Jack Frost At The MAC

A twig for a tree, a guilty love of bad Christmas movies, and the sound of a dog “tap dancing” set a playful scene before we dive into the real star: a brand-new Christmas musical called Jack Frost at The MAC Belfast. We sit down with writer Ali Harding and choreographer Jennifer Rooney to unpack how a spark turned into an epic winter adventure with twelve original songs, a celestial court, and a snow globe that holds the heart of the season.

Ali shares why she stepped from performer to writer after decades of Christmas shows and how Jack became the perfect canvas—light on lore, rich with possibility. Together with director Cameron Menzies and composer Katie Richardson, the team built a world that feels cinematic on stage: a village in winter, storms that crack the ground, martial-arts-inspired battles, and character moments that land with heart. There’s Hoot the Owl, a scene-stealing diva with lines for the grown-ups, Jon Snow’s gentle humour for kids, and a ballad—lovingly adapted from Ali’s late brother—that delivers a quiet emotional punch. Expect monsters and loud moments too, balanced with relaxed performances for sensitive audiences.

We talk about the craft behind the magic: overwriting so you can cut in rehearsal, writing with empathy for actors’ quick changes and breath, and shaping movement that reads as elemental power rather than busy traffic. With only seven performers, the company had to conjure a village, a journey, and a battle for balance across the seasons. The result is tight, vivid, and designed so families leave feeling lifted. If you care about theatre-making, festive storytelling, and the kind of belief that gets people through tough winters, this one hits home.

If you enjoyed the conversation, follow the show, share it with a theatre-loving friend, and leave a review to help more listeners find us. Got a favourite Christmas stage memory or character you’d be—Jack, Hoot, Krampus, or Jon Snow? Tell us in your review and tag us on socials.

End of MLL

Chapters

• 0:00 Festive Banter And Traditions
• 2:17 Introducing Ali Harding And Jennifer Rooney
• 4:00 Why Write A New Christmas Show
• 7:05 Building Jack Frost: Story, Music, Team
• 10:30 Characters, Cast, And Comic Relief
• 12:50 Themes, Worldbuilding, And The Snow Globe Quest
• 16:05 Rewriting, Collaboration, And Letting Go
• 18:40 Rehearsals, Music, And Movement Language
• 21:40 Staging Epic Moments With A Small Cast
• 24:30 Schedules, Previews, And Handing It Over
• 27:30 Other Christmas Shows And Community
• 29:35 Three Words: Magical, Epic, Belief
• 31:30 Future Writing And Final Details

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:25

I'm with you there, Timmy. I'm definitely with you there.

SPEAKER_03: 0:28

Yeah, my twig. My Christmas tree's a twig. Literally a twig.

SPEAKER_04: 0:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 0:33

But listen, we've got much more jolly, twinkly people with us today. Got the best. Friends of the pod. They're back. They're back. I love them so much. Welcome, Ali Harding, and Jennifer Rooney. How are you?

SPEAKER_01: 0:44

Hello.

SPEAKER_03: 0:45

Are you okay?

SPEAKER_01: 0:46

Are we allowed to say happy Christmas whenever it's not? It's only November, darling. It's only November. No. But we have been filled with the Christmas bird for months now because we've been.

SPEAKER_00: 0:55

So we catch it. That noise is my dog, by the way. So sorry about that.

SPEAKER_03: 0:58

Stephen went up today.

SPEAKER_00: 0:58

It sounds like he's tap dancing. Any heavy panting is not me. I did consider, because you've got to go up in the loft and get your winter coat down going, oh well, you might as well get the Christmas decorations down as well. I normally put my Christmas decorations up weekend before Christmas.

unknown: 1:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:16

Oh and then they're down New Year's Day.

SPEAKER_02: 1:19

Okay, well, I'm gonna be.

SPEAKER_03: 1:20

I agree with that.

SPEAKER_02: 1:21

No, I'm gonna beat you. So our school, well, they've brought us forward, so they'll be up on the 20th of November. We take our showing on Boxing Day. Wow. Is that the traditional day? No, it's not you meant to figure out our twelve days after Christmas, which is the sixth, yeah. We do Boxing Day because then it's like one last thing that's sort of in it for you. So then it's out of the way and you can enjoy that time off. Right.

SPEAKER_03: 1:47

Like boxing day, I don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_00: 1:50

But lions and watch the Christmas edition of East Enders.

SPEAKER_02: 1:54

Yes, exactly. Oh yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:57

Lauren also does a weird thing, like come to the beginning of November, she starts watching Christmas movies.

SPEAKER_02: 2:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 2:02

So how many of you watch the box?

SPEAKER_02: 2:04

Have I leave it behind? Watch 11 so far. 11? Yeah. But I I start in November, I start with like the really rubbish, you know, really rubbish Christmas movies that are all like travel part.

SPEAKER_03: 2:19

It's such a waste of your time. It's nothing worse than a rubbish Christmas movie.

SPEAKER_01: 2:22

I have to admit, I see the appeal of those terrible films.

SPEAKER_02: 2:27

Yeah. Yeah. Like they just take you into a world that doesn't exist, and you know, the biggest problem is the fact that the Christmas tree might not be lit the way it usually was for the past 30 years, and why is the time gonna survive?

SPEAKER_01: 2:40

And it's just yeah, I like doing the ironing and watching one of those terrible films.

SPEAKER_03: 2:47

I don't like doing the ironing, so if I can avoid it, I will. Me too, darling, me too. I mean, there's some things you just don't need to iron, Jennifer. Like sure, like, it's tea tangling, everything. Everything. Oh, for good. Tea towels, no, yes.

SPEAKER_02: 3:03

Stops at the pants for tea towels, yeah. I ironed once whenever we got married, and I put on a movie, and I I did until I went, no, I'm not doing this, so I have not ironed ever. Good feeling. Good feeling. The kids come back in their uniforms and Aaron goes, get that off, I need iron! I was like, I'll be fine.

SPEAKER_01: 3:25

You might need a steamer in your life because you can just steam it while they're standing there.

SPEAKER_02: 3:29

I think that's probably life's too short.

SPEAKER_03: 3:32

Well, apart from seeing your beautiful faces, we wanted to get you back on the pod because you are right in the middle of something very Christmasy. Um Ali, you have written Christmas shows.

SPEAKER_00: 3:46

I know. I well, I must have been mad when I came up with this idea. It basically happened, I I took I don't really do Christmas shows anymore because I've been doing them for 40 years, and I just think, nah, I can't do it anymore. 12 shows a week, leave it to the youngsters unless I'm being paid an absolute fortune. So I went and saw every almost every Christmas show last year, and I thought, why don't I write a Christmas show? I want to bring a bit of magic back for the especially for the little ones, you know. So I spoke to Cameron Menzies, it's all his fault. And you, we were in the same room, and he said, Go on then. So I said, Well, what shall I write it about? He said, I said, What so we had a think, and I went, Well, Jack Frost, because all he's known for is nipping at your fingers and toes and frosting windows. So you could actually write anything about him, he could go anywhere. So that's what I did, and I put a storyboard together and a visual storyboard, and I think it was the second week of January. We went to the Mac and presented the the pitch. As I suppose I've never done a pitch in my life. And then two weeks later, Cameron rings to me and says, Do you want to do a Christmas show with me? And I said, I'm not sure if I can swear, but I went, the bed. We got it. So we're now known as STB productions. And I just basically said, Well, I better put my money where my mouth is. Yeah. So I started the first draft in March because I was doing the importance of being earnest. So my head was full of Oscar Wilde, so it was no chance, yeah, no chance of an idea popping into it. So I started writing it yeah, in February, January, February, and did about three drafts. Okay. Um, and then the final rehearsal draft was in September.

unknown: 5:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 5:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 5:30

So it hasn't been a hugely long process. No.

SPEAKER_00: 5:35

Well, uh, you you wrote very quickly. I wrote very quickly because I felt I had to to just get it off my chest. I well, I had a couple of deadlines. Um, they were always in early.

SPEAKER_04: 5:47

Of course.

SPEAKER_00: 5:48

So and I was away, so she had the house to herself. And not someone going, What are you doing every five minutes?

SPEAKER_03: 5:54

Um during the time you rent three, yeah. Yeah. Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 5:59

So it worked out very well because she was able to just have that time just to think and do stuff. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 6:04

No demands.

SPEAKER_01: 6:04

No demands. No demands being made. Somebody dinner.

SPEAKER_00: 6:08

Um, I've got Madame on board, obviously, as um one of our Northern Ireland's best choreographers. Choreographing it. Um Cameronis.

SPEAKER_03: 6:17

It's something, like.

SPEAKER_00: 6:19

Nama Keever's set design, and Katie Richardson, who's written some beautiful, beautiful music. Because it's a musical. It is a musical. It's a musical. There's 12 songs. I can't even, I can't even, yeah, I think so. I mean, you know, it's it's short and sweet, it's 45 each way, we hope. Um, but there's a couple of teardrokers. You're gonna need your hanky to me. If I do cry, I think you will, you will cry at this. Yeah. I also am very proudly, because I'm my brother's custodian of his back catalogue, yeah. Alex Harding, I got one of his songs in. Oh, sorry. Which is Katie's done a beautiful, it's a ballad, so that's where you're gonna need your tissue. Yeah. And it's called I'll Always Come Back for You.

SPEAKER_02: 7:03

Oh, right.

SPEAKER_00: 7:05

But we've changed it to I'll Always Be Here for You because it's a it's a moment which is quite a pivotal moment in the story between Jack and Neve. Jack Neve is the snow angel angel, and Alex wrote it for his dog called BJ, and it's always been there. And I thought, oh, I know that song will go perfect there. I did ask him first, and he communicated and said, Yes, that's fine. And Katie's written a beautiful, beautiful um arrangement. Oh, that's yeah. So he's got us that song is finally out to the public.

SPEAKER_01: 7:41

Yeah, we've got some amazing singers as well. In fact, they all can sing beautifully.

SPEAKER_00: 7:45

We have Mark Mark Dogdell who's playing Hoot the Owl, who is a sarcastic sarcastic, witty Maggie Smith style.

SPEAKER_03: 7:55

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02: 7:56

Yes, we'll be interested in Hoot the Food. Hoot.

SPEAKER_00: 8:00

Such a diva.

SPEAKER_02: 8:01

We have been.

SPEAKER_00: 8:02

She is such a diva, and she has her number at the top of Act Two, which you will love. You will love. So Mark Dubdow is doing a fantastic job with Hoot. Connor Quinn, who was our Jack in Into the Woods, recently just finished Harry Potter. So we managed to lure him back. Ema Furon, who was in Pinocchio with me. She is Neve the Snow Angel. We have Rosie Barry, who's got pipes that you can hear in Dublin, playing K-Lock, who I drew from Celtic folklore. We have Jack Watson playing Krampus. Who else we got? Avama. Oh, Shauna. Shauna Kearns. Sean Kearns playing St. Nicholas and the big red man might appear at the end. We'll just have to wait and see. And that's that it and Darren Franklin. Oh my godness, my brain. Darren Franklin, who is the most beautiful, bumbling Jon Snow you could wish for, and very, very funny. So my comedy in the piece is Hoot the Owl and Jon Snow.

SPEAKER_03: 9:03

Brilliant.

SPEAKER_02: 9:04

And you mentioned about going and seeing all the Christmas shows last year, and you wanted to bring back magic. So what sort of what sort of themes are in Jackie Cross?

SPEAKER_00: 9:14

Well, it's set. Oh, and I also forgot Colette Dougal Lennon and Richard Croxford are on film as the King and Queen of Winter. So they are set in the celestial plane. So it's all starlight and orbs. We have kind of watching over the world. Watching over the world. A bit like you know, how the Greek gods look down on everything and comment. Like Hercules. Like Hercules. Oh, is it? I didn't know that. I don't know Hercules for my sins. So they are very part much part of it as well. We have snow, finally, falling snow.

SPEAKER_03: 9:51

Snow on ice. You kind of you look for certain things, and snow is one of those snow.

SPEAKER_00: 9:55

We've definitely got snow. By hook or by crook. And we have basically the to cut a very long story short, Jack St. Nicholas is the guardian of Jack Frost. Okay. And Krampus and Kaylig are after the snow globe. Now, when you say snow globe, it's not a globe you shake. This globe is the gl the heart of winter, the soul of winter, and is in a box protected with snow whirling around it, but it is basically the world. And Krampus and Kalok want to get their hands on this globe because it will control winter and they will have an everless everlasting frost, a freeze. But that can't happen because the world needs the other seasons for the world to function. So it's it's basically, I should have called it the battle of for the snow globe, but um so Jack Frost has to prove himself and find his place in the world by uh getting the snow globe out of harm's way and putting it behind the frozen gates, but there are watchers there, and he has to perform three tasks to place his magical sigil to open the gate.

SPEAKER_02: 10:59

I'm in love with this already. This is like right out my face. It's epic, it's absolutely epic.

SPEAKER_00: 11:05

We have relics, we have the ice dagger, which if anybody is stabbed with it, yeah. That's basically it, you're a goner. We have the sigil, which is Jack's thing, and he has to prove himself with the sigil. We have the cape. The cape of what's that called actually? I can't remember. Okay. Basically, you know, it's funny when you write when when you write things, you just can't talk about the cloak, the cloak because it might give away some of the plot. When you write things, you don't retain them.

SPEAKER_03: 11:37

Yeah, of course.

SPEAKER_00: 11:38

As if you're learning a script, you retain it. But when you write things, it's written, it's done. Well, you have to let go. You have to let go.

SPEAKER_01: 11:43

That's the thing, isn't it about writing? Like it's your person, it is your it's coming from you, it's your personal journey, but then you have to hand it over to the director, the choreographer, the designer, and then whatever they do with it. I've been grand, I've not been too difficult.

SPEAKER_03: 11:58

Yeah, no, it has Allie being with that.

SPEAKER_01: 12:03

I was worried because I really you know, I realize how difficult it is. That's a skill that I've developed over the years, is sort of doing something and then someone coming in and going, actually, that's terrible, change it, door, that doesn't work, and you just go, right, okay. But it isn't easy. Yeah, you know, you can't be precious about things, and she's been very good because there has been quite a lot of discussion, and there have been quite a few changes, you know, in the room when we got the actors on their feet and so basically you've got to let what my main thing was was it when you read a script, you go, Wouldn't that be good?

SPEAKER_00: 12:36

Just get up on your feet and try it first. Yeah, yeah, see if it works. So that was my way around having to change things just from reading it off the page. Yeah, and it kind of worked most of the time, didn't it?

SPEAKER_01: 12:47

Yeah, yeah, and then there was just some things that had to be changed, and we would quickly try something and then send her another.

SPEAKER_00: 12:53

Your character would say that, yeah. And whatever they came up with, I would change a little bit. Yeah, but they they would be happy. Yeah, but I will say something. I never want to go to another production meeting again in my life. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01: 13:06

You're on the other side of the table?

SPEAKER_00: 13:08

I'm on the other side, it's very been very, very interesting too. So different, so different.

SPEAKER_01: 13:12

I hit them.

SPEAKER_03: 13:12

I hate them.

SPEAKER_00: 13:13

What about this light CP4321? That will that go up there at an angle of 30. Can you go in? I don't. What are you doing?

SPEAKER_01: 13:19

Like, I don't care.

SPEAKER_00: 13:20

I don't care, just get it up there.

SPEAKER_01: 13:23

It's like welcome to my world.

SPEAKER_00: 13:25

I mean, I know they're essential and what have you, but I'd be happy never to attend one again in my life. I really would. That's fair. Especially in your lunch hour. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 13:35

Well, that's what yeah, we're doing it in our lunch. Raging.

unknown: 13:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 13:38

And do you think because you are a performer and you've lived in that world for so long that writing for a performance became easier rather than maybe writing for a you know, writing a story?

SPEAKER_00: 13:50

I think because I've done so many Christmas shows, like 40 years worth, I kind of know the formula and the formula that works and doesn't work.

SPEAKER_03: 13:57

So what is the formula for a Christmas show?

SPEAKER_00: 14:00

No, that I couldn't tell you.

SPEAKER_01: 14:02

It's the shit. She thought she or I thought you were gonna say you thought you knew, and then you realised in my head.

SPEAKER_00: 14:09

If I was writing the scene for Krampus and Kalok and they had to go and get changed, I don't want my actors panicking to get into a quick change. So I gave them a couple of scenes to get changed into.

SPEAKER_01: 14:20

So she was thinking a little bit more considerately, I suppose. Lovely for the actors, absolutely. It's a pity she didn't think a bit more about the director and the choreographer when she was saying, and then they scale a mountain.

SPEAKER_00: 14:35

But John Ferris, I think basically to me, I wrote the film version. If you are listening on Ice Scream, it's a beautiful film now.

SPEAKER_03: 14:46

So the number of times we have said, Wouldn't it be great if somebody did this? And then literally the next week there's a big announcement of such and such as coming back to the West End, or You've got your finger on the pulse, yeah. Like performance of this musical that's never seen the Lady Day, and we're like, Yeah, you've got your finger on the pulse. The movie could be on its way this time next year. That's what well, I'll get you all jobs on them.

SPEAKER_00: 15:10

Right. It would make a very good film, it would make a great film, and it's not like the Jack Frost of the movie, yeah, that was completely different. This is because I wanted you know the kids to watch something exciting, yeah, and they are gonna be a little bit scared. There are some monsters, yeah. There's a few dark moments, quite a few sort of loud moments, yeah. But I mean, obviously, when we have the uh the the quiet performances that are all be toned down, but Cameron Vigili has produced something quite I think spectacular, especially in the costumes, yeah, wigs.

SPEAKER_03: 15:40

He's such a stunning eye, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 15:42

I mean, the cut the cast all play villagers at the beginning, and they do look like they've just stepped out of that. What's that song with all the white coats? The band. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02: 15:51

Oh, East 17. E 17.

SPEAKER_03: 15:55

Yeah, another day, if you're not sure.

SPEAKER_02: 15:57

As soon as you sing, that's what they were calling themselves.

SPEAKER_03: 16:00

Yeah, is there a white fur collar somewhere?

SPEAKER_00: 16:02

Oh, there's plenty.

SPEAKER_03: 16:03

Oh, fantastic.

SPEAKER_00: 16:04

There's lots of lots of white, shabby white coats. Love it, but with an embellishment of snowflakes.

SPEAKER_03: 16:10

Love that. I'm so excited. I've been I will be gone multiple times, I think. It's a great adventure story.

SPEAKER_02: 16:17

Definitely signs like one that so my kids are 14 and 12. Um, pandemics are great, but I have kind of missed something because they're not little anymore. Yeah, but I still want to always have that Christmas.

SPEAKER_00: 16:29

This is for the it's also for the youngsters as well. I think that'd be a good one for them. Hoot and John Snow, which are for the kids, um, and Hoot is is for the adults as well. She has a few remarks that like she's my favorite line is I am not made of seasonal precipitation. You know, I mean I Hoot is me, basically.

SPEAKER_03: 16:48

Well, that's what I didn't want to say.

SPEAKER_00: 16:49

Yeah, Hoot is me.

SPEAKER_01: 16:52

That's the thing about the characters, actually, because as you watch, I we had this, we got maybe we had two minutes last night where we were doing something, so we were working out what character best described you as a person, you know. So I was saying that I was part Krampus, who's the evil dude, um with a sprinkling of Jon Snow, who's the funny like just like the two sort of parts of my character. And Cameron was hoot as well. He was hoot.

SPEAKER_00: 17:18

Yeah, she's more than a diva than me, isn't she? Yeah. Sorry.

SPEAKER_01: 17:22

Yeah. But you know, it was it was quite fun because you're like, actually, these characters find all the traits of the characters. You can see somebody in them, you know, that you know, yeah, which is quite nice.

SPEAKER_03: 17:33

And when you started right, Nally, did it just come out?

SPEAKER_00: 17:38

Yeah, it did. It was really weird. Really weird because I kind of had I did this the storyboard and then just went right. Okay, logistics, and I've I have thought about the logistics for the actors, yeah, because I am an actor and I go, I'm you know, tired of having to run off stage, get something on, and then run back on. So give let's give people a chilled time this Christmas rather than a manic time. Yeah, and it just came out, didn't it?

SPEAKER_01: 18:03

It did, yeah. You were just producing more and more, and then in fact, we had you had to cut some stuff, didn't you?

SPEAKER_00: 18:08

I overwrote to cut. Okay. That was my thing. I thought, right, I'll override.

SPEAKER_01: 18:12

I believe it actually that she was just going into the office and then you know, the next thing these in between you going, what you're doing. Yeah. Because I did eventually come back from South Korea and started bugging her.

SPEAKER_00: 18:26

Uh so yeah, I overwrote to cut. Yeah, and I think we're gonna trim a little bit more as well. Okay. We should we're just yeah, we're continually just because we didn't workshop it and to it's a new play with new music. Yeah, it's a musical, yeah, it's a full-scale musical, about 12 songs, we think. I can't remember.

SPEAKER_01: 18:43

Yeah, and it goes everywhere, you know. So it's yeah, it's pretty involved actually.

SPEAKER_00: 18:47

Yeah, and I hope you know that people will come out with their hearts full and and full of magic, and it's all about belief and believing in yourself.

SPEAKER_03: 18:56

Well, they will because you're both magic. Oh, written stuff, and that's gonna be and it's short 45 each way.

SPEAKER_01: 19:03

Even better.

SPEAKER_03: 19:06

Good girl. Yes, because nobody wants to sit through one hour twenty. No, that was just saying we're too busy, we all have things to do.

SPEAKER_01: 19:14

Yeah, one thing we can definitely say without feel is that every single person has just put their absolute all into it. You know, we've been working very hard, very hard.

SPEAKER_00: 19:24

Cast crew creatives.

SPEAKER_03: 19:29

Four weeks.

SPEAKER_00: 19:29

Not for a new musical, no.

SPEAKER_03: 19:31

So Jen, how have you got through all those 12 uh numbers in four weeks?

SPEAKER_01: 19:38

Well, look, she's still it's actually it's actually nice. It is a musical. It I'm still yeah, but it is a musical, and but it is also a play with music. Like Katie, although she has created moments where there's so there are songs, yeah. She's also doing a beautiful soundtrack. So the whole thing, yeah, sounds soundtrack and soundscape. It's a lot of work. There's a you know, so the the whole thing is sort of quite rich in the way that the it's cinematic, cinematic, and the way that it's put together.

SPEAKER_03: 20:10

They open she's written the film.

SPEAKER_01: 20:11

Because she's written the film, so Katie had to write a sound like a film.

SPEAKER_04: 20:15

A film.

SPEAKER_01: 20:18

But the there it's it's not really like I've gone from Folly's, which was the epicness of the dance, so this feels less dance-oriented and more movement-based.

SPEAKER_00: 20:29

I mean, it's careful what you wish for, isn't it? Because I remember this was like, I would really love to do a big musical two months later.

SPEAKER_03: 20:35

You wanted a big dance show.

SPEAKER_01: 20:37

I wanted a big damp show, I did. And then it came true. This is the podcast, isn't it? What can we think of? Now that was next, I want to do a film, actually. So fill 'em. Fill him.

SPEAKER_00: 20:49

Um that Folly's was this one every night, tap dancing till midnight downstairs. And I've in fact I didn't have to learn a word of any of the lyrics because I was blasting it out every day.

SPEAKER_01: 21:01

But and I'd go, oh no, not this one again.

SPEAKER_03: 21:04

While Sweet Touch and it was absolutely stunning, both of your work NI Opera, Cameron's director. I we talked about it beforehand. There was this one big tap number. What's the name of the number again? Who's that woman? Who's that woman? Or is the um or merr. Oh no, well, um and genuinely there I haven't experienced it very often when I honestly got the the riff of the opera house was gonna come off with the audience response for a number. It was insane. Bunkers. And it was brilliant, so well done.

SPEAKER_00: 21:48

Thank you. But you were part of helping with that as well.

SPEAKER_03: 21:50

Yeah, this is just what you tried. Well, it was the first time.

SPEAKER_00: 21:56

I couldn't go downstage for me, but no, I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_03: 21:58

We were partners. We were partners. It didn't quite work.

SPEAKER_01: 22:01

Basically, these two, um, plus I don't go upstage too. May and Mae of Burnt were all my guinea pigs. And Jelane came along for one of my wee sessions as well, didn't she? She was brilliant too. She was like, Yeah, that looks like that looks like tap dance. I was like, Oh, brilliant! Yeah, excellent. I'm not a tap dancer, you know. I've done it, but I'm more of Jack of all trades, basically, master of none. But it was great crack doing it.

SPEAKER_03: 22:26

What I've learned about you is you can turn your hand to anyone. Oh, that's nice, though. That's very kind. That's very kind. But yes, no follies was amazing. So I went from that dance to your sort of yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 22:39

Oh, so we have with a big how many? So it's 32, I think, in Follies, and there's seven people in this. Actually, I don't know what's more difficult, you know, because they opened a number of this show. If Jack Frost is in the village, yeah, you know, of Lunaris, and to try and make that feel like, yay, it's winter. Here's all the people in the village, and we've got seven people. You know, that's sometimes that can nearly be more tricky, but yeah, we had a we we started with that number and spent the first couple of days, first three days on that, and there that they found that tough, you know. Yeah, the cast found it tough because it is quite there's a lot of words. Thank you, Yali. It's Katie's Katie's, yeah. Thank you, Katie. There's a lot of words, and it's it's lovely to listen to, and the music is gorgeous, and I've got them running around like lunatics as well. So, yeah, the stamina for that number. In fact, we haven't done that in a couple of days. We need to get back on that. That reminds me.

SPEAKER_02: 23:39

It's just never never off. Never off.

SPEAKER_00: 23:43

Then after that number, um, as a thoughtful writer and actor, I've given them two pages off to get their breath back before they have to come back on. See you.

SPEAKER_01: 23:51

See, so there's I don't know why they're complaining.

SPEAKER_04: 23:53

Yeah, no idea why they're complaining.

SPEAKER_01: 23:57

Get on with it. But yeah, they're very good, and we've got lots of traveling because we're going on a big journey, so there's lots of we're traveling through storms and we're reacting to weather a lot, like the the ground cracks, you know, and the wind blows and the flip. There's loads of like big events that happen. So we're doing a lot of movement-based work trying to work out how to make this theatrical. I mean, we're in one, I mean, everyone's going to see a show. We're in one space, we know what a theatre is, but actually, we need to try and work hard to bring everyone on a journey.

SPEAKER_00: 24:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 24:27

So there's a lot of that sort of thing going on.

SPEAKER_00: 24:33

Um, you know, weapons. It's a magical battle. It's a magical battle. Oh, brilliant.

SPEAKER_01: 24:38

So we've got, you know, I'm drawing on my, I suppose, Sean Captain Harry Potter experience. We've got some swishing going on.

SPEAKER_00: 24:46

Sean Capes going on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 24:48

Oh god, I can't wear it. Yeah, I can't.

SPEAKER_00: 24:49

So yeah, there's a there's there's a lot going on. There's a lot.

SPEAKER_03: 24:52

There's got a different feel to choreographing a person's show compared to the other. The Rocky D.

SPEAKER_01: 24:57

Just not like No. Not on no, and not I don't usually approach it in a different way. I just like most things that I do, I just look at the script. I looked at the script, I look at the the feel of it, and I we put together, I always put together a Pinterest board where I'm trying to just like collate images of what I think. So, for example, with the battle, I went down of sort of very martial arts type of a look. So I got all these images of different uh martial arts poses, and we worked together and kind of what we wanted to try and do was with each cast member they have their own individual style of battle and and movement throughout. So, no, not really. I think if you were doing a pantomime, I think you would probably have a style, wouldn't you? Like a Christmas style, because you know that needs to have a certain look about it.

SPEAKER_00: 25:53

Yeah, it's been really written.

SPEAKER_01: 25:55

I haven't actually done a pantomime in a long time, you know, like a proper, yeah, proper Christmas pantomime. It's mostly been Christmas shows. So no, I think I treat it more like I would any other like musical or something that I've done.

SPEAKER_03: 26:08

So you don't go in with your Christmas hat on or your jingle bells.

SPEAKER_01: 26:12

No, absolutely not. I mean, we started rehearsals.

SPEAKER_03: 26:16

Oh, they're off tomorrow, aren't they? They're all tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01: 26:19

I think it is time for I've got a lovely hat that's a Christmas pudding. And I that I feel that's sort of coming towards the top of the pile. But yeah, we started back in the 20th of October. October. Do you know? So that's really early to start thinking about Christmas. So you sort of put it to this, although in saying that, we arrived for the read-through on the first day. I couldn't believe my eyes. The Chris the they had done the studio up and we had Christmas trees everywhere. We had edible, you know, the snowballs, like you know, the ones that you have have coconut on them. They had those on the table for us, they had sweets, you know. They made it a Christmas all in in October, which was hilarious. But that was lovely actually to get away Christmas feel then. So, no, we're not really we're not Bahumbug. No, like we definitely are channeling the spirit of mapping. More, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 27:09

Like I did consider normally like you, Timmy. I go, Oh god, here we go again. Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 27:14

I did consider should we get the Christmas tree episode? Maybe. No, not yet. Too soon. Maybe next week. No.

SPEAKER_03: 27:21

No, when we have time. When we have time to put it up, if you don't put it up.

SPEAKER_01: 27:26

Oh no, yeah, we'll not be able to put it up today.

SPEAKER_00: 27:28

Well, we once we open on third first preview is Wednesday morning. Oh yeah, Wednesday, yeah. And then they have another one in the evening, and then another preview on Thursday morning, and then press night is six o'clock on Thursday. Oh yeah. So from then on we hand it over. We hand it over.

SPEAKER_04: 27:43

Okay, good.

SPEAKER_00: 27:45

And that's us done.

SPEAKER_04: 27:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 27:46

Yeah. So that's five or six weeks or something of just being in it. So yeah, we're ready to we're ready to hand it over to the past.

SPEAKER_04: 27:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 27:53

Yeah, it's been uh hard working. Yeah, not hard, but hard working.

SPEAKER_03: 27:57

Yeah, you know. And the Christmas schedules are always a nightmare, anyway, aren't they? So being nice, Alec, for you to be able to walk away and leave them here. Now they'll be very thankful of you being so thoughtful as a writer. What is their performance schedule?

SPEAKER_00: 28:12

Are they doing one and too bad? They have a ten o'clock shows for school kids and eleven, but they're most I know to warming up at eight o'clock or eight thirty. Can you imagine that? And this isn't an easy thing. Yeah, it's a hard thing. And then they have one o'clock shows, and then they have a couple of six one o'clock and six o'clock. But listen, you know, Rosie Barry will be in the pub by eight o'clock with the glass from Rose. 45 minutes each way.

SPEAKER_03: 28:38

Well after then sure it's filled as well.

SPEAKER_00: 28:41

You'll be home in bed. You'll be home on your sofa at half past eight, you know, won't you?

SPEAKER_01: 28:45

Yeah, it's an easy, it's an easy Christmas for us.

SPEAKER_00: 28:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 28:48

No, for them, I mean. Oh, for them? Oh, yeah. It's easy for you.

SPEAKER_00: 28:51

I mean, it is it's is you know, it's tough. Those morning shows are tough.

SPEAKER_01: 28:54

Yeah, no, they're the the Max schedule isn't too bad.

SPEAKER_00: 28:57

No, it's not as relentless as quite a tough show. And the opera house, I think is 12 shows a week. Yeah, and the opera house is tough too.

SPEAKER_01: 29:11

Yeah, but we'll probably try and get to see as many of the Christmas shows again as we can because we it is a really lovely time of the year. My birthday's at Christmas, you know. It's just I think we'll go out and we we like we like supporting our friends, loads of our friends are in different shows.

SPEAKER_02: 29:26

Yeah, so that's supposed to be Christmas well, yeah. Absolutely there is a different show for every month. Yeah, because there's you know, there's obviously the out pumpers now, there's more like fan more church called pantomimes are coming in. Yes, exactly. That's doesn't we have to be able to do that?

SPEAKER_01: 29:42

Um and for the the different age groups, yeah. There's another little show upstairs on the map.

SPEAKER_00: 29:47

The alpha inspectors the alpha inspectors replay theatre, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01: 29:50

And it's for yeah, yeah, it's for two to five year olds. And you just bring your it says bring your you know your person, your big person with you, and I just think that would be adorable to go design.

SPEAKER_00: 30:01

That looks amazing, and that again is it's 40 minutes long, but not so long.

SPEAKER_01: 30:05

It's replay, isn't it? Is that replay theatre company? Yes, yeah, yes, it's just and yeah, I think it just looks gorgeous. It looks gorgeous. It's about how like they're trying to again, they're thinking they're trying to see if Christmas, and yeah, it just seems really, really cute.

SPEAKER_00: 30:17

Christmas has gone wrong for them, I think, in the out inspectors. It's all gone wrong. Oh, has it right again? And they're trying to get the machine to work to make Christmas work again. So it looks a beautiful show. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 30:28

Very good. Well, if you were to sum ja your jack roll stuff in three words as a shoe. What would your three words be?

SPEAKER_00: 30:36

Magical.

SPEAKER_03: 30:37

Nice.

SPEAKER_00: 30:38

Epic. Cool. That'll do. That's three. Oh, I thought we had three each.

SPEAKER_03: 30:44

I was gonna say three each, but you do yourself. So well.

SPEAKER_01: 30:51

We're just so we're just absolutely magical and believe in yourself.

SPEAKER_00: 30:59

I know that's but belief. Belief.

SPEAKER_01: 31:01

Belief.

SPEAKER_00: 31:02

Belief. Right, okay.

SPEAKER_01: 31:04

Mine?

SPEAKER_00: 31:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 31:05

Epic. Resilience. I can think I think because Jack has to be resilient and find his inner par.

SPEAKER_03: 31:14

Well kids need these days. I don't have it.

SPEAKER_01: 31:17

Yeah, and and and magical. I'd go with magical as well. Yeah. I think it'll be a really it'll be a lovely show. We just need to get to the other side of it, you know, to get it because you're in the middle of it. Yeah. And we just need to step back. It is, it very, very much is. 50p 5p, 50p 50.

SPEAKER_02: 31:38

Yeah, we just need to concentrate. It could be quite emotional.

SPEAKER_03: 31:43

I will say it'll be very emotional. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 31:46

Just because that'll be the release of emotions after all the work. And because you're connected to you in a way to have you connected to a show before you've written it. Yeah. So just play it.

SPEAKER_03: 31:57

Well, I haven't now done, haven't I written show? Is there more in your writing pen? We'll see. Oh, it's so we'll see.

SPEAKER_02: 32:05

I think she should. Like in your if you want one, I'll write you one.

SPEAKER_03: 32:09

Does Hoot have a MP? A little two-hander? A little two-hander for you too.

SPEAKER_00: 32:17

Well, she is head of the Parliament of ours. Oh, she has to she always the tawny. I think I love that. Tell me the tawny works really. I do have a little story in the making, which is about a mushroom and a flea.

SPEAKER_03: 32:30

Oh basically. I don't know if that's much better.

SPEAKER_00: 32:39

But the flea is called Pip, so we'll see how that where that goes. So I'm just writing the basic storyline at the moment.

SPEAKER_03: 32:46

Oh, it's so exciting. Well, thank you very much for coming to see us. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02: 32:49

But do give us all the details on Jack Cross.

SPEAKER_03: 32:51

So Jack Cross, the Mac Theatre Belfast, the 22nd of November to the 1st of January, written by the wonderful Alison Harding, by Cameron Lenzi, wrapped by Jennifer.

SPEAKER_01: 33:04

And music by the lovely Richardson.

SPEAKER_00: 33:07

Thank you. Thank you so much. Merry Christmas.

SPEAKER_03: 33:12

Wow. Thank you so much for having us. No, thank you. We we love you very much. We'll have you on everyone.

SPEAKER_01: 33:18

We'll be back to talk. We'll see you in 2026. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_03: 33:22

Really talking about what's in the pipeline.

SPEAKER_01: 33:24

What's in the pipeline? Yeah, we'll hopefully have a bit more solid information for you next time we come back.

SPEAKER_03: 33:29

You're always well. Thank you. Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas. See you later. I'm away to put my Christmas tree up. No. Bye.