Talkin' Tennessee with Yvonnca
Talkin' Tennessee with Yvonnca
A Beacon of Hope in Knoxville with Pastor Chris Battle
This week we welcome Pastor Chris Battle, owner of BattleField Farm Gardens! We had a great conversation about his journey In ministry, and how he is bringing fresh food and spreading love to the community in such an amazing way!
Battle Field Farm is working to end food insecurity by partnering with community members to make fresh food accessible and to cultivate land-based sovereignty through education, workforce development, and direct relationships to land. To contact battlefield farm, check out their site. https://battlefieldfarm.org/about/
If you are looking for a Realtor, don't forget to call The Landes Team to help you buy and sell!
Yvonnca Landes
Realty Executives Associates
865.660.1186 or 588.3232
www.YvonncaSellsRealEstate.com
Adrienne Landes
Realty Executives Associates
865.659-6860 or 588.3232
Click here: https://linktr.ee/talkintnwithyvonnca
Turning Knox Rental (Event Rental Services): www.turningknoxrental.com
Landes Home Collection Online Store: www.landeshomecollection.com
For promotion inquires please contact Yvonnca Landes. 865-660-1186
All Copy Rights are owned Yvonnca Landes and the Landes Brand ©. To gain legal access contact David Landes 865.660.6860 or theappraisalfirm@charter.net
Produced and engineered by: Adrienne Landes
Thank you for listening! Follow us on social media! https://linktr.ee/talkintnwithyvonnca
Check us out to hear the latest on life in the volunteer state. Yvonca and her guests discuss everything from life, love and business with a Tennessee flair. It's a Tennessee thing, always relatable, always relevant and always a good time. This is Talkin' Tennessee, and now your host, yvonca.
Speaker 2:This episode is brought to you by the Landis team, your go-to real estate family in East Tennessee. If you are looking to buy or sell, we are the ones you should call. Give us a call at 865-660-1186 or check out our website at YvoncaSellsRealEstatecom. That's Yvonca Y-V-O-N-N-C-A salesrealestatecom.
Speaker 3:Welcome back to Talking Tennessee with Yvonca. I am your host and this week I am featuring Pastor Chris Battle. Welcome to Talking Tennessee.
Speaker 4:Thank you for having me today.
Speaker 3:Most definitely, viewers. This has been a work in progress. I reached out to Pastor Battle last year and our schedules was really packed and they stay packed, but I truly believe this is when God really wanted to happen. I have to tell you that he has been recommended to me by so many different people in our community and they talked about what all you're doing in the community. They talked about who you are, who you've been in the past. They talked about different things, that they've watched you evolve and just keep growing this community. So first let me give you your flowers and tell you thank you for everything that you do for our community, because that is truly a God sent thing. Thank you, thank you. So let's get into it. Who is Chris Battle?
Speaker 4:Who is Chris Battle? I think, at the core, chris Battle was this little, shy little boy who loves God and wants to make everybody happy. I think that's if you had to take off all the layers, yes, I think that's who you would find.
Speaker 3:Yes, but throughout life I think you've probably realized in certain areas you can't make everybody happy Wish you could.
Speaker 4:I have learned that the hard way, the hard way. Yes.
Speaker 3:I think, we all learn that. But I think that we have to remember that because there's times that we really want to make somebody happy in things, but for whatever reason, it just doesn't work that way. But I think the best part about it is you having the heart to want to be pleasing.
Speaker 4:Well, I shouldn't maybe my at my core, I want to see a world which is at peace and sh's shalom, you know where. Everything is there. Everybody's needs are met doesn't mean you're gonna have problems right but I think that's what the kingdom is all about. It's about this, this place of shalom, where everybody's whole complete, um, dare I say, happy yes, yes, you know yes, um, but but that's that's what I, that's what the goal I'm working for in community, you know you basically trying to do your part and stay in my lane.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, sometimes God will take you out of that lane and God will say, okay, I need you to go over here.
Speaker 2:And you're like no.
Speaker 3:God and he's like yeah, you going. Well, I think for me Willingly, or not willingly, for me it was.
Speaker 4:I had to understand what that lane was. I was kind of angry at God for taking so long, you know.
Speaker 2:Okay, or maybe I was Be honest.
Speaker 4:Maybe I was slow about listening yes. Or maybe it was just for me. It wasn't time yet you know, I was telling somebody the other day. I said I wish I would have known this work 20 years ago, oh, you know, when my knees were feeling a little bit.
Speaker 3:It's funny you say that because last week I was thinking, you know, with the wisdom you get when you grow older, I hope is that you think, gosh, I wish I would have known that. I don't know what I could have, how I could have applied that. You think, gosh, I wish I would have known that a long time ago, how I could have applied that and stopped a lot of things, and so that went through my mind last week. So we got something in common. So how long have you been in Knoxville?
Speaker 4:I moved to Knoxville in 2008. 2008. I'm from Cincinnati, ohio, originally. Grew up there left. Went to college, go Morehouse Left Morehouse. Graduated from Morehouse, went to Southern Seminary in Louisville, kentucky. Got called to a church in Bowling Green, kentucky, which was actually 38 years ago this past Sunday, father's Day and then went to Hackensack, new Jersey. Okay, from Hackensack I went back to Cincinnati.
Speaker 3:Oh, wow.
Speaker 4:And stayed another about 15 years or so and then got called here to Tabernacle Baptist Church here in 2008.
Speaker 3:Okay, so you're married.
Speaker 4:Yes, I'm married to my wife.
Speaker 3:Please, yeah, please tell us who your wife is. I guess it's good to be married to my wife. Please tell us who your wife is.
Speaker 2:I guess it's good to be married to your wife.
Speaker 4:Her name is Toma Battle. We have 19 children, 15 of which we have adopted or have legal custody over 19?. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Viewers 19.
Speaker 3:That's a lot of and let me say this um, I have a biological child and I have an adoptive child and you can relate to this we love it's, it's, there's no difference, or we just love, you know that type thing. But it's such a great feeling to know that, for when you saved a child and you gave that child love and you showed them the world, you know as best you could. So to do that for 19 kids, that's commendable in itself. I mean to have the patience for one for 19 kids and just. Life could be hard or life could be easy, but you chose. You didn't choose either one.
Speaker 4:You just said I'm just gonna help somebody well, yeah, um, I'm not gonna say, we came out, that was our okay we're gonna get married and have all these children. Yes, that was not, that was not the case at all no and, and my sister once asked me well, we were talking. She said, chris, I don't think I could go foster because as soon as I get attached to the child, yes. They'll take the child.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:And remove like that. How I look at this is give that child all the love you can, show them some semblance of what normalcy looks like, some semblance of functionality.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:I'm not saying my sister's just as dysfunctional as I am. But some semblance of what a family looks like, but some semblance of what a family looks like. So, even if they are taken away, even if they do leave, they'll be able to reflect on that period of time that you're together and say hey this situation here.
Speaker 3:it doesn't have to be like this. There is another way.
Speaker 4:Yes, and I think, a lot of our young people some of you have not seen options.
Speaker 2:Yes, they haven't seen that there are other ways to do things.
Speaker 3:There's other options. And then you know the opportunity to grow and the opportunity to see through someone else's lenses, that type thing. And I think with my son, you know I've got a girl, a daughter and a son and I'm learning that raising a boy and a girl is so different oh, it's so different boys, give me boys oh okay, so me, I would say give me girls.
Speaker 4:Yes, boys are hard girls are girls are they're chatty?
Speaker 3:I'll say girls are chatty, I'll say girls are chatty, but boys, they try you, they try you and you have to show them who wins.
Speaker 3:You know that type thing, but I think that was God's plan. You know, we had had, at the time when I adopted him, we had had six miscarriages. We've had a total of ten and we had given up, you know, and my husband's adopted. And so David one day was like what do you think about adoption? Okay, this is way before my son, and I said I'd be open to that. And he said if I ever adopted a child, I'd want them, I would want to really teach them you know how to grow in life as an adopted child. He said because that was me. And so months and months later, the opportunity came and so I commend you for it because I'm like I understand where your sister's coming from, because we did kinship, we didn't do foster care we knew the family and so I never forget.
Speaker 3:When I got my son, uh, the social worker says to me okay, do not get attached. Well, the moment they hand you that, baby, you're going to get attacked. That was the first thing they said to me is do not get attached, and I was just like how can you love and show this kid, you know, especially infant? You know love and you tell them no attachment.
Speaker 4:That's ridiculous.
Speaker 3:Yes, and so yeah, yeah, exactly, well, they did.
Speaker 4:And for us. You know, I had two sons from my first marriage and when me and Toma toma got married, we had five miscarriages and that's why we went the adoptive route. And I'll never forget um. I was running a revival in baltimore, maryland, and she called me. She said chris, they found a sibling group of five. Yeah, it was a sibling group of five, but they were living in three different homes and they wanted to bring them together. Can we take them? I said, if you good baby, I'm good with it, you know.
Speaker 3:And she said well, I already told him yes, but we'll she said listen, I just want you to feel like that I can see. And then we had then we.
Speaker 2:We had our first child together, then we had another one yeah, and then you know, but it's like, you know, it's like if an elephant steps on your foot.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:And another elephant jumps on its back. It ain't going to make a difference.
Speaker 3:Yes, it's not. It's not. That's the truth. It's not.
Speaker 3:It ain't going to make a difference. Your situation was kind of like with mine. My husband, where we shoot in this office is the studio in my husband's office and he was in the part of the house and he was walking through and I told him the situation and I said can we take him? And he goes, yeah, and he walks off, okay. He said, yeah, we can, and he walks off and he walks back in here, okay, and then he comes back and he he goes. Did I just say we could take a child? And from there on you know the rest of the story. He's 15 years old, he just um graduated from ninth grade, going to 10th grade, and we're one big, happy family. But I will say, adoption is a great thing. Uh, can it be trying? Yes, I'm not going to tell y'all it's not, but it is a great thing and you're saving a child and it's a great option. So let me ask you this why do you love this community? Why, yes?
Speaker 4:I'm trying to remember when I fell in love with Knoxville.
Speaker 3:That's a darn good you should have sent that question to me. I told you I wouldn't throw something at you, but I'll give you a good question ultimately, it's the people.
Speaker 4:It's the people in the community.
Speaker 3:I've met some wonderful, loving.
Speaker 4:I'm going to give you a good question. Ultimately, it's the people. Mm-hmm, it's the people in the community. Yes, I've met some wonderful, loving, crazy, peace-loving people in this community and I've always invested in the communities. I've pastored Okay, I've always lived in the communities. I've pastored, okay, pastored. I've always lived in the communities. I've pastored Because I work, play, pray, play in the same zip code. So I believe in that. And I've always been one who likes to see the beauty and the wonder of people, the image of God in people, and grow on that. Now, some folks, you've got to look real hard. You've got to look real hard, yeah, real hard, but we'll find that there's beauty and wonder in everybody. And I told somebody the other day I said you know, I think one of my faults is I genuinely like people.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:I genuinely like people, so that's, it's the people, it's the support that I've received, you know, and East Tennessee is different, it's definitely different.
Speaker 3:It's different and East Tennessee is different. It's definitely different, it's different. And I think the biggest thing with East Tennessee is I'm not trying to say East Tennessee is perfect, I'm not saying that, but we know that, because some people are like, oh, we're all balls. You know, I'm like, no, there's some parts of East Tennessee that could be better. But I think the biggest thing about our community is what I appreciate that we can go in a grocery store, maybe not know somebody, and they still speak, yeah, you know, what I'm saying.
Speaker 3:When there's a call of duty, someone gets sick, someone is in need, it just seems like east tennessee rallies. And I'm speaking of, you know, from experience, when my husband got sick, when I told you off camera, uh, 11 years ago, there were so many churches. Well, first of all, his story just went like wildfire. Well, first of all, his story just went like wildfire and grew and a friend of mine put it on Facebook. I didn't want it on Facebook but God knew what he was doing Because this friend put it on Facebook and he was the only one that I didn't tell not to, because I didn't think he would.
Speaker 3:He put it on Facebook and he asked people to pray for David and it took off, just. But there was so many people that came together for me that did not know me from Adam. There were churches that were reaching out all over the country, literally said he's on our prayer list, he's this, this East Tennessee man, and that to me just I'm not saying other cities are not great, but to me I'm East Tennessee All day, every day, because I love how we rally. You know we may get mad at each other at times, we may not speak sometimes, but it's something about East Tennessee brings us back together.
Speaker 4:Do you agree with that? I would agree with that to a certain extent.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes.
Speaker 4:I believe particularly in the African American community. We would see that yes.
Speaker 3:Even to the expanded community.
Speaker 4:We have some hurdles that we got to cross.
Speaker 3:We do, we do. I agree with that, I totally agree with that. And that leads me to my next question. Uh-oh, two-part question what led you into ministry in Knoxville Tennessee? Let's start with that.
Speaker 4:Well, again I had started. I've been pastoring in different cities across the country, up and down the East Coast.
Speaker 3:I guess you could say let's go back for one second Viewers. Pastor Battle has been in ministry for 43 years. He has been a pastor. Am I? Is it?
Speaker 4:Yeah, 43 years 33 of those were institutions.
Speaker 3:No, no. 43 years in ministry, 33 years in pastoring, so now go ahead. I just want to give them the back um what was? Your question. Your question is what led you to ministry in knoxville?
Speaker 4:so we were um, we were a part of a congregation in cincinnati, we were doing well, but we just felt it was time to leave. My wife put out the. She started filling out applications for me.
Speaker 1:She said let's she said it's time.
Speaker 4:Tabernacle extended a call to me and it was a fit. I really believe I had come here planning on retiring here.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:That was probably my last church and you know, boom, I'm through. You know. But you know, then the trajectory changed. God threw me a curveball.
Speaker 3:Them curveballs. They be brutal sometimes. And that's my next question what is your thoughts of the church, of the current state of the church, the current state?
Speaker 4:I'm going to tell my story. Go ahead, answer your question.
Speaker 3:Tell it.
Speaker 4:So when I moved here again, I had 30 years under my belt and I said I'm going to come approach this with a more philosophical approach. I think I know what I'm doing now and my question was how can our church impact the community? And so we moved here in 08. And one of the and during the interviewing process, one of the questions was if you become our pastor, what would be one of the first things you would do? Ok, I had been on a tour of East Knoxville and I said well, the first thing we're going to do is clean that cemetery across the street. I've been asked that question. Before I give them, you know, brush off, you know. Oh, I want to sit and look at the community and sit with the people and understand the needs of the city and you know, yes, yes.
Speaker 4:I said, no, we're going to clean that because Oddfellow. Cemetery was a mess and I said you know it's overgrown, headstones are knocked over and most of the people buried there were born in slavery. I said it's an embarrassment to our history. I'm not even from here. I'm not even from here, and that's an embarrassment.
Speaker 3:It is. We're going to clean that cemetery. I'm not from here either. Keep going. So they called me, I think in.
Speaker 4:September, First week of December, I think it was. We were out there cleaning about 30 of us.
Speaker 3:I said we're going to clean this.
Speaker 4:He said we're going to go clean, we're going to clean it and we're mowing, we're chainsawing, we're putting headstones back up, we we got bags and bags of debris we've collected. And this brother pulls up in a pickup truck. He stops me and starts thanking us for what we're doing. Thank you for investing in the community, thank you for doing this, da-da-da-da-da. So me and my thinking I done caught me a fish. Okay, I got me a potential member.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:And I said, brother, won't you come join us at the church? And he looked me in the eye and he said these words, and I quote I ain't come to your damn church. And he pulled off oh wow, well, that was my response too, so uh, especially after he's yes his, his, his, his, his commendation turned to consternation.
Speaker 4:Yes, yes, and I'm flabbergasted, but it plagued me, it still plagues me. And then fast forward to 2016. Okay, concord Baptist Church did a study on church attendance in Knoxville and this is the buckle of the Bible belt, and 20% of Knoxvillians go to church on a regular basis 20%, and regular was considered once a month. Yeah, and so roughly 40% are done with church. They used to go, don't go anymore. Love Jesus can't stand the institution or consider themselves spiritual and the other 40% from this study have no religious affiliation.
Speaker 4:And I'm like well, don't look like. Anybody's going to anybody's church and I'm talking to my pastor. Friends across denominational lines, across racial lines, across the country, they're telling me the same thing Attendance is going down. We're having to reconsider our budget, you know, because we're not getting as much money. And this is before the pandemic. Right right, this is before the pandemic.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you're saying 2016.
Speaker 4:And I got to thinking I'm like, well, maybe we need to do church differently, Okay, but I don't know. I'm like, well, maybe we need to do church differently.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:But I don't know what that looks like. I'm a baby boomer and I get that.
Speaker 3:I get that I'm a baby boomer. You may see that there needs change, but what change?
Speaker 4:I don't know what that looks like. What is it supposed? To be, and so the stuff we were doing that we thought would you know in retrospect the stuff that I would do to try to get attendance up, whatever was really for the folk who were already coming. You really teaching right now so 2018,. We had a piece of property and I've always done a little gardening.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:I don't consider myself a good gardener. Now I just know that God puts something in a seed, that when you put it in the soil, give us some warmth and some water it's going to grow.
Speaker 3:It's going to grow.
Speaker 4:Okay, you know, and I've also I've always done this a little bit at the house, right here and there and we had a plot of land like two doors down from the church. I'm like, why don't we do a garden here? It took me three years to get this garden going, okay. So I started like in 2015. Okay, it was 2018 when we got it going. Okay, and I called a friend of mine who was working at the botanical garden.
Speaker 4:I said hey, come help me talk. So I wanted to do a community garden. You know, give me the ins and outs, you know, help me design this space or whatever. And in that conversation we start talking about food disparity and food desert, and it was literally at that point that the trajectory of my life changed. I'm like hold up.
Speaker 3:I'm in a church.
Speaker 4:I'm in a church and we have a significant problem in our community. People are literally dying a slow death Hypertension, obesity, sugar, diabetes, heart issue and it's all based on diet, because they don't have access to fresh fruits and vegetables.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:They have access to Burger King. They can have it their way. They got access to, you know, Pizza Palace and McDonald's and all of these.
Speaker 4:Chick-fil-A. They got every corner store, every dollar store, but yet there's no grocery store, there's no place to sell fresh produce. The USDA says if one third of your community is living in poverty and more than a mile away from a grocery store or farmer's market, you're considered a food desert. We were two miles away, see. And then places of poverty is always a transportation problem. People can't afford cars. The median income in the zip code that we're working in it's seventeen thousand dollars a year.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it says they say they say it takes like nine thousand dollars a year just to maintain a car in knoxville. Say, okay, so if I'm, if I, if I'm making 17 and I got a car, that knocks it down to what? Eight thousand already, yeah, so we got some issues. We got some issues, so I got some issues. So I didn't know all this at first. I just knew that there was a problem here. I'm like well, maybe what we could do is get other churches to start growing gardens.
Speaker 2:Okay, start doing gardens.
Speaker 4:Reached out to some pastor friends, but something happened. Something else happened. I'm at the garden. My wife would tell you I was there. Every morning I would go to McDonald's and get my coffee. And get my coffee Right, and I'd wait for the sun. Come on sun, let's go. So I'm ready to go out here and work in the garden Garden is peaceful. Yes, we come from the soil. That's why there's that peace in the soil.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:Maybe that's what the song should have said. There's peace in the soil for me.
Speaker 2:Anyway.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you can cut that part out. But what happened, monica, was people started coming to the garden Community. People were coming to the garden Community. People were coming to the garden. I'm meeting people. I'll never forget I met this woman, did you?
Speaker 3:hear him say they were coming to the garden.
Speaker 4:Who would never come to my Black Baptist brick and mortar church Are y'all?
Speaker 3:hearing what he's saying. They wouldn't, come to the church, but they would come to the garden.
Speaker 4:Came to the garden.
Speaker 3:Why is that?
Speaker 4:I think because it is a place of peace. There is no condemnation in the garden Plus.
Speaker 3:I think it's seeing something grow. It's visible, it is and it brings joy. You know what I'm saying and I'm not saying the church. There's not joy in the church. I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is is that the joy that garden signifies joy. You know it doesn't signify attitudes. It doesn't signify, you know, people not getting along. It doesn't signify people not getting along. It doesn't signify any of that. It's only joy and growth. I can see why you'd want to go to the garden. People come to the garden.
Speaker 4:We had black folk, white folk, straight folk, gay folk, old folk coming to the garden.
Speaker 3:I'm like why is is that? I didn't really care why.
Speaker 4:I'm like you're just happy they're coming to the garden and I was going through something in my life, in my understanding of church. I guess I think I said before I was really starting to realize that church is not a space, it's not a place, it's not an address, it's not a point on my GPS.
Speaker 3:It's who I am, it's what we do, and it's going against what you were taught.
Speaker 4:Yes.
Speaker 3:Let's talk about that, and I will. And because, and I'm like Because we're taught go to church, go to church, and church is a building.
Speaker 2:And church is a building.
Speaker 3:Yeah, keep going.
Speaker 4:And the folks would come to the garden? Yes, and they wouldn't come to my. There wasn't a building my bleep church? Yes, and still won't. I had a guy stop at the farm one day a few months ago. He goes. I love your mission, I just don't like the god of your mission oh, wow but he was in. He was in the garden he still was in the garden.
Speaker 4:You see, I think I think what, how? I again, as I said, my understanding of church was changing, okay, and I'm like, well, if they're coming to the garden, maybe that should be the church.
Speaker 3:So let me ask you a question Historically, the church has been in our community. The church has been the cornerstone of our communities for generation after generation. But these days and times, people are running from the church, people are not going to the church. What do you think of your opinion? Why do you think that's been the cornerstone of our communities? Okay, I tell people let me go back a little bit. I tell people I'm like the two things that people don't get that slavery taught us. It taught us family and it taught us God. Okay, because that's all we had. We didn't have a lot in slavery, you know so. But in these days and times, so many people are running from the church, so what do you think the reason why is, I think?
Speaker 4:I think I think a few reasons actually, but I think one is that I think oftentimes our churches have become irrelevant. Ok, we're, we're, we're solving, we're asked, we're solving questions, we're answering questions that nobody's asking, that the community is not asking. Ok, secondly, we don't work together. Secondly, we don't work together. The civil rights movement was started in the church, but churches had to work together. Yes, you know our church, the way our structures are built, is because we're set up for competition, not cooperation.
Speaker 3:You know, teach, pastor and I could go on for that, but I don't know how much time I don't understand. What I don't understand is OK, we all say we love the Lord. Well, the Lord is of love and unity. Yeah, not division, unity, ok, not division, unity, okay. I don't understand. If I'm a pastor, you're a pastor. Why can't we be unified and worship together and not be worried about? Well, you know why.
Speaker 4:The reason why is because if I don't get the money, that if I don't get people in there, get the money to pay these bills and to pay these salaries I don't have a job. Okay, because our the way the structure of our congregations I've in my opinion, is really built around income oh it's built around income, so the matrix that we use to determine church success, I call them the bps the bps the bps, butts and pews butts and pews okay bucks in the plate, baptisms in the pool and building programs.
Speaker 4:If you have that going on, if you got theisms in the pool and building programs. If you have that going on if you've got the butts in the pews, which people tend to think brings more bucks in the plate.
Speaker 4:Right, right, right, and if you've got the people coming, they'll have more baptisms in the pool, right, and if you're always building, it always looks like you're successful. That's the matrix we use for church success, and if we can get more people in, we can get more people. That's the matrix we use for church success and if we can get more people in, we can get more people. That's why we're competitive. That's why we're competitive because I need those people. We're fighting for the same people. We're in a small pool and we're trying to fight for the same fish, right? Yes, I need you to come to my church, you need them to go to your church or whatever. I was telling a guy one. I was like, hey, man, you guys talked, maybe start doing like, um, we, we were, we were moving to, uh, small groups and homes okay and the guy told me he's a friend of mine, he pastors another, another state.
Speaker 4:He goes no, I can't do that because they might try to go and start a church. I'm like, well, what's wrong with that right? You know, but if they, go start another church.
Speaker 3:That's money. Then he loses members, that's right. Then he goes to the church, so it really gets based around that Okay. But if it's that, it's the wrong matrix. It is because, if it's that, if we say we're a child of God and we're following God, god said I will provide. He said, just build a kingdom.
Speaker 4:He said I will provide but you said the key word kingdom. Kingdom is the key word. He didn't say build individual kingdoms he said build a kingdom and kingdom requires cooperation. And I began to look at church. So much different. He said build a kingdom, kingdom, and kingdom requires cooperation. Yes, you see, and I began to look at church so much different. I'm like you know what?
Speaker 3:We're supposed to be building kingdom we are.
Speaker 4:If I asked you what the gospel is, I ask this question all the time to the classes I teach and people give me the same answer the gospel is the death, burial and resurrection, and soon returning, of Christ. I'm like you haven't read the Bible, because every time you read gospel in the New Testament.
Speaker 4:It's always followed by the gospel of the kingdom. The gospel of the kingdom, the gospel of the kingdom. It's the good news that there's going to be a better way. It's the good news that there's an alternate way of living way. It's the good news that there's an alternate way of living.
Speaker 3:It's the good news that shalom is on the way and people do not get right even when they read it. They miss, they miss the kingdom they miss the kingdom.
Speaker 4:And and how do you?
Speaker 3:sit and say that you read the bible and you study it, and, and then you get up and preach it, and you get up and teach it, and all this, but I don't see many pastors preach kingdom.
Speaker 4:Because it doesn't fit into the BPs. You're teaching, thank you, and I'm not mad. I mean, I was involved in that too. Yeah, I tried my best to do the BPs, but you learned something different.
Speaker 3:I try my best to follow, do the BPs, but you learn something different. I learn something different.
Speaker 4:I begin to understand church. I begin to understand what kingdom is really all about.
Speaker 3:And it's not about competition.
Speaker 3:It's not about competition, it's really not when you really follow God and you. One thing I'll say about our race we're history makers. Okay, we love to be the first. I'm the first, and I'm not saying that's not a good thing, but you can't be the first and stay the first. You got to be able to see. Okay, god allowed me to be the first, to be an example. Now let others eat off of what you became the first of and allow other people to do. It may be similar, but God made us one of a kind, so we don't have to worry about competing if you really know God. Well, jesus said that. Do you get what I'm saying?
Speaker 4:Jesus said that the disciples told Jesus one day. They said, hey, we had to stop these cats because they're over there healing folks in your name. Jesus said why are you stopping them? Why are you stopping them Just because they're not walking with us? They don't need to Let them go ahead and do what they're doing. But my thing is that when we start seeing it, I believe that our churches should look like our communities. We complain about. The communities are not. They're drug infected, affected. They're craziness going on, they're shooting each other. But we got all these churches in the community and nothing's changing in the community. Nothing, nothing's changing in the community.
Speaker 3:This is what I don't understand about it and you can please explain this to me. True evangelism is in your community, being out in the community, it's not in a building. I don't understand about our churches that we want to keep everything in house Okay. But we want to say we work in our community Big piece. Yes, we want to say we work in our community.
Speaker 2:but we don't see you in the community.
Speaker 3:We don't see you getting your hands dirty. We do not see you telling your members hey, let's go help Pastor Battle If that means going to pick the beans. Do you get what I'm?
Speaker 4:saying I got saved the second time you got to have one in one when I was in college Is that the second time. When I was in Campus Crusade for Christ right. Yes and we had the four spiritual laws. You know God loves you and has a wonderful plan. I knew that whole thing, you know. And every church I pastored. I taught them the four spiritual laws taught them about going out of the family.
Speaker 4:Then it struck me one day because I would go to McDonald's and get my coffee every morning. And how long are you in the coffee when you're in the drive-thru and you see the?
Speaker 3:30 seconds. Yeah, a minute is long, yes, 30 seconds. Yes.
Speaker 4:But it's amazing what you can learn about people. Is McDonald's coffee that good, I thought?
Speaker 3:so, okay, okay, go try it. I used to work at McDonald's, but back then.
Speaker 1:I wasn't drinking no coffee, so I kept going.
Speaker 4:It's amazing what people you can learn about people in 30 second interactions. You know I would go through there and the same lady, every pastor pray for my son. He's da, da, da, da da.
Speaker 2:You know, hey, pastor, how you doing.
Speaker 4:You know, I'm like, hmm, and so what I? And so I started approaching it like this. I think I got to a point where I discouraged the church, discouraged them from going out, taking these pamphlets and knocking on doors.
Speaker 3:I said no, we ain't doing that. No more.
Speaker 4:Why are we going to knock on a stranger's door, who we don't know? Take them through this four spiritual laws, or take them down the Roman's road of evangelism or salvation or whatever, and they'll say a sentence, prayer, and then, boom, we'll say next, okay, I'm like no, that's that's. Let's not do it. Let's do what I, what we call a relational evangelist, and that's what we try to do at the farm. We try to live our life in such a way that people will ask us why we do what we do. Peter talks about it in 1. Peter talks about always be prepared to make a defense for your faith. But be prepared for what? Because people should be asking you why do you do this, chris?
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:Why are you so kind to me? And everybody else so you can share. I can share why, but it's a result of the relationship, not because I knocked on your door. You've seen an example of it.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:You've seen an example of love. You've seen an example of mercy. You've seen an example of love.
Speaker 3:You've seen an example of mercy, you've seen an example of grace and they need to see it in your wall.
Speaker 4:And I right, and I got guys folks that walk by my garden every day and and some of them have even taken ownership. You know, I saw somebody walking through. I told them to get out. I mean, you know you're right because they know me, they have a relation. I had a guy who was a houseless fellow and we were loading up the truck one day and he said, pastor, I need to talk with you. I said okay.
Speaker 2:When we get finished, I'll talk with you.
Speaker 4:I said okay.
Speaker 2:It was just kind of strange.
Speaker 4:Right. So we got finished with what we were doing and then he went into his backpack and then I saw it. Then I saw it, I saw it and I knew what he was saying and he came to me and said because what it was was a camera he had stolen. Okay, it was a camera he would stole. And he said I took it and I'm sorry, I apologize when I took it when we first met, but when I realized what you guys are doing, here, guilt was kicking his mind and he said I hope you can.
Speaker 4:I hope you don't think.
Speaker 3:I said, brother, I think more of you now because you made the mistake but you tried to rectify it and you did rectify it, but yes, he did rectify it, but it goes back to what you said a few minutes ago when you said you know, I was part of that belief of building churches up that way, but I don't think that way anymore. So you changed your, your belief changed changed. Your belief changed. So your walk changed. So to the church, part of it. I'm like we're all going to make mistakes but the one thing we have to do is we've got to grow and we have to be able to let God work in us. I mean that type thing and I'll never forget early in my walk with God I was going to this church and I thought very highly of the pastor and the wife and the first lady and I'll never forget a Christmas cake and I do a huge Christmas party every year, show appreciation to my clients and all that.
Speaker 3:Just say thank you, and then people in the community that has helped me all year long referring me, and I'll never forget that I'm a tree person, christmas tree person, so I put up a lot of trees every year, and so people will call me and ask me to come see the trees. And so I'll never forget I was going to this church and to me I feel like God gave me my house, not just for me and my family, he gave it to me to share, and so I've had church cookouts here. I've had all kinds of events here, okay, so this particular Christmas I was talking to the pastor and first lady and I said, oh, so-and-so, so-and-so, so-and-so is coming to see the trees tonight, so we're going to have hot cocoa and this different stuff and some snacks. You should come by. I'll never forget.
Speaker 3:This pastor said and his wife said this to me you are inviting those people to your house. And I said what? You're inviting them? You don't want all of them in your house. Pastor Battle, that's literally hit me like a ton of bricks, because this is why it hit me. I'm like these people are members of your church and you're calling them that people those people we were taught the Bible says it, you know shun.
Speaker 4:You know, to some folks you need to be shunning and everything. And it hit me one day, the people that we shun, we stay away from that. We don't invite to come to our house to see the Christmas trees and have hot cocoa with, or the same people Jesus was sitting with. And I'm like whoa, if Jesus can sit with them.
Speaker 3:And those are the same people that if things got tough and you got sick they're the same people that will show up and nurse you back to health, but to hear a pastor tell me to not invite them to my house, like they are a different set of people and that like they are not worthy, I was in shock.
Speaker 4:And I think that's the problem. I think that's one of the problems with our church. That's a whole other issue.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 4:But most of our churches don't look like our communities.
Speaker 2:They just don't they don't.
Speaker 4:And nobody wants to admit that I mean because we got white-collar churches, we got blue-collar churches, we got no-collar churches, churches, churches.
Speaker 2:I had a lady at my first church.
Speaker 4:My first church in Bowling Green was a first church.
Speaker 2:And it was one of those.
Speaker 4:It was. Anyway, and I asked a lady walking down the street. I'll never forget. I said won't you come join us at church? She goes, I don't wear silk drawers and she kept on.
Speaker 1:She said that to me. I'll never do that. That's your battle.
Speaker 3:People say crazy things to me. They say crazy things to me.
Speaker 4:They say crazy, and particularly at the farm. Yes, I bet, but that's the beauty of it to me. That's the beauty of it to me that people can say what they need to. Because, I don't tell folk I'm pastor.
Speaker 3:I don't.
Speaker 4:I'm farming, I'm the gardener. You know why? Because when you tell people you're pastor, they treat you differently. They talk differently when you put a title on it.
Speaker 3:I tell people titles. We make titles. Titles don't make us If your name does not stand for anything. When people say to me now, like if I go to like an event that we have to use our titles, in real estate or something like that.
Speaker 3:Then I want to say Yvonne Calandas, I'm a real dad, but outside of that, I'm Yvonne Calandas, ok, because my name means something to me. You know what. I'm Yvonne Galathas, because my name means something to me. You know what I'm saying. But I think a lot of times people get caught up into titles and position because they don't think highly of themselves and don't think and haven't done anything to gain respect to their name through life. And that's where you have to tap into yourself and say where am I lacking and where do I need to get better than I? That title is more important than my name. I mean, you know what I'm saying. I feel you on that one. And so let me ask you this so up today, if you could give advice to pastors, what would be name two things that you would say? If I was standing up in front of a whole bunch of pastors and they were asking me about making an impact in ministry, what would be the two things that you would say Make sure you try this or do this.
Speaker 4:I think I'd say two things.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:One cooperate and collaborate. Don't fight each other.
Speaker 4:That's a whole word, right there, you know we had, when I was pastoring Tabernacle, fight each other. That's a whole work right there. You know, um, we had, um, when I was pastoring tabernacle, me and the wife would walk going down the street one day, driving, and we started counting the churches that were on or about Martin Luther King. This was back in 20, early, 28, 2000. Um, and we counted 15, 15 churches, Basically three schools. I'm like what if we all work together with and each, you know, from this point, here we could work with Vine. This school here could work with Fair Garden. These churches here could work with AE, we could adopt these schools, we could have impact in these schools.
Speaker 3:And I tried my best to get it going, but nobody wanted to work there.
Speaker 4:Some girls got into a fight and this kind of what motivated it. These girls two girls from Vine got into a fight and I'm like why don't we get our churches together and have a patrol? Yeah, you know yeah, after school, and because first I asked the church. You know I asked the church and nobody's crickets, nobody responded. I asked the other church. I've reached out to pastors. They fighting, call the police. I mean, those are literally the responses I get. I went to the secular community and they all showed up.
Speaker 4:So, cooperation and collaboration. I think the second thing. Well, I might have three things Cooperation and collaboration, kingdom minded Be kingdom minded, which kind of goes with the first, but kingdom minded to build community, to build shalom, to look at more than your location.
Speaker 3:And let me say this, he may not want to say it Community is not inside your church.
Speaker 4:When I say community, I'm talking about the geographic location around your church.
Speaker 3:Do you hear what?
Speaker 4:he's saying that's what I'm talking about Community is not, I think, in the black culture.
Speaker 3:I don't think nobody's teaching that.
Speaker 4:Well, I'm learning that they don't.
Speaker 1:I teach at Johnson.
Speaker 4:University right. And one of the classes the class, not one of the. The class I teach is called Thriving Church, thriving Communities. Yes, and my whole argument for that class is whatever matrix you use the BPs to determine a thriving for your church, if it's not happening in your community, it's not happening at all yeah.
Speaker 3:So you got to come out of the churches and you have to realize that when you're saying collaborate, you got to come together and you have to be able to see that sometimes the problem is not, you know, we'll sit and say the opposite race, or we'll sit and say about different things, but sometimes it can be just in our mindset of changing our mindset and telling your congregation it's okay.
Speaker 4:When I was pastoring in Cincinnati we had planted a church, and we had actually purchased an old kingdom hall.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:And there was a bar across the street from our church and some folks were using our parking lot before that to go to the bar. Well, I got a little attitude okay, they go to bar, can't come church, right yes and I never forget. I'm gonna put a chain up here so they can stop, you know, and something told me to go talk to my church and community teacher professor at the school.
Speaker 2:I said man, let me tell you what I'm thinking, Let me tell you what's happening.
Speaker 4:He looked at me and said Chris, what message does that give? You don't want them folks here. He said what you need to do is go to the owner of the bar and tell him that your parking lot is available If they can park in as much as they want. Just don't throw bottles on the ground. And I left there.
Speaker 2:But I did.
Speaker 4:Okay, I did, you know, and because what, what they and they didn't? Interesting thing is they didn't park over there. Ok, you know, but but what? But what I learned? What I realized is I could have made an enemy or I could have made a friend.
Speaker 3:I've been just a good neighbor is a lot of times, when you're fighting against the grain of something, sometimes it's better to go and have a conversation. I think a lot of times we get angry and we cut off conversation and we cut off communication when God wants us to build the kingdom and he wants us to bring people to the kingdom.
Speaker 4:We're trying to stop people from doing what most of us are doing. You know what I'm saying. Let me get a drink too.
Speaker 3:You better preach pastor.
Speaker 4:But I'm saying, you know, just because I close off my parking lot, that ain't going to stop the people from the bar. It's not and and cause, it's about relationship. It's about relationship. You know you. You probably got you know um people going through AA, who you know, whatever those are the ones that need to be ministering there.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know what I'm saying. And, um, there, you know what I'm saying. And I had a guy once. He said I'll preach on the streets and everything. I said we're going down. I said we're going out there, let me see you preach. He walked out my office went to on the sidewalk and started preaching to the cars going by, did he? And I'm like, look at this fool. He's preaching to cars driving by.
Speaker 3:Who going to? To cars driving by? Who going to hear him? Nobody, no, you're just making noise, it ain't even joyful because can't nobody hear it.
Speaker 4:He said it's not a joyful noise. It ain't even a joyful noise, you know. Third thing third thing Follow your passion. I agree, God has a way.
Speaker 4:What I've learned is this when I started the gardening thing, it became like I said. It just changed, my trajectory changed, my passion changed. I still love preaching. I'm not, I'm not. I don't think. I don't know if I'll ever pastor in the institutional church again. Okay, I can't see that. But I love preaching, don't get that wrong. But it's the gardening thing, it's the feeding people, it's giving people health.
Speaker 3:That's my passion, and ministry comes in all forms. And what?
Speaker 4:I've learned is this I've learned a couple things from that One. When you follow your passion, you're less likely to burn out.
Speaker 3:You can, but you're less likely to burn out. You can, but you're less likely.
Speaker 4:Because you do what you love and you love what you do. There you go. Secondly, your passion attracts, like passions. So when I you know, who loves well everybody loves Chris Battle right, but gardeners, farmers right, but gardeners, farmers, people concerned about climate control, climate care, vegans they love what I do, people who are just as they love what we're doing.
Speaker 3:And they reach out, and they reach out.
Speaker 4:And thirdly, and offer a hand.
Speaker 3:Not only some offer hands, but they offer financing and support and you've got to have that. I tell people. You know, a lot of times people will be like I owe the church. You know the money and all that stuff. And I'm like, okay, no, wait a minute. I see both sides of it. I say because no, it shouldn't be about the money, okay, but at the same time the church does have to have money to grow and pay bills.
Speaker 4:The question, though, is this it can't be all about that, though, it can't be, yeah. I looked at our budget once and I got angry.
Speaker 3:Okay, okay.
Speaker 4:I'm like we're spending almost 80% of our budget on salaries and maintaining this building. Wow, and I got and that part it was the maintaining the building. God, I needed my salary.
Speaker 2:I need my salary. It was maintaining of the building part that bugged me.
Speaker 4:I'm like we're spending a lot of money keeping this building up to par KUB, all of that and nobody's here. You better say that 90% of the time this church goes empty.
Speaker 3:Something's wrong with that. So you're paying to house a building For Sunday morning For Sunday morning and no one's here, and that's what I don't get. I'm like you got to get out of the building, you got to go out.
Speaker 4:Jesus said build my church Upon this rock, I'll build my church. But he never said I'm building a building.
Speaker 3:He never said that Matter of fact. He said the temple was going to come down build my church, but he never said I'm building a building. He never said that no, but but that matter of fact.
Speaker 4:He said the temple was going to come down, it ain't been built back okay, I ain't.
Speaker 3:but the problem is we've been taught in our generation and back that the you got to go to church, you got to do this, you got to do that, you got to do that, it's got to do that. It's all about church. But if you really read that Bible and you really first of all God said put him first. He didn't say the church. If you really look in the order, church is farther down on God's order. I mean, you know what I'm saying Of who comes first. He said put him first. And I think that was the biggest thing that taught me when I was in the hospital what David was. Because I couldn't go to church anymore because I was in a hospital. So I had to find church within me, I had to build it up in me, I had to search for God in me.
Speaker 4:I had a lady tell me why she goes because they had left the church they were at and because the husband got called to a church and she told me I so miss the relationship, the fellowship with the other man, why you miss it. I'm like you can't see them on other days of the week. She's looking for the get down. I couldn't figure out. You missed them on Sunday morning.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:You missed them in the choir. It's not like you can't see them throughout the week Again. I think it's that matrix. I remember when I left the pastorate and quit going to church institutional church. It took a while to get that out of my system, you know. I mean because you're like oh, I didn't go to church, I'm going to sin and fall and show to the group.
Speaker 4:I remember that, you know, and I'm like I remember feeling that and I felt like that and sometimes I mean and I, even when I go now, I love it, yes, and pieces of me miss it. Yes, you know, but you miss the good times, but you don't miss the other part, you know, but, yeah, I'm not going to go there.
Speaker 3:But you know, the biggest part about that is is that, like how you said you missed it, I missed it. Like how you said you missed it, I missed it. Okay, but I can honestly say this this may not be your walk, but I can honestly say this I do more ministry now than I ever did when I was in the church. I do way more in my community. I'll do way more reading the word and seeking him and praying way more than I ever did. And I remember when I first stopped going in the hospital, coming out because David couldn't eat or feed himself, he couldn't walk or anything, so I still couldn't go. You know what I'm saying when I got out.
Speaker 3:And I never forget. Before I left the hospital I'm like, oh, I can't wait, I can go to church service. But then it came that I couldn't. When David got out, and the more and more I grew in Christ, that desire went away. The desire of him came stronger, and that desire, and then I was like, well, then I started. There was different pastors started asking me to speak at their church, and I'm like I said to my husband, I'm like, wow, they really want to hear what I got to say and I'm like really and I'm not saying what we have now needs to be destroyed.
Speaker 4:I do think it needs to be reformed.
Speaker 3:It does.
Speaker 4:Okay, I think it needs a restructuring.
Speaker 3:And people need to see God.
Speaker 4:I'm not saying they don't. I'm not saying they don't. I'm not saying they aren't truly saved.
Speaker 2:I'm not saying that Jesus is you know, I'm not saying that.
Speaker 4:I'm just saying that there is something about buildings that stop the movement it does.
Speaker 3:It does.
Speaker 4:That causes us to miss the kingdom.
Speaker 3:I think the building is, honestly what's the word? Intimidating to people. I don't think God is intimidating, but the building and the pressure of going to that building is intimidating to the world now. So people are. Well, I would say, do you get what I'm saying? I wouldn't say intimidate, I think the world out, so people are.
Speaker 4:Well, I would say Do you get what I'm saying? I wouldn't say intimidate. I think the word I would use is welcoming. I don't think. It's not as welcoming, it's kind of you know, but that's because the people aren't.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but I'm going to tell you what my husband said. My husband's from Pittsburgh and he said I hate Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4:I'm from Cincinnati. Oh okay, Hootie Go Bengals.
Speaker 3:Look, y'all know black and yellow, black and yellow. But David made a valid point to me. He said, yvonca, I have to say he said if I was not married to you? My husband grew up, his adoptive parents was white. David had never been in a predominantly black church till he got me. We've been together almost 25 years.
Speaker 3:I took him to our churches, I took him, he got to see the good and the real bad and the ugly, okay. And he said, yvonca, they're not welcoming at all. He said if I wasn't married to you, he said I'd feel like an outsider and I was like, really, and he's like, seriously, yvonca, and he goes, and I'm not from here, but I had been in the church realm for so long that several people knew me so that they were more accepting to him. But for somebody that walks in the door, that does I'm just being honest that does not have a big checkbook, okay, does not look like what whoever thinks they need to look like. And that's what I struggle with, because I'm like it shouldn't be about what someone looks like and what checkbook they can write. It was interesting when I got here, Do you get me oh?
Speaker 4:yeah, I know, because I had locks when I first moved here.
Speaker 1:Oh, did you yeah.
Speaker 4:I mean they were halfway down my back and I had guys Chris, you might want to cut those locks off. I'm like I had guys I'm that I knew got up in the pulpit and preaching against locks. You know then looking oh not you, Chris.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, you meant me yeah, yeah you like, but but but again, I think the when we can look beyond people's faults and our own faults and you know, and begin to see people from the created in the image of God, that are kingdom built, that are a part of our community, then that changes everything. For me it did, you know, it changes everything. I don't care what you, I don't care what color you are, I don't care what, I don't care what color you are, I don't care what, I don't even care what gender you claim.
Speaker 2:Okay you know, the kingdom is.
Speaker 4:There's a space in the kingdom for you and if we reject, there's a space in the kingdom, in the kingdom for you? If there is, if I read, and if I reject you, if I cut you off, you'll never be able to see you off.
Speaker 3:You'll never be able to see it. He said you'll never be able to see it. I am really enjoying this conversation with Pastor. Battle Tune in next Friday for part two of this powerful, powerful conversation. Bye, guys.
Speaker 1:Thanks for listening to Talkin' Tennessee with Yvonca. Watch out for our weekly episodes from the First Family of Real Estate and check us out on the web wwwyvoncasalesrealestatecom. See our videos on Yvonca's YouTube channel or find us on Facebook under. Yvonca Landis and Twitter at Yvonca Landis. And don't forget to tell a friend about us. Until next time. Yvonca signing off.