Tristen Epps Talks Top Chef, Cultural Cuisine and Finding His Culinary Voice

Want the INSIDE SCOOP on building and growing a food business? Subscribe to our newsletter.

Today on Chefs Without Restaurants, I speak with Chef Tristen Epps, a Season 22 finalist on Top Chef and a James Beard–recognized chef. From his Trinidadian heritage to a globe-trotting childhood in Guam, Japan, and the Philippines, Tristen’s culinary path was built on a foundation of cultural diversity and bold flavor. He’s a Johnson & Wales graduate, completed the rigorous Greenbrier apprenticeship under Chef Richard Rosendale, and worked closely with Marcus Samuelsson, who became both a professional and personal mentor. 

Our conversation explores culinary education and mentorship, and how institutional bias and discrimination continue to undervalue certain cuisines. We also examine how pricing can reflect, or deny, cultural respect in the food world. 

Tristen shares what it was like competing on Top Chef, and why competitions fuel his creativity.

TRISTEN EPPS
Tristen's Instagram and Facebook
Check out Tristen's website

Podcast with Top Chef Season 22 contestant Lana Lagomarsini

CHEFS WITHOUT RESTAURANTS
If you enjoy the show and would like to support it financially, please check out our Sponsorship page (we get a commission when you use our links).
Get the Chefs Without Restaurants Newsletter
Chefs Without Restaurants Instagram, Threads, TikTok and YouTube
The Chefs Without Restaurants Private Facebook Group
Chris Spear's personal chef business Perfect Little Bites

PERSONAL CHEF BUSINESS STARTUP GUIDE
Listen to the podcast here, or on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or YouTube
Follow us on Instagram, Threads, TikTok and YouTube
Reach out at chefstartup@gmail.com

Transcript

Chris Spear: [00:00:00] Who's been watching the season of Top Chef as of this recording, they're down to the finale with three chefs left, and by the time you hear this, that last episode will have aired no finale spoilers here if you haven't watched it yet. But if you've been following along, you'll definitely recognize today's guest, chef Tristan PPS has been bringing bold flavors, big heart, and some serious skill to this season's competition.

And today we're getting the full story behind one of the chefs you might have been rooting for this season. This is Chris Spear, and you're listening to Chefs Without Restaurants, the show where I speak with culinary entrepreneurs and people working in the food and beverage industry outside of a traditional restaurant setting.

I have 32 years of working in kitchens but not restaurants, and currently operate a personal chef service called Perfect Little Bites, doing dinner parties in the Washington DC area. And yes, this show is Chefs Without Restaurants. And yes, chef Tristan is a restaurant chef. In fact, in the episode he says that he loves [00:01:00] restaurants so much.

It's what he just wants to do. He doesn't wanna do catering. Private dinners are fine, but he is a restaurant chef through and through. And that's fine with me for this episode because I really wanted to talk to him and I was excited to have him on the show. And I think you're also gonna enjoy this if you don't know much about him.

Tristan's a James Beard nominated chef with Trinidadian Roots, a Johnson Wales graduate like myself. And he completed the three year Green Briar apprenticeship under Master Chef Rich Rosendale, who is also a guest on this podcast. And after that, he spent a lot of time working with Chef Marcus Samuelson, someone who I think he would call a mentor for sure.

We talk about his international upbringing, culinary school, that apprenticeship. And I gave Tristan a lot of room to talk about what he wanted to talk about. We really get into the value that we, and that's the collective we place on different cuisines, especially food from the black diaspora and other underrepresented cultures.

Why are people willing to [00:02:00] pay more for Italian and French food than say Haitian or Trinidadian food? This episode goes beyond Food is about culture, identity, and what it really means to have your work valued. So if you're into conversations that challenge the status quo and celebrate the richness of global cuisines, I think this one's for you.

And congratulations to Chef Tristan. I'm really hoping he pulled off a win here, but even if he didn't, I'm super proud of him and I really enjoyed watching him this season. But when you're finished, if you enjoyed the show, be sure to subscribe and as always, share it with a friend. Okay, let's get into it.

Thanks so much for listening and have a great weekend. Hey Tristan, welcome to the show. Thanks so much for coming on. Hey, man, I appreciate it, Chris. Thanks for having me on. It's, uh, it's exciting to have you on because right now I'm sure many of our listeners know you're on the current season of Top Chef.

I've talked to a lot of people who've been on Top Chef, but never someone who is still going through it. So, [00:03:00] um, that, that's pretty cool. 

Tristen Epps: Yeah, 

Chris Spear: it's 

Tristen Epps: been a, it's, it's been 

Chris Spear: kind of a journey going and kind of watching it. Is that weird? Watching it like in, you know, uh, after you've gone through it, like, is it weird sitting at home on the couch watching the show?

Tristen Epps: Yeah, because there's like two sides of it, right? You, you know that you've lived through it, but you also don't know how it's coming off. So it's just as much a surprise for everybody else, and a lot of the times you block a lot of that trauma out, so you're just like, man, did that really happen like that?

Or is that what was really going on? So. It's very different. 

Chris Spear: Yeah. Well, before we get into Top Chef, let's kind of go backwards a little bit. When did you know you wanted to be a chef? 

Tristen Epps: Oh, uh, you know what, I probably was maybe like seven, eight years old. I'm one of those really lucky people who found something they liked and found out that it could be a career.

Um, I maybe didn't take it seriously until maybe high school, but I [00:04:00] loved cooking and if there was a way to, to cook and make that my future, it was 

Chris Spear: like that. So you did a lot of cooking, like at home, like with mom or by yourself? 

Tristen Epps: Uh, I mean, a little bit. So, I mean, some of it was a trip to Japan and we were there for a little bit of time and the food was very different from what I grew up with, uh, being Trinidadian and.

I remember I watched a lot of like cartoons and anime as a kid. I mean, I still do, but uh, I remember all of it was in Japanese and the only way to watch something in English that I understood was like QVC or like, or like a version of QVC. And they were making like a, they, they were like trying to sell a waffle maker and they were making waffles and waffles were already kind of a new thing to me.

But, uh, they were putting ice cream on it. They were putting chicken on it. They were putting all sorts of things. And me seeing like [00:05:00] a certain food could be customized in a way, like so many different ways, like really, uh, really enamored me. 

Chris Spear: When you said Japan, I didn't think that's where you were gonna go with getting your culinary inspiration was gonna be a QVC type show.

So that's, that's really interesting to me. Yeah. I was thinking like you had this great like Oma sushi experience when you were like seven, eight years old or something. 

Tristen Epps: No, I mean, there was a couple experiences that like, I really hold really near and dear, like as in cooking, it was scrambled eggs, you know, how something could go from a hard shell egg to like this viscous little orb to, to like delicious with the addition of heat, you know?

And like, and then we added cheese, and then we added green onions. And to me, once again, it was always that, like customization that I really liked. And my mom always took me out to eat on Friday nights to some restaurant. We got dressed up, we went to a really nice restaurant, or what we thought was a really nice restaurant.

And, uh, we would eat. And it was, it [00:06:00] was great. And I, I loved it. I got to order whatever I wanted, uh, which was amazing. You know, I have a, like a Caribbean military mother, so there wasn't a lot of like questions asked. There was a lot of like commands given. So being asked, I mean, it was, it all got me. 

Chris Spear: So like what were some of those things when you went out to eat that maybe you had never had and saw on a menu and wanted to try?

Does anything stand out? 

Tristen Epps: So sushi was one of them, obviously, and I come from a culture where not a lot of raw things are, are, are eaten and consumed. Uh, so that was a big one. I remember having a fish called Mahi mahi and me just loving the name and thought it was the coolest thing. You know, there was this restaurant in Guam and I remember it so well, uh, and I must have been like six or seven and it was called Top of the Mar, and it was on a cliff that overlooked a beach and it was essentially like a, a Mongolian barbecue.

It only took me like 20 years to figure [00:07:00] out what that actually was like, what I was like seeing. And you know, like. You would go around and you would grab noodles or rice and like all the different marinated meats and all these things. And one day I saw a person in line like, grab an egg and never thought of that to go in what I was making.

And you would take it up to these guys on this big, like flaming drum and they'd throw it all on there and they'd like mix it up. I mean, it's like Benihana for any kid, right? Like it's just the best day of your life. And it's just the most enamoring thing. Like having those kinds of things really like shaped what I was used to eating, like rice, roti, curry, you know, those kinds of things.

Chris Spear: I think we should have more experiential dining like that. Like in, like, I, I don't know that my kids have ever, ever even been to something like that. Like we go to a lot of restaurants, but I don't know they've ever been to something similar. Like we, they've never been to a Benihana or anything. Maybe we should bring 'em out more to more experiential dining.

I don't know. I 

Tristen Epps: mean, maybe [00:08:00] like, you know, it, it is a cool experience as a kid for sure. I think us as chefs are like jaded, like, are you kidding me? Like, 

Chris Spear: yeah, that's how I am. Yeah. Onion, 

Tristen Epps: volcano, 

Chris Spear: $30 a person for what? Yeah, exactly. And then you end up going to Johnson Wales. I, myself also Johnson Wales graduate.

I went to Providence, graduated a few years before you. Did you find the college experience to be good? 

Tristen Epps: Yeah, I loved it. Honestly, it was like my way out of home, right? It was my, my way. I had already given up my own scholarships for going to college for sports. I had made my decision, um, was finally gonna pursue something that I'd been really passionate about that I didn't necessarily know.

Could be a career, but there was like a whole college just like that specialized in it. Will I say that like I don't regret anything. I loved going there. Uh, I made great friends. I really put the work in and. I think that was worth it for me. [00:09:00] And I think some people don't really put the work in, so therefore, culinary school is kind of, I mean, it ends up being kind of bullshit and I would just say, go work and go make money rather than like, go get in debt.

But, you know, I partied, right? Like I had fun. Uh, but you know, on Saturday mornings I did the little distinguished dinners and, and anything I could, uh, help or volunteer for, I did, you know, I always found that it was really annoying, like Right. You went to like, what is the class, like French or French class?

That we do. And you know, you like split everybody up into groups and like, you're gonna do this dish and your group's gonna do this dish. And like I end up on like vichy carrots, right? So it's like I'm, I'm paying the same $40,000 a year that you are and I'm doing carrots and you're doing lobster and sweet bread.

So I would come to the class afterwards and then just like tag along. 'cause I, you know, I asked if I could, so I really wanted to get what I could out of it. 

Chris Spear: That's a [00:10:00] great point. I don't think a lot of people know how that works, but yes, there were many days where it's like, I'm doing green beans almondine, and I have four hours to do that for 20 people.

Yeah. And that's like literally all I'm doing and I missed all the cool French stuff or whatever. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I, um, it's almost like you knew kind of maybe what I would ask because, you know, I don't wanna go down that path, but I have spoken to a lot of people about, you know, would you do it again? I mean, it's a very different age than I graduated in 1998.

So the world is very different than it was then, especially with, you know, um, availability of knowledge and working opportunities. I think. And I'd say if you're gonna go, I'd at least hold off a year or two. Um, yeah. And then decide like, not necessarily like 18 years old, I've never worked in a kitchen.

Let me just go off to culinary school without having ever even tried it. 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. I've watched a lot of Emerald Live. It looks cool. Let me, let me go to cool school. You know, I 

Chris Spear: mean, that, that's kind of how I was though. I mean, I grew up in Massachusetts. [00:11:00] Emerald was from Massachusetts. Yeah, of course he went to Johnson Wales, you know, I was like, sure, let me go.

I didn't actually have that much restaurant experience, but it worked out for me. Okay. And if nothing else, I met my wife there and my best friends, so, you know, um, all good. Uh, but then you also worked at the Greenbrier was, what was that experience like for you? 

Tristen Epps: So, yeah, when I left school I was bored. You know, I was working and I was going to school.

Uh, when I graduated, I went and got like a second job. Uh, I was just used to it and I really wanted to, I felt like I exhausted all of the places I wanted to work in, in Charlotte at the time. And it was very much like a growing city still. And, you know, they wanted more interns than they wanted employees at this point.

'cause we were a little cheaper at that point. So I found out about the Greenbriar through one of my classes. One of my teachers was a graduate of their apprenticeship program. Also at that time, [00:12:00] the current, like the season of Top Chef was there, I think it was season six and it was Michael Gio. 

Chris Spear: Yeah. Good season.

And I 

Tristen Epps: had found out that he went to the Green Briar and graduated there. Uh, I had just gotten a new Chef de cuisine and he was friends with my global GIO and he was a graduate. So like all of these things were kind of coming, uh, like kind of leading me to like, let's give it a try. And, uh, I went up, I staged, I went up there and I was in, you know, they tell you all the stories.

It was started, I mean, at that time, 57 years ago, this apprenticeship program only had like 12% like graduation rate. You know, Richard Rosendale is like this, demi god of this classical cooking and modern cooking. And it kind of like, was this like. You're those, those kids that go into the mountains as monks and become out as ninjas.

Like that, that's how I looked at it. Right? Like otherwise, I wasn't gonna convince myself to go to West [00:13:00] Virginia. And, uh, it was, it was very, it was very different. It was a culture shock, you know, going from a city to the mountains instantly, like shave off the beard that I just finally got to grow. And it was just like a really serious culinary program.

And in some ways it represented a little bit of like the toxicity we were trying to get rid of and other ways it taught me so, so, so, so much. And it was. You know, I would always say it was a mixed experience. I'm, I'm better for it a hundred percent. I'll always say that. But the experience of it became strange for me because I just wanted to evolve and keep growing.

And they kind of just, they take you to a point that they find a value in and then they, they, the other, no other direction is really allowed. So 

Chris Spear: it's weird because I feel like there's, you know, the kitchen is still [00:14:00] evolving and the kitchen culture and all that. And, you know, a lot of people came up through those kitchens and have come out the other side and said they, they really enjoyed it.

But I don't think that that would be the kind of kitchen experience for me. Um, and I don't know, like is the food like overly particular, is that the word? Like, I don't know that I'm into ultra fine dining. I am because 

Tristen Epps: I like to see skill shown in a lot of different ways. And ultra fine dining is, I think what it was defined as was like ultra focus.

Listen, I've always described fine dining as just, just giving a little bit more of a fuck, right? Like just, yeah. That's all it was. And, and that's what I thought it had to be, right? Like I really give a shit about how I look and my pristine white coat and my black pants and my shiny shoes and that, right?

I [00:15:00] came from a military back background with my mom, you know, the food and the, the, how everything was cut and the precision and all of that. It just seemed so nuanced and I was attracted to that part. The part that I forgot or wasn't being conveyed was that's not the end all be all. And so few people get to taste that and it's kind of.

Unapproachable. And in my family and in my, my circle, right, they never get to touch that, right? Like, yeah. That's just not a, a circle that we live in, right? Caviar fo gras, lobster, like lobster was lobster, you know, lobster, uh, red lobster, you know. So, um, it was attractive, but also like unobtainable, and I didn't like the unobtainable part of it.

Uh, so obviously fine dining's starting to take a shift, right? And once [00:16:00] again, as I define it, I still think that you can do fine dining without the tablecloths, the towel hats, the, the precision knife cuts, the, all of that. Like, I still think that experience can be obtained, you know? It's how you feel when you leave.

Chris Spear: Yeah, no, a hundred percent. And I guess like. Listen. I know, I know Rich. Um, I, I actually joined the American Culinary Federation, which was not, that's not really my, my circle, but, um, rich moved back to this area not too long ago, and he joined our chapter. And the first day that Rich rolled in, I was like, oh, shit.

Like Rich is like in this a CF chapter. That was pretty cool. And I've gotten to know him and he is been on the podcast, super respect for him. But like that kusta or kind of stuff like, yeah, that, that doesn't interest me. Like that level of cooking, like it's a little too showy and not as like, I don't know, I don't know.

Maybe I'm just talking on my ass here. But anyway, uh, [00:17:00] you know, I'm sure the experience was formative and then you can take what you liked and what you didn't like, and then yeah, hopefully carry forward through your own lens, if you will. No, for 

Tristen Epps: sure. I mean, when I first saw this stuff, I thought it was amazing.

Right? But, you know, I, I, I. I thought it was amazing 'cause I hadn't seen it before. But then when I like did it and tasted it and I was like, all right, it's cool. It's all right. Like do I want to eat this or do this again? And I was there while Rich was doing his boku store, you know, practice, and they set up this giant war room and I mean, it was, it was really cool to see, but I don't know, it just didn't look fun.

And the a CF circle just seemed like, and I did the competitions. 'cause once again I really liked competition, but I. You know, then I'd get docked points. 'cause my guer had gr air instead of menthol. And I was like, what? 

Chris Spear: Yeah, yeah. No, that's how, that's how I feel like when I, I, I'm not, I live in Maryland and when I moved [00:18:00] here I was like, oh, that'd be a great way to meet people.

Kind of like in the culinary circle. And it was just like a bunch of older, like country club guys. Yeah. And like that's just not my vibe. Like nothing wrong with it. Those people do a great job. I'm super impressed with what they can do. I just found that like it wasn't for me really. Yeah, yeah. No, for sure.

And then you also worked for Marcus Samuelson. Was that like, how did that compare to your green Bri Brier experience? So, 

Tristen Epps: I mean, just a crazy juxtaposition, right? So from the black pants, the white coat, and you know, the tall hat and all the French terms and the wee chefs to. You know, wear what you want.

You know, the, the colorful aprons, the, the backwards fitted hats. Um, the, the dining room was so loud, you know, the music, the, you know, just the people working next to me. It [00:19:00] was, it was amazing. And what I'm happy about is that I got those formative skills right through. And this is why I don't regret, right?

Like, I got these skills to be organized. I got the next skills to be fast and, and flavor profiles and technique. And then I got to take it to like somewhere where I could like show culture and show the things that meant something to me and feel a little bit more soulful. And it was, I don't know, it was such a great experience.

It was the first time I got to like, be. Me and find a voice of what I actually liked about cooking and what I thought cooking was. 

Chris Spear: So did you start to be given some leeway there then, it sounds like, to create dishes and kind of find out who, figure out who you were as a chef? 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. It was the first time I was asked, where are you from?

You should cook something from there. [00:20:00] You know, up until then it was like, make this Italian dish, make this a SC dish. Make this, you know, like it was always that. And then, you know, there was times where I tried to insert my stuff into it with the skills that I had and it, it was met with like confusion or, you know, always not the, the most open to it because it was like, you need to learn this.

And my, you know, I always had a lot of questions and you know, my questions were, you know, why is Esca the standard of this, you know, Chinese cuisine, Japanese cuisine, African cuisine are all older than him. Why are these not the bases, right? Like, why is being French trained the standard of skill? 

Chris Spear: And have we gotten that answer?

Because I feel like they're still having this conversation, like out in the world. You know, I just saw someone last week say something about like the mother sauces and everyone should know the mother sauces, which is like, it's fine, but I would rather eat Ethiopian food than French food. And like, I can't tell you the last [00:21:00] time I made an Espanol, but you know, I, I, or I'll make like a guillo salsa.

Like, it's just more interesting to me. Why are these classical French sauces the epitome of knowing how to cook? 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. And I mean, those were the questions I had and those were the questions that, you know, sometimes were well received with like, you know, answers and sometimes not right. Like it's, and it is what it is.

Yeah. I also get that like sometimes just stick to. What somebody thinks are the bases. Learn that and then go off and find what you, what you want. But I feel like you have to give people the opportunity to explore them themselves and then, and then teach. And that's what I kind of try to do now. 

Chris Spear: So when were you first given the reigns to run your own kitchen and um, you know, I guess like how did that go?

Tristen Epps: So, I mean, I started at Red Rooster as a sous chef, but was given so much to do, right? Like our chef de cuisine was, you know, he was there. He was, [00:22:00] he was fine. He was very like supportive and he was also tired. And he was just like, you guys do you two sous chefs, just do whatever you want. And there was me and there was a Filipino kid, and both of us were like.

Sure if we're gonna, if we're in charge of this stuff, we're gonna make the menu and probably be our own demons, right? Because we found out really quick, like maybe don't make the dishes so intricate when you're doing, you know, 500 covers, 400 covers. But we, we ran that kitchen really well. But when it came to like my actual owned kitchen as executive chef, I opened a restaurant in, uh, Brooklyn and it was a farm to table restaurant.

It was owned by, uh, Caribbean, uh, ownership. And I felt like I was kind of getting all of the cool things that I really liked. I got to do, you know, fine dining at certain parts. I got to do casual and other parts. I got to do Caribbean. [00:23:00] I kind of got to do all of it and kind of put a little bit of my ethos of like wanting to do some farm to table in there as well.

Chris Spear: How would you describe your food today if you had to, you know, obviously people wanna know, like, what do you cook? I mean, I've seen you on Top Chef, is that I'm sure representative kind of where you are in your career right now? 

Tristen Epps: Um, yeah. It, it really is. I, I'm a product of my experiences and while I'll say, you know, as a blanket statement, like I do like Neo Afro-Caribbean cuisine, right?

That is, that is, but that's, I've only been able to identify that in the last seven, eight years. Right. But my career goes back further than that. Right. It takes me to Sweden, it takes me to The Bahamas, Bermuda, you know, my upbringing, the, the fast food jobs that I had. Golden Corral, like, [00:24:00] you know. Times with, you know, cooking with Thai friends and Turkish friends.

And so I would say global, I would say just I have a really good understanding because I am a, I'm kind of a dweeb on food stories, and that's what got me to my Afro-Caribbean thing of just asking a lot of questions. And so I would say my food style now is just answering, and I'm a, I love to be a historian about food and, you know, so that's where my tur, that's where the Turkish stuff comes from.

And that's where Portuguese, you know, if you take Vasco de Gamma and look out as his roots, like what would the world be like without what Vasco de Gamma did, right? Like what would the world be without the spice trade, without colonization? And my understanding has been trying to do that. And because a lot of that is rooted in African cuisine as the start.

Um, that's where, that's where [00:25:00] my Afro-Caribbean cuisine comes. 'cause that's also my journey. 

Chris Spear: Do you find it interesting or, I'm, uh, I dunno if interesting is the word, but like, there seems to be a lot more focus in recent years on African Afro-Caribbean cooking. Like, are you seeing this as a whole, like, I don't wanna say trend, but just like more up and coming.

Like you're definitely seeing more attention placed on those cuisines than I can remember in, in past years. I, I mean, I am, I, I really, really 

Tristen Epps: am. It is been an amazing thing to see a lot of success, right? The, the Kwame Achi, the mm-hmm The Eric Ajapon, the Gregory Gord days, you know, the. Coco and Iko in London.

You know, there's so many people doing this really great thing and you know, some of it I think, started with Marcus. It's what attracted me to him, right? I once again had only seen a certain image of a chef, and as a kid, I [00:26:00] finally saw this man. That was black, working in a Swedish restaurant, doing Afro Swedish cuisine.

But, and it's funny 'cause it ended up doing something different later, but like, you know, like it wasn't just, he wasn't just being put in a box of like soul food and barbecue and he was wearing like a denim coat and it was just so different for me and I saw something cool and something different and I don't have to be in this, this box.

I could be whatever I want and tell a story. So I think that we're starting to have more acceptance of that and people are starting to accept the, their story a lot more. So it's starting to come out and you know, people are recognizing it and I love that. 

Chris Spear: I mean, and obviously it's very regional. Um, you know, I have a, maybe a slightly distorted view because I live outside Washington, DC you know, like we've [00:27:00] had Kwame's been here.

Eric has a restaurant here, you know. Yeah. Uh, I actually met Marcus last week. He's got a new restaurant coming to DC Yeah. Sly. Yeah. You know, we've, we've got the most Ethiopian restaurants like in the United States in like one little cluster. So I see a lot of it, you know, it's probably different as you get out to like Boise, Idaho or something like that.

Sure. But, but definitely in the mainstream food media, I've seen so much of this and I think it's really cool. 'cause I really love the food and wanna keep trying these new cuisines I've never had before. 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. I mean, it's, I, I think it's really great. I mean, I, I, you know, I'm from the DMV too, so I grew up going to DC a lot.

You know, ever since the sixth grade and you know, the Ethiopian cuisine was absolutely there, but when you went in there, it was nothing but Ethiopians. And now you can see a lot more people in there, and people are a lot more open. And it is, you know, like I said, it's a really beautiful thing that it's starting to get the attention that it, [00:28:00] it deserves.

And you're finding more chefs have the same journey, right? Like, you know, Kwame worked in fine dining, went into this, now, you know, Gregory worked in fine dining, went into his route, and so you're seeing all of this collective of, of these skills coming together, but with stories being able to match them on their parallels.

Chris Spear: Yeah, I think it's great. And, um, I need to get out to more of these restaurants really soon to do some eating because, uh, I, I feel like I'm falling behind there. We always feel that way when you're chefs like you're always cooking, never eating. What do you, what do you have cooking? Um, what's going on with you right now, professionally?

Where are you at and what do you have working on? You know what, right now it 

Tristen Epps: has been, I've been really like blessed to, I, I took some time off from working in an actual kitchen and I'm addicted to being in a kitchen like I am a, a restaurant chef. I don't want to cater. Uh, you know, I love a private [00:29:00] dinner every once in a while.

I love, but I am just, I love being in a restaurant. I like ordering my food. I like it coming. I like guests. I like. Service. I like all of that, addicted to it. But for the last year, I kind of took time off of that so I could focus on trying to open up a restaurant. I've been wanting to do this for years, but every time I get like another offer, I get scared.

Right. I'm, I'm, I want to be comfortable. Uh, you know, I like going to restaurants when I can get off, you know, and like being able to pay for that. And, but, uh, I've taken the last maybe like year, traveled, kind of done some events, you know, some with Marcus, some without a lot of, you know, private dinners, private events, and really have just kind of practiced my own skills.

But this is all to lead up to my own restaurant. And so that's what I'm looking for right now. You know, I'm looking at spaces, I am looking at different opportunities to get what I want, and I've just been [00:30:00] shaping kind of my dream. The show will be right back after a word from our 

Chris Spear: sponsor. 

Tristen Epps: I. 

Chris Spear: Hey chefs, it's Chris here with a quick message.

Are you thinking about starting your own personal chef business? Or maybe you're stuck trying to grow it? Then check out my other podcast, personal Chef, business Startup Guide. I'm sharing real world tips from over a decade of running my own successful personal chef business. Everything from pricing strategies to dealing with picky clients.

I also interview some of the best people who can help get you there as well. So if you're ready to turn your culinary skills into a profitable business, head over to Personal Chef Business Startup Guide, wherever you listen to podcasts. Let's build that dream together. Also, you can find the links in these show notes.

What do you think about the whole popup thing? Because it seems like everyone has a popup. Uh, some, you know, a lot of people use it as the gateway to a brick and mortar. What's your experience been with that, either as both a, a [00:31:00] diner or someone who's done that? I mean, I'll say it like this. I love a popup because 

Tristen Epps: it supports people.

That's the first thing that, that's the only reason why I'll go to a popup. I, I just wanna support somebody because I feel like if we don't do that, then that's one brick and mortar we may never have. That might be great. And the other way is like with me doing them, I change my mind a lot. I have a million ideas in my head.

I probably scale up too much when I shouldn't. And pop-ups are a really good way to humble the shit out of you, to show you what's is possible and not possible. And if you don't love it, you'll know that day. And so I've really used it to kind of mold the format of what I wanna do in life, uh, restaurant wise.

Um, see how people [00:32:00] really. Take to my cuisine that I'm saying, right? Because yes, I'm seeing all the success that other chefs are having with it, but is theirs exactly mine and is their area exactly where I'm doing it? And, and I'm trying to take it to another level, higher and fine dining, right? So like I want to do the Oma cae, but it's African and Caribbean and Southern and like that black diaspora cuisine.

I wanna take it to that level. And I'm really trying to find where people find the value in that, right? Like, we'll all go spend two, like 150 bucks on a single steak, on a plate at a steakhouse. We'll all go do that when it says it's French, we'll all go do that. How I, I am doing these popups to test where the threshold is with this cuisine because I feel like as soon as we hit the equator, everyone's value for food starts to dip.

And. [00:33:00] That's where I really want to change. And the popups have been really kind of helping me do that. And it's also helping me like bring more value to it because people are loving it. And I was skeptical because I was made skeptical my entire career. So, you know, I cook with fear and, and that's what kept me in restaurants and not opening my own because I was just like, it's not gonna work.

They want this. It's not gonna work. They're used to this. It's not gonna work. I, I just need to do this. And now that's why I've like forced myself to just go through it, go through the exercise and, and see what people like and what they're willing to pay for or make them figure out that they wanna pay for it.

Chris Spear: Do you think you still need to be outspoken about. Justifying prices for this kind of cuisine, like where do you see your role in that as far as being outspoken about like, this is why this costs this much, or this is why we should be paying this much. Do you have those conversations [00:34:00] publicly? Oh, all the time.

Tristen Epps: I even do this little exercise where I wanna see where people's heads are at, where, you know, I'll hold up. I'll try to give people, you know, I'll, I'll bring 'em with me, but I'll give everybody the dollar signs, things that you get on like Yelp and stuff. And I'll just start going through cuisines and I'll ask how many, what people think the the cuisine is worth.

Right? And no matter what, right? If I go Italian, like $2 signs will go up, some will be three. If I say Japanese, you know, you'll get some people that hit up three 'cause that's really expensive. And some people that hit up one, and you'll kind of know where they eat Japanese cuisine at. But you know, French $3 signs, a steakhouse, $3 signs, and then you start throwing in like Colombian, $1 side and you know, Mexican $1 side.

And they're not saying that these cuisines aren't delicious. They're not saying that they don't eat them. You know, you say African food and they're like. Throw the dollar [00:35:00] sign like halfway. Like they, like, you know what I mean? Like, they, they don't, they don't necessarily say that it's bad. They're just like, I've never paid this much for this.

I've only ever gotten this food in a to-go container, and why should I pay this much for it? 

Chris Spear: Yeah. I, uh, a few years ago I heard Alex speak and he was saying something along the lines of like, listen, you go to La Berna ine love Eric Repair. Right? But you get like two scallops on a plate, you know, French technique, butter sauce, lemon wine, butter, whatever.

The dish is like $25. It's a, a first course. Everyone's fine with that. He's like, I put that on a, you know, a tortilla and it's a taco and people lose their mind. But I'm, yeah. Next izing the corn in-house. We're grinding it. We're making our own tortillas. We're making our own sice, all the accompaniments.

These, like, arguably it's like three times the work, but because now it's identified as a taco, people just absolutely lose their shit about it. And you can't sell a $28 taco. For sure. 

Tristen Epps: And, and, and that's the [00:36:00] part, right? That is the, we are what we're familiar with. And you know, like people fear what they don't understand.

Uh, and you're right, like it. And, and right as soon as you call it a taco, it is something that you stand up to eat and you smash. And all of the, the thought process of sourcing single, you know, you know, single harvest corn and, and the ization process and everything, you went to go through that, right?

Like I, I, I went to Eon, right? It was delicious, right? And of course, did I quickly look at a $35 set of tacos? I did. But then I said, you know what, I'm here. Work goes into this. Is it delicious enough? Said we just can't. Give values to things just because of where it's from. It it's, it's unfair to certain cuisines, right?

It's just we did that to Japanese cuisine, somehow Japanese cuisines, marketing and ability to get out [00:37:00] of that worked. And now 80% of Michelin star restaurants or Japanese worldwide, and someone had to be outspoken about it. Someone had to do it. And until someone can not be sure which one's the most expensive cuisine, like I would like to be outspoken about it, 

Chris Spear: keep talking about it.

Something I talk about all the time. I love when people talk about this, especially when it's not centered on Eurocentric classics like French and Italian. We all know kind of what that is. I'm more interested in seeing the, the finer dining versions of other cuisines. 

Tristen Epps: I mean, it, it's gotta be interesting, right?

Like, we've all had these dishes before. So let's see, some boulder sauces, right? Like, let's see, some Mexico sauces. Let's see some sauce from Peru. Let's some African sauces. I mean, shit, even if we're gonna do European, like, let's go a little deeper, right? Like, what's a Bulgarian dish? Right? Let's like, you know, what's the check doing [00:38:00] right now?

Like that. Those are the things that I wanna, I want to talk about. 

Chris Spear: On the flip side, you need to deliver because I will say I went to a high-end Filipino restaurant. Okay. And it was like crazy expensive. And there was like nothing. I ordered some chicken dish and it was like, it came out, I don't even re know if it was two drumsticks.

It was like one drumstick, maybe there was two, but there was like no sauce. It was just like a dry rub and grilled. And it came with a bowl of white rice. Like I, I'm not kidding when I say it was like maybe two drumsticks and a bowl of white rice, and it was like $27. Like that was it. And that was the entree.

It wasn't like a starter. Wow. And at that point I'm like, uh, there's like a lot of great Filipino places where I could go get like an $8 bowl of like really awesome stuff. And I just felt like, I don't mind paying for it. But if you are going to be like the fine dining version of like Filipino cooking, then like you also need to go like balls out if you're gonna be charging those kind of prices, in my opinion.

I mean, 

Tristen Epps: when I lived in the Philippines as a kid, that what you described was [00:39:00] a number one at McDonald's, but. And that's where I take it very seriously because Marcus always told me like, if we're gonna do this, we need to do it well because we need to build trust. And that's what we're doing. That's what I'm doing.

It's the only reason why I actually ever did TV was to build trust. And unfortunately, this is the route that we had to go to get there. Right? Once again, the Kwame's, the, the Eric a, like, we had to like go put ourselves out there and show it and be successful at it. At a grand on a, on a, on a, on a scale like that, in order for people to look and say, oh 

Chris Spear: my God, look at it, it's 

Tristen Epps: good.

And we had to go get value. We had to go get, um, validated by white people to say it was good for other people to come try it, even our own people. And you know, but the biggest thing is when you're building trust, you gotta do it correctly and you gotta do it amazing so that when someone says, okay, I gave you a [00:40:00] shot.

You gotta hit it. Like you gotta, you gotta hit it. Otherwise they're just like, Nope. Back to that burger that I wanted. You know? And, and it's, it's a really important thing to try to do at a really high level. Um, because, you know, I, we, we have something to prove. No one's gonna say like, alright, this one kind of sucked.

I'll just go to the next one and pay like $32, uh, for the next place that does it. Like, nah, they're just like, no, I swear off this chicken and this rice dish and I'm gonna go get a steak. 

Chris Spear: But do you find that like your people from your backgrounds and cultures might even be more critical? Because I hear that from friends, like, one of my best friends is Filipino and he's like, yeah, like we are the hardest.

Like if a Filipino restaurant were to open up, especially like a high end one, like everyone's gonna come out in the community and be like, that's crazy. Oh yeah. A hundred percent. I mean, 

Tristen Epps: I a hundred percent. And it's funny because at first I didn't get it. I, I judged back, right? Like I would, I did a, I was [00:41:00] doing a Haitian dish, and when I lived in Miami, and for the most part, I did almost everything exactly the same, right?

I was making Rio, the only thing I changed was the cut from a pork shoulder to a St. Louis rib and the color of cabbage from white to red. But past that, it was all the same and the most critical, you know? And I charged 27 bucks for it. And it was like three ribs, four ribs or something like that. And man, I got crushed for that.

And they weren't saying it wasn't bad. They're just like, this isn't it? And why am I paying this much money? But then if I went down the street and I went to another restaurant that served the same ribs, but they called them, you know, FRA Olo ribs or whatever, right? $27. And they were like, these are amazing.

And I was like, well, why'd you value theirs over mine? These are yours. Like these are, this is legitimately yours. Right? You [00:42:00] identified with it. You saw it on the menu, you're like, oh, that's a Haitian dish. But you're the being the most critical on something that I guess I changed. But yeah, I mean, we are, we're the biggest critics and that's why, once again, popups and stuff, like, be supportive of the change so that our cuisine can evolve.

Chris Spear: Hmm. Um, well, yeah, it's a, it's a big thing that I think we still need to keep talking about, but, um, I actually, can we talk about Top Chef for a little bit? Sure. You're on Top Chef. What, like what, what made you want to go on Top Chef? I mean, I think, like we discussed before, well, one, I'm competitive. I really, really like to compete.

So this is your wheelhouse. You, you like your, you have that competitive in your soul. I do. Okay. I, I think 

Tristen Epps: competition breeds progress. Competition should just pull the best out of you, right? Like, if you're not playing to win, then why are you there? Or if you're not there to [00:43:00] get better or be around people who want to do better, then why?

Why not? Why don't you want that? And I can understand some people aren't competitive. They want like everyone to win and they want everyone to eat. And you know, there's a point to that. But for me, the best I've ever cooked was in competitions. When I met Marcus, I met him on a competition and I was working at an Italian restaurant, you know, doing my thing, got on there and all of a sudden I had to cook things I'd never cooked before.

And I was like, I didn't even know my brain could work like that. Like I was just exercising muscles that I just never used before. And I thought the food was amazing. Like amazing. And when I came back to the real world, I was like, I can't do that anymore. And so competitions really allow me to remind me why I cook, why I love cooking, and gives me that ability to be around a [00:44:00] bunch of people who feel the same way.

Chris Spear: I mean, kitchens as a whole are fast paced, they're stressful, they're hard. I'm sure top chefs the same, but like, I'm sure it's a different kind of like stress and that kind of thing. Like how do you compare those two kitchens? Like if nobody's been on a competition show, how would you describe it? In relation to like working in a regular, fast paced, maybe fine dining or high end kitchen?

I think they're the same, 

Tristen Epps: honestly. Like, I mean, I always felt like I was in a competition on the line. 

Chris Spear: Hmm. 

Tristen Epps: I just wanted to do better every single day. I wanted to clean the mushrooms a little faster every single day. I wanted the next person's job. I, I wanted all of those things. So for me, it's kind of the same, I guess to say.

The only difference is when you're on a competition. One, you don't worry about food costs or waste, right? You're just, you get it done, which sucks to say, and sometimes has been my downfall. I was like, I don't wanna waste that. I really need to use that. [00:45:00] The other part of it is like, I mean, you're still, you work against a clock, but you do that online too, right?

Like how many times has someone been like, yo, where's my scallop? And you're like, six minute chef. Like, it's, it's the same on a competition, right? You, at least that's the way I look at it. I was like, man, what's the fastest I can get this plate up in my regular kitchen and, and also in this time limit that they're giving me.

Chris Spear: Is it more mentally taxing though? Because you have to be. Yes. I mean, I think you're a creative person. It, it seems like it, but like, you know, when you're in a restaurant and you're not. Having to create like that every day necessarily. Mm-hmm. Like once you've got your menu locked in, I mean, staying in the creative space is really hard 

Tristen Epps: and trying to outthink other people your own mistakes, things that can go wrong, your own skill level, like trying to stay in that space is the hardest part of it.

I, [00:46:00] I think, you know, it's cool to put, come up with a special Right. But like, is it cool coming up with a special on the spot and then executing it perfectly with like, no second take two, right? Like, no, no way of fixing it. And then you get judged on your first try of doing something and then, okay, maybe you're successful at it, but can you do it again tomorrow?

Twice. And then can you do it again tomorrow? Twice. And can you do it again tomorrow? Twice. And. It taxes you, right? Like, you don't sleep. I don't sleep, I, I already don't sleep. So like, now add that, right? It's not the, just like when you go home, you settle down for a second, you grab a beer, you know, you watch some tv, some highlights, you go to bed, you wake up real quick like, yo, did I put the veg order in?

And then you're like, but that's it, right? Like, that's, that's where you, that's where it stops. That's where the stress stops. But when you're [00:47:00] in these competitions, it's just like you run through everything over again. Over like, alright, well I have enough time to do this. Do I wanna show this skill that I have?

Do I want to do that? Like, being in that space all the time and being nervous on how people are gonna perceive you on a, like, you know, now you're also on tv. Can I be that same person that I'm in my regular kitchen? Or like, I also have to worry about how I behave. You know, it's, it can be, yeah, really, really mentally taxing.

Honestly. It's, it becomes harder, you know, in your kitchen, you're comfortable and there you're never, 

Chris Spear: and I'm sure there's, you know, you're living with these people too, so you're kind of like, I imagine rehashing this, like, you don't just go home and decompress. Like you've got all the same people there now that you're with, and they're around you.

So you're, I'm sure thinking about it the whole time you're there. I, I think I would be, I don't know if that was your experience, but like always with your brain going, thinking about the show and the cooking. 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. I mean, you can't turn it off and it's not like you have anything to turn it off with, [00:48:00] and then you just go to round other people and they can't turn it off.

So you guys all just start talking at it because there's no other distractions other than maybe like playing Monopoly or Uno and you know, then again, you're still competing with them and just like, even a dumb way. But it, it becomes that and it's, uh. It's the not being able to turn it off and you can't distract yourself.

You can't go watch a movie, you can't go watch tv, you can't go like scroll on your phone. Like it is, you're just in it all the time 

Chris Spear: of the episodes. I think we're up through like episode nine through the episodes that people have maybe seen. Is there a challenge that you felt was particularly hard for you from a culinary standpoint?

Just like, I, I don't really know what I'm gonna do here, and it kind of threw you for a loop. So, 

Tristen Epps: I mean, if people have watched the episodes, I, it makes me look like I'm the pickiest eater ever, but I am, I am not. They just happened. So there was like [00:49:00] two episodes where, you know, one, we had to basically deconstruct it and reconstruct a dessert from a dessert to something savory.

I was able to figure out, you know, my own way through that. So I. That was the, not turning it off, but I got through it. I did well, I won that one. The next one was a pickle challenge, which there's only two things in this world. I just can't, I can't get down. And that's pickles and okra. And it was a five course meal of pickles and I thought I was never gonna get through it, but I figured it out.

I did really well. Um, got through it. Now, the one that I think has been the hardest for me was the very last, uh, episode that we just did. And the challenge was to create a stunt on a dish. Mm-hmm. And it was just really hard to conceptualize, like, what is a stunt on a dish? Right? Like, is it easy to get distracted by trying to do molecular gastronomy [00:50:00] and then it just like, doesn't taste good, or, you know, the juice isn't really worth the squeeze.

There were some liberties taken there with what a stunt was. I think 

Chris Spear: there, there really was. But like I. I don't know. Do you know what you would've done? What stuff would you have done? I have no idea at all. No. Like I think everyone did a great job with having to come up with a stunt and make a delicious dish.

For sure. Yeah. I was just stressing with like all the liquid nitrogen. Freezing the stuff though, because like I'm at home, I'm at home like getting stressed for y'all. 'cause I'm like, oh no. Like that's not how I think they wanted that to come out. No, I 

Tristen Epps: mean it's, it is a strange, it was a strange, strange, strange thing to do because you know, in your head you're just like, I'm just gonna make a damn good dish and just come up with everything else later.

Some people get really contrived and you know, like I'm just gonna lean in on the stunt part and the dish part will come later and like, it's just trying to figure out what the challenge means to you. And it meant something com I mean, what were there seven of us? Eight of us? No, seven [00:51:00] of us And seven different people looked at it seven different ways.

Chris Spear: I mean, I think at the end of the day, they would rather have a dish that's tastes absolutely amazing and maybe didn't deliver on the stunt than like this really kind of whizzbang, stunty thing that just tasted absolutely horrible. But I don't know, I've never had to put a plate up in front of them, 

Tristen Epps: right?

I 

Chris Spear: mean, 

Tristen Epps: if I were tell you like, the things I thought about doing, it was insane, right? Like I, I had requested helium, I requested all sorts of stuff. I wanted my dish to come out, and then I wanted somebody to like light a balloon that had seasoning in it at the table, and everyone's plate would be there and they'd light it and it would explode.

The seasoning would come down and, and I was like, Tristan, back up. 

Chris Spear: Maybe, uh, three years St. Staging at Alinea. And you would've been better prepared for that. Yeah, exactly. Like everyone had to wear a 

Tristen Epps: goggle, so it's nothing in their eye like it. Yeah, I mean, in the end it was a really [00:52:00] hard thing and you know, my ability to not turn it off was really active that day and night.

Chris Spear: So is this an experience you would recommend to people? And if so, like any, any words of advice? 'cause I'm sure there's people out there listening who have applied or wanna go on this show or a similar type show. What do you have to say for those people? I mean, culinary wise, 

Tristen Epps: I think I would just tell people don't limit yourself.

If you have a specialty, you know, I would say go get some more. You know, if you're like, I just cook Colombian cuisine, I. Like, I would go learn a little bit more things, um, at least know two things of something else, right? Because I, for certain, didn't expect to have to make a pizza. 

Chris Spear: I see that a lot. I feel like, not necessarily the season as much, but there's some seasons where people seem to not know something.

That to me seems like pretty [00:53:00] straightforward. Like they do have to go make, I don't know, some dish. And I'm like, what do you mean you've never had, I don't know, whatever type food. It just seems surprising, like Spanish food. It's like, oh, we have to create Spanish food. I'm like, you've never had Spanish food.

Right? You 

Tristen Epps: don't know how to cook this. I mean, they had a barbecue one where they had to like just do barbecue one night and people were like, I've never done this before. And I was like, really? Like, you've never made potato salad. Like, you know what I mean? Like, but you have to be appre. I I find that I, I was very lucky.

I'm very blessed that I had, I. A very casual upbringing, a very, like, very down to earth upbringing, very well traveled. You know, I worked at McDonald's, I worked at Golden Corral, I worked at Cheesecake Factory, Dave and Buster's, and then I worked Michelin, and then I've worked a pizza place and I've worked a, a Asian spot.

And I, I never said no to a type of cuisine, no matter the format it was. And so that [00:54:00] made me a well-rounded person. There are some kids now, and this is where the culinary school thing comes back to it, right? That they come out of school now. It's way easier, not easier, but it's more common that you can come right outta school and go right into a three Michelin star restaurant, right into a fine dining restaurant.

Because once again, you think that's the goal coming outta school. Like fine dining is the goal. And so, yeah, you know, there's people that I know that have worked nothing but fine dining. I bet you if you give them a burger, they'll, they'll fuck that up. 

Chris Spear: Yeah. And, and you skip a bunch of steps. When I was at John Sowell's, you know, we had to do our internships and I had a lot of friends who went to very fancy places and they basically like the stereotypical, like I had to peel potatoes like every day, like they were just free labor.

But I went and worked at a hotel in Minneapolis and the day I got there, like my chef was just like, do you know how to make like this thing? I'm like, sure. He is like, go do it. You know, like I was given like a lot of leeway. Yeah. [00:55:00] And I learned so much from that experience. It wasn't super fancy, but it was a nice hotel in downtown Minneapolis.

Um, but they gave me a lot of room to learn and, uh, you know, make some mistakes and then they would always like swoop in and I got some good training, but it wasn't like I just stand there and sweep the floor and peel the potatoes kind of experience. 

Tristen Epps: Yeah. I mean, yeah, I got really lucky being able to do stuff like that.

And, you know, I've never looked at any cuisine. I've never looked down on any cuisine. Or any style. I'm very thankful for McDonald's. I'm very thankful for Golden Corral. Uh, I was a horrible employee there, right? I worked the grill station and like I didn't know temperatures. I just really liked that it was the only real cooking I could do.

So I volunteered to do it all the time and like everyone either got rare or well done. Like I didn't, I didn't know anything else at that time. But yeah, I mean, if anyone should go on that show, like, like just try to round yourself out the most because if you think you're gonna make your food, you, you'll get lucky if you get to be [00:56:00] like, this is actually my specialty.

But you'll make so many things that you've never made before or even thought you would ever have to make before because of those situations. So the second part I would say of that, and that's the most important part, 'cause once again we always know cooking is the easy part, right? Like it's the mental game.

Like know what you can do with yourself in your alone time workout. Learn how to get your energy out in certain places, learn how to sleep, like, learn how to wind down without your normal wind down stuff. Um, that was a, that was a big game changer. I was lucky to, to be warned about that beforehand and it was something I never thought about.

And it's also something that we should know in our regular industry, right? Like, we should exercise, we should do these things. 'cause it really does help you in the long run and, you know, reduce stress because it's a stressful situation. And, and that's what you need to learn to be able to do and your own [00:57:00] 

Chris Spear: Yeah.

Words of advice for anyone in the food industry right. Is I'm always like, how do I squeeze in a 45 minute workout today? Yeah. Yeah. Um, well before we get outta here, I wanna give you the opportunity to, uh, share anything you want to talk about, get off your chest, say to people listening out there. What do you got for us before we get outta here today?

Tristen Epps: You know what I, I will always tell people, ask questions. Ask all the questions you can, and even if it's a stupid question, ask it to yourself and then just go chat GBT it, right? You have that ability now. So don't take anything for, for granted. You know, like I've gotten to where I've gotten and I hold the little bit of knowledge that I have now by, by legitimately just asking.

Why is it like that? If you're of a certain culture, you know, advocate for it, advocate for its value, advocate for, its its visibility. Advocate [00:58:00] for other people trying it, force it down as many people who haven't had it before, and that is. How our world can progress, our industry and culinary industry can progress.

You know, if you don't like wine, go drink it. If you don't like beer, go drink it, you know? But don't just drink it, learn about it. Like that's what separates you from the alcoholic, you know? But like, for sure. But yeah, in the end it's just like, you know, ask yourself questions and, and because of that, you might find a lot of parallels and stuff.

And that's how I've learned how to connect cuisines. And, uh, you'll find that the world's a lot smaller place than you think, uh, when you ask the right questions. 

Chris Spear: And I think being on the other end of that from like a mentorship, um, stance, try to be the chef who can take the time to answer those questions.

If you have someone asking you, you know, I'd like to see the days of the, because I said so, like, that's not how I parent and that's not how I ever ran a kitchen. Yeah. I mean, yes, there's times we are on the line and shit is flying and it's just like, I need you to do [00:59:00] this thing. But like taking the time to come back to that after the fact to say, okay, like here's the explanation behind that.

So 

Tristen Epps: no, it's important. It's really important. Like platform is important and if you're the executive chef of somewhere, you're in a leadership role and you're not actively trying to have, train someone else to take your job, then you're not doing enough. You, you're, you're not doing enough for them. And while I've been told, and I agree, like it's not my job to teach you.

It's your job to ask the questions and then I'll teach you, because I'm not gonna just come up to you and be like, you wanna learn how to make a tour today? Yeah. Uh, because we're a Mexican restaurant, we don't do that. Like, it's not gonna happen. Right. It's gonna, you know, so that's why I always say ask the questions, but on the other end, like, take the time, right.

Your staff, your, your people. Mentorship is so important. And I was lucky that I got that. It was probably annoying to them pro probably a lot. Uh, like, chef, can [01:00:00] I come in earlier and we can do this? Like, I've been thinking about this dish. I made it at home. I I'm gonna bring it in. I brought, I, I bought all the prep, like, like chef, just sit down and try it and you should like, you should give them the feedback.

Sit down and try it. I'd like to see more kitchens like that. Yeah. We just gotta make the time, like we wanna keep employees. We wanna like, let's, let's teach them. Let's make it a place that's worth their while. Let's make them better for the next place they go to. 

Chris Spear: In the industry that is ever evolving and is, you know, I, I've seen a lot of good people leave in recent years.

So how do we get people to stay and get more people interested in this industry? 

Tristen Epps: It only benefits us. I mean, you go to a restaurant and it's shitty. It's your fault because you didn't, you know, like if you're in the industry and you went to a restaurant and it's shitty, it's because we didn't support someone enough to be better.

Like, that's it. 

Chris Spear: That's [01:01:00] it. Well, that's a great place to leave it then. Listen, it's been great having you on the show today. I really appreciate you taking the time, 

Tristen Epps: Chris, man, thank you so much. I love being able to just kind of throw it all up. So it was really good. Thanks for the opportunity to do that.

Chris Spear: And we're all, uh, gonna be pulling for you on Top Chef. Although I will say Lana came on my podcast in 2021, so she's an og. She was, uh, the kickoff of season two and we're now in season six. So I've been, I've had my eye on her too, but, um, I. Hope one of you two pulls it off in the end. That's my boo. I love her so much.

She's amazing. Well, again, thanks uh, for coming on the show and to all of our listeners has been Chris with Chefs Without Restaurants. You're still here, the podcast's over if you are indeed still here. Thanks for taking the time to listen to the show. I'd love to direct you to one place and that's chefs without restaurants.org.

From there, you'll be able to join our email newsletter, get connected in our free Facebook group, and join our personal Chef Catering and food truck [01:02:00] database so I can help get you more job leads. And you'll also find a link to our sponsor page where you'll find products and services I love you. Pay nothing additional to use these links, but I may get a small commission which helps keep the Chefs Without Restaurants podcast and organization running.

You might even get a discount for using some of these links. As always, you can reach out to me on Instagram at Chefs Without Restaurants, or send me an email at Chefs Without restaurants@gmail.com. Thanks so much.