Education Pillar: Integrating Faith in Education

In our latest heart-to-heart conversation, unlock education through the lens of faith with Tim Webb, the visionary behind the Texas Leadership Summit. Together, we explore the wisdom in academic pursuits, arguing that true education extends far beyond the classroom and into the realms of moral and eternal understanding. Discover the pivotal role of education in shaping individuals who are in tune with their faith as we trace the scriptural roots of learning and its significance in reflecting God's image.

Parental guidance stands at the forefront of our thoughtful exchange as we delve into the scriptural duties of parents, especially fathers, to lead their children toward God. This episode sheds light on the critical influence of parents in their child's education, from assessing school curricula to advocating for godly leadership within our schools. Hear Tim Webb's insights on the support networks available for those considering non-traditional educational paths and the importance of local involvement in shaping the education system.

Wrapping up our enlightening discussion, we acknowledge to the dedicated educators and leaders who infuse the kingdom's perspective into their efforts. We emphasize the necessity for all sectors, including business and government, to champion the cause of active parenting, recognizing the impact of this support on future generations' educational and spiritual development. Join us as we appreciate the tireless work of these educators.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:04

Welcome to the TLS Texas Leadership Summit podcast. I'm the director of Texas Leadership Summit, Deanna Kinnesow, and we're here today with our founder, Tim Webb. Hi How's it going?

Speaker 2: 0:16

It's going great. Thanks for having me today.

Speaker 1: 0:18

Yeah, excited to talk about our education pillar.

Speaker 2: 0:21

Great.

Speaker 1: 0:21

So everybody can understand why it's important and why it's one of our four pillars in Texas Leadership Summit. We've got some questions here that we want to kind of address, okay, and we'll see if we can get everybody up to speed on it.

Speaker 2: 0:35

Sounds great. Okay, sounds great.

Speaker 1: 0:37

So what is the primary purpose of the education pillar?

Speaker 2: 0:42

Well, deanna, when we initially, when we started all of this and we were defining the pillars, we said that the education pillar gives life, and I think it's good to clarify that.

Speaker 1: 0:54

Yeah, and in what ways does it give life? How do you get derived at that?

Speaker 2: 0:59

Well, let's just back up for a little bit. Okay, and you know, for me, as a pastor, that's what I do when I'm not involved with TLS. But as a pastor, we have to define life, Sure. And if we're going to say it gives education, gives life, what do we mean by that? And obviously I'm going to go to scripture. And so when we go to scripture, we find that God is our creator, the creator of all life.

Speaker 2: 1:23

God decided in his infinite wisdom to create man and woman, male and female, in his image. In fact, scripture says in. God said let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. He specifically says, though, in this creating man in his image. When you go into the detailed account in chapter two, it says scripture says then the Lord God formed man of the dust from the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living being. When you look at the, the meaning of those words breathe into man the breath of life. That breath is spirit. Okay, he breathed into, he bled well to breathe. He blew into man, who is an inanimate object at this point.

Speaker 2: 2:20

Okay, he's not alive, he's formed him, but he's not alive until God does an action, and that action on this, this body that he's formed from the dust of the ground, he, he breathed into him. The breath, the spirit, the breath of life is the spirit. He puts a spirit in man and it says and he became a living being. That living being is a living soul, suke. It's that we get that word soul from suke in the in the Greek, and it is the what separates us from all the other animals. God places within man a spirit. He has a living soul and and out of that we have the ability to relate to our creator, we're able to. He designed us as worshipers to worship him and he reveals himself to us. And so the problem that we have is that, as you and I both know, and many other believers listening watching our podcast, is that Adam and Eve, in the beginning, made in the perfect image of God. They sinned, they rebelled against God and that marred that image, and since then there has only been one complete, true image, bear, and he is Jesus Christ. Now, as we just staying focused on education, the education pillar, what we want our kids, the primary, and go back to founding fathers of this country. The primary lesson that the kids were taught the chief end of man is to know God and enjoy him forever, forever. So how can you do that if you don't know him? How can you do it? And so what? The whole goal here for us as people, as believers, is to get back to being that complete image bear, and Christ enables us to do that. And so we always say and we said, education gives life. So, as we go to God's word, and this is why the founding fathers, that whole age, that age of understanding, and when we became a country and nation, the United States of America, the founding fathers in those families, 96 to 97% of them knew God's word. They were educated from God's word. They had this understanding of who God is and that he is the one who gives life. Now, it's not just life on this side of heaven, it's not just the years that we have before we physically die. What the scriptures are very clear about when it speaks of life, it's speaking of eternal life. Right, and the only way we can know eternal life is through the scriptures. And so when we look at, if you'll hold on to him, hold on with me just for a little bit We'll get to our point.

Speaker 2: 5:00

I want to go to Proverbs, and it's at the beginning of Proverbs, right there in chapter 1, and the first seven verses talking about the purpose of Proverbs. And the scripture says this. It says the Proverbs of Solomon, the son of David, king of Israel, to no wisdom and instruction. Now we're getting into education To no wisdom and instruction. To discern the sayings of understanding, to receive instruction in wise behavior.

Speaker 2: 5:27

I think we would all say we need that Righteousness, not only wise behavior, but righteousness, justice and equity, to give prudence to the naive, to the youth, knowledge and discretion. So in other words, the youth. They haven't defined what it means to actually live life in wisdom and the fullness of life. They're untaught, if you will, and so they're in that process of understanding, gaining that understanding of what living is all about, what is life, what is an entail and all those things. And Proverbs is saying this is how you're going to get there. And so a wise man will hear an increase in learning and a man of understanding will acquire wise counsel to understand a proverb and a figure, the words of the wise in their riddles.

Speaker 2: 6:15

And here's the theme of Proverbs the fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom and instruction, and so when we talk about education, pillar obviously right up front. Our chief end as mankind, men and women, as believers, followers of Jesus Christ, our chief end is going to we want to know God and be able to enjoy him forever, and so education, primarily at the foundation, should be about enabling our kids to understand who this creator, god, is. Who is God, the Father, his Son and the work of the Holy Spirit, the Trinity, and how do we relate to our God, how do we even have a relationship with him? Because wouldn't it be, wouldn't this be a tragedy, if your children went all through life not having any understanding of this eternal life?

Speaker 1: 7:10

Oh yeah, can't even imagine.

Speaker 2: 7:11

No, it would be horrendous. Yet many of us, as parents, we focus on okay, let's get them educated to where they can get a skill, a trade, or go to college or get a great job as if that's the main goal.

Speaker 1: 7:24

One like what are their grades? Are they making good grades in math and spelling?

Speaker 2: 7:27

Yeah, and so this is the areas, the subjects and all of these things. So we really have a limited, short-sighted view of education when we take that approach. And so what we understand education pillar gives life Primarily we're talking about. It gives you the ability to understand what does it mean to have eternal life Just that term gift. It is to extend freely, to hand something to someone. Education gives you, as a parent, the ability to hand to without any expectation of return. It's a gift giving you life.

Speaker 2: 8:05

And so, as a parent, you're going to say okay, son, daughter, this is what you need to understand what eternal life is, how to obtain it, how to grow in it, how to function within it and ultimately experience the ultimate life, which is eternal life apart from sin. And so I think sometimes we focus so much on the land of, as our good friend David Klingler says, the land of the dying. The Christian who's listening, this Christian leader, is going to know that we are in the land of dying and we're moving towards the land of the living. But our world has it flipped backwards. We act as if we're in the land of the living, moving to the land of the dying. And so what we need to be about as parents is how do I get my kid to understand what is life eternal life and so this education gives them the ability to access that life and function fully in it. So that's what we mean by that.

Speaker 1: 9:08

So what would you say is the role of the parent whenever it comes to education? Are we just sending them off to school and hoping that they learn all this? I don't know I just I, because that's what a lot of people are doing.

Speaker 2: 9:18

That's exactly right and a lot of people feel as if it's someone else's responsibility.

Speaker 1: 9:24

And job yeah.

Speaker 2: 9:24

It's their, you know their calling. I hear a lot of teachers say well, this is my calling to be a teacher, and that's great. I love our people, our leaders, who are teaching and devoting their life to teaching kids.

Speaker 1: 9:35

And it's a very hard job, Very hard job. I tried helping at my son's school and well, I couldn't do it, I couldn't do it. They are not paid enough and they're not giving enough credit for sure.

Speaker 2: 9:45

But again I'm going to go back to scripture. And we know what the God of Israel required of parents and right at the right, before Moses change it, before he dies and hands over leadership to Joshua, he tells the people of Israel and Deuteronomy it's, it's really a second law, is what that means? It's a giving of the law to the next generation, second generation. And so he tells them, and Deuteronomy six, beginning of verse four hero Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is one. You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your might. That's every part of your being. And he says these words which I have command, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart. You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way, when you lie down and when you rise up. You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. You shall write them on the doorpost of your house and on your gates. And what Moses intent here was to remind them one who God is and how we're to respond to him, to love him with every ounce of our being. Well, how do you going to do that? Well, you got to know his word, right, okay, and? And so the law was given to Israel to know the character of God. And so when he was saying to the parent parent, and primarily it's the father who was responsible A lot of people shipped it to the mom. Okay, we probably have some moms out here, a mother, and there's a lot of responsibility that is basically handed over to the mother, as if she's to be accountable to make sure the kids get good grades and go to school and get the homework done. Not so in Israel. In Israel, it was the father's responsibility. Now, as the wife is the helpmate, she works with the father to make sure that's accomplished. Okay and so.

Speaker 2: 11:38

But the main point to this tax is Israel is going into the promise of the land that God is going to give them. As a nation, they were to constantly have the word in front of them. Remember what we've already said the chief and end of man Is to know God and enjoy him forever. We're created in the image of God. We, we need to know that image has been marred. So how do we know what that image looks like we go to the word. It gives us the character of God, it tells us what he's like and it tells us how how far we've missed the mark, how different we are, and we're wanting to get back to that image.

Speaker 2: 12:13

Right, and Christ being the only the well. Scripture first of him as a second Adam. He is the only one besides Adam in the beginning, before he fell, to be that true image bearer, and the scriptures are very clear that he is the visible representation of the invisible God. We see that in Colossians, and so here's where's our standard. It's defined in scripture. We see the character of God, we see the life of Christ, we see the words of Christ that was given to the apostles and then handed over down through the generations to us, and what that tells us as Parents is that this is where we want our kids to move toward, because it's through faith in Christ, the son of God, that this is how we receive this gift of eternal life is through faith in him.

Speaker 2: 13:00

Now, outside of that, yeah, there are other. There are other people involved in that, there are Other Opportunities to bring education to the forefront in the child's life, working with and collaboration with, but primarily, what I want our parents understand is that biblically, you are accountable. There's one other scripture before we go on. I know we have limited time, but I just want people to understand, because a lot of people we talk about these pillars. They Well, is this a political movement?

Speaker 2: 13:30

or whatever, and I would have to say no way we're this is. This is just biblically Founded, and we are wanting to move people back to the scriptures and to be able to stand on their faith. So, parents, if you get, if you're out there and you're going, well, that's the Old Testament. That's not for us. Well, messiah comes in. Here we have the church and in Ephesians, chapter 6, it says children, obey your parents and the Lord, for this is right. Honor your father and mother, which is the first commandment with a promise, so that it may be well with you and that you may live long on the earth. Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord. So, whether your Old Testament, new Testament person, both of them are in agreement. In fact, paul is quoting the Old Testament here, one of the Ten Commandments that says To the child honor your mother, father, and with it that's the one that comes with a promise, and long shall be your days, long life.

Speaker 2: 14:24

And so we want to remind our parents you are to be intimately Involved in the education. It is your responsibility, you are accountable, because education is how we receive again, education, the pillar. It gives life, the more you grow in this understanding of eternal life, how to receive it, how to thrive in it, live fully. It also, on top of that, as you, as you venture out into different areas of your life, it continues education as you grow in your understanding of the word. It tells you how to relate to other areas of your life. Scriptures very clear. It speaks to every area of our lives. So, yeah, a parent, yes, you may have to collaborate, you may have to bring other people in and we have many different opportunities and ways to educate our kids. But primarily, to answer your question, parents, you are responsible, you're accountable. God.

Speaker 1: 15:17

And so I hear you say talking a lot about biblically and education. So what do we do with those that might not be able to afford private school or don't have very good options like where they might live? So how do you decide public school versus private school?

Speaker 2: 15:38

Well, now more than ever, we're having a lot of doors open up for education within the church. There are several nonprofits and we can put those links on our website. There are nonprofits that, in fact, would encourage you to come out of public education because of where education is today public education and so there's some nonprofits that can give you the tools to establish homeschooling. You can do it in your church. There are a lot of churches now that are doing homeschooling co-ops.

Speaker 2: 16:09

Co-ops yeah, and there are methods. There's ways to implement this in the church and help bear the cost of that. And so we have some parents say, well, I just can't afford Christian education and I really don't have a great public school option. I know I should homeschool, but I just can't do it. And so there are some opportunities, and so on our website we'll have some of those links, information for that. How do you decide? Well, that's something that the parent needs to get involved first. They need to educate themselves about what's going on in public school. Now, there are people in your district that can help with that. There should be churches that can help with that. We can definitely give you some pointers on that through the Texts Leadership Summit. There are people that make this their business every day to find out what's going on in the public school education system, and so that parent has to do the research get involved, ask great questions, make sure you know what's going on.

Speaker 1: 17:05

Don't necessarily take surface level. Sometimes you have to dig into it. See what's going on also in your public library. It's a lot of where they're getting their books and stuff like that and what's being in the textbooks that they're using at school the curriculum and stand up if you don't like what you're seeing. A lot of people are scared to do that, but we've learned that a lot has been accomplished by being able to do that and there's people that are out there to help them.

Speaker 2: 17:31

Right and go to school board meetings. There's a lot that goes on at the school board meeting that the parent, if they knew what was being discussed, in some cases it might be horrified. Some things are just being passed through so you are able to attend those.

Speaker 2: 17:48

They are public meetings and you should Every parent should make it a point to be a part. As best they can communicate with the teachers. So when you find out whether or not, ok, we have a great public school, it's OK for us. We're going to be in connection with the teacher. We're going to dialogue with the leadership of the school, stay in touch. That's definitely an option for people and we need to encourage great leaders to run for school board to get involved with education.

Speaker 1: 18:13

I had no idea. I really didn't. I mean, when I was growing up in school, it was the parent-teacher association. All the parents were involved in that. I never heard anybody talking about going to a school board meeting ever, and now I realize that's where everything happens and decisions are made, and it's vitally important for them to get involved and for them to know what decisions are being made and to speak up if you're not happy with what's being. I had no idea that we, as parents, even had a right to have a voice in that.

Speaker 2: 18:46

Oh, absolutely, I had no, I mean, I seriously.

Speaker 1: 18:49

I mean mine's only in second grade, so we haven't been doing this for very long, um, but it's been a huge learning experience for me just to learn how involved we can be in, and I also kind of thought that people who ran for school board were like Lawyers or you know very highly educated people. I didn't realize that it could be parents and people in the community and how important it is that those within the church Be running for these positions, um, and that the grassroots root movement for the four of those running, so we make sure that people come out and vote, because not many people show up for those elections even right especially christians.

Speaker 2: 19:27

Right, it's amazing how people are elected and placed on these school boards and so, when you understand, it's everyday leaders. Yeah, that's part of our mission, that's what we're trying to do. Empowering everyday leaders. And so to the moms and dads they're primary.

Speaker 2: 19:42

That's who needs to be on those boards and be involved, and so we want godly Leaders on in these positions to help so important, that's right so important, and so there's some other things that we need to mention later on as we're walking through this, as far as resources and tools to help with that. But, uh, again, I just want to encourage everyone do your homework, because the question was private versus public. Um, do your homework as parents. Find out what's going on in the public school district. There are people that can help with that. Meet the, the people involved, the leadership involved. And, uh, primarily, we need to understand and this, this is going to come out more and more. It's already out there but public education today, unless at the local level, godly, men and women intervene, our public school districts are being led by a global system.

Speaker 1: 20:35

Then, moral trouble for sure. So we, are.

Speaker 2: 20:37

We are definitely moving and specifically let me give you some specifics. Specifically, what we saw in the early days was a knowledge based curriculum, and so it's basically what you and I grew up with. You need reading, math, you know arithmetic kind of stuff and all that, all that basic education, what you needed to function in society, right, uh, but what is the shift has now moved towards a more psychology based curriculum, and what we mean that by that indoctrination, indoctrination.

Speaker 2: 21:08

So what? But so the state is now taking trying to take the role of the parent and parent. You really don't know what's best for your kids. We do, the professionals do. This comes right out of marxism and car marks and communism. And and how would you? How would you take over a society? Well, you go for the kids.

Speaker 2: 21:30

Everyone knows this and this is what hiller did. This is what others have done for centuries. If I can take the kid and indoctrinate the kid, then we win. That's the future, and so we know where public education is heading Now. At the local level, we can do some things to at least push pause on that, take hold of it and move it in a more biblical, godly way. The the problem with this is that our state government oftentimes is is Void of a desire to to lead towards godliness or biblical worldview. So we know that. So If public education is not for you and you're in a district that's horrible and it's indoctrinating the kids, then that's when I would say, okay, let's look at the option. Is there a christian school here? Are there grants? Are there scholarships? Are the opportunities to offset the cost? Can I afford to put my child in this private education? Christian education, I would caution people. Just because it's a private school doesn't mean it has a biblical worldview.

Speaker 1: 22:35

I just must say that, and not only that. But don't think, just because you're now paying for the education, that now it's the teacher's job to do everything To take care of the kid.

Speaker 1: 22:45

I see a lot of that, too, happening, not necessarily at my son's school, but I'm just saying across the board. They think, oh, I'm paying these teachers, they should be teaching them this and teaching them that, and I should be able to. They should be able to come home and we should just be able to have a grand old time together. It's still the parent's job, absolutely. Just because you're paying for the education doesn't mean that you get out of that.

Speaker 2: 23:06

Our responsibility. Somebody else you still need to be involved with the leadership of the school.

Speaker 1: 23:12

I've heard horrendous and making sure that it's right right.

Speaker 2: 23:15

I've heard story after story, horrendous stories, parents that had no idea the the curriculum or the ideology of the private school. They just thought it's it's private, it's going to be better. They they're getting some great Numbers out there as far as percentages and test scores, so check it out. If you do not have that option as a private school, private education, christian education, biblical worldview, then I would look at homeschooling, um, and really it's not. Then, as in progressive from public to Christian, private to homeschooling, you may want to go to homeschooling right away, so that I don't want to give that wrong impression. So, homeschooling, though, we have some options as the church to help with those homeschooling co-ops, opportunities for parents to come together and work together, collaboration, and then also to offset some of those costs. So, again, we'll have some of those resources available on our website.

Speaker 1: 24:13

Okay, I think. So, wrapping it up, we've covered a lot. I think it's very helpful information. Um, let's end on the question is education a right?

Speaker 2: 24:23

Okay, so I may offend some people, um, because we tend to think that we have the right to receive something from others. Uh, I would go back to your personal responsibilities of parent. Yeah, I see education as a privilege. It is a gift. It is a responsibility of parent. Do we deserve to be educated? Absolutely. But I'm going to step out here as defined by rights, as if I have a right for someone to make that happen in my life. No, I would say it's not a right. I would say it is something that we, as parents, should strive to do for our children.

Speaker 2: 25:08

Now, when we say is it a right, we've immediately moved it out of the home and, under the authority of the parents, into a whole different category of the state. If we're going to be true to our terms, the state is responsible. It is a right for the individual, the citizen, to receive that from the government, and that's not the case. Our founding fathers now, while we implemented public education, many of the parents, the family and the founding of this nation, they were the ones that were responsible for the education of the kids. And you got to remember when this country was founded, it was on the backs of farmers, it was on the backs of trade and people, individuals, and they had large families because they needed help on the farm.

Speaker 1: 25:59

Everybody had a responsibility.

Speaker 2: 26:00

Everybody had a responsibility. Now, eventually you see the one room classroom, school and kids coming to that school, that location, and eventually, yes, the community, through taxes, the local community would hire someone to teach. But if we're going to be true to our terms as far as a right to be given by a nation, I think we need to be careful when we go there, because then it becomes something that I am owed and then you have children today that feel entitled and you have children who do not appreciate. I don't think we as a kid kids don't understand. You know why do I need to do this? So I know I may get some pushback on this, but I say this in light of people say that our health, the ability to receive healthcare, is a right, and it's not Right, it's a privilege, it's a luxury. Actually, in many countries, Right.

Speaker 1: 27:04

Yeah, a lot of countries don't have it. Don't have it, that's right.

Speaker 2: 27:07

Yeah. So as we're wrapping this up, I do want to kind of circle back to what we've said, just to summarize. When we talk about the education pillar giving life remember where life came from, remember how we acquire that life. We are educated, the gospel shared with us, we read the word of God and then we flourish out of that understanding. We have said as a church that it is faith seeking understanding. When you came to Christ, you didn't understand it, right.

Speaker 1: 27:41

I'll did you, and then you end up with a lot of questions.

Speaker 2: 27:44

A lot of questions, but you grow in that understanding and that's really when we say the education gives life, allows them to know what questions.

Speaker 2: 27:53

And grow in the understanding, the understanding of eternal life and this life rooted in Christ, and then where it's all going, because when you are ready to die, when you're prepared to die, you really then know how to live and you understand how to live. So I just wanted to kind of circle back to that, because this is not the end for the believer, and every day, every day, leaders please be reminded of this is that we want to empower your leadership, and one of the things part of that with education is, as we focus in on that and the leaders get what this is all about. We've got a king who's going to return, according to scripture.

Speaker 2: 28:37

And we want to make sure everybody knows it and we want everybody understands it and living in that, and so to those involved with the education pillar, my hat is off to them.

Speaker 1: 28:46

For sure it is hard work, it's all hard.

Speaker 2: 28:50

And his parents. I'm a grandparent now, you're a parent and it is tough work, yeah, when you got to go you know, you got your job, you got so much going on, and so I just I am super thankful for our teachers, I'm super thankful for administrators and those involved in education. I think I would say also in closing is that the more educators understand the influence that they have.

Speaker 1: 29:17

Oh, for sure.

Speaker 2: 29:18

Kingdom standpoint and these precious kids. What a blessing to be able to that.

Speaker 1: 29:24

I think it's important to the leaders that might not be in the education pillar they're in the business pillar, government, church pillar but they have employees to help encourage the employees to be parents that are involved and even understanding should they have something at school that they need to go to, or parent teacher conferences and to find a way to like, encourage your employees to be involved and to let them know that you support that as an employer to them. I think that's a huge thing for a parent when they're looking for jobs a little bit of that flexibility.

Speaker 2: 29:53

And when we talk about the business pillar, I'm really excited about that aspect for people involved in the kingdom. So thank you for having me Awesome. Well, thank you.

Speaker 1: 30:02

Yeah, it was fun to talk about education and to learn a little bit more at where Texas Leadership Summit stands on that, and thank you all for joining us, and we've got more next month, so come back and listen to us and we'll dig in more about some of our other pillars. So thank you.

Speaker 2: 30:17

Thank you.