Living Catholic with Father Don Wolf

Our Lady of Guadalupe Still Calls Us to Build the Church | December 7, 2025

• Archdiocese of Oklahoma City

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A cloak without brushstrokes. Roses blooming out of season. A bishop on the brink of giving up. In this episode, we follow the story of Our Lady of Guadalupe from the hill of Tepeyac into the charged world of 16th‑century New Spain, where evangelization faltered, questions about human dignity raged, and a simple message—build the church—carried a meaning far larger than a construction site. Along the way, we examine why the tilma’s image refuses easy explanations, what the Church actually teaches about private revelation, and how humility makes room for both rigorous inquiry and genuine wonder.

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Father Don Wolf is a priest of the Archdiocese of Oklahoma City. Living Catholic also broadcasts on Oklahoma Catholic Radio several times per week, with new episodes airing every Sunday.

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This is Living Catholic with Father Don Wolf. This show deals with living the Catholic faith in our time, discovering God's presence in our lives, and finding hope in his word. And now your host, Father Don Wolfe.

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Welcome, Oklahoma, to Living Catholic. I'm Monsignor Don Wolf, pastor of Sacred Heart Parish and rector of the Shrine of a Blessed Stanley Rother. And this coming Friday, we come to the 12th of December, the celebration of Our Lady of Guadalupe. Now we're all familiar with the story of Guadalupe. In 1531, on a hill just north of Mexico City, a recent convert whose baptismal name, Juan Diego, encountered an apparition of a young woman who called herself the Mother of God and used the title Guadalupe. In her message, she told him to visit the Bishop of Mexico City and communicate to him that he was to build a church on that spot. After a series of misunderstandings and misapprehensions, the bishop asked for a sign of authenticity. When Juan Diego reported his lack of progress during the series of additional apparitions, the lady directed him to pick some roses and deliver them to the bishop. Juan Diego found the roses growing and blooming out of season, picked them and brought them to the cleric. During his audience he opened his cloak to give the roses to the bishop, thus providing the sign he was looking for, and when he did, those in the bishop's office were astounded. The inside of the cloth was imprinted with the image of the young woman who had appeared to Juan Diego. From this we have the image of Our Lady of Guadalupe, which still hangs in the Basilica of Guadalupe in Mexico City. It's a relatively simple story. It follows the patterns of other Marian apparitions from around the world. A relatively unknown person encounters the Virgin Mary. He's given a task that will make the encounter more well known, as well as provide for ministry or aid to the whole community. The apparition's not received with acceptance by those in authority, and because it's not, those who have experienced it have to insist on fulfilling the task they've been given even against opposition. And finally, the object of the quest is realized and the message of the Virgin is embraced. The story of Guadalupe follows this pattern. Of course, there are nuances making this story not simply one more in a long line of similar stories, but one unique among all other encounters, and the most prominent feature is, of course, the image. It now hangs in the basilica in all of its splendor, and is incontrovertible as the image it is reported to be. That is, there is no other image, nor has there ever been a claim to have been another. Whatever you want to make of the story, the artifact is present to us. There it is, looking down from its solemn position next to Tepeyak Hill in the capital of the country. The image has been described and analyzed and dissected in minute detail over the centuries. There are dozens of videos on YouTube of lectures about the history and the meaning of the many aspects of the image. Over the years, I've collected a number of startling facts about it, all of which contribute to celebrating its uniqueness. If you'd like to begin to appreciate it, take a look at some of those videos. I won't go into any intricate breakdown of its composition or meaning at this time. Go and listen to what the experts have to say. There are two details, though, I find the most fascinating, the one general aspect of the apparition that has become the most salient to me. And the first fact I find interesting is that the image is not painted onto the fiber of the cloak. I read an authenticated account of one of the men who was present when the image was last taken out of its frame and examined. That was about 30 years ago. The team of scientists and other experts wanted to check the frame in the image to make sure there was no deterioration. As they did, according to his account, a member of the team was able to look at the raised cloak from the backside. It's made of relatively rough woven fibers, a normal tunic for regular use, handmade from the plant fibers of the area. Because it is roughly woven, the team member wrote, when it's raised to the light from the backside, you can look through it to see the scenery in front of it. The image is on the front only, and there's no paint, no clinging brushstrokes, no absorption into the fibers, no clotting or daubing or dried spots. The image is as if it were printed on, and then only on the fibers at the front of the image. This fact astounded him, and it astounds me as well. And not only that, the image hangs now as it has for centuries, its color and composition unique to itself. No reproduction, even the most intricate and expensive, approaches it in the richness of its hues or the penumbra of its holiness. It is unique, and there it is, hanging in the basilica. Now, this may seem like a small detail, a brief factoid about this Marian specimen in Mexico, but it's no small detail. If we were dealing with a legend about a painting, every aspect of its composition would be subject to the scrutiny of the art involved. The tilt of the head, the flowers on the mantle, the color of the signature, the shape of her eyes, the hue of her skin, and the arrangement of the stars, all of these elements would be examined and analyzed according to the intent of the artist. Were we given to the most minute detail, even the brush strokes and framing of the image would be the subject of our critique. This is the standard list of how to understand and make sense of the images we have from around the world, said to be inspired by the work from notable artists. By looking closely, we understand more thoroughly. It's only obvious to us the more carefully we look, the more we see. And this is certainly the case with the many careful expositions of the image, those I mentioned on YouTube. But these questions begin to take on another cast when we realize there is no explanation for how the image itself is placed on the cloak. How it got there and the means of its preservation currently defy explanation. We just don't know how it happened. Were it a conventional painting, we could account for its inspiration. The work of the Spirit isn't limited by the actual handiwork of an artist. Even the Word of God in the scriptures is brought to us by the hand of the compositors. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were composed by the hands of the evangelists, not by the brush of angels' wings. St. Paul's letters were composed by Paul. He doesn't record that they were whispered to him by the voice of Christ so that he merely transcribed them. Looking at a painting and understanding it to be inspired and understand and to be inspired and inspiring work is nothing new. But the image at the Basilica at Tepeyak Hill is something different than that. Now we're free to discount it as something inspirational. No one is required to look at the facts of the image and conclude that it must be a divine message to us or has ever been a source of holy encounter for anyone. And the story is not divinely entrusted to the church as a requisite expression of God among us. The encounter of Juan Diego and the Virgin, the resulting image, and the story that's told of them are all an aspect of private revelation. Any faithful believer is free to discard or disbelieve it in part or in whole. We're free to marvel at the image and wonder what it means, but it's not required for us to jump to a conclusion of divine origin just because we have no explanation for what it is or how it got to be there. Oh, and the account of how this image is preserved on a grass cape that should have decayed into dust centuries ago? No one is required to look at the facts and see an arrow pointing straight to the divine. It's something like the description from Father Tom McSherry when he witnessed the moving of the shrine of Blessed Stanley Rother, present in the parish church of Santiago Atitlan. When Blessed Stanley was murdered, his body was autopsied in order to be shipped internationally. At the autopsy, his heart was removed, and as a gesture to the people of the village of Santiago, this heart, along with two jars of blood, were interred under a small monument in the church behind the main altar. It was intended to be a continual reminder of the sacrifice of Father Rother for his people in the parish. At the tenth anniversary of Blessed Stanley's death, Father McSherry wanted to move the monument to a more prominent location so that Stan's example would be more honored and acknowledged, especially by the outsiders who came to visit the church. The location behind the altar was hard to find, it was the opposite of prominent. So he chose a site just to the right of the main entrance to build a notable cenotaph there. Upon finishing the project, they moved the heart and the jars of blood from the old monument to the new one. When they opened the box, the heart was notably preserved as if it had just been placed there. The blood of the jars had also remained liquid. Father McSherry, when describing the experience of seeing these remnants with no sign of decay, said what everybody else thought. He said, I don't know what it means, I only know what I saw. What should have turned to dust was preserved whole and complete. The facts are incontrovertible. What they mean is subject to interpretation. Thus it is with the facts of Guadalupe. And just to complete this aspect of the image, there have been several very prominent Mexican clerics who have maintained that the story and the image of Guadalupe are of no special provenance to them. Perhaps nobody should be surprised that clergymen can be disagreeable and stubborn, but it is the case also with this central aspect of Mexican history and spirituality. They placed no special emphasis on the artifact of Guadalupe and wished the entire phenomenon would have diminished. That is to say, disbelief is not limited to or constrained only by those who want to damage the faith of the people. It is the true teaching of the church that no one is bound to believe private revelations, not even bishops and priests who are nurtured in the environment of the religiosity of Guadalupe. The mere artifact of the image was for these hierarchs nothing more than an interruption in the common course of history. It was not a gift for divine interpretation. But you know, in the end, the image is still there, however it got to be there. The second aspect I find interesting is the context of the revelation. Juan Diego and the report of his encounter with the Virgin Mary happened in the midst of the work of the whole church in Mexico to bring the gospel to the people. Nothing happens without precedent. When the image of an apparition was delivered by the visit of Juan Diego to the bishop's office, there had been many conversations and much discussion about what was to be done with bringing the gospel to life in the Valley of Mexico. The message of Guadalupe both presumed these conversations as well as added to them. Like all stories, it's told inside of a larger story, and that story inside of an even larger one than that. That's what makes the study of history so fascinating as well as so rewarding. It is endless. When the conquest of Mexico City, the town, the city of Tenochtitlan, was completed, the Spanish conquistadores were in charge of the administration and governance of the peoples of the Aztec Empire. As part of their responsibility, they brought the life of the church with them. They were Spaniards, the church was a part of their lives. Plus, they were the inheritors of seven centuries of the Reconquista, the recovering of Spain from Muslim occupation for the church. Remember, the Muslim presence in Spain ended with the conquest of Granada in 1492. The conquest of this great empire in the New World was an extension of their conquest of land for the truth of the gospel and the life of the church. As this conquest was achieved, the new overlords faced the concern of bringing the message of Christ to the people. But what kind of people? That was the question to be faced square on by the Spanish. While we may think it obvious all human beings are equal and deserve respect because of their humanity, such sentiments were not at all obvious to the men of the 16th century. In fact, most of what we believe about universal human rights, adhering equally to all people in all circumstances, even beyond the boundaries of governance and ethnicity. Those beliefs come only from the 1960s. These facts were not acknowledged, much less practiced by the men of the 1530s. When they looked at the people of Mexico, they didn't know what to do. After all, these people had built an intricate empire of wealth and sophistication. They were good engineers, competent administrators, and great farmers. They hadn't progressed to the use of metallurgy and had no notions of gunpowder, and so didn't have the sophistication in weaponry the Spanish enjoyed, but they were not primitive. When the Conquistadores arrived in Mexico City, they marveled at its at its beauty, its size, its organization, and its cuisine. Even from the beginning, Mexican food was a marvel for those who tasted it for the first time. These were not cavemen, but they were organized by a bloody religion that depended on human sacrifice and the desecration of bodies. Blood and flesh were the food of the gods, they were offered to the gods regularly, and the Aztecs embraced their devotion to their deities with frightful enthusiasm. Seeing these elements among the people in the Valley of Mexico, there was an opinion among the Spaniards that these people had given themselves over to the devil. As such, they were not really subjects of evangelization, because the devil had taken possession of their souls. In fact, they were less than human, some said, and were incapable of ever being fully human, because they lacked the essential elements of true humanity. As such, they should be governed and controlled as if they were a separate species. As no one would expect a Spanish priest to baptize his horse, no matter how much he liked it and how useful it was to him, so also no one would expect a Mexican to be baptized, even if he had two hands, two feet, and could learn to speak Spanish. Of course that wasn't a universal opinion. The Bishop of Mexico City was set against it. He understood his work as bringing the gospel of Jesus to these people who deserved to receive it. And while they had been given over to a religion that seemed to be a demonic mockery of the religion of life and forgiveness in Christ, the people of Mexico couldn't be written off as of no consequence. He was committed to making the church come alive among them. They merited the grace of Jesus. It was one thing, though, to proclaim this belief. It was another to make it happen. The proof would be in the proclamation of the gospel by the missionaries and its embrace by the people. And as is always the case, there was the countervailing conviction that these people should be controlled and even enslaved for their own good, and for the good of the Spanish in this environment. The bishop and his staff were working to embody their convictions even as the tide of popular opinion was against them. They had to get results, or they would have to abandon their efforts. Even in the church, especially when it is in conflict with those who have an interest in seeing the church's efforts fail, there has to be results. And those results have to be significant enough to convince the stubborn and the committed. In the midst of this tension, the bishop and his people didn't have much success. The Aztecs did not respond well to the evangelization founded among them. They proved to be indifferent to the message and hostile to the condemnation of their previous religion. After a generation of work, there was almost nothing to show for it. In fact, tensions had become so overwhelming the bishop of Mexico City was tempted to give up on his conviction and abandon the people to those who would regard them as a type of livestock to be used and to husband. It was in the middle of this frantic worry that the bishop and his vicar general offered a special prayer. On the eighth of December that year, 1531, on the feast of the Immaculate Conception, they prayed that the Virgin Mary might intercede for them and their efforts to bring the gospel of Christ to Mexico. After all, churchmen are not set apart from the vicissitudes of humanity. They're not granted infallible knowledge about what to do and how to act, not even bishops in important places. They didn't have an answer to every question or a conviction about every position. The bishop wasn't absolutely sure his regard of the people of Mexico was the right approach. He was beginning to be forced to consider it might not be. Perhaps these people were indeed a separate species that were not subject to the command of Christ to go out to all the nations and make disciples. The bishop felt desperate. He offered his prayer on that December morning, the eighth, that God might intervene, might send a sign to bolster his work and bring Christ to those in most need of his message. It was December the ninth when the first encounter between Our Lady and Juan Diego took place. It was December twelfth when the image was revealed to those in the bishop's office. The message of Guadalupe was a message to all the people at the behest of the one whose committed work was to bring the gift of salvation to all. It's funny how God is at work. You might say it's unbelievable, and yet it happened in just such a form. The greatest of all elements of this story is that its true meaning is greater than any one person in it. That is to say, every character in the story has its place and is integral to the meaning of it. As in most stories, it's not the sum of the story that communicates, it is the sum of the story that communicates, not just the individual parts or the individual characters in it. But in this encounter, the grandest meaning to be communicated wasn't understood by any of those who were part of it. One measure of the genius of a story is that it can't be appreciated at first. Its true harvest comes only when it has been cultivated and cared for. In this story, Our Lady tells Juan Diego to go to the bishop so that a church might be built there at the site where the apparition took place. A church there, according to her, would be an important would be important for the spread of the faith. When the bishop heard this message, he was skeptical. After all, he was in charge of the whole church of New Spain at that point. One more chapel at one particular spot wouldn't contribute to the GREATLY to the life of the faith or to the quality of the gospel message. Build the church here is hardly a message designed to move the hearts and minds of the people, especially in the context of the failures of the evangelical efforts up to that point. But neither Juan Diego nor the bishop had heard quite rightly. Build the church didn't refer to a geographical spot or to a building. Mary wasn't talking about architecture or contracting or real estate. The message was to build the church in all of its glory and all it offered in the lives and the hearts of the people of the Valley of Mexico. The image of Our Lady helped to communicate the message of God to the people of that time and place. It's still communicating a message of hope and promise to those who continue to encounter her. We could say with all confidence that the church is still being built, and its construction is as lively and certain here in Oklahoma City as it has ever been in Mexico City. Build the church is the message we're still following. As in so much of the gospel, we come to know the presence of God and the message of hope by way of the passage of time. It can be embraced, but not thoroughly, it can be understood, but not completely. It can become the foundation of a whole life, but not provide sustainment. It can be misapplied, but not fatally, and it can be acted on with enthusiasm, but not become hopeful. And then, with the passage of time, with greater reflection and greater insight, with deeper appreciation and further growth, the message can become fuller and richer and more meaningful as it is re-encountered again and again. The greater the distance from its encounter, the more it can grow and deepen. It just takes time. And since time is a resource of God's creation, it's also an element in the recipe for God's revelation. The message of Our Lady Guadalupe has ripened with time. We're now much more capable than we used to be, so the message goes out with us, not just with Juan Diego. We are to build the church here. Back in just a moment. Here, make it here, bring the graces you have cultivated here. Upon this stony ground, ground the life of goodness. Make it clear, clear away the confusion of blood and story. Construct it firm, make firm the convictions, firm the faith. Set the stress straight, straighten the lives of those who wander. Now, respond now, don't hesitate upon the now, have it done. From heaven it comes, comes upon the clouds of hope and dawn. At this place, place the cornerstone, set it upon the bedrock. So there will be prayer there for the ages, prayer, and from the heart, hearten your brothers here. That's Tepeyakility. It's certainly happening at the shrine of Blessed Stanley Rother, to which you are invited on the 12th, the 13th, and the 14th. Please look at our website for further information. It is the opportunity to encounter the gift of life and the message of Mary to all of us that we continue to build the church here.

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Living Catholic is a production of the Archdiocese of Oklahoma City for Oklahoma Catholic Radio. To learn more, visit okcr.org.