#76: World Schooling- What Is It? How Is It Done? And Is It For Me?

What if your child's education could be as unique and flexible as your family's needs? Join us this week on The Homeschool How To as we talk with Jennifer Norman from British Columbia, who turned her middle son's special needs into a homeschooling journey that breaks all conventional norms. Initially reluctant, Jennifer found that traditional curriculums weren't a fit for her family, and she embraced a life-based learning approach that evolved into world schooling. Hear how she incorporated travel, unschooling, and game schooling to create an adaptable and enriching educational path for her three children.

Jen's nomadic lifestyle has taken them across non-English speaking countries, where her children effortlessly pick up new languages and adapt to diverse cultures. From the Caribbean to Europe, she reveals their travel planning strategies and the importance of integrating into local communities. Supported by remote work and a faith-driven journey, Jen's family's adventures have enriched their children's education and social development. We'll also discuss the challenges and benefits of balancing healthcare abroad with a special needs child and how their unconventional lifestyle has led to remarkable real-world learning experiences. Join us for an episode packed with insights, stories, and the benefits of a flexible, unconventional approach to life and education.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:06

Welcome to this week's episode of the Homeschool How-To. I'm Cheryl and I invite you to join me on my quest to find out why are people homeschooling, how do you do it, how does it differ from region to region, and should I homeschool my kids? Stick with me as I interview homeschooling families across the country to unfold the answers to each of these questions week by week. Welcome, and with us today I have Jennifer Norman. You can find her at Within Jen's Lens on Instagram. Jennifer, thank you for being here today. Yes, thanks for having me. So what?

Speaker 2: 0:45

state are you in? So I'm actually in British Columbia, in Canada.

Speaker 1: 0:48

Okay, that's cool, because when we had connected on Instagram, you were in Costa Rica.

Speaker 2: 0:53

All right, we'll get into all that good stuff. How?

Speaker 1: 0:57

many kids do you have and do you homeschool?

Speaker 2: 0:59

So I had three kids in three years, so they're really nice and close. That makes it really nice for homeschooling. Yeah, my youngest is six, evan. My middle is Owen, who's seven, and then my daughter just turned nine, emily.

Speaker 1: 1:17

Wow, All right. So what got you into homeschooling? Have you always wanted to educate your kids at home, or? You know what was the epiphany?

Speaker 2: 1:26

No, I don't think that I thought that this would be my life, but sometimes choices are made for you. My middle son was actually born with special needs and we spent pretty much since he's been born in and out of hospital and we actually have to travel out of the city to go to a really great children's hospital and so, with that disruption to our lives, it pretty much became impossible to even put my other children in school because they would have to be taken in and out so often. So this was just kind of something that I was like you know, and there were so many things that led me towards it, which you know. You get affirmations along the way that you're you're not swimming upstream, you're going the right way. And my daughter, she actually stopped napping when she was one and she's never slept. I hear that.

Speaker 2: 2:24

My son was the same way I know, so actually she was four when here the schooling system would have had her go into school, um, able to go into school when she was four, and all of a sudden she started napping again and so I was like if I were to put her in school here and she's having this kind of midday slump, this wouldn't be that fair to her. So everything kind of just pushed me towards let's just give this a go for the first year and see how it goes. But then second year, covid and I was like that would be a terrible first year of school, right, sitting in a box, a masking tape box, all day and can't socialize, and at that age that's kind of the primary focus of schooling. And so I was like, okay, no, we're not starting here. And obviously you know that dragged on for years and now here I am going into my sixth year, wow.

Speaker 1: 3:19

And okay, so did you start with like curriculums?

Speaker 1: 3:24

You had your hands full If you had a child that was in and out of the hospital did you feel like this pressure of we need to do these curriculums at this age kindergarten, first grade, yada, yada. I can imagine I'm just willing to guess that over the years you were like wait, no, they spend, you know, six to eight hours a day in school and we do not need to replicate that at home, which I think a lot of us really try to do that first year and then realize this is crazy. We don't take them out to do the same things at home. So how did that kind of transpired? How did that work out in your house?

Speaker 2: 4:02

Well, because this decision was made for me and something that I kind of had to dive into. It wasn't something I'd always aspired to. I started doing some research and things weren't sitting right with me, like trying to sit down with my four-year-old or five-year-old, trying to do block timing of different subjects of learning and then have my toddlers running around and be disruptive. I was like no, none of this feels right, and so we actually went many years. I'd have to think back, but it was probably not until about grade two that we even started introducing any form of curriculum. Everything was life-based learning, play and, yeah, just as I had mentioned, we travel the world, so they were getting like a world education, and so curriculum wasn't something that we started with at all.

Speaker 1: 5:03

So what got you into the world? Basically, it's called world schooling, correct? Yeah, it's a term. Yeah, and I had never. I mean, when I first started talking to homeschooling families, someone mentioned unschooling to me and I was like Lord, that just seems complicated. But then someone introduced game schooling and then someone else introduced world schooling and I was like holy moly, this is. It's really cool that there's so many options, but even I don't even know what is world schooling and does it have one definition? Does it look different for everybody? Absolutely.

Speaker 2: 5:41

And everyone calls it something else, right? Like you've said a few, some people call it unschooling, ex-schooling, wild schooling, rome schooling there's so many terms and I think people just try and give a name to the lifestyle that they're living, because there are many people who are in that conventional lifestyle who, when they hear about your life, they have questions, right, and they just start grilling you like what do you mean, what are you doing, and what about this and what about that? And then, if you have a name to give them, they kind of can calm down a little bit, right.

Speaker 1: 6:14

So true. So what does it look like for you guys?

Speaker 2: 6:17

We are three years into traveling a substantial part of the year. We always. I don't know if you know much about British Columbia, but I've traveled almost 40 countries now and I don't think there's anywhere better than British Columbia in the summer, so we always like to come home for the summer. It's, it's beautiful, is that?

Speaker 1: 6:39

where you're from.

Speaker 2: 6:42

Actually I'm from Alberta, but we've been in BC now for 10 years, so for the kids whole life. And then we set off for the winter and we've been gone anywhere for, you know, three to six months at a time.

Speaker 1: 6:58

What are some of the places that you've traveled?

Speaker 2: 7:01

We have. Actually, we lived a little while in the amazon jungle in peru, so we it was.

Speaker 2: 7:10

It was wild. Um, we were living on a floating platform in the middle of the jungle on the river, so, um, that's where my kids learned to swim. That's um, that one was pretty wild. Um, after Peru, we have spent time in Costa Rica, nicaragua. Um, we had flown up to Miami after Peru and we caught a ship and we sailed across the Atlantic over to Spain and then we traveled all Europe Colombia, jamaica. We've kind of been all over with them and had some pretty neat experiences.

Speaker 1: 7:50

Okay, Rewind to Peru. How do you get this on the books Like okay, everyone's thinking right now how can they afford this? So I don't mean to cry, but you know what I mean Homeschool families. They are creative and they figure out ways to make this. Things like this work. How did you guys make this work?

Speaker 2: 8:08

I think I am usually quiet about that piece and that's the only reason. Why is because I think so few people would be willing to do.

Speaker 1: 8:17

We won the lottery.

Speaker 2: 8:20

I wish. I don't think people would be willing to do it like we do it, because it's really not glamorous. You know, we will take the flight that is the red eye if it's most inexpensive. We will let the price of the flight dictate where we're going. Our last trip we just got back about a month ago and we spent that whole time all five of us in a one bedroom condo. So we definitely don't travel the world on these extensive durations in a glamorous way. I think people kind of think enjoy your vacation is what they always say before we leave. I'm like we are not having like room service and robes and resorts while we're away. We are, you know, trying to get into the culture and we are trying to do it for a cost effective way as possible, well, while getting to not forego the experiences of that place. But we do not typically do anything that is touristy, like, yes, we went to Peru but we didn't go to Machu Picchu, or, you know, we're not doing the hot spots where those tourist traps are so expensive.

Speaker 1: 9:42

You're looking at flights for the next place to go Peru comes up, and then is there like an app or something that's like here's a floating piece of wood if you'd like to stay on that. I mean, how does that happen? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 10:00

This is kind of where I think some people think that we're a little out there. I have a reel on my Instagram that shows how I find really cheap flights. And there was really cheap flights to Peru. We actually got our flights for $200. And there was a lot going on in Peru at the time and so this was two years ago now, so it was very unsafe to be there, hence why the flights were so cheap.

Speaker 2: 10:31

But we passed right on through Lima and continued on into the jungle. For that reason, you know, as long as you're staying out of the city and out of any kind of political unrest that's going on there and that's why we decided to head into the jungle and we started looking. There were things like river cruises and that's all great, they're beautiful, but that's like $10,000 a week. That's not what we were doing. So kept searching and kept searching and stumbled upon this place and it looked beautiful and serene, but many unanswered questions and the only way to reach out to the person who ran it was via whatsapp, and they only speak spanish and I speak a bit of spanish. So I started corresponding with him and I said okay, you know what guys, let's just go and commit to two or three days and if we we like it, then we'll see where it takes us.

Speaker 2: 11:26

And we ended up staying for a really long time. A month later we were still there and we started working with this family and help them build their business. We built them a website. We translated it all to English for them and they in turn wanted us to stay. So it just became this really beautiful friendship and relationship. We we call each other family now this Peruvian um jungle family, and they um. They wanted us to stay and we wanted to stay and we just kind of felt like we were each giving to each other um in a really beautiful way. So to date, that is still my kids' favorite experience.

Speaker 1: 12:06

Oh, that is so cool. And so what were the type of things that you saw there? You say jungle, so we think of monkeys swinging from trees. Is that reality?

Speaker 2: 12:16

The reality is, when you're living out in the jungle like that, you actually don't see a lot of wildlife because there's no animal that is off the menu.

Speaker 2: 12:28

Yeah, so sloth, monkey, tortoise it's kind of a really funny story actually.

Speaker 2: 12:37

So it's quite a ways into any kind of civilization other than some tribes. My husband actually started playing on a soccer team and they would take boats up and play local tribes, and so headed into town one day and I saw this tortoise on his back and he was for sale for soup that's what they make with the tortoise there and I needed to go into the bank and I couldn't stop thinking about this and I was like we got to go back and I bartered for him and our taxi driver's name was Jordan and so he took us all around and I couldn't remember where it was. So he was so dedicated to the cause that we named the tortoise after him. So we took Jordan home to our floating platform and this thing kept walking right off the edge into the water. So we all had to take ships babysitting him until we could actually get a boat that would take us up river far, far enough away from any other villages so that we set him free into the jungle in hopes that you know it's. It's pretty funny.

Speaker 1: 13:46

So I just had a post yesterday that I put cause I've been thinking about this a lot and thinking of the three main things that people need to survive. It is, um, basically safety, procreation and food. And when you go outside in nature, you're looking at every insect, every animal, like that is their daily uh tasks that they, you know they're always looking to procreate.

Speaker 1: 14:14

I found some, you know, bees that were busy getting it on in my garden at springtime, um, and then you know the, the bees in the hives, and just learning all about that, and it just came to me that they've taken all of these elements away from the human experience in most places Obviously not the Peruvian jungle, but I got thinking that with taking away our food sources, one just making us disconnected to the food in general.

Speaker 1: 14:47

Two making the food so that it's filled with chemicals. But three really have knowing, no connection and no appreciation and no pride in what I have accomplished. Today. I have fed my family. You know, we think about that as going to work in the suit and tie, sitting around doing kind of a lot of times meaningless stuff, pushing numbers, funding, yada, yada. But um, that that's feeding your family, but it's really not at the core. You know, and we were watching this show alone where they like drop people out in the middle of nowhere no man's land and the episode that I had watched.

Speaker 1: 15:29

You know, the guy took down a musk ox and it really hit me. It was like wow, like that, like it gives me chills just to think about what that?

Speaker 1: 15:39

must feel like to say, of course, like. Of course people look at that as like that's so terrible, but it's like, okay, well, do you eat meat? Do you know what the animals are living like in your conditions where you're buying them from at Walmart and Price Shopper I don't know if people at Price Shopper out there, but the grocery store that's inhumane. When you have the expertise, the ability to take down your animal and use every piece of that animal and thank that animal for the life it gave, it brings an entirely different spiritual perspective to your life. Try to be depressed when you live like that.

Speaker 2: 16:23

And.

Speaker 1: 16:24

I'm going to ask you do the people seem depressed in the Peruvian jungle?

Speaker 2: 16:29

No, Is anybody there?

Speaker 1: 16:31

on Zoloft or, you know, prozac right, um, very, very spiritual community.

Speaker 2: 16:39

Um, they're all, uh, faith filled, um, and they live far apart, you know, sometimes like a 15-20 minute boat ride away, but yet the unity, the way that this family on this floating platform that we lived with, the way that they saw money, was really cool. They didn't have lot, hence why we wanted to help them kind of improve their business so that they could increase their revenue, but everything that they had that they didn't need, they would give. They would give to the village. Somebody would be driving by and their boat would break down. They would take their boat out, bring them in, call a mechanic, pay for the fix, get them back on their way and never ask for a thing. And I always just said, wow, you guys are so giving. And they said it's not my money, this is, this is God's money and I'm just always provided everything that I need and the rest is is not for me. It was really beautiful.

Speaker 1: 17:43

It's a different concept to think about money too, and this has just kind of started for me. It was really beautiful. It's a different concept to think about money too, and this has just kind of started for me over the last four years. And why I was able to. I just last week actually submitted the paperwork to leave my government job and like say goodbye to the pension and the health insurance and all that and the salary. And it's just because it was so ingrained in me that, like, you need this and the goal is to get higher and higher and higher and higher in your place of work. The goal was never really like but are you doing what you love? Are you doing what you love or why are you doing it?

Speaker 1: 18:19

You know, so, coming to those terms, that like this money that you speak of, it is like paper. It's not backed by anything. It's not even backed by gold anymore. You know you have Wall Street and the Federal Reserve and they're all kind of just saying it's worth something different every day. You know prices change on everything every day, so money is literally nothing. It's just what other people say it's worth, and so it makes total sense that they live this way and I'm assuming many more cultures do as well. It's more of an American or a Western kind of civilization thing that we do hold this paper in such high standing that we're willing to send our kids away and send ourselves away and live by someone else's clock and someone else's management of time.

Speaker 2: 19:12

It's true yet so necessary, it is absolutely necessary and so kind of to circle back around to your initial question about how we do this I actually, when my son got sick, I started to realize me going back to my career was not going to be viable. So I actually started my own business when my kids were all little. They were three under three and I started a business and in true gen form I really became obsessed with it, grew it and really didn't have any balance in my life. I was working 15 hour days, I'd work all through the night and it was an eco store and refillery and eventually I had opened up three stores. I don't know what that means.

Speaker 1: 20:07

You're going to have to explain that Eco filling.

Speaker 2: 20:12

A refillery. So everything from your shampoo to your makeup, to your lotion, to your deodorant, to your cleaners, to your everything you can just take your container and go and fill it back up, instead of getting a new container every time beautiful and I had opened up stores in other cities and did this kind of all whilst managing homeschool and my son's hospital schedule, and it was a very exhausting time.

Speaker 2: 20:44

But I was also really being filled up by what I was doing and what I was showing the kids, because in lieu of curriculum, they were getting a business education. So they were heavily involved. They were helping me count inventory, they would help me stock shelves, they would help me label, and the tasks were endless that they were able to be involved in on the on the ground level of watching either a store be opened from the ground up or even behind the scenes. So they were really involved in that. And I did that for three years and then sold my business. So that gave me a bit of breathing room. And then it took me four to six months to convince my husband to leave his job.

Speaker 2: 21:30

Yeah, he was not on board at first. He is very much in the mindset that's the opposite of me job put into RRSPs, try and retire by 50, 60. And that's just the way life goes. You put your kids in school and formal education and save for their college and all of it. For me, I was like, no, I don't want to do any of that and so I just asked him. I said give me a year. And so I just asked him. I said give me a year, Give me one year, Try and hear me out, Try and think of things, Quiet all the noise and open up your mind to new ways of thinking. And if you revert back to your old ways at the end of that year, that's totally fine because you've given me a chance. Reluctantly, he finally agrees, and now it's been a couple of years and he hasn't gone back to his job. He actually was offered a job almost double his salary the month we got back from our first big trip and he declined and he was like no.

Speaker 1: 22:40

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Speaker 1: 23:46

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Speaker 1: 24:25

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Speaker 2: 25:02

So, as my kids have started to get up into higher grades now my daughter's in grade four I have had to find teachers that, um, because we actually you can register as homeschool or enroll and we're actually enrolled with an online school, so we do have a teacher support who we are accountable to, which I like because it kind of keeps me on track and going like, my kids get the opportunity every year to make the decision Do you want to go to school or do you want to be homeschooled? Another year, and unanimously every year they choose to be homeschooled. But I have it as a fail safe plan. I register them for school and so that they have their spot in their local school and then we just withdraw if they decide not to and also make sure that they're you know, mas amenos, that they are where they should be, you know, with the BC curriculum.

Speaker 1: 26:01

So it's probably a little different there in Canada and British Columbia than it is in the States Right yeah, many of the episodes of alone are filmed here in british columbia yes, vancouver island was the first few yes.

Speaker 2: 26:18

So, um, I kind of just like to know that they are somewhat on track and, um, we have that teacher. But I've had to go through a few teachers until we could get to the point where it's like I am not writing weekly reports in monthly check-ins to show and demonstrate everything that we're doing. Our teacher now has full faith in what I'm doing and supports it and, due to my son's special needs, we actually have a tutor. And I cannot recommend this enough if you are somebody like me, because I did this in my business and now I'm doing it in homeschool is that there are elements of homeschool that I do not like, and if I don't enjoy it, how am I going to be excited and relay and convey enthusiasm towards that subject to my kids? So I, I outsource it so that tutor actually teaches my children language arts, and then I do math, and then I feel like social studies and science are well covered by our lifestyle and yeah, so we've had a few hiccups along the way. I felt kind of on an island sometimes because I've had a few hiccups along the way. I felt kind of on an island sometimes because I've had to convince my husband, had to convince the tutor had to convince the teacher and our whole community around us.

Speaker 2: 27:41

It was actually grade three that my daughter was still not interested in reading, and when we would try and push it, you know her page would be soaked with tears and I was like what, what, what is this? What are we doing? And she is. She is so highly emotionally intelligent, she is. She's a pretty wild girl. If you met her, you think she's going on 30. She's very smart, but she just had no interest in it so I said let's just forget about it and then kind of snuck it in all the time while we were out and about and her love for it grew. And then now she's in grade four and this spring she asked if we could go on a mommy and her date. And I said why don't we do a reading challenge to do it? And I said you pick the amount of books in the time frame and whatever you set. Once you get to the end, we'll go on our date.

Speaker 2: 28:37

And she chose 100 books. She crushed 100 novels in 30 days. Novels, yeah, well, you know that she's grade four, so they are chapter books, though. Yeah, they're not like the honking ones, but they are, you know pretty decent uh size books and she did 130 days and now I can't stop her from reading.

Speaker 2: 28:58

So I just I really have liked, and that was kind of a sweet victory for me, for everyone around going like you don't need to force these kids. If they're not feeling ready, whether it's emotionally, emotionally or you know their brain development, it's like well, you should be doing this by this age. I don't really subscribe to that. I feel like we all have our gifts and we should foster those and pour into those and and where we are lacking, we can slowly bring it up.

Speaker 2: 29:28

But we all don't need to be proficient in everything because you know, I um, we are a family of faith and God and I believe God has given us all our own unique gifts. And if our goal as a society is for all of our skills to all just be good in all areas, how will we ever flourish in the ways that we were gifted? So my daughter is very artistic and I really like to foster that in her and my son I don't know if you watched the reel I had posted recently he is so gifted mathematically. We call him the accountant because my kids have actually just started their own business. So awesome.

Speaker 2: 30:09

Yeah, they started a gemstone bracelet business. Awesome, yeah, they started a gemstone bracelet business and they it's been two weeks now and they are just crushing it. They've done. They've done $3,000 in two weeks already.

Speaker 1: 30:22

How do I get on this Like? Are they selling them online? Yep.

Speaker 2: 30:28

Yeah, they've done markets. They're selling online and so they're having to learn about they created a business plan. We've done sourcing and this, I think, is the best education because it's everything into one. We were down at the farmer's market. We're interacting with farmers and other makers and they're learning how each of those makers are making their unique products and there's really cool stories down at a farmer's market about how some ideas are born.

Speaker 2: 30:59

And then they are doing all the interacting with customers, so the customer service and community engagement. And then they've had some give back initiatives because it's been so. Their business has been so blessed so far that they have we're doing actually a project this afternoon after this a little girl with cancer. We're doing 45 bracelets to go out to the whole team that has been caring for this little girl. So it's just it's been really cool. It was their idea to start the business and I feel like the foundation that they've had laid for them, watching me build mine. They're like you know, they've got it and they're doing really well so far. And go ahead and look at a curriculum of subjects and this is already ticking every single one.

Speaker 1: 31:48

Yes, you're so right and I think I've talked about this before. When, like my son is, he's almost six. So we are completing our kindergarten year this year and you know when I haven't actually done curriculum with him on a consistent basis in a few months, but we started out last July. You know, banging it out every three, four days a week and it would take a couple of hours and there were tears, and you know it was like do you want to just go to school? Instead, you have to learn this stuff and your friends are all learning it. And you know, do you want to be left behind? And mommy doesn't want you to have a bad job when you're older. But it's like it definitely took me evolving. You know talking to the homeschooling families helped, but to be like, listen, if my kid can't read by age six, that's my insecurity, that's me fearing that other people are going to judge me as a homeschooling parent.

Speaker 1: 32:49

She must not be working with him. He needs a professional, he needs a specialist. You know she's she's not doing enough with him, right, but that's my own insecurity. I know there's nothing actually like wrong with his ability to learn, it is just having the interest or not having the interest in it. So that's why the last couple of months the weather's gotten a little nicer. We are now in like a million forts and activities and all that stuff.

Speaker 1: 33:19

And you know, anytime that he has the opportunity for a play date or, uh, you know something, where we're outside with other kids, I always choose that over curriculum. I never say always choose that over curriculum. I never say no, we can't make it, we have to do math. Because he's five right now and it's like getting out there to play. And even yesterday we were um, we just started getting really nice weather here in upstate New York. We were in my in-laws pool, him and a friend and I was just kind of like who can tell me what's five plus six? And you know. So they were having a little competition of who could shout it out, you know, um things like that are enough in the pool in the sun.

Speaker 1: 34:02

And so I really just kind of had to to realize like I can't take my own insecurities out on him. I can't take the fact that I'm afraid people will judge me as being a poor homeschooling parent on him and make this a terrible experience for us. It has to be something enjoyable and like yes, we'll have to learn to read, but that will come. Because his brain is so one I can't focus for too long. And then he's asking things like well, mom, why is W-A-S was? Why don't they just say W-U Z? And I'm like I don't know, that's a smart question.

Speaker 1: 34:44

So it's like you're trying to teach a five-year-old these crazy concepts of like here's A, a makes the sound A and S makes the sound S. But when you put was together, a doesn't make that sound anymore and S doesn't make that sound anymore. And of course, a five-year-old is not at the level of comprehension for like that to make sense. So you're just frustrating them, frustrating yourself. So, yeah, we really do have to. Just take take the fact that they're doing whatever they're doing in school. It's not working because IQ levels are low. Kids don't know how to communicate. They don't know general things about life when they graduate from high school generally.

Speaker 2: 35:27

So take it easy Take that breath, and that's the other thing is we are going to learn to read and do math by default, just by living, and I try and integrate learning into our lives in ways that they don't even know what's happening. So I'd hand my four-year-old 15 fruit snacks and just say, hey, can you divide these up and make sure the three of you get an equal amount? And they're just sitting there dividing it up and I'm like, okay, how many did each of you get Five? Okay, great, go play right. And you just did like a mini math lesson and then you do the next thing, and then you do the next thing and make sure that it's all enjoyable and playful. And you know, I really resonate with what you said like he's crying and then, probably later you're crying and everybody's crying, and it's also that you can replicate something that you aren't subscribing to anyways that you aren't subscribing to anyways.

Speaker 2: 36:33

Absolutely, and so you know my, my kindergartner is doing grade three math and Emily is reading above her grade level now. But the difference is is that I didn't force her to do it before she wanted to. And that doesn't mean that my kids are spoiled. My kids are hardworking and resilient, because I think that's kind of. The other misconception is that, oh, living somewhere where the food is not anything that they're used to and they lived somewhere for a long time where their, their language was not spoken, not one word. Oh, these are not spoiled kids, diva kids. I get to do whatever I want.

Speaker 2: 37:29

They have learned resilience in other ways that are, I guess, more unconventional, but, yeah, they still get done what they need to get done and I feel like their work ethic and their resiliency shines through in moments of real life, and it's really also kind of cool that they don't seem to have the fear that many people have. You know, when we're out and about, I've had so many people come up and go wow, your kids are such fantastic swimmers. Like, what swim level are they in? My kids have never had a swim lesson ever. Dan, my kids have never had a swim lesson ever, you know, but when he was four, he was learned to swim in the Amazon river, which has a tremendous current, and so you know, and then people go, you let your kids swim there, like, aren't there piranhas? Yeah, aren't there electric eels? Yeah, aren't there caiman and anaconda? And but those are your fears, right, that's.

Speaker 2: 38:35

And I find that fear a lot of times for people is just the unfamiliar, and so we go hiking up in the mountains here. Aren't there bears? Yeah, aren't there cougars? Yeah, aren't there rattlesnakes? Yeah, right. But that's just your familiar fear or your familiar dangers that you expose yourself to, and so you do the odd thing whether you carry a bear bell or bear spray or whatever you, you do whatever that you do to make those dangers acceptable to you. And then you live your life and we just expose ourselves to many unfamiliar dangers to many people and they think it's crazy. But I don't think that we as a family have much fear about the world as a result.

Speaker 1: 39:22

Yeah, I mean, how is it different? Don't you send your kid to school? Aren't there school shootings? I mean, you know, like there's danger everywhere. Yeah, it's just the danger.

Speaker 2: 39:32

You know like there's danger everywhere. And it's just the danger, you know right, and it's the danger that you don't know that you think, oh, you need to avoid that. And why would you put yourself in that kind of danger? We were just in Costa Rica again recently, and my daughter yelled from the room she goes oh mom, there's a scorpion in my room. And I said and my daughter yelled from the room she goes oh mom, there's a scorpion in my room. And I said, okay, I'm coming.

Speaker 1: 39:56

And she goes no, no, I took care of it Like okay, girl, what do you do to take care of a scorpion? Just out of curiosity, she's Christian, aren't they big?

Speaker 2: 40:06

No, this was a smaller one, but you know she's kind of like seeing a spider, yeah. I guess we have many. We have many scorpions in the house In Costa Rica.

Speaker 1: 40:19

Mm-hmm, holy moly. Are you trying to pick a curriculum but feel a little overwhelmed at the variety of options? Me too, I mean, how do you pick a curriculum when you don't know what each one has to offer? That's been my biggest problem. Well, I am here to help. I just launched a premium content series, psst. That means it's $3 a month, which will just help cover the cost of running the podcast.

Speaker 1: 40:41

In my curriculum series, I interview homeschooling students and parents and curriculum creators about specific curriculum each week so that you can take the guesswork out of your curriculum choices. I'll be asking questions like what does the day-to-day look like with this curriculum? What does it cover from a bird's eye view? How long does one lesson take to complete? How many lessons does the curriculum contain and what does it cost? Did you have to order the book or could you download them and print them somewhere like your library?

Speaker 1: 41:07

Does this curriculum have a lot of games, writing or crafts, and did your child enjoy this curriculum? Can you do it with more than one child at a time? And if I did this curriculum with my child, would I need to add any sort of supplements to it? These are all questions that I've had while I search for the perfect curriculum to suit my son's personality and my expectations. Let's face it there is no one curriculum out there that will work best for every child and adult, so I invite you to join me in my search to find out what every curriculum has to offer, so that you can feel confident in your curriculum choices and enjoy your homeschooling journey that much more. Right where you find all of the Homeschool How-To Podcast episodes, you'll see my curriculum series and you can subscribe today. Let me ask you this how did your children and you guys adjust to being in a place where English was not a primary language, if spoken at all?

Speaker 2: 42:03

So we do do Spanish lessons on an app every single day and you'd be surprised how quickly children pick up a second language and how slowly adults pick up a second language. So yeah, that's the first thing. If you're ever going to introduce your kids to a second language, do it as early as possible, because their brains are just sponges and they tend to not. You said your son asked a question which I found interesting because they tend to not question like we do. You know, like why is that was? And that instead of you know a UZ there.

Speaker 2: 42:41

But whereas me in adulthood, there's like a you know feminine and masculine to every word in the Spanish language and I'm like why is dress masculine? Like that doesn't make any sense. And my kids are like whatever it just is, like, just say it, mom, right? So they, they question way less and they retain way more.

Speaker 2: 43:01

And I also find that kids are so much less I don't know bashful than adults, adults for adults, we tend to not want to try in fear of embarrassment, whereas the kids are like I will just try and you're going to get what you get and the rest I'm going to act out. And next thing, you know, the kids are communicating beautifully with one another and neither speak a word of the same language. There was another little girl who lived on the platform and they played all day, every day, not speaking a word of the same language, and it never. Another little girl who lived on the platform and they played all day, every day, not speaking a word of the same language, and it never got in their way. So I feel like adults we let that get in our way way more than kids do.

Speaker 1: 43:44

Yeah, that's so cool. Okay, where else have you been?

Speaker 2: 43:48

Yeah, like I said, we've been to throughout the Caribbean. We've done Aruba, jamaica. Yeah, like I said, we've been to throughout the Caribbean. We've done Aruba, jamaica, colombia, costa Rica, nicaragua, panama and then a lot actually in the States. We just did a really cool trip in the States that we did Zion National Park and the Grand Canyon and went up through California and did the Redwood Forest. Like it's just stunning. You guys are really blessed in the States with so much natural beauty. We went to a place that was just like a fairyland. It was called Fern Canyon.

Speaker 1: 44:26

Where is?

Speaker 2: 44:27

that it's in California, okay, but it's just this little creek running through and the canyon walls are just completely vertical and completely covered in greenery and ferns, and so you're just walking through these shallow waters, just through it. It's very magical. But yeah, we've even had some really cool experiences down in the US, and then we did so many places in Europe. We did Slovenia, croatia, italy, spain.

Speaker 1: 45:01

So uh, and this is all in the span of the last four years. Uh, three, so okay. So, take me through your process of I know you did talk about like the flights are cheaper here, so we'll pick where we're gonna go, but like even staying at a place, like are you staying in hostels?

Speaker 2: 45:22

No, we'll usually always stay somewhere, but sometimes, yeah, it may be a one bedroom but it has a kitchen and so we can go to the local markets or the grocery store and do our cooking and, you know, actually make a bit of a home base. But it's not in a tourist area. It'll be somewhere where we are, you know, getting to know the community, and once that happens, that's when the magic starts to happen.

Speaker 1: 45:48

Mm, hmm, and so your husband left his job, was he able to do something like working remotely?

Speaker 2: 45:55

Yeah, we have done a bit of business consulting. I have continued to do some business consulting to help other women kind of get started in doing what I had done. We're now moving into some financial consulting. He's licensed I'm getting licensed next and so we're always dabbling. He's doing some construction and development projects so we bought some land that he's developing. So we're always kind of working. But it is so wild that our life now doesn't have any kind of conventional structure and doesn't resemble the life that we used to have.

Speaker 1: 46:34

Yeah, yeah, because I think most people, myself included, would hear this and be like, yeah, I think I really could do that, but how could I make that work with having the money just to even stay someplace overnight, make sure we had enough money for food? So you, but there are ways with the technology and the internet. You know, my husband does commercial HVAC. So I'm just thinking like, well, how could he? He could probably go anywhere in the world and work on people's hair conditioners, plumbing, that sort of thing. But how you can do.

Speaker 2: 47:09

it is not him. Hands-on tools you could create a business where you hired people and that he was managing that business remotely, and then that's kind of how it happened.

Speaker 1: 47:22

I'm more of the manager, he likes the hands-on, so that made him want to be in the Amazon, probably building a chiller or something.

Speaker 2: 47:32

Well, the thing is, is that's kind of what my husband used to do. He was addicted to work, he loves work, and it's been really kind of cool to watch his whole mind, body and spirit change out of that high gear all the time. And I think and I guess this is why I don't talk about it as much is because you would really have to go on faith. We, we went without knowing how it was going to work, that the how was not defined, but the faith that it would was and so it is. It is crazy once you just go. So, whatever you have to do whether you downsize your home we actually renovated our house, we have a large house because we were both successful working professionals Turned out a part of our house, turned it into an Airbnb and I rent that out remotely so I can do that from anywhere. Have a team that cleans it and I manage it, and so that subsidizes our home. And then, if you can set up a bit of money just to get yourself started, who cares how long you're going for that doesn't need to be defined, but go and go with an open heart and an open mind to the experience and the opportunities that have come our way Once you go and you go with the openness to it. It's so crazy. It is so crazy what happens.

Speaker 2: 49:03

I ended up having breakfast every morning with this man in Costa Rica. He was Canadian, but he lives down in the US and owns I didn't know this, but he owns a substantial amount of land in Costa Rica and I was so drawn to him and I was sitting there having breakfast with him every morning and I made porridge one morning. He goes can you make this for me every morning? I said, yeah, sure. So we started having porridge together every day and I told him about our big dreams, about our development project that I wanted to do, and he was like, oh, you got to take it bigger. And I said, well, we don't have money, and he goes you need to have friends with money. I said, well, we don't have friends with money, and he goes yeah, you do, you just need to make them forage every day.

Speaker 2: 49:52

And turns out he is a multi, multi, multimillionaire. He owns land all over the world. He owns businesses all over the world. He's connected with is all over the world he's connected with. So here's the funny thing my husband listens to this podcast of this real estate tycoon all the time and he was listening to it.

Speaker 2: 50:12

One morning and I'm sitting having breakfast with this gentleman and I said just to come and sit with us and he was just talking about the podcast that he was listening to and my friend Walter goes. I just cut off the phone with him before I had breakfast with Jen and like here's his phone number. So you know it is. It's just wild the things that can happen and will happen if you just kind of relax into an uncomfortable or, I guess, unknown experience. That is one experience I can tell you of 50 that we've had over the years of going. You know he goes, you seem so relaxed down here in Costa Rica. I was thinking of buying the hotel right there. I would love if you guys wanted to move down here and run it. You know you work to ownership and all this and it's like we said no, thank you, but there's just an opportunity for you.

Speaker 1: 51:09

It's like if you really like living here here's an opportunity that was just put in front of us to live here. You're so right. How has your worldview changed from you know, the old life that you lived, to now exploring the world and really being immersed in it? I mean, we live in a world where every time you turn on the media it's fear and this and that COVID, I mean all that jazz. I can't even imagine what that looked like around the world. How has that changed for you, for how you look at the world?

Speaker 2: 51:35

I would say media sensationalizes a lot of it, but there are definitely really obstacles for people that you're in New York, you said that in Canada and the US we don't face and the things that people complain about here. I think they're complaining about the wrong things. We should be complaining about all the ways that stress and busyness is keeping us sick and be grateful for all the ways that we don't have real things to complain about, like the political corruption that we experienced with friends that we made in Zimbabwe. We traveled all throughout Africa. We did about nine countries along the eastern coast of Africa and they would put their polling stations like six hours away from their home. So you know just stuff like that, where you go. We don't have that um and we don't have true fears. We just have, um, I think, I think, fears that are real to us because we lack the perspective.

Speaker 2: 52:46

Yeah, and so I think maybe that's how my views have changed and I also am kind of unique in this world. Many people go all in, they sell their home and they just travel the world full time. And we haven't done that and so we kind of have this really unique dance that we have to do where we go. We're kind of world schoolers. We travel the world and we live this kind of wild and crazy life with such unique experiences.

Speaker 2: 53:16

But then we have to come back home and reintegrate into our community again and try and go like okay, who's not too busy for a play date and you know who's not moved on with with the new community, and try and kind of settle back into that. And, you know, not sign up for activities because we know we're leaving and you're going to miss half the season. Or not sign up for um to do service at church because I know I won't be able to fulfill. You know, we kind of have to do this very unique dance of we kind of live at home and we've kind of been traveling and doing that for years. So I don't know too many people who do that, but you're constantly in a in a state of transition.

Speaker 1: 53:58

Yeah, yeah. Do you think that that will have? What do you think the effect on your children of that will be? I mean, overall, these experiences are going to give them more than most kids ever get in a lifetime, most adults ever get in a lifetime. So obviously that is great. Do you think? Like you know, do you see them doing this as they're older?

Speaker 2: 54:22

I have no idea and I really don't have much fear or criticism towards myself, because I know that what I'm doing each and every day is, with the best of intentions, to give my kids a good experience. And so the long-term effects. I can't tell you that because I don't think any of us can, I don't think you can, about the mother who's sending their kids to school every single day, or the mother who's sending their kids to a private school, or the mother who's homeschooling their kids or traveling with their kids. Do any of us know what effect that is going to have on our respective children, with their personality types? Or you know the sector of the world that we live in? I don't think any of us know.

Speaker 2: 55:06

But I know that they are really happy, they're really thriving, they are. We do still have to do the exams, you know, like the grade four, grade seven, grade nine, grade 12 here, and they crush their exams. Like you know. They're working ahead, like my kindergartners working in grade three stuff. So I know that they're thriving academically. I know that they're thriving socially and they have a really cool view of the world that that is free from from fear, which I think is the greatest gift I can give them. So I don't know if what I'm doing is the best, but I really don't have fear or criticism of myself about it, because I'm just going in with the best of intentions and trying to give them the best life.

Speaker 1: 55:53

And with your son that has the special needs and spent a lot of time in the hospital. Have you had to make sure that there is adequate healthcare where you do go, or is he doing well now that you don't have to worry about that?

Speaker 2: 56:08

No, yeah, that that is one that definitely takes a lot of faith that we did not have adequate or close medical care when we're in the middle of the Amazon jungle, that's for sure. And yeah, he had one of his most severe medical episodes on that platform and it was. It was very difficult, but you know whether we're here, whether we're there, it's. We've also had seven years to get used to it and get comfortable with what we're comfortable dealing with on our own versus what we need the medical system for. So I think that comfortability, with us feeling like we can take care of him, has given us the freedom to go.

Speaker 2: 56:58

Okay, we can go a little further away, but he just had a surgery a year and a half ago now, or not even, and we did make sure. Okay, are there centers? And there are centers all over the world, and you just get the right insurances and go. Well, come what may. But this is not the only hospital in the world, the one that's near our home, and so a lot of times the medical care is actually far superior.

Speaker 1: 57:26

So I was going to ask you that have you found that there are better health care? Like I know, I had on a woman who had had cancer and she said that the chemo pretty much almost killed her here. So she went to Germany where they did a fecal transplant. So it took like the good feces from a healthy human and inserted them into her to fix her microbiome, because the chemo and radiation just killed everything in her, it was going to kill her and she went to Germany for that and it's illegal in the States.

Speaker 2: 58:03

Yeah yeah, You'll find that a lot. We've spent a significant amount of time in Costa Rica. They have a fantastic medical system there and I found a lot of people from the States headed down there for treatment Patients with cancer. A lot of times they're seeking alternative treatments in Mexico and we even found that a lot in Europe.

Speaker 1: 58:22

Yeah, we found that a lot in Europe.

Speaker 2: 58:23

So, yeah, we found that a lot in Europe people coming from. There was actually quite a few people from Russia who had come to Germany for medical treatment. So I have two neighbors right next to my home here that have flown to Germany for treatment. So, yeah, I think there will be specialties all over the world and sometimes you do need to travel for that and so just knowing that everything right next to you know, the close radius of your home is not not the be all end.

Speaker 1: 58:54

All that's so true. That's such good advice. We are already like done with the hour. I feel like I could ask you a bajillion more questions, but as you were thinking about coming on this podcast. Was there anything that? You wanted to make sure that we touched base on that you let the listeners know about.

Speaker 2: 59:12

I think the only message that I ever like to give anybody is to let go of the fear and judgment and really follow your intuition. I don't think that learning ever needs to involve tears and force and stress. You can listen to interviews of people who are just wildly successful Elon Musk or Bill Gates, or a president. You don't ever, ever hear the question what age did you start reading at? It's not a question, right? Yes, so you know going are my kids doing what they need to do exactly according to this timetable? And then stressing them out. Stressing you out accordingly is it's just not it, and so that's kind of my message. But also being really in tune with your kids' gifts and skills and fostering those, because we all need to work. We need to work as adults, as kids, we need to put in work every single day to make ourselves better, and so I just like to do my message to be to foster your kids kids gifts and to really let go of the fear and judgment around what they're not interested in.

Speaker 1: 1:00:29

yet that's such good advice. Jennifer Norman, where can people find you if they want to follow your journeys and your tidbits of advice?

Speaker 2: 1:00:39

Well, within Jen's lens is my Instagram, and I really try and do as much sharing as I can while being really present in the experience when we travel. Oh yes, it's so hard, share some tidbits on there of many of our travels, so you're welcome to follow me there and the kids'. New business is Reign Underscore Goods. It's R-E-I goods and that's where you can find their bracelets and follow them, because they've been making some really cool content on their page as well.

Speaker 1: 1:01:13

That's so fun. Thank you so much for joining me today. This has been so cool to learn about.

Speaker 2: 1:01:19

Maybe in a year I will be in a you know a jungle somewhere you message me and I will give you the encouragement to take the leap, because anyone can do it. Honestly, I have not come from a Silver Spoon background, but it's just been a lot of risk and leaps of faith.

Speaker 1: 1:01:37

I think I'll start going around the US first because, like you said, there's so many places here. We'll take baby steps, baby steps. Thank you, jennifer, us first because they're like you said, there's so many places here.

Speaker 2: 1:01:45

We'll take baby steps, baby steps, thank you jennifer nature experiences, but you won't get the cultural experiences but, like you said, baby steps very true.

Speaker 1: 1:01:56

Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you for tuning in to this week's episode of the Homeschool How-To. If you've enjoyed what you heard and you'd like to contribute to the show, please consider leaving a small tip using the link in my show's description. Or, if you'd rather, please use the link in the description to share this podcast with a friend or on your favorite homeschool group Facebook page. Any effort to help us keep the podcast going is greatly appreciated. Thank you for tuning in and for your love of the next generation.