The Two AM Club: "Collecting Stories: A Discussioncast on Embracing Diverse Approaches to Raising Children Around the World.
Welcome to The Two A.M. Club, where we have open and diverse conversations about parenting and partnerships across different cultures. Join us on an amazing journey as we explore the joys and challenges of raising children through the stories of parents from around the world.
Our collection of stories represents a tapestry of cultures and personal experiences. We celebrate our differences and the love we share for our children. While everyone's parenting journey is unique, we find common ground in the experiences that connect us.
Whether you're a new parent, experienced, or simply curious about raising children, The Two A.M. Club has something for you. Expect heartwarming stories, practical advice, and thought-provoking discussions. Our goal is to inspire, support, and connect with parents and partners worldwide.
At The Two A.M. Club, we value open-mindedness, diversity, and honesty. We create a community that embraces the universal journey of parenthood, where love knows no limits. Join us today and be part of a welcoming and supportive community of parents and partners.
We believe that parenthood is a journey filled with joy, challenges, and countless stories that deserve to be shared and in doing so we are collecting stories from parents about their experiences in navigating the intricate paths of parenting and partnership. We understand that parenthood isn't solely about raising children; it's also about nurturing and sustaining strong relationships with our partners.
Our aim is to weave a rich tapestry of stories that celebrate the beautiful, messy, and wonderful world of parenting and partnership. Your stories have the power to inspire and guide others on their path to growth and fulfillment. We are eager to share the triumphs, struggles, and lessons learned along the way. Whether you're seasoned parents or just embarking on this remarkable journey, we invite you to listen to the diverse experiences, insights, and advice that these stories hold.
Join us as we embark on this voyage, hand in hand, as parents and partners. Welcome to our discussioncast, where we embark on an honest and unfiltered journey through parenthood and partnership. As everyday individuals, we deeply empathize with the triumphs and challenges that come with these roles, just like many of you. Each episode of our show explores a wide range of topics and features special guests, offering a glimpse into the diverse experiences and perspectives within our global community. Despite our differences, we all share a common objective: navigating these challenges and joys in our own unique way.
The Two AM Club: "Collecting Stories: A Discussioncast on Embracing Diverse Approaches to Raising Children Around the World.
"Breaking the Silence: Honest Reflections in Fatherhood's Real Tears, Real Talk"
Episode 14:
Embark on the intricate and demanding odyssey that is fatherhood, contemplating what it truly takes to navigate its complex terrain. Join us in the hushed hours of the 2 AM Club as four dedicated fathers unveil the depths of their personal narratives. They share profound insights that illuminate the triumphs, trials, and transformative moments defining their journeys as fathers. Baring their souls, they cast light on the delicate dance of balancing work, family, and personal aspirations, exposing their deepest fears and celebrating hard-fought victories while acknowledging the profound impact fatherhood has etched upon their lives.
In a society often inclined to hear more from mothers, these fathers also have a lot to say. This special mini-series aspires to shatter societal barriers enforcing toxic masculinity and femininity, offering an authentic platform for real tears and genuine conversations about the challenges of being fathers in the contemporary world.
Our guests embark on candid and heartfelt discussions, delving into the profound responsibilities of being protectors, guides, and mentors to their children. They bravely detail their individual struggles, navigating the delicate equilibrium between professional commitments and personal passions, all the while ensuring they stand unwaveringly by their children when it matters most. From the unpredictable nuances of childbirth to the poignant highs and lows of raising children, these fathers present a poignant and unfiltered perspective on the enigmatic journey of parenthood.
The exploration extends to the transformative power of self-improvement in parenting. Our guests generously share invaluable advice and sagacious reflections on the significance of personal growth and self-awareness in fulfilling their roles as fathers. They openly reflect on their deepest fears in parenting, courageously embrace the daunting challenges, and joyously celebrate the monumental successes.
So, join us on this profound and enlightening expedition into the multi-layered, awe-inspiring world of fatherhood in the 2 AM Club, as we dismantle the walls of silence that have long encapsulated the experiences of these fathers.
Hello and welcome to our podcast, the 2 AM Club. As you can hear, my wife is not here today. That's why she couldn't do the little jingle at the end. But I'm here with three other dads and we're doing a special podcast on being a father, so you guys would like to present yourselves, Sure.
Speaker 2:So my name is Bart, I am Polish, have been in Dubai since 2016, and I'm a father of two, two boys aged nine and ten.
Speaker 3:I am man. I'm known as a chairman because I sell chairs. I have two boys twin. They are 17 years old and from Syria.
Speaker 4:And I am Karim, from Egypt. I've been living here since 2008. I have a two years old child, so I think I'm one of the newest in the fatherhood industry, and I'm known as a dentist, or they call me the butcher.
Speaker 1:Remind me never to go to your place.
Speaker 4:Which clinic should we be avoiding Same day dental implants?
Speaker 1:Is Noah two already? I thought he was the same age as Mounanoui.
Speaker 4:No, he's just turned two last Friday.
Speaker 1:Last Friday, so a couple months older than Okay. Alright, somehow I thought he was a little bit almost the same age as Mounanoui, Alright, yeah, so just a backstory for those listening in Bart is my DM at Dungeons and Dragons, my N is the chairman of our cigar group and Karim he is actually my sparring partner back in the day when I did Jujutsu before getting hurt, and yeah, so that's how I know all these people. I'm more like his punch bag.
Speaker 1:Okay, that is true, alright, so we're all dads. Different ages of kids. Right, you have two boys, and I forgot Bart. Two boys, also two boys. So only boys. Here too, we're all boy creators. You have the oldest kids.
Speaker 3:Yes, I do. My kids are twins. They are 17 years old.
Speaker 1:What was? How would you define a dad? What is it? What is your definition of being a father?
Speaker 3:Oh, that's a very difficult question. I think a father is a person who dedicated his life to make sure that his children will become a better part of him. Maybe that's really beautiful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1:I mean, I was also thinking, like you know, like my, I was getting like the worst question, maybe just no, no, I mean everyone is going to go through this question because I think we're from we're all from a little bit different generation and especially with the kids being of a different age, I think it's a very interesting question because we've all been fathers at a different historical point. Not to make you sound really old, it's already.
Speaker 3:It's already sound.
Speaker 2:So back to the question. I mean I love the way he kind of put it. I think we definitely want to be, we want to shape them in a way that they are not making our mistakes. I think that's what every parent wants to kind of say about you know, looking back, like whatever my parents did, I want to make sure I don't make those mistakes. And then we try to kind of put it, you know, pay it forward to our kids. Dedication, absolutely 100%. Again, I think we will talk more about it as it's kind of, you know, maybe wavering at the first. You know stages and we all go through like different journeys but overall, like we never want to see them hurt, we never want to see them, you know, unhappy. We all only want to see them kind of be successful and satisfied and kind of be the best version of ourselves, probably right in some way, and I'm not even sure that kind of covers the question 100%.
Speaker 1:So like protector and guide.
Speaker 2:I think that's a good way of kind of trying to boil it down to maybe two words. Yeah.
Speaker 4:Well, I love how you guys concluded at the end of protector and guide. I read many years ago a piece for Guberan, khalil Guberan, and he said like your children are children of the world, they came through you but not by you and you don't actually own them. So, and I'm seeing that how my child, even from since he passed one year old, he has his own personality, his character. So I feel it so much as a father. Maybe my role is to set a good example, try to try to show him the way he will definitely choose his own. But I here to set a good example, a role model which, as Bart said, like it's pushed me to be the best version of myself here to provide, to protect till they don't need me anymore, but I think our kids will always need protect.
Speaker 1:I mean, even my mom is still my protector. I feel sometimes, maybe emotionally, yeah, definitely emotionally. I mean for sure, yeah, yeah, I mean, for me, being a father is guiding, for sure. Protecting, yeah, that's definitely. I'm here to at least not really protect him, because I also don't want to protect him that he is too soft and doesn't understand that the world is a hard place, but more of a. Teach him that this is what you need to do how to protect yourself when I'm not here anymore.
Speaker 3:That's kind of protection, you know, when you teach him how to protect himself when you show him the way, how to be strong enough to face it, to face the difficulties we face every day in life. That's the best way of protecting your son.
Speaker 4:And Mo, you said something like when you leave this world or like when we die. You remind me of a quote in the Black Panther movie. It was like a dad yeah, wakanda forever. He was saying like when he, when he, when he saw his dad, maybe in his dream after his death, passed away. It's like a father who did not prepare her child for his death has failed as a father. Oh, that's actually. I loved it and I live by it. Like that's pretty strong.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. I mean, this is something that that I do. Want my son to live a full life, and you know, know that the day he was born was also the same day that we condemned him to death. At the same time, I mean, it's the reality, right.
Speaker 2:I mean you're born.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and one day you will pass away. Yeah, it's a safe for pretty strong. It's quite nice, my, do you think that if, when you look at parents today, how do you feel? Do you think it's different from I would don't want to say your time, but from, let's say, 16 years ago? That's twice.
Speaker 2:You hit me twice. We're only starting.
Speaker 3:Let's see. Well, I don't know how to explain it, but it's just. I think the younger you bring your children to life is the better for you and for them, because the shorter the gap in between in years, in between you and them, it will be much easier for you to understand each other. That's why I was like encouraging always my friends who like just married or they are taking this mistake to have make babies immediately.
Speaker 1:It was a mistake to be married or to make babies. Which one is it?
Speaker 3:Make babies. You never know when will you make it. Yeah, it's. Marriage is something really good beautiful to have someone with you always all the time to support you and support her Always. I advise the newly married couple don't delay the baby making as fast as possible because you want them to grow up with you. You don't want to be like 70 years old and your children is 17 or 20 or you want them to be close to you. First of all, you will be able to give them more. Secondly, you will enjoy your life with them more. I see some dads and some. They go out together different places, they do activity together and if there is a big gap in the age in between, that's difficult. If the gap in between, like, is shorter, so it's much easier for them to understand each other. Like today I'm 52 years old, 53 almost, and my kids 17. So I feel there is a big gap, even though I'm trying to do maximum activity I can with them. But I cannot compete with them physically now. Big muscles, mine are too small.
Speaker 1:We're definitely not getting younger, that's for sure. Absolutely how long between you and when you had kids in.
Speaker 2:America. I was just doing the math in my head. So I'm 37 and my eldest one is 10.
Speaker 1:God damn, you're young.
Speaker 2:Thank you, I'll take it every time I think he's the youngest on the table.
Speaker 1:How old are you? 45. Okay, I'm second, I'm 41, but you're 31. 37., 37., 31,.
Speaker 2:I'll take it, I had my first, we had our first. My wife and I were the same age, so we were 27 when we had our first. And I mean I would stand by what my aunt said already. I think the bigger the gap, the more. I think it's just different caliber of challenges that we put on ourselves when we decide to maybe have them later in life as opposed to earlier. But at the same time every person will have their own way of doing things so we can say, listen, it makes more sense to have them early. But at the end of the day, everybody makes the decisions for themselves. So I would never say you're stupid, you're 50 and you want to have a kid now. It's your choice. I think, yeah, it's just a different level of challenges probably, but I think the connection is definitely there and it's definitely strong. I think maybe it's more relatable, maybe we are more relatable if the gap is kind of, you know, you think your kids think you're cool.
Speaker 2:I think every dad would like to think that their own kids find them cool, at least on some level. The longer we live in that bubble, the better it is the better off.
Speaker 1:It is Exactly.
Speaker 2:Psychologically, and then once that's kind of gone, then you know the kids have, you know they moved along and that's it. Yeah, where were we? So? Yeah, the age difference. I think again there is no best way of doing things, but I think having them early worked out Of course it's not done right, parenting is not done, but I think, you know, having them 9 and 10 right now is like a good time in our life as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean for us. We're both old and we had children. Well, we were old, right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I think it's a bit controversial. The age difference is 43 years, like my son came when I was already 43. I find it beautiful. I was done with running, career chasing, degree whatever. So I actually enjoyed every bit, every moment of him growing. Meanwhile I remember back in the time when many of my friends got their babies when they were like 20 plus. Sometimes they look at having a baby at that time as kind of an obstacle or they had to completely detach to just focus on their careers. So that's what I used to hear. So at the moment, if that was my destiny, I have no regrets. But, as man said, I don't know in maybe 15, 20 years from now I'm from 60, 65, and my son is just turning 20 something how it will look like.
Speaker 4:That's why you do Jujitsu, so you can still kick his ass, that's why I run, I do triathlons, I kill myself and I keep telling my wife, actually, the moment that child was born, I take it as a motivation. I gained some weight, like tremendously gained some weight, which is not typically me, and she saw that in the last three, four months before she delivered I was like a machine and I lost so much weight and I was so fit. She was telling me, like why are you doing that? I said because you're giving birth. She's like, but he's not going to remember or see you, but like there will be pictures, there will be videos.
Speaker 4:And he didn't choose that I bring him to life when I'm 43. I chose that I need to be good enough for him, so I took it. I take the whole overall experience of having a child at that age as a kind of motivating, challenging experience. I'm enjoying it. I believe that he like pumps young blood in me, like when I play with him, when we laugh, when we smile. So my wife, which is significantly younger than me she's 15 years younger than me she's telling me I don't know who is that child. You're him. So I'm like, I'm enjoying that.
Speaker 2:I think that's wives general.
Speaker 1:I was just going to say she, my wife, thinks exactly the same before I had a child, no different. No, I think I mean for me and my wife, we never wanted to have kids for a very long time. We never. We travel, I mean, we move to countries every three, four years. We enjoyed our life without a child and we never said a definitive no. But we never proactively chose to have a kid. We said, ah, in case it happened by accident, we'll keep it, but if not, we're totally fine without having a kid. And then afterwards, two years ago, we started talking about it and at that point, if you're going to talk about having a child, then you just do it.
Speaker 1:I'm really one of those guys that just jumped two feet in and I don't think about the consequences until later on. And the wife was like, yeah, maybe we should start thinking about having a child. I was like, all right, let's do it, let's just have a kid right now. And it's not because I just wanted to have sex at that point, but it was. I mean that too. But it was just like if your mind is already set on having a kid, you should have it.
Speaker 1:I think the age for me it's never really been in the back of my head and I never thought about it that way. But I mean, the thing is what you were saying about how your friends that were younger and having kids and they were, you know, they were working. And I do look back at my friends that had kids younger and I think I'll ask you guys this question afterwards I don't think they spend as much time as we do now being older and more thing, but do you guys agree with that? Like we're having kids younger because you were starting up your company and then moving, and though your whole story is another, another podcast on its own, but I mean, did you feel like there was a lot of times that you weren't because you were young and you were hungry and you had that thrive and you had to, you know, provide and everything else?
Speaker 3:Maybe I'm a bit different from that perspective because I always believe that you have to divide your day for the way you live. There is time you have to work you have to work hard. There's time you have to spend with your family. There's time you have to spend with your friend. There's time for you personally. Only, no one else is allowed to come into that. So I always try I can't say that I'm perfect and I'm doing that balance all the time, but I always try to make that balance. So I'm never stops me from being with my family with the time I set for my family, unless, like there's something urgent comes with the work or with any other things. So I think there is nothing will stop you from achieving your goals. If I might say it like if you want to be with your family, you can. You want to work, you can. It's your decision how to balance that.
Speaker 1:So it's the quality over the quantity.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I guess so.
Speaker 2:I mean just to comment on, like I think whatever how you put it, I mean I love it because I personally, being the youngest at the table, I think I still haven't figured that out like to a science. I mean, I'm not saying you did, you're admitted, like you know, it's never perfect, but you sound like it's a very kind of, it's like a way you live by, almost right. And I find myself now realizing that I was struggling with it much, much more in the past. And again, looking back, I feel good about the time I spent with the kids and with the wife when they were really young and really small and we were always there for each other.
Speaker 2:But also I realized, like having them earlier on, like if you don't have it that kind of balance, if you don't have it figured out really, really well, you will be struggling and and and something somewhere will have to give right.
Speaker 2:So then maybe later on you might have regrets like oh my god, like I was not there for this thing or for that thing, because X, y, z. So I'm like more actively looking at it, like now especially, like you know, my, my in, like in the way, in the way we live together, of course, but also, like in my like professional life, trying to kind of always like switch off a certain time, never keep work kind of mixed up, make sure the weekends are always there for the family, right, but also looking after your own needs, right. So, like you said, like there was time for everything, right, you will have time for family, you will have time to meet your friends and show, socialize, but you also need that time for yourself, which is super important, and we should always kind of emphasize that, even if we don't admit like everybody needs that time, right. And if you're not giving the time to yourself again somewhere, at some point something will break.
Speaker 1:And just actually a question that was later on is actually how to balance your you as an individual than you as a father. First of all, you as an individual, then you as a husband, yeah, and then you as a father, because I mean, it's three different things, but you're one person.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:And this is really difficult it's. I mean, I just got back from Thailand 10 days with my best friends. I know it sucks no kid, no wife was horrible. But I was talking about it with my psychiatrist on Monday and she's like, yeah, you need to do this like every once a year and everybody should actually do that, anybody who actually has a family. You should go once a year, yeah, with your best friend and just go be that old self, that that you before you got married, that you before you had a child and you really need it. And I was like, great, can I have that on a prescription so that my insurance can pay for my next?
Speaker 2:trip.
Speaker 4:Really great.
Speaker 2:She's like that's not going to work out, at least tell me how that works.
Speaker 1:But it is. It is the balancing act is quite difficult. I mean, it's already difficult in a couple without a child. I think with with kids it becomes a lot more difficult.
Speaker 2:But it's like it's all for the overall health right like and if you're not doing it, you're neglecting that, so I'd like. That's why I said, like at some point, somewhere down the line, something has got to give right, and it may look very bad when that happens, right.
Speaker 1:Is your goal to be the perfect parent? Is that, is that what you want? Is that your?
Speaker 3:No, no, never, because I know I will never be the perfect. It's just I'm trying the best I can. I'm, I know, eventually in the end, like just one number in the of a human being, but I try to to give the best I can give. I try to, as I said earlier, balance between personally, family, work life.
Speaker 1:Was it? What was your biggest fear before becoming a parent? Is there anything?
Speaker 2:I think there's more than one thing right like yeah, but I mean we all have like.
Speaker 1:For me, I was afraid. My biggest fear, right, I mean, of course we have different kinds of fear before becoming a parent, but for me I didn't want to be my dad. That was, for me, one of the biggest things was to not have the relationship that I have with my dad to have with my son. I wanted my dad and me we don't talk horrible relationship. My wife and her parents they spend Christmas all the time together. They it's really great. And for me that was for a long time. I didn't want to have a child because I was afraid. You know, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Luckily enough, I'm on a hill. My apple kept rolling down, but the apple still comes from the same tree sometimes. So for me I was always afraid that I would become my dad. That was always my, my greatest fear. It's not.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you're looking at me.
Speaker 1:You wouldn't know, I just for the greatest fear?
Speaker 2:I don't know. I mean, definitely each and every one of us had different relationship with parents, right, but it's somewhere, at some point, it also boils down to that one. Like you either look at it and it's been, it's been like fantastic and you want to take it up a notch because you know you are the next generation, so it only, it's only fair that you try to do it even better, or it's been really bad and you, absolutely, first of all, you may be afraid you're going to repeat those mistakes. Or, second, you will just think like it was bad for me, so I'm going to do my best to make it great for this young being right. So I don't know like my relationship, of course, is different, probably not like the best, but but there is like no bad blood between us. But I think thinking about my relationship with my parents probably also makes me want to be like certain parent for my kids, right, so I want to be more, I want to be more present, I want to I don't know, I want to have like I don't want to lose my temper or you know all those things right.
Speaker 2:Greatest fear probably that I'm not going to be around for as long as I would like to and like that's kind of my one of the things, but again, I don't think it's like something that's keep me, you know, keeping me up at night. But if you like, really like, put me in the spot like what's your greatest fear? Like connected to like parenting and then parenthood, and I think that just like I will not be around and it's still you know, it's still not the time to not be around, like, be it like death or something else, right, or like I don't know, we end up being split or something. So that would be my biggest fear, probably, like I will not be there when they really need me. Still, not like when they're like whatever, when they're moving on with their life and they're, you know, being like all grown and everything. But like right now, for example, if I was to be kind of away now for whatever reason, being permanently or or temporarily, even I would be like that would be keeping me up at night.
Speaker 3:Well, no, I think it in a different way. If, if, if death will take me, like, so it is nothing to be worried about. It's this is something I shouldn't be thinking of. But my biggest fear is, like, if they need me and I'm not capable to give them what they expecting from me, that's what always scares me and pushed me to work as hard as possible to at least financially be able to support them whenever they needed that, especially these days, like it's all about being capable to provide financially to your kids for good education, good lifestyle I'm not saying like to spend money left and right for no reasons, but at least I to to show them that they don't need anybody else. And back to the relation with my parents, I would say I have the best parents ever I would. My father is my idol. If I achieve like probably 20% of what he has achieved, I will be, I will feel that I'm the best person on earth.
Speaker 1:And we had a discussion. Actually remember we were smoking cigars one night and we had a discussion about your dad and I know how much you look up to him and how much you really really love him. I know how great of a dad he is. Yeah, that was and and I know you're also a very good dad, but it's and for Mr.
Speaker 4:For the butcher butcher.
Speaker 3:Your words.
Speaker 4:Well, for me. I remember the question said like what fears you had even before you become a father? Like before, I'm kind of like you. I don't really think a lot, and when I go for something I just jump hands and feet and great for dentists.
Speaker 4:But I can say that before I didn't think of anything, I was the type that I I never fancied have children, Although I was not against it. I was just living my life, so present in every stage and even the way we had. How we have a child. We were married. It was only two years, it was 2021, we both had COVID. I said we were bored at home. That's the time my wife got the COVID babies. My, that's the literal meaning of.
Speaker 4:COVID babies. So my wife got the COVID. Everyone told me, man, find yourself a hotel, otherwise we get infected. Like I'm not leaving a man behind, I'm staying with her, I'm serving her. So obviously, by day five, when she was at her peak, I started catching. So when she was day 10, she was done.
Speaker 4:I was in day five, she was, she was done, she was bored. And she started all the thoughts about, like you know my abs, like I'm fertile now, like no, we should have a baby now. But I'm in day five, I'm in, I'm a shattered pieces of a man remaining. I say like, but like now, now. Now the app say, now, okay, let's do now. Then at night, like the other app says, now I was like you know what, in normal days I would never mind, I would even kill for it as many times as possible, but I don't have anything of me left yet. So this is how, even with that other child. And then we were blessed that this guy came to the world and it all these trials like I just love the fact that men will even 40 degree fever.
Speaker 1:You're losing the leg on a battlefield and a woman comes like hey, you want to have sex? Yeah, it's perfect time right now. I'm good, let's go.
Speaker 4:Men I day five my spine was hurting, like as if a tank has passed over me, like just crossed on me and then, but I would say I would say being the father, being the father, the fear is that I don't give them experiences. That's because I came as an Egyptian. I love my country, I love my family, but the way I grew I had a very limited vision of the world. I didn't have the chances to experience a lot of things in life and I was cherishing living here that it's a very cosmopolitan.
Speaker 4:Every nationality I meet they have like different culture, different sports. That's why I even I quote myself as the pastor, why I feel like I'm like every day I'm catching something and I feel that's the biggest treasure I can give to my child. He can get experiences. And about death, of course it scares me a bit because I know I'm a bit older. I'm afraid that I cannot leave them with maybe good money, but my belief in general that they will be taken care of, nothing will go in vain. But it's about creating and giving experiences where he can really find himself and identify himself.
Speaker 1:I mean for the money part. I mean whether you leave money behind for a child or not. For me personally, it doesn't matter. It's the building blocks for him to become a better human and to know how many options he has. For me, richness is how many options I have. Yeah, this is really like that. Of course, money is important. Great to have. It's better to have than not to have. But to have those options, that is priceless. And to him to realize that the experiences is really yeah, it's the same. For me it's experiences. Don't be afraid to jump into things, take your risk.
Speaker 1:Yeah, to try stuff, try stuff yeah try it out, even if you're 40 degrees sick and your back is hurting.
Speaker 2:You can still make a baby. You can still make a baby.
Speaker 1:You don't have to move much. You get a participation medal at that point.
Speaker 4:Yeah, man, yeah, man, and yes, experiences. I feel I'm so curious since I came here, like actually living here and seeing the tons or magnitude of chances we can live and learn from. This is what I want my child to have. He will have his own identity, he will find it. I want him to grow to understand that having a hobby and doing sports, this is one thing he will grow old with.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And this is something he can even make money out of one day. It will be his best friend one day. I adore when you just, for example, go to your man cave and then you draw or you play your music.
Speaker 1:You don't have a man cave anymore. It was transformed into a baby room, right?
Speaker 4:Yes, my wife treated my man cave as my second wife. She was so jealous because I go inside and I find myself like then where am I in this equation? So before one year, before my child needs his own room, she made sure like to convert it into the child room. Then I cannot have my man cave anymore.
Speaker 2:Yes, and all your stuff is now given to charity.
Speaker 4:In boxes in the closet, like You're lucky. Then I just look at them and was like ah, it took me almost 40 years to have this study room of mine and then in no time, like it's taken away from me it can come back.
Speaker 2:Still, you still haven't lost it. It's there in boxes, yeah.
Speaker 1:I just I'm just looking at him, looking at his boxes, sitting on the floor, going like maybe if I didn't have a fever that night, maybe things would have been a little bit different.
Speaker 4:But, but to be honest, this, this little man, like just opening the door coming from work and now, as he's growing older and he runs at you, is he can even fall, because he's like he's not thinking, he's just running, opening his arms and smiling. That's worth the world.
Speaker 1:Heaven.
Speaker 4:That's heaven. Yes, thank you Was there any regrets.
Speaker 1:Do you guys have any regrets? I mean, we're not that far down the road as you guys. It's too late for regrets now.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's such a heavy word, right? I probably know there are definitely things that you know always. Like you know, whatever hindsight is 2020, right?
Speaker 2:So, you always like, oh my God, we should have done that one. But so probably no regrets. Probably there were some mistakes that happened and you know we will be working on making sure they are, kind of, you know, addressed and we're going through some of them. Maybe no, I don't think so. I think it was the right choice. I think it was a good call.
Speaker 2:I can definitely confirm from my own perspective that it was rough, which probably means for my wife it was like 10 times rougher, right, because she was the person stuck at home for like months. Right, and because she was going through like a mild depression. Right, and not me. Right, and because she was also thinking like, oh my God, like he has to wake up for work every day and it's important because you know we needed it and everything else, right. So it was like all these things kind of going through her head even more than my head, right, so no regrets. But you know there are always things you could have done better and you have to live with that and the only thing you can do is just, you know, keep doing your best and keep giving it your best shot every single day.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, what you guys were saying about like just being like welcome at home. That's still there. Like my kids are big but it's still a big deal. They don't see me for like most of the day. We have like all mornings together because we wake up at the same time, so I see them go to school, then they are back from school and only kind of like around dinner time I'm the one coming back. So my wife is like always jealous because like I'm not getting any of that kind of love You're getting every single day. You open the door and just come back right and they're like big, right and that's worth like everything. That's true. And I'm like just dreading the days when it kind of starts going away, because they're also like at an age where, like you know, teenage years are like very close on the horizon. So we're just waiting for that dreadful moment when it's like going to be like talking back and slamming doors and all that stuff. So I treasure that right now.
Speaker 1:Mayan, you passed the slapping doors and talking back right. It was like from 13 to 17. No, isn't that like the horrible?
Speaker 3:It didn't happen with me, honestly.
Speaker 1:He's so perfect, he's perfect.
Speaker 3:No, it's just I tried to like come as possible as I could to their level of thinking and explaining to them that anger and shouting and yelling and screaming and breaking things it's not the solution. We can always think about it. Like, even though, until now, when we have any discussion about things and it turns to argument and they start like losing time to prove their point, I just like stop there, calm down, relax, take a deep breath and let's talk slowly so we can understand each other. I'm not saying no to you, I'm just trying to understand your point and I'm trying to explain to you my point. We let's talk in this way, so by shouting and yelling and getting high temper. All of us can do that, but who will win in the end? Nobody. So just calm down.
Speaker 3:So this didn't happen really with me, that slamming doors and these things. I'm just I'm saying that something like great had happened, but maybe it helped me because, again, they are a twin, so they grew up together and I tried from the beginning, from like the moment they start playing together, explaining to them somehow about the sharing, the caring, the, that's. Nothing happens, nothing will be solved by fighting, like if they fight over a toy. So the toy is taken from both of them. Both of them they lose it. So they understood from this that fighting is not the solution, yet giving each other, talking, calming down. So this could be a reason to help me, I don't know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, open discussion. I mean I have the same with my wife. It's a very you have to have an open discussion and we have a safe word whenever one of us is angry. It's like we just say chattel and it just needs, everybody needs to calm down. Take a second, think really about what's going on and then from there you know you keep on moving ahead and really kind of talk about it. But sometimes I find it a little bit difficult with Moon anyway.
Speaker 1:I mean she's still young, but there's you wait, you know it's it's. Sometimes it's a little bit difficult to really even as a as an adult. You just sit there and you're like, can you not understand what the fuck I'm trying to tell you right now? Right, and I think it's a. I do find it a little bit difficult that he's testing your limits.
Speaker 4:Children are very smart. Yeah he's, he's exploring you, testing your limits. See to what extent he can get through or get away with things. I believe this, they are all doing that.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's it. It goes back to like how I thought my parenting style is going to be, and then every day it kind of starts shifting because you're thrown into this. It's like, oh, I didn't see this coming and I didn't see that coming. And I'm trying to stay true to how I want it to be. But life is, you know, life throws you, you know. It just starts going like, oh, you want it that way. Well, that's not going to go that way. Oh, you had plans this weekend. Yeah, that's not happening anymore. So it's, it's. It's difficult to have a certain parenting style and really trying to stick to it and and trying to to kind of have it your perfect way. What, what kind of?
Speaker 2:I mean I think that's also where my wives come in, because I mean there is no fatherhood without motherhood. My wife, if you're listening to it, I said it.
Speaker 1:She probably told him to say that before 100%, like I had to sneak it in. I can say it, I'm not sleeping there.
Speaker 2:But it's true, right? However cheesy it sounds like, we are not alone, right, the same way, unless there are circumstances, of course, right, but I think all of us are. You know, are with wives and you are all sharing the same responsibility, right, and you're trying to play it by the same rules For the most part. Of course, there's always going to be a different style the dad is this versus the mom is this, but you're not playing against each other, right? So all on the same team. Yeah, exactly, even if the styles are different. Right, and the kids know it as well.
Speaker 1:I can get away with this with mom, it's like Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippet. I'm Jordan, of course.
Speaker 2:But I cannot get away with this with dad, for example, right. So I think it's like a shared responsibility, but it's also like a shared objective, right, because you do it every day and sometimes one person has to give more than the other, but ultimately, at the end of every day, it's all. Like you know, whatever we did today was good. It's getting them to the next milestone, let's say right, and getting us to the next milestone as well, like when they are going to be self-sufficient and all that, right? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, we definitely. Like. You know, having it like, oh, father, kind of talk is fantastic and I love that, but also like it's super important to keep that other side of the story right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just a lot of times. The thing is why I really wanted to make it kind of a dad thing on this micro thing is because sometimes I really feel there's a lot. I mean, we talked about this before A lot of men don't want to share how they're doing in their fatherhood right now. Yeah, women, if you go on social media, it's full of moms sharing everything and the dads are very quiet or it's videos of dad being funny. It is, it really is. Yeah, it's like the dad is throwing the kid like a football and that's kind of how it is, but there is no honest, deep conversation of how you're doing.
Speaker 2:How tough it is.
Speaker 1:It is really tough. It's not easy to balance your manhood, as they would put it, and being able to share your deep thoughts and feelings with other men, because maybe you're ashamed or you don't feel confident enough to cry in front of another man because you're like, oh, maybe he's going to think that I'm weak or whatever. And that's really kind of what I wanted to do is really make it that it's a safe spot. I guess we can put it that way. It's a little bit woke, but how woke. I mean, however, you want it, but the thing is, the more and more I talk with dads, there's a lot of pain and suffering that we weren't able to share.
Speaker 1:I went through postpartum depression. I mean, I'm actually going through it right now and I couldn't do it before because my wife went through it. And my wife was like you need to heal what happened, you need to go through it, and I was like I cannot go through that right now because you're going through that. We cannot have two parents going through this taking care of a child. One parent can go through that. The other one needs to stay strong and I'll deal with it later. I mean, that's personally how I feel about that, and I do talk to a lot of fathers about it, and they go through their postpartum light or not light. Wives go through it all the time. I mean moms also go through it all the time and it's not easy being a dad, being a man, being a husband in the world we kind of live today. I mean, that's kind of how I'm.
Speaker 4:Yes, there is a stigma of things being competitive. Your way, my way. I always say we complete. We don't compete, we actually complete each other. Like even in things that straightforward has a competition, like, for example, when Spartak and Jujutsu. If you're, for example, taking me down this way, you're completing me because you're teaching me something. So we always keep to complete each other, even with a competition.
Speaker 4:So parenting, of course it's very challenging.
Speaker 4:When it comes to this point, how parents behave in front of the child, of course I have my own heritage and background and I want, for example, to a parent from my own perspective and definitely respectfully, my wife has the same and it's how we behave and how we handle it in front of the child, how we can have an understanding to deliver the best for them, because this is our goal at the end.
Speaker 4:Unfortunately, sometimes it becomes like my way but this is wrong. There is no right and wrong, I would say, and we forget that. Each child is unique, so there is no rule. We have to have resiliency. Not everything, for example, the grandparents have passed to us as parents should be right, not everything we read in books. I see my child as very unique and I don't need to impose or force on him the way I've been raised or the way my wife's philosophy or my own philosophy, and that's what I always call for resiliency If we're doing something but he's resisting. Is this challenge between providing what's right or showing him the way, but at the same time not overwriting his personality that he has one already?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, the thing is, I get it, you want to. You kind of want to guide him, but you don't want to write his whole book.
Speaker 4:Thank you.
Speaker 1:You want to give him. Here's the paper, here's the book, this is how you build it. Here's the pen, and now you write your own story. I don't want to write your story for yourself, for you, right? I mean, he's got to live his life because I live mine and I can't tell him how to live his life. I can show him how I lived it and I can give my own, my own, how do you call them?
Speaker 2:Now your own perspective or your own spin on it right, but it's going to be yeah.
Speaker 1:But at the end he is going to do his own thing. And, yes, we're all individuals and when you're talking interracial marriage, the same like mine, it's two totally different cultures and dynamics that are clashing together. And then you're trying to raise your child with this whole thing abroad on top of it and it becomes even more difficult. There's more layers to it.
Speaker 4:There's a 100% and actually the way I see this, interracial marriages. I feel it should be like a.
Speaker 1:Abogatory.
Speaker 4:It's like a mine of treasure because, like now, that child is not carrying only one culture, it's happening too, not only one perspective having more. So unless we do it in a civilized, very, very natural and very respectful way, they will not really benefit from it. We don't want it to be a struggle and a hustle. We want it to be an added value. This is how I see and the one thing I want to really comment on parenting, or parenthood. It is the most magnificent and beautiful experience in this life.
Speaker 1:And difficult.
Speaker 4:It is difficult, but it's worth it.
Speaker 4:But it's difficult but it's beautiful, there is a lot of meaning in it, a whole purpose in it and there is a joy. There is joy if you just open up your eyes. Some people maybe are more prone to see the negative more than the positive, but if you really keep an eye open on the positive and on the happiness and in the joy in it, it is beautiful. There is a moment that is always sometimes being teached to my eyes, and my wife was challenging me like oh, you're going to cry while I'm giving birth. It's like why? Because I see videos on the internet like these are pussies. Why don't you cry in these situations? Actually, what happened is at the delivery. It was a natural one, so I was having my GoPro, so there was the doctor and the midwife.
Speaker 2:He's the GoPro dad. He's the GoPro dad. And they were like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the 366.
Speaker 2:We have all seen them. We have all seen them, it's fine.
Speaker 4:Giving, delivering. And then I was having the selfie stick long one, so I was between the doctor's hand and going like almost inside. So she almost stopped. She looked at me. I was like yeah, yeah, I want to get everything to her. Go back, please, and then let me do my work. So I was actually that happy and that excited about it.
Speaker 4:But then it was the next day I was carrying him. I know that when they are very first born or newly born, they don't really see as good, but to me how it felt. I was carrying him and it looked like he's staring into my eyes, as if he's staring in my soul, and he gave that very, very cute smile and he just put his head on my chest and I was crying Like I've never cried in my entire life. And then my wife said so you cried Not at delivery, but maybe this is the moment that really got put the mercy in your heart towards this thing. It was a connection that no other. I thought look at this small, tiny, helpless human being or creature. I felt like he greeted you in a smile, he trusted me and he leaned on me. I was like that's something that's very meaningful. I was crying for like a long.
Speaker 1:I can see there's little tears in your eyes. You still think about it. I think the one thing that children do bring to you there is this mirrored image of yourself as a child, without your barriers, without your ego, without your. You're a man. You shouldn't cry, all of that stuff just. And I think this is that moment where you were not a man anymore. You were just a human. At that point, that's a beautiful. You're just a human. At the end of the day, we forget. We're just humans, trying to do our best, and that's all what it's about. And trying to do our best to make another human do his best, and without the walls, without anything, and it's just the pureness of the humanity.
Speaker 4:And you're just holding that child and you're just like, yeah, it's a some they bring a lot of beautiful meanings to your life, like honesty, trust, curiosity, enthusiasm, love, unconditional love, like I don't know.
Speaker 1:I mean this guy. He got two of them at the same time in his arms. That must have been.
Speaker 3:Well, my story a little bit different than Karim's story. It's actually the Jumana. My wife had a difficult pregnancy period, so it was like really struggling during her pregnancy and that twin were not stable without the doctor who was taking care of her. And then there was some pills. We used to bring it all the way from Syria she, because it's not available here that time and we used to bring them from Syria to take them to keep the baby stable in her Until.
Speaker 3:One day we were at the clinic and the doctor said, okay, we will stop the pills now and after a week, on that day, we will meet at the hospital for the delivery. And that was Wednesday evening. Friday evening, jumana start feeling that there's horrible pain. So I called her like two days later, two days after the, which we were supposed to be like a week after. So I called her she's in pain. No, that's normal, just relax these things. And then the pain is starting. Then and she was out with her family, the doctor, and I told her that pain is not going and it's unbearable. She said, okay, bring her to me to the clinic.
Speaker 3:So I drove from Karama, where we were at my in-law house, all the way to Deira, to MacTomb Street, where the clinic is of the doctor, and she said, oh my God, she's about to have the baby now, so take her to Latifa hospital. I don't know what do you mean? Latifa hospital? She said, well, this is the only one who will accept emergency. I don't know what about her booking with you? You're the one who will deliver. No, no, latifa hospital. They will not allow me to deliver there because I don't know one on earth will touch my wife.
Speaker 3:But you know her, you know her condition from day one until now. So you are no way. Don't even think of it, man. I don't have booking. I told her I don't care, you will be the one who will deliver her. So she start like calling the hospital that she deals with. It took her a couple of hours. She booked a room and booked a bed. She brought a doctor, baby's doctor and everything, and we were going together and I was supposed to be with her in the delivery room. Then the doctor, before she goes inside, she looked at me and she saw my color has changed and I'm about like to faint.
Speaker 3:She said I wanna take care of her not you inside the delivery room.
Speaker 3:Get the fuck out, no, I wanna be. She said no way, you will not be inside with me, go out, I wanna take care of her, not you. So yeah, and the first few months, honestly speaking, I was not that parent feeling yet because what I was thinking? Look at my wife and what happened to her because of the babies so because of the baby she was like eight months not nine eight months in difficulty with her pregnancy. She had to lay down in bed many weeks just doing nothing. Because of them, she's now like running after them, like not being able to sleep properly for around three months, like every day maximum four to five hours and not continuous, like it's break every 30 minutes she wakes up for some reason. So it was really very difficult and I could see only her, how much she's suffering. Of course I was there, trying to help her as much as I could, but the only time I felt that I'm a father probably six months later, when one of them was hospitalized.
Speaker 1:Mm.
Speaker 3:That's the time I felt, oh my God, what happened to him? And I cried. But I cried only after I made sure that he's OK.
Speaker 4:Yeah it's a cry of relief.
Speaker 1:But I had the same thing for me, like I, told you before.
Speaker 3:I mean, I remember you put it also on the emergency C section, almost losing my wife and my child.
Speaker 1:It's tough, it's really nice Because at that point in time that's your everything, is your wife, that's your whole world, that's exactly. Everything for you at that point. Yeah, him being in the hospital for the first time was really, really, really difficult.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 1:When was your first time you realized your?
Speaker 3:do you see?
Speaker 1:and nobody had the moment in the movies where the finger of the dad is going and then the little baby finger comes up and grabs it. Like this is such a movie kind of thing. Pleasure you were.
Speaker 2:I think so, as you were both recalling the birth. So in our case it was a difficult birth both cases. First time was completely it just happened. It basically wasn't progressing at a certain point Because my wife was adamant to deliver naturally.
Speaker 2:She really wanted that and I think deep down she really has some sort of regret or there is this kind of nagging kind of thing that you didn't deliver naturally, it was a C-section, even though you didn't plan for it and so on. So the first one it was a C-section and it kind of went down like normally, but again it wasn't the plan. So she was not feeling great because of it. But the father moment, I think with the first one, straight away the same day, kind of delivery happened. So because it was a C-section, I wasn't planned, so of course I wasn't there in the room, I was literally next door and I was with him as they were taking him away just to put him in the neo-nato world. So I had my first whatever 10 minutes, 15 minutes, I don't remember, maybe even a half hour, and that felt like.
Speaker 1:Do you remember what you told him?
Speaker 2:I think it was some stupid shit.
Speaker 1:I will always protect you. Yeah, like hey what's going on.
Speaker 2:Look at you, something like that. Right, it must have sounded silly, I'm sure, but it felt great. It felt great. And with the second one, again, it was a C-section. It wasn't planned, sadly. And with the second one it was a bit closer to what you guys were describing Probably not as dire, especially your case, mo like. When you were describing it it felt really kind of serious. So I never had that situation. But for a moment there I really felt like stuff might go completely south and I have nothing to do with it. There's nothing in my hands. I'm just like the Powerless, I'm like the sucker sitting outside the room just waiting for the news to be delivered, right. So with the second one, I had that weird moment when like, oh my god, something is going to go bad, right, and ultimately, like, all in all, it went down well. But with the second one, I think it took me a bit longer to get to that moment. And again, everybody has a favorite right, like whatever they say.
Speaker 1:We now know who your favorite is Always true.
Speaker 2:It's always true with the favorites and all, but I remember I had a different journey with my younger one than with the first one and looking back now it must have felt like unfair and all, and I'm hoping he's going to forgive me at some point.
Speaker 1:He's definitely going to hear this.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I think it took me a longer to get to that Like, oh wow, it's like number two, and now there is two of them and they're like looking up to you equally or they will be looking up to you equally in the next couple of whatever years, right. But yeah, I think, just talking about dangerous situations like I think ultimately both were close to kind of danger zone, but not as dire as the examples you guys gave, because they sound really intense and thinking about hearing those examples like going back, like it kind of just makes me realize how lucky we had been ultimately that nothing of that magnitude happened. But it kind of also made me like scared, like whoo, Things can go so many directions, right, Even if everything is fine and everything is kind of going well.
Speaker 1:So for the second child, you were more worried about the fact that you're going to have to provide for two now.
Speaker 2:I mean, again, the thought was there for sure, but again, that was the plan. So it's never a conversation that we have with friends Like, oh yeah, number one was planned, number two wasn't. Like we knew there's going to be two of them. Again, I think the only difference is like we might have spaced them differently. But again, looking back, I think it was the right call, even if, like medically, we maybe made like a mistake because we probably should have waited.
Speaker 2:But then again the doctors also gave us like a bit of like kind of wrong messaging on that. Yeah, because I remember you were waiting, like is that a good time or not? And we technically got like a green light saying, like you know, you could probably think about if you want to have them close. You could probably think now and it started really quickly, right, that it happened really quickly. And then when the second was delivered, after they opened her up, they told her listen, it was really a close call and you know you ended up being super lucky that we did the C-section, because it might have turned really ugly if you were trying to go ahead with the second being a natural right. So then we were also thinking like, oh, wow, like you know, we like dodged the bullet probably, and you know not going to want.
Speaker 1:Both of them are healthy and everything, so yeah, exactly that's all what you want at the end of the day.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Happy, healthy kids. All right, so there's going to be two last questions. The first one it's going to be for any new dads or dads that want to become dads out there what was the greatest piece of advice somebody gave to you and would you give it to that future dad?
Speaker 3:Well, same what I said in the beginning.
Speaker 1:Get him young. Get him young as young as possible, as young as possible, even for your sons, you would say that.
Speaker 3:But even for my sons I would say that and I would also tell them do the best you can and don't worry about the future. It's, it's nothing. I mean no one can know what will happen in the future. You cannot. Just you can plan as much as you could. You can work as hard as you could, do your duties and rest. It will be OK.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's pretty good.
Speaker 4:I would say be the best version of yourself. Be a good man first, before you become a father. Then things will fall in place naturally. You will be a good example for them. Even I do it before. Like I say it, when people want to get married, like they're very concerned like looking for a good woman to get married, be the best version of yourself. Be a good man before you look for a good woman. If you're good, everything good will come to your life and you will do good.
Speaker 3:Absolutely correct and I like that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I feel maybe when I led my life and I worked on myself, I've been through coaching. I worked on myself really hard and even some of my homies my brother, used to say, like we can sense that you have changed, you've grown more mature and didn't look like you worked on yourself. I feel this is helping me to become a good father. So if everyone just work on themselves, become good.
Speaker 3:Man. Nobody ever told me, I became more mature.
Speaker 4:They don't see that hidden part, they don't know what's happening behind the scenes.
Speaker 2:If any of the wives are listening to it. They're like, just like no.
Speaker 1:No, way no.
Speaker 2:I mean, I love how my man put it, but I also love the way Karim put it. I think getting your house in order before you kind of take the next step it sounds like a great thing to do. Again, I'm not sure I actually went through that, to be honest, and now, looking back, I think I will repeat, like a phrase that I keep hearing from my office manager, the person who runs the whole company Somebody wants a raise.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:Like he's a fantastic guy and his famous line is don't take yourself too seriously. I think and we kind of put a lot of boundaries, we put the bar super high, right, and sometimes it just goes down to listen you will make mistakes, you will. You know stuff will happen, that some of it is on your hands, some of it is not in your hands, right. But I think, ultimately, at the end of the day, if you're being kind to yourself, as you're kind of going through that, that's super important. It's going to give you much more than, like killing yourself over all the things you did wrong and now you're just nagging at you, just eating you alive, right. So just like, don't be too hard on yourself, Don't be too serious about it, right. Like you will be making every parent is going to be making mistakes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course, the only thing you can hope for is like you will not screw them up too much.
Speaker 1:I mean, we are going to screw them. Yeah, exactly, don't screw them up too much. We're going to screw up and they're going to hate us for something.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:Right, and I mean, for me it's one of the first podcasts we had was actually with my wife's parents. Wow, this was. It was actually super interesting because they're now grandparents and they brought up kids at a different time. And it was relax, don't make it more difficult than what it actually is. It's already super difficult. Exactly, relax, chill, the fuck up, chill, like just chill.
Speaker 2:Don't overcomplicate it, because it's just relax, I think that's the piece of advice parents are not getting enough of.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think a lot of parents they're just, they're they, they. They make themselves more busy, they make them lies more complicated, and I also I also think it's a lot of the baby industry. I mean, it's a multi-billion dollar industry and you know, if you don't have this, you're going to fuck up your kids.
Speaker 1:If you don't buy this, you're you know, if you don't have this and this and this. And then at the end you're also as a parent, you don't want to mess up too much, right? So you, you kind of buy all these things, and then at the end, I that, and I look at my wife and it's like when, when there is something new coming in, I just like, all right, relax, do we need it? Is it going to be then?
Speaker 2:and then just relax and then you go back to like old basics anyway, right?
Speaker 1:Exactly, and at the end you go back to old basics.
Speaker 4:Man, we're seven, but we're over seven billion on the planet at the moment. And how many billions and billions have been been forced. So it's not rocket science, nothing new. It's like it's. Maybe the time is different, but like chill yeah.
Speaker 1:It's. It's really relaxed chill.
Speaker 4:In there, everywhere. Everything's going to be fine and for those who say, like you cannot survive without doing this or doing that, it's mostly commercial, like they ask me. For what is that? What is the best toothpaste? Like just brush your teeth. So it's where it's just brush it If you'll be fine, I even don't care what toothpaste I buy for myself and I'm a dentist like that, Just brush. So just like live it.
Speaker 1:Chill, relax, relax, relax relax, make work on yourself, be the best you want to be, yeah, and everything kind of falls into pieces after that. Guys, thank you so much for being on this little podcast. Is it over? Yeah, I hope you guys enjoyed it.
Speaker 3:Very much, very much, thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you, my wife called me only three times so.
Speaker 1:You can tell her it's my fault. Don't worry, Guys. Thank you again.
Speaker 2:And have a good one.