How to have a podcast that supports your online business with Caroline Hull

In this episode of Mompreneur Mastery, Sydney O'Brien invites podcast strategist, Caroline Hull, to discuss the essential elements of a successful podcast for mom business owners. 

Caroline delves into the importance of having a solid strategy to support the business and shares her journey into podcasting. She emphasizes creating a content plan well in advance, structuring episodes for sales, and the significance of listener retention. 

The conversation sheds light on transforming podcasting efforts from a guessing game to a strategic and sustainable endeavor. Listeners gain a valuable insight into how to align their podcast goals with their business objectives, optimize content strategies, and enhance listener retention.

Key takeaways from the episode:

- Implement a strategic content plan well in advance, coordinating it with marketing and sales calendars.

- Structure podcast episodes to promote and sell effectively, ensuring alignment with business objectives.

- Embrace organizational tools and templates to streamline podcast production, making the process more efficient and sustainable.

Connect with Caroline:

Create Podcast Episodes That Sell - Free Guide

Caroline's podcast: Share, Strategize, and Shine

Connect with Caroline on Instagram

MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:

Carousels That Sell

1 Month of Conversation Starters

1 Month of Conversation Starters Content Calendar

Double down on your efforts, not your time with the Content Maximizer System

Music courtesy of Pixabay

Transcript

2:12

Welcome to the Mompreneur Mastery Podcast, where we share actual Instagram strategies that fit into a busy mom's schedule so that you can get more engagement, more leads, and more sales in less time so you can spend more quality time with your family. I'm Sydney O'Brien, an Instagram strategist who started my business with 3 kids under 5 and found a way to do it without sacrificing quality time with my family And only working 2 to 3 hours a day. I love helping other mom business owners find that seemingly impossible mom work life balance instead of spending too much time creating content that isn't getting them the results they want. If you're an overwhelmed but very ambitious business owner and you wanna strategize the heck out of your Instagram account so that you can save time and make more sales, you're in the right place. Hi, Caroline. How are you today? I'm so great. How are you? I'm good. Thank you. Thank you so much for being here. I'm really excited to talk about podcast strategy. I consume your content, your podcast, your Instagram stuff. And, of course, I'm a member and you're a membership, and so much aligns with Instagram strategy. The parallels are there, but the execution is very different. So I'm really excited to talk about it to differentiate the execution pieces. Yeah. I totally agree with you. I you know, it's so interesting because I've been having a lot of conversations with business owners and content, strategist. And the strategy really is very similar across the board, like when we talk about Instagram, YouTube, all the all the places really where you're creating content. But there are some major differences with podcasting that kinda sets it apart. So I always love digging into this because it's so fun. Yeah. So to start, what got you into podcasting? Yeah. So I was actually a stationery designer. This is about, like, 8 or 9 years ago. I had, you know, I had wedding stationery line. I had greeting cards. And One thing that I loved was having conversations about the business aspect of it. I really love talking about business and strategy and all the things, and I was literally in a Facebook group. There there was an app. This this is gonna age me. There was an app back then called Periscope, which actually doesn't exist. And so if any of your listeners know what Periscope is, if you'll just DM me on Instagram, and we can, like, chat about it because I feel like nobody remembers what it was. But I had started using Periscope to, like, talk about business, and I I really loved it. You know? And I was like, oh, it'd be interesting to start a podcast. Literally posted in a Facebook group that I wanted to start a podcast, and somebody in that group was like, oh, I wanna start a podcast. And I was like, oh, we should do it together kind of as a joke. And then we ended up launching a podcast called the Creative Biz Rebellion, and it was very successful. We had a very successful community. We had products and courses associated with it and absolutely loved it. It was so such a great experience. Well, through that, What became known to me was that I was really good at the back end of podcasting, the technical stuff, the editing, the putting it together. My cohost was super amazing at the branding and the artwork and the marketing, but I was I was better at that. And I started helping out a couple business owner friends who had podcast, and then it it just snowballed from there. That's so cool. That's, like, kind of similar with Meister, just the starting with business owner friends and then snowballing into, like, its own thing. Yeah. Like, hey. You have a business. Like, 1 morning you wake up, you're like, oh, this is this is a whole business by itself. Yeah. I love that. Yeah. So when you say podcast strategy, what does that mean? Yeah. To me, podcast strategy really boils down to how is the podcast supporting your business. So Mhmm. Right away when I jumped into podcasting and, again, I mean, I I need to preface this because the podcasting role is very different than it was when I first started, but I noticed right away that business owners were Trying to podcast the way that podcasters do. Right? Like, when like, you know, like podcasters who are creating storytelling podcasts or Maybe comedy podcasts or even news podcasts. The the model is so, so different, and I immediately noticed there was kind of a gap in how we were using the podcast for business owners and making sure that it was actually supporting their business. And that's so that's really where all of this started and how I kind of got into this idea of having a podcast strategy for your business. And, again, it just really is about what What is the purpose of the podcast? What is it helping your business achieve? And then how can we create a strategy for not only the content that we're creating, But the call to actions that we're putting out there, the funnel we have, you know, in our greater funnel of our business. Right? Where does the podcast sit? And then our marketing, and how does that all work together to help us with that purpose? Because I mean, here's the deal. Podcasting is a very you know this. It takes a lot of time to put together a podcast. And I feel like business owners jump into it, and they're like, oh, I wanna start a podcast. It's gonna be so fun. And then they fizzle out because it's hard, it takes time, and you don't necessarily see those returns like you do on Instagram or YouTube. Those are the places. Right? And where you start to see the success with a podcast is when you have a strategy and you understand exactly what everything is doing to support your business. Yeah. It's very similar with Instagram, all the things, like, working together to create that funnel for sure. Yeah. And I think the fizzling out part. Like, I can definitely see that happening because it does take a lot of time. But, also, If you don't have a strategy and need all of these pieces, all of the episodes aren't working together, it feels a lot like throwing spaghetti at a wall and seeing what sticks, and that can get really frustrating. Yeah. And I I feel like what happens with a lot of podcasters is Because they don't have a great content plan in place, because they don't have a great strategy for how it's supporting their marketing and their launches and their promotions throughout the year, What they'll do is and and listen. I've done this too. And and you know when it happens because you know right away, but, like, They'll create an episode last minute. Right? So you'll go, oh my gosh. I have an episode that needs to go on Monday. It's, like, Thursday, Friday before the weekend. You're like, okay. Let me just record something real quick. And then what you're putting out there isn't necessarily being put out there with purpose, and it isn't necessarily being put out there. It's not your best content. Right? And that's that's really, like, when we start to see the negative impacts. And and we call it pod fade in the podcasting world. That's when podcasters, like, Release an episode, and then they don't release an episode, and then slowly they stop podcasting altogether. And, you know, when you have a strategy and a plan in place, it's so much easier to create amazing content consistently, and that's really what's gonna help you not only build your audience but retain your listeners. And so, yeah, strategy and having a plan, it's it's a huge part of, I think, long term podcasting success. And because podcasting is a long game, that strategy and that plan is so important. Mhmm. I can definitely see that. And I've definitely had those times where I'm like, oh my gosh. I don't have anything ready to go for Monday. What do I do? And I just do, like, something very quick that isn't as in line with my mark like, entire marketing strategy as it should be just to be able to put something. Yeah. You're just like, I just gotta get something out, whatever it is. Yeah. Totally. I listen. Like I said, I've been there. I've done that. We all have. It happens. For sure. How do you rate the success of your whole podcasting journey. Yeah. I'm so glad you asked this question because I think it's a really important one. And, you know, You know, we're seeing a lot of shifting in the podcast industry right now as a whole, and so I just I think this is such an important conversation. So where a lot of people get tripped up with podcasts, especially and and I'm talking about always, specifically business owners. They think that if they create a podcast and get millions of downloads, that will help them grow their business. And it's so hard because With podcasting, we don't have super great metrics like you do with Instagram. Even YouTube has way better metrics than than podcasting. In fact, I have been diving into YouTube a little bit, and I took a workshop couple weeks ago. And the whole time I was sitting there, I was like, man, Why don't we have this for podcasting? Because she was talking about, like, keyword research, and it's so much easier to do in YouTube than it is in podcasting. Now we do do keyword research in podcasting, but it's it's not as black and white as it is with YouTube. And the whole time, I was just sitting there going, I want this. And so, you know, as somebody who is in all these marketing spaces, You're gonna very quickly realize, like, the metrics for podcasting are not as great. The only metric we really have to measure is This thing called downloads or listens, and that's literally, like, the number of times somebody clicked play and listened a certain amount of time depending on who's measuring Right? Like, there's so many caveats. And that can get really frustrating because we're so used to looking at insights. Right? We're so used to looking at engagement and, you know, how many how many people press play, not not necessarily, like, How or or how many times was the play button pressed, not necessarily how many people press play. You know, we're we're so used to seeing these different metrics. And so when you go about into the back end of podcasting, it's like, Is this good? I don't know. Is this good? And so what I always tell my clients and what I really try to drive home to everyone when I'm talking about podcast strategy is how we measure it is really dependent on what your goals are. You know, It re this is why having a purpose for your podcast is so important when you sit down and you say, hey. I'm gonna create a podcast for my business. And I always say, you know, what is the ultimate goal here? Is the ultimate goal to get people in your membership? Is the ultimate goal to grow your email list? And then what can we set up to measure that, and how can we track that? You know? And that's really what I want people to do. The other thing too is I think with podcasts, when we're talking about is it a success or not, is we have to really reframe how we think about our podcast. I think, you know, I can compare it to Instagram a little bit. I feel like Instagram and you can totally correct me if I'm wrong here because I'm not an Instagram strategist, but, you know, you post a reel and you get kind of immediate results. Right? Like, you know, like, pretty much right away if it's gonna do well or not or if it's gonna convert. You can tell, you know, pretty quickly. Podcasting is is a little different. It's a long game. We do have, like, measurements that we look at at, like, 7 days, 30 days, 90 days. But what's so amazing about podcasting is that it is this piece of long form content that is nurturing and lives forever. And so A year from now, somebody may find my podcast, listen to 5 episodes, and come book a service with me. And so there are some other kind of, like I call them intangibles of how we measure, like, is this podcast a success or not? A really good example is I had a client recently, and she felt like she wasn't getting any conversion with her podcast. And so we redid her content strategy, And I talked to her a couple weeks later, and she was already getting people in her membership who said I came from the podcast. And I think she and she had something else in there, like, booked something else or sold something else. And it wasn't necessarily that she was able to track this, but it was that people told her, Well, I came out I joined because I listened to this episode, and that's another way that you kind of know it's a success. So, again Yeah. Knowing what the purpose of your podcast is and then also just having a really good understanding of how it's working for your business. That makes a lot of sense. And I was actually looking at my downloads and, like, stats and everything the other day, and I am still getting leads from a lead magnet from that I promoted in one of my very first episodes Yeah. That I don't I don't really have it. I don't really market it anymore in any other content or in emails, but it's pretty cool that, like, months later, I'm still getting leads from it. Yeah. Isn't that amazing? And, you know, that that's that's one of the things too about podcasting, you know, because they do live forever in a way that's different, I think, from other content. E you always have to make sure those links are updated and redirecting and you know? And and so I always try to, like, remind myself every once in a while to go back through and look. Like, did I did I redirect that correctly or, you know, if I got rid of something? Because people do. They find your podcast, and they'll just will send to your entire library and then click on something from 2 years ago, and you're like, oh, okay. Thanks. You know? It's so funny. Yeah. It works out really well. There there's definitely a draw to, like, long form content that does that as opposed to, like, having to constantly do things more frequently on Instagram. Yeah. I think that's one of the things I love about podcasting. I mean, you and I have talked. I am not good with the Gram. Me and Instagram, we're we're in a very love hate relationship right now, but I really struggle with the short videos. But down And do an hour I can talk for an hour about podcast strategy, but if you ask me to make a quick reel about it to post on Instagram, I'm like, I don't know what to do. And, you know, and I just think that's so funny. And I definitely think, like, people have their strengths. You know? Some people are better at short and long, but I think it works really well for me because it it invites people to come and listen to me and really hear, like, my philosophies, What I teach, how I talk, how I show up in a way that I think is so unique from short form content. And so Yeah. You know, for me, really, that sweet spot is when it all works together, when your short form content is leading to your long form content and vice versa and then leading to your lead magnets, you know, that's when you know you, like, hit the sweet spot is when it can all kind of be cohesive and and all working in this, like, well oiled machine. So I don't think you have to do 1 or the other. I think both are fantastic, and they can work together so well. For sure. That's the dream. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. And then you mentioned earlier about listener retention. How can you tell if you are retaining listeners. Yeah. So what we do to see if we're retaining listeners is look at our downloads week to week, there's kind of 2 really good indicators. And to me, this is all about content. So is my content hitting the mark? I can usually tell if 2 things are happening. A, my downloads are staying the same each week, so I don't have, like, a ton of fluctuation, Or, b, they're going up consistently. And that's usually when we can tell that we're retaining listeners. Right? Because they're coming back each week, especially that first number you see after you post an episode, that, like, initial kind of spike that you have, because those are usually people who have subscribed or followed you in an app. Right? Where we get into trouble is when we start to see those downloads go down Every week where it seems like we're losing some listeners. Right? And that's usually a pretty good indicator. Okay. Something's off with my content Or maybe my podcast isn't being distributed correctly, but, usually, it's a content thing. And so, you know, kind of at that point, I will usually advise, like, Okay. Well, can we shake it up? What can we do different? Can we talk about something you haven't talked about before or look back through your episodes, see which ones did really well before, can we reiterate those in some way? You know? So that's usually how we tell like I said, podcast metrics are not the best. There's not, like, A place you can go and see, like, all the things you wanna see, which is really frustrating. So that's my my hope and dream for the podcasting future. Yeah. That's so nice. Having that data is a game changer and saves a lot of time instead of just, like, trying and seeing how it goes. I know. It does sometimes feel like a lot of guessing with podcasting, which I think is where people get tripped up. And so Mhmm. You know, that's why, like, I think Again, like, it all just all goes back to strategy. That strategy is really gonna help you understand, like, what the metrics are telling you and if they're telling you what you need to know and and how that's helping your business. And at the end of the day, like, that's way more important than, like, how many downloads you got. You know what I mean? Yeah. For sure. That makes a lot of sense. And that also coincides a lot with Instagram, like the actual how it relates to your business instead of just vanity metrics is something I I have been talking about in my content recently. So, yes, I wholeheartedly agree. I always try to remind my clients that, like, imagine you walked into a room. And so let's say, like, you know, you had 50 people listen to an episode. That's literally like, can you imagine walking into a room and there's people sitting there who just wanna listen to you talk about the thing that you wanna talk about. And so I think sometimes that helps us kind of put it into perspective Because we can we can feel kinda down on ourselves. Like, I just don't have enough downloads. And, you know, I I I heard somebody say the other day, like, don't devalue the audience you have just because it's not what you think you need. And I was like, so good because That's good. You know, it really is true. Like, If there's 40 people who are coming and listening to your podcast each week, you're doing something for those 40 people. You know? And so then the question can become, okay. Well, how do I increase this number? But don't ever feel like you're doing badly because that's where you're at. Yeah. I love that so much, not devaluing the audience you have. And it is true. It's hard sometimes when you see just, like, numbers and bar graphs. It's very easy to forget that those are actual people, like Yeah. Listening and learning from you. Absolutely. Yeah. And I feel like in this marketing, like, environment we're in now where everybody's, like, posting online, like, how much money they made and how many Crazy download numbers they got, it can be real easy to kind of fall into that trap of, like, if I just get a 1000 downloads on this episode, I will have made it. Like, what does that even mean? You know? And so that's why I focus so much more on the purpose than the actual metrics. Yeah. I love that so much. Do you have any advice for mom business owners that want to start a podcast and make sure they're good onto the strategy part of it. Yeah. Absolutely. Well, I think especially for mompreneurs, the key is gonna be having a really solid system. And the key to perfecting that solid system for your podcast is having a strategy. So, you know, really planning out your content way in advance, Looking at your marketing and sales calendar, putting the 2 together, you know, it's so great. Like, I'm I'm a homeschool mom. I don't have a ton of time. And so I have my content planned out for the next month at least, if not 2 months. And what's so great about that is that when I'm having a busy day week And I've gotta get an episode out. I know that I can sit down, pull up my calendar, look at my schedule, say, oh, this This is the episode that I'm supposed to do. Does it still feel aligned? Great. Let me knock out the script in 30 minutes from a template that I created, And let me sit down and record this tomorrow when I know I have a stretch of quiet time. Having something as simple as that system is what is gonna make podcasting feel easier, and then it's gonna make it sustainable for you. So, you know, sit down, plan out your content, and then think about all the things you need to do with your podcast to get it out the door, and what can I make a template of? What can I put in a folder that just I can just open and go? And, you know, that's what we do for all of our clients. We we create dashboards for them, and everything is in there. And people always, like are like, I don't think a system is is the problem. But then when you get them in the system and using the spreadsheet consistently, they're like, oh my gosh. This is amazing. Like and so I I think that would be my biggest piece of advice. If you're thinking about, getting more strategic with your podcast or starting a strategic podcast, the best place to start is with having a really consistent plan. That is great advice. I I find that even when I have just, like, an idea of what I wanna talk about in an episode, it also just takes off, Like, a lot of the stress and overwhelm of like, oh my gosh. What do I need to do right now? Because I know at least part of it is done. And I've used the the template in strategic podcasting academy, the for the show notes and everything, and it's it does save a ton of time. It helps so much. Yeah. It really does. So I used to not be a real big organizational person. And if anybody knows me, they're gonna laugh at this because they know that I thrive in in chaos. But I have become so organized in my business and with my podcast, and I love those templates. I have templates for show notes, and then I just released into the academy like a a script template for interviews and solo episodes. And I've been using those for my own podcast, and it has been So amazing. You know? I I used to riff all of my episodes. I used to never write down bullet points or anything, And my downloads actually started going down, and I realized it was because I was being too repetitive and also just the quality of content wasn't there. And since I've started actually scripting them out, it has made such an impact. And so, you know, it seems like I said, it seems silly to sit down and, templates and things like that, but it really can affect the actual quality of the content that you're putting out. So if you take the time to set it up on the front end and incorporate it into your schedule, it'll make things so much easier. Yeah. I find if I also don't write it down. I will forget, and then I'll go back and be like, oh, man. I forgot this, like, really important point that I wanted to make. I know. I also keep a bank of episode ideas because I'll be, like, walking around, and I'll be like, oh, this would make a great podcast episode. And then I'll sit down later, and I'll be like, what was that idea I had? Like, it was so good. You know? She's gone. Yeah. Mom brain. Mom brain. For sure. Does that ever go away? I feel like I've had it for years. I don't think so. Not that I'm I do have a big age gap in my kiddos, so I kinda set myself up for failure there. So I have, like, no age gap in between mine, and it's not I feel like either way, it's just rough. I always laugh. My husband and I always laugh because we felt like we were kind of getting the hang of things. We have so we have 2 for the listeners who don't know. I have 2 olders. She'll be 13 and then 10, and then I have a 3 year old. And so, like, we were in the homestretch. Like, we were, like, gonna be free and easy, like, you know, because we were sleeping in. And then we had my 3 year old, and so we laughed because we're like, What do we do to ourselves? Like, we're so tired. When did this happen? Like, we were like the diaper stuff and, like, potty training and all of that all over again, that sounds like a lot. Especially when you, like, you were, like, I'm done with this, and then now you're doing it again. You know? Yeah. I'm like, we're finishing that phase now, and I'm very excited to be, like, completely over it. Yeah. I yeah. I'm ready to be done with it too. Let me tell you. Yeah. And you have a resource to share with listeners. Right? Yes. I do. So one of the things that I teach a lot is how to structure your episodes So that they are set up in a way that is promoting selling because the whole concept of having a podcast for your business, right, is that you're supposed to sell what you do on your podcast. And so I have a resource. It's a guide on how to set your episodes up for sales. Even if you haven't launched a podcast yet, this is a really great guide to look at to kinda give you an idea of, okay, what do I need to put into the structure of my episodes to make sure that I'm Promoting what I have going on, and I'm, you know, sharing what I'm working on, all of those things. And you can get that at wildhome podcasting.com/sales. That sounds amazing. I'm gonna link to it in the show notes. And then can you share where you are, like, the name of your podcast where people can find you and where they can find you on Instagram Yeah. As well. Absolutely. My podcast is share, strategize, and shine, and I talk all about podcast strategy on my podcast. It's a podcast about podcasting. So if you wanna hear more about what Podcast Strategy can look like, definitely go listen to that. And then to find out more about what I do, you can head to wildhome podcasting.com, and then I'm at wildhome podcasting on Instagram. So that's where you'll find me. Perfect. And definitely check out that resource and our podcast. I listen to your podcast every week. It's been so incredibly helpful. I love that so much. Thank you. Yeah. As as has yours, so thank you. Perfect. Well, thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much. This was so fun.