From Botox to Self-Love: Sandra Silverman on Overcoming Identity Crisis and Finding True Worth

In this episode of The Remarkable People Podcast, host David Pasqualone interviews author and entrepreneur Sandra Lena Silverman, a co-founder of a large mortgage business and mother of two, about her life story and the lessons she wants listeners to apply—especially learning to love themselves. Sandra shares being adopted as an infant, childhood molestation that later manifested as a severe fear of elevators, and a lifelong pattern of perfectionism and overachieving. She recounts a difficult marriage marked by gaslighting, manipulation, and emotional abuse from a narcissistic husband, including constant body-shaming that contributed to her pursuit of numerous cosmetic procedures and surgeries. Sandra describes how the abuse escalated after pregnancy, the onset of infidelity, multiple separations (including in 2006, 2016, and 2023), and her decision to end the cycle with a final separation in 2024 and ongoing divorce proceedings. She explains how prolonged stress affected her health—high cortisol, inflammation, shaking—and how those symptoms improved after leaving. Sandra discusses warning signs such as love bombing, excuses, and blame-shifting, emphasizes the need for strong boundaries, and updates listeners on her current work: her book deal for three books (including the republished From Bullshit to Botox and a forthcoming second book focused on her marriage and narcissism), her show Parties Over, and her social media presence where people can connect with her.

01:50 What You’ll Learn Today: Loving Yourself
02:56 Adopted in Maryland: Family, Identity, and Early Questions
04:58 Childhood Trauma Revealed: Molestation, Memory, and Finding Her Birth Mother
06:21 The Trauma Shows Up Later: Claustrophobia & Fear of Elevators
08:18 Perfectionism and Overachieving to Earn Love
09:37 Meeting Her Ex: The First Body-Shaming Comment
10:49 Building a Business + The First Surgery (and the Put-Downs Continue)
14:04 Pregnancy, Cruelty, and the Moment She Saw the “Monster”
16:13 Affairs, Separations, and the Crossroads She Didn’t Leave
19:05 Hard-Won Warning: Without Boundaries, It Only Gets Worse
20:11 Breaking the Cycle: Final Separation & Choosing Yourself
22:13 Healing After Abuse: Epiphanies, Boundaries, and Health Recovery
25:02 Kids, Co-Parenting, and Protecting Them from Dysfunction
26:21 Red Flags of Narcissism: Love Bombing, Gaslighting, and Blame-Shifting
29:40 Life After Leaving: Books, Podcast, New Opportunities, and Independence
32:50 Beauty vs. Self-Worth: Elective Surgery, Internal Work, and Doing It for You
35:00 Faith, Divorce, and Where to Find Sandra + Final Wrap-Up
37:25 Podcast Closing Message: Feedback, Sharing, and Living the Mission

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Transcript

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Hello friend. Welcome to this week's episode of The Remarkable People Podcast. Today we have a woman who is an author. She's a business entrepreneur. She runs a large mortgage business. She's a mother of two, and she talks about her very difficult marriage. How she navigated it all. But during it, she was being gaslit, manipulated and kind of controlled by a narcissist who would make her feel bad about herself. So she got over 30 surgeries on her body and different procedures 'because she didn't feel like she was good enough. So at this time you're going to hear Sandra Lena Silverman's story, and then we're going to transition that into hopefully practical steps of how it can help you and those you love to be aware of what's going on, to put a stop to what's going on and to recover from what has gone on, and so you can move forward in more joy and peace and love. And so you can also help other people. So at this time, enjoy this Remarkable and important episode with our friend Sandra Lena Silverman now. The Remarkable People Podcast, check it out, the Remarkable People Podcast. Listen, do Repeat for Life, the Remarkable People Podcast. Hey Sandra. How are you today? I'm good. How are you? Man, I'm Remarkable. I am looking forward to our interview and I just told our listeners a little bit about you, but straight from the source. If someone spends time with us, whether they're in America or anywhere around the world, what do you guarantee, by the end of this episode, they're going to be able to take, apply their lives and be a better human after listening to your story? That they need to learn That would be the best takeaway from this, from this story. All right. I mean, love is the most important and most powerful force, so I couldn't agree more. So what we're going to do, yes. Is, we're going to go through your story.'because clearly you didn't just, you didn't, weren't born into a perfect environment and you were taught this by your parents and you've carried the torch through Absolutely. Through your life. So where were you born, Sandra? What was your upbringing like? How did you know? We'll work chronologically through today. Okay. So I was born in Maryland. I'm adopted. I was given up a week after I was born and adopted it three months. Of age and I spent most of my adult life in Maryland for the first 45 years until I moved to Miami nine years ago. Okay. And then growing up adopted, that impacts. Everyone but to a different degree. Some people, it's a nice transition. Some people, it really bothers them and and burdens them their whole childhood. What was your upbringing like? Were you okay with it? Were you thankful to have a family or did it hurt you? No, I, I was fine with being adopted. I didn't know any different since I was three months old, so my first children's books that I read were called the Adopted Family. So I didn't know any different at that point. It was a little difficult as I got older, I wanted to meet my biological parents, and my mother wasn't receptive to that as a teenager. Just out of curiosity. But my childhood was fine. I grew up in like an upper middle class family. My parents sort of had a dysfunctional marriage, so it wasn't perfect. And I also have an adopted sister who is three years younger than me. So is it two sisters and then your mom and dad? Yes. Yeah, and, and as our listeners know, who've been listening to our show for eight years, or maybe it's their first episode, we go through the past, not to dwell on it, but everything that happens, good, bad, ugly, pretty, pretty ugly. It makes us the people we are today. So that's why we want to understand it. So now you're growing up. And you're going through, you know, we all go through school in America for the most part. We decide are we going to go career or college. So as you're developing, you said you reached out to your mom, you try to con connect. She wasn't into it, at least at that time. Where does your life go from there, Sandra? No, my adopted mother wasn't receptive to me reaching out to my biological mother. So, yeah. So let's back up a little bit. So as a child, I. There were some issues. So I was molested when I was seven, and that subconsciously was difficult for me. Consciously. I, I think I blocked it out. And then as a teenager, I started remembering things and then fast forward, I, I did go to college and found my biological mother once I was in college. So once I was. Over the age of 18, I reached out to the state and she had already written a letter. So if I ever reached out that she was willing to see me. And so I didn't really have a relationship with her, but there were issues from the childhood that I had to, that I really didn't understand, you know, what was going on. So fast forward, I started working after college, and then my life just went from there. Okay. And then. When you're, you know, a lot of changes in your teenage years, a lot of changes when you go to college. You know, we're, who are we going to marry? Or if we're going to get married, what are we going to do? So all these things are spinning through your head, and now you have that burden of even the subconscious, the molestation. Mm-hmm. And now you're aware of it. Was it at that point you started processing it, or did you kind of just push it down and deal with it later in life? So where it happened was an attack room. So I rode horses and one day my dad left me there at the facility and the person that owned the facility, that's where it ha that was the perpetrator. And that's where it happened. But it happened in a very small space in attack room. So fast forward, I developed a major fear of elevators after college. Where it got to the point, like if I walked into an elevator, I thought it was going to die. So it was really bad. And then over the years I worked on that. To this day, I cannot ride an elevator by myself. So, and I've tried so many different therapies, so many, so many different plant-based drugs. And so that's an issue now, I guess I started developing the that in after college. Yeah, it started emerging 'cause things weren't, did you even I, I don't wanna say it wasn't being dealt with, but at that point, did you acknowledge it or did you just kind of keep pushing it away? You didn't want to deal with it? Where were you at at that point? I had to have pushed it away because I didn't understand why I had a fear. I didn't know about the fear of the elevator, what caused it until much later in life. But yeah, so I wasn't dealing with it for sure. Like I wasn't in therapy, I didn't deal with it. I just kind of pushed it away. Okay, so now mm-hmm. You kind of have the, it's natural. When you're like, I grew up, my parents weren't married, my dad never came to see me, he chose not to. And you just have this natural rejection, right? Mm-hmm. So you, I'm guessing at some level you had a natural rejection by being put up to adoption.'cause you didn't know what happened until you were older and now you're molested and you're trying to grow and trying to move forward. So when all this is happening, do you start. Usually what happens is it piles up and we develop other, whether you wanna call it a bad habit or other issues like you got claustrophobia. Was the rest of your life pretty balanced or were you starting to just pile up? No, I was pretty balanced. So as a child I was a perfectionist, like I was made sure I was always on the honor roll. I was always at perfect attendance. I was great at all my activities. I was always perfect in terms of like, like a, as a child, my room was always perfect. My closet was always perfect, like everything was perfect and I didn't realize that until I was an adult. Like wow, I was such an overachiever and at for at such, such a young age and probably. Subconsciously that was because I was adopted and I was already rejected at birth where I wanted to live up to my adopted parents' expectations. Even if they didn't have expectations, I don't even remember. But now, as an adult looking back, I think that's probably where I was with my mindset, and that carried into my adult life. So every job I had, I was always the top producer. I started my first company at age 27. So I was always like overachieving, I guess, in everything. Yeah. It was almost like you said this. We're going to get into the core of what you learned about love, right? And about self-love. But at that point you were trying to earn your love, it sounds like. Yes, a hundred percent. And then I met my ex when I was 26 and a month into the relationship. He looked at me one day and he was like, wow, he's. Said, oh, your body's soft, you need to go to the gym. And I didn't understand. I thought, okay, my body's soft. I need to go to the gym. But that's the first time in my life that I actually felt like there was something physically wrong with me. Like I never felt it before. Even if there were physical things wrong with me, I never felt it. And so that moment, so think that's what started the whole journey of all of the surgeries and you know, all the procedures that subconsciously prompted it. And I know a little bit, he asked me to do this. Yeah, I know a little bit more about you 'cause I saw your intake form and we had a pre-call. Yes. But for the listeners, let's not jump through. So you had someone you cared about. You met this man and then he says you're soft. And that's just like, what? And, and so what did that, what was that thing? Negative catalyst to I didn't understand because no one's ever said anything like that to me before. So I was confused when he said that. So I was like, fine, I'll go to the gym, I'll get a trainer. I, I guess my body stopped, like I didn't understand. So I started working out and a year later we started our company together. So I was in residential lending. He wasn't, and we actually started the company before we got married. I worked like morning, noon and night building this company. And I had my first surgery at age 27, which was breast augmentation. So that's where it all started. Yeah. And he basically was telling you whether it was it that one time or was it a constant stream of passive aggressiveness or was it straight in your face? Mm-hmm. You know, this is wrong. No, it was more pass. It was more passive aggressive. Or he would talk about his ex, oh, she had the most perfect body. She was this, she was that like to probably to try to make me feel bad about myself. And even though he didn't directly say, oh, well, you don't look like her. He would make. Say those things to me like nonstop. Yeah. And were you married When, at what point did you get married? We got married two years after we met, so we were together for a year. We got engaged and then the following year we got married and we were tied together.'cause we had started this company together and started working together. So we were together like 24 7. Okay. And then you're working a ton. There's this passive aggressive behavior where he is putting you down where clearly he has the issue. Not you, but you're just believing it. And you're starting to have surgeries, you said multiple. Mm-hmm. So did those surgeries ever interfere with your wellbeing?'Cause a lot of those surgeries, they can go south or, you know, they're unnecessary. Yeah. What, what was your opinion?'cause I'm going to be honest with you. I'm, I had surgeries that I had to have to save my life. So I've never done elective surgeries. I'm really like, if I don't need it, I'm not touching it. Right. Okay. So for someone to have elective surgery, that's really foreign to me. But I am in a different place in life. You know, if somebody says I'm ugly, I'm used to it. I don't care. You're a beautiful woman and you get the man you love telling you you're soft. That's just ridiculous. So how did this process in your body, and was it becoming physically harmful? It wasn't physically harmful, but it had to have been emotionally harmful.'cause I remember one day I had lost a lot of weight fast, and my friend noticed and she looked at me and she was like, how did you lose so much weight? It must have lost like 10 pounds pretty quickly. And she remembers this to this day. I mean, this was so many years ago. And she said. That I told her, well, Dave said that my, my legs looked like baseball bats, so I wanted to lose the weight so my legs wouldn't look so big. So this point I was telling me like, okay, your body's soft, your legs look like baseball bats, and that's going to affect somebody psychologically. It's like impossible not to. Yeah. So how long did it take before you started seeing like, wait, this isn't right. I, this is unhealthy. This is harming me. Years. So I didn't realize what was going on. I just thought, okay, my legs look like baseball bats, or you know, okay, my body's soft. And then when it really hit me was when I got pregnant. So fast forward now we're in 2002. I got pregnant. My son was born in 2003. And I gained a lot of weight. So during that pregnancy I gained like 60 pounds and he, it got to the point where he started calling himself and, you know, hold on, I wanna hold off just 'cause that's a normal pregnancy weight. That's not like a, it's not like you gained 180 pounds. Yeah. So I wanna make sure like I'm a guy, but I know when I had, you know, two, my wife had two children, that's like a normal amount of weight to gain. So just, I don't want you to just continue to think that was too much. Thank you. So, yeah, so during that time, once I started gaining a lot, like toward the, the last trimester, he was calling himself a whale watcher. He was making comments and I couldn't help it because I just was having all these cravings and I was so small to begin with that I just, you know, gained all this weight. So after my son was born, my friend had called me one day and she's like, oh, come to New York for the day.'cause I lived, you know, in Maryland, it wasn't far, and we'll go to lunch and we'll get our eyebrows done. So I was getting ready to leave the house and he said, where are you going? And I told him, and he's like, eyebrows, I wouldn't be worried about my eyebrows if I were you. If I were that big, I'd get to the gym while, that's when it really hit me. I was like, wow, this guy's a monster. Like I just had a child. You know, trying to juggle like this extra weight that I gained, I'm going to, I knew I would lose it, which I did by December. I was like, I was in the best shape of my life and that's when I knew that's when I knew like I'm married to a monster basically. Yeah. And as a guy, you know, guys like that. And you don't keep friendships with them. But normally guys like that are either complete hypocrites or they are in good shape and they think they're the top of the world and they're having all sorts of affairs. And I don't wanna put words in your mouth. Mm-hmm. But it sounds like that's the type of guy this was. So was he having like on top of it, was he having affairs? Was he doing other things? Not yet. Not yet. It started after that. So his affairs started after my son was born. I didn't know at the time. I found out much later on that. He was, there was a lot of infidelity even that started then. I didn't know 'cause I didn't catch him. But yes, that's when it started. He had completely changed in terms of, he became much more bold, so. Once he said that he probably maybe had already started with affairs, I don't know, but that's when it kind of turned. And then the first time he left me was in 2006. So our son was three years old and he moved out for 30 days. So that was our first separation. And then, and then still, I didn't know about infidelity at that point. He came back 30 days later and things seemed fine. And then we adopted our daughter in two. Thousand seven, maybe 2008. And then by 2009 I knew that I should leave this marriage. I, at that point, he stopped having sex with me, started telling me he wasn't sexually attracted to me. And at that point I knew I was, I should have left. And that's probably my biggest mistake for not leaving. Yeah, but I mean, hindsight's 2020 and you got two children now you got a business together. Mm-hmm. Good faith of, you know. Yeah. It's hard. We love each other and we're trying to grow together, so, and I, again, I appreciate you sharing this, and I know it's a delicate, sensitive topic. Mm-hmm. But we have listeners all around the world, men and women, and a lot of them. Your situation currently. So that's why we kind of go through the past and we talk about these things. So looking back, like you said, you can see now how abusive he was, but at that point it was just par for the course. I mean, it probably didn't feel good, but you, do you remember any kind of like, you just accepted it? What was going through your head at that point? Do you remember? I wanted to leave. I was planning to leave and I remember talking to my father about it, and he's like, what he's doing is emotional abuse for him to even tell you he's not sexually attracted to you and he doesn't wanna be intimate with you. You need to leave this marriage. So I remember we took the kids on vacation for Christmas, and I remember telling him after the vacation that I was leaving and I planned to leave. I was going to take the kids and move. To my parents' house temporarily. And then my father died. So when that happened and before my father died, he's like, no, you know, I'll make changes. I wanna work this out. And then my father died, so then I just, I never left. Yeah. And so where does your life go from there? So for all of your listeners, this is really important 'cause that I was at a crossroads at that point where I. I was scared I should have left. I didn't leave. And I promise your listeners that if they're in this situation, it will never get better. It continue. These people, when you don't have a, a strong enough boundary, like I didn't have, it never gets better. It, they continue to become more and more disrespectful. And my second book, which isn't, hasn't, it's in publishing right now. That book talks about this whole journey and about the marriage and. How everything that happened step by step, and I can tell you from 2009 until we finally separated, the final separation in 2024 was horrific in terms of the behavior that this person displayed. I mean, I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy because my life turned into so, so much anxiety. I was living in flight or fight every day of my life, and it never got better. It just continued to get worse and worse. Yeah. And that was a long, I thought you were going to say, you know, after your father passed away, you stayed another year, but you stayed No, a long time. A long time. So after 2009, he, I mean, it wasn't like all bad, like he would. He was good and then he wasn't, and it was just like a rollercoaster. So then after that, we ended up moving to Miami in 2015, fall of 2015. By 2016, he left again. So now we're at, this is the second separation. Then in 2023, he left again. That's the third separation. And after 2023, we got back together for a year. And then when he left in 2024, that's when I finally was done. I was like, I'm filing for a divorce. I'm never getting back together again. Like I'm breaking the cycle. But it took so many years and so much trauma. For me to endure, to actually wake up and choose myself because I wasn't loving myself. And that's what the big takeaway from this podcast hopefully will be for your listeners. Because if you don't love yourself like nobody else is going to like, you have to choose you. And I don't mean choose you over your kids, like of course you're still going to be a good parent, but you have to choose yourself. Oh yeah, a healthy balance. And I totally get what you're saying. And ladies and gentlemen, it's like if you've ever been on an airplane, they always go through, you know, if the plane is going down and oxygen's low, put your mask on first so then you can't help other people. What Sandra's talking about is biblical. I mean, if you can't care for yourself, if the love of God isn't flowing in you and overflowing. You have nothing to give to other people. You know, if I, if you had no money and I asked you to borrow$5,000, you can't give it to me. Well, if I try to borrow your love or use your love, I'm just going to suck you dry if you don't have it. So what Sandra's saying is she was empty on the inside in a lot of ways, and it was just draining her. Even worse. So draining. Yeah. So now you go through these years of dysfunction. And it hasn't been that long before we progress into today and tomorrow. When you go through those years of abuse and now you're on the other side, what typically happens is you just have these epiphanies. Like all of a sudden now the blue, you're be at the grocery store doing something completely random, it seems, but then you realize just how dysfunctional things were and it takes time to reacclimate. Acclimate to balance and normality. So are you finding yourself now just, you know, during the days that you've been separated, you're just like, wow, I can't believe I put up with that, or I can't believe that happened. Oh, I can't believe it. I think about it all the time. I can't believe, and I'm so happy that I have this platform now because I can help other people. Like the first book that I wrote was more about reverse aging and timeless beauty. The second book, which. Will be published this year, hopefully, will help so many women see exactly what I went through. And I have experts in the book talking about narcissism and how these people never get better. I don't care how much help they get, they never get better. They just continue to get worse and worse. And when you don't set boundaries for yourself, I mean the behavior just, it just continued to get worse and worse and worse. And I just. Dealt with it. And it was wrong because it affected my health. My cortisol levels were so high. I had so much inflammation in my body. I was a nervous wreck. My friends told me that I was shaking all the time. They thought I had like Parkinson's disease 'cause I shook so much. And now all of that's gone. But you know, now the inflammation's gone. The I don't shake anymore. Thank goodness. Yeah. Praise God. And, and that's so true. There's. People try to give you good advice and I'm sure you want to try to do everything to make the marriage work. Mm-hmm. But I know like in my personal life, and you've said it several times, like you're like, you know, I dunno if you used the word regret, but you're like, I wish, I wish, I wish, looking back, the regrets I have. Or for trying to make things work that I had no control over. Like we can't control ladies and gentlemen, the other human. Mm-hmm. And like Sandra's saying, unless they choose to change, which is going to take a complete mental and emotional and spiritual reckoning on their side, it's not going to happen. And it sounds like you were holding on. Waiting for the miracle, but it didn't happen. Looking back now, especially with the kids, you don't have to go too deep. But I know with my kids, I love them so much and they're 21 and 23 now. Mm-hmm. But trying to help them reestablish a relationship with their mother. Destroyed aspects of the relationship with me. And my biggest regrets are for trying to do the right thing. You know, quote unquote, how are you at, are your kids solid? Are your relationship with them or did they, did it cause a rift between you three? No, my relationship is solid. My kids will always choose me. They will always choose me first. They will always choose to be with me for the holidays. Like they're always going to pick me because I was the constant in their life, even when they were children and he was running around and chasing this person or that person, or at one point he, we had a se a second home in Vegas, so he would just take off weeks at a time. I was always with the kids, so they know that I'm always going to be that solid person in their life. That hasn't been an issue. Yes, they have a relationship with their father for sure, but they're always going to pick me over him. Yeah. And you want to have a relationship with both parents for your children. You love your kids, you want them to have a healthy as healthy relationship as possible. But at the same time, we don't want them to pick up on the dysfunction. So again, it's that balance. So looking back, or not looking back but looking forward, helping our audience, what are some things that you'd recommend? Like, Hey, these are serious flags. If you're seeing them, you need to, to really pray and talk to somebody and maybe consider getting out. What, what are some things that you look back, you're like, man, I should have known better the love bombing. Like from day one, this guy love bombing told me we're going to have cute kids together. The first time I basically met him, or it was like the second time, whatever the, he's telling me, oh, we're going to have cute kids together. The number one thing when you're. Involved with the narcissist, like they're always going to love mom use. So you're going to have that at some point, like in the beginning of the relationship, the gaslighting, the. Over time it was, oh, but I do these things because of your tone. Like, okay, you're cheating on me and you're all this infidelity because you didn't like the tone of my voice, or, oh, we have fundamental differences.'cause you don't put your keys in the same place. Like I can tell you the amount of excuses that I've heard over the years of why his behavior was the way that it was. Like there's no way, like, oh yeah, let's say I had a nasty tone. So that's going to cause you to go down this path. And then he will say, oh, but in the beginning of the relationship, so before we got married, we had an issue. I thought we were broken up. He didn't think we were broken up. I had canceled the wedding and I had met someone and I had I was intimate with him and he found out. So he's always like, used that against me by saying, oh, but you did that in the beginning, but, which I, it was a misunderstanding. I thought we were broken up. He didn't, we ended up working through it and getting married, but he always brought that up. Well, if you hadn't done that in the beginning, I wouldn't have done what I did. So I messed up, you know, before we got married. But then you would say we're with 30 people behind my back. Like, it doesn't work like that. Okay. So can I be totally honest with you? Yes. Listening to that part of your story right now, I'm either thinking A, that was something that should have been dealt with, but again, I did the same thing. Everybody does the same thing. We all make mistakes and hindsight's 2020, but I bet money on B that that's one of the areas you need to go back and maybe reprocess.'cause it sounds like. He was a narcissist even back then, and he just thought, oh, here's the golden goose. I can just use this for years to come, because if he really had a problem with it, he would've called off the wedding back then. Mm-hmm. And if he just had that to hold over to you, that was like his golden ticket to do what he wants and just keep slapping you in the face with that instance. That's my take from the outside. I'm not saying I'm right, but have you ever considered that before? Oh, a hundred percent. Because if he really, he now, he says, oh, I was just an insecure man. I should have married you to begin with. He had every. He, even the day of our wedding, I was unsure and he was like, no, no. I wanna marry you. I wanna do this. So he could have easily walked away. You're right. Yeah. Yeah. And he did. He used that. He used that as his, the golden goose or whatever your Yeah, I agree. Yeah. So let's do this. Can you hear me okay? Yes. All right. My camera at the beginning, ladies and gentlemen, was having issues and it seems to be again, but let's do this. Today, you're in a much better place than you've been. So talk to us. Where are you today, Sandra, and where are you headed next? So today I, like I said, I just, I finished my second book. I have a book deal with a publisher for three books. So they're republishing the first book, which is from Bullshit to Botox. They're publishing the second, which is from Bullshit to Broken Hearts. And the third I haven't written yet, so I'm going to be focused on that. I started a. Podcast talk show called Parties Over, so that launched in November and basically like my whole life had just taken off like in a totally different direction. So I'm no longer, I, now I have my independence in terms of, yes, we still own this mortgage company together, but I have a completely different name now for myself that's separate from him.'cause before we were always kind of combined since we started our lives working together, you know, as a married couple. So that part's been great. I've met a lot of people along the way. I have a good follow on Instagram and other opportunities have have happened because of that. In terms of like, I did some modeling work. I was able to walk the runway in New York and Paris and just opportunities like that that I wouldn't have had before. So my life took off in a different direction. I do date. I'm not involved in like a serious relationship, but you know, it's only been a year and a half, so you know, I'm just constantly working on myself trying to make improvements. Yeah, yeah. Now you still work with him? That's for me on the outside. I know my marriage, like people might view. Differently, but I know the truth and God knows the truth. And it was like the Twilight Zone, met the good son, met the Jerry Springer show. Mm-hmm. It was bizarre and I did everything I could to keep it together. There is no way in this planet I would work with my ex-wife. How do you manage to continue to work with your ex? Or is it something you're, you're going to get an exit plan and get out of there because even just a practicality of your next relationship. I don't think it's insecurity. I think it would be wisdom to, you know, if you were working with him, it's just not healthy. What, where are you going to go with that? No, we don't work together any longer, so we, I'm still a co-founder of the company, but I don't work with him on a daily basis. Okay. But I mean, yeah, so we haven't worked together in a long time in terms of side by side, even while we were married. So I'm not involved with the day-to-day operations of the company. Gotcha. You gotcha, you gotcha You okay. All right. And I'm not, again, I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just trying to process it myself.'cause there's no way in this planet I work with that woman again. So No, no, no, no. I don't work with them. And we are in the process of the divorce, so hopefully the divorce will be final in the next few months. Got you, got you. And then. Your surgeries. You know, let's go back to that. You, you said from bullshit to Botox or Botox to bullshit. What was the name of the first book? It's from Bullshit to Botox. So the first part of the book is all about different surgeries that I did, and I have experts in the book and all my books are written like in a very humorous way. But we talk about like important topics. So the first part's all about the external beauty, and then the second part is the internal beauty. So. That's why I was saying for your listeners, I kind of did everything backwards. Like I did all the external work and realized I'm not happy, I'm not really loving myself. And that's when I went to the whole like internal work journey. And so I talk about all those things in the book. The book doesn't really talk a lot about the marriage, just about my own personal experience and my own personal journey. And then the second book is more about the marriage. Being like dating and at the time, at age 53. Yeah. So now looking back, would you like, again, my stance on elective surgery is don't do it. Mm-hmm. Are you at a place now where you're like, yeah, no more elective surgery for me, or was it maybe elective surgery, but for different reasons? Where do you stand on these surgeries now? I think that you should do whatever makes you happy as long as you do it for yourself. I don't think there's anything wrong with the elective surgeries. As long as you're doing them for the right reason. You're doing them for yourself. You're doing them, you know, just to look better or feel better about yourself, but you're not doing it for somebody else and you're not doing it because you don't love yourself. I don't think there's anything wrong with it. Get 25 surgeries if you want, as long as you're doing them for you, and also that you're going to the right people and you look natural because so many people will go down this rabbit hole and they'll look unnatural. It just doesn't really work out the way that it should. So I explain all that in the book. And it's a good guide for women where if they don't know where to start, or even if they just wanna do non-invasive treatments, I talk about everything in there. So yeah, people. All right. And I do, I want to just rehash this so I don't. I believe the Bible is clear on divorce that you don't get divorced unless it's for adultery. Mm-hmm. Adultery even then, you know, you try to make the marriage work, but if you're in a relationship. Like we had, ladies and gentlemen, you know, there is the biblical oat and God knows how painful like that type of broken vow is. You, it's a broken vow to God and a broken vow to you and your family. That's why he allows for it from what I can read in the Bible. But now that you get to heal and move on, Sandra, where are you headed next and how can our Remarkable community help you get there? So. I have my website if anybody wants to reach out, it's Sandra Lena Silverman. My Instagram is Sandra Lena Silverman. My show is on YouTube and all the podcast platforms called Parties Over and my books, well, the first book from Bullshit de Botox is on Amazon and Barnes and Noble, and the second one will be published this year. So I would love to hear from any of your listeners, and that's how they can reach me. Awesome. Excellent. And then before we wrap up this episode from your birth to today mm-hmm. Is there anything we missed, significant that you want to talk about in your life or any final just thoughts, wisdom that like, you know, I feel like I need to share this? No, I think we've pretty much covered it all. All right. Well ladies. Ladies and gentlemen, like our slogan says Listen. Do. Repeat. For Life!. Don't just listen to the great information that Sandra presented, but do apply the things you know, you need to repeat it each day. Have those good boundaries and hard lines so you can have a great life in this world. But most importantly, a turning to come. So Sandra, thank you again for being here today. Thank you. Thank you so much. This was great. Thank you. Thank you for inviting me. Oh. Absolutely, it's been an honor. Ladies and gentlemen, if you have any questions, you can check out the show notes, whether you're listening through your favorite podcast player or on our Rumble or YouTube channel, on our website. Connect with Sandra and if you need anything else, let us both know and we'll do what we can to help you. So I'm David Pasqualone and we'll see you in the next episode. Ciao. Ladies and gentlemen, I sincerely hope this show has inspired you. The whole purpose of The Remarkable People Podcast is to inspire you, to motivate you into action, to help you have an even better life, to overcome things you've not yet been able to overcome or to grow to the next level that you never thought possible. And all of this, not just to benefit you in this world, but to have you come to a relationship with God where it grows every day stronger. And not just this world is blessed, but your eternity is blessed. And we sincerely want to do just that, and to glorify God. And we hope with this episode we accomplish that. If we did. Please let me know. It's great to be encouraged and to spread the word to our Remarkable guests that it helped in your life. If we didn't, let me know. Write me an email. You can go to DavidPasqualone.com. Go to our contact us page and let me know what you think. I got tough skin. Let it rip. Anything you can think of to make this a better podcast to help you grow and to glorify, God, I'm in. So that's it. Thank you for listening to the podcast. Thank you for sending us feedback. If we can help you in any way, let us know. And if you can spread the word about the Remarkable People Podcast, share the episode to your friends, your family on social media. It would be a huge honor and blessing. Again, I'm not trying to be the most famous podcast in the world for my benefit, I truly want a podcast that's the best podcast in the world to help as many people as we can to have a better life, come to know Christ, to grow in the Lord, and to have that salvation so they can be with God and peace and joy in eternity. And right now we're together on this earth, so let's do everything we can to work together and help each other grow. Like the Bible says, love the Lord thy God as a first commandment. And the next command is to love thy neighbor as thyself. So let's do it together. I'm David Pasqualone. I love you. Not as much as God loves you, but if I can help you in any way, just ask. And again, please share this with your friends and family so we can help them too. Ciao and see you in the next episode.