Ep. 94: The Secret of Sforza

Welcome back to At Refreshment
In this episode: We interview the Grottoes International M.O.V.P.E.R historian and Masonic influencer Frank Sforza. Get to know this great brother and prophet of the mystic realm. Grab your favorite drink and enjoy the good times in the great episode.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

She's been very, very supportive. My wife is like super supportive in in pretty much everything Freemasonry.

SPEAKER_05 0:06

Well, obviously you didn't find much, but did you find any conflict, or did the church have any conflict with you being a Freemason and attending church?

SPEAKER_07 0:15

I I'd like to add that you're uh explaining how Grano has deep York right ties is probably my favorite paper of yours.

SPEAKER_00 0:21

The views expressed in this presentation are those of the hosts and guests and do not represent the views of any lodge, grand lodge, or anybody, or any other person or person who is away.

SPEAKER_03 0:34

We are back.

SPEAKER_05 0:38

Yeah, um, thank you. You're welcome. I appreciate that. You know, it kind of sucks that we don't get your countdown. Maybe we should just have it anyways for the hell of it. Oh, we can record five, four, three. Big hot Wainsworld, welcome party time. Excellent.

SPEAKER_04 0:54

Woo woo!

SPEAKER_05 0:56

All right, all right, everyone. Welcome to the At Refreshment and Sonic Video Podcast. Once again, I'm your host, Wesley Rooter, and I'm here with uh who do I got today? Oh, sound off, guys. Hi, I'm the Maxa. Villa Park Lodge, worshipable master. Really know how to blow an entrance, don't you? Have a great day, guys.

SPEAKER_02 1:19

Oh, jeez.

SPEAKER_06 1:20

Uh calves, uh, night's attire, window sons. Marty. Marty Quillis, York Ride All Night, baby. Woo!

SPEAKER_05 1:33

And we have a very special guest for you today. You probably recognize him because uh, well, every time I see him on social media, he's always wearing that beautiful feza, his representing the grotto. Let's hear for Frank Zortha. Well, I screwed your name up. Please say it right now. Good afternoon. Good afternoon, Zorba.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

Zoran.

SPEAKER_05 1:57

Uh so Frank, tell us where are you from? Where are you broadcasting from or streaming from the street?

SPEAKER_01 2:03

My name is Frank Sporza. I um I grew up in Lindenhurst, Long Island, New York. I uh currently live in Massapicle Park, Long Island, New York, which is uh just five minutes down the road from where I grew up. I'm a past master of South Shore Long Beach Lodge in Rockville Center, New York, also in Nassau County. I'm uh currently at well, uh South Shore Long Beach Lodge merged into Spartan Lodge 956. I'm also a past master of Limbrook Massapical Lodge 822, also in Rockville Center, New York.

unknown 2:32

Nice.

SPEAKER_05 2:33

Beautiful. Beautiful. He's a he's a Long Islander. I like it, I like it. How long have you been in Mason?

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Just over 10 years. About just uh I think it's 11 years in November. 11 years at Master Mason in November. Oh yeah, this is uh February's 11 years. I just February 12th is 11 years my entered apprentice degree, February 12th. I just I just I missed it. I should have celebrated it. Happy birthday.

SPEAKER_02 2:57

Happy birthday.

SPEAKER_01 2:58

Congratulations, mate. I missed my uh I missed my 12th birthday.

unknown 3:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:02

My 11th birthday, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_05 3:05

Ah, that's alright. A couple more years you'll get the 15-year pen. Or do you do that in New York?

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Yeah, absolutely. Every five years you get a pen.

unknown 3:12

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 3:13

After uh after a while it goes to tens, and then uh guys stop coming around, so then they then they get 25-year aprons and 50 and so on. And then they forget about you.

SPEAKER_05 3:23

Yeah, they come on out for uh$5 pin and expecting a$50 stick, right? Exactly. You deserve it after all these years. We see you on social media a lot. So uh I guess I'm gonna ask because I I don't I you said you were on a couple podcasts. Let's start there. What podcasts have you been on? Oh, let's see.

SPEAKER_06 3:49

I just did what was the name of the one I just did old old-fashioned Masonic podcast we just recorded with them a few weeks back. Um I can't remember all their names. There's a few of them.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

That's alright. Uh fourth part of a circle podcast.

SPEAKER_05 4:11

I don't think I'm familiar with that one. No, I don't know. Okay, there's more.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

They're here on the line and some and some other one. Sound like something or other. I'm sorry, I don't remember. I apologize. Yeah, look at it. You gotta Google it. You gotta Google it. So I think it's on YouTube somewhere. Oh, and Jonathan, uh, what's his name? Uh my buddy Jonathan's got one. I can't. Mild those magic. Mild those magic podcasts. Sorry.

SPEAKER_06 4:33

Sorry, sorry, Jonathan.

SPEAKER_05 4:36

Didn't mean to put you on the spot. Uh, you want to re re-record. Yeah, I would have wrote that down. It would have sounded a little better. So, okay, are you in the grand line for Grotto?

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Oh, well, technically in a way, kinda. I mean, not I'm not in a the elected grand line where the silver tassels. I'm still a purple tassel, so I'm what they call what appointed grand line member. The grand historian is really just a fancy title for the person who's in charge of the grand historian committee, but it's a one-person committee, and it's uh it's a title where they give you almost honorarily, but you make it what it is. Like I made the position what it is, essentially. I, you know, you write, you write three papers a year and they get published. How many people get to write an article in the in the grand uh I'm sorry, the uh Grotto's International Magazine? You know, there's only three people the Grand Monarch, the uh the first lady, and myself. I think that's an honor to be able to do that. So I take it very, very seriously. I also go as much as I can to speak at lodges and uh grotto and wherever they'll have me and talk about grotto, or I'll speak to your Masonic body about some Masonic topic if you ask. I've written over 70 papers on any Masonic subject. I consider myself a bit of a historian because I've done uh a ton of research over the years, yeah, a little bit of a Masonic nerd in that way.

SPEAKER_07 5:59

I'd like to add that you're explaining how Grotto has deep York right ties. It's probably my favorite paper of yours that um I have read, and I'm also looking forward to publishing in the Illinois Grand Chapter newsletter uh when our education committee inevitably drops the ball one month out of paper.

SPEAKER_01 6:18

I um I'm I I love that. I I wish there was more evidence so that we could like really, really kind of like tie up the loose ends on it. I'm going by what W.C. Eaton is saying when he's talking about like grotto being a secret a super secretive order. Like he really wanted grotto to be secret, he wanted us to be almost like the most secret of the fraternal orders in the Masonic world. And he wanted like the Mokana to be the veil of what we were talking about. And say he was making correlations between the Royal Arts degree and like what and our our culture, our grotto culture. Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 7:01

It's a cool paper, and I fully believe in it.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

So I'm sorry, say that again.

SPEAKER_07 7:07

It's just a really cool paper, and I know like most of our topics that are slightly esoteric, we gotta connect the strings ourselves and bring it together. But I really do think everything you presented, even if you learned it from WC Eden, I it's hard for me to say I take it, it's fact, because I know there's some speculation, but I I truly believe in the paper, and I truly believe in what you presented and how Rotto and York Wright should be propping each other.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

100%. If you look at the way uh the Scottish Right and the Shrine kind of teamed up in the in recent years, there's absolutely no reason the York Wright, the way they team up when we look at like when we look at the York Wright College, this is the same exact thing. They could absolutely be teaming up with us and we could take over the world.

SPEAKER_06 7:50

We're wearing the same colors.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

I always say that too. Um, like, yeah, because if you go from regular prophet to monarch to silver tassel to gold, it's basically just the the progression of uh let me Mark, let me interrupt you.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

Um Knight's Templar is black and white large, right? Yeah. Okay, that's silver. Okay. Um red is red. That's large. And purple is cryptic. Sorry. We ran out. And then your gold is your pinnacle of Freemasonry. That's your I've made it to have the highest level of consciousness. I'm the grand.

SPEAKER_06 8:26

Yeah, we're all gold at that point. The grand line.

SPEAKER_05 8:31

Yeah, gold and white gold being the purest, that's how I've always looked at it. You know, it's and white gold is gonna have a silver look, but it's not gonna turn. I mean I break it too far.

SPEAKER_06 8:45

So I think there were secrets.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

I think that I think that like with grotto, there's a lot more that we kind of just look away from than there than more to meets the eye. We we've kind of made it something that it's uh it wasn't. But it's okay. Because we love it and we keep it, and we are uh we're all having a wonderful time with it. But there's more to it. We could celebrate it.

SPEAKER_05 9:04

So historically, what is the first grotto? The first grotto? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 9:10

Druid grotto will be the first one. Druid grotto number one. Where are they? That was in Hamilton, New York. It came out of Hamilton Lodge number 120 in Hamilton, New York. Um, nowhere near me, nowhere near me, all the way up north in uh like western northern New York, almost Canada. And uh, I'm all the way on the line, all the way down south, as far south as you can go. But uh Druid Grotto then became Mokanagrotto. And um, Mark is now a member. Once you become a member of the Grand Line, you are now a member of the once you become a member of the elected grand line, you are a member of Mocana Grotto. So if everything falls apart tomorrow and the Supreme Council, you know, everybody in grotto disappears, and they'll always it'll all fold back into one grotto, Mocana Grotto number one. And then they can just rebuild from there. It's the way it's the way it's set up. It's set up like a an a genius organization. The whole that's what the Supreme Council came out of one grotto, and it can it's designed to fold back into one grotto.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Smart. So, Frank, let's let's um let's go actually go back to um the beginning. What got you into Freemasonry? Oh man.

SPEAKER_01 10:19

Um I've always had an attraction to Freemasonry in a way. It's a it's more of my comes from my spiritual path. I grew up as a Pentecostal Christian and uh grew up in the church, very, very uh involved in my uh my church. I was a Royal Ranger. I had a lot of structure in my life. Royal Rangers is like a Christian scouting organization. Have you guys have that in Chicago?

SPEAKER_05 10:41

I don't know if we have a ranger. We have scouting, but yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:44

Well, okay, it's like a Christian scouting organization. So I was very involved in it. Uh I was and anyway, um I was always seeking more. I kind of like always wanted to delve into the Bible and uh I was always just looking into more things. Um I even looked at becoming a priest at one point. I wanted to go, I was thinking, thinking about going into seminary. And uh things didn't always like go in that exactly that path. Life always changes, goes in different directions. But I um I remember at a young age pointing at a Masonic building, which I now know to be Babylon Lodge in Babylon, New York, while I was at a park and asking my mom what that was at that building. And she just told me it was like, oh, that was another VFW or another uh another like Amvets or another like one of those like fraternal order buildings. And I said, Oh, okay. Like I just took I just took it as anything else. And I didn't really give it another look. I saw the same symbol on the back of one of my older cousin who I looked up to's cars, and I was like, oh, so I asked him about Freemas about what it was. And then I kind of got some information about what Freemasonry was, and it kind of aligned with what I was looking for in my life, kind of a spiritual path without a dogma to my religion. And so um lacking like positive male role models in my life and like needing that spiritual guidance, I kind of thought that Freemasonry would be a good place for me. So the opportunity then presented itself as the universe does it does that's just the way the universe works. So uh my wife and I were maybe married for a couple of years, and I went to a dinner party with uh some of my wife's stepmother's family. And so we're at this round table, and my wife's mother-in-law is getting an award from her temple. And so the guy sitting across from me at this table, this gentleman Lee Pollette, Lee is wearing a square encompass on his collar. And I got perfect opportunity for me to ask a Mason, right? So I ask him, he introduces me. Long story short, that's how I got involved. Check this out. That Lee, that guy, he was the wrong Lee. They invited him to the party, he was the wrong guy. He wasn't supposed to do that. They invited the wrong Lee. It was supposed to be a family friend. They ended up inviting the wrong lee. They invited their neighbor Lee. Can you believe that? So that was that guy was put there by Divine Providence so that I could be the grand historian of Brothers International. You like that?

SPEAKER_05 13:10

I love it.

SPEAKER_01 13:11

Nonetheless, that was funny.

SPEAKER_05 13:12

Now, the question I have for you, uh, Frank, is have you found that spiritual guidance that you were seeking when you first joined?

SPEAKER_01 13:21

Somewhat. Somewhat, absolutely. I would say, um, I would say I definitely had an opportunity to pursue my own religion and to my own, my own, like, my own pace. I learned a lot more about like uh that, you know, as as Pipe would say, as Pipe would be, like when he studied multiple religions, I was able to kind of like go into my own and delve deeper to kind of like what I believe and what I was able to kind of like compare what I believed and what I was being taught over the years to kind of like put my put the own pieces together for myself and see what I want to believe, see what I want to teach my children. That's all.

SPEAKER_05 13:55

Okay. And with your uh how do I word this? Uh so with your faith, you said Pentecostal, right?

SPEAKER_01 14:05

I I was I was Pentecostal. We uh Danielle and I um took the kids to a non-denominational Christian church from when we got married in uh what was that, oh nine till just recently? And we've been going to actually a Episcopalian church for the past year or so. Uh we really like it there. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 14:23

I I'm not uh familiar with either of those sects in Christianity. Did you find any? Well, obviously you didn't find much, but did you find any conflict or did the church have any conflict with you being a Freemason and attending church?

SPEAKER_01 14:39

No, no. Um in the in the non-denominational Christian church, the pastor once told me that I had to be careful with like doing yoga. And so I was like, that's kind of weird.

SPEAKER_05 14:48

You know, was he worried about your spine or your space?

SPEAKER_01 14:51

He was okay with like everything else, but he's like, Oh, well, you're doing the yoga, just don't do the chance. And I was like, um, okay, you know, or I think it would be all right. I think it's gonna be okay. I recently had a nice long discussion with my Episcopalian, the priest, about this, and he tells me the the church has no view, like not like the Catholic Church. They don't have like a it's it's really a church of one, of come one, come all. We're more about people and bringing people into the church and making being a church for the people. And I that really resonated with me, kind of like touch my heart, you know. Good. My wife grew up in the Catholic Church, so we have like a lot to compare and contrast when we're teaching our children and bringing them, making them people of God.

SPEAKER_05 15:33

And when you first joined Freemasonry, were you married? Yes. How did your wife first take it?

SPEAKER_01 15:42

Uh let's see, how did she first take it? She uh how how was that day? I think she I think she liked the idea that I was interested in something and she wanted to get me out of the house a little bit. Um she kind of let she kind of like let me go. Um she's been very, very supportive. My wife is like super supportive in in pretty much everything Freemasonry with me. She goes to a lot of our grotto events. Umne She doesn't like it when like things interrupt with with the family. And I can I don't like it either. But um we do our best to make sure that we uh can take care of the family first. So I I would think that uh I think well on that she didn't have much issue with me getting out of the house. I was pretty much able I didn't miss a meeting for the first like few years.

SPEAKER_05 16:31

I think it took it took me a couple, yeah, it took it took me a couple years to realize like, hey, I I could miss one meeting. It doesn't it doesn't have to be every time. I know that I felt uh lost, I missed that brotherhood when I missed it, but the first meeting I missed, I I I think I was like, I was like, man, I I can't miss. I I gotta go, I gotta go, I gotta go. And my wife's like, why? What's going on? I was like, I you know, I don't I don't really know. It's the same reason I got into Masonies. My wife, we my my buddy Chris has been a Mason a little longer than I have, and he he kept like, hey man, you'd make a great Mason. I'm not gonna push you, you know, but I think it'd be a great idea. And we talked about it one night, and I was like, you know, I I I'm not really, you know, I I don't really have the time. I'm not sure. And we got in the car, and my wife's like, why not? What are you really doing that you're that you're keep skipping out on this? I'm like, I don't I don't have an answer. I don't really have a good answer for that. So I I know um having a supportive wife has been definitely helpful in Freemasonry, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

Yeah, like one of my one of my uh I'll give you a little give you a little secret. I'm writing a I'm writing a paper that's gonna be published one of these days. It's gonna be women in Freemasonry, but like women about like how about they support us in grotto, how they kind of like come around, not so much about Dorot of Mokana and Eastern Star, but about like how our first ladies, about like the the first lady of a certain organization, you know, president's wife, etc.

SPEAKER_06 18:01

etc. Yeah. You're saying, Marty?

SPEAKER_07 18:06

Oh no, it's it's interesting how kind of cats might have nudged you a little bit because Yoshi, who is uh also sometimes on the show, sometimes not on the show, he uh I was trying to get him in and he wouldn't do it, and his wife was pretty much had to give him like, all right, why don't you stop crying and go do something kind of vibe, which i it's just funny. I wonder how many guys were on the uh fringe and a very loving, supportive woman was like, dude, you should go check this out. Because I hear the story you know, I it it's not an uncommon story to hear, and I Frank's wife's amazing, and so I'm glad uh she got him out of the house. We now have Frank and we have the two of them in our amazing Grotto family.

SPEAKER_06 18:44

It's just a really good thing. I can't tell if he's still talking. No, skip it around.

SPEAKER_05 18:55

Yeah, I over overall, overall I think Cass being supportive of my Masonic journey reassures me that when the time comes, like push comes to shove, like I'm not gonna have a moment to like if I if I have to set aside something to support her, like I'm not gonna say like the brothers won't understand. All of the brothers understand. Hey, family comes first, we all have a family, we all have to be there for each other. And sometimes knowing what's going on with the other guys' families also leads to, hey, what's going on? You know, is there something we could help with? Maybe you know they need a night out and they need somebody to babysit. I'd I'd jump in and babysit for G if you know Mark and Amanda needed to get a night out. I'd I'd come uh you know Yeah, I'd I'd come uh you know help Wes with his weed, you know, if I needed to. That's all I'm gonna do.

SPEAKER_06 19:53

But it's just no, I wouldn't.

SPEAKER_05 19:56

Overall, it's just you know, having that brotherhood has meant also like having the families also involved, you know, having another family. Like we have more I have more friends families that I'm closer to within my own family. So like if everyone's getting together, like I look forward to getting together with everybody.

SPEAKER_06 20:17

It's another reason I love grotto.

SPEAKER_05 20:19

Yeah, and it and and growing in grotto has has you know really helped step up that other side of like families all coming together because you get to know everybody's family on the outside.

SPEAKER_01 20:31

Yeah, I mean, I don't know how it is by you, but like even here, uh Grotto is the most family-oriented organization. It's just like our our events, they're just almost all family events. Even our shrine, like the guys come out, and it's all yeah, it's great, the guys come out, but even unless we're having like some kind of a real party, the families aren't there.

SPEAKER_05 20:53

True story. Yeah, I I mean we try and with our blue lodges, we try and get more family events, you know. We do have blue lodges, family events, that's true. Yeah, but like in general, of all the appendant bodies, I think Grotto's the most family forgiving that I've come across. Sorry.

SPEAKER_06 21:10

Yeah, but I yeah, hmm.

SPEAKER_05 21:13

I guess our ladies are we're there so much, it's like, why not start a daughter's a mo Conn? Right? Yeah, that happened too. That did happen. We have a lot of active ladies when we're there for grotto. And it's so funny because you're right, there we do have a lot of blue lodge events, and you see them there too. So it goes around. It it's a it's a good thing. So speaking of which, I was gonna lead me into this next question. Is your wife active in grotto somehow with you?

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Oh yeah. Oh yeah, constantly. She's always with me. She comes to uh every ESGA, she comes to every Supreme Council session. She's been to almost as many as me. And uh she like when we go when we have like a like our local grotto events, she She comes to uh usually she comes to Lia Grotto if we have like a like one of the grotto that are here, like the grotto that I started here on the Larto. She doesn't normally go with me to a zine when I go to the when I go to a zine. Um we've gone to Datum Grotto in Babylon once or twice. Uh we've never gone to New Jersey grottoes together, but but I'm sure she'll travel with me eventually. Certainly when we get into the Grand Line and we start moving around.

SPEAKER_05 22:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

Yeah, doing the travel.

SPEAKER_05 22:26

Do you have do you have plans to get in the Grand Line?

SPEAKER_01 22:28

Oh, yeah, absolutely. In two years I'm gonna be running for the Supreme for the uh cut at the bottom of the line. I'm gonna at the when the Supreme Council session is in Niagara Falls, I'm going to run for Grand Captain of the Guard.

SPEAKER_05 22:38

Any uh any hints uh or tips uh there, Grand Captain of the Guard, Victoria?

SPEAKER_02 22:45

Just travel a lot, and um obviously big actually biggest X factor that nobody like ever really talks about is your lady. She like she can really make or break your your uh your campaign.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

Man, you have no idea. Mark, I'll tell you a story. I don't might you may already know the story. At the last Supreme Council session in Worthington, Ohio, I just came out of the Supreme Council district deputies training session, and I'm standing there, we're having a good time, we're all talking, and I'm waiting to like go to the next thing. And around the corner comes Danielle walking with all of the Supreme Council line ladies, and she's walking with them like she's one of them. And she walks past me like I'm nobody, like I'm nothing. She's just like doesn't even like acknowledge that I exist. And I was just like, what is happening here? I'm like, okay, that's fine. So I think we're gonna be okay on that end. I really do. It's a it's a vision of your future. I think honestly, can I tell you, I'll be honest, I'll be blunt. I'll be blunt. It grotto would not be the first organization where they like Danielle more than me.

SPEAKER_05 23:48

Yep. My family's that way, so I can't.

SPEAKER_01 23:54

Hey. My name is Frank. My name is Frank. Frank means one that tells the truth.

SPEAKER_05 24:01

Hey, there you go. Like Mark said, ladies can't hurt. Only can help you rise to the top. Whether kicking your ass up there or throwing you up there, right? Cream always rises to the top, brother.

SPEAKER_02 24:16

He's so correct.

SPEAKER_05 24:20

Oh, man.

SPEAKER_02 24:22

All right, Frank. So I love an on a moment. Yeah, I I I saw. I saw. I think it's a requirement for grotto. Oh god. I think so. It is. I think it is. So, so going back a little bit, uh, you said, okay, you joined uh Freemasonry. What what got you to the grotto? And secondly, what made you focus like pretty much almost all your energies into the grotto? Because I mean I've seen you in chapter, you know, York right and all that stuff, but it's like it seems like you know, you're really, really like focusing most of your energy for the grotto.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

Well, I'm focusing more most of my energy on the grotto, mostly because like the titles kind of came up with the grotto first, you know. Um, when the the responsibility of being being told you're a Supreme Council district deputy and then like opening a grotto, like these responsibilities came up, somebody had to step up in my area to make this happen. And it kind of just kind of, I wouldn't say like fell on me as more much as it fell into my lap, and I decided to pick take the ball and run with it, you know?

SPEAKER_05 25:19

It it gravitated towards you.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

Yeah, yeah. We needed somebody on Long Island to kind of like bring grotto back to Long Island, and I was more than willing to be that guy. I had the energy, I had the, you know, I was I had the energy and the time. There was uh there was an opportunity to be a um what they call an assistant and grand lecturer here on Long Island, which is a blue lodge role where you're in charge of the ritual. And um there was uh two years ago they decided to go with me and one other candidate, and they chose the other candidate. And so um it that was right around the same time where things were kind of like picking up with grotto, and I was like, okay, well, like if that's not the case, I'm gonna go in this direction. And so this is kind of the way I just kind of took the ball and ran with it with the grand historian title. And I said, okay, we're gonna make grotto. We're gonna do this. You know, I wanna, I wanna expand in New Jersey. I want to make sure that we get our face out there. And I'm not just the guy who wants to keep opening new grottos. I wanna, I don't wanna just open new grottos. I do want to open new grottos, but I also wanna recognize where an opportunity is to see where old grottos are that can be re-established. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There are grottos in city town in cities or small towns where like lodges are now established, where grottos used to be. We have a whole list of them, hundreds of grottos that used to be, where lodges have now been re-established that that grotto could revisit. One perfect example is is Annar Grotto in Auburn. I was there just a few months ago. That's just one example. There's so many in New York and New Jersey we could touch.

SPEAKER_06 26:54

I like it. Did I answer your question? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:58

Well, actually, the first one is more than your question, Ma. Yeah, the first, first, first, the first one.

SPEAKER_01 27:03

What what what made you join the grotto? Yeah, I'm so sorry. I apologize for that. No, you're good. You're good. You're good. The guys from South Show Long Beach Lodge, my mother lodge, uh, Bill Fode, some other great guys who are at like part of our grotto now, they kind of like invited me down to like something that felt like a really cool party, uh, like at a scene. And so like uh when I went down there, I was like, oh, this is great. This was like a really good time. It was at the it was at the Grand Lodge in in New York City, and I was like rubbing elbows with like Grandmaster, and it just felt like a really good time. And um they asked me if I wanted to join, and I said, you know, I think I will join, I think I will. So I filled out a petition and um they kind of put me right in and they gave me a fez like that night. Um and I was in. They kind of like went off to the races after that. I just I didn't miss a meeting with the Zeeem. And then one day Victor Mann asked me if I would open a grotto on um on the Laura. And I said, uh yeah, I think I think that's something I could do. I put together the Avengers and uh created a grotto on the Laura.

SPEAKER_05 28:01

Can't say no to Victor Mann, right?

SPEAKER_01 28:03

I do not say no to Victor Manner.

SPEAKER_05 28:07

So um Marty just texted. I he's having a problem with his phone. Uh so I'm doing bad. Sorry about that. He for whatever reason his phone keeps overheating.

SPEAKER_01 28:16

I don't really understand what you're saying. Not not nearly as close as you guys. You guys sound all clear. Yeah, he was like all mumbled.

SPEAKER_05 28:21

Yeah, Marty's been having issues either with signal or with uh his phone overheating. It just we're trying to work it out, but yeah. So I I apologize to you and the audience. This isn't the first time that he's dropped off uh like that, but unfortunately, there's nothing we can do if things are just gonna keep crashing on his end. So uh well, we'll just keep going. And uh that's that.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

Hey, if you want to have me on again someday, please just let me know. I'd love to be on to hang out.

SPEAKER_05 28:49

I think having you on when you're running for grand captain of the guard would be great. Absolutely. Oh, yeah, we'll definitely have you back for that. But okay, you were talking about we had it from Mark. I guess we could all say that.

SPEAKER_01 28:59

There is like a I could talk about a lot of things. I have like you know, this is a lot to talk about.

SPEAKER_05 29:04

No, no, no, we're we're we're not done yet. So you said that you you want to work on establishing grottos that already exist. So in your opinion, if a grotto is gonna start, why should they start? Okay.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

So I think that grottos fit a need in a district or a certain like area that possibly it doesn't can't be given that a blue lodge might not give that function, or a certain Masonic area might not give that function. In in a certain case, maybe a lodge doesn't have like the uh the opportunity to have um I don't know, some kind of a unit that might that a group some group of guys might want. And Grotto may be the perfect opportunity for them to have that function, such as I don't know, a pool group or a clown unit or uh any anything. And literally grotto is that that incredible body that can almost do anything, and uh just a wonderful opportunity for fun and fellowship. You know, you can't really just bypass that. It's just there's really nothing like it.

SPEAKER_05 30:09

And uh, well, I don't know how things are over there, but here some grottos meet in restaurants, not just in a lodge. Oh, yeah. Would you prefer that lodge to go or that grotto to go to lodge or try a different environment?

SPEAKER_01 30:26

I love the idea that grottos have um essentially meetings slash events every month, according to their bylaws of crawl, of course. And let's say they're meeting in a in a restaurant that month. I would rather you not even like worry about doing an opening and closing and just have your great event that month and just have it be that event. Get on social media, blast it out there, get people out there, get them invited, have your event, and just have that be the event that month. And just in your minutes, that's your event was there, and that that'd be taken care of. That's what I'd rather you have done instead of worried about you going through some ritual for some reason, just so you could say you did it. My opinion.

SPEAKER_02 31:07

No, I mean it goes pretty much on the you know, on the fellowship part of of grotto, you know, and it's something, as you said earlier, where it it really fills in what sometimes Blue Lodge lacks.

SPEAKER_01 31:19

That's it. That's it, and that's how it started, honestly. That's the that that goes back to the actual founding. The actual founding and the reason for grotto was that blue lodge is supposed to be serious, it's supposed to be solemn, it's supposed to be a place of symbolic reflection and spirituality where men can meet on the level and just be there in the presence of God and honestly go through those three beautiful degrees and just you know, come on. This it's Freemasonry. It's a it's a powerful, powerful spiritual path. And Gorado is a fun fellowship organization. We're doing something a little bit different. So I just think that's what they're doing something different. This is a place where we're gonna be out there. We wanna be able to be able to out there and express ourselves and be able to have a good time and fun and frolic and fellowship and be with each other and play practical jokes and that drink a beer and get crazy, get wild.

SPEAKER_05 32:15

You know, put some context to it.

SPEAKER_01 32:17

My shirt off.

SPEAKER_05 32:18

You mentioned drinking a beer. Have you ever had Molort? Say it again. Have you ever had Molort? I don't think I have. You know what? Come out to Chicago, we'll get you some. Yeah, you guys should have pulled me out.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

You guys should have pulled me out for the podcast. We don't have to worry about the microphone.

unknown 32:32

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_05 32:34

Yeah, I uh my couch doesn't hold that much change because well, I don't have a couch.

SPEAKER_06 32:40

I should have just flew out. I should have just surprised you.

SPEAKER_05 32:43

Oh, uh yeah, we need uh well. If you want to do that, you're more than uh we uh we can set up the in-person uh scenery and everything, regular podcast, the original way. So yeah, we can we can always do that. Um it just depends on who's available. So we got like a big storm over here. Snow's coming down.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Snow?

SPEAKER_05 33:12

You got snow right now?

SPEAKER_01 33:13

Yeah, a lot of snow. We got like a blizzard coming through.

SPEAKER_05 33:16

Oh geez.

SPEAKER_01 33:18

We got like a light dusting.

SPEAKER_05 33:20

Yeah, have fun with that.

SPEAKER_01 33:21

Yeah, we got like two feet of snow coming through. No, no, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 33:24

We had a like an inch or two.

SPEAKER_01 33:26

Robert, Robert Blaze, Robert Blaze is uh his weather. Came over here.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

Yeah, I was gonna say send it back up to uh to Glacy.

SPEAKER_06 33:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 33:36

So oh I forgot what I was gonna do. I don't know. It was like no, never mind. What else you got for me? So what do you do as a historian? Is it just the papers or is it just giving uh historical lectures? What is expected out of you from Grotto's International? Not much.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

Not much. Grotto's International, honestly, they don't expect anything from me. They they asked me to do three papers a year and put three papers a year into the Grotto's International magazine. That's it. The rest of the role is something that I entirely made up. Go to go to lodges, talk about grotto, go to any Masonic body, talk about grotto, write papers, go online. I try to like, I try to find items on eBay and I try to like uh like you know look up the history on them, and if I can I'll return them to either the family or the lodge or the or the grotto that they come from. I I try to do my best with that. I just uh I just went up to Anar. I just went up to to Auburn and I brought back the Anar Grotto banner that I had gotten on Etsy, and I bought it on Etsy like a couple years back, and I posted it on Facebook. No one saw it, and I posted it again as a memory. And then a guy from that area like calls me and I'm like, yeah, absolutely. I'll come up. And we're in the same like Grand Lodge committee, the Ritual Renaissance Committee. And so uh I came up and I gave a lecture at his council, and now they're interested in restarting their grotto. Like if they're restarting their grotto in that area, it's been closed for 60 years, you know? That was so cool. And I was able to I was able to contact Michaela at the uh at the office to get their old bylaws so they have an example of what to go by. It's kind of uh it's a really interesting.

SPEAKER_02 35:18

Nice. So you're the person that I fight with when I uh start bidding on stuff.

SPEAKER_01 35:23

It's fun, it's always you. It's always you. I know I try not to do that anymore. I try not to like when I see people bidding, I try to like I when and it goes back and forth, I try to like let it go now because I don't want to like run the prices up on these things for no reason. If someone really wants something, I let it go. I have so much stuff. If you show my basement, you'd be like, this is insane. We have enough to do a broader museum.

SPEAKER_02 35:43

Yeah, I have hold on. One, two, three, four, five. I think I have seven fezes um that are not mine. So yeah, yeah. I I know about I know we're getting about.

SPEAKER_05 35:59

Hey, Frank, it sounds like the grand captain of the guard wants to donate back to uh the Grotto's International.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

Well, I mean, it could go there. Mark, I'm sure Mark's been there at the at the office. They have like endless, endless uh of like artifacts.

SPEAKER_02 36:17

Actually, surprisingly, I haven't been there. Uh my first time Yeah, my first time will be our Bog meeting in April. So I'm actually excited to see.

SPEAKER_01 36:25

Well, they got great stuff, apparently. I I haven't been there, but I've heard, and I can't wait to get there myself.

SPEAKER_02 36:32

Yeah, I'll be sure to take pictures, do a live stream. Nice.

SPEAKER_06 36:35

I got that in my truck. I have that my I have that sticker in my truck.

SPEAKER_05 36:40

I love it. So do you as a historian for for Grotto and you being in New York, do you do anything with uh the Grand Lodge of New York historically as the historian or otherwise?

SPEAKER_01 36:51

I am I am the historian of my Blue Lodge, uh Spartan Lodge 956, and uh all I'm responsible for with that lodge is um there's like a bunch of displays in our lobby that have to be refreshed from time to time. And I just do that. That's really all my responsibility is we just kind of like manage that out of our attic, and uh that's really all I'm responsible for is the historian of the lodge. I had given a bunch of lectures at the lodge. In like in that lodge in particular, I'm kind of more of a ritual director than I am in historian, but my title is historian.

SPEAKER_05 37:21

A lodge historian might introduce that development.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

So they had they had to give me something to do, you know. You couldn't just be a Tyler? Well, I'd want to be outside the lodge. And there's already a Tyler, you know. There's already a title of this guy, Barry. He like kind of tiles for us. He's like the Tyler Tyler, he's like been there forever, you know?

SPEAKER_05 37:40

And so you see the guy on Facebook that does all those swords and all that other stuff. Oh, I don't know, maybe. Oh, that's from um St. Paul Lodge 500 in Springfield. Is that who you're talking about? Yeah. Different guy. Yeah. Okay. Um yeah, he does swords. He does like different swords every time he does it. He just takes videos of him with like different swords tiling. Oh, that's fun. I think he did a he did a lightsaber one time.

SPEAKER_01 38:05

My favorite, my favorite piece is my like my grotto sword. It took me so long to get a grotto sword. Grotto sword. Oh, you never saw it?

unknown 38:12

No.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

Yeah, go get it.

SPEAKER_05 38:18

We got time. Get it. We got plenty of time. All right, now that he's gone. At least he's wearing pants. So hey. I I I I my foot hurts so bad, guys. Take a pill. I just did. Oh have a have a beer with it.

SPEAKER_02 38:36

So it's not gout.

SPEAKER_05 38:38

Fuck those warrants. They don't mean shit. That's not gout. No, but uh, you know, I I'm already going to Texas Roadhouse for the mother-in-law's birthday tonight.

SPEAKER_06 38:46

Ooh.

SPEAKER_05 38:48

So red meats. Yeah, they said it's not presenting as gout, so they're not convinced it is gout. Red meat is not gonna give you gout. I've been eating it straight for two years. Oh, here we go. Here we go. Oh, here we go.

SPEAKER_01 39:01

I'll brush it this out. So this is a grotto sword.

SPEAKER_05 39:04

Dude, look at the excitement on his face. I love it.

SPEAKER_01 39:07

No, you have no idea.

SPEAKER_06 39:08

Dude, I'd be excited too. This is incredible.

SPEAKER_05 39:10

Oh stop pinning yourself. Frank, say something. Oh, wow. Oh, now you that's clean. Can you see this? Can you see the number? I'm trying to fix the layout. Hold on a second. What happened? I think you pinned the wrong person. It's number uh, what do you call that?

SPEAKER_06 39:34

Number six? Number six. Yeah, number six. I think you can see over here. It has the matching sheath. Number six. Oh, you can't even see it.

SPEAKER_01 39:48

You can almost see it. So, like, I have the matching sword and sheath. A lot of times they got mixed up. You know, there's only so many grottos that had these. But these were ceremonial swords that these guys where they were marching their parades. Shriners had the same sword, but with a Shriner logo, so obviously three million shriners versus ten, thousand grotto. There's uh quite a few more of the Shriner swords than these. But I got mine.

SPEAKER_06 40:16

And this one is in incredible condition.

SPEAKER_05 40:18

How much did that cost you?

SPEAKER_01 40:20

Um, I think I spent$100 or so. A little over$100 on the on eBay, on the uh on the on the uh I forget exactly how much of it.

SPEAKER_06 40:30

Mark's over here like, he spent how much?

SPEAKER_05 40:34

It wasn't a lot. That's right. Speaking of Mark, I found my old Masonic license plates today. Oh yeah. I'm like, where where were they? Where the hell did they go? No, well, I've got two of them. Mark, do you want one? Frank, have you ever seen Mark's license plate collection? I have, yes. It is immense. Yeah, mine are 6134.

SPEAKER_02 41:02

Actually, let me get one that actually could um that it's kind of related to Frank, so let me be back on one second.

SPEAKER_05 41:09

Uh-oh. So, Frank, how long have you been the historian?

SPEAKER_01 41:13

Uh, since 2023.

SPEAKER_05 41:16

Okay, and are you are you were did you create that position or was that created for you? So that was already there.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

The immediate grand historian is Mark McCombs, past grand monarch Mark McCombs.

SPEAKER_06 41:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

And he was doing it for 15 years.

SPEAKER_06 41:28

Before him, it was uh Bernie Schwartz.

unknown 41:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 41:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 41:37

Is there anything you learn as a historian that really surprised you about grotto?

SPEAKER_01 41:43

No. Okay. No. No, I'm sorry. Like, honestly, it was it's like you you learn as you go. You don't you don't get like handed a book of secrets. You know, it's it's not it's not I everybody, you know, people will people will send me messages and they'll say, Oh, Frank, you're the grand historian. And then I'll be right back.

SPEAKER_05 41:59

I mean, like uh like hi history-wise, not secret-wise, I'm sorry. Just like within the history of the grotto, like, oh, I didn't know that. That's surprising. They like kind of like that.

SPEAKER_01 42:09

I mean, you know, you got great stories of like the pres like you know, you know, they get the the presidents, you know, kind of like which presidents and which grottos they were from, and the stories of were they active, were they actually who actually wore a fez, who was a part of their grotto. That's kind of cool. But, you know, besides that, there's really nothing too nothing really like came out of me. I I love seeing like the parades and you see thousands of members. There is one really impressive uh factor that I can tell you about before like transportation. Um, that was really cool. Like you remember these Supreme Council sessions, and they've been happening annually for many, many years, obviously. You know, uh we're we're we're we're a little organization, right? So now think about this. Not everybody had a car, right? Right? Right. We we traveled differently years ago. Everybody traveled by train. So years ago, um people traveled by train, and so like this the session will be in one location, and your gr the grottos would be in different cities, and the train would pull up to the station, and it would stop, and it would pick everybody up, and it was like a party in that station. Oh wow. It'll be a party, you'd be picking up the next grotto. Do you understand? You'd be fighting, you'd be picking up the next Shoopa guys.

SPEAKER_05 43:21

You're picking up picking up the next next participants in this party. Let's go. Keep it going.

SPEAKER_01 43:25

So you would be like and it was almost like you were touring a bat portion of the country on your way to this incredible event. So I just kind of I kind of put myself in those in that picture. And I have um, I do have one, I'll I'll bring it to the next Supreme Council session so you guys can check it out. I do have one catalog that they they did uh they they had pictures from where they took pictures of each stop. But really, like just to be back in those days when they had that. It's just so incredible. I wish I could be back then with those with those uh those that experience.

SPEAKER_06 44:00

No cell phones.

SPEAKER_01 44:05

No, no, uh, no Facebook Supreme Council group chat letting everybody know where's dinner.

SPEAKER_05 44:11

No air freshman group chat of degeneracy.

SPEAKER_02 44:16

Yeah. All right. So so back to back to license plates here. So I'm um a part of the Automobile License Plate Collectors Association. And they have like little subgroups, kind of like the Grotto Associations, you know, like Midwest, um, Illinois State, blah, blah, blah. Uh so there's Mid-American, uh, Silver State, which is like Nevada, Rocky Mountain, Arizona, blah, blah, blah. And every place has like sometimes like do the special ones. So there's a Long Island region. So I actually have this one. Massapequa. Oh, nice. Oh, get out of here. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. So they had it, they had it uh last year in um, I guess in your hometown.

SPEAKER_05 44:59

Well, and they just uh they'll they'll put your whatever you want on it right there.

SPEAKER_02 45:04

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So just mine, my it's just obviously my initials and my my lucky number.

SPEAKER_06 45:09

Nice, very nice.

SPEAKER_02 45:10

Yeah. Cool. Cool. So um actually, uh Frank, I remember actually seeing something where it was the grand um grand alchemist. Do you know anything about that? Uh so the grand alchemist is like the junior ward.

SPEAKER_01 45:30

The uh the guy bartender responsible for like making sure that like refreshment was taken care of for the group uh for the people's getting the uh everybody ready, getting uh the refreshments were prepared.

SPEAKER_05 45:44

The the bartender. An apothecary, basically.

SPEAKER_01 45:47

Making sure an apothecary were well taken care of.

SPEAKER_02 45:50

I love it. So that's all it is. It's just the rename of um master of not master of some I can't even think of um who would be our um I don't know the equivalent, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_05 46:02

That would be I believe the master of ceremony. Yeah, yeah, master of ceremony. Yeah, yeah. Or the grand orator, but we don't use a grand orator. No, no, no. They mean the grand orator existed.

SPEAKER_02 46:12

Originally, no, I mean we we started the master of ceremonies. Well, I'd say grand orator, at least for um for during Supreme, he actually kind of stands up into the podium when um when the Grand Monarch's receiving his gifts. So I think that's when I actually really see him do be Grand Orator.

SPEAKER_05 46:32

Okay. Yeah, I don't recall if our Grand Lodge has won. I know I was Pat Robbins back in what year was that? Twenty? Shit.

SPEAKER_02 46:42

Uh I think twenty-one, actually. That's when I for when I first started uh becoming a district deputy.

SPEAKER_05 46:47

I'll take your word for it. Getting a freshman, essentially. I have not I have not been in a grand line or grand institution yet. I'm I'm a simple, humble, worshipful master of a lodge. Oh, wait till Marty. Wait till Marty gets in.

SPEAKER_01 47:06

Essentially, that's probably the best position in Masonry as worshipful master. It's kind of just to stay there and just kind of like enjoy that.

SPEAKER_05 47:13

I've been enjoying it. We we've got a lot of good good plans for the year. That's that's that's all I care is that I leave the gr I leave the unit or my lodge better than I got it. And then, you know, we can just thrive and succeed and keep going. You know, if we can get some new guys and we can push them towards grotto crew, you know.

SPEAKER_01 47:34

So what year did you say you were gonna run, Frank? It would be 2028.

SPEAKER_05 47:40

2028.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

Niagara Falls.

SPEAKER_05 47:42

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 47:43

So next year is um Houston, Texas. The year after that is Niagara Falls.

SPEAKER_05 47:48

Okay. All right. Yeah. It's been a while since I've been to Niagara Falls. I think it was on the Canadian side. It'll be on the New York side. Yeah. Well, yeah, I kind of figured out. That's pretty cool. I don't know. I hear the Canadian side's better. Hey, whatever. Well, I well, I don't know. See, when I went, I was sober. So, well, might be a little different this time.

SPEAKER_01 48:13

You just gotta bring your uh your driver's license and you can make it right across the border, no problem. Yeah, the uh the real one, they have like something called a real driver's license. Yeah, real idea. Yeah, if you if you have that, they'll just kind of like let you pass. They just check you out.

SPEAKER_05 48:30

Okay. That's not that bad. It's not a bad bad. It has to inner and outer passwords, though.

SPEAKER_01 48:36

So when you run you just let them know you know the grand alchemist.

SPEAKER_02 48:41

Yeah. Yeah. I want to revive that actually for my year. I'm gonna appoint somebody as a grand alchemist. Great idea. You should absolutely do that. That's a wonderful idea.

SPEAKER_05 48:50

That's a great idea, yeah. I agree. Uh so when you run for grand captain of the guard, do you have to give up the grand historian title? Yeah. When you run, not when you're running. I'm Supreme Castro Deputy. So just running or winning? No, running. Running. Oh wow. Oh wow. Okay, okay.

unknown 49:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 49:09

So you're going all in on it, man.

SPEAKER_01 49:11

If you support it, if you uh you can't just say, you can't just say, okay, if I uh if I I'm I'm giving this up, like hire me if I lose, you know. Well, uh question is.

SPEAKER_05 49:23

Yeah, grand historian it is not an elected, it's not an elected position.

SPEAKER_01 49:28

That's what's that's what I was saying. I'm gonna I'm an appointed member of the grand line. It's like a I'm like the bottom of the barrel of the grand line. I'm an appointed member.

SPEAKER_05 49:36

Gotcha. So is there like a uh like a grand historian book of all the things you did? Kind of like in Game of Thrones when they're going through all the nights, like, oh, the grand historian book. Yeah, my Facebook page. There, there you go. There you go.

SPEAKER_01 49:52

No, that's not. That's actually a great idea. I probably should have done something like that. It's actually a wonderful idea. I did not do that, no.

unknown 49:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 49:59

I mean, yeah. You still got time.

SPEAKER_01 50:01

Yeah, kind of like I could do something like that. But I have not.

SPEAKER_05 50:08

No, you're right.

SPEAKER_01 50:09

That's actually a great idea. I really should have kept some kind of a record. I mean, there's a uh but uh well, I don't want to say.

SPEAKER_05 50:14

He shall be known as Sir Frank the Dapper.

unknown 50:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 50:18

I I don't want to say the Bible's worn out, but at least us signing a Bible for everything we do, they kind of get mixed up. Yeah. You know, in the bunch. Oh, it another bot you see so many of them, and no one really looks at them. They're just well, Mark, you're doing something kind of similar. You're doing the memoirs of the grand uh captain of the guard.

SPEAKER_02 50:38

Yeah, yeah. So there's there's two books I'm keeping. Uh one is for me, for my put myself, just kind of writing notes of what I'm what I need to focus on, what I need to like, you know, tips and tricks as I, you know, um get up on the line. And then what I actually want to do, I have a second book where it's basically like, yeah, what what Eric said is like kind of like memoirs from like the grand captain of the guard, where I say, okay, this is these are the tips and tricks that worked for me. And um, you know, I'm gonna pass it down to um whoever wins next year, and then hopefully, you know, it kind of goes progressive. So it's like, um, so who's ever the next grand captain of the guard can actually see the notes and just see, okay, um, this worked for Mark, but not for blah, blah, blah, and and vice versa. So, you know, it's something like uh, you know, because like when I ran, it was like more on like the mentorship program. So it's like, okay, any and all knowledge that I can pass on to um to my successor and you know, and and beyond, um, I I do it. I'd I you know, I do it in a heartbeat. I love that.

SPEAKER_01 51:40

Yeah, I love that because I can use all the all the tips I could get for sure. Like the same thing with the when it comes to ESGA with the same exact thing. Like um, we you join the line, the bottom of the line, four years later, you're the president of the association, you're like, how do I put a convention together? How do I do this? How do I do that? You know, you got 12 grottos, you got to visit it. There's a lot going on. How do you organize all that?

SPEAKER_05 52:01

I think he's got something. I think it's a great idea. Mark? I think it'd be good. I think it could be applicable for anybody too. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 52:09

No, it can be. I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, even just being a worshipful, you know, that's that, you know, that that takes a lot. Oh, these Masonic skills are all interchangeable.

SPEAKER_01 52:17

We the uh well just last week, the shrine. The secretary's run the brother show, man. The shrine just had a whole um like a podcast, not necessarily a podcast, it was like a it was like a pod show. You gotta kind of like log in to watch it. And they were teaching all these different skills. I forget what it was called. It was like a training session. Uh it was like a leadership seminar training session. And I was like, all of these skills can translate to literally every Masonic body. And I was like, this is like gold. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 52:44

Well, they were called Boad Map to the East here. You put it together like a cooking recipe. You start with A, A1, A2, you put that together, let it simmer, do whatever it's gonna do, and then you move on to the next thing. I mean, that's right up your alley with cooking.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

Oh, yeah, yeah, definitely. Well, I mean, I mean, it's more baking. Kind of a little bit of both. I mean, I love to cook, so obviously more mine's more of just like, uh, let me just kind of go with uh whatever, um, whatever looks good, feels good, and then uh whatever my you know my ancestors say stop, don't add more.

SPEAKER_05 53:16

I was gonna say Mark just seasons with his ancestors saying, hey, you would not put enough yet. Yeah, seriously. Enough more garlic. We need more garlic. So Frank, where do your Masonic and grotto travels lead you? Like, where all over the country if you travel all over the country.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

Come on, you can't everywhere, man.

SPEAKER_05 53:35

Let's hear about it.

SPEAKER_01 53:36

Where do you want me to start? I've been everywhere. I've been everywhere.

SPEAKER_05 53:39

Wherever you'd like.

SPEAKER_01 53:40

I want to hear about it. We've been everywhere, man. We've been everywhere.

SPEAKER_06 53:44

We've been to uh Worthington, we've been to like um New Orleans, New Orleans, Florida, we've been like Massachusetts, Connecticut, all over New Jersey, um Maryland, uh come on, all over Pennsylvania, Ohio, obviously, all over Ohio, a couple different places in Ohio.

SPEAKER_05 54:12

There you go. Okay. So which is leading me to my next question. Do you think those travels would be the same without Freemasonry?

SPEAKER_06 54:23

No. No, of course not.

SPEAKER_05 54:27

That's the experience I want to hear. That's the experience I want to hear to share to you.

SPEAKER_01 54:32

No, I wouldn't be nearly as cool, man. Come on. I wouldn't have like like I'm not I'm not a fun guy if I don't have my Masonic. Look, look, without my fez, look, hook. I'm just a regular guy. Look at me. I'm just a regular guy. Now you put the fez on. Now it's a party. You see what I'm saying? Like this is probably important. This is the party. Like now you got like a without Freemasonry, I'm just a regular guy, you know? Like I have all this all this fun knowledge and all this uh great things to talk about and a fraternity and a party, you know? Like uh without Freemasonry, I'm just an old wrestler. I'm uh I'm I'm punchy, you know, I'm half-deaf.

SPEAKER_02 55:07

What what does it mean to you when uh grottos call you and say, hey, I need you to help install our grotto?

SPEAKER_01 55:14

Oh, I love that, bro. I love it. I love it. I feel like uh I feel wanted, I feel needed, I feel um, I feel like a sense of uh pride in that, you know. I got to install three grottos so far this year, and it was it should have been five. I messed up. I shouldn't say I messed up, winter, you know, the winter's rough. Like going from Long Island to Buffalo, going from Long Island to Rochester with the snow. Just sometimes it doesn't work out. But um I almost installed five grottos this year, it was supposed to be, but I got three.

SPEAKER_05 55:41

Not bad. Marty, you or Mark, you've only installed uh one grotto?

SPEAKER_02 55:47

No, uh three. Oh no. Okay, I can remember now. No, um Lionight was my first, and then Chicago Grotto Weekend, Maru, and then Eliabad.

SPEAKER_01 55:56

I was so jealous you guys had being like right there. There's everything being in Chicago last week. That was awesome.

SPEAKER_05 56:03

I should have gone up. Oh, with the uh uh Grandmas Conference Grandmasters?

SPEAKER_01 56:09

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:10

Did you guys meet my grandmaster Steve? Steve Rubin? Um maybe maybe um Texas Marty did. Uh but I I I I saw him.

SPEAKER_01 56:22

He's like the president of organization and he's like the Grandmaster New York, Steve Rubin. You know, no, no, no. I think I I did. Uh yeah, yeah, I did.

SPEAKER_02 56:30

Um I actually saw him speaking well too.

SPEAKER_01 56:31

Live grotto gave him a fez a few years back. He's uh he's a great guy. Really, really good guy.

SPEAKER_02 56:37

Nice. Yeah, we actually that that conference was gold for grotto, basically. Like we um we laid some inroads to um to open more new grottos. Let's go. Uh get get some grotto tables. Like I guess like Pennsylvania has like a very like tight restrictions on what they can do during their Grand Lodge, but uh we worked it out to get get um you know uh a table out there. And um yeah, so I mean like we we really laid some um inroads to open up grotto more yeah unsheathe your sword mark. Yeah yeah yeah so no no it was it was it was good it was good and uh the one thing actually uh Wes I'll I'll send it to you is during the presentation when um Marty talked about Grotto and just like what we did and how special we are we actually stood up in front um of the podium where we were actually all within our green jackets and our fezzes so it was like a very striking um you know thing to see you know the grand Grand Line officers just um you know supporting um supporting being there and being supportive of um of the Grotto.

SPEAKER_06 57:44

I um I hope everybody recognizes me in a green jacket.

SPEAKER_05 57:48

Oh yeah, you look just like your all your Facebook posts. So I'll recognize you right away. Okay. So uh do you would you consider yourself an influencer for Free Made or Grotto?

SPEAKER_01 58:02

Maybe maybe that's funny. I never said no, I I never said that, but no, that's cool. Maybe an influencer Do you know who I am? I don't pay for it. I like that. I'm a sonic influencer. I have not used that term, but I do like that.

SPEAKER_05 58:16

Well, uh well, we're we're having an episode come out tomorrow or uh whenever it comes out. And I asked the guys from Time for Fellowship, you know, do you feel like uh I guess they're an influencer? And in a way, I guess we are. No, I think you are. I I think you certainly are.

SPEAKER_01 58:31

Anybody, any podcasters are Masonic podcasters.

SPEAKER_05 58:34

Just trying to get the word of Freemasonry out. Hey, we're having a good time. Check this out, you might like it as well.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

You're the basic the international public eye. So I'm not gonna say guys like me, like who are who are on Facebook and have like or who are on the various social platforms on on a public scale that has like a lot of followers or whatever, like we're the same thing. We're that public face of Freemasonry.

SPEAKER_05 58:57

He's got a point, Wes. We are really big in the Pacific Southwest. Oh yeah? Uh, where was at the uh not Uganda? Uh Fiji? Was it Fiji?

SPEAKER_02 59:05

I think it was Fiji.

SPEAKER_05 59:06

Oceana. Oceana, yeah. That's where it was.

SPEAKER_01 59:10

So I'm sure you'll get uh I'm sure you'll get a bunch of New York fans from having uh me on sooner or later.

SPEAKER_05 59:16

Um yeah, yeah. I would be great. It's still growing. That's a and it's beautiful to see that we're still getting new uh new subs. Yeah, we are. Um it's you know, we're up to we're up to what like a thousand on YouTube? Uh something like that. Now we're at well as of this recording, 1810. Wow. Uh which if you think about it, that's that's like a fifth of the grotto.

SPEAKER_01 59:40

I'm a little jealous of you guys, honestly. I I love the idea of podcasting. I wish I was like more fun. I would I would run out of things to say.

SPEAKER_05 59:47

Hey, uh that that's no you wouldn't. No, I think you would, but you really don't.

SPEAKER_02 59:53

One of the videos that we did that's actually selling the hopper is things we found on the on Reddit. Oh like free Freemasonry posts. Yeah, we're gonna be coming out with the Reddit files. Oh no, we already did. We already talked about you.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:08

Frank's pause. The the Reddit files takes out the sword on Reddit.

unknown 1:00:15

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:16

We're we're also I'm gonna be putting together, if you're interested, if you want to do podcasting, uh because I know again, I don't expect everyone on the show to yeah, no, no, no, no, not that one. I don't expect everyone to do it, but if you're interested in doing Masonic video reviews, uh I'll send you links. Oh, for real? Okay, cool. Yeah, yeah. You said um Sundays are good for you, right? Yeah, I would love to do that. That'd be right. Absolutely. Okay. Yeah, because I'm gonna I'm getting a bunch of guys together from other podcasts, getting their ideas like, hey, I'm gonna throw this on and let's get pissed off and drink. Yell at these guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:54

I you know, I'm I'm willing to speak my mind. Sometimes, you know, some guys like it, some guys don't know, whatever.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:01

As long as it's all as long as you're not on the podcast called Milk and Cigarettes, you're fine. Yeah, we talked about that. Uh no, well, we joked about it on the um on the last one. What was um the Road Prophets? The carcass, the carcass. Yeah, the Road Prophets. Just uh talking about whatever, whatever we want and just call it milk and cigarettes. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:29

Yeah, something something where we like talk about whatever, but not Masonic related.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:33

Yeah, it can't be.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:34

It can't be because our mouths were just uh Yeah, I don't want to deal with any of the blowback from that.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:40

I don't know. Road Profits was a good episode. I enjoyed that one.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:44

It was fun.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:45

Gonna have to get somebody else to pick everyone up so we can go drinking and driving. I love that. We did not drink and drive. Okay, we pulled over for a little bit. I said so we can. I didn't say so we can do it again. I was drinking lemonade. What did you think was in that lemonade? Selective wording. Selective wording.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:06

All right, so so Frank, um let's hear your elevator speech for a brother who's not a prophet that you want to sell grotto to.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:14

Okay, a brother is not a prophet, and I want to sell him grotto. Okay. Well, I would start off by explaining to him about what grotto is. So grotto is a grotto is a social order where we put fun and the fellowship first. And I tell him about our charity. I say, our charity is the humanitarian foundation, where we provide dental work for children with special needs. It's sort of like a gap insurance. Sometimes your your uh your um insurance won't cover certain procedures where insurance simply won't cover it. So sort of like uh sedation or anything that might just not be covered. The Grouse International Humanitarian Foundation steps in and picks up the check on that. It's just a one-full organization. We support them through the sale of enchanted lanterns, they're they're$50, and we that's our charity. But we're not, we're different than other organizations. We're a fraternity that has charity. We are fun and fellowship. Gorados International is Grott, Mystic Order, Veil, Prophecy of the Enchanted Realm. This is an organization based on fun and fellowship. We're gonna get together and we're gonna have a good time. This is a place where you can go, be with your brothers, and we're gonna be called prophets, we're gonna be with friends and family. And when we have our events, you could bring your wife, you could bring your kids, you could be amongst people who are like-minded, and we can enjoy each other's company. We go away twice a year for associations that your grotto is gonna be a part of, and you go away once a year with your family, with your wife to a uh to a Supreme Council session. One's a week long, one's a one's a few, one's a long weekend. You can go, you could not go. You're not forced to go. You can join the line, you could stay at Red Tess. Um Grotto's body where it's just we're there to uh make sure that like we're taking care of our people and we're just having fun with each other and just enjoying each other's company. We are uh a place where we are a family. I know I would probably went over 30 seconds, but that's that's my where I kind of like I try to passionately speak about grotto as best I can.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:20

There was a Masonic 30 seconds. Yeah, yeah. Hey, that's enough time to pass the green beans, okay? Yeah. I got a couple more questions, but uh Eric, Mark, do you have anything? I'm good. Yeah, I'm good. I'm actually gonna be heading out here. Talk to me. I barely talk to you guys. Unfortunately, I gotta celebrate the the mother-in-law's birthday. Yeah, I know I know. And that's all right. So real quick, a couple fun questions. Your go-to drink. What do you what are you drinking at anything you go to?

SPEAKER_01 1:04:48

Oh, when I go to like a Masonic Lodge, I'll get like uh like either um whatever whiskey is on the bar, like a bourbon, like uh like like uh either a bourbon straight or bourbon or a couple ice cubes. Um I've been kind of staying away from liquor, but sometimes I'll get like a rum and coke. Like uh if they have like a spiced rum, I'll like a spiced rum. Um I'll drink like a beer here and there. It depends on what I want. Like uh I like all of a sudden I've been liking these all American beers because of the Hulk Hogan thing. That was really that was kind of like my uh I started drinking that beer. So I like a really, I really like I had like a Hulk Hogan was like my guy in the world.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:26

Those are really good though. Those are actually really good though.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:28

Yeah, it's tasty beer. Reminds me a lot of the PBR. Anyway, um besides beer, sometimes I like those spiked seltzas. Those are fun, those like those alcoholic seltzas, you know, with the uh sometimes made with vodka, sometimes made with tequila. Crushable. I forget what they're called. Uh you like crushables. Is that what they're called? Crushables? Yeah, my mother's. Anything you could crush, man. Anything you could crush down. Sometimes they're like raspberry flavored, those are kind of tasty. Sometimes in the summer I like those. But um, yeah, it depends on it depends on kind of the mood I'm in, I would suppose. But in the hospitality room, you can't be getting Too crazy. So, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:02

All right. So speaking of hospitality, hospitality rooms, what do you expect or hope to see in everybody's hospitality room?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:11

The perfect hospitality room is a place where there's plenty of like space for people to kind of like enjoy each other's company. You want to have a space for the elder folks to be able to sit and relax. You want to have space for the younger folks to be able to get fresh air and socialize. You want to have like, you know, some fresh air in the room. You want to have plenty of drink, plenty of food. That's it. Fun and fellowship. Something to entertain people, someone funny, someone to keep the energy up.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:40

So what you're saying is anything with Wes Rooter involved?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:43

Yeah, Wes is a guy.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:45

Yeah, I got a lot of Marty too. Marty's got a ton more than I do. All right. Yeah, Party Marty. Yeah, he's Party Marty. So once again, on the hospitality aspect, what can we expect from New York hospitality when it comes to Niagara Falls?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:02

Uh hot dogs and hamburgers, and uh maybe some like uh yeah, we'll probably just do like some bunch of New York like basic type stuff, man. We'll bring some of the things.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:10

No, Buffalo Wings. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:12

You know, like that kind of stuff. Honestly, it'll be like a New York flavored type thing, like like Frank Sinatra-esque, that kind of stuff. Well, we're gonna go like New York, like classic New York kind of things.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:22

Martini, like it.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:23

Yeah, like that. I can't really I can't I can't really give you like all the details because like everything is kind of like ideas up in the air, so it's you know, still two years away. But um, it'll be it'll be all based around like New York, New York, that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:36

Nice, nice. I've never been. I want to go. I I was in Cooperstown, and I was, and yeah, I'll probably guess why. I was in Palmyra, New York.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:49

That's up to Palmyra.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:51

Yeah. Uh more to do with the uh Mormon church. I went up there. I went up there because Joseph Smith's uh house is up there. What they call the Sacred Grove, Hilcomorra, and there's a temple there. I went and seen all that. I drove, I I can't remember where I was at. My wife at the time, her sister was living in uh not Birmingham, Briggham, or oh shit, somewhere in New York. We're probably about a couple hours away from the city.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:21

Can't remember where, but it was a three-hour drive to it's the way that New York is shaped, like the way because of the way it is, like I'm all the way at that base, and then New York just kind of like goes up and out. And so everything like that. Yeah, everything is like that.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:35

Yeah, so it was a wild ride driving through New York from Chicago and then all the way up from where we're at to put my run back. That was yeah, that was wild. Well, boys, I gotta punch out. Yes, so wait, wait, wait. Shout out and shout out. Shout out, shout out. Oh, yep, shout out. That's the last question. So I know mine, I know mine. I'm shouting out to all of the secretaries of the blue lodge. They run the show and they get everything done. And without them, the lodge would not function as great. Amen. So to the secretaries of the lodge, to the secretaries, to the secretaries, Mark.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:15

Uh, shout out to actually, uh, you know, since this was last week or whenever that's we're getting through. I don't know why I chose Gold Schlager. Yeah, what is wrong with you? Everything. Everything's wrong with you. I'm an adult. Anyways. Um, no, anyways, no, shout out to all the Grandmasters and everybody that came out last week to Chicago. Um, it was a fun uh fun event. Uh shout out a special shout out to Ricardo Ruiz, uh, who's um who's a local Illinois Mason. Uh he worked his butt off. He was a volunteer there. And uh he actually we had lanyards, and there's just pins of him getting Grandmaster's pins and like a like a medallion from the Grandmaster of Fiji. So um like you know, shout out shout out to um to Ricardo for for you know um hustling him, hustling.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:02

Yeah, hustling, not hustling him, hustling. Hustling, yeah. Uh I'll get mine and then we'll save the best for last for Frank. Uh shout out to uh Time for Fellowship. Uh they were kicking some podcast ass, doing things uh really well at the conference of Grandmasters. I know Brock will be on maybe one of the episodes or not. We'll see. I'll be on I'll be on it as well, too. And oh, great, great. And shout out to you for that too, and to Raven Lodge for another successful chili cook-off on February 15th. Frank?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:33

Yep, and finally Frank the tank. Shout out to the Masonic Widows, everywhere dispersed. May you be taken care of. To uh Mrs. Um Ms. Kibboitz. I miss you. To our ladies.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:50

Excellent. All right, everyone, that's our show. I didn't want to go down. Well, don't forget to like and subscribe. Yeah, you gotta select good liquor to drink. Hey, last episode it was uh what was I drinking? Oh, Absinthe. Yeah, that's great. Oh, man, that is good. That is good with you. So again, uh, please comment, like, and subscribe, share, uh, let everyone know about the show. Uh, and thank you for watching. We greatly appreciate it, and we will be back with more.