#167: When the School Said 'Behind' — One Mom Said 'Watch Me'

What happens when a single mom in the Foreign Service gets the double whammy — "your child might have dyslexia" AND profound hearing loss? She figures it out. Katharyn Havens joins Cheryl from outside Nairobi, Kenya, where she's running a multi-age homeschool pod, teaching kids AI ethics, and building her own AI co-pilot for homeschool parents.

In this episode:

• How cochlear implant surgery changed everything — and bought them time
• Why Katherine walked away from a 14-year Foreign Service career
• The year they moved to Florida, ditched the diagnosis, and just learned to live
• How her son went from nonverbal to reading Green Eggs and Ham — on his own timeline
• Building a homeschool pod in Kenya with kids of all ages
• Her AI code of ethics for kids (yes, they have written rules)
• What "symphonic thinking" is and why it's the most future-proof skill you can teach

Whether you're just starting out or deep in the homeschool journey, Katherine's story will remind you: you know your kid best. Trust that.

Connect with Katharyn: 

Substack: https://substack.com/@kairoslearninglifestyle?utm_campaign=profile&utm_medium=profile-page

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/radicallyresetting/?hl=en

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@KairosRiseHomeschool

www.KairosRise.com

🎯 Ready to learn how families are actually working + homeschooling? Cheryl has interviewed 200+ homeschool families—and put a step by step process together for how to work and homeschool (even as a single parent!) Check it out!👉 How to Work & Homeschool (Even as a Single Parent!)

Transcript

Why Homeschooling Became The Answer

SPEAKER_01 0:02

I didn't plan to homeschool. I started asking hard questions, realized how little control parents actually have, and made the hard decision to leave a government job to homeschool my kids. Now I interview other homeschooling parents to learn how this all works. I'm Cheryl, and this is the Homeschool How to podcast. Let's learn this together. Welcome, and with us today, I have Katherine Havens with me. Catherine, I'm not even going to begin to attempt where you are calling in from. Why don't you tell us?

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Yeah, hi Cheryl. Thanks so much for having me. I'm actually outside Nairobi, Kenya. And um I'm looking Yeah. I'm looking out at some tea fields, and who knows what we might hear on the audio. There's animals around, and yeah, it's a beautiful day here.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

So like what kind of animals?

SPEAKER_00 0:49

My neighbors have cows, pigs. There's a rooster that crows all day long. All kinds of dogs and okay, all right.

SPEAKER_01 0:56

So that's similar to what I have here in New York. I didn't know if you had, like, I don't know, a giraffe walking by at just any time.

SPEAKER_00 1:03

Not far away. We only have to drive about 45 minutes and we'll be seeing zebras. So cool.

Overseas Life And Single Parenting

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Okay, so where are you originally from there? Did you move there?

SPEAKER_00 1:12

No, no, no. This is a long journey to get here. I'm originally from Texas, and then yeah, and I started my life of overseas living really right out of college. First place was Norway. Uh, and then I went back to the States for a little bit and did some more schooling, and then ended up joining the Foreign Service. So, like you, government employee, and I did that for almost 14 years. Uh, and that's what brought me here. After Mozambique, Belgium, I worked at NATO, and then I was back in DC. Yeah, lots of things happened along the way.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

Wow. Okay, so how many kids do you have and what are their ages?

SPEAKER_00 1:53

So I have one son. Um, he is 15 now. Yeah. He's 15.

Hearing Loss And Early Intervention

SPEAKER_01 2:00

And then what even led you to homeschooling? Did you always homeschool?

SPEAKER_00 2:04

I did not because I have, however, always been a single mom. So I've had to figure out how to do all of these things. I was with the Foreign Service for most of his life. Let's see. One way that I'll really connect with your audience is that I've gotten the same talk from the school that a lot of people have gotten. Your child is behind. The second thing I got was he might have dyslexia. So those two things sort of compounded after. This is already after a long journey with hearing loss. So my son has profound hearing loss, and uh that sort of made me divert from being overseas. We went back to DC so that we could sort out all his medical issues, and he went to a really special, amazing school that really helps kids with hearing loss. I always say I'm, of course, a huge advocate for school when school is needed. And for us, you know, there's no way I could have like navigated how to do speech therapy and all the things that he needed. Because he wasn't speaking. He didn't speak until he was really almost four. And yeah, so we had a lot of people.

SPEAKER_01 3:15

What ages did he do that school for?

SPEAKER_00 3:17

Wow, from when he was tiny, like three, like immediately, so that I could go back to work. So three until he was six. And then we ended up having to do cochlear implant surgery. So he had the surgery on one ear, which is basically six steps backward in order to go ten steps forward. So that sort of prolonged our time in DC and his need to be at this really special school with speech therapists and, you know, master's level teachers who were really working with him on communication. Okay. And you saw an improvement? I mean, science and technology is amazing. He they said give us three years. Um, and because we had the surgery, it was four, but he speaks beautifully and has the amazing ability to take his ears off and turn off the world.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

So he can hear now though.

SPEAKER_00 4:08

Yes, with his devices.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

This is so interesting to learn about, because I I haven't talked to anybody that has gone through this process. So this is super interesting. What is his condition called?

SPEAKER_00 4:19

So he had profound hearing loss, and we know that it's from an it's a it's the most well-known genetic condition. It's called connexin 26. So often if kids get, you know, from both parents the recessive gene for hearing loss, it's because of this connection, is what they call it. And so it's progressive. So he was probably born with hearing, and then it slowly started to deteriorate. And I happened to be posted uh to NATO. So I was in Belgium when he was two, and I'm there all alone in my apartment, thinking he's not speaking, he's not, he's not babbling a little bit, but not repeating, you know, and all the books are saying he should be at these milestones. And I kept saying, There's something, something's off, something's, you know, not right. He's really happy, but something's off. And it took so much cajoling because they were saying he's a boy, it's because he's in dual language, he's doing French with the nannies, and then he's English with you. Eventually, I had to go to the US military doctor and say I want a hearing test. And finally, after like eight months, I know, but mom's intuition, listen to it. Yeah, wow, thank goodness you did that and you pushed for that.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

So, okay, how long was he how how long how long has he been homeschooling?

The Dyslexia Scare And Burnout

SPEAKER_00 5:38

So when we got to the end of this process where he's now speaking, right? We were in DC, and I really needed to go back overseas because no one joins the Foreign Service to not be in a foreign country. The life is so much easier, like the benefits, all the the connection, just general life is so much easier overseas than in DC, right? They're not paying for your housing or anything like that. So I was super keen to get back overseas, and then the school said you might have dyslexia, and I just had been through so much at that point and spent. I mean, exhausted. And so the day we both were on the floor crying together, he didn't want to go to school, and I didn't want to go anywhere, you know. That was sort of the breaking point. So I said, okay, I can't even mom right now. I've got to take some time off. And so that's what I did. I took a year of leave without pay and uh said to the school, thank you for all of your amazing help and advice. I will tell you in a year if he has dyslexia. I'm just gonna teach him to read. So luckily we got to go live with my mom and stay with family in Florida and kind of uh decompress and you know, figure out how to like be really alive and happy and fulfilled and all the things. And that was just a magical year. I had no idea what I was doing. Like most of us, right? Spent how many hours sitting at my desk in Washington before doing this movie, listening to podcasts. Sound familiar?

SPEAKER_01 7:10

Yeah. Oh my god, I'm sure so many parents are resonating with that right now. And the books, and can I do this, and what do I have to do? Luckily in Florida, I don't think your reporting requirements, well, I don't think they're that bad in anywhere because I'm in New York where they're the worst, and they're really not that bad at all. It's like no different than what I had to do as a supervisor working for the government for like my employees. How much did they improve? What are you doing? But luckily, you did not have strict standards in Florida to adhere to. What did that year look like? What did you concentrate on?

Teaching Reading Through Real Life

SPEAKER_00 7:41

Well, my whole goal was teaching him to read, really, to find out if this whole dyslexia thing was true or not. And of course, that's the part that scared me the most. Like any parent, you know, they give you a diagnosis or a potential diagnosis, and you think, who am I to do? I'm not qualified to do that. So I was deep into reading, and I I found this program called All About Reading. Got the curriculum, and other than that, I happen to also be a photographer and a writer, and so I have a whole creative vibe going on. So I just wanted to teach him to read, make food, and make art. That was my whole uh theory behind it. And we found other friends and we found groups and we did all the, you know, ended up marine biology, everything with the water. We were at the coast all the time. We were we were sun babies, and it was it was lovely.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

So that you found that that was an interest of his right away? Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that like there's so much to that because if he was in school, whether it be a regular public school or the hearing school, the time you would not have had the time. Maybe it would have come up along the way that, like, oh, he really likes whales. But to know that like you can dive deeper and really take anything that he has to learn and put it center it around marine biology. Like, let's learn how to read through learning about marine biology. And yeah, so walk us through what that kind of looked like for you guys.

SPEAKER_00 9:07

Completely. I just looked for any sort of class or get-together or things that were offered at the parks, you know. We found we found some groups of homeschoolers that would meet up at various um parks and so and library and all the things that you do. The other thing I did that year was, you know, I'm obviously very keen uh about foreign cultures. So we would take, you know, spin the globe and choose a place and then for a while just dive in and go make the food. Like we did Brazil. So I found some Brazilian shop and like we went there and got the food and talked to the people, asked if we could come back and he could like learn and get in there and like make the little I now totally forget what they're called. You know, we would do and then we did French and we did crepes and we went to the French restaurant. We did so I really love to like take any idea and then get the whole package from history to art to videos and food and culinary and meet someone if we can. Yeah, and we still do that today.

When Kids Are Ready To Read

SPEAKER_01 10:12

So, how did the reading go? Did you see improvements in his reading in that year that you guys were home and homeschooling?

SPEAKER_00 10:18

We started in September and it was April when he first read Green Eggs and Ham by himself.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

And he was how old at this time? Was he about seven?

SPEAKER_00 10:28

Yeah, seven and a half, yeah. So not even that, you know, it's not far out of the range, but the way the system scares you, thinking you're six, you know, and what I should have been saying is hello, my child just came through having a real disability and he was late to speak. So obviously he's gonna be late to read, and he just needs time. Like I just knew that he needs time and I was ready to take all the time, whatever. And now I cannot keep up with the number of books he reads. It is phenomenal.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

So, did you find that he does have dyslexia, but he can still learn to read on top of it, or he didn't even have that at all? Didn't even have dyslexia at all. That's interesting. And and my son, he is seven and a half right now, and he's just starting to read. And it's funny because I mean, I even though I talked to homeschool family after homeschool family, and I know that all how that in Finland they don't even teach anything formal until age seven because the boys especially are not cognitively ready. But in our school systems here in the States at least, we pound into the kids at by age six, they are reading because I remember being at six-year-olds' birthday parties where they were reading their birthday cards in front of everybody, and I was like, dang, Colin, you see those kids reading their cards? Like, we gotta get on this. Just thinking, am I failing him? Is there something wrong? Am I not doing enough at home? And are other people going to judge me when they notice? And I think that's the biggest thing. We don't do an intense like reading here. None of like I enjoy reading a book. It's just not like my priority of the day for myself. So my kids will see me read on vacation or if I'm in a downtime with the business, but they don't see me read, they never see their father read. It's just it's terrible, but it's just not in our daily life. So, like when we do read to the kids, they kind of haven't adopted that love either. And that's our fault, but it is what it is. There we're like outside hands-on people. And um, I noticed last night I was kind of just like too tired to read. And I said to my son, Can you read the bo read me some of the book? And he just started reading every page. Like he and we've done a little bit of formal curriculum, but not every day, no more than 20 minutes at a time. And it the curriculum he does now. We did start with all about reading, and he liked that. But him and I bought heads, and it was somebody on my podcast once told me about a curriculum called Reading Horizons, and it's online, but it's like old school online, like from like the 80s and 90s. So, like it's I don't know. Um, he started that and he's been with that for like almost two years now. And yeah, like I said, we don't do it every day. It's like when we have time, he'll throw in 20 minutes. And he just was reading a whole book last night. I was like, I didn't know you could do all that. So it's like when their brain cognitively is ready, it'll just happen. If I and I know that there are adults that can't read because I think about that too. I'm like, definitely people, like especially like slaves back in the day. They, you know, they were not, but it was different because now we just have so much technology around us and information and ways to do things that it's like if you care about your kids at all, like they will read, like you just expose them to it and you know the different curriculums that are out there, but then they're ready instead of pounding it into them. It's so true.

SPEAKER_00 13:38

And I I actually teach a pod now, so I have several other kids, including my own, and I have a six-year-old who I'm just teaching to read. And that was a talk that you know her mom and I had in the beginning, was just has she is she showing that she really wants it? Like, is she really ready? And she's completely ready. She was just here actually, uh, a minute ago, and she's come a long way. And it's just the beauty of being able to give them the time and your I mean, I and to know what works for them to try this way.

SPEAKER_01 14:11

Like, I know the all about reading uses the Orton Gilliam, I don't know, I might be butchering that method where the way they teach reading makes sense for a lot of kids, but then there are other kids that love um this teach your child to read in 100 easy lessons, which we've tried and it didn't work for us. That's a completely different way to teach them how to read. And that works for so many people. And then there's other kids that just pick reading up on their own by age four years old, and you know, it's it's just one of those things. Like if somebody was like, I'm you're I'm gonna teach you to be an ice skater, summer it's gonna come naturally too. Some are gonna have to work really hard, some find that they have no interest in it, but they'll learn the basics. It's really we don't ever we're not taught to think about it that way in school because I feel like they want you to read so they can start having you take those tests. Because as soon as you can start taking tests, they can start reporting to the system and getting more funding.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

Yep, that's what it's all about.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

I used to think that you couldn't work and homeschool, but after interviewing over 200 families now, if you've been a listener for that long, yes, that's actually how many it is, I realized that it's not true. People are working and homeschooling, it just looks different than we expect. I started noticing the patterns, the resources, the schedules that people were using to actually make homeschooling while working work. And I put everything that I've learned into a course called How to Work and Homeschool Even as a single parent. Yes, you heard that right. Even as a single parent. If this is something that you've been trying to figure out and would really just like it laid all out for you, check out the link in the show's description.

SPEAKER_00 15:49

But I'm sure you've had others say on your podcast before, or you probably have said, no one's gonna ask you at 16. Oh, so when did you start reading?

SPEAKER_01 15:57

So she's true.

SPEAKER_00 16:00

You're just gonna read. One day you're just gonna read. And then that'll be that.

SPEAKER_01 16:05

Like, it's not it's so true. And even I noticed, like, my daughter she is uh watches TV. Like, I don't I hate to admit it, but like I have to because there are parents out there, they're like, I feel so guilty. My kids are front of a TV. My daughter watches TV, she but she learned so much from it. One day she rifled off the ABCs, and I was like, Where did you learn that, Miss Miss Rachel? Thank you. Even though she's a whatever viol. She taught my kid the ABCs, so I can't falter too much. Right.

SPEAKER_00 16:33

But I feel like really that that year and like accomplishing this, I can teach him to read. And oh, by the way, we had the most amazing time. We just came alive. Like, I can't I I just think back to like wow, I was struggling so much trying to be full-time working mom. And then I had a a second job as a photographer in DC because I was trying to pay for this amazing school. And so I I mean, where do you find more hours in the day? You feel bad that you're not working, you know, to capacity, and you also feel bad when you're at work because you're not momming to capacity. It's exhausting. I mean, it was the best thing I ever did. And then I got introduced to homeschool, and then I thought, well, this is the life I want. Can I just do this?

Back To Work And The School Tradeoff

SPEAKER_01 17:21

And so what did that look like? Like what when how did that transition go from okay, we've actually well, we've been homeschooling, can we just continue this the whole time? And then moving overseas again and really deciding, like, how did you decide, like, I'm gonna homeschool, but I still have to work? And what did that look like for you?

Building A Homeschool Pod

SPEAKER_00 17:38

So I had to go back to work and so I knew I couldn't homeschool. So at that point I thought, I really, I mean, this is my heart's here. This is what I want to do. And I found that I have so many ideas with this. My brain is alive in a way that it has never been in that cubicle. So, but I thought, okay, I mean, it's another overseas adventure, and you know, I need the insurance, right? So I had to go back to work. So I had to take whatever job was available at the end of my year, and so we, you know, within four weeks, I learned we're going to Kenya, okay, go to DC, get the thing together. A friend of mine who was already here knew of my situation and my son's hearing loss and everything, recommended this one school that is set here in the forest, and they focus on outdoor learning. Classes are really small. So I thought that's the closest I can get to homeschool. So that's what we did. So got here and had to put him in school. And ironically, you know, I thought it was so amazing, and I really felt that sigh of relief that okay, if I can't be there, this is the second best thing. And it really was. It was great. It's called Woodland Star, and it's and it's beautiful and it was a lovely environment, and he did well. But it's only after a few years later, when I decided to leave government and ended up homeschooling again, that he said to me, you know, a lot of times in school I didn't feel like I was smart, and I feel like I, you know, and he started telling me, you know, negative things that I just wow, I had no idea. Like even in such what I thought was amazing school, he was still kind of struggling in some ways and would have never known. Yeah. So eventually, um, yeah, I decided to leave government because we were doing so well in Kenya. It's lovely here. And I think that that pool, having had the year of homeschool and then trying to go back and put myself back in that box in a way, was extra hard. So the point at which I saw an exit ramp, I took it. And I wish I could say that it was to homeschool. It wasn't. There was a stop along the way. I did a different job in the private sector. But anyway, when that ended, I immediately thought, now I can homeschool. Like, how can I figure this out? And it was just then I met a friend who was also taking her kids out of school and said, Hey, why don't you if you teach mine, I'll pay you. That's how we started. So that was two years ago now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:03

And so that's kind of how your pod was born. Did you get more kids over time?

SPEAKER_00 20:08

I did. I have at one point had eight boys around my table, all different ages. And because we're in such an international environment, you know, people people tend to come and then go. And so some of them have left and then another has joined. And so, yes, it's fluctuated each term. I tend to have different, different crew, but it's been scary but also amazing. And I've figured out a way that works for me of like how do I have several ages at the table? How do I incorporate global citizenship? You know, we're in this amazing place. Part of why we homeschool is to take it all in and participate and try to speak Swahili and go to the market and do all the things that we can. And then, yeah, I've really taken a deep dive into AI. So I have figured out a way that we do what I call human fluency, which is how to be grounded. We read real books, we sit around the table. Uh, I lead the class, I guess, on a daily basis. And then in the afternoon, we sort of take what we've learned and then see how does that apply in the world of AI.

Multi Age Groups And Clear Norms

SPEAKER_01 21:18

Interesting. Okay. Yeah. I really want to get into the AI thing because I think that I mean, that's huge right now, whether you love it or hate it, to not know about it. I mean, you gotta learn about it. It's like, you know, when the tractor came out, I'm sure people were like, we some were like, we don't want this, you know. But it's like, well, you you should learn about it, see what it does, and then know if you want to use it or not. But I love this story because I just came out too with a course on like how to work in homeschool. And in like my marketing of it, you know, I'm kind of like talking to with AI, like, how should I market it this way, that way? And it's like, oh, tell them that you know, you don't have to quit your job. And I'm like, Well, wait, no, I'm not claiming in the course that you don't have to quit your job, but I'm giving all Other options of ways to make money with your children in tow who are, you know, while your kids are home. And this is one of them because I've talked to a few people that have left their job or maybe like they couldn't work from home. They had to be, whether it was a hospital job or they had to be right in the field. So it it does make it make it impossible because there are so many places like your pod that you can bring your children if you have to go into the office or the field. If um you know, you think about it, this is an option too. Okay, can I keep my kids home with me and take in other kids? And so many homeschool parents have done this in all different ways of like whether it's a forest school or just play groups, or you know, you are actually learning curriculum and specific curriculum or out in, you know, nature. Uh there's just so many ways to do it. I love this. So, how hard was it for you to take on other people's kids, especially all different ages? Like, did you have like a screening process? What if their kids are crazy and don't blend well? Or do you find that kids that might be crazy with their parent aren't with you, maybe in your environment?

SPEAKER_00 23:06

How what did that how did it's funny because it's true that kids do act differently here than at their own homes. And because I figured out that I needed to sort of set the the stage and the expectations, and also just create an environment where they both want to be here, but they also respect that we're a learning community. So I haven't really encountered any kids who were just, I don't know, really difficult. Um, some who don't want to learn, and that that's a challenge, right? Some who really want to go really fast, some who love the online thing of that um, you know, like a traditional you watch the video and then you answer the questions and yay, confetti. Some kids really want that confetti moment and others don't, right? So I try to be very inclusive, but I treat it as like we are a community. So we get to do this really cool thing, and we're all gonna agree to our part in this learning environment, right? I can't do all the chores, everyone has to kind of help out. And when we and I had everyone here when it was a big group, we would all eat lunch outside. So everyone needs to like take all the stuff outside and then take back in. So they have a responsibility and they know what's expected of them. And I also tend to do this thing called like um mentor morning. So I make time to see each one of them individually once per term, so that we just have a catch up and we sit in the yard and or take a walk or whatever we do, so that I can just be the mentor and really be connected to them. Here's what I've noticed, or you know, there was some sibling rivalry I had to navigate. I feel like, you know, you this thing happened and you didn't like when your brother did that. I mean, you know, so in a way that I as a single mom never had to navigate these types of challenges. So it's it was definitely a lot of learning for me. Not only just how to have all different ages at one time and figure out how how to not how do we all stay kind of on the same page or at least on the same river if we're in different boats. So I did have to come up with a system. And once I got that and just locked that in, that just made it seem so much more easy. But yeah, I've learned a lot about uh how to parent again and because they're so different. My kid is like a mini-me. I'm so lucky.

AI Rules For Kids Who Think

SPEAKER_01 25:36

He's if this taught me anything, it's that my kid is awesome. Yeah, I know that's so cool. Well, I love that because and you only have like eight at the most, and then you think of a classroom with 30, and it's like, okay, you might not have the sibling rivalry, but you still have rivalry between kids, it's not that much different. Yeah, it's like how do they do it? How does anything get done in the classroom? So all right, now I would like to touch base on the AI because I mean, is it different where you live than here in the States? Are you guys further along or not as far along, or at the exact same pace? And what do you see for the future? And how can we use this in a way that is good for our children and um not have the world be taken over by AI?

SPEAKER_00 26:21

Well, I would say Kenya in general is much, much behind, right? So no one they're not, no, it's not it's not happening so much here, but I spend a lot of my free time learning from YouTube. I follow all these tech gurus. What's the latest in AI? What's happening? And that's sort of how it started. I was just so inspired by the fact that you can make a website and have it live in two hours. I thought that's why I'm I've gotta teach them this because this is only the beginning. Like, forget about we used to learn computer literacy. This is now the the base base level is gonna be. You need to be able to make a website, you need to know about you know selling a bit and how to see yourself as a small business in a lot of ways. I feel like they're all gonna be basically a bundle of skills, right? So you are gonna have to navigate a world where you are presenting your skills and what you offer much more like a consultant or an entrepreneur. You're gonna be a bundle of skills. And so no longer is it I'm studying accounting and now then I'm if I get a degree in accounting, I am assured an accounting job. I think we can see that that's probably not gonna be a safe bet anymore. So I want them to know, to learn how to learn, to teach themselves, and to be able to skill up very quickly. So, in whatever ways I can help them test out this sort of new playground of AI, we try out lots of different apps. Now, I have to say that I know there are a lot of people who are averse to it, and that comes from the cheating aspect, right? Thinking that we're going to outsource our thinking instead of doing the hard work of thinking. I actually have a set of rules, a code of ethics for AI that all the kids have and they have it in their notebooks. We talk about it a lot. We talk about our rules of AI. Things like all ideas happen on paper first. AI is there to improve, not to impress. So start, they start in notebooks, right? We have we write things out, we talk it out. Then they all know how to talk to LLMs as giving them a job. What's an LLM? So the large language model. That's your chat Gemini grok. Claude, my favorite.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

Who is Claude? I I just signed up for the Claude subscription. I was doing chat. I did Claude last year. I don't know. I just like to see the difference in them. I think all of them I yell at at least like once a week saying, People say you're gonna take over the world and you can't even do this simple task, I'm asking.

SPEAKER_00 29:00

Right? But that's part of the learning. We I actually completely show them that. I use three or four of them a lot to construct my lessons, but I often discard 40 to 60 percent of what it gives me. Yeah, just found that it goes off on a tangent with this whole thing, and I think that's actually not gonna work in the real life with these with kids. I still reference back to teachers pay teachers, like I still spend a lot of money on TPT and get real lessons from other teachers that have been tried and tired.

SPEAKER_01 29:35

I heard about that site from my friend. No one's actually talked about that one on the podcast. Do you want to just quickly mention like what teachers pay teachers is?

SPEAKER_00 29:41

Yeah, I love this site. It's basically teachers anywhere can upload their lessons, usually with nice graphics or no um packet. I mean, you can find anything in French, and often they're priced like for$2.99 or$5 or whatever. So you can buy these lessons and then you download them and print them out, segregated by either subject or age level or whatever you're looking for. And I always feel like I mean, teachers are amazing. They have figured these things out and and now they're there and available, and they've been tested, like I say, they've they work. So I often get teachers by teachers, I get a lot of math from them, word problems and things, and then I cut them out and put them all around the house, and so the kids have to walk around and do math while they're with their clipboards and stuff. So yeah, I love that site.

The Future Of Work And Trust

SPEAKER_01 30:34

So cool. All right, and then where do you see the future? At least for like I know you talked about the building the website, and I guess I never really thought about it in those terms. It's stuff I do and I use AI for with having this business, the podcast and the Instagram page. Like, how can we just, you know, make this more efficient? So I'm not spending, you know, 12 hours on this. I can do it in more like 30 minutes with this tool, which is essentially just a data bank. And I know you know, they you've heard Elon Musk talk about like, oh, it is dangerous, you can run away and become the terminator. But as of right now, it is a data bank where just all information has gone into, and then you're just kind of siphoning out what you need, or you know, kind of an the the roundabout about what you need. And then you still, like you said, you only use 40 to 60 percent, or you throw out 40 to 60 percent. You do have to decipher like what's relevant, what is not. Um, but where do you see the future going? Like, say in 10 years, when you know your son is a probably a working individual in society, like, where do you see AI like playing the role? What will its role be?

SPEAKER_00 31:45

Inevitably, all of our kids are gonna need how need to know how to manage a supercomputer. So I think as more information gets automated and more entry-level jobs disappear, they talk about a white-collar bloodbath, is the most graphic example I've heard, but so much of what um young people would be doing, especially immediately after they so-called finish their education, right, is disappearing, and that's be what AI is taking over. So I feel like they need to know how to one, be an authentic human presence in the world and online, right? So if more things become AI, then I think what's gonna be the most important is then for people to see what I can trust, what's authentic, what's really human. So, how do you teach them then to be authentically creatively themselves and like shine in their humanness while still being able to, you know, understand what the computer is doing, they need to have the the skills that lay above the AI. So I talk a lot about symphonic thinking, which is a word I got from Daniel Pink in a book he wrote like 20 years ago, talking about how important it is to take ideas that are unrelated and be able to see the connections. So I know there's like a symphony, right? The horn section's playing, the drums are playing, everyone's playing their own piece, but the conductor or the creator of the written music can somehow see that all together, right? They were able to see how they lay together. So I think teaching symphonic thinking and really diving into how to be like myself is really a core part of like what I teach because we don't know what the jobs will be. We have no idea, but I do know that if he feels comfortable managing a supercomputer and has the foundations of how all these systems kind of work together and where they could go off the rails and where they give you some really weird stuff, like you need to know how to verify your information, go and investigate and research. Is it true? What's just propaganda? You know, we really need to hone these like truly human skills. I think that's just the most important skill set that we can give them so that they'll be able to find their own way, whether it's create a business or three or ten, because you'll be able to have that many in 10 years' time. Because your AI sub-agents will run your businesses, they'll give you your morning report of like, okay, for business A, this is what you need to attend to. Can this run? Can we go with that? Like, yeah. So one business is not even, I think it's gonna be too simple.

SPEAKER_01 34:35

And do you think people are doing this already? Like the Elon Musks or I do. Any of them?

An AI Co Pilot For Parents

SPEAKER_00 34:40

I do. This is part of my somewhat obsession with what's new in AI. And I see that like sub agents are already happening. In fact, I myself am creating my own AI at the moment. It's you create your own AI. What does that even mean? Yeah. So I'm gonna I'm creating a platform where other parents who want to know about homeschooling, world schooling can have basically what I call a co-pilot. So it will do everything that I do right now, which is filtering and curating all the different things that are out there, right? So take some curriculum, some of whatever your specific goals are, right? I feel like the beauty of homeschool is that we get to provide the values that we want for our kids and teach them how to be what I call awesome humans. I make my parents fill out a form called awesome humans before when they join me so that I know what their goals are. What is an awesome human in your house? Like, what does that mean? Can they, are they survivor guy? Can they like camp for you know a week alone? Or are they, you know, super great at some other skill or what whatever it is, right? That's such the beauty of homeschool, and that's why it works. Um, so I'm creating an AI so so that parents can get as little or as much help in how to create your day, structure your day as they would like. And it will basically be like the way that you talk to Grok or one of the others, but it will be wearing my glasses with certain pillars, right? If you agree with like global citizenship, I come from the world of diplomacy, so I happen to still think that diplomatic ties are important and we should know how to talk to our neighbors, some basic stuff. And if you believe that, you know, some tech fluency is really important, and also the things like being grounded. And you know, I teach my kids meditation, we go for walks, we spend a lot of time outside. So if you were wanting to pull in all those things, like this, it's called HR, actually, has a name, will help you to sort of navigate and also because the AI can learn you, right? It will start to know your kids, their their challenges, what they're great at, what they love. And so then it will combine all of these things and give you like some tips and like also some games. Like, have you thought about this game will go with your lesson today? Because I feel like right now there's all the you can go, you pull your curriculum off the shelf, so to speak, right? You you choose the big discussion, what's the best curriculum? I want to make a curriculum that is alive and that is agile and it's it's evolving every day, taking in what's new and what's really, you know, a value to you specifically and your child.

SPEAKER_01 37:35

That is very cool, very cool. All right, so as we uh roll up on the hour, what else did you want to make sure that you got across or inspiration that you gave want to give to other parents just thinking about homeschooling and maybe don't see it possible? Or what would you like to maybe tell yourself 12 years ago, knowing what you know now, you know, with your little son and going through everything that you were going through then?

Confidence To Choose A Different Path

SPEAKER_00 38:02

That's a lot to answer. You pick one, two, three. I mean, the 12 years ago question is is really why I'm creating the business that I'm creating, because I just want to support other parents. I want them to know that that system that most of us, you know, came through has a lot of alternative goals, right? And we should all have the not only the authority, but the confidence to know that we know our kids best. And we can look to the future and see what would be, what do I want them to have as a successful life? Like what is success? Is it just to get a job? I don't think so. I think it's to enjoy, create craft, hone your skills, like create your amazing life. So if that is your goal, then there are so many ways to do this thing called education. I mean, world school is completely amazing. I know unschoolers, that's amazing. You know, the program that I'm putting together is a way to have a hybrid between all of the things. If you want to follow a curriculum, great. If you also want to do these other things, it's very possible. Not only is it possible, but with the help of AI, we have the the opportunity right now in this moment to create something that is truly like individual for your child. I mean, think about that. It's wild and it's so fun. And I really think that for parents who maybe would love to homeschool but feel like it's gonna be, you know, it's too hard or financially, or for other reasons it's not even possible, right? Like pods and small groups, as you mentioned, I feel like is really where there's gonna be a lot more momentum, you know, as people realize that the traditional system is not preparing our kids for a future that we cannot even imagine right now. Maybe there won't be a return to small, small groups and pods and collective, you know, teaching. If you're really like I love writing, I love teaching writing, but maybe you're really good at science, right? So we so we co-op and trade off. But never before has there been so many resources and so many ways to get the learning in and the education in in shorter amounts of time, and then be able to teach them life and play it. So I hope more than that.

SPEAKER_01 40:18

Well, Catherine, I second that, you know, coming from the cubicle as well, was that the goal, that six-figure salary with nights and weekends off and a couple of paid weeks vacation, you know, is that the goal? No, I my brain was melting 40 hours a week, and there's just so much more to life. I never really paid attention to like the birds, what they're doing outside, what kinds there are. You know what they do different times of the year, and it's like there's so much beauty around us, and it seems like the school system and the work, uh, what they make us believe that work should look like. There's just such a divide between that and nature. And I love that you are taking the steps to help other parents break through that, and not only have you given so much to your son, but to other people's children as well. So thank you for that. Thank you for sharing your story today.

SPEAKER_00 41:13

Yeah, I really hope to uh connect with a lot of your other guests, especially as I start to create this network, right? There's so many shared resources. Like you said, that you were developing this program, and I know you have another ebook, and so many of your other guests have amazing things. So I just really hope to create a more collaborative, you know, exchange of like these are different ways to do it. And also, wow, there's a whole community out there, you know, that you can absolutely do.

Where To Follow Along And Closing

SPEAKER_01 41:42

Yeah, no matter what. Is there anywhere where people do you want them like uh leave a Instagram or an email? Or I can put that in the link of the show's description too, so people can follow what you're working on.

SPEAKER_00 41:53

You can do, thank you. I do post on Instagram, it's called Radically Resetting because I have a program to help parents in that first initial if you're thinking about homeschooling. And I call it radical reset because that's really what you need. You have to reset yourself. As so many of your other guests have said, you know, we have to de-school first. Um, and I'm, you know, my YouTube is there, needs more attention. I've just started on Substack because I love to write. And I have websites, so there's lots lots of ways to reach me. And hopefully within a couple months, I will launch my AI and then I will be really about trying to connect with people.

SPEAKER_01 42:32

Awesome. All right, I'll put all of that in the show's description. Thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your story.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

Yeah, thank you so much. And if you want to come to Kenya, send me a DM. We're here.

SPEAKER_01 42:44

Thank you for listening to the Homeschool How To podcast. If today's episode helped you, please be sure to follow the show and leave a review. It's the best way to support the podcast. And if you're just getting started or need a reset, head to thehomeschoolhow2.com and grab my free 30-day homeschool quick start guide. Until next time, keep learning, keep questioning, and thank you for your love of the next generation.