Special Guests - Mora Babineau & Elizabeth O'Rourke

Today the wonderful Mora Babineau and Elizabeth O'Rourke of studio47 Pilates join me on the podcast. They share their experience working in the Pilates industry for almost two decades, how Pilates has evolved over that time, and how they've adapted with it. They share the importance of apprenticeship, advice for new teachers, and a peek into the future of Pilates. Tune in!

I want to hear from you! Share your thoughts and follow the podcast on Instagram and Facebook @pilatesteachersmanual. Full show notes and episode transcription can be found on the podcast website here: http://bit.ly/pilatesteachersmanual. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast for updates, and rate and review wherever you listen!  Episodes now available on YouTube: *https://bit.ly/YouTubePTM*

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Show Notes:

Elizabeth and Mora are co-owners of studio47 Pilates, which has two locations on the East Coast of the United States. Mora is a Balanced Body Master Educator, and studio47 Pilates is a satellite training facility for Balanced Body. They share decades of movement, dance, and Pilates experience on the podcast and in their classes. Check out their website and her Instagram!

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Episode Music:

Tracks: Tobu - Good Times, Tobu & Itro - Sunburst 
Tobu Official YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/tobuofficial
Itro Official YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/officialitro
Released by NCS 
https://www.youtube.com/NoCopyrightSounds

Transcript

[00:00:00] Olivia: Welcome to Pilates Teachers' Manual, your guide to becoming a great Pilates teacher. I'm Olivia and I'll be your host. Join the conversation and the Pilates community on Instagram at @pilatesteachersmanual and visit buymeacoffee.com/OliviaPodcasts to support the show. Today's chapter starts now.

[00:00:56] Olivia: Hello. Hello everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. Today [00:01:00] is a Pilates Teachers' Manual first. I am so excited to have two special guests on the podcast today, Elizabeth O'Rourke and Mora Babineau. They are co owners of studio47 Pilates, which has two locations, one in Warren, Rhode Island, and one in Mashapee, Massachusetts, and they are both joining me on the podcast.

[00:01:20] Olivia: And I'm thrilled. I'm thrilled to bits about it, um, to hear their experiences and to hear, you know, how they've made this incredible studio together. So thank you so much for coming on, Elizabeth and Mora. Um, what is, we'll jump right in. What is your first experience with Pilates? Can you tell me about it, Mora?

[00:01:41] Mora: Excellent. Well, thank you, Olivia, for having us on today. We're very excited. Elizabeth and I like to say that we were doing Pilates when Pilates wasn't the cool thing to be doing. So 17 to 20 years ago, um, Pilates was in its infantile [00:02:00] stages as a fitness modality. Um, it was sought out by individuals, but it wasn't on every street corner as we are hearing a lot about Pilates now.

[00:02:10] Mora: So my first introduction to Pilates was actually through the dance world, um, and through the fitness world. So I come into this industry, uh, via being a dancer in college and then after college working in corporate fitness and doing all of the fitness things, step aerobics and boxing and all the things that we do in fitness. Um, and then at that point started doing a little bit more mind body work and getting introduced to some Pilates classes. And then at that point also then trying to bring in Pilates with fitness. Um, so to try to, you know, bridge the fitness people over into the Pilates industry. We'll talk a little bit more of that, I'm sure, later in the podcast. But that was my first introduction. 

[00:02:52] Olivia: How about you, Elizabeth? 

[00:02:54] Elizabeth: Yes. So very similar. And I kind of feel like a very cliche story. I was a [00:03:00] dancer and I danced in college and I was kind of dabbling after and didn't really know what I was going to do. And I had, um, a friend was like, you've got to try Pilates cause I was kind of done. I knew I was never going to be a professional dancer. So they were like, you should totally try Pilates. You'd be great at it. 

[00:03:17] Elizabeth: Um, so my first experience was in a very classical studio. Um, I was instantly hooked. I loved it. It had like the grace and the flexibility. And again, I was fresh out of college and I was like, I have no idea what I want to do. And the studio owner was like, you should totally get certified. And I was like, why not? So that's how, that was my journey. That was my experience. 

[00:03:39] Olivia: It sounds like you were very right place, right time in terms of, you know, very naturally transitioning to be a teacher. Was it like that for you, Mora? Were you also inspired to be a teacher? Cause you were around it and like, this was it. 

[00:03:52] Mora: Yes. So I have been teaching dance since I was in high school. Um, and I was, I have been a fitness instructor since [00:04:00] I first got certified in 1993, um, and that was my kind of side hustle throughout college. So yeah, so it's, so the teaching part has always been part of my career journey. Just making the change to, to be a Pilates instructor about 16, 17 years ago. 

[00:04:15] Olivia: I think that is such a valuable thing. And I know as you said, Elizabeth, it's a cliche to come from dance into Pilates, but teaching movement in a lot of ways. Like there's a lot of skills when it comes to teaching the terms of like interpersonal skills, the way you present yourself, the way you share instructions with people, that is a very natural crossover. So I know why that cliche is there because it makes total sense to go from teaching one movement modality to another. Um, what, so you did a classical training program, Elizabeth, what was your training program? 

[00:04:49] Elizabeth: So interestingly enough. The woman who referred me was, she was a classical instructor and studio owner, but she actually sent me to physical mind [00:05:00] so I am actually grateful at this point in my career. So I started at the Physical Mind Institute in New York, which I don't even think it was called contemporary Pilates at the time, but it was not classical training. 

[00:05:15] Elizabeth: So, um, I know that, again, this is back in like 2004, the idea of working in neutral pelvis was so exciting and groundbreaking and, you know, on the cutting edge of science. So that was how I started. And then I have since bridged over to balanced body. 

[00:05:33] Olivia: What about you, Mora? What was your training program like when you went through it? 

[00:05:39] Mora: Um, excellent. So I also, um, stepped in and did the physical mind Institute training program, which at that point, the comprehensive training was not broken down the way that we break down training modules now, um, at least I'm a Balanced Body educator. So the way that balanced body has broken down that the training program is through different modules, [00:06:00] like reformer one, two, three, mat, one, two, three, Cadillac, ladder, barrel, and chair. Thank you very much. 

[00:06:05] Mora: Uh, the physical mind comprehensive training was show up and we're going to teach you everything. And that's how, that's how, how, how, you know, we learned. So, so we, we, we were all comprehensively certified at that point, uh, when we finished our, our training programs. And it was a very different, uh, time period. It was definitely more of a a little bit more, you know, as a, as a Pilates apprentice, you were to be seen, not heard. And you kind of tiptoed around the studio and watched what was happening. And that's, it was just, there was not as much two way dialogue as we have now with our apprentices and trainees. 

[00:06:43] Olivia: That's so interesting. I am excited to hear more about the training program that you offer in your studio as well and how you've changed it and, you know, how you've adapted it, but it's, it's very interesting that, like, I can see the pros and cons to a modular system where you're doing the chunks, the way Balanced Body [00:07:00] does it, the way a lot of training programs kind of break things down.

[00:07:03] Olivia: But I also kind of think that there's a lot to be gained from learning everything simultaneously because of of the overlaps, like because Pilates lends itself so naturally to, okay, we're doing this exercise here, but we also do it on the barrel and we also do it on the chair and we also do it lying on our side and lying on our back and with straps and without, you know. So it's like for our lives now, I understand how modules came to be, but I think that they're like, if we could set aside time, the way those really intensive, you know, Uh, overlapping programs are, if you could just like take a pause of your life for a year and just immerse yourself, like I do think that that would also be really awesome to do. 

[00:07:45] Elizabeth: Well, and what else was really interesting too, is you were kind of all in, so it wasn't a weekend and then off you go. So you were affiliated with one studio and you went every, mine was every Friday [00:08:00] from like nine to six, and you were just immersed in all of that.

[00:08:03] Elizabeth: And then you came next week. And so there's something to be said about that as well and how it's, you know, It's different now. 

[00:08:11] Olivia: Definitely. I mean, it, it reminds me of like, Oh, go ahead, Maura. 

[00:08:15] Mora: No, I said that, you know, Pilates in and of itself is a system. And so I think understanding the intricacies of the system of the work is, is really important.

[00:08:25] Mora: And that's something that we're trying to get back to in our training program so that clients and trainees understand that the mat work is what you're doing on the chair and what you're doing on the mat is also what you're doing on the Cadillac. And so we, it's, you can't silo or isolate the equipment. It was designed to work as a system. So there were some, some really good pros to that. 

[00:08:47] Olivia: I love that. Um, thinking back to yourself as a baby teacher, when you were very new and you were still perhaps even that apprentice tiptoeing around the studio, how have you seen your teaching change [00:09:00] from where you were to how you teach now, Mora?

[00:09:05] Mora: Excellent question. So I think it's hard to remember when you first start out once you've been doing something for so long, but we all started with note cards and we all started with, you know, notebooks full of information and exercises. Um, and I think. You know, once you've been doing something for a while, I take for granted that now I, I just, um, I work off the cuff. I see who's here. I can literally plan a class or a session by looking at someone's body. Um, but that takes a lot of time. 

[00:09:34] Mora: So I think as a baby instructor, one of the things you have to remember for newer people coming into the industry is that time you spend is valuable and you can't rush the process.

[00:09:46] Mora: As we evolve, our students evolve, you know, now that we've been doing this for so long, we have clients that have evolved with us and continued on their journey. And, you know, we're always learning. I think that's another thing to remember. You're never, you're never done learning. And [00:10:00] I also think that the science evolves to Liz's point around neutral pelvis, you know, some of the original terminology that we learned, the powerhouse and house for a mouse. And those terminologies have all changed. Right now we, now we talk about the inner unit and we explain to our clients, what muscles are part of the inner unit and how do we tap into that? So I think, I think we're doing a better job as teachers, as we've, as the industry has evolved. 

[00:10:26] Olivia: How about you, Elizabeth? How has your teaching changed over time? 

[00:10:31] Elizabeth: I think the first word that comes to mind is just overall confidence with time comes experience and comes knowledge. Um, I feel like I have my whole bag of tricks and because like the longer I've taught the more tricks I have in my bag. So whatever happens to be thrown at me, whether it's an injury or a postural issue, I feel like I've got all these little tricks in my toolbox and you gain [00:11:00] those with all of your experience and all the different clients you work with and all the different workshops and the continuing ed you take.

[00:11:07] Elizabeth: And so to Mora's point, you know, never stop learning. And I also think I recently read somewhere now I can't remember, but it was how Pilates is like an intellectual exercise. And I feel like it's not just, you know, squat or curl up or sit up. So there's this whole mind body connection, obviously. And I think that it really, um, deepens your practice.

[00:11:31] Elizabeth: And so us as teachers can pass it on to our students and then they get more and more out of it. And I just think it's that time and having a lot of patience. 

[00:11:40] Olivia: I completely agree, um, especially in terms of how you accumulate tricks in your bag. I think to new instructors watching an experienced teacher, they're like, Oh my gosh, how did you know to adjust this or do this?

[00:11:53] Olivia: And a lot of times the answer is, Because you tried a bunch of things over time, and you found that [00:12:00] this one worked pretty well, and so that becomes your go to, and like you said, it's because you tried lots of ways of approaching something, or it's because you learned through having to work with someone who had difficulty getting up and down off of the reformer, so you have tricks to get, help get people up and down, because you needed to find them, you know, necessity is a great thing.

[00:12:21] Olivia: So, um, I completely agree that that, with that experience, you just get better at it because you've tried things that didn't work and you just don't get better. Keep doing those. You do the ones that do work. Go Maura. Yeah. 

[00:12:34] Mora: Um, I also think to, to Elizabeth's point is working on different bodies. So it's great when you're in your training weekends and there's 10 really fit Pilates instructors and you're training them. And then you get out and you teach a foundation class. And it's, it's wait, what happened? You know, how, how do I do this? How do I do this? So that, so the observation time that you spend as a new instructor and [00:13:00] the practice teaching hours, which you will continue to evolve in are really such an integral part of the, of the training process to be a Pilates instructor.

[00:13:10] Mora: Um, because we really are trying to connect that mind body and there is a level of precision, control, breath, all of the Pilates principles are really the guidelines, you know, the guidelines for your teaching practice. 

[00:13:24] Olivia: So how did you two meet each other? Is it through the physical mind Institute? Were you like in a coffee shop and you're like, gee, I wish there was another awesome Pilates teacher around here that I could open the studio with. Like, tell me that story. 

[00:13:37] Elizabeth: So, um, I had a ballet studio and one of my students parents was like, Oh my goodness, my friend is moving to town and she's fabulous. And she's a dancer. And you guys were both, you would totally hit it off and you have to meet and the rest is history. We, we have this, um, funny story.

[00:13:56] Elizabeth: We had a refrigerator, a small [00:14:00] refrigerator in our studio and it was a glass front. And, you know, back when it was a much smaller scale, you know, we had Fiji water for our clients, you know, when, when it wasn't, you know, very expensive and whatnot, um, and they were all lined up perfectly and we always say like we had each other at the Fiji water because we're both OCD and we like just totally hit it off.

[00:14:22] Elizabeth: And now here we are 16 years later in two studios and oh my goodness, I think we're at 10 other instructors and three apprentices. I know. 

[00:14:33] Olivia: That's incredible. So how, how did studio47 Pilates come to be, Mora? If you can tell me your origin story of your studio. 

[00:14:41] Mora: Sure. Yeah. So we, so listen to this, we had the dance studio. Um, and so we, we bought three reformers and we set up shop to teach Pilates. And so we, the majority of the classes that we taught in the early days were mat classes. Um, and because we are both physical mind trained, [00:15:00] one of the hallmarks of the physical mind training is. Something called standing Pilates.

[00:15:05] Mora: So Joan Brewer, who was the founder of physical mind, wrote a whole book. It was a huge part of our training, uh, was standing Pilates. So to me, that was a nice bridge between fitness and Pilates. So we created our own. Right. We did a lot of standing Pilates classes. Um, and that really, we were able to then bridge the fitness people over into, um, the Pilates world.

[00:15:31] Mora: So in terms of studio47, we kept evolving. I think that's one of the things as a business owners that we're really good at is knowing when something's working and knowing when it's time to turn. And I think, you know, all of the pivots that we've had to make over the years have kept us on the, on the, you know, on the forefront of the industry.

[00:15:49] Mora: Right. Not just relying on, you know, we're going to keep doing that classes. Well, here's what I say. If you want to come to a mat class, you're going to come once a week. I need you three times a week. So I need to [00:16:00] offer you something different. So you're coming three times a week. One day it's a standing class. One day it's reformer. And one day it's stretch and rolling on a Friday, you know? 

[00:16:09] Mora: So, so I think in terms of, so studio47, we actually started out as Barrington Pilates. Our first studio was in Barrington, Rhode Island, and it was next to Barrington ballet. So in keeping with the evolution, uh, we then realized that we were kind of stunting our own growth with that as the, as the name of the studio, where it felt like it was very limiting to that close geographical area.

[00:16:34] Mora: So we then, you know, continue to evolve and we changed the name to Studio 47. Not that, um clever because our studio was at 47 Maple Avenue. That's where the 47 comes from. Um, but we have since changed, we've moved, um, studios, I think three or four times. We've kept, you know, outgrowing space, outgrowing space.

[00:16:55] Mora: Um, then we, we closed the dance studio. We took over the dance space, then barre became a [00:17:00] thing. And then we put bars in, you know, so we're getting, we're kind of always. Staying ahead of the trends in the industry. Um, and then we most recently moved to our larger location in Warren, Rhode Island, which is just, you know, across the bridge, um, from Barrington.

[00:17:15] Mora: So that way, again, we're opening up more geographical area for ourselves to attract clientele and with that, we just opened our second location on Cape Cod last July. 1st. So, so we are, we are studio47 Pilates by the sea. So our, our studio on Warren, it happens to be waterfront. And our studio on the Cape is close enough to the beach.

[00:17:39] Olivia: So one of the things that you shared is that you are, one of the hard things I should say about being on the cutting edge and is that you have to kind of pave your own way. So I know that when you're opening your studios, Pilates was not yet mainstream. And I don't imagine that you had a thousand Pilates teachers knocking on your door, asking to, [00:18:00] you know, be part of your studio.

[00:18:01] Olivia: How did you kind of get the word out about Pilates. Like obviously you did because your studio has adapted and evolved, but how did you meet this need for teachers, meet this need for more classes? Because you're only two fabulous people. And even if you're working 40 hour weeks, that's a lot going on. So how did you address that?

[00:18:23] Elizabeth: So just how Mora was saying that we've kind of constantly evolved in terms of our offerings. We like to say that it was literal, just blood, sweat, and tears. And like the one word I truly will use to describe us is like, we are hustlers. Like we absolutely, we put in the hard work. We would wear our studio47 t shirts to Starbucks and be like, does anybody want to come try Pilates?

[00:18:49] Elizabeth: Um, we printed out flyers and we would literally put flyers or business cards under windshield wipers in parking lots. I mean, this is before social media. [00:19:00] This is before, I mean, We had a website, it wasn't interactive. Um, there, there was no booking software, like it was a landing page. It didn't go anywhere. Maybe it had a phone number, like, God forbid you actually call a landline. And, you know, we, we had a clipboard with paper and pen and our clients, um, their class card system was index cards. Like I'm saying this, like I making myself feel so old right now, but this 2008, there was, there was no MindBody or Moments or, you know, Mariana tech or any of it.

[00:19:35] Elizabeth: And so it was literal, just, you know, it was word of mouth every once in a while we would, you know, pay the very expensive advertising fee in a magazine or the local newspaper. But it truly was word of mouth and, you know, bring a friend for free, or it was slow and steady. 

[00:19:56] Elizabeth: And I think that is so important for anyone who is a new [00:20:00] instructor, getting clients or anyone who is new to being a studio owner. It is slow and steady and it's one day at a time and it is not going to happen overnight. I promise. 

[00:20:12] Mora: Oh, and I just have one more thing to add to that. I think this is also super important in terms of building longevity in an industry is, you know, we were then approached, are you guys going to offer yoga? Should we do TRX? Should we do X, Y, and Z? And we said, nope, we teach Pilates. We are Pilates only. And everything we've ever done, that has been the central piece of our business. We've never strayed. We don't offer spin. We don't offer yoga. And I think that's one of the reasons that we've been able to pivot when changes like COVID happened, right? We were able to pick up and move left. 

[00:20:46] Mora: And I think, Because of that fact that we have always been a Pilates boutique studio. That's what we do. That's our teachers. We're certified to teach Pilates. I don't, I don't try to pretend that I'm a strength trainer. I'm not. I [00:21:00] teach Pilates. So I think it's great to weave in these other things, but also stay true to who you are as a business owner.

[00:21:08] Mora: Um, and when you can really focus on something. Like McDonald's sells hamburgers, right? Like they try to sell other things. Nobody buys that. They're not as successful, right? Do one thing and do it well. That's what I think has really helped us with a little bit of our staying power. 

[00:21:22] Elizabeth: And also to follow up, um, you had asked about instructors because even in this day and age where Pilates is totally having its hot moment and, you know, certification workshops are full and it's like, it looks so cool and fun to be a Pilates instructor. We really also pride ourselves on a lot of our instructors are homegrown. It is not common that someone moves to the area or knocks on your door. Hey, I have a fully full certification under my belt. I've all this experience. I'm looking for a new studio to teach at like. That happened once and our instructor who is still with us after I think nine or ten years, [00:22:00] she moved from L.A. So, she's amazing and she's fabulous. 

[00:22:03] Elizabeth: Um, everyone else, so they started as clients. And we were like, hey, you'd be really great at this. But it takes a long time. And, we always say, um, we can teach you what's in the manual. We can help you like with choreography, we can help you with injuries. We cannot teach personality. Um, and we have had instructors that have, I hate to say audition, but maybe they've had like an interview process or even after being with us for a few months, that it's not the right fit and it's not the right vibe. And I think that is really important as well. And I'm proud of us for when it hasn't worked, it's been like, okay, that's all right. We can, we can go a different way. Um, but really important to stay true to the integrity of your business and like your little vibe that you have going on. 

[00:22:54] Olivia: Definitely. So tell me about how your training program has evolved because [00:23:00] you've got amazing clients who are interested in Pilates and you've won them over to the dark side of teaching. How did your training program kind of evolve and grow and change? 

[00:23:10] Mora: Yeah, most recently, um, as of two years ago, I actually became a Balanced Body educator. Um, prior to that, most of our staff had, um, either bridged or has, has done the Balanced Body comprehensive training program. So, you know, as training programs phased out, physical mind kind of phased out, Balanced Body stepped in around 17 years ago as kind of the premier training, um, within the industry.

[00:23:37] Mora: And that's, you know, most of our staff now, if not, all are comprehensively certified through Balanced Body. So having that has been really important as kind of a unifying factor in our staff. So any, any new staff coming in. So this was pointing around, you know, a client that is maybe interested or we see an interest with them. Um, they've gone through the Balanced Body training program. So [00:24:00] we are a proud satellite location at our Cape Cod studio. Of Boston body, which is the premier, um, authorized training center for Balanced Body in the Northeast. Um, they have robust training program that they've had for years led by Zayna Gold, and we are excited to have come on as a satellite location working with Boston body.

[00:24:23] Mora: So it's been a really nice relationship and, um, has given students another option of a place to go um, as these training programs were getting more and more popular, you know, having access to reformers on a, at a training weekend is, is key. Um, so we're able to provide that another option for our students.

[00:24:42] Olivia: That's incredible. That's really nice to have. That commonality and kind of a lot of times studios, you have to find a common language to speak, um, because training programs can be very different and how they approach things. So I love that you have that, you know, unifying [00:25:00] factor of, of training. That's really great.

[00:25:08] Olivia: Hi there. I hope you're enjoying today's chapter so far. There's great stuff coming up after the break too. Be sure to subscribe wherever you're listening and visit buymeacoffee.com/OliviaPodcasts to support the show. There you can make a one time donation or become a member for as little as $5 a month. Membership comes with some awesome perks, including a shout out in the next episode, a monthly newsletter, a monthly zoom call with me and more.

[00:25:37] Olivia: You can also visit links.OliviaBioni.com/affiliates to check out some sweet deals on products I use and love. Now back to the show.[00:26:00] 

[00:26:06] Olivia: I'm going to ask more, like, what was it like becoming a master educator? That's so cool and amazing. And I know that's how you knew, uh, Tabatha as well. 

[00:26:13] Mora: Yes. Yes. Tabatha was in my training program. Honestly, it's been one of the best, you know, and most fulfilling honors of my career. I think I've always been a good teacher. And I think as an instructor to now be able to teach teachers is kind of the next evolution for me and my, in my personal development and growth, making sure that I'm instilling the right values and techniques for the new and next generation. 

[00:26:39] Mora: So it's, it's quite a process. Um, you apply for the program. You were interviewed for the program. You spend, um, two 10 day time periods out in Sacramento at the Balanced Body Headquarters, um, going through the trainings. Um, it's, you know, nine to six for 10 days in a row for two, two times. So it is a [00:27:00] commitment both personally and professionally. Um. And then if you pass through the program, then you can become an educator.

[00:27:07] Mora: So most recently I was at the Pilates on Tour in Arizona, um, working with some fellow educators there, teaching some workouts. And so it's a really fun, next level community for me to be a part of as a, as an educator and a teacher. 

[00:27:23] Olivia: That is so cool. And Elizabeth, I know you wanted to chime in about being a satellite location, I think, for training.

[00:27:31] Elizabeth: Yes, I was, I was going to, um, segue off of, um, yes, we're so excited and honored to be this satellite facility. Um, and it's been a great addition, uh, for the Cape studio. And it's really interesting because what we've done and what I think Mora and I are really good at is so you take this workshop and then you're kind of like, well, now, what do I do?

[00:27:55] Elizabeth: So maybe you're taking classes somewhere. You know, maybe you're an hour away. Maybe [00:28:00] you're whatever, 30 minutes away. Um, and so over the years, we've really very slowly and now a little more, um, strategically put together, like in a whole apprenticeship program and a mentorship program, because it can feel very lonely while you're going through your training.

[00:28:16] Elizabeth: And most of the time you're a master educator that you're with for the weekend, you might be able to email them and say, Hey, can I have a quick call? Or, Hey, I've got this one question, but you don't have that point person to guide you. Um, and even like the silly questions like, What do I do about a playlist? What do I do about teaching a multi level class? I mean, there's so, so much, you know, more than just learning the actual repertoire and the exercises. 

[00:28:43] Elizabeth: We found that it was so important for, um, any trainee to have this home based studio. And so we've kind of, over time we've cultivated it and it's gotten much more streamlined. Um, but it can be really important to have, um, like a little home based [00:29:00] You know, find like a little apprenticeship place that you can carve out your own little corner. 

[00:29:05] Olivia: I love that. And that's something that when I started talking with Mora on Instagram, that that was the first point that she was like, I would love to talk about apprenticeship, because I think that this is a missing ingredient and so important in the teacher training process that, you know, you, even when you graduate, it's like the process continues, like, it's like, good, now you've got your certification that you know what you're talking about, but like there's more, um, so more, is there anything you'd like to share about apprenticeship or, you know, what you offer apprentices who are in your program or at your studio?

[00:29:38] Mora: Yeah, I think, I mean, so this is why I think this, this is, this is, if not, um, the most important piece of your training and it's, it's, we are evolving by the minutes. I think this is, this is a piece that, you know, we, we have undervalued for a period of time, and I think it's now that we're, we're turning out more teachers, um, in a, in a, [00:30:00] as opposed to when Elizabeth and I were doing, I had two people in my training program.

[00:30:03] Mora: I mean, it was very much, you know, now we've got 10 to 20. So if you've got all these, these people coming through your programs, how do we maintain the integrity of what we're teaching? And I think having access to a master instructor, having access to your educator, or even a comprehensively NCPT certified staff person that you can turn to and ask questions, um, and, and guide you through that next phase of your program is super important.

[00:30:32] Mora: I think we're really. Just kind of seeing that now, kind of the real value of this right now for us, for our program, we take no more than two apprentices, um, usually in a year time period. So if you're working with us, you are, you are getting a lot of observation time with us. Hands on, um, teaching with us.

[00:30:53] Mora: We offer, um, our apprentices the ability to teach community classes, which are offered at a reduced rate, um, [00:31:00] smaller number of students for those. So it really gives them the hands on experience that really completes your training program. 

[00:31:07] Olivia: I love that because I see a lot of people who come out of their training program and on paper they're done. But in reality, there's some gaps in maybe how they're approaching things, like programming. Like I've worked with newer teachers who maybe like it, things that come totally second nature to us, like if I'm using this piece of equipment, I'm going to use it for more than one exercise. I'm going to thread it through the whole class.

[00:31:36] Olivia: Um, but you might have someone who's like, we're grabbing a magic circle for footwork and then we're chucking it for the rest of the 45 minutes. And you're like, all right, that was a choice. Um, so having, uh, But like, you don't know that until like I was, I was looking at a student's program that had six pieces of equipment used in their one class. And I was like, that seems like several and could we use fewer? Um, so [00:32:00] having that person as a resource, having the ability to ask questions and especially also what I'm really loving about what you're sharing is like you're encouraged To be new, like you're not expected to be experienced when you're new, you're expected to be new and you've really created a system to support people in gaining the confidence.

[00:32:19] Olivia: You've talked about, Elizabeth, that just the more you do it, the more confident you feel, the more tricks you have um, and then having access to that resource and that guidance, um, that is a, what this whole podcast is about. And I think absolutely invaluable to the people you're working with. 

[00:32:38] Mora: Yes, I think if you were to ask, and we did obviously prior to coming on this, we asked our apprentices for feedback, just, you know, they all said hands down the experience as being an apprentice was, was tremendously valuable.

[00:32:52] Mora: It's something that they wouldn't be where they are today as instructors without that piece. Um, so as you know, we're looking to [00:33:00] continue to build our piece of the business, um, we're now going to be launching a mentor program, which is going to, you know, open up access. Um, it's going to be online. So I think that's something else, um, where all of those different things, you know, programming ideas.

[00:33:14] Mora: Yeah. Working with multi, you know, level classes, um, client retention, all of those, those things that are not in your manual, but those are a piece of what we're doing. You're seeing this now, as I'm saying it to you. Um, this is very trendy right now in the industry. We're seeing a lot of, you know, what we didn't learn in the manual, which is great.

[00:33:31] Mora: I'm glad we're, we're touching upon this. And I think, you know, if you're a newer instructor looking for a program like that, look for somebody who has some, some season. Look for somebody who's, who's been doing this for a little while. I think they're going to give you the best information on that. 

[00:33:47] Olivia: Definitely. Um, you had mentioned about. COVID being a big pivot point for you. And COVID is one of those things that like is over, but isn't over. But can you tell me about what happened for your studios [00:34:00] during COVID, how you changed it and, um, what maybe you've kept from that time, if you'd like, Elizabeth. 

[00:34:08] Elizabeth: So, yes, I actually think the pivot that we were, I'm going to say forced to do ended up being such a silver lining on the backend. Um, Was it stressful to go through? Absolutely. Were there conversations with the landlord? Absolutely. I mean, I think everybody was in the same position here. Um, so for us at the, our Warren, uh, Rhode Island studio location, we had a space for all of the auxiliary equipment, which included five reformers.

[00:34:39] Elizabeth: And then we had a big open space that was for Matt and bar classes. Um, so we would have 16 people max in our. You know, little studio space. So when we were allowed to reopen about 12 weeks after we were initially shut down, we were now allowed to have four people, including the instructor in that square footage. [00:35:00] And it was like, okay, that's impossible. You can't, you know, that you do quick math there. It's not going to work. 

[00:35:07] Elizabeth: Um, so what we ended up doing was separating and putting the reformers into the mat and bar studio, and then keeping all of the auxiliary. Equipment and the other. So now because it was two different spaces, we could have eight people.

[00:35:21] Elizabeth: So this was now a little more manageable. Um, and we had been offering smaller group reformer classes, but we were ready to kind of go and we were able to increase our five reformers now to eight. And it was a wonderful pivot for the business because now we're solely an equipment studio. I mean, yes, we have mats and yes, we have the arcs and we, there's a place for all of that.

[00:35:45] Elizabeth: And is it, it is incorporated in all of our classes and sessions, but there's also something that's so wonderfully addicting about the Pilates reformer. I mean, if I that's, that's my like one true love, um, but clients want to [00:36:00] touch something, right? So like I can go on YouTube and get a instruction for Pilates mat or Pilates circle, but you get to touch a piece of equipment.

[00:36:09] Elizabeth: You get to play with it, you get to experience it. And the power of the group, I just think can be so motivating and fun and people are ready to be social again. So we, we completely got rid of our mat and barre program. Which honestly we had talked about over the years. Like it's hard to maintain the instructors, putting out a lot more effort, partaking in more demonstrating. And we basically COVID forced us, it made the decision for us. And, and now it's been wonderful. 

[00:36:41] Olivia: There is definitely something magical about the reformer. And so it's, it's just not like anything else. And it really is the thing that people fall in love with. So I love that that is the switch you made. I'm sure it made lots of clients very happy.

[00:36:55] Olivia: Yes, Mora chiming in. 

[00:36:57] Mora: Um, I think also too, in looking at [00:37:00] staying with industry trends, you know, when we opened 16 years ago, a group reformer class was unheard of. I mean, Pilates was solely one on one. It was, that's how you trained. That's how you took, it was one on one. Um, and then maybe you've got to do a duo. We'd have trio, right? That was a scheduling nightmare, but anyway. Um, but so I think now where we've evolved to with, with Pilates reformer as a modality in group fitness is phenomenal. I think we're able to offer the benefits of Pilates to more people safely. Um, so I think where the trend is going, I'd like to see, you know, I think 10 is a good number of reformers in a group studio, that's my personal opinion.

[00:37:44] Mora: Um, I think. You get a lot more reformers in, you're a little bit limited at what type of choreography you can do because you'll have more variability in your class. But so we, we have found that that to be our sweet spot. Um, and to Elizabeth's point, you can do mat [00:38:00] at home. So if I'm going to come out, I want to touch equipment and I want to be motivated and I want to be instructed.

[00:38:06] Mora: Um, so I think that's, it's been a good, good win for us over the past couple of years. 

[00:38:11] Olivia: I think that the community aspect was something that COVID really kind of highlighted the importance of it, that as much as it is, exercise is good for you. Yes. Pilates is amazing. Also yes. But the fact that there's a teacher there, that there's other people there, that just like accountability piece that. You know, they're almost counting on you. And like, even if you're doing something really hard, like other people are doing it with you, you're not alone. Like we're all struggling together through that teaser. And um, and that social component of like, you really do make friends at the studio. Like you really do, like it brightens your day.

[00:38:50] Olivia: And like, I know as a teacher, there's clients that I love to see that love to see me and they just like light up you while you're there. Um, [00:39:00] and yeah, I like, I do love group. I love one on one. I think my schedule is a little bit 50 50 in terms of doing group and then doing a one on one sessions. 

[00:39:09] Olivia: But you're right. Like there's this trade off, right? Because you work with more people, so you can have more positive impact when you have more people in your class. But then if there's too many people in the class, people don't feel seen. It just becomes like, I taught at a yoga festival once and you had like 70 people and like, you don't get to say hi to them. You don't know any of their names. You're just kind of leading them through something. So there's definitely a trade off in terms of class size. I'm glad that you found a size and a space that uh, works for you all. 

[00:39:43] Olivia: You've shared this kind of woven throughout, but can you tell me based on your experience, what, what you've learned while teaching, um, what is advice that you would give to a brand new teacher?

[00:39:58] Mora: Um, I would say for [00:40:00] brand new teachers, and I tell my instructors this all the time. Teach Pilates. It works. So, we get on Instagram and then there's all, I gotta worry about the choreography. No, you don't. Teach Pilates. It works. That's what you are. You are a Pilates teacher. Teach the 100. Teach the stomach series, teach side splits, teach Pilates. We don't need to constantly reinvent the wheel. All of that stuff is fantastic. But as a new instructor coming in, teach, teach the work and that's how you're going to get good at it. And then two years down the road, then get a little creative. But don't, don't stress yourself out about getting creative to keep up with Instagram.

[00:40:43] Mora: So I think, I think that's one of the things that I teach. I, I, I tell my trainers all the time, turn off social media and you know, no one, no one is, is, is really going to actually do that in your class. Um, you know, and I think when we kind of remember like teach, teach the [00:41:00] work, I had a multi level class.

[00:41:03] Mora: I had 10 people in my class. I had a professional dancer with a foot injury, a young girl. Um, I had an L5 S1 spinal fusion. I had a dementia patient, a stroke victim, um, a knee replacement, and um, a breast cancer survivor. Now I know all of these in my, cause I'm their instructor, that's my job. Did everyone get a good workout? They did because I taught Pilates. And I think we have to remember that, that teach the work and there's value in it. 

[00:41:33] Olivia: I love that because there's. Like, everyone wants to think out of the box, but the only way you can effectively work out of the box is if you know the box really, really well, and you know where to make that one little adjustment, that one little variation, add in that prop, um, but you can only do that when you have a really firm foundational understanding of Pilates.

[00:41:54] Olivia: And I love, teach Pilates at works. That might be the new tagline because that's fantastic. [00:42:00] That is so true. What about you, Elizabeth? What would you recommend for a brand new teacher? 

[00:42:05] Elizabeth: I think just put in the time you, especially with privates, I think when you are newer to, to teaching and instructing, I think privates is the best way to start. That's how we have all of our apprentices start before they jump into community classes because you're going to be nervous. Right? And then what I like to tell everybody is, Your client, they don't know, they don't know if you had on an extra spring. They don't know if you change the box the wrong way, you know, just put in the time, get comfortable with it.

[00:42:38] Elizabeth: And I think the other really important thing, even for seasoned instructors is, um, ask for feedback, especially for, from other instructors or from mentors, um, ask for feedback and then be open to it. So look at it as, you know, positive feedback, constructive criticism. But I think you can [00:43:00] really get some valuable information on how you're teaching or how you're communicating or your teaching style by having someone else say you did a really great job at X, Y and Z.

[00:43:12] Elizabeth: I was a little confused with, you know, one, two, and three or whatever, and not so much the client, but have, have someone else observe you that they know what they're doing. And it's, it's really valuable. 

[00:43:22] Olivia: I love that getting feedback piece as well. Um, that. We continue to learn and grow and change and it's not teaching isn't something where it's like.

[00:43:34] Olivia: Check now I'm a Pilates teacher and I'm done and I just do this forever like Mora said the science has changed, like best Practices have changed every five years or so we get new prenatal guidelines and it's like we want to pay attention. We want to change with those things. So recognizing that Like, we're not really chasing perfection. We're just trying to be better than we were before. And it's an incremental process. [00:44:00] 

[00:44:00] Mora: I think just another thing is don't over cue. I think we feel that we need to fill the space. Remember we're, we're giving people information in a language they've never heard before. So and this is something I'm constantly working on in my own teaching style, slow down, let it resonate.

[00:44:20] Mora: And I think that's hard to do because we want to prove that we're knowledgeable and we want to prove that I'm going to make you find connections, let the client have the experience. Um, and I think that's another thing, you know, I do a lot of test outs as well, and that's a constant piece of feedback when I'm doing a test out for a new teacher is don't over cue. Right. We got a lot of information to get out. Let's not, you know, bombard the client. That's hard. It's easier said than done. It's very hard to not feel like you need to talk a whole. 

[00:44:54] Olivia: Yeah. Feels like a, like a, a rap from Eminem where suddenly you [00:45:00] get there and you're like spine and neutral and arms by your sides and feet on the footbar and da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. And the person's like, Oh my gosh. Um, so finding that balance, like, uh, One of my teachers, uh, told me that, you know, you have 100 percent information in your brain. You're going to sprinkle out 20 percent at a time. And then you're, once that lands, once that, she called them chewable doables, you give them that thing. They understand that thing. Then you can add another thing. But if it's just a laundry list, it's just exhausting. 

[00:45:29] Mora: Yes. And you know, one, two, one, two, three, move on. You know, some, some things. May not be executed, move on, right? It's kind of also recognize when it's, you're through, you threw something out there and it's not working and how do we, how do, how do we pivot?

[00:45:46] Mora: So I think that, you know, we, we do, we have our staff meeting every couple of months and one of the exercises we did at our last meeting was, um, define your teaching superpower. And one of our instructors said, pivot. [00:46:00] If I, if I see it and it's not working, pivot. I'm going to, I'm going to keep moving because nothing's more frustrating when the client's not getting it and you're maybe not explaining it the right way or whatever, for whatever reason, it's one, two, three, move on.

[00:46:12] Olivia: Yes. Cause Pilates is a process for students who are doing it as well as for learning how to teach it. So I, what I, one thing that I share with new teachers, that's very much in alignment with that is that this isn't the only session that you have with them. This isn't the only time they're going to try this thing.

[00:46:31] Olivia: So if you try it and they don't get it, or they think they're getting it, but they're not getting it and you try to correct it and they're not getting that. Like you said, you'd let that go because we're going to do it again next week. We're going to do it again later in the week. They're going to hear another teacher talk about it a different way.

[00:46:46] Olivia: And it's just continually, um, I have a teacher friend who calls it polishing the stone that it's like, there's a diamond in there, but every time you work on it, you're just polishing it a little bit and over time with consistency, with practice, that's how we get there. [00:47:00] So I love that. 

[00:47:01] Olivia: You can't also, I think, as a teacher, if you get hung up on this one thing, not working, you're never going to feel successful because it's really, it's not fair to you to say that, you know, I'm going to define myself by this, you know, whether or not they get this one thing in this one exercise, like, that's not fair.

[00:47:21] Olivia: We got lots of time to work on that. 

[00:47:23] Mora: I think we need to remember the origin of Pilates was you went to Joseph Pilates studio, um, and you were responsible for knowing the work. You were responsible for knowing the order. You were responsible for knowing the springs. And so I think we have to empower our clients.

[00:47:40] Olivia: That is one thing I loved about COVID, did not love COVID, awful, but loved that clients had to take more ownership for things like equipment changes, like a studio that I worked at. We changed all of the springs for all of the clients all the time, so they don't know what their footwork springs are. They don't know what their feet and strap springs are.

[00:47:59] Olivia: I'm just running [00:48:00] around getting bruises on my wrist, trying to pull springs off a thousand times. And so that degree of ownership, like you said, is really empowering to know. Like you get to play on this fancy piece of equipment, but not just play. Like you really know what you're doing on it beyond, okay, they said teaser. And I know this is the setup for it. Like you really know how to make those changes and those adjustments. I think that's super cool and super important. 

[00:48:26] Mora: And I think, you know, it's important as you, as a, as an instructor, um, you should, I, this is again, something I'm working on my own personal practice is leaving my classes or sessions with clients feeling energized and not exhausted. And I think, you know, for how many years I ran around and adjusted foot bars for eight people, um, we don't do that anymore. Pace your energy. 

[00:48:49] Olivia: Yes. It's much easier for every person to set up one jump board than it is for me to set up 10 or 12.

[00:48:59] Olivia: Teamwork makes [00:49:00] the dream work and we're all a team in class. Um, is there anything else that you'd like to share maybe about studio47 or about teaching that we haven't touched on just yet? Is there anything else that I've missed? 

[00:49:16] Mora: I think, you know, just as we, as we look to the future of the Pilates industry, um, I think we need to, just to reiterate, you know, kind of maintain the integrity of the teacher training programs and the teachers that we're turning out.

[00:49:33] Mora: I think it is an honor and a privilege to be a Pilates instructor and because it takes time and dedication and. So that's a, when you, when you get that certification, it's, it's a, it's a pretty amazing achievement. Um, so I, I, I don't want to see that water down. I think we need to continue as an industry to uphold and even raise the standards.

[00:49:54] Mora: So I think the NCPT is doing that. That's the national Pilates certification program. Um, [00:50:00] they're creating an industry standard. I think that's, that's a nice step in the right direction. 

[00:50:05] Elizabeth: I would agree with Maura. I think, um, when I have someone who will say, Oh yeah, I have a mat certification and I'm like, Oh, you do. And it's like, Oh yeah, I went to a weekend. I'm like, so you don't have a mat, you know? So the integrity is such a, is such a big part of it. And this is not something that you can rush. This is not something that you can. You know, there's a lot of time and money that goes into it, and it is very important that the time is put in. You can't, you can't rush it. 

[00:50:38] Elizabeth: And one of the things that I love about, um, this industry is the older you are, the more experienced you are. The more like revered you are like this is, you know, you, you want to work with someone who's been, oh my goodness, my Pilates instructor is 75 years old and they've been doing this for 40 years. And this is so inspiring. And like, that's really cool. And we don't see that a lot in our [00:51:00] society right now. And that's okay, but, but when it comes to Pilates, you, you are held a little bit higher, a little bit more on this pedestal when you have all this experience and time, um, behind you. And so, yes, the integrity of the program is very valuable and very important.

[00:51:20] Elizabeth: And I think if you are, whether you're deciding on what training you want to do, or if you're deciding on what instructors you want to hire, I think you definitely need to make sure that all the certifications are, you know, in place. It's important. 

[00:51:35] Olivia: Sometimes I wish that Pilates was classified, like, as vocational education the same way it would be if you were like an electrician, um, because those do have boards and those do have standards.

[00:51:48] Olivia: Like you said, the National Pilates Certification Program is doing something like that. Like, I want it to be national. I want it to be international. I want There to be recognition for what you've put in that it's [00:52:00] not the same as like an eight hour TRX training That it is really intense and it really is comprehensive and that what you are taught is a skill set. Like you are this is a career that you are being trained for. 

[00:52:17] Elizabeth: We're also You know, going along with all of this, we're also trying to educate our clients, um, that there is so much time that goes into this. And yes, we are learning about anatomy and we're learning about different injuries and surgeries and, you know, all of this really important information that, yes, this is not like a personal trainer or, and that has its place. And I respect personal trainers as well, but with all of, uh, the requirements that come from getting your Pilates certification.

[00:52:49] Elizabeth: Um, so we've been, you know, cause Pilates is also very expensive and we also shouldn't have to justify because of all of our training and [00:53:00] all of our experience and yes, you are going to get what you pay for. Um, and so we've been putting some time and effort into even just explaining that to our clients. Like, do you know that your instructors went to this workshop this past weekend, or did you know that, you know, so and so specializes in Pilates? Blah, blah, blah. And it's, it's important. 

[00:53:20] Olivia: Yeah. There's so much value, I think, in the work that we do and the extensive training that we have. Um, echoing what you've shared before that, you know, it does take time and it can't be rushed. You can't make experience happen faster, but you can keep working on it, um, as much as you can, uh, over time. And yeah, it is, it is a different, it's, I can see it from clients point of view because I'm trying to think of me before I knew about Pilates and it feels like, Oh yeah, you know, like other fitness modalities, but, um, I think that sharing with your clients, the fact [00:54:00] that it is different. And I think they'll also see when they work with you, if they had a session with you or more, uh, that they would see like, Oh yeah, no, this is not just, okay, now we're going to do 10 bicep curls. Like, no, it's a little more than that. Um, No, I love that. 

[00:54:16] Olivia: Is there any last thoughts that you want to share before we wrap up about anything wonderful, wild, Wacky in the world of Pilates? 

[00:54:24] Elizabeth: Like, be careful, be careful what you ask for. We could talk about Pilates all day long. 

[00:54:28] Mora: I think one thing that's interesting is when we were, you know, kind of having a discussion prior to this interview, um, was, you know, 20 years ago, technology did not have a place in fitness and now technology does, and what are we going to do with technology in the future?

[00:54:46] Mora: And so I think, you know, as, as fast as AI is moving, all of these different things are helping in other industries. I don't think you'll ever replace coming in and physically being a part of something. [00:55:00] I think there's a place for technology. And I think there's, it can help us. And it's, you know, what it's done so far for the fitness industry in terms of, you know, just booking software.

[00:55:09] Mora: So now we can text clients and now, you know, we can recognize when they come 38 times. You know, there's all these wonderful tools we have. Um, but I think as you know, as the world evolves, I I, I don't see us losing the, the one-on-one. I don't see us losing the showing up for yourself in person. 

[00:55:27] Olivia: Yes, yes. Um, technology is great I think at connecting us.

[00:55:32] Olivia: Like I get to take my reformer class with my teacher in Australia and I can't take it live 'cause it's at two in the morning, but I can do the replay. Um, and, and there's value there, but I don't think that AI is going to replace Pilates teachers. Anytime soon. 

[00:55:50] Mora: And it's nice to see that now. Um, you know, I've been in the fitness industry my whole career, but now this is a legit career. You can, you can make a career out of this. Um, [00:56:00] and so I think that's, you know, we're seeing a lot of people making career changes into this, into this field. Um, so I think there's, there's a lot of value that we bring to the table. And as fitness professionals, we're starting to be recognized. 

[00:56:13] Olivia: We are definitely, I think, in that regard on the right track because I also look forward to being a 70 year old Pilates teacher with a wealth of experience to share.

[00:56:24] Olivia: Well, thank you both so, so much for taking your time for coming on the show and sharing your incredible journey and all of your insights and, and the experience that you've had, uh, teaching Pilates. Thank you for sharing about your studio and sharing that advice for Pilates new teachers. I appreciate you both and thanks so much for coming on.

[00:56:44] Elizabeth: Thank you for having us. 

[00:56:46] Mora: That was amazing, Olivia. Thank you. And if you're interested in more learning about more about our mentorship program, uh, follow us on Instagram at @studio47pilates, and you can get all the information there. 

[00:56:58] Olivia: Fabulous. I'll also include [00:57:00] all of your information in the show notes for this show as well.

[00:57:11] Olivia: Thanks for listening to this week's chapter of Pilates Teacher's Manual, your guide to becoming a great Pilates teacher. Check out the podcast Instagram at @pilatesteachersmanual, and be sure to subscribe wherever you listen. For more Pilates goodness, check out my other podcast, Pilates Students' Manual, available everywhere you listen to podcasts. The adventure continues. Until next time.