And for my daughter, her lowest brain function is my highest. So emotional  feeling, extroverted feeling is my number one. That's her lowest function. So without awareness, she and I were like, you know, nails on a chalkboard for each other.  But with awareness.  We could help each other grow and balance each other and become better and and that's that's what happened And that's what I am passionate about helping parents do is so that they can learn What realistic expectations are for each one of their kids?

That's so cool. And that's so important because as you were explaining this, I was just thinking about how, you know, on, at least for me in my feeds, I'm seeing like on social media, there's all these things about what to do with your kids and how to handle this when they're in this situation or they're feeling this, talk to them in this way.

And there's just, All these things surrounding what you should be doing in parenting, and it's not often I'm seeing this information about how to parent the specific child that you have. And learning this, like you said, and it's interesting because it, it's a product of nature versus nurture. It's just so helpful.

And these expectations that we all put on our kids, right? Whether you want to admit it or not, you know, when they're born, you're just like, Oh, like, why aren't they enjoying this? Or why aren't they talking to me this way? Like, I just, I, what did I do to them? I'm asking them how their day was at school.

Why aren't they responding?  I think that's so helpful. And I'm curious. So how early then can a parent, right? Test their child's temperament because like I said, my kids are like five and six, um, are you testing young kids or is this when they're a little more mature? How does it all work?

Yeah, I, I start as early as three years old. Um, A parent can test their child at three years old and then down the road, the parent will tell me that what I forecasted for this child was like specific. It was like spot on, um, because there are some temperaments, like I said, that do this morph. Like they're this total free spirit lion type tornado as a kid.

But they just want to have fun and. Their parents are worried because they think, okay, my child is very average in school or below average. And then this child will morph in high school. And then as an adult, they don't even know how to test themselves correctly because they have morphed into what society needs them to be or wants them to be.

So they're this free spirited kid, but because we live in a society that is structured, they learn from life. that it is important to be structured. And then as an adult, they don't even know who they are when they take the test. And I am able to know what happens. That is a pattern that happens a lot. And I bring them back to their childhood.

Who were you as a kid? And, and they're like, Oh yeah, you know, this is why. I'm not happy in my job because I'm not having enough freedom. Yes, I can do the structure, but I don't have enough freedom in my job because that lion type needs freedom. That is one of their number one needs.  And it looks a lot different when you're a father and you know, it's mainly men that will test incorrectly, um, because I will have parents test their children. But then I also will have the parents test themselves because they need to know the lens they're looking through when they are seeing their child, because that is how they're going to set those expectations. And so it's how they can kind of change the lens they're looking through.

That makes so much sense. And what kind of tools are you using to do these tests?

 I have several modalities that I use. So one is for brain wiring and it's almost like you've had an EEG map done of your brain because my daughter and I actually did that. We had Oh, that's scans done of our brain. And it looks exactly the same as the psychological functions that I will map out for parents, for families. So I will give them a visual map of how everyone's brain in the family is wired. And sometimes when you look at this brain map, I'll have to make one for you.

Yeah. 

Let me do the tests. 

That would be awesome. 

When you look at this brain map, sometimes you can literally see one thing that stands out that nobody else has. And this is the child that the parents called me about because they thought this child is just trying to be difficult, but no, they have a brain function that's completely different from anyone in the family.

So they feel different and they're trying to say, see me, you know, they're, they're different. Parents see me and that causes them to be like a little rebel because they want to be understood. They want to be seen for their uniqueness and not have the same expectations as. their brothers or their sisters.

Yeah, that's so interesting.  I've been diving into, different temperaments a little bit with my sons. Um, we earlier this year discovered that my oldest son is on the autism spectrum. And then, my younger son's been in OT for a while, just with some sensory processing difficulties. So I've really been trying to learn like how their brains work and you know, when they're young, they're dabbling in different activities, whether it's soccer, gymnastics or whatever. And I'm like, trying to figure out, like, what do they actually like, as opposed to like, what am I putting in?

Because my one son, it takes him like four days to warm up to a new situation. And by the time he does that, you know, the camp's over or whatever. And my other son is just, well, tell me he loves every single activity. He's like, Oh, I just love basketball. And he's on the next, I love soccer.

And I'm like, okay, but like, where are your. Skills going to shine or more so make you most happy because I, it's hard to, you know, he's kind of like that people pleaser and he's just going to say he likes it anyway.  So that's so interesting 

what you're describing because introverted sensing is one of the eight brain functions and introverted sensing often, um, has sensory processing disorder that goes along with that.

Or like OCD or, definitely slow to warm because they sit back and they want to observe before they jump in. They can be quite anxious, but they're sweet, compliant kids, but they are very, very sensitive in their five senses. And then as far as what you described. autism spectrum. There are intuitive brain functions as well as this sensing, this introverted sensing that a lot of times introverts, when they're serious introverts, that can be a, a clue or, that can be something to make you look into maybe autism for that child.

There are the intuitive types that are just in their head, that a lot of times will show up as being on the spectrum or not. It's just a personality thing. Like for instance, what you described with your child that likes everything.  There is a brain function called extroverted intuition, which they are curious about everything.

They want to try everything and then they'll try it and do it. And the curiosity has been satiated and then they want to move on to the next thing. Yeah. And parents don't realize that is quote normal. For that type. And that's why my, my podcast is called not so normal parenting because there are some personality types that are very rare.

Yeah. 

What is normal for that type might seem not so normal. to the parent. 

Yeah. 

And so I'm sort of like the normal bar for these different personality patterns so that I can tell the parent, nope, that's actually very normal for that rare. 

Yeah. 

So now pattern that function where they just want to try everything. And this child can seem defiant at times too, because they're so curious. They, Just take their ice cream cone and throw it up against the wall because they just want to see what's going to happen. And it looks like defiance to their parent. And so by reading this brain map for the family, I can help the family know what discipline techniques to use,  what types of rewards are going to motivate their kids.

What to expect down the road, what types of activities to put them in, what activities will have other kids with their personalities in them, all those sorts of things. I can offer. 

That is, what a amazing tool. I'm just, Like thinking about how, our journey into kind of diving into more into getting to know how I'll just say our oldest son's brain works is because we're like, okay, that something's not working in our household. I don't want to be yelling at him at all, but like, I don't want to be. You know, disciplining him about something that he genuinely can't do differently, or like he's not seeing it the way I like, he's not doing something wrong. This is just how he's doing it. And again, it might not be our expectation for how something said or done, but it's just how his brain is working.

And, this sounds like the perfect tool to really figure, figure that all out, because it's not as simple as,  people. You know, love to be like, Oh, like my younger son, Noah, they'll be like, Oh, Noah's shy and Hunter's outgoing. And that's pretty broad. Cause I'm like, it's not that he's shy. Cause he will talk to people and he will engage in activities.

Like he's just slow to warm up. And Hunter, you know, my older son,  it's not that he's outgoing. A lot of times it's that, we've kind of learned how his brain works. He, He's super intelligent and he just remembers these like, like he'll remember phrases and like, I'll say like social norms and, and things like, well, but well beyond his years.

I remember he would be too, and being like, thank you so much or like, he would use these full. He was like, so cute and polite. And they're just like things he's memorized. He's not necessarily like, you know, interacting that way. He just knows in this situation, I should say this. , so it's just really interesting.

There are four people patterns to keep it at the simplest level. And then it goes  way complicated when you get into the eight different brain functions that come in different. Patterns, but it can get as simple as the wizard of Oz and that's like a big movie , but the scarecrow sounds a lot like your son.

The scarecrow is a rare type. So is the Tin Man. Those two types are both intuitive and intuitives make up only 16 percent of the population.  And so intuitive types are unicorns in our society. And a lot of times parents don't realize that there is a whole herd of unicorns out there because they only have one unicorn in their family. 

But there is a type that  a lot of times parents.  Think they're autistic or they are autistic because they are so introverted. They're so intelligent and They kind of don't need anything. They just need their mind. That's their happy place Yeah, and sometimes just having a parent You're  that they can relax.

This is who your child is going to grow up to be. This is probably what they're going to be interested in. Albert Einstein is the type that I'm talking about, but he thought he was really strange and he wasn't the best student, but he had this brilliant mind. That was his happy place.  He was constantly thinking outside the box and you know, one of the brain functions is a very out of the box brain function.

It seems like it's being a rebel, but we need those innovators in our world. We need those thinkers that don't think like everyone else, but they're difficult to parent. 

Yeah. 

And so once a parent knows their child has this type of brain, that's my daughter. Hershey has such a different. Um, it just really helps you to relax and go  of who God created them to be.

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think any parent listening, I mean, I would rather be  understanding of the gifts that my child has as opposed to feeling stressed about what I think they're not doing quote unquote right. Um, that makes me laugh with like, yes, my son definitely is out of the box thinker. It could be something as simple as, you know, my sons will be like bored one day.

I'll be like, well, why don't you, why don't you do this? It doesn't matter what my idea is. He'll always be like, or we could do like, he's never going to take my suggestion. And so it's kind of just become this comical thing. I'm like, I know he's not going to do whatever I say, but at least he'll figure out something on his own because he's just, it has to be like his own idea and he probably will come up with something better, but, um, yeah.

Well, and, and parents are so intuitive, like you are learning your child and you are adopting your parenting to him. But what I like to say is  if you could have found out when he was three, who he was. 

Yeah. 

And. You know, taught him emotional intelligence from that age and taught him the things that he's lacking in from that age. And that's what I have done with my daughter because she was lacking so much in social intelligence. And she did have this very out of the box Wacky brain that came across as really wacky and weird when she was in elementary school. I was just able to really, guide her and coach her better. really point out her strengths because when you have an introvert It's a lot harder to pinpoint their strengths because a lot of things are happening internally. 

So I've been able to, in my book, I wrote a 450 page reference book. It's not meant to be read like a novel, but find out your child's type. You can turn to the chapter and read all about their strengths. And sometimes their strengths show up as weaknesses.  

Interesting.

And you don't frame them as strengths. Like my daughter was so contrary. Like you're saying your son goes against what you're telling  him.  And as a kid, that can just seem like defiance, but really it's this out of the box creative brain and this child can actually help you with the problem solving. They can actually collaborate on their discipline with you because they have this amazing ability to negotiate, solve problems.

And so you use that as a strength instead of something that just annoys you.  And you know, that's what I started doing with my daughter early on. I would, I would see a, a physical problem because she's tactile, but then she's also logical.  And so I'd see this physical, logical type of problem. And I'd say, even when she was six, can you help me with this? 

And she would be able to do it. And so it just built confidence in her because she was so different from her brother. Like in my intro, I say she was like the black widow, like as in Marvel comics, the superhero. And my son was like, Bob Ross. And so she always felt like she was the naughty kid, always the one getting in trouble.

But I early on was like, no, you are this person, you know, and I would just speak to what those unique strengths were. That would have been hard for me to recognize had I not  kind of literally taken a look inside of her brain. 

Yeah, what an amazing opportunity to, you know, empower our kids with confidence. And I mean, in my thirties, I'm still trying to figure out who I am. And I know plenty of people who are like, what are my strengths or is that a good thing? You know, like I've always, Told myself like I'm type a, but like half the time it comes up as like a joke, like, Oh, that's your type a again, like calm down.

But I'm like, well, I, I hear you, but it's also like one of my biggest strengths. Um, but so cool to like, be able to teach your kids, you know, that the way they're thinking or the way they're doing things is, is not wrong or bad, but like, That's just unique to their brain. And, at first it's can sound at least for me when I was  just realizing how different my kids truly are, which makes it, I've always known that everyone's unique and special.

And, um, I just didn't realize how wildly different they would all be. And,  it can be overwhelming as parents trying to not only parent  one child, but one way, but knowing that it's not going to work. The best across the board because they are different people. So, I think,  diving into this is . Just such a helpful tool, not only for parents, but also for your kids to go forward and grow up knowing what their strengths and Weaknesses are and just kind of how they tick 

well, and there is you know, you asked about how I go about testing So yeah, first initial session is all about The brain map and how your brain is wired and the EEG map of the brain, you know, so that's actually your brain geography.

But then as we work together, then we get into behavior patterns because that is different. So behavior patterns develop from your brain wiring. That's the, the nurture piece. Okay. But then it also develops from who your siblings are and what your birth order is and what kinds of experiences you had. And,  and so I help parents with that as well.

And my podcast is, is a lot for the parent. It's for the parent's self growth. just as much as for them to understand their child. Because like you said, that type a, that's a very big basket. 

Yeah. 

So, you know, are you a type a perfectionist or are you a type a, because you're at this people pleaser and you just want to give, give, give, and you don't want to receive anything in return and you care about what people think, or are you this type a, because you want to appear like, Successful or you type a, because you are independent and you don't want anyone to hold you back. 

You know? So there's just so many behaviors that go into that. And sometimes a lot of the time we're unconscious of  our thought patterns. We're unconscious of these things that keep. Um, taking us down the same well worn path over and over again.  And so  becoming conscious of our thought patterns, almost observing our thoughts is what I help parents do because you know, when that child keeps pushing their buttons,  there's something going on there, you know, inside the parent.

Maybe that parent is,  this successful parent, like I have to be successful and this child doesn't seem like. I'm a successful parent. It's a reflection on me. Or the parent wants to be a peacemaker and there's chaos in the house. So again, that's a reflection on the parent and they have to understand how to separate who they are and what their core fears are.

So that they can parent their child without fear,  because, you know, anger usually comes from fear underneath. And so I help people understand kind of what's happening at, at the core.

That's so, so great. I find this so interesting. I cannot wait to dive into all of this myself with my own family because,  it's hard  with a full family of all different personalities and, everybody wants the same thing. You know, we're, we all love each other and support each other and,  it can get difficult when we're all dealing with our own stuff and every situation we're all going to react differently. And, um, I've taken, I've never done, um,  I don't know what Enneagram I am, or I haven't done any of that yet. Um, but I've taken like personality quizzes through work long time ago.

 And I'm sure my husband has as well, but we both definitely, I would be so intrigued to just even learn more about my husband, you know, as we are parenting together, obviously, there's so much, nature versus nurture with somebody, a spouse you met.  They're 25, 30 years into their life. It's like, I'm still learning about his childhood and you know, what made us who we are today. 

 Well, it's so interesting because I've worked with thousands of couples now, as, you know, since I work with the parents  and I see this brain pattern happening in most couples where there are eight brain functions that.

That you can possibly have, potentially have, but the couple will have the same four brain functions, but they'll be in inverted order. Oh, okay. It's like the Jerry Maguire effect, that you find someone that completes you. 

Yeah. 

And so, you know, the very thing that is chemistry that before you're married becomes carpentry after you're married because it's a lot of work.

Yeah.  That makes sense. That would make sense.  

Yeah. And, and that's the pattern that my daughter and I have  inverted pattern where we have the same four brain functions, but they are. In opposite order, how we can balance each other and help each other. And it's funny because you know, when she was first dating, she was attracted to guys who were just like her and that I see that pattern happen as well.

But then now that she's matured, now she is dating someone who is her opposite because she needs someone who's more feely and emotional to balance her out because she is number one logic  So 

that's so interesting. I'm sure I did the same growing up. If I think back, it's like, and as you mature, you know, you start to look for different things in your life as you, as you age.

Yeah. So  it's just one of my favorite things to do because, you know, even parenting coaches that I've worked with will learn something new. And in the forward of my book, I had one who said that. They would accredit this work for them being friends with their child someday, because they were butting heads so badly that the parent just did not realize this daughter did not have the capability that she was placing on her  and her expectations were all wrong.

Cause she thought this was a little mini me,  wasn't because there were so many things about her that reminded the mom of herself. 

Yeah. 

And she was trying to be firm with this child. And, and I get, I get annoyed. I have a hard time like listening to, um, like Dr. Laura, for instance, the famous psychologist that's on the radio.

And she will tell a parent that's talking about their child. Well, just do it. Or just, you know, just make the decision, just do it.  And that works well for a couple of temperaments. There are some temperaments that are very gritty, very resilient.  They make a decision and they just do it.  Dr. Laura is one of them, the lens she's looking through  and she doesn't realize that there are, well, I'm sure she does.

She's an amazing psychologist, but it doesn't seem like she realizes there are these fragile unicorn kids out there. That their number one brain function is introverted feeling.  And so every feeling sticks to them and every feeling they have, they feel like it's true. It's a true story  and they can't just do anything because they are fighting with these feelings that they believe are true.

Yeah. 

They choose this brain wiring. It's just how, what they have. And so it's up to the parent to help that child learn to cope  with this fragile, beautiful personality. These are our artists. These are our counselors. These are, you know, but they're sensitive.  And they're told all the time by their parents, you're too sensitive, you're too sensitive.

And it's just, it's how they're wired and  use that wiring as an excuse for sure. But for parents, you, you use that as a way to coach them into their strengths, coach them into who they were meant to be. 

Yeah, it's it's this knowledge is really just a tool tool for the parents tool for the individuals who are learning about, you know, their brains and personality types. I would agree with you on the whole doctor on the dr Laura thing I it's  that's just not a one size fits all for sure I mean, I was just thinking of my kids when you said that and yeah, my youngest son is super sensitive and the way you said that I've never heard it like that, but yeah, everything that like sticks to him, you know, you say one thing it's like on him.

And, um, and I think even  especially with boys to, you know, people, it's gotten better. I feel like with every generation, but people love to put labels on boys, like how you shouldn't be sensitive and you shouldn't be this or that because you're a boy. And it's like, I don't know. That has to do with anything. It's how he works. It's who he is. 

It's, it's so crazy when you get a lion personality type. So there are four personality types. I actually didn't finish my thought. There's 

yeah. Yeah, please. 

It's the tin man, the lion.  And Dorothy is all about safety and security and she makes up 46 percent of the population. She just wanted to go home. 

Yeah. 

You have the lion who's courageous and just, you know, wanted courage. And then you have the scarecrow who wanted a brain, they're super cerebral. And then you have the tin man who just wanted a heart. And those are your relational. People, but the lion types, um, that are boys that have introverted feeling as their number one brain function  are so conflicted because they're this lion who wants to be brave and wants to win, wants to be competitive, but their number one brain function is the most sensitive of all.

So they go through life trying to hide who they really are. They're, they're just like kind of one dimensional because to fit in with what they, what society is telling them to be. So our artists like Prince and Michael Jackson  were this type. It's the, it's the feeling lion who there were so good with their bodies and you know, so brilliant on stage, but they had this super sensitive when you read their lyrics, you can see that. 

And so. That's a type that's really difficult for, and you can see these men that I've worked with that have just tattoos all over and they're driving a giant truck because they're showing I'm tough. I am not sensitive and they're trying to cover that up. 

Yeah. 

It's one thing for, you know, a man to realize, but for a parent to realize this about their child, it's super helpful because you can have that role flip where the boy is more sensitive and we're all in the family, which is what happened in my family.

And that's partly all the podcasts. Not so normal is because everything is flipped in my family with the, the gender roles and, um, just with.  What is normal. Right.  According to society. 

 Yeah. That, that lion type sounds exactly like my son and, that's why I find this brain mapping so interesting because I would definitely want to be able to empower him, you know, to be who he is as he grows up.

I don't want him to be, you know, a grown man shoving his feelings down and, you know, just to lift up that kind of powerful side of himself. I mean,  it, it does sound very conflicting, but I think, you know, both sides of the brain can coexist. And, . The more I can empower him and what his strengths are, um, the better.

So I just find this all so, so fascinating. And speaking of your podcast, what are you streaming on? Where can people find your show?  

Apple podcasts, pretty much everywhere. Apple podcasts, um, Spotify. Yeah. Everywhere. And, I just wanted to say one more thing at that. Some. personality types. The reason, another reason I call it not so normal is I'm not trying to say something is abnormal or anything like that. Like  there's nothing normal really under the sun, but um, it's because some personality types are really rare and those are the parents that I attract to my business and my podcasts are the kids, the parents that have the kids that don't Match up with the norm.

Like just what you explained with your son.  Those are the parents that I speak to the most because the, the kids that fit those societal norms, parents aren't calling me about those kids. Yeah. It's, it's the not so normal.  Once they are perfectly normal, but not so normal according to our society's standards.

Right. Which makes so much sense. And, um, which is also why I absolutely had to have you on the show because you know, on this podcast, I love to have conversations that kind of go behind the typical highlight reels that we are scrolling on social media and talk about things that. don't get talked about enough.

And I do think it's, you know, the parents out there who  would be the people coming to you that would love to hear more from more parents who are like, I don't understand, like I'm butting heads with my child. I'm not sure what to do. You know, you're not going to see that usually in an Instagram story.

You're going to see the good moments that they're having.  Parents are not alone out there because we know everyone is unique. Every child is unique. And,  I think as soon as we let go of those expectations, like you mentioned at the very beginning, the more we can understand our kids and ourselves better, because, you know, I've waited a while to have a daughter and, you know, she's only seven months old, but I'm already trying to like change my brain to just, you know, You know, after being a parent for so long now, I'm like, okay, she just, isn't popping out this like miniature me.

Who's going to love dance and Barbies and all the things that I loved. Like I'm going to get to know her. And this, you know, the more I can tell myself that it's just like, I'm going to get to know her and learn who she is. And as opposed to like, Oh my gosh, this daughter I've waited for for so long. And she's going to do X, Y, and Z the better off we'll both be.

And I think everyone listening can, can understand that. So I could pick your brain forever on this topic. I find it so, so interesting. And I say this often on the show, but I swear guests will come to me and the moments that like, I personally need to hear from them. Um, this was very top of mind for me as,  we're, diving into learning more about  my son's diagnosis and, and truly just like, I don't even love to call it like that because I just like to learn more about him.

It was overwhelming at first to kind of hear these labels, which was our biggest fear, like,  But really, we've come to terms with the fact that it's just us getting to know our child better and how we can help him be successful and happy in this world. And that's exactly what you're doing.

And I love that so much. So I know myself, I'm going to be, Diving into your resources. I know you offer free, different free tests and things. Where can people find you? And,  if someone listening is like me and is like, okay, I need to dive into this, where does everybody get started? 

Yeah. So I really like to let my listeners have the full gamut.

You know, if they want to just do a DIY  and take my tests and listen to my podcast. They can do that.  Obviously the easier way is to, to work with me and then, you know, I'll give you all the tests, but the tests are available. Um, there's one test available currently on my website. It's my free child test.

It's a shortened version of the test, but it's usually pretty spot on. And so a parent can go to Wendy Gossett. dot com. That's probably in your show notes and find that test on there. And then you can go to the episode that talks about your child's personality or go to my YouTube channel and watch a whole video about your child's personality.

personality or get my book and read the whole chapter about your child's personality. And then I have all the other tests as well. Adult tests, um, the Enneagram test for a child. There are instinctual variants, which are so interesting.  You're either a self preservation, a one on one sexual or a social, and this goes for children and the self preservation types are very anxious.

So that's a whole nother piece of it. And these are like primitive instincts, and so they really play a huge role in behavior. So I have all this gamut of tests and I just tell people, email me and. I'll send you the test as a reward for listening to your podcast, listening to my podcast because I'm trying to promote that. So yeah. So just reach out to me, Wendy at  wendygusset. com. 

That's perfect. What valuable resources. I can't wait to take some of those tests. Um, and just get some clarity. Um, I will definitely include the link to the show notes to make it easy for everybody listening. Just click that to get in touch with you and find everything you just talked about.

Wendy, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. This was super insightful and, I'm really glad that we're covering this topic,  because.  like we mentioned, not every child can be parented the same and they all have different temperaments and, um, learning about all these, um, different things that you mentioned and how our brains work is only, you know, another tool for our tool belts in parenting. So I really appreciate you educating us on this. 

Thank you so much for giving me the opportunity. 

 Thanks for tuning in to today's episode. I love this topic of, you know, no more cookie cutter parenting. We want to tailor our approach to our child's unique temperament.  I have learned this firsthand as  my boys get older and I just, you know, you have one child and You think the second one is going to be a walk in the park.

You're like, okay, I've done this. I'm a seasoned parent. I know what I'm doing now.  Absolutely not. Every child is different and unique. And truthfully, just like I said, I had two boys within, you know, less than two years and it through COVID. And I swear, they both came in like in a whirlwind. So.

It's very humbling as they grow and mature, as I'm learning the ins and outs of their personalities, and realizing that they both need different things from me. I hope you took something away from this episode. I hope it was enlightening. If you have any questions at all, feel free to reach out to me or Wendy.

Her contact info will be in the show notes. So before you click out of your podcast app, be sure to look at all those links. And stay tuned, follow the show if you're not already, so all new episodes pop up in your queue. But next week, I will be dropping a new segment in addition to our regularly scheduled weekly episodes, and I am very excited about this. It'll be shorter episodes, more casual, talking about a very specific topic each week.

Think about is like you're tuning in to a conversation between friends because this new segment is called the village chat. That's right. Every week  I'm going to be welcoming on somebody in my personal village, whether it's a friend, a family member, my spouse, and we're going to be diving in to a very specific topic that feels relevant to the week.

So Get excited because you're going to be getting more content from me. And I think it'll be a great opportunity to get some quick insights, from somebody else's perspective on different fertility and parenting topics. 

So yeah, stay tuned. I hope you have a great rest of your week. Stay warm if it's like cold by you. Obviously here in Chicago we are in like the teens and 20s and it is icy. So yeah, winter's here. It's here. Stay warm. Have a great weekend and you will hear from me again next week.