#102: From Challenge to Triumph: A Single Mom's Homeschooling Journey with Seven Kids

TRIGGER WARNING!! In this episode, Stacy shares with us her journey of overcoming abuse and doing it all while homeschooling. This episode talks about some tough subjects and may not be suitable for kids to hear. Stacy gives us some great pointers for how to talk to our kids about abuse and what to do if they find themselves in that situation- which could just be a friend or family member showing them something inappropriate on the phone... This is a powerful episode with a message that shouldn't be ignored.

Stacy shares her journey into homeschooling her seven children as a single mother, highlighting the challenges and joys that come with this educational approach. Through her experiences, she emphasizes the importance of fostering a love for learning, building resilience, and creating a nurturing environment that celebrates curiosity.

• Stacy’s initial motivation to homeschool
• The benefits of using living books in education
• Addressing dyslexia through tailored educational methods
• The importance of community support for single parents
• Overcoming fears of inadequacy in homeschooling
• The journey of preparing children for college as homeschoolers
• Exploring the balance between teaching and allowing children to learn naturally
• Reflecting on the significance of character building through adversity
• Thoughts on the limitations of traditional schooling
• Concluding insights on empowering children through education and experiences


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Chapters

• 0:06 Single Mom Homeschooling Journey
• 12:17 Empowering Kids to Pursue Passions
• 18:40 College Acceptance and Unschooling Approaches
• 26:41 Community Support During Family Crisis
• 33:53 Learning Through Experience and Lifelong Growth
• 41:11 Teaching Kids About Emergencies and Abuse
• 46:01 Protecting Kids From Online Dangers
• 56:35 Overcoming Fear and Pursuing Homeschooling
• 1:04:03 Safety Measures and Homeschooling Insights

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:06

Welcome to this week's episode of the Homeschool How-To. I'm Cheryl and I invite you to join me on my quest to find out why are people homeschooling, how do you do it, how does it differ from region to region, and should I homeschool my kids? Stick with me as I interview homeschooling families across the country to unfold the answers to each of these questions week by week. Welcome, and with us today I have Stacey Stacey. Thank you so much for being here, Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1: 0:38

Alright, you have how many children? And I'm going to let you just say how many you have, and can you name all their ages?

Speaker 2: 0:46

Seven. Yes, so it's 9, 11, 13, 14, 17, 19, 22.

Speaker 1: 0:54

Okay, I feel a little bit better because some of them are now self-sufficient, like you're not running around with all these little ones and then and then taking time out of your day to do a podcast, because that was really throwing me for a loop. I was trying to get dinner ready. The instapot didn't cook the chicken like it should have, so I had it back in. I'm like, get in the basement, get in the basement. I'm like how is she doing this with seven? I only have two.

Speaker 2: 1:16

It's such a different stage of life when you get teenagers and drivers and I have one dropping somebody off at gymnastics and one taking someone else to a mall- Well, people still go to malls.

Speaker 1: 1:29

That's good to hear, I guess. So what state are you in? I'm in California, okay, nice, all right. I'm in New York, so totally opposite end. It's like nighttime and snowing here. I would imagine it's still daylight and beautiful where you are. I would imagine it's still daylight and beautiful, where you are Awesome, all right, and do you homeschool I?

Speaker 2: 1:47

do. Yes, I love it. I graduated my oldest two homeschooling and it's definitely an amazing journey.

Speaker 1: 1:55

All right. So what I really loved about like what struck my eye on Instagram which is why I reached out to you is you post a lot about like doing this as a single mom, and that is one of the biggest questions I get from people like, oh, I'd love to homeschool, but I can't. I'm a single mom, and I was like well, here there are people that do it, and I've and I've had some on the podcast before as well, but I love hearing all the different like strategies that you know, thinking outside the box, that moms do to make this lifestyle work. So let's just go back to the beginning, though. What made you even want to homeschool in the first place?

Speaker 2: 2:27

So I had homeschool before I became a single mom. It started when my oldest was. She was in private school and I saw how it just was robbing her love of learning and her excitement for life, and she looked like a tired executive. This is not healthy and I knew we could do better, and so I started homeschooling her and my number one goal at that time was to get her to love reading. She hated to read and I thought my premise was if you love to learn, you love the Lord, you have a character and you love to read, you enjoy the story. You can essentially learn anything and do anything in life. Right, if you have that passion for learning, then there's nothing that's going to stop you. You'll always pursue it and you can always increase whatever you're doing Right, and so, um. So that was that was my learning period. My learning curve was with my oldest and I had two little ones at the time, and then we um.

Speaker 2: 3:18

So what I did with her was what ended up transferring over to what I would recommend actually to a lot of parents, which is always stop when they still want more. So I would read a story and I know it was a living book when my kids were just engulfed right, they're like what's going to happen? And as soon as I could see them just hungry for more, I would close the book and I'd say, okay, let's do something else. Or maybe it was let's make a recipe from this time period, or do you guys want to play, dress up from what we just read or find where these characters are on the map, anything creative like that? But I always wanted to stop it and I kid you not. This led to conversations like if I clean my room, can we read another chapter? So you just have to stop when they still want more and not cram it down their throat. And then it just fosters this hunger and this desire and cultivates them thinking about the story and backing off of creative writing assignments and rather just letting them form, formulate that in their brain developmentally, if that makes sense. So I've improved on that through every kid, but she was my first and an avid reader, loves to read. Her wish list for Christmas is always books. So yeah, and and so, and it's true, you know they can pursue anything.

Speaker 2: 4:28

So then, when I became a single mom, I did have many babies, like very, very little. I was pregnant with my seventh, I had an 11 month old, like toddlers. My youngest was, or my oldest was 12, so seven kids under 12 and four under four, and so on. And so it was. That was a really crazy, crazy season of life, to say the least, and I did panic. I was like, okay, I I fundamentally believe homeschooling is the best thing we can do for our kids. But I panicked and I put my kids in school, which was really ironic, because four of them were too young to do anything, and so I had four babies at home, and then it just became abundantly clear that it was doing more harm than good, you know.

Speaker 2: 5:12

And it was obvious that I needed to pull them in homeschool. And so, for example, my third. He is profoundly dyslexic, so he was the last one that I pulled Because at this time I'm thinking there are, you know, they have so endless resources. It seems right for special, whatever the special ed department, right, yeah? And so I'm thinking I know I'm capable. Any of us can learn anything. Any of us can be doctors. We're all humans, right? Any of us are capable of learning anything.

Speaker 2: 5:39

But I was spread really thin and I didn't think that I could learn how to teach to a profoundly dyslexic student. But I watched it just destroy him, like the system and the way that it attempts to teach kids and the environment. Even in one of the top public schools, you know, it's considered that with teachers that cared and nice families. It wasn't like we were in, you know, really rough area or anything but it it just destroyed his love of learning exponentially and made him have symptoms of depression and self-esteem issues and I'm thinking I'm ruining this kid's childhood. Why would I do this to him? I mean, the worst thing that's going to happen is he doesn't read at a certain age. But the worst thing that's going to happen if I leave him there is, his childhood is ruined, you know, and you can't get that back and so so that was a huge leap of faith, taking him out, and I actually went in and toured a school. It was a private school, very expensive for dyslexic students, and their whole thing is, you know, after so much time we'll get your kid at grade level and they can go back to the mainstream system. And it turns out that that curriculum that they use or strategy that they use was what I had learned to teach my first daughter when I pulled her out. So God had already kind of equipped me unknowingly. And then he had such a negative connotation with pen and paper that I did how long? Probably more than a year of no pen and paper, no pencil and paper at all. So if he was trying to decode something, trying to read something, trying to spell something, trying to spell something, it was his own leading that brought to that. And then I would just use you're just basically breaking the words up really slowly and then I focused on just rebuilding him as a person, just what builds his confidence, what makes him have a happy childhood and brings that joy back into childhood, and maybe I'd play an audio book in the background and we'd go skateboarding while you know, come home and play with clay, with classical music or whatever.

Speaker 2: 7:30

He was in fourth grade and the crazy thing is that by not doing school in eight, so okay. So let me back up. So when he went into school from homeschooling, he was reading at a late kindergarten, early first grade level. And then in fourth grade, when I pulled him, he was reading at a late kindergarten, early first grade level. And I'm like we're destroying you and you're not even you know, maybe like a tiny bit of progression. But also, these are kids, like we all learn to walk at different ages and stages. If you and I were running, you can tell who walked at nine months versus 14 or 12, you know, and so um. So within eight months he was reading at grade level and he didn't hate it and I still won't force it on him. It's not even about that. It's about like, where are your gifts and skills? And then I watch him. The dyslexic people are the movers and shakers of the world. They get things done. He can look at something. It's so impossible for me to assemble and figure out a solution so many times.

Speaker 1: 8:22

You have a gift that I don't have you know, almost like looking at a rubrics cube and know how to figure out the answer. So I'm like how do you do that.

Speaker 2: 8:31

So yeah and um, and then my, my youngest, who was old enough for school, was in kindergarten and I went and sat in. You know, I was volunteering and I had my babies with me and they were very sweet to let me have everybody, but it was the assignment was it was so sad, but it was the assignment was it was so sad and it was a fun assignment according to the standard. And so they read a book, and it was just a book, not anything like alive. And then they had the kids write out a sentence and draw a picture of their favorite part. And I'm thinking kindergarten, this is going to be so great, what's your favorite part? And all of them had I kid you not this petrifying anxiety. They were like she turned the projector off, I can't see what she's doing, and I was like that was her favorite part. That was the teacher's example. What is your favorite part? And none of them could do this. They wanted to get it right. It was all about getting right instead of thinking for themselves and just enjoying being immersed in the story and and having their own opinion on anything. And so I felt like and that was kind of somewhat art and literature, which should be an incredibly and creative and subjective subject. Right, you should love it and it should totally be yours. And every answer can be different and still right.

Speaker 2: 9:39

So that was a big deal breaker for me. I was like, oh, this is gonna my young, that kiddo is extremely creative, so it's like this is going to break him, he's not going to just be his creative self. And so it's one by one. It became incredibly obvious. My next step from the kindergartner. He saw all the fun field trips and stuff that we were doing and he walked his little self to the office in the beginning of first grade and said I'm not coming back after Christmas break, I'm going to go to school. And so he did. It's like, you know, it makes sense.

Speaker 2: 10:10

So, anyways, it just became abundantly clear that, whether it was I have a son who's really advanced and just learned so fast, it's not fair to the rest of us. I have kiddos who are obviously dyslexic, and you know, all across the board, but they don't customize it and they can't customize it, you know, and so and the childhood has to matter more. And that's not even talking about the things that are in the schools that are damaging, that's just talking about just the basic way that kids thrive in childhood. So my premise is that public school in my opinion is kind of extreme. In my opinion, public school in my opinion is kind of extreme.

Speaker 2: 10:43

In my opinion, public school would do for most kids so much harm to their love of learning and their future. And I'm not talking about can you pass the test in this as a, you know SATs and get into a college and then maybe you use your degree, maybe you don't right, but like the love of learning, it's gonna destroy them. It actually does so much harm to a childhood that my premise would be that your kids, our kids, are better off if we do no lessons with them. If we have access to a public library, if they have friends, if they get outside and get dirty, if they explore the world around them right, like our kids learn to walk and talk and use a spoon with us, why can we not explore the world with them? Why can we not just follow their lead and let them be curious kids, right? And if we're a single mom, maybe we don't have time.

Speaker 2: 11:31

You know what History oftentimes it's a bedtime story and there's, you know, five of them right there six of them, and it's just a living story, and if I'm really tired I'll lay down and say who wants to volunteer to read. I need to know and always stop when they want more. So then as they sleep, they're hungry for it, right? They like oh, what do you think happened? Maybe you're talking about it at the breakfast table? I don't have to have all the answers. We have Google. We can learn anything we want, and I wouldn't say we should just send our kids on Google because of online safety issues, but we can partner with them and learn together, like I graduated from a prestigious private school in Silicon Valley so really smart area and I have learned exponentially more homeschooling my own kids than I did in my own high school years.

Speaker 2: 12:15

Yeah, so I think it's absolutely doable. There's a lot of hours in a day and if you have a kiddo who is really driven and you're worried that you're going to fail him which I did he graduated this spring I was thinking I can't give him everything that he needs. He's so fast, he's 13. He was on calculus. I'm not doing calculus, so the question so then, why not empower our kids to pursue it? Right? Why? Why are we thinking that we need to teach our kids to rely on someone else to give them the knowledge. Why not teach them how to find it?

Speaker 1: 12:50

you know, and so.

Speaker 2: 12:52

So when he became we, when he was 13 and he's passionate about this I'm like that's a great idea. How could you do that, you know? And sure enough, he found someone who knew calculus, who was willing to tutor him. He ended up, you know, joining a little group of kids with a guy who loved math and he had calculus on his transcripts before he graduated and that was his personal goal. Likewise, he was so gifted in music and this is where, looking back at the time, I had so much mom guilt and I think, a lot of single moms we have so much mom guilt because we can't do it all Right, we just can't, and I'm thinking I'm going to fail him. And I had family with. You know, loving intentions kind of lay into me. Stacey, you cannot give your kids everything that they need. You're one person with seven and they all have such different needs and I really prayed about that because it stung, because that's like our biggest fear is failing our kids, right.

Speaker 1: 13:49

Right.

Speaker 2: 13:50

I leaned into it and I was like, okay, you know what You're right, like I am going to fail them. I am, I'm not going to get it all right. I'm not going to be able to give them everything that I want. I'm not going to be able to pay for private music tutors and take them to Europe and do all these things I would love to do. I will fail them, but watch my God work right, because I love them. No one is more invested in my kids than me. No one is going to be more dedicated to their wellbeing and their pursuit of their own personal passions than me.

Speaker 2: 14:18

And so my second son is who I'm talking about with the calculus. He, um, he has an amazing gift with music. I mean, he was five years old and I thought he had the automatic thing on the keyboard playing. He had learned to play it from ear and I was like it totally filled me with mom guilt that I could not get this kid into music lessons. I couldn't afford that. I couldn't afford a music tutor or piano lessons or singing lessons or any of that and um, but we learned as much as we could together, right, and he would play songs and he learned a ton of songs on the guitar, on the piano, just listening.

Speaker 2: 14:54

And then he wanted to serve at our church um youth group. He wanted to serve, like on stage, with the worship team, which required him reading notes. He's like, I don't know how to read notes, like, what can you do about that? So you find free things online and, sure enough, he learned how to read notes and then he passes it on and he teaches it to his younger siblings. So now I have a 14 year old teaching my nine year old piano and they're playing duet together. The piano was gifted to us by this amazing nine year old man who just went to a retirement home. He's so happy that the kids are loving it. It's like a real piano and so it's just. It's just beautiful how it all comes together. And and my oldest son is the original one to learn the notes and he, you know, looking back, he owns that. You know, no one fed that to him. He owns it.

Speaker 2: 15:35

he had to pursue it and then trickle it down that gift to the other kids and we'll get around tons of friends around or even just our family around a campfire and he's leading you know, leading the songs and it's really fun. And then get this with no music classes whatsoever. He goes and applies for a university because he wants to be a child psychologist, which means a degree. Right, it's not. It's not trade school. I do believe very much in trade school and very much in entrepreneurship for our kiddos. Not everybody needs a, but this is what he wants to do and it does require a degree. So he applies for universities and ends up auditioning for a choir and they gave him a massive scholarship for joining the choir and then-.

Speaker 1: 16:16

That's amazing.

Speaker 2: 16:17

Isn't that awesome. This is just, and it's just such a testimony to like it's okay to just let our kids. It's not only okay, it's just such a testimony to like it's okay to just let our kids. It's not only okay. It's beneficial to not be perfect, to not be able to give them everything, but if we are dedicated, devoted, we love them, we walk with them, we encourage them to learn what they're interested in, right? And then they fully own it.

Speaker 1: 16:40

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Speaker 2: 17:21

And there's nothing that can stop him. He ended up with a full like between the choir and the academic scholarship. He has a full ride.

Speaker 1: 17:29

That's awesome, okay. So the first thing I love what you said about stopping the reading when they're thirsty for more, because how many of us are like we have to get through three books tonight and I'm envisioning that you're up in the level of more like chapter books where we're kind of still on. You know children's books that are done after you know 10 minutes. It takes five, 10 minutes to read a book. But even you kind of um, but my son said today he goes, oh, I really like reading and I probably could have been like okay, well, we'll go, but'll go.

Speaker 1: 18:01

But I get the idea that you're saying let them fester in that story about what's happening next, and maybe that is a good segue for us to get into more of the novels. Where I have a two-year-old and a six-year-old, so it's like getting into the story so that he can think about what's going on in that story and be wondering about it and talk about it the next day, where it's not just done after five or 10 minutes. So I love that idea. I've never heard anyone say that before and it makes a lot of sense. But to still keep it in what you're doing, like finding where they are on the map or on a timeline. I love that, okay.

Speaker 1: 18:40

Second of all, so I think a lot of people are hesitant that their kids wouldn't be able to go to college. If that is a choice for their kids or you know, they're just not in that even arena yet of are they going to go to college or not, but I don't want to stifle them in any way. So could you talk a little bit about how you put the sort of this kind of unschooling approach that it sounds like you're doing and made that be something that was okay to get into college with like acceptable that colleges said yes, this works for us.

Speaker 2: 19:14

Oh yeah, colleges love homeschoolers. They do because those kids are so well-rounded and they they own right, they have character, but they also usually love to learn. There needs to be no fear around college. I was definitely concerned about that. I didn't want to limit my kids. I don't think every kid needs to go to college automatically, but I would never want to restrict or limit their options. Right, that's a big part of our mommy hearts is. We want to make sure our kids can do whatever they want to do when they grow up and to be equipped for that, and so it worked beautifully.

Speaker 2: 19:47

I used HSLDA, which I highly recommend everybody join. They have a transcript service and so I input and you know we have so many conversations on psychology him and I so many conversations and we've done case studies and we've helped survivors and victims escape and all sorts of things. Many, many, many conversations on psychology. So he's never had a textbook, a psychology textbook, but he's learned so much that he's in these college classes and his professors are going you're a freshman, how do you know this? And he goes. Well, my mom and I did a lot of psychology together and it was not something that I knew when I became a single mom. It was something I learned along the way, because it was essential for our survival.

Speaker 1: 20:25

So that's really cool, that like you can kind of say, like we like write down, do you basically write your own transcript that Well, it's a service that I use.

Speaker 2: 20:35

You can write your own Absolutely. If you're doing a university, I would use the service from HSLDA because they can send officials. So when it goes to the college it's stamped and sealed, and then it goes to them from the school, which is you. So, anyhow, we have different ways of homeschooling, and I do the private school affidavit, which gives me complete freedom. A lot of people call themselves homeschoolers but they're in a charter school, so the charter writes it which you you still are enrolled in a public school system. So it's it is different.

Speaker 1: 21:02

it's not my recommendation but yeah, you probably have some stipulations you have to follow to do that yeah, it's, it's a big difference.

Speaker 2: 21:11

They do try to be parent choice, but I've watched it over the years increasingly pull the kids outside of the home, increasingly be less and less homeschool friendly, more and more test oriented, and whereas I mean and the amazing thing is even back to the reading thing there are tons of studies. If you look at the Waldorf schools, right, they don't teach their kids to read until third grade, but they expose them, expose them to living books. You expose them to theater, expose them to poetry and songs and and stories. And if our kids are hearing a story and then they're relaying it back to us, their minds are developing that creative writing thought process, just naturally, in the love of it, right so, and not to be like, oh, can you tell me the story back, but rather be like what was your favorite part? Or they just randomly start talking about it when you're on a walk the next day or whatever, and it's amazing how much it does for the brain. And in the Waldorf schools they have done a lot of studies and compared kids, like with tests, and it shows that kids who are not taught to read till third grade but are exposed to living books and poetry and theater arts and that sort of thing, in contrast with kids who are starting to read or taught to read in kindergarten.

Speaker 2: 22:17

Those who are not taught to read till third grade their comprehension is off the charts. The kids who are starting to read or taught to read in kindergarten. Those who are not taught to read till third grade their comprehension is off the charts. The kids who are taught to read in kindergarten they're just, yeah, they can sound it out, but they're not. They're not loving it, they're not comprehending it. You know so, if you really focus on the story and yeah, so I started homeschooling. All of mine my youngest was be one and a half when we went back to homeschooling, so there were lots of yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 1: 22:41

Yeah, talk to me a little bit about living books like and what that means as opposed to any old book on the shelf at the library.

Speaker 2: 22:48

So I would define a living book as one that captivates our kids, and it can be different for different kids, right, I've had one book captivate four of my three kids and that's okay. I don't. They don't have to stay, especially when they're little. I would set up different stations, different art things, play-doh. Whether they're listening or not, if they run outside and play, it's not a big deal. It's not their living book.

Speaker 2: 23:08

But a living book is one that grabs them. You know, you read the first couple of sentences and they're like wait, what Wait, I want to hear more. And the story becomes alive. The character becomes alive, they're immersed in it, kind of like a movie, but in our mind's eye. Right, they're immersed in. I want to know what's going to happen and it's really the best way even to learn history. My oldest daughter, she was 14. She could out-debate a history professor at a university Just exclusively from living books and you know experiences talking. We would talk to like elder people and go play games with them and hear their stories from that time period that you want to read a book about it, and so I love that.

Speaker 1: 23:49

yeah, like, could we just like volunteer at nursing homes, like hi, can we just like get a little bit of your wisdom before you peel off and take that with us?

Speaker 2: 23:59

Exactly, exactly, my oldest son. He was four and he would go once a week and play chess with his 84 year old war vet and they would just sit and have the most amazing conversations.

Speaker 1: 24:10

That's awesome.

Speaker 2: 24:11

Yeah. So I think this time of year you just make make some cookies, bring them to a couple of us at home. Sometimes you have engaging conversations, Other times it's just an act of service, you know, yeah. I love that they have more wisdom to give them credit for you were.

Speaker 1: 24:25

You were pregnant when you became a single mom. How did you manage all that, even like the time-wise, feeding everybody, cleaning up every you know after everybody, and financially even. I mean you just get into what you're comfortable with. But I think that's a huge hurdle. A lot of you know, 50% of families at least, are divorced. So how can moms that still want to homeschool make it work?

Speaker 2: 24:52

Yeah, I mean. So my, my case was honestly, absolutely crazy. I look back and I'm'm like there, it's only by the grace of God, there's no rhyme or reason. I had two under two, four under four like I had such little babies and and we left a crisis situation. It was a really, really abusive situation. So I actually escaped and then three days later I found out I was pregnant with my seventh, there was like there was so much.

Speaker 2: 25:16

We were on the other side of the country and that in and of itself was quite a journey. So that season, that was the lesson. It was really just, we were just together, we were just surviving together and that was okay, you know. And again, my oldest daughter, she was 12. And she had her books and she was just immersed in them. It was, it was. You could have been a fly on my wall. That was a crazy season and sometimes that is how it goes right.

Speaker 2: 25:44

You have a baby and the transition of bringing a new baby home is the lesson. Maybe the baby is up and with a tummy ache all night and mom's really, really tired. And what a beautiful lesson to care for your mom. What a beautiful lesson to say I'm going to, I'm going to play puzzles quietly with my brother while she takes a little nap. You know what a beautiful lesson to be nine years old, eight years old, and say, oh, I'll make sure that we sit here and I'll come get you If I need you.

Speaker 2: 26:06

You can close your eyes, mommy, you know to have that character. I mean, if you're, if you're a company and you're going to hire somebody, I would prefer someone with character that you could trust and count on, who would work hard for you, who would love to learn more over someone who went to Harvard, you know, and they had the credentials If you have the character and can truly, truly passionately put everything in and work as a team and work with those around you. So, yeah, I would say that our crisis season was an amazing time of growth, not as academically as I would have liked it to, but looking back, it was a gift. If that made sense, makes sense and it was it was really just surviving and being together.

Speaker 1: 26:41

In that, that first year or two Did you have family or friends or some?

Speaker 2: 26:49

sort of community that you could lean on that would help in this time. Are you talking about, like, the escaping the abuse?

Speaker 1: 26:53

Yeah, or even just you know handling like I don't know. I'm thinking you're nursing or you know when you have the newborn and you're trying to. You know, make dinner for everyone. If your oldest was 12, she's still a little bit young Did you have to work?

Speaker 2: 27:07

Yeah, it was. It was a really crazy time, I will tell you that. So I was in, I was on the East Coast and I went and stayed with a family, took me and they had three teenagers, and helped because there was a lot going on and then eventually we ended up being able to come out to California where my family is. It was actually a really dangerous situation and so he was hunting for us so we ended up in a woman's shelter because he was actually sending people to my family's homes trying to find us. Um and posting on.

Speaker 2: 27:37

Facebook that might be dead and I got her somewhere and he needed help to locate us. So it was a really extremely abusive situation that we escaped, and so we ended up somewhere different and were enrolled. Basically, we have the protection that you would get from witness protection, without them deciding where you live, and so address is sealed, dmv records are sealed, all of that. So we're not living right where my family is, dmv records are sealed, all of that. So so we're not living right where my family is. But we found a homeschool community out here. So, even though I sent my kids to school, the community I would say would be the church, the homeschool community, the crisis pregnancy centers, you know there. And then, how cool is this? So not that I had necessarily like adults in my home helping me make dinner, doing the daily stuff, but I did have community. They'd be like, oh, I can stop at the store for you, or how are you doing? Or you know I wasn't alone. And they like we came out with nothing. We traveled across the country, I didn't have two pennies to rub together and you know, I was pregnant with my seventh, my youngest had just turned one and my cousin flew out to fly with us. He's a black belt, so he's like I got you and just people just gave. Just people from on the East Coast. It was people from the church and people from the homeschool community. They donated their frequent flyer miles to help us get out. Someone paid for our dog to come with us.

Speaker 2: 28:51

It was really a crisis and we couldn't make it look like we were leaving. So I got a restraining order and I was able to go back in the house. But it was really dangerous and he would sit down the street and, like he had he knew how long, how, how far he was allowed to go from the restraining order. So he would sit that 300 yards with the scope and look, I know it was really bad. So we couldn't. You know, we had to be really, really, really careful and looking back. If anybody is listening, that would be something to call the police on. I didn't know it at the time, but that would be something to report, right, I was like, oh, he's 300 yards. Restraining orders to 300 yards. No, no, that's a violation. Right, that's stalking.

Speaker 2: 29:27

But we basically waited until it was dark the night before and then closed the blinds and like kind of hid the suitcases and had a family there that stayed with me till the wee hours, I don't think we stopped till six in the morning and it was just whatever we could take on the plane. So all the furniture was left, everything, everything was left, just the basics, right, we brought diapers, kids' favorite toy, favorite levy, basic clothes, whatever we could bring on the plane, car seats and strollers, and that was it. And then we came across country and then the people at the church were gracious enough to go in after we left, so he didn't see furniture being moved because that would have been really dangerous. And so when once we were here in California then the church went sorry, I'm like totally blanking, then the church went and hold all of our furniture and put it in storage and they gave the key to the attorney that volunteered to help with my case and then that way he couldn't say like, oh, you took all our stuff, you know, and get it from storage if he wanted. And yeah, it was.

Speaker 2: 30:28

It was really an incredible crisis and it was one hardship after another. It wasn't like we left and it got easier, like it got harder, and I think that that hardship actually built a lot of resilience in me and my kids and we had to work as a team, I think, because having a large family is amazing for character development, for character building. They have. Even if you have the most amazing family ever, if you have two parents, they still look out for each other. You just have to, you know, you just have to care about one another, and that's how you do life together. Especially if you're in a family rhythm, with homeschooling, where it's not kids being separated all day, every day, from each other, but they're doing life together, they really learn to love and look out for each other.

Speaker 2: 31:08

And then, with us going through this crisis, it was just a whole other level of hard and impossible and we had to be together, had to look out for each other, and so I could I mean I could do probably a whole podcast on just that.

Speaker 1: 31:20

Right, yeah, and for people that are like, oh my goodness, she's asking a lot of like really deep questions, but you're very open about this on your Instagram page. You're very you are there to let people know, kind of what happened to you, so that you give them the encouragement to get through it if they are going through something similar. So that's also, too, to why I touched so um, and you know I will link your Instagram page in the show's description because I think the stuff that you share it really, you know, makes you feel like, yeah, I can do this, I can do this, so she can do it, and you probably look like, as you're going through it you don't know if you're coming or going, looking back at it, you can say, you know this happened for a reason. I wouldn't be the person I am today. My kids wouldn't be who they were today.

Speaker 1: 32:02

Um, and so you know, you, you just kind of build on that. So for the people who, like I know that there are some days where I'm like, oh my God, I didn't do anything with the kids today. I didn't, you know, teach them anything. We didn't do any sort of academics, you know, as you're talking about telling your story. It's, it's like it doesn't, it's the overall that matters. So for parents that are like I'm failing at this homeschool thing, I'm not investing enough time, what would you say? That, as long as you're reading to them, I would say in my personal experience, having started with one all the way down to seven.

Speaker 2: 32:39

Looking back, the more I got out of my kids way, the more successful they were, the more I love that. Yeah, I think we get in our kids way where we have this anxiety because we're used to having someone tell us this is what they have to do at this age and they have to learn this, and what if I'm not doing enough science and all these things. But we need to get out of their way. We are hindrancing them by trying to spoon feed them Instead, just let them I mean, turn the screens off right, because that robs creativity. But you turn the screens off and then creativity is born, passions are born, curiosity is fed, and you can just follow that or let them follow that. It's good for them.

Speaker 2: 33:13

I'll give you an example. So my now 14 year old he was probably seven and he's my middle child of seven and this was when I had, you know, very young kids and obviously there was trauma, especially in my older ones. I was navigating a lot more than just babies. If that makes not just there's no, just with babies but you know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 33:32

It was not to minimize that, but there was a lot of different things pulling me in different directions and so I'm thinking of all my kids. I'm totally failing him. I'm going to do this free online Christian program and let's see, you know, just make sure he's not having any patches where he misses out on any black spots or whatever, right? And so we put him on and I put him in whatever grade he was supposed to be in, like second, I think third. And he and he was like, oh, and it was science. Because I'm like all we're doing is fun science, right? We're playing with polymers and you know, making slime and instant snow. And Steve Spangler, I love his stuff because I just read it and I learn with them and it's fun. And so he goes, he goes. I already know this. This is so boring, can I go to the next grade? And I was like, okay, so we do that several times. He's a fourth, fifth grade level at seven years old. And I'm like, betty, there's no way that you know this. And he goes no, I really do. And I was like, and it was how the trees breathe, you know how the oxygen cycles. And I'm thinking, how do you know this? Also, you're reading these words. How did that happen? And? And so I said, okay, honey, can you tell me what this is and where you learned it? He goes. Do you remember when we went camping and the air was so fresh and we were walking together and I asked you why it was so clean and nice and easy to breathe? Because one of his siblings has asthma and so it was so comfortable. And we were talking about the cycle of the oxygen and carbon dioxide and how it's a symbiotic relationship. And he was five when we did that, and he was seven or so when he was on this online program. And it stuck with him because it was an experience. We were walking and talking, he's looking at the trees, he's picturing them breathing and exhaling, and us breathing and exhaling, and and it stuck with him. And it was at that moment that I was like, okay, I don't even need to worry about you having any gaps in your learning, right, like you're going to be fine. And if there's something that they want to know, they can always learn it.

Speaker 2: 35:23

So my oldest daughter, she she did not graduate really strong in math. That was a struggle for her and she would learn whatever she needed to learn or wanted to learn, and then it just didn't retain very well. Some of that was her trauma and um. So then she decides I want to take this emt course and become certified as an emt in, I think, three weeks or something crazy like that massive textbook she's got to learn right and there were so many different things and she had already graduated, but she wanted this. You better believe she goes. She finds someone to help her with math, she gets the massive, she aces all the tests. She she's down there helping teach the class now.

Speaker 1: 36:01

I love it yeah.

Speaker 2: 36:02

So like it's not like if we don't give them what they supposedly need, by someone else's standard, at seven, they're gonna miss it when they're 27. Because if they're in a career and they love to, if they love to learn and they know how to learn and they know how to think for themselves as challenging questions, pursue knowledge and learn and they know how to learn and they know how to think for themselves, ask challenging questions, pursue knowledge and greatness, and they have the character to do it. It doesn't matter if you're 27, 37, and you need something to further yourself in whatever career you're doing, you can go learn it, right, yeah?

Speaker 1: 36:31

Yeah, I agree with that so much and I think about all the stuff that I never learned in my life about.

Speaker 1: 36:36

You know the butterfly, you know going for it. They might even put one in the classroom or something, although that never happened to me, but some they might put the caterpillar in there. But we did it in our house and it was like felt. You know, you wanted to know about everything, because now there are pets and now we're really watching every single day what's going on, because we want to, and you know the release and what's going on and how long do they live, and there's just such like a passion or, you know, curiosity for it when it's like, brought down to your level, where you know even even just simple things, like we found a Christmas present that was like stashed away from last year and I'm like, well, we better use this before Christmas comes around this year.

Speaker 1: 37:34

So it was putting together robotic like vehicles and I'm like, oh, it's for age six and up. I'm like, oh man, I wonder if this will be too tough for him, but it's five different vehicles and he's putting it together. And then one is wind powered. So now we're looking at one solar powered. So now we're looking up wind power and solar power and pulling up some children's videos on YouTube about it and you know it's really cool and you know he was talking to my husband at dinner about it and I'm like, oh, he really did retain that. He almost knows more about it than I do. So I agree with you wholeheartedly that we're so worried about like OK, at third grade they need to know this, this and that for this test. But that's all part of society putting that on us. There's really nothing that you need to know by any certain age other than how to like feed yourself, and most Americans can't do that right. Yeah, we're like eating chemicals, red dye 40. Like we don't know how to grow anything anymore.

Speaker 2: 38:31

Oh, it's so true. It's so true. And actually I just thought of something from this season of crisis that would apply to answering your question better. You want me to tell you that? Yeah, so initially it was just crisis getting safe, getting out. We came out to California right, homeless, about to deliver. I mean not homeless like on the street, but homeless living in my friend's bunk bed.

Speaker 2: 38:54

I'm like we're going to. You know, we were in the shelter, all the things, and so finally we get into this home, so thankful we literally didn't have a table. We like cut you know, we tore actually our food on the floor. We had no bed, right. I'm nine months, like I guess I was like seven and a half months pregnant, and all my kids and I like posied up in the carpet together. I had had a yoga mat and a pillow.

Speaker 2: 39:15

I'm like this is what we had, and so it was that kind of season. And then, once things settled down a little bit and I had had my baby and we were, you know, working on starting business with my mom, that kind of thing. Then I realized that I couldn't trust anybody because I didn't know how I ended up, where I did Right, and so because I was like this was someone I had been with since I was 17. I had known him more than longer, I'd lived with him longer than anyone in my whole life. I trusted him and had babies with him, and it was like a frog in slow boiled water. I was thinking that too.

Speaker 1: 39:50

you know you, you've learned to trust. I mean kind of like. That's kind of like I feel about the government now, like I've trusted you for so long and you've lied this whole time, like so that had to be huge. Like you know, who do you trust now?

Speaker 2: 40:03

It was really huge because I was so determined to keep my kids safe and so determined to never trust the wrong person again, right, so I was with him since I was 17 and it was like a frog in slow boiled water. So by the time I got out it was so extreme that, like I knew I was going to die if I went home that day and had almost died before. And it was so secretive and so hidden and so manipulative, and it's not an unintelligent person if that makes sense, and so no one's exempt from having this happen. But I had to question one how in the world did I fall for that, hey?

Speaker 1: 40:39

everyone. This is Cheryl. I want to thank you so much for checking out the podcast. I'm going to keep this short and sweet because I know your time is valuable. I want to ask you a serious question Do your kids know what to do to actually save their life in an emergency?

Speaker 1: 40:52

The most important thing we can talk to our kids about is knowing their first and last name, knowing mom and dad's first and last name, mom's phone number, dad's phone number, their address, what to do if they get lost, what to do if someone who's watching them has a heart attack, a stroke, an accident, where they fall and your child needs to get help. We live in a world where there's no landline phones anymore, basically, and cell phones lock. Does your child know how to call 911 from a locked cell phone? It is absolutely possible, and my book demonstrates how to do that, whether it's an Android, whether it's an iPhone and, most importantly, it starts the conversation, because I was going through homeschooling curriculum with my kids, realizing that, gee, maybe they skim over this stuff, but they don't get into depth, so my child's not gonna remember this should an accident occur, right? I asked a couple of teachers what they do in school and they said they really don't do anything either other than talk about what to do in a fire during the month of October fire prevention month.

Speaker 1: 41:52

So I wrote a book because this is near and dear to my heart. I have had multiple friends that have lost kids in tragedies and I don't want to see it happen again if it doesn't have to. We were at the fair over the summer and the first thing I said to my son when we walked through that gate was what's my first and last name, what is your first and last name and what is my phone number? And if you get lost, what are you going to do? You can get my book on Amazon and I will put the link in my show's description Again. It's called let's Talk Emergencies and I really hope you'll check it out because there's just no need to be scared when you can choose prepared.

Speaker 2: 42:28

I was this strong, independent, opinionated, outspoken, drove my parents crazy, had an opinion and wasn't afraid to share it as a teenager. So how did I end up marrying someone who was abusive? Right, and, and it was, you know, I was 17. He broke into the house I was staying in and, like, climbed in my bed and watched me sleep and I not only didn't report it, but I married the guy. Like, how did that happen, right?

Speaker 1: 42:53

And there's, like that movie fear I'm picturing right now with Mark Wahlberg, like I like, have has lifetime approached you to give them your story.

Speaker 2: 43:09

I finally figured out what I'm gonna write it about, because I I knew I wanted my story to be used to help other people not only escape and not only prevent it in us adults, but teach us how to help our kids. You know, and just to to let the what I went through not be for wasted right, not be for nothing right, not in vain, yeah my direction.

Speaker 2: 43:32

So hopefully that'll that'll be helpful for people. But because I needed to write it in a way that wasn't gory and wasn't traumatic to read. It's something that I could have my kids grow up and read, you know. So it'll actually be starting at the escape and then going through all of the hardships and miracles and challenges and obstacles and how I overcame that and in that escape how I started to uncover and understand the abuse that I had been in and then the psychology that I learned from that.

Speaker 2: 43:59

Because it was a question of how in the world did I trust him and fall for this? And how in the world does someone like him, who seemed to be a normal, nice person when I was 17 and my parents trusted him my mom at least how in the world can somebody become so horribly evil and hurt the people they're supposed to love the most in the most gruesome ways, like he did? You know how does that happen? How does someone become so sick? So that led me down just a ton of research. I was kind of unschooling myself, if you will, and it was, you know, four babies sleeping. I was like nursing one. I had toddlers here and there and I'm like, okay and I'm trying to like read. I kid you not, they're falling asleep on me and I'm like, I'm going to, I'm going to read this, I'm reading these articles, and then, I would not know, I fell asleep and drop the phone and smack my head and that's how I wake up.

Speaker 1: 44:53

Wow.

Speaker 2: 44:53

Because I had to get an understanding of how all of this unfolded before I was able to feel like I could trust him when with my own kids, and to trust myself like, how can I know who to trust? So that led to me how do I spot a sociopath? What do I do when I see a sociopath? What do I teach my kids to do At an age appropriate, it weighs, it's not going to terrify them. What about a narcissist? What are boundaries? How do you handle narcissists? Most of us know someone who's at least on the spectrum of that right. And what about you know when kids having boundaries? How can we protect them? What about porn addiction? What does that do to the brain? I did, you know my, my abuser. I did not know he used porn, but that turned out to be a really big thing that he had going on and so so that messes with your brain.

Speaker 2: 45:39

Anyways, I learned so much and as I'm learning that, just because I was doing life with my kids, those conversations came out right. It was. It was a conversation of oh hey, guess what I learned about? One in 25 people are a sociopath. Not every sociopath is dangerous. Here's this book that I'm reading to my older kids, who you know. It was like nine or 10 and 12 ish, right, maybe we're talking about them. And so then I remember vividly one of the camping trips we went on. I was crazy, I took my kids camping. They're all so little, six months old, anyways, we're out in nature. I felt like it was the way to connect, like I could finish a conversation with my older kids. The little ones could dig in the dirt, it just felt like it was wholesome and we were free and I wasn't drowning in the mess of laundry. So I'm just connecting through that sort of just sense of adventure that is affordable or free, even, you know, and getting creative with that. So there was a park ranger who approached us and he kept coming and was nursing my youngest and he kept coming up saying the most off the wall things and my 10 year old eventually he goes. Matter of fact, I think he's a sociopath and I was like I think you're right, anyways.

Speaker 2: 46:52

So all of that, as I'm learning and uncovering what I went through, what led someone to be that evil different mental illnesses and markers, right, I'm looking at my kids like, do we have genetic things I need to worry about? How do we prevent them from repeating the cycle? So all of that, there were tons of lessons, to the point that my oldest boys they were probably 11 and 13 or they're a year and a half apart, so like 11 and a half and 13, probably at this time and they're at the playground and these friends start showing them porn on the phone and they're like talking about it. So my boys, they come home and tell me what they said, like this is something that our kids, they're going to be exposed to. It, right. And we talk to them about cigarettes. We talk to them about we pass by someone who's smoking. Maybe we say, hey, that's unhealthy, this is what it does to your lungs and your ability to be an athlete. We talk to them about Red Dye 40. We talk to them about all these different things.

Speaker 2: 47:46

Why not also share things online can be damaging and make sure we're always approachable, right, make sure it's. We're always that safe spot for our kids to land, so you're never in trouble. You always come to me. I'm here to help you if you see something online, if you're curious and you keep looking. I'm here to help you because you get stuck when it, when it's hidden in the darkness and then it grows and you become addicted and it will change your brain, right? They've done brain scans of people consuming porn and the object part of the brain lights up. So it's cultivating rapists. They're seeing whoever arouses them as an object. You can throw a rock, you can kick a stick right, that's an object, that's not a person and so not that I would say.

Speaker 2: 48:28

Most 11 and a half year olds need to know that. But it depends on your kiddos. You know where they're at with things in the conversation. But there was a lot of learning, a lot of learning around that. And starting just with the little ones, if the minute that they can get online, they don't need to know anything about bad guys, sex, none of it. To know what a good picture, bad picture is, right, there's a book on that. You can have a good picture. That's your family vacation. They have toddler books and then they have like for kid books where, if you know that a bad picture maybe is a naked picture, right, or it's a picture that makes you feel afraid, and a naked picture might not make you feel afraid you might feel very curious, your body might react. You're not in trouble for that, right, but what's on the computer is not healthy, it's harmful to us. So you're never in trouble, right? It's normal to have your body react. So, in other words, just being that safe space for our kiddos, and even down to the little ones.

Speaker 2: 49:19

I think I kind of blurped that out but you know, even down to the little ones, where, if you're, if they're on any device, what do you do? If you see a bad picture, someone who's naked or something that makes you feel scared or afraid, I put it down and I come and tell you right, will you ever be in trouble? Is it ever too late to tell no, you know. And role playing with little kids like, hey, what if? What if a kid wanted to play a game where they touched or looked at your private parts? You know, oh, I would scream and go get help, and you know you can.

Speaker 2: 49:46

You can actually, like, ask preschoolers, kindergartners these questions and they're so matter of fact. It's just like you, I would never want to try a cigarette. Right, it's not. It's not anything for them to be afraid of, because we're empowering them for when something happens and and protecting them. Yeah, and and just basic rules like why don't we have cell phones behind closed doors? Why do we play in common spaces? You know with the older kids that they ask that question. Let's talk about it. You know, little kids don't need to know that. That's just our house rule and we don't keep secrets from each other. You know, it's just a safety thing.

Speaker 1: 50:19

Right.

Speaker 2: 50:19

Well, and that's part.

Speaker 1: 50:21

I just recently wrote a book, a children's book, called let's Talk Emergencies. I didn't know that. Yeah, right here actually, so it doesn't get into the depth that you were talking about, but it is that conversation starter. Like a lot of phones, a lot of houses don't have landline phones anymore, so you've got to talk to your kid about if you need to call 911, you have to be able to find my phone or maybe grandma's watching you. You have to know how to get grandma's cell phone and maybe grandma had a stroke. You can still call 911 even if you don't know her password, and let's talk about how to do that.

Speaker 1: 50:57

And I do talk about strangers. If someone comes up to you, because even asking for help and you just want to be innocent and offer it back, it doesn't your safety means more than you being nice in that instance. When it's a stranger, okay, like you know, strangers know better than to ask a child for something. So that, yeah, and I, and, and the only reason I even thought to do this was because I'm homeschooling and a book would touch on like what's mom's phone number, and I'm like, oh yeah, I never really thought to talk to him about that. He doesn't even know that, doesn't he? And you know so, but it only asked like three times, like he's not going to memorize 10 digits three times.

Speaker 2: 51:36

And it was then I was like what's?

Speaker 1: 51:37

our address and do you know my last name and what's what's my first name? And you know? If you get lost, what do you do? It's so true, it goes to everything. We don't even if your kids are in public school. I've talked to teachers. They say we don't the time to teach, that it's not our job to teach your kid personal information and or or an escape route in your house If there's a fire or, god forbid, a burglar. Um, you know, there it's. It's our responsibility. But they busy parents so much that who's going to think? You wouldn't generally think of all these little things. So that's why I wrote the book. But you're right, and even the internet. I have a. I have a page on it with a wolf in sheep's clothing and he's calling the little girl's iPad.

Speaker 1: 52:22

So it's like lens that conversation for mom and dad to kind of talk to their kid about what. What does that mean? Why is that wolf wearing a sheep costume? So it's, like you know, kind of touches on it without really but letting the parent do that, and I love the way you explained it. Like the the you know good picture, bad picture, because they're all going to get there someday. I mean we're, it's just inevitable. Screens, yeah, whether they're at a cousin's house. You know we have tons of cousins that do not live the lifestyle we live, so you know they can go there and see screens that that we we can't monitor everything.

Speaker 2: 52:59

Yeah, yeah, I love the wolf in the sheep's clothing. It gives a good picture to the kiddo that it's. It's not who you think it is. Yeah, and the cousins. It's really sad how the fastest growing demographic of child sexual abusers are kids.

Speaker 1: 53:19

And it's because, yeah, that just pains me so bad, but you're right, because we have friends where the little boy is my son's age and there was a sibling, a half-brother, that, yes. So it's like it really makes you like not want to let your kid go anywhere. But then you're crazy if you to let your kid go anywhere, but then you're crazy if you never let your kid go anywhere.

Speaker 2: 53:38

Well, we just need to equip them because we don't want to live in fear and we don't want our kids to live in fear, but just basic rules. I mean, at least that's the balance that I found is basic rules. Right, we play, go to someone's house, but don't play in the bedrooms, just play in the common area and make sure that you're never one-on-one. We just don't play one-on-one and that's just the way that our family does it and there's enough of us At least my kids don't feel like it's the only one. That alone helps keep them safe. But then those conversations too, of just role-playing, just basically, hey, what is the private part? Because you know what it's actually anything you don't even want touched right. There's consent, there's private parts. Your mouth could be, it's a very vulnerable spot, so it's not only what covers the bathing suit. Necessarily.

Speaker 2: 54:22

If there's a game that makes you feel uncomfortable a lot of times it's hey, let's play doctor, and it starts out really interesting and fun and really they're unraveling and trying out what the kid had seen in pornography. Trying out what the kid had seen in pornography. So, without what we want to, of course, not harm our kids, not tell them any details of something that would be frightening for them. You know, no fear, just equip them, just, yeah, well, right, if someone, it might, you know your body might even respond like hey, that tickles. But I don't think you're supposed to touch there, it's just come talk to me. Right, call me, go talk to the parent, like you, you're not in trouble. It's just kind of role-playing those scenarios that unfortunately are really common. But having that in their mind, where it's like if back in our day it was drugs, right, what would you do? How would you say no?

Speaker 1: 55:06

And you know, so it was-. Oh, I miss those days. We just have to worry about PCP. I know seriously PCP. Nobody ever who has Zeus done PCP and I told their song about it.

Speaker 2: 55:22

But we long for the days where kids are just trying PCP. So much more now, but just having that in their back pocket, even in kindergarten, like what if a friend wants to play that kind of game? Well, we say no and we walk away and we get help and you know, are you in trouble? No, cause, that's a big fear usually, you know.

Speaker 1: 55:36

Yes, yeah, Because it's uncomfortable for the person it's happening to and embarrassing. So it's yeah, yeah. Now, okay To round up, cause I've had you a long time, even though my kids interrupted like half of it. But did you have people saying to you at this time like Stacy, I think your kids would be better off in school right now You're going through so much Like they need normalcy, they need you, can't? I mean, you talked a little bit before about it. Was that part of why you put them back in school or was that kind of separate Did? And even, just how did you deal with the pressure from people? Cause people say it to me and I don't have the issues that you were going through at the time, so I can imagine some people said like Stacey, come on, you can't do it all.

Speaker 2: 56:16

A lot of people said that. A lot of people said that and my answer was, yeah, I can't. But I'm going to do far better than the public school will. If I do nothing but expose them to a happy childhood and offer living, books and a community of friends, it's significantly better. I mean, I was so strong on that so when I put them in school, it was me doubting myself. It was me saying how in the world am I going to be a single mom? There was a lot of definitely like some unique fear of it wasn't that I thought public school was good for them. Some of it, to be honest, was I just needed to sow roots in this new state, right? Because it was like he was just very scary person with very deep pockets and I did want the kids to just have a place like it. Just, I don't know how to explain it. There was just something really strong in my heart that I was like I have to do this, and then it became abundantly obvious that it was doing more harm than good, right, maybe?

Speaker 1: 57:17

you just needed to see both sides so that, as you were homeschooling later and even now looking back, so that you can say, like if you never put them in school, you might now look at it and say what could they have been had I? Could I have made their life more normal if I?

Speaker 2: 57:33

just put them in school, but now.

Speaker 1: 57:35

But you did and then you saw like, nope, this isn't it. So yeah, I think that could even be on purpose for you it made me really strong in.

Speaker 2: 57:43

There's no way, no one's more determined to give them the best than I am. And yeah, the damage in public school and my oldest, you know, she went through ninth grade and every day was she'd been homeschooled up until that point. She goes mom, what in the world, why do you have me here? And she will never put her kids in public school. She was the story that she came home for it with and she was because she was homeschooled. We had that relationship. We talked about everything, so she'd come home and tell me all the things right, and didn't learn anything academic, but learned lots of vulgar things and saw lots of horrible things and you know so, which is really actually really sad that our kids are immersed in that. But she will never. She never questioned right after that with that homeschooling was better and will definitely is determined to have as many babies as she can and homeschool them with a wonderful guy. And you know she's got a really determined and beautiful head on her shoulders and super she's turned out. She's just a really cool person. She's 22 now, so she's, you know, probably a really cool person. She's 22 now, so she's, you know, probably my one of my closest friends, ironically, and yes, and so we just, yeah, we do life together and she's volunteering medically at an afghan refugee clinic and just, she just does so many cool things. She learns sign language, homeschooling, and she's learning phlebotomy and it's just, it kind of never ends, you know.

Speaker 2: 59:03

And so I think after I put them in school, I was strong in my stance with homeschooling before, very strong, but after I put them in school, the pushback that I got it was pretty much like, well, who cares what you think? Like there's no way I'm doing that to my kids. Right, we've had enough harm damage. Why would anybody send their kids to school? Not to condemn or judge people that do, because I know it's a really scary and hard thing to pull our kids and it takes a huge leap of faith right To take that onto ourselves. But we're harming our kids. Back in the day, right when I pulled my daughter, it was because homeschooling was ideal, it was better. At this point I would say it's still best for our kids. But also public school is so damaging.

Speaker 1: 59:46

It's so damaging. Okay, so it was like, of the two, one's better than the other, but now it's like, yeah, there's actual harm coming. And you're right, there's more than just the reason of the love of learning.

Speaker 1: 59:59

That's almost like the icing on the cake for homeschooling when you think about active shooter drills and you know, think about the trauma that a lot of kids do go through. Not to take anything away from your situation, but I would imagine that there are lots of kids in very traumatic situations because we have things like porn you know, and the foods that we eat. And nobody has, like you know, grows up with that purpose anymore, Cause we're not doing that hard labor like growing our food and yada, yada, we can get into stuff tons of stuff like that.

Speaker 1: 1:00:29

So there are reasons that people are getting these addictive personalities and kind of changing the way the synapses in your brain work. So now we're throwing all of them in a cement building with no fresh air, chemicals in all the food, and like we're just like, hey, yeah, that's, it's going to turn out great. Like you are right, you and, I just hope, parents. The takeaway from this episode is that you literally just have to read books to them and they will thrive far beyond what any other child in a traditional school would do.

Speaker 2: 1:01:03

They will, and that would just be even the foundation. I would even add there's no limit with homeschooling, right? As a single mama, I want to world school my kids. We have taken six weeks and done road trips and gone through all the states and done all the things. I would love to take them to Europe. I have one kiddo who wants to go to Ireland and he's studying all the folklore and all the you know poems on his own.

Speaker 2: 1:01:25

I can't afford to take my kids to Ireland, and it's okay, because guess what I can teach them? I can teach them entrepreneurship, right, I can. Hey, what skills do you have? What would you like to make? A lemonade stand? A Christmas cookie stand? What would you like to do? How could you earn money, right? So all of my kids have collectively come together and been working for a year and we have these little jars that they're putting money towards going to Europe for a month and touring all the countries.

Speaker 2: 1:01:53

And so I would just say that, like we encourage them and equip them to reach for the stars and have no limit, right, there's so many limits in public schools. You're stuck in the walls. But just because I don't have the funds, you know, for that music teacher it doesn't mean he can't learn music. Just because I don't have the funds to take my kid, who's really passionate about a certain culture, to that country doesn't mean that I can't walk alongside of him and cheerlead him and research with him and teach him how to, you know, just formulate ideas to make that money himself. You know there's there's no limit to what they can do, and so just being that inspiration.

Speaker 2: 1:02:30

You know you can give them such an incredible experience. It's not that you have to do all that, it's just that you're not limited, you know.

Speaker 1: 1:02:37

Yeah, last question, cause I've had you for a while now are you and the children safe now? Because I know people listening are gonna be like why did she like? Are you like for real, for real, safe now? Because I mean you talked about what state you're in.

Speaker 2: 1:02:52

I know you're on instagram yeah, he well, yeah, he knows we're in california, he just doesn't know where we're. We're in a place where he would never imagine, thankfully, and and so we are safe. We have a lifetime restraining order and obviously, if he's doing things like watching us with a scope, I would know to call 911 now and we are safe in the sense of all the protection possible, if that makes sense. But he's walking free. He's walking free.

Speaker 1: 1:03:20

Yeah, crazy, because you have to actually do a physical act to be punished for it.

Speaker 2: 1:03:25

Well, no, he did enough and he crossed his overstate line so many times that the police, when it was finally reported, they were like, okay, where did that happen? And it was like, well, this plus this, and then basically the officer said that, or the detective, rather she said that it was really dangerous for her to approach him while we were still there, so she waited for us to go to California before she approached him and then he just ran to Florida and so there's jurisdiction and there was, you know, things that happened in so many different states. So I mean, it's an open case. It's not closed. He still technically could and should go to prison, but as of now, yeah, he's walking free.

Speaker 2: 1:04:03

We have a lifetime restraining order and each of the kids have their own lifetime restraining orders, which is not something they usually do like. Usually it's five years max and we had a five year and then he pursued us because he's a little. He literally thought it was just like my time out is over and I can't wait to be one big, happy family again, and I'm like no repentance. That was really crazy. So he was reaching out to like friends and family and why are you trying to get a hold of my family and I was like you're insane. So that led to a full. He asked for a full trial because he wanted back in her life, he wanted custody, the whole thing, and the judge ended up just totally reprimanding him and looking at all the evidence that he provided, which, ironically, just proved that he was a stalker and abusive, and then granted as the restraining order for life and each kid, so as they grow up, they don't have to go to court ever, which was nice. And the kids were assigned their own attorney. So, like they, the attorney spoke for them, so they didn't have to testify, which was really nice.

Speaker 2: 1:04:57

And so, yes, so we have, you know, name changes, our social security numbers are being changed. That's the last, the last of it. But the dmv records are all sealed and we have our address is protected. So, the secretary of state, they have a save at home program. So you get, get a state capital po box, because it goes to the capital, but it doesn't matter if you live in san diego or wherever. And then they repackage all of your mail and send it directly to your home. So, like insurance doesn't have our address, nobody gets it. So, so there is really good protection out there for someone in a hard situation.

Speaker 1: 1:05:31

Okay, well, that's good to know that the government hasn't completely failed us. There's a little bit out there, but it but it's still kind of, because then he can go out and do this to other people. I mean it is crazy that.

Speaker 2: 1:05:42

It's still kind of, because then he can go out and do this to other people. I mean it is crazy that, yeah, that is that actually was the thing that got me on Instagram, because during that trial, one of the letters testifying on his behalf it outlined him grooming this woman and her kid and like totally trusts him to be alone and he pays their rent and he fixes their car and, you know, comes over for dinner all the time and plays with the 12 year old. And I'm thinking, and I was like I talked to my attorney, like can you get a hold of this woman and warn her? Like that was outlining him grooming the mom to molest the kid and we couldn't. And she goes, everybody in that courtroom, all everybody who knows anything, the judge, everybody saw through it, but we she wasn't there testifying.

Speaker 2: 1:06:18

It was like a character, so there was apparently nothing we could do. So I thought, okay, well, maybe I'll just get on Instagram and maybe one day she'll see it, and if not, there's other parents out there, you know. I mean, you know he groomed my mom. I was a teenager.

Speaker 1: 1:06:32

Yeah, wow, yeah. So this really is like the movie fear Mark Wahlberg and Reese Witherspoon Like I think I have to watch that. What if I've seen?

Speaker 2: 1:06:41

it. I have to go watch it.

Speaker 1: 1:06:42

I mean, I was in high school. It's a good 20 years old. I'm 40. Yeah, there was. That was like kind of because you don't see many movies on that Maybe. Maybe there was a Jennifer Lopez one, but like who's going to take that seriously? But yeah, it's interesting. Thank you for speaking out about this because it's probably more common than we think it's. Yeah, it's more than just a movie, it is real life. I'm glad that you're safe now. I'm glad your kids are safe and thank you for sharing your story today and for sticking with the homeschooling.

Speaker 2: 1:07:14

Yes, it's. Oh, it's such a gift and it was so cute where we have some people helping to fix our bathroom today and just today they were asking about my kids because they don't have family yet. It's like we're wondering about homeschooling and we're meeting your kids and seeing how kind they are to each other and how much fun they're having together. And his little sister is the age of my 11 year old and he goes. They're picking out books together and they're making a comic book together and he goes. It's so different than my sister who's in public school and he's like I got to talk to you about homeschooling because it just gives kids the chance to be kids and love life.

Speaker 1: 1:07:53

And yeah just send them over to the podcast to just have them listen. You know, that's so true, it is. It's very, a very different way to live. Yes, and even like we have screens in our house, I love to like, I think I will. I'm like slowly getting rid of things like the toxic things, and it's so much like the TVs will be the last, because it's so foreign to me to not have one, but it is becoming more normal, it is becoming more normal.

Speaker 2: 1:08:18

And yeah, we've had years where we go without all screens. And then there's also something to be said about. It's okay to cozy up with your kids and watch a Christmas movie, and it's different than every time we go to one of your sibling sports events. Here's a screen so you can let them be bored. You know what I mean. Yeah, christmas blessing, creativity is born into them.

Speaker 1: 1:08:41

A thousand percent.

Speaker 2: 1:08:43

Yeah, I wouldn't condemn anybody for having like family movie nights or anything like that, it's just we do watch little house on the prairie I love it she also watches coco melano.

Speaker 1: 1:08:53

That's pretty bad. I didn't say I was perfect, I just, I just I just I bring the homeschoolers on and I gleam stuff from them. I didn't make all the changes yet.

Speaker 2: 1:09:02

Babysits. Maybe you won't Like. Maybe you'll keep certain movies and just not do unlimited video games. You know.

Speaker 1: 1:09:10

Yeah, no, we have a Nintendo 64 that my husband grew up with, so it's literally like still attached. The remote is still attached to the systems. That's all you know. This is so funny, yeah, thank you so much, what a really interesting story. I really appreciated you sharing that with us today.

Speaker 1: 1:09:33

Thank you for tuning into this week's episode of the homeschool how to. If you've enjoyed what you heard and you'd like to contribute to the show, please consider leaving a small tip using the link in my show's description. Or, if you'd rather, please use the link in the description to share this podcast with a friend or on your favorite homeschool group Facebook page. Any effort to help us keep the podcast going is greatly appreciated. Thank you for tuning in and for your love of the next generation.