Bedside

It’s OKAY to Be Disliked or Misunderstood: Quickie with Amanda Blair

• Tatiana Fogt • Season 1 • Episode 167

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Today we're backkk with another Quickies episode to talk all things LIKEABILITY. Ever felt like someone just doesn’t get you, or that you’ve been unfairly disliked? Amanda and I are diving into those moments when we’ve felt misunderstood or judged, and how to handle them with grace. From the buzz around Ballerina Farm and Blake Lively’s movie promo to sticky situations of being misunderstood, we chat about how to embrace your true self & handle rejection despite the pressure to fit in.

Today we're chatting:

  • the ‘medium friend
  • pressure to be likable
  • fear of judgment
  • being disliked
  • friendship values + boundaries
  • embracing rejection
  • handling criticism

QUESTIONS & CONFESSIONS (ask us your Q's to be featured on the next pod!)
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Connect with Quickies cohost Amanda Blair:

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This episode is brought to you by the Monthly Manifestation Journal. Step into your dream life with our detailed journal, learn how to manifest, align to your desires, and meet your most authentic self each and every day. Plus, you'll begin to obsess over who you are becoming. Trust me, hundreds of you guys downloaded our freebie notion template for manifesting and I knew that I had to bring this journal into a process that brought you to pen to paper every single day through our monthly prompts to help you visualize, align and attract to your goals and daily space to journal, brain dump, manifest, jot down to do's. Pleasure practices, and so much more. And my favorite part about it is that I created this journal to be undated. So you can actually start ASAP. You don't have to wait for a Monday or a January one, which is our entire ethos of the journal in and of itself. And it's really perfect for the goal setter, the daydreamer, the type a or the free spirited to manifest anything from your career to romance to relationships. To self love and the best you yet. So head to the bedside. co and for all podcast listeners, you can use the code manifest to get 11 percent off your order. That's the bedside. co code manifest. This is Bedside, a podcast series on a mission to debunk sex. I'm your host, Tatiana, and each week we uncover stories, ideas, and expert information to help guide you on your ever evolving journey of deep love, relationships, and good sex. Oh, and a little bit of manifestation sprinkled in there too. Hello, everybody. Welcome back to another quickies episode. I have my co host Amanda Blair here and you guys we are back we're back from our summer break. We're back. We're back. We're back. I think it's so cool that we took a summer break. I think that was a great idea to do. Yes. I am curious to pick your brain on it, but I feel so refreshed and I feel like it's nice to give yourself pause in your passions and just kind of be like, okay. What's working? What do I like? What do I want to continue? And it's not, I was saying this on the first episode back, but there was a part of me that was like, let's come back and see what feels like it really resonates from this break and see if it still resonates afterwards. And I was saying everyone like good news. I fucking love the podcast. I love everything about it. You know what I mean? But it's really nice. Yeah. I think for you specifically, because listener Tatiana does all of the work. She is the one who's editing and like collecting everything. And I'm, you know, here kind of showing up and doing the work in the actual episode. But like, not in the background. So I think for you, especially because you're doing this with me, but then you also do podcasting all on your own and you're interviewing other people. So you have a ton around this, right? Like this is a big lift for you. Not that it isn't like a passion and you don't love it. Of course you do, but it's still a big lift. So I think for me, I love taking breaks from things. I think that's always a good opportunity. Also, I love keeping summer as like summer and that it's free and it's not like the rest of the time because when we were kids like that was just so magical. Yes. Like going to school and then like you're out of school and it's summer and then like going back to school like I love recapturing that magic so. I think that does that. But also, just for you, I was glad that you had a break. This is your second job, essentially, right? And you still have other work that you do. So I was happy for you to, like, really have a break that you just got to, like, be more free and, like, do other shit. I think that's really important for overall well being. 100 percent. And I think, like, That was the spirit I went into it with. I totally agree with you. I was like, you know what I really want for the summer is it to feel like summer and not like a continuation of the rest of the year. And I think if anyone's listening and kind of has side hustles or other businesses or is just kind of. Doing a lot of fun, creative process on the side, regardless of what field you in, I feel like there's creativity in anything. It's nice to really, even content creation, you guys, like if you're content creators on social media, there's a lot of pressure, I think, around feeling like you need to constantly execute 24 hours, 24 seven, you know? Yeah, of course. Like this output, output, output. And I think I would urge us to Maybe revisit some of those pressures and I remember I was feeling that way. I was like, I'm feeling like I'm just outputting so much. And this summer I wanted to really focus on inputting. So yeah, it felt great. And also you had a huge product that you launched. Yes. No big deal. No big deal. Except huge deal. Yeah. And that was also scary too, right? To be like, I'm going to kind of take a social media break. While simultaneously launching my first product, yeah, it was so cool because it kind of proved to me that you can still launch things and create things without being just a launching machine and creating content 24 7 around it. So, it was really nice. We need that in our culture, right? Our culture has gotten so fast paced because of social media and the internet. And in some ways there's like been positive to that, but then there's also been this like, we're, that's never ending. Yeah. And like, we have seasons and like there needs to be seasons in life. Yes, where, you know, you're more productive at this time and then you're not as productive and you're just living, you're just being, you're just enjoying moments, you're relaxing, you're resting, like, there needs to be more of that baked in. And I think as we look at, collectively, a society, social media being our norm. From here on out and like only how that will become more of the norm, right? Like technology isn't slowing down. Of course. Technology is only growing, right? And that's going to become more of like the every day. And like, we really need to look at how we can make that more sustainable. 100 percent. For us, because it's like, there is the option where like, you can go off grid, right? And like, you can not be in the matrix, so to speak. But that's not really an option for someone unless they are very wealthy. You need a lot of money to be able to do that, right? And so it's like, you need to learn how to live in, inside of this, world, this technological world we live in, in a way that's like actually healthy, right? I'm not worried about content creation. I'm going to let myself have a break. I think that's so important. Yeah, it's so important. You know what it reminds me of? It reminds me of Amanda, kind of like, I'm thinking in like agriculture, like growing seasons, whereas social media is a continuous harvest. It's always like pulling and taking like ripe fruit and content. You know, I feel like it's give, give, give, and I think of having seasons in your life where, you know, are you in like a seeding season? Are you in a growing season? Are you in a harvesting season? You know, and like, Leaning into that and I feel like that's always, I love leaning into that truly with the actual seasons because I find that that is so permission granting. But yeah, yeah, I think it's so interesting. So how was your summer? It was so good. It wasn't filled with a ton of travels, which I kind of liked, you know, some summers I have more travels than others, but I did go to the East Coast for a week, two weeks with my fam. It looks so ideal. Oh my gosh. It was magical. So, we went to Martha's Vineyard for a week and my family goes every other year. It was very interesting because it's like I haven't been in a while, but what I like about Martha's Vineyard, I've been going since I was like a little tiny, tiny kid. So it's a very nostalgic for me. And it's kind of different from Nantucket for those who don't know, because Martha's Vineyard is larger and it's, has this total artsy community. So growing up, my mom paints. And so she'd always bring like her big baskets of canvases and paints. And it's always been this very creative, crunchy granola space. What was so interesting, Amanda, was my family was there this time and we were like, where is everyone? And it's kind of, Things are shifting a little. It's becoming a little bit more kind of like Hampton vibes. That's what I think of when I think of like Martha's Vineyard. It's so funny. I read a book about Nantucket in the summer, Swan Song, I think it was. It was so good. I really loved it. It was like a, like a beach read, but it was great. And it's all about like life on Nantucket in the summer. And I was like, this is so ideal. Like I want to go to Nantucket. I want to go to Martha's Vineyard. I want to go to Cape Cod, all those like super like East coasty places. When I think of Martha's Vineyard. I think of the Hamptons. When I think of Nantucket, I also think of the Hamptons. Like, that's not the whole thing, but definitely a vibe of like, there's like country club people. Oh yeah, no, there's definitely that. There's kind of a distinction between kind of the people who live there full time versus the seasonal people who come. But nonetheless, I think like, It's like any place, right? Like you find your beat. So it was so fun. I mean, I was floating in water and eating seafood and relaxing on the beach, biking everywhere. So it was just. That really felt like the pinnacle of summer. And that's honestly, that time is when I started picking up some more non fiction books. Cause I'm a big fiction reader. And sometimes it's too cerebral. Like it's like too much. It doesn't let my brain turn off. So I have been very, very getting into non fiction. And I've been getting into the ACOTAR series, A Court of Thorns and Roses. Okay, wait. So you've been getting more into fiction versus non fiction because non fiction Oh, I'm sorry. Wait, did I just swap them up? Yeah. Sorry, guys. I was like Fiction is too cerebral. Yeah. Okay. I mean, I guess they stopped coming to me. No, no, no. Sorry, guys. You know, I know. I just swapped them. I swapped them. Okay, I have seen everyone and their goddamn mom reading that book. I'm sending it to you. No, no, no. And now I'm like, okay, well, I guess I have to read it. I'm sending it to you. The book, I, I'm done. I'm on, like, book three now. Oh my god. Please, send, send it to me. I would, I want to read it now. You're gonna die. Just send it over. I do love fantasy, so I'm like, I'll feel like I'll be good. The only thing, the reason that I avoided it is because I read the Fourth Wing books. I haven't read those yet. Because I'm real, I love dragons. I think dragons are so cool. I wish dragons lived in our world. Like, uh, I love them. And this book is about dragons, which is very cool. But it has, like, the love, you know, uh, like, romance. It starts in, like, a lot of female romance driven books, which I find really cool. Very interesting, but it's like the dude wants to kill the girl. The girl is like weakened and then the guy is like, I need to protect. And it's just like, it was too tropey barf. Yeah. I was like, who this is. This is so toxic. This is not the kind of love I want or that I want to see. So that I was kind of like, I really the dragon stuff I liked, but I was just like this, this like romance genre is just like not that I don't love. I like don't. Love that vibe. I don't love the, like, twilight of it, you know, of like, He wants to kill me and so we have to overcome that, like, I'm sorry, I, I don't want to be with anyone who wants to kill me. And that's something that he needs to get over. Like, that's not romantic. That's fucking unhealthy and toxic, and that person's just a, like, literally a so so bath. Like, no thank you. Oh my gosh. Like, I'm not into, I think, you know, maturity, healing, attachment wounds, like, I don't need a bad boy with a heart of gold. Yeah. Okay? I don't need that. Amanda's like, been there, done that. See right through this. Yeah. Yeah. Like, been there, done that. Got my heart trampled on a gazillion times, because it's like, that doesn't actually exist. Yeah. Yep. 100%. Yeah. I like I want a healthy, secure. Yep. Like write me a love story about that. Like that is actually fun. So summer was good though. You're on the East coast. Yep. Summer was good. East coast. And then between all that, just really unwinding. I feel like I was just like feet on the earth. sun on my skin, salt water in my hair, windows down. Like that was what I was calling in and just really, really gifted myself. So through and through it's felt incredible, but I am really excited about fall. So I'm kind of ready for it, but tell me about your summer. Well, what was the most exciting thing that happened this summer is that I started my internship. So that has been very cool. So if anyone doesn't know, I've been in my master's program, becoming a licensed marriage and family therapist. And I have finally got to the internship part and it has been, it has been a journey of, and we are here. And so that has been very cool. So like I'm going into an office, I'm, you know, the internship site that I have is an intensive outpatient, well, I work at like a non profit but the section of the non profit that I work for is a intensive outpatient treatment for adults who are dealing with substance abuse and often have, because of that substance abuse, DHS cases, so you know kids that have been taken away and that sort of thing. So it's a non profit. It's been incredible. It's been so fun to, like, work in an office and have, like, co workers and just have, like, office chats. I didn't realize, like, how much I miss that, but I really do. And it's been really fun. And, like, getting ready for work and, like, making a lunch. Like, those things I really enjoyed. And then also just the work of it all has been incredibly gratifying and it's been really enlightening and I'm learning so much. And I, like, I'm really digging the population that I'm working with. And it's just been like really heart opening. But it's also, I'm a beginner. Yeah. And though I've been coaching for a very long time, this is a very different thing. So being the beginner again is so interesting and hard and like humbling and again challenging. And I'm learning and growing so much. And I'm, I'm really excited to see who I'll be at the end of this, like as a professional. Oh, that's awesome. It's been really cool. So that's, like, been the main focus. Other than that, like, summer hasn't felt very summery. Our weather here in Portland has been very weird. Like, June was, like, June gloom. July was great. July was beautiful. I had a friend come in town and we, like, went and did the float the river and bend and, like, did a bunch of summery stuff and that was nice. We had some of Zach's friends come visit, which was great. So like we did get to like do some summer stuff, but for the most part, the weather here has been like really mild and like not super summery. So we haven't been to the river as much as we wanted and it just hasn't, this summer just hasn't felt like summer. Even though I'm in my internship, I still had academic classes, so I still have like homework and a bunch of readings to do. Yeah. Ugh, and like, I don't, I'm not done with my academic portion of this until December, and like, I just cannot, I like, need to be done. I'm like, so fucking done with homework and writing fucking papers and like, presentation, and then like, ugh. I will still have clinical courses until I'm done with school and I graduate, hopefully in September, it's all depending on like, You have to get a certain amount of hours and it's like if you can get a certain amount of hours by the time that you're done, otherwise I have to take an extension. So hopefully, fingers crossed, I will be graduating in July when I'm supposed to on time, but it just depends on like hours and clients and all the things. Sure, sure. So I think there's just been more stress. It hasn't felt like super carefree. Cause like I have, I'm like learning a new skill, a bunch of new skills. And like, I'm like in a new job, but I'm trying to get done with this like academic portion of stuff. So it's like, it hasn't felt carefree. So that is been a little bit of a bummer. I'm really looking forward to fall. I'm really looking forward to December when I'm done with my academic classes. Yeah. So it's been good, like, no complaints, nothing bad has happened. It's just, it hasn't been like that summery vibe, no worries, no cares. Like, I've had a lot of cares and worries. Like, because of my internship and like, the different things going on with that. So, that has felt kind of like a bummer, you know? Sure. But, it's okay. Like, it is what it is. It's a season. Not all summers can be magical. Exactly. I do agree with that. And any updates on, well, I feel like you kind of like have wedding planned. Yeah, weddings, weddings planned. Um, I did get wedding shoes. I found these beautiful, I wanted blue wedding shoes. Oh, cute. And I was like, look, I really like mules. And so I found on sale, what is this shoe? Oh, Manola Blahniks. I was gonna say, are they Manola? I was at the tip of my tongue. That is incredible. Oh, yes, Amanda. Like, on super sale. They're so beautiful. I can't wait to wear them, like, outside of the wedding. Like, they'll shoes, they'll be shoes that I will wear again and again. But they're so pretty. So I got that. I found my makeup artist and my hair stylist. The same person. Who like do my hair and makeup, which I was kind of like, how am I going to find that? Cause I want someone to come to me cause we get, we're getting married quite early. So I don't want to stress, like, I want to be like, you're here. I'm like, this is happening here. Yep. So that's good. Found that that's done. So like everything's really done. We have to send out our, save the date soon. And then we'll send out like our invites in like December, January. Oh my God. Cause it's like next year. So like, yeah, you have time, but everything's done. Yeah, so next summer will be super fun because we'll be getting, I will just turn 40, so will Zach. We're getting married. School will be done. Hopefully. It'll be fucking done. Like, hopefully. Ugh. And then I can just like focus on working, also getting paid. Yeah. I'm not currently getting paid for my internship and I don't know how in today's age. That's legal. That's cool. Yeah. I, like, how is that? It's, that is also very stressful. Just like monetarily, that's very stressful. So like that sucks, but next year I'll be making money. So that will be nice. During my internship, I'll be doing therapy full time, which will be really fun. And though I have, you have like hours that you're accruing for your licensure, You're doing that within like two to three years. So like there's, the timeline is just way more approachable. There won't be as much stress. Right now it feels like I need these hours. I need these hours. I need these hours. I need these hours. And it's just like, uh, you know, and so I'm ready to like, let go of that. So next summer is going to be great. Yeah. This summer has been a little stressful because of school. Oh my gosh. Well, I'm really proud of you. I loved your like first day of internship photo. I can't remember you. Oh yeah. I can't remember you had texted me that or posted to Instagram stories. I posted on Instagram. Okay. Yeah. It was, I was not planning on taking that. It was very sweet. Like Zach. So cute. Like, let me take a first day of your internship photo. And I was like, okay. So he like woke up early and like. That's so sweet. Took it for me, which I thought was very cute. So. Yeah, it's like so exciting, and like the more I get into it, I am excited to get into it. There's just so many steps. I remember I had someone come in, For a coaching session and one of the things that they want to talk about with me is like becoming a therapist and like doing a program and they're like, well, I think I'm thinking about doing a master's but like, I don't know if I want to be a therapist and I was like, girlfriend, if you don't have a like a burning desire to be a therapist at the end of us do not fucking do a master's program. Yeah, it doesn't seem intense. Yeah. But it is very intense and it takes over your life and it's very expensive. It's like Oh, expensive. I can't stress how expensive it is. And like, you gotta have a light at the end of the tunnel. Yeah. No, 100%. Otherwise it's just not worth it. Yeah. My brother lives in Berlin and he's with his girlfriend who's getting her master's and he was out there. He's like, Oh, I might as well get my PhD. He's just like super academic lead driven. And he was getting his PhD. And then he was like, one day he was just like, basically told my family, he's like, I'm no longer pursuing this. And we were all like, Oh my God, why? But then we were like, he explained it. And he was just like, it's so hyper specific that if you're in it, you need to 110 percent be like, like you're saying burning passion desire when you're like this far into academia. And we were like, okay, good call. Like all of us were like proud of him for calling it, you know, it's not like he couldn't do it. It was more just like, he was like, this is a specialty that I'm realizing isn't where I'm exactly wanting to go. Yeah. And it's incredibly time consuming. impossible to do, but it does require a deep commitment and passion to that thing. And if you don't have that, it is not worth the time and energy. Yeah. Like it is worth it to, and money, and money. I cannot stress how expensive this is. And so if you don't have that, which I do, so it's worthwhile for me. But I, cause I feel like I'm doing exactly what I want to be doing. I feel like so gratified, but it's like, it's a lot. Yeah. And if that's not there, learn differently. Totally. Well, I figure we could get into our pop culture moment. Yeah. Okay. I've been like dying. This has been the hardest part for me about doing a summer break. It's like all the pop culture stuff. I'm like, Oh my God. Um, so I'm really excited about this section. First thing first, have you watched the UK love is one? No, I thought you were going to talk about Love Island. No, I'm not a Love Island person. My girlfriend, when she was visiting, she got into Love Island, and I did watch an episode with her, and I was like, This confirms that I have no interest in this show. But, it's like mind numbing. Amanda, you cannot get into Love Island. Laura, like, it's good, but like, I actually caught myself, I had to stop because I was like, I was going to sleep at night and I was like, narratives were still playing in my head. I was like, this is just chatter. It was chatter in my brain. Totally. I was like, it's not. You would hate it. You would hate it. Yeah. Period. It's yeah. It's like not. I think why I like love is blind. Is because I genuinely feel like there are people there that are like genuinely trying to like see if this can meet, help them meet someone. I think that, you know, other people are there for like the drama of it all or for like to be on TV, whatever, that's gonna happen. But I do feel like there's a genuineness there. And that could be me being naive, but I do, I genuinely do. And so I like, love is blind. Like, I don't watch a lot of reality TV. That's like, not my genre. And like, this is one of the things that I do watch, but they have a UK one and it is very good. And the whole, everything is out. So like, you can watch it all the way up until the reunion and it's very good. And I highly recommend it. Okay. I'm going to add it to my list. It was not on my radar, but I'll take your word for it. Okay, so, rundown of pop culture things that happened. Well, there's a couple of things. So first off, there was the ballerina farm. Oh my god! Oh my god, we have to talk about this next because we already had this conversation! Yeah. Okay. So that article came out on the London Times or whatever it was, I think, where the interviewer went to Ballerina's Farm and interviewed the fam well, tried to interview Hannah, but it sounds like there was a lot of joint interviews between her and her husband, lots of kids around, and she came out with a really specific narrative of Ballerina Farm. And that narrative was, uh, Hannah gave up everything, you know, she is in this marriage where her husband is, decides everything. She's miserable, she's overworked, she's depressed. Yeah, suppress poor woman. When I read it, I did not buy into that view at all. And I know, like, the trad wife thing. I have since, like, since the conversation we had, I have seen, like, true people promoting, like, the trad wife lifestyle, to which I venemently disagree with. Like, I don't, I'm a very liberal person. I have very liberal views. I believe I'm a feminist. I believe in equality between people. all people. So I feel like trad life is, is not that. It's more conservative. Yes, I would agree. With that said, I still don't feel like Hannah Ballerina Farm is trying to promote that really specific trad wife. thing. I think that she is living a very traditional way of life because she is a Mormon. And what I think that article didn't really comment on in a way, it was more like a judgmental view, is her context is super important. She's Mormon. She's grown up in the Mormon church. She comes from a family of nine. So does he. Them getting married at that age is not abnormal for Mormons. That wasn't her giving up her dreams. Every Mormon girl that I knew that was, like, very Mormon and in that religion, she knew whatever she was pursuing, she would stop pursuing once she had kids. Because her job would be to have kids. Right. And, like, be there with the kids. So, do I believe in that life? No, I fucking don't. But I'm also not going to say if someone is doing that, That that is wrong for them. I believe that women who are growing up in that world, I think that they are happy. And that is what they want. And have they been conditioned to want that? Yes. But I've also been conditioned to be liberal. And I think if we're saying that I'm right and that's wrong, I, I also don't agree with that. I, there's room for both. I don't want to live that life. But like, she doesn't need to live mine, right, in order for her to be happy. I do think that she is happy. I think her context matters, and that is more normal for her, but to paint her as a suppressed woman when she's not, I think is incredibly problematic. I don't think it's right for the world to say, your lifestyle is wrong and promoting bad stuff and whatever. Like, I, I disagree with that. Do I agree with? their religious views? No, I don't. But I also don't begrudge her having a different view. You know what I mean? Like, we have different views. So, that was my take on it. I thought that that article was very pointed. And she went in with a certain mindset. And she, like, painted that mindset. Yeah, I think so was my take. No, I agree with you. I think the the journalist went in with a totally specific angle, a narrative that she wanted to pluck out. And I think kind of just to like echo off of what you were saying, I think for the conditioned woman like you and I in 2024, who's liberal and who is a feminist and who is tapped into kind of the cultural norms quote on quote, I can understand. And I think it's why this ballerina farm has so many followers. Yes, there are lots of people who admire her. There are also lots of people who are just fucking intrigued by her life, like you and I. Totally. And I think it's just this jarring juxtaposition to what I think a lot of feminist culture has fought for, right? And so I think it's threatening. And I think it's unsettling, truly unsettling to people like you and I, right? Who are like, if I were in that position, I would literally be fighting for my life to get out of it. Well, and the whole narrative that the, the article had of like, she gave up ballet for Daniel because this is what Daniel wanted her husband. And then, you know, when sort of ballerina farm talked back and was like, Actually, here's our actual story. Right? Like she danced for quite a long time, even after they started having kids. And then they moved to South America, and that's where they got into agriculture and farming. And from there, they decided, we want to do this. in the States back home together. So yes, she wanted to be a ballerina and she pursued that dream. And she was also always knew in her head that her family came before that for her. And she was not going to be someone who, was like, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna be 35 and single in the city pursuing being a ballerina. Like, I, that was never the life that she was gonna choose for herself, because that is not the context in which she came up. And just because that wasn't her choice doesn't make her suppressed, unhappy, or giving up everything for her husband. Like, I do believe that that is what she wanted and that is okay. I'm okay with other women making choices that work for them. Also, you know, her husband talking for her in the article. That's also part of the Mormon culture! Like, the man is seen as, like, the leader. Do I agree with that? No. Is that the kind of relationship I want? No. Do I think that that makes her suppressed? No. I don't. And also, she works. Like, she is, she brings in a lot of income with that. Like, she's not a stay at home mom. They have a huge brand and a huge farm. They are, as she said in the article, co CEOs. She's not doing that traditional thing where she's sitting at home just taking care of the kids. Like she's like running social media and probably is getting so many brand deals too. Like, yeah, she's in pageants. Do I agree with those? No, but like, she is very ambitious and she's still pursuing that ambition. She is not being told, like, sit at home and be quiet and be unseen. Like, that is not happening, right? That's how we know of her. So I just think that there was a lot of nuance that was missed. Yeah, I think it's a very interesting, like, we'll continue to see, there'll probably be always controversy with this topic, so I'm definitely curious to see kind of what unfolds next, but it's wild. Yeah, I mean, it was like a wild article, and then it was wild when she like, spoke out about it, which I didn't think she would do, so that I was actually quite surprised that she did. I also didn't appreciate everyone being like, you know, when she wrote, or she posted her post about it. They were like, oh, Daniel made you say this. I was like, you guys, you gotta stop. Like, you don't, she's not unhappy in her marriage. Like, she seems like a happy woman who is satisfied with her partner. We have to stop pretending that we know what people's relationships are. You know what I mean? Fair enough. But also, another thing in pop culture that happened this summer, sort of similar, another white woman sort of being like taken down, Blake Lively. It ends with us. Yes. I thought this was fascinating. I'm blown away by it. Did you see the movie? I haven't seen the movie yet. No. Oh, okay. Well, I do think you should see it. Have you read the book? No. I'm very, like, out of that storyline. I'm reading the book right now because I saw the movie and then all the hubbub. I was like, well, I actually do want to read the book. The book is? Not awesome. Not terrible. Not super awesome. The movie is far better, but I just, like, wanted some more context, you know, of, like, the whole thing. But I think this whole drama, I will say, like, right off the bat, the way that Blake Lively called it this movie was a huge problem, and there needs to be an apology issued. Yes, this movie has serious, serious themes. Domestic violence. is huge. So many people experience that and re experience that and get stuck in that cycle that kills so many women. Yeah. You know, like that kills so many children. Like, it's like deathly serious. Yeah. And you spend very little time talking about that. Is a problem and like just needs to be addressed and apologized and for and like that just needs to I don't know how that hasn't happened that to me is wild that there hasn't been an apology issued because that was wrong. Yeah, I just feel like they covered such sensitive topics and just glazed over everything, which is such a weird choice. And I'm, I want to know, I'm like, did the, you know, she was a producer, I'm like, did the studios tell you to do that? But then, you know, Justin Baldoni was promoting it as a movie about domestic violence. So I'm kind of like, what's the deal here? But I will say, I did listen to, um, a podcast on, have you heard of the Shameless podcast? Yes. Yes. I listened to their episode about it and they kind of were speaking to how I felt about it. But they weren't. being as harsh on Blake about the way she was promoting it, which again, I think was incredibly wrong. Like, I was like, what are you talking about, girl? Like, put on your florals and bring your girlfriends and friendship bracelets? Like, Yeah, no, that's that's not what this movie is. And no, like that was weird. But beyond that, there was something had something happened. And Justin Baldoni wasn't doing press with Lake Lively. And, you know, people were like, essentially, Just because of the way that Blake was promoting the movie, we're just like, fuck Blake Lively. Justin Baldoni is the one winning this. And, you know, they were like, how dare Colleen Hoover and Blake Lively profit off domestic violence? Yeah. And this podcast was like, bro, Justin Baldoni bought the movie rights. His production company made this movie, he directed it, he's profiting off this movie, right? And I think that what I didn't appreciate was, like, the takedown of a woman. Yeah. Like, I think we can hold someone accountable of like, Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. The way you're promoting this is, like, super out of touch and super weird. And we want an apology, and we can hold someone accountable for that, which I think, as the public, we need to do, and that's okay. But to just side with the man on everything, and be like, it's the woman, the woman's fault, she's bad, she's the worst, we hate her, especially with a movie about domestic violence. I was like, Are we missing the point? Yeah, literally like it just was hand. It's a PR nightmare It's just like I just don't understand why like her team didn't swoop in and I don't know I think like there are certain people who right, like let's let's talk about for a second like, you know, taylor swift's PR team about the like potential threats, right, to the concert in Vienna, and the fact that her silence was really intentional out of safety precautions. And, you know, I think someone like her at her caliber has such intentional PR tactics with just the level of influence that she has. And I know Taylor and Blake are really good friends, and I wonder, you think about that? If from Taylor standing, she's like, don't say anything. Let things brush. Like, I wonder. Right. And I think of her. I'm like, in a way, she's in such a different position than someone like Blake in terms of like, really the significance of power that they have and the tactics they need to play. And I just like. There is a part of me that's just like, I don't know who is giving like the right advice here. Cause I'm just like, I think you have to say something. I think you need a different team. Yeah. Clearly you're surrounded by yes people. Yes. Yes. Exactly. Like people aren't like people aren't. Yes, Amanda. Yes, Amanda. It reminds me of like the Sophie Turner, like Joe Jonas scandal where it's like Joe's PR team. It's like people were like, too scared to like maybe say no to him and it got messy and then finally he just like went silent and everyone was like good because you were never going to win this battle and like yeah we were like no no you will not do that to sophie um so but here's where i go i'm like i am not a nice person i'm gonna be really honest with you guys and here's why and i i don't want to be a nice person i don't like women being nice people because i think nice gets women killed and Because nice is people pleasing. I'm gonna make me uncomfortable so that you're comfortable. That's nice. I am kind, which means I'm clear. I'm honest, direct with my communication. I will make myself comfortable, even if that means you're uncomfortable, right? So to keep myself safe. So with that, I would not be a good famous person. And like the chaperone of it all. Yep. Right. Of like, I didn't, this is not what I want. So I don't like want the like bad shit. I just want to be an artist. Not saying that Chaperone and Blake Lively are like, I'm not, there's, there's clear differences there. But, um, just that, like, I have some understanding of like, I would probably be rude to a bunch of journalists. I'm going to be like really honest. Yeah. Because I think a lot of journalists, a lot of journalism in like the, you know, entertainment world is like inherently rude, especially to women. Oh yeah. It's low. It's low hanging fruit. It Yeah, like, a lot of, like, poking and prodding and whatever, and I think, you know, women have finally been like, we don't have to take that, and we can, we can stand up for ourselves. Like, if you look back at interviews in, like, the 90s, the 80s, the 70s, the fuckin thing, early aughts, like, the things that Journalists were allowed to ask. Journalists were asking Britney Spears if she was a virgin, if her boobs were real. Yeah. I saw an interview with Helen Mirren. Helen Mirren, when she was like, in her forties, or thirties, and the interviewer was like, well, your boobs are huge, so how's anyone going to take you seriously? Like, we have to take in the context of it all. And, for like, the past interviewers, Interviews, there needs to be like a little like, yeah, that was rude. Apology. Hopefully apology occurred, but she wasn't rude in any of the other ones that were resurfaced. She was just having boundaries and like trying to probably get through the day. And like that, can we not understand that? Yeah. Yeah. Like, I just don't think that we need to like be shitting all over a woman. I think we can just say. The thing that you did here with this movie was really fucking weird and a problem and like, please apologize. Right, yeah, we don't have to pull out your whole history and like, yeah. We don't need to make it like, the man is the one who we're gonna lift up and like, the woman is who we're gonna pull down. Like, I just feel like that's shitty. It's just a, it's a stale story at this point. Like, just like the takedown of women, like, I think, like, even as consumers, we should be doing better. And that goes for ballerina farm and that goes for flake in a weird way, right? Like take accountability where it makes sense and like. Where it applies and like don't be tone deaf, you know And that's what your audience and fans are gonna call you out for but like that's like where it ends and that's the tea And that's the tea but that leads us into what we wanted to talk about today, which being Unlikable. Yes so we want to kind of dedicate this episode to the concept of being disliked slash Misunderstood And I think this is a really fascinating topic because, again, with many of the things that we talk about on this show, a lot of topics that are kind of swept under the rug or people deal with quietly, or is a universal truth but isn't spoken of, might feel like a lot of shame behind it, even talking to your friends about it. So Yeah, I think we ought to dive right into this topic and I think honestly, Amanda, like maybe we start with the idea of is there a difference between being misunderstood versus being disliked or are those kind of interchangeable? I think it can be interchangeable and I think that sometimes they may be separate, but I think it's definitely something that women deal with more. Yeah. This idea that we need to be likable, and I kind of felt that with the whole Blake Lively thing. I was like, she isn't being very likable and we are not okay with that. Yeah, we are not okay with that , but like if a man were to do that, we'd be a little bit more, okay. Mm-Hmm.. If a man was more sarcastic, whatever, blase, we'd just be like, oh. Whatever. And we'd like get over it very quickly. Yeah. But like for women to be unlikable is like the ultimate sin. Yeah. Right? It's like you need to be here and like perform and be sexy while doing it but not too sexy. Yeah. There's, like, such a tightrope that we have to walk. 100%. And I wonder, too, kind of getting into the topic of perception, too, and self perception is interesting, right? Like, how people perceive you and how you perceive yourself. And I, find that it can be such a trap to really fall in one section of the pendulum of operating off of how people are perceiving you all the time, right? Like creating your character around the perception of others, which I do fully agree with you. I think heteronormatively women deal with this so much more frequently than men do. Totally. Well, and you read an article about, like, a similar kind of topic, right? Yeah, so I read this article that was talking about this concept of the medium friend. And it's been a book on my book list to get into. Because I've just been so deep in ACOTAR, but there's a book called The Courage of Being Disliked, which is all about handling rejection and handling discomfort, which I think is what I really want to get into with you. Yeah. But let's talk about this article because there might be kind of like an interesting cross connection between this concept of the medium friend slash being misunderstood and disliked. From this article about the medium friend, this is like the zone where a lot of people feel they get stuck in the territory of being misunderstood and disliked, right? Like, you can be misunderstood and disliked by a close, great friend. That can happen, usually less common with a best friend. With acquaintances, I think people kind of tend to give less of a shit. They're like, who is this random stranger? You're like, whatever, right? No connection here. I think it still depends. I think it depends on the person and where they're at in their journey. Okay. Fair, fair, fair. This is true. But I think what this article was getting at was that with people in your life who are maybe considered more medium friends that this idea of being misunderstood and disliked can happen more frequently. And actually, Amanda, I do agree with you because Even the fear of being disliked happens to people on the internet, right? Like, and those are complete strangers. Yes. So yes. And that's like a whole thing, right? It's a whole thing. Internet culture is, is like all about misunderstanding people and like hating them and tearing them down. That's like the culture of the internet right now. Yeah. I had such a journey with this. I was so insecure growing up and then also in my 20s and in my early 30s. And so low consumed with being liked and worrying about being disliked and misunderstood, which I think also caused me to be more misunderstood and like, disliked because of, like, my. Desperation for acceptance, right? Cause I wasn't accepting me. So I was like looking for other people to do that for me. And there would be pockets of it. Like I remember when I was traveling and I was dating guy and he was much younger than me, I was on a trip around Southeast Asia and I met a guy named guy. And he was 10 years younger than me. You know, it was a period of time. It was fun. And he had a friend that he met traveling, who I loved, his name was Miles. And Miles met a girl, and they were all younger than me, right? So, but Miles was like, cool. So he brought this new girl around, we went out together. I had a great time. We like went to dinner. We were in Vietnam. They went out for drinks. I just got water. I went talking. Great time. Had so much fun. We went home. The next day, guy was like, Oh, Miles texted me that his girlfriend thought that you didn't like her and was like really upset. And I was like, Oh, well, that's her insecurity. And he was like, Oh, like you're not gonna be like, Oh my God, I need to apologize. And I was like, Oh, the difference 10 years makes. I was like, No, because that's her shit. Like I was there. I was talking. I was being very, you know, inviting and friendly. And if she wants to interpret that different, that's fine. That's for her. That there is no truth in that. Yeah. But I'm also, I don't need to apologize. I did nothing wrong. Right. I didn't, I like know when I'm rude and I know when I'm like, I'm not talking to someone and that, I was not doing that. I was being lovely and friendly all evening. Were we like besties bonding? No. But we don't need to be. Right. And that doesn't need to happen. So if she's going to take that wrong, that's also okay. And that's her experience. You're allowed to not be okay. That's cool. I'm okay. I'm okay. And I remember he was just like, I was like, yeah, well, I'm not 22. So like, I'm not going to operate as a 22 year old girl would. Yeah. And I would have as 22 been like, and like been so worried about it. But even like beyond that point, I still had a lot of work to do it with that. I also think the culture of New York really brings out that insecurity in people because it's very like, who are you with? Scene be seen. What group are you in? Like, it's very like that, you know? And I've noticed like a huge relief Of that since leaving New York of like, like, I just really don't care. And I think age, like you just, you worry less, which is such a relief. But ultimately, because it's like someone else's view of you just isn't your business. No. And if you try to make it your business, you are just going to be miserable. Like I need to answer to me. So I have values. I want to be a kind person. I love boundaries. I'm not going to let someone walk all over my boundaries. And that came up recently, actually, we had friends. staying at the, at our house and I had to have a conversation about boundaries. I was like, look, being friends with me means we're going to talk about shit. If something comes up, I'm going to be super honest with you. I'm going to be super direct with you. I'm going to say everything to your face so you know where you stand with me and we can work it out. I'm not going to suppress it. Be weird about it. Be passive aggressive about it. That is not who I am, and not the kind of relationship I want to be in. And so I was super direct, and I was like, here's what's going on, here's my boundary. Everything was cool in that moment, but then I heard later, everything was not cool. And I was like, that's fine. But I told you the kind of relationship that I'm looking to be in, which is honest and upfront. And if that isn't something that you want to do that's uncomfortable, totally cool. But I'm not participating in like the other thing. Yeah. And like, I'm not going to change because that upsets you. That's fine. You are allowed to be upset, but I'm not going to change the way that I'm operating for that. Was that situation resolved in the end? No, because that person wasn't willing to communicate with me about whatever they felt. And I was like, and that's okay. And you don't have to. That's, you know, that's the way that you want to do that. Totally fine. Literally no hard feelings, but it's just like, well, then that's as deep as we can go. Yeah, another thing came up with another friend where it was kind of we had a like a little weird thing and I just immediately was like, okay, that was weird. Here's where I'm coming from. How are you feeling? Cool. Here's why I think that happened for me. What was your experience? What can I do better? What do you need? Here's what I need. And she met me there. We talked about it. We let it go. And we were like, now we're better friends. And I was like, this, these are the friendships that I'm interested in being in. Sure. Someone who is going to say, yeah. Like Amanda holding a boundary is like rude or whatever, I'm like, that's fine. You can totally, that's your call. I don't mind being misunderstood now. Yeah. And I also don't mind being disliked. Because if I'm being true to myself and that happens, then that's okay. Like, that's their experience. I'm not willing to break bonds with myself in order to be cool with someone else. Mmm. That's so powerful. And that's so hard. Yeah. It took me a long time to get here. No, I know. And I'm, I'm like, I have an interesting scenario I'll speak to after this, but I'm wondering in that circumstance when you were like, okay, I expressed my boundaries. Maybe the, I thought it was cool in the moment, but then I found out later that it wasn't. And we, you know, we haven't spoken about it or communicated about it since. So that's the depth of our friendship. What are the tools that you use For someone who might feel like they're like, Oh, that's so cool that Amanda's there, but I'm so not there. Like I would spiral out. What are your tips around handling that? Well, at the end of the day, it's me being a secure base for myself, right? So what I mean by that is I am safe with me. I love myself. I accept myself. I know my worth. I'm a being who is worthy at that's like the deepest truth of me as are all of us. And I really connect with that. And I operate from that space. So like, that's the underneath of it. I also know what my values are and I know who I am. I am someone who values. Being blunt and direct and honest. Because I find those things safe. I grew up with a lot of uncertainty. I grew up with a lot of lying. I grew up with a lot of not telling the full truth. A lot of codependency. There is nothing more unsafe to me. Nothing more unsafe. But if I am direct and honest with you, you know exactly where I stand with you. That's safe. Yeah. And I want to operate with people who tell me the same. I want you to say to my face, What's happening. And if you can't do that, you're unsafe. If you're not taking your problems to me with me, then like, how could we ever resolve that? Right. So I think like it's learning how to be a secure base for yourself, which if you're like, what does that mean? Come to a session with me. I can help you or go to therapy. And that really helps. That's how I did that through a lot of work. And it's also understanding your values, understanding interdependency versus codependency, and then. Right. And really trying to work out of codependency. Codependency says, you're not okay. So I'm not okay. We want interdependency, which says you're not okay. That's okay. But I'm okay. Right. That girl saying she thought I was mad at her. That's okay. That she felt she's not okay. That's okay. I don't need to do anything. I'm good. That's for her to look at and delve into. That's not me for me. So we want to work on those things. Right? And then we want to understand like who we are and we want to be fully accepting of where that's not to say that I am not accepting of like growth or feedback. I totally am. I'm not a perfect person, right? Like I can take that blunt directness too far sometimes. Um, and there's times that I do and like, I have friends that will be like, Whoa, that's too much. And that's okay. I can listen to that. But there's a difference between feedback and like taking in feedback that works. You're like, okay, yeah, I hear that. That's something that I could work on. And there's feedback that I'm like, that's just coming from a place of you trying to attack me. In which case I have no room for that. So it's, I think, all of those kind of things coming together. Yeah. Thank you for explaining that. And I think, too, before I maybe share a little bit of some of my examples, which is funny because I look to you and I'm like, oh my god, Amanda is even more of my evolved future self. Like, I, I feel as though I'm, I'm that person who's a few steps back, which might be relatable. Well, I'm also 10 years older than you. I know. Right? But that's what I'm saying. So like, we have to take that into consideration. You're so much further ahead than I was when I was, So you're doing well, I'll get into my story, which I think you might have an inkling of what what I'm going to share. But before I go into that, I wanted to kind of round out what Maybe I meant earlier by the concept of a medium friend. And I think there's something kind of interesting here because what you're saying is, it seems like with these, some of these people that you were speaking with, this also might be such an Amanda thing too, where I know you are so. It's a strength of yours to really speak clearly and communicate truth and honesty. But I think what this article was getting at with medium friendships, which are kind of those people who are neither close friends, neither just mere acquaintances, like they teeter that line in between, that there is a bit of a lack of clarity around boundaries. And around conflict resolution and communication around emotional challenges, right, where many of us who have super close friendships, let's say a best friendship, a romantic partnership, right, we could only hope that there's clear lines of communication and trust and honesty, whereas this article was kind of speaking to maybe a little bit of that gray area where that line of communication might be Not as developed and therefore it can miss it can skip some of these moments of right of truth Totally. Well, I think that some people being and I don't think this is super conscious I think it's like upbringing and context and you know conditioning but that the closer relationship is The less boundaries you need, and it is the very opposite. The closer a relationship is, the more boundaries you need. Yes. Right? And boundaries aren't bad. Boundaries are not barriers. Boundaries are, this is how I'm keeping myself safe. Right? Like, Zach and I have boundaries with each other all the time. And like, that's how we have close relationships. My close friends and I have boundaries with each other. And that's why we're able to be close. Like, boundaries equal safety, and the safer people are, the more emotionally available they can be. If there is no safety, there is no emotional availability. Period. The end. Right? So, that requires boundaries and trust, and for trust and boundaries, there needs to be transparency, there needs to be direct communication, like, those are all things that are going to really foster that. Do I think that everyone is available to that? No, I don't. I think that there's a lot of people that don't have that conditioning, aren't interested in that, aren't pursuing that, are in various stages of pursuing that. And that just is what it is, but you have to be willing to, I think for me specifically, I had to be willing to look at. relationships that weren't showing up in the way that I wanted to be showing up in a relationship. So like I was showing up that way, but that other person wasn't. And it's like, okay, well then I'm rethinking the way that this relationship shows up in my life. And like, if that means that person dislikes me or misunderstands me, that's also okay. I'm okay with that. I'm not going to be for everyone. I don't need to be for everyone. I don't want to be for everyone because if I'm for everyone, I'm not for me. And you're for no one. Right. Like, but like, I want to belong to myself. Yes. Me and me is like, that's the most important. So, you know, I was thinking when Chaperone posted, did you see what she posted on Instagram about? Yeah. Which I was like, I have just so much respect for her. I love that she was calling out, like, I don't want to be harassed. I don't care if, because I'm famous, you think that I owe you that. I don't. Mm hmm. Boundaries. Yeah. I want to be protected. I want to enjoy my life. And I was like, hell, yes. Yeah. Like, I could not be a famous person with those expectations. No. Like, No way, shape, or form. I would, I would be cancelled because they would be like, she's so rude. And I'd be like, yeah, because like you don't get access to me. Yeah. And that's fair. Like we need to allow for that. I love that she's willing to be misunderstood and disliked, right? Because people are like, Oh, you're being such a brat. You're so entitled, la la. And it's like, well, she is entitled to boundaries. So sure. But she was willing to be unliked to be true to herself. And I think that is like the most powerful thing you can be. 100%. And I think too, like, the more and more you exercise this, the more comfortable it becomes. I feel like I look at you and I'm like, you have exercised this muscle so many times. Like, this is something that comes so naturally and is, like I said earlier, almost a strength for you. Whereas if you're a little younger listening to this and you're like, oh my god, that terrifies me, you know. It's not something that anyone's going to be perfect at overnight, right? Like, of course, I think it literally goes against the human instinct, right? We want to be liked to quite literally survive the tribe. We're pack animals at the end of the day. And so it makes sense that we truly have that instinct within us to kind of be like, ah, freak out, ah, spiral. Like when, when we aren't liked, right? Cause. Back in the day, it could mean, it could mean your death. Right. You would die. Yeah. Yeah. Like, that primal thing is there. Yeah. And that we have to acknowledge that. But, I think we also have. The ability to still be safe and to operate from a place of I am safe, right? But it's okay and normal that our brain is like emotional danger equals. I'm physically unsafe in our, like the most subconsciously part of our brain, but that's not actually true, right? We're no longer in physical danger if we're in emotional danger. And it's sort of like recognizing that. 100%. And I think I had an instance, I'll, I'll kind of share the broad strokes of it. It's funny because coming out of this instance, I now totally have like a different outlook on being liked or disliked. There was a part of me that years ago I went through a big friendship breakup. It's on, it's on the podcast. You guys can like, there are plenty of episodes where we touch on all of these topics where, you know, I've had many instances of being disliked, right? And I feel like I was almost like 80 percent there and now I feel like 90 percent there of like my feelings of being disliked and misunderstood. But I have this crazy instance and I, I actually called Amanda about this because I was like, Truly, genuinely, what the fuck do I do? And, um, Amanda's such a good, not only great for advice, but I find it's sometimes nice to source a completely unbiased opinion. And a couple of months ago, I had a really, really wild instance where I found out. that I was deeply disliked by someone who I thought was a friend of mine. And there was a ton of drama and a ton of games being played. And it was really immature. It was very immature. And it was years of, An individual speaking poorly about me to other close friends of mine and me truly genuinely being just blindsided like I didn't know I didn't know that this person didn't like me I actually thought we had a great relationship, you know, they definitely fell in the category of maybe more of a medium friend, somebody who we caught up. every couple of weeks. They've stayed with me at my house before I've opened them up to, literally hosted them multiple times. And anyways, it was, I'm going to keep kind of the intricacies of it vague right now. I'm sure I'll go into it later when I feel more comfortable if there ever reveals to be a story time from this, because I actually do think it's such a real topic to get into. I'll save that from today's episode, but it was very interesting to kind of go through the emotions because I would say after this instance, really, of truly finding this out and being so, so taken aback, I would say, Amanda, I had a good week where I was, you know, I was quite devastated about it, right? I was devastated at the idea of being disliked. And not only disliked, but truly me feeling so deeply misunderstood, right? Totally. Yeah. Misconstrued. And it was something that ate at me. I would say it gave myself like a good week for it to like really eat at me and like kind of talk about it to like who I needed to talk about it to and really, really process it. And then I was able to truly actually let it go and realize. And I think, like, you really helped turn on the lights for me here, where this person, after I called them out, realized what they had maybe done in some way. To me, I'm like, how do you not realize what you did? But that's a story for another time. Yeah. And they were seeking repair. And I think at first it was seeking repair as well, right? That people pleasing side of me was like, fix it, fix it at all costs, codependency, let's figure this out. Right? Right. Right. And then the interdependent part of me stepped in and said, wait, uh, wait a second. Is this how I want to be conducting friendships in my life? Are these the rules? Are these the protocols? Are these the boundaries? Are these like, is this the foundation that I want to set? Well, and I want to respect. The privacy of this, but I just want to say also in this situation, you can go into it a little bit. Like if you want this person and I'll be broad, but like this person wanted to, by not communicating something specific to you was trying to teach you a lesson. Yeah. I mean, I'll just say it for what it is, not to tease you guys too much, but I was intentionally not invited to someone's wedding, but out of spite to teach you a lesson. Yeah. To teach me a lesson. That is so icky. It's icky. And like that, not a bad person, but not the way that you want to operate in friendship. I have been icky to people in my past, and people have held me accountable for that. Thank god they didn't want me in their life anymore. And that was really hard at the time. I will say there's been some times. Many where I wasn't mature about that because I was young and I now look back and I'm like, wow, thank you for teaching me integrity. Thank you for teaching me boundaries. Thank you for teaching me it's not okay to mistreat someone and you get to stand up for yourself. Yes. Because until I had that. example of someone doing that to me. I mistreated them to the like, nice to, I was just terrible because I was operating from you get to do that and you get to be welcomed back because that had happened to me. That was the example I was shown. And so that's what I lived. And that's what I experienced. You just get to mistreat people. And then you just get to like, be cool with that person. Once you're like done mistreating. And the first time that I was really held accountable for that. And it was like, no. Our boundary, you don't get to have access to me, was such a wake up call. And I'm so grateful. It took me a while to like, really wake up to that. I would say, took some time. But now I really look at that as like, I'm really appreciative of that. Because I got to see, again, what integrity looks like, what boundaries are, what accountability is, and that you don't have to be mistreated. And you can say like, You're not a bad person, and I don't hate you, but you don't get to be in my life. No, exactly. And like, that is appropriate. And as it should. Like, I had a yoga boss. I have never been more mistreated in work than when I taught yoga, let's tell you. But I had a particular boss, who was a friend. And she, like, I have never been in such an abusive environment. I mean, it was, like, It's comical now, but it was like really, I mean, it was really bad, like really, really bad. And that person, to her credit, did reach out to me a couple years later to apologize, which I was like, Oh wow. I'm proud of you for your growth that you got to understand that that's not okay. Like that makes me feel better for you. And I was like, I accept that, but never will you be in my life ever. I don't care. I'm glad that you apologize and thank you. I appreciate that. But like, never do we repair this. It is okay to be like, you don't get access to me anymore. And I think we need to be better about that. Yeah, I think so too. As women. Yeah. Specifically. I really think so because I think it's, we can be so quick to glaze over so many things and it's not to say that we're not here to forgive. Give people right. Forgive yourself. And my tactic that I always use is like, I forgive you for where you're at in life for what the tools that you currently have. And that's how usually I find my peace, right? Like I'm not, I don't forgive you for what you did, but I'm not going to hold onto this, right? No, no, no, no, no. Let something build up. But it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, Exactly what Amanda said, which is, we can lay a situation to rest, we can be disliked, we can have situations happen like this, but let's not open arms and welcome people after this. And that, I think, is something that was really hard for me to do, and it still is. I have to actively make that decision, but it's me choosing myself every time when I do it. Yeah, this person wanted repair with you and you were like, no, and I think that's super appropriate. Yeah, it was too far for repair. It was very, very damaging and it was very telling to who this individual was. So, you know, I just had to be like, listen, take inventory of what's around me and the things that I love and the amazing things that I've built for myself and the relationships I built for myself and say, you know what, okay, like your truth is being revealed here. Right. And. Like, let this be, as Gabby Bernstein says, the detour in the right direction. Let it be. Amen. And I think, you know, when I was younger, I mistreated people and they held me accountable. Like, that was a big learning. That was a big character building for me. And I think when we also do that for someone, that gets to be an opportunity for them. I'm not doing it for them. I'm not like, Hey, you need to learn a fucking lesson. Cause like then I'm not, I'm not like in my power when I'm like trying to control what helps someone else. But I think if we're like, look, like that, no, like I, I don't want to repair. No hard feelings, you know, peace be with you, but also I'm good. That gets to be an opportunity for that person to grow from that experience. Fully. That's Yeah. And I think that, that's okay. It's okay that they operated the way they did. It's okay that you were like, not for me. And it's okay that you guys are both going to grow from that experience. Yeah, 100%. Like that's what we want. Yeah. Right? Without a doubt. And there are some instances where something happens and you can get past that, but that's not every instance. And just because someone wants to repair does not mean that you have to. Agreed. You can say, I hear you. Yeah. Not even sorry. Just, it is what it is. Yeah. I agree with you. And I think like, if you are in a position of being disliked and not knowing it and feeling like it kind of came out of left field, or maybe even like, even a scenario like that outside, like, you can take your time with coming to these conclusions. You don't have to. I remember in the moment feeling like really rushed. Like, oh my gosh, I really need to figure this out now. And then be like, what the heck is the urgency? Clearly this person has spent years disliking me. I'm just trying to wrap my head around this and like, you know, come to some sort of like conclusion. But then I realized it was like, listen, I can give myself space. I can give myself time to really think, do I want repair? And initially I thought I did. And then I, and then I realized, you know what? I don't, I don't. I realized that like me wanting repair was. Me denying myself of my truth and my own values and it was kind of taking me down at the expense of someone else, at the expense of maybe a larger friend group and, and what would mean of that. And then I realized, wow, that doesn't fucking matter. Right. Yeah. Totally. And also I think, you know, you're in the phase of life where friendships really start to shift. Mm hmm. Like I think they shift a little bit when we get out of college. And we're just like in life because suddenly we don't have that one cemented thing in common where we're all like circling around it, right? And then we're kind of like living and so you kind of like grow apart from people. And then I think once you hit your 30s, I think that happens again. Yeah. When it's like, We are now, we've gone through that saddened return, that initiation into adulthood, we're more grappling with like who we really are, not just who we have been conditioned to be. And that can often mean that there is, you know, a divergence too. And like that can feel difficult, but I think it's also important and it's also normal. And I think it needs to happen. I think it's really nice to audit. An inventory of your life, you know, you want to feel like you're in the driver's seat of it and that like you are in active participating relationships and if it's not like that, then what are we doing right? What is this? Why are we in this? So, Amanda, what are kind of your tips? You know, we've kind of spoken to maybe some more specific dynamics, but maybe for the person who is even worried about their perception of others in more of acquaintanceships or even online, right? Like, creating content and putting it out there and being worried about maybe speaking their opinions, right? Like maybe there's someone who's kind of just stepping into training their muscles around what this might look like for them and what creating kind of their value system might look like. What are your tips there? Yeah. I mean, I had someone ask me this in a session. They're like, I really want to do a podcast about like this specific thing, which was actually incredibly cool and niche. And I hope that she does it. And she was like, but I'm so scared of like what people think, like criticism and I was like, well, here's just like a truth that will not come until you're successful. Yeah. Success being, you're very well known, you have a lot of people watching you. The haters don't come until you are, have a lot of people watching you. Yeah, you gotta have reddit pages, right? Yeah. Like, once you have a reddit page. Yeah. You've made it. You're famous. You're, you're doing very well. But before you really have that visibility. That isn't there so much from strangers that might be there from people in your life, right? People could be critical. And I think one, you need to look at the kind of relationships you want. I am not interested in having friends or a partner or a family that's critical. I think that If I'm coming to them and I'm saying, Hey, could you look at this new thing I'm doing and give me some feedback? And I'm asking for that. Great. But if I'm, you know, posting something that's new and my friend is like, Oh God, how embarrassing. Why the fuck am I friends with that person? Like what are they adding? So I think it's understanding the kind of relationships you want to be in. And if someone is operating outside of that, we need to have some conversations to see if that person is willing to show up in the way that you want to show up, clean up your side of the street. See if they're willing to, and if they're not, let's reevaluate if that friendship is for you. And then I think when it comes to like, and holding boundaries and speaking your needs and all the things that we've already talked about, but I think when it comes to strangers, it's what I talked about, you know, how I got myself there. It's, Having that secure relationship with you, understanding who you are, fully accepting that, that you are a being who is worthy. You don't have to do anything to prove that worth. Nothing you do adds to it. Nothing you do subtracts from it. The example I always like to give is like, Trump is a worthy human being. He is not making great choices and I do not like him, but he is a worthy human being. You can't subtract from it. You just are. We just are. Everyone is who is here. Everyone is worthy. So you have to really live in that place of truth and understand how to get yourself to that secure base inside of you. Again, if you don't know how, book a session with me, do some therapy, that will help you get there. And when you're operating from that space, then when you're getting criticism from strangers, you can say, is there something here for me? Maybe someone's commenting on your page like, I think that your typeface is terrible. And you could be like, is my typeface terrible? Like, is it unreadable? Like, okay, let me look at that. And if someone is like, you fucking suck. Is there anything that I can take from that? No. So I'm gonna let that go. That's like, that person. And I'm not gonna pay attention to what that person's saying. And I'm not saying that you won't feel hurt by comments, of course you will. But like, feel the feeling of like, oh, that hurt. Feel the feeling and move on. Don't get caught up in the story of it and what it means about you, because it doesn't mean anything about you, right? Like, I would never spend an ounce of my time Going on to a stranger's social media and attacking that person. Not even people who were like, don't believe in abortion, which is insane. I just like, I not associating with you, like, bye. I just, that's not what I'm looking to call into my life. Right. And I just don't do that. So, because I really like myself and I love myself. People who aren't there are going to be the people that are reaching out to like criticize other people and like that is more about them than they're saying about you and you really have to just know yourself and know your boundaries and know your values. Hurt people hurt people. I found this like really great sound someone had made on TikTok and I like made a cute edit to it and it was this whole thing and it brought me so much peace and I was like I have to share this with everyone. Bedside because I was like, I know someone needs to hear this, but it was this girl kind of making this narration that was just like, you are a good person. Yeah. You treat people well, you treat people with kindness. You are, you are, you genuinely are. And it's okay that not every single person is going to like you. And I think knowing deep down, if you like yourself, if you're walking through this world, proud of how you show up and how you treat others, Then you don't need to worry so much about other people's perceptions. Like Amanda's saying, like, take a listen. Be like, is there some accountability I need to hear from this? Even in my own situation, you know, that I was explaining, these were friends from a certain era of my life that there were parts of this conversation that I was able to take and take accountability for, which was a time in my life when I was really bad at showing up. I was like, okay. heard loud and clear. But I think that my lesson learned from what I went down with, what I ended up just leaving a friendship behind. But what I distilled from it was, yeah, there was a time in my life where I didn't show up and I can take accountability for that. Have I changed? 100%. Have I grown from that? Yes. Over the years, many, many, a plenty of changes have happened because of that. But you know, Someone was judging me out of a really old operating system. My OS has updated a lot since then. But yeah, I think take what you need to take from it and then do not make more meaning of it, right? Because it's just other people's. perceptions that then we're taking on and we have to know our self perception and our self worth. Yeah, I think it's really just at the end of the day, knowing who you are and like really accepting and liking who you are. Like I used to get so much criticism for being blunt. And being direct. And that was, it was always like, at jobs, like, You're being rude. You're being dismissive. You're too blunt. You're da da da da da. And because I didn't accept that about myself. And then once I learned to accept that, that shifted into, Oh, I love that about you. And it was because I no longer was, like, insecure about it. Yeah. So, like, the energy of that really shifted. Yeah. That became a strength. That becomes, became something that I led with. Which doesn't mean that everyone wants that and is for it. That's certainly not true. Some people do not like that. And I'm like, yeah, then I'm not gonna be for you. And so, I think, also, understanding, Everyone, not just you, everyone has people that don't like them and that that person is like, no, not for me. And that's okay. And that doesn't mean anything. Right. But like everyone, I do, you do, you're showing that you do. Everyone does. I know someone listening to this will be like, well, it's just me. It's not just you. It's just part of being human. It really is. It really is. And you know what, guys? Like, I'm going to be so real with you. Like, You're gonna master, life, little trademark on it, life TM, you're gonna master that if you get good at handling rejection. Word. And like, not everyone is for me. Like, for example, you love Alex Cooper, right? I don't love her. I don't hate her. But I also don't think she's, like, super good at interviewing people. Do I think it's really rad that she just scored a 120 million deal for Sirius Radio? Yes, I do. Go I love when powerful women are, like, operating well. So, like, I really celebrate women for that. But, like, her personally, I'm just like, not really for me. She's just like, not really my cup of tea. That's okay. Does that mean Alex Cooper should change everything that she's doing? No. Right? Does that mean you're wrong for liking her? No. That just means We have different cups of tea, right? And like, that's okay, right? I love Megan Fox. A lot of people don't like Megan Fox. I really don't care. I think she's awesome. Right? And like that is okay. Amanda and I love Taylor Swift and it's okay. Taylor Swift is my hero and I don't and if you don't like her, that is totally fine. I won't hear blasphemy but that is totally fine. You don't have to like her. Right, right. Okay. Yeah, I, I just really want to seal home, you know, like, rejection is a really, really uncomfortable thing, but I think the more we come familiar with that and kind of train ourselves to sit in it and not run from it or try and fix it. I tell my clients, like, I want you to seek out rejection. Yeah. Because I want you to get comfortable with it, right? I was telling that to a client and they're like, and they were talking about romantically and they're like, have you been rejected romantically? I was like, bitch, I've dated in New York for 12 years! That's all I was! Hello? Like, I got my ass handed to me over and over and over and over again. Like, no one escapes it. And it didn't mean anything about me. And it doesn't mean anything about you. Yeah. Right? So if we can just allow that, Like there's just much more peace to be had. I would agree with that. I would agree. All right, guys. All right. Let's wrap this. Let's wrap this show up. We've been yapping. This is what happens when we take a break. Yeah. I'm just, there's so much to say. Well, anyways, thank you guys for tuning in. I wanted to say Amanda and I started officially. A new Q& A section. So, I've been calling it questions and confessions, because I think it would actually be really funny if you guys sent in not only questions, but if you want to send in any, any tea, any confessions. Send me that tea. Let's hear it. I'll link it in the show notes, but if you go to thebedside. co backslash questions, that's where it is. You can drop a question or confession and then get featured on the podcast. So basically you just like enter a name, real or fake, it's up to you. And then you just type in your question for us and then you have a chance to be featured on the podcast. Our episode, which I'm really excited about. So yeah, run over there. And Amanda and I will be good about posting this link on our stories and our pages before we record episodes, just so you guys know that we have a recording coming up and you can drop in your cues. But yeah, I'm really excited about it. I'm really excited. Yeah. I'm excited for you guys to be more a part of the show because like that. is has been our intention for a while. Yeah. Not that like we don't have enough to talk about because like we could just yap and yap for days on end, but it's always fun to take some questions and hear, hear what other people are working through. Anywho, I'm off to the river to go enjoy the like last summer day that I think we're going to have this summer. Yeah. And I'm so happy we're back. I'm so happy we're back, you guys. Thank you for tuning in and we'll catch you soon. Bye bye. Thank you for listening to the Bedside podcast. I hope you love this episode as much as we did making it. If you have any feedback, questions, or suggestions for future episodes or if you just wanna chat, don't hesitate to reach out to us at the bedside on Instagram and the bedside.co online. You can also find us at by the bedside on TikTok to stay updated on our latest. Episodes, be sure to subscribe to our podcast on your preferred platform. And if you found this episode valuable, I would so greatly appreciate if you could leave us a rating, a review, text it to a friend, share it to your Instagram stories, let's get this message out there loud and clear until next time. Thank you so much for tuning in and I'll see you next week.

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Tatiana Fogt

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