Copacetic Hour One on One: You're the Common Denominator...

Episode: 212

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This week on The Copacetic Hour, we sit down with author and coach Lionel Moses as he shares his life experiences, personal journey, and what inspired him to write The Marriage Seed. 

We also dive into relationships, accountability, and the tough reality that in many of our broken or failed relationships, we may have been the common denominator. A real conversation about growth, love, and self-reflection you don’t want to miss. 

Grab your Copy of The Marraige Seed:

https://www.themarriageseed.com/

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

You're tuning in to the Copa Setic class Copacetic Why don't you just chip Why don't you just chill Why don't you chachish channel Copa Setic Yes, this is the Copacetic Hour.

SPEAKER_05 0:26

Copacetic is a term meaning everything is fine, cool, and in excellent order. This podcast is an area for open discussion, but not for the weak hearted nor the simple-minded. And although we may not always agree, we will always exemplify respect. But at the same time, nobody, and I do mean nobody, is exempt from getting these jokes. Everything is copacetic. Yes, it's the copacetic hour. Today's guest is a man whose life story reads like a blueprint for resilience, reinvention, and for real growth. From turning wrenches as a mechanic to serving this country as a U.S. Navy veteran during Desert Storm and Desert Shield to navigating high-pressure world finance and entrepreneurship. He's lived through transitions that tested not only his strength, but his understanding of relationships, purpose, and self-awareness. But what makes him stand out isn't just the titles he's held, it's the wisdom he's gained through the processes. He's a coach, mentor, family man, and author who believes the biggest relationship battles don't start with other people. They start within ourselves. Through his experience through marriage, divorce, career pivots, and personal reflection, he's dedicated his life to helping people stop pointing fingers and start planting better seeds in their own lives. His book, The Marriage Seeds, How to Cultivate the Relationship You Desire and Deserve, challenges readers to rethink love, accountability, emotional resilience, and the patterns that keep us stuck in unhealthy cycles. Whether it's romantic relationships, friendships, or even workplace dynamics, he has a way of breaking down complex truths into relatable stories and powerful analogies that hit home. Today, we're talking about accountability, emotional maturity, why some people in relationships fail before they even begin, and how healing yourself may actually be the key to everything. If you've ever questioned love, struggled with commitment, repeated toxic patterns, or tried to make sense of modern relationships and life's chaos, this is the episode for you. Ladies and gentlemen, give it up for author of the Merit Seed, mentor, veteran, entrepreneur, and relationship coach, Mr. Lionel Moses.

SPEAKER_01 3:01

Yeah. Oh man. And look, I'm so glad to be here. I'm waiting to see this person you just spoke about. I'm impressed. I know I can learn a lot from him. That's you. Oh my god. Oh my gosh. I need I need to take that and you know, send it to my kids and my siblings and everything. Hey, look, this is who I am. Yes. Regardless of what you think.

SPEAKER_05 3:26

Yes. Oh, you know, when I get the when I get the audio out, I'll send it right to you for sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:31

Oh my gosh. Oh man, it's great, great to be here. You know, love the work that you're doing. You know, life, you know, can truly be copostatic if we put the work in.

SPEAKER_05 3:42

Facts, facts. All right, let's jump right into it. Today's why don't you chill icebreaker is what's the most random job or hustle you've ever had before your current path? You've done a lot, so I feel like this icebreaker was like a good one for you.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

Well, yeah, you covered most of my life, but so I'm gonna go way back into my childhood.

SPEAKER_05 4:04

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:05

Most random job I've had, I worked for tips at a car wash.

unknown 4:10

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

So I'll be I'm the guy out there that will wipe the cars down, vacuum inside, and I work for tips. You know, I got to meet a lot of people and you know, see nice cars, you know, because you know, when I was growing up, I've always wanted to be a race car driver and a mechanic. I got the mechanic car, but never a race car driver. So that was my way as a kid. I was a teenager, you know, probably somewhere between early 10s, like 13 to 14. Okay. Just going to the car wash, you know, just wipe down cars, you know, just to see them.

SPEAKER_02 4:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Because I grew up in a city and a lot of people didn't have nice cars, so I went to the suburbs.

SPEAKER_05 4:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:45

Where they tipped well. Right. Had nicer cars. Yeah. And it helped me to dream.

SPEAKER_05 4:50

That is what's up. Yeah. I can't imagine. Yeah. So what was it? Who okay? Who was your favorite race car driver growing up?

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Oh my gosh. You know what? I don't, I, I can't name a race car driver that I love. You know, but uh I'm I'm gonna say it's not a it's a fictional character.

SPEAKER_05 5:15

Okay. But my is a fictional character. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

My favorite race car driver was Speed Racing. Okay, that's why we're gonna be racing.

SPEAKER_05 5:22

Okay, yeah, speed racer.

SPEAKER_01 5:24

Just put put me in the cartoon and let me roll.

SPEAKER_05 5:27

Okay, speed racing. That's a classic for our our younger listeners. Uh, speed racing is a classic. Speed racer is a classic. It's like uh there's nothing the Mark V couldn't do. Right, you know, it's a it's a it's a quote unquote anime, you know, for everybody listening. Speed racer is a classic anime, for sure. For sure. I'm surprised you knew. Uh my dad is a super fan of Speed Racers, so he had me watch that growing up. So yeah, I know all about Speed Racer for sure, for sure. I thought you were gonna say Del Dale Earnhardt.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

I I thought, you know, Del Dell is good, but there's so many other people out here now that I'm like, okay, I you start naming names, and you know NASCAR is is pretty good, but when you start talking formula, it's real, it's too competitive out there now.

SPEAKER_05 6:15

Okay, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

It's like okay. Yeah, I'm a formula dude.

SPEAKER_05 6:19

I'm just now starting to get into formula uh so I'm not as converse in uh formula. So where are you from? What how did you grow up? What in what's the environment that started you off in your path?

SPEAKER_01 6:35

I was born and raised in North New Jersey. Okay, you know. Also known here in Jersey as Brick City. Okay. Because, you know, very when I was growing up, very little grass. I was finna say concrete asphalt bricks, concrete jungle as well. So, you know, yeah, man. Brick Brick City is where I grew up. Yeah, which is why, like I said, you know, at my job, my most random job, it's going into the suburbs and washing cars.

SPEAKER_02 7:01

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

You know, a lot a lot of people around me didn't, well, they didn't have cars. They didn't have transport used mass transportation. You know, so I went somewhere where there were cars and a little bit more money.

SPEAKER_05 7:15

Facts. Now, growing up in school, were you were you into writing? Did you like, was English like your favorite subject or anything like that?

SPEAKER_01 7:28

No, no, no. Did I say no yet? No. No. I I I really I'm not I don't like reading or writing, to be honest with you. Oh, wow. But I love learning, so I have to.

SPEAKER_05 7:43

Right. Okay, okay. There's a lot of things.

SPEAKER_01 7:44

So I don't I don't enjoy doing it. But I I love learning. So I'm I'm always reading something. I always writing something.

SPEAKER_05 7:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

In high school, I went to a technical school, learned how to, you know, automotive technology.

SPEAKER_05 7:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:57

I studied that. And again, coincidentally, it requires a lot of math to work on cars. I don't like math. Oh, wow, yeah, yeah. But, you know, when you're measuring our pistons and piston rings and trying to get, you know, these different velocities and all, yeah, you you need to do math. But it it wasn't math because of the practical application of it.

SPEAKER_05 8:17

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

And that's you know, but it wasn't until later in my life that I started realizing that, hey, you know, anything can be practical, which is why I'm on the path for more now.

SPEAKER_05 8:27

That's good.

SPEAKER_01 8:28

We overcomplicate things and we overthink too much.

SPEAKER_05 8:30

That's good. I like that. I like that. Now, did your environment shape how you viewed relationships and love growing up? Did your parents, were they together, or how did you how did your environment shape it?

SPEAKER_01 8:46

I was raised predominantly by my mother. Um, my father was around, you know, but he and he I'm not gonna say he's the absentee father, but he didn't really step into my life on a full-term basis until I was a teenager.

SPEAKER_05 8:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 8:59

And by then, growing up in the city, you know, I had I had to already establish a name, which I did.

SPEAKER_05 9:05

Right.

SPEAKER_01 9:06

So I already established my presence when he came here. So, you know, as with everything in life, you know, you can get at least two meanings, two pieces of information from everything. You learn what to do or you learn what not to do.

SPEAKER_05 9:20

Right.

SPEAKER_01 9:21

And, you know, I said that simply because, you know, I was I was a young dad. I had my first child when I was 20.

SPEAKER_05 9:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

And uh the things that I was doing just wasn't the greatest things and the greatest practices. And my ex told me, she said, you know, stop what you're doing, or you won't see your daughter, because I can't bring my daughter in those environments.

SPEAKER_05 9:41

Right.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

So, in essence, yes, I did learn how to love in the environments, but not by the example, but by the example what I did not want.

SPEAKER_05 9:50

Yeah, definitely. I think we all kind of you know, we gotta learn and unlearn certain things that we grow up around. So that's not you know what I'm saying? All right, absolutely. So jumping into that, what made you write the marriage seed?

SPEAKER_01 10:09

This is a good one.

SPEAKER_05 10:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:10

Actually, the the marriage seed is a is a culmination of actually my uh journal notes from things I've experienced in life, uh therapy sessions that I went through, coaching sessions that I went through, just aha moments that I had, I put it down on paper. Uh, because I to me it was interesting and things that I did not know at the ripe age of, I think I was I think I was around 50 when I first started writing.

SPEAKER_05 10:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 10:41

Yeah, and and it sat for like seven years in the note form, and you know, because I I tried to put it together and I sent it to get edited, and you know, my little fills were crushed. It's like, yo, what like what is this? You know, what where is this? Where is that? I'm like, okay, I have no idea what you want from me. This is it. But it's like, yeah, this is a nice little pamphlet.

SPEAKER_03 11:08

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 11:10

Yeah, so but you know, the inspiration to actually put it out actually happened after my mother passed away. You know, something inside of me told me I promised her I was gonna do it.

unknown 11:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:22

So I did it. So, you know, like a one year after her death, you know, I could not sleep until the book was done. So I actually got it published, you know, I uh I'm gonna say it's like the 38th or 28th of December.

SPEAKER_05 11:38

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

Because committed to doing it that year. So I'm not holding it anymore. So I started living my life to like fulfill some promises that I made to my mom, and that was my biggest inspiration, you know, for for writing it and putting it out when I did.

SPEAKER_05 11:52

Okay. Now the relationship C speaks more to honesty within self. Right? So what what inspired that? What how did that come about for you?

SPEAKER_01 12:06

I was divorced twice, married twice, and divorced twice. The common denominator of both my marriages was me.

SPEAKER_05 12:13

Hey, that is real.

SPEAKER_01 12:15

So at the end of the day, if you know, if my relationships aren't going right, you know, then there's there's only one person I can point at because the only person left is me.

SPEAKER_03 12:26

Right.

SPEAKER_01 12:27

So when I honestly look in the mirror and I start taking an honest assessment of who I am, and it's not easy, I just started seeing certain trends and certain things. And the hardest part, truthfully, was to learn how to love myself in spite of what I saw.

SPEAKER_05 12:44

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 12:45

And acknowledge that, okay, yeah, that that that's that's not the greatest thing. There could be a better way to do this, you know. And you know, ironically, I was asked yesterday, you know, by someone that I would you know I would consider a friend, and he said, he said, um, why would anyone buy a book from you when you were divorced twice? And because practicality is how I talk and how I think, first thing I said to him was, you know, what do professional athletes do before and after a game? They watch film.

SPEAKER_05 13:20

Right.

SPEAKER_01 13:21

That's how you improve your skill set by watching film and you watch the film of your competitors. So the reason why, you know, I wrote the book and why it was important to me to write the book is okay, I had all these blind spots in my life that I wasn't aware of.

SPEAKER_02 13:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:41

And, you know, you can't truly heal between relationships unless you take the time to assess.

SPEAKER_05 13:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

And for me, the first place to start assessing is on the things that I know. And guess where they were? Written in the book. My journals. Nice. So when I started addressing those aha moments, you say, okay, let's put those aha moments to work. Let's use them and see what happens.

SPEAKER_05 14:09

Now, the aha moment. Is that the planting of the seeds? Is that what it really means to plant the seeds?

SPEAKER_01 14:18

Planting of the seed is just simply a metaphor for saying that a seed represents everything that you want out of your relationship.

unknown 14:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 14:28

It's in that one little seed. Planting it just means, okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna put it in a proper place for it to grow.

SPEAKER_05 14:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

So if I have an acorn, there's a tree inside that acorn.

SPEAKER_05 14:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 14:40

But it's not until I put it in the ground, I I let it die in the ground, I water it, allow sunshine, I add, you know, manure to it, that it can grow and become, you know, all that's supposed to be. It will not reach its redemptive potential until all the work that's in it and around it is done. So the seed just represents, you know, you have everything within you to create everything that you need in your life. You just have to work it like you do a seed. Because a seed on a dry table is not going to produce any of that.

SPEAKER_05 15:13

Nice. Now, I've hearing you say that, I feel like people spend more time on quote unquote finding the one instead of actually like becoming the one. You know what I'm saying? Why is that?

SPEAKER_01 15:29

I found for me, I can't speak for the world, but what I found for me was I knew, like I said, I knew. I thought I that's that's the issue right there. I thought I knew what I wanted.

SPEAKER_04 15:39

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:40

What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna flip your question around is you know, we look at finding the one, but most of us don't really know who the one is or what the one would look like for us because we don't live in our authentic self most of the time.

unknown 15:53

Nice.

SPEAKER_01 15:53

Well, you're going around thinking of funk all the time and you're being an imposter, the person you find that you think is the one, okay, they they meet the criteria for your dream person, but can they handle the real you?

SPEAKER_03 16:06

Right.

SPEAKER_01 16:07

You can't answer that question if you don't know you, and that's why I speak the way I speak in the book about becoming self-aware and learning who you are, because it's until you know who you are, you won't really know who and what's the match for you. Because I I've I mean, you know, I'm right now I'm I'm single and I've dated, and I've dated people that I thought were very attractive, they were very intelligent, I mean, their lives are well put together, but they wouldn't work for me. And the reason why they wouldn't work for me, I mean, we had the same faith, I mean, so much in common that everybody on the outside would say, that's a good couple, they will work well together. But I know me. And what I know about me is I'm a very, very busy guy. Okay, okay. And that right there, the average person can't handle.

SPEAKER_05 16:54

Definitely.

SPEAKER_01 16:55

You know, so okay, all right, everything else lines up, but if I'm too busy and you work, you know, just a straight nine to five, you wouldn't understand me. And how I operate and why I move the way I move. You know, being an entrepreneur, you have to take opportunities when they come.

SPEAKER_05 17:14

Definitely. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

You don't necessarily get to create your schedule the way someone with a nine to five. And then there's sometimes where you have to pivot. And, you know, it's hard on a family when you're trying to pivot because everyone has to pivot. It makes it bigger. As a single man, when I pivot, I'm pivoting.

SPEAKER_02 17:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:31

Does it affect me? Yes. And I found that in a lot of relationships, while they while the women that I met, some of them will understand it, but most of them don't like it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 17:43

Time and attention is probably one of the most important parts.

SPEAKER_01 17:47

Love language.

SPEAKER_05 17:48

Missing out on that.

SPEAKER_01 17:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 17:49

You know what I'm saying? Yeah. It's going to be hard to balance.

SPEAKER_01 17:52

And that's something I learned about myself through my marriages, my relationships. I grind. And as long as I'm on a path, a growth path, it's going to be hard to find someone that can relate to that. It's not impossible. Because it's, you know, I believe she's out there. You know, it's not impossible. But for now, you know, my purpose in life is to help people build relationships. That's what I'm called to do. But I used to push that helps aside for other people to give time to, you know, my partner. And when I did that, I felt a hole in my heart. Because I'm not doing what I was created for to appease someone else. And it is that bad. Not always. You know, because when you're in a relationship, you have to make this sacrifice. They they need to be number one, and they are number one. But until I can give what someone requires as number one, you know, I've been called cold because it's like, you know, I know what I can give you, but if it starts hurting me too much, you know, then there's an imbalance. And we have to find that balance. And that has been a struggle for me, you know, finding that balance. But I can tell you with all assurance that I feel that if it's meant for me to be with someone, and I believe it is, I I I'm almost about to say, I know it is, you know, we we will line up. This is gonna be controversial, but I'm gonna say it anyway. There will be a mutual chase.

SPEAKER_05 19:26

A mutual chase. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

Well, I mean, you know, in Western culture, you know, people are trained that, okay, a man chases a woman. You know, but if attraction makes you chase what makes you stay. I'm just saying. If attraction makes you chase, why is it not okay for you to chase? Now, chasing is may not be the best words because chasing means that it implies that someone's running from it. But pursuit is something different. Why not pursue what you want?

SPEAKER_05 19:58

Right.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

Because I'll tell you straight up as a busy man, I'm not gonna waste time or energy on something I don't think can develop.

SPEAKER_05 20:05

Okay. Definitely.

SPEAKER_01 20:06

So unless I see mutual investment, and again I say mutual. If I see an open door, I'll tap on it to see if it open. I'm not gonna try to kick it down, but I'll tap on it to see if it opens. And how it opens, and then after I see it opens, I'm coming in carrying all the baggage that I have, dropping it on the table, and see if I'm still welcome. I'm at an age, I don't have time to play. But, and that's kind of stuff I talk about in the book. One of the most popular chapters is one called Purposeful Singleness. And it's about learning who you are and what you need and what you bring to the table.

SPEAKER_05 20:45

That's what I was gonna ask you. What m inspired you to be so vulnerable in the book so publicly?

SPEAKER_01 20:51

What inspired me to be so vulnerable is you know, I don't want anyone to ever suffer through the things I suffered through. You know, there's growth that comes with suffering, but you know, I'm not old enough to be the father of everyone in the world. But if I have a life lesson that can provide a shortcut for someone, I'm gonna do it. And that's you know, why that's why I coach, that's why I train, that's why I have workshops. Because I have a lot of experiences in life, romantic relationships, business. I don't want to tell people the highlights.

SPEAKER_05 21:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

Your highlights is definitely going to be different because in order for your highlights to be like mine, you have to interact with the same people at the same time, and that's not gonna happen. We're in a different space. But when I coach, you know, that gives you an intimate relationship with you for me to tell you, you know, what I see in your life, and you have to be ready for it, and also tell you about my failures. See, I can tell you where I fell. And that's what assessment does. I assess my strengths and my weaknesses. So if this is an area that failed, we need to find the underlying principle that made me do what I did, principle and process.

SPEAKER_05 22:03

Now, do you think that you know they say that people, because of everything they've been through, they sabotage relationships unknowingly.

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Hundred percent. All of the time. I'm trying to think of the right phrase, but I'm gonna just say what's on my mind. I'm gonna say this. My disclaimer is boundaries are good.

SPEAKER_05 22:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 22:26

It's good to have boundaries in a relationship. You need to have them, regardless of what kind of relationship it is, whether it's work, friendship, romantic, you know, parent, child, you have to have boundaries. But when you make blanket statements like I will never do blank, blank blank again out of pain, you're sabotaging it. Because what you're doing is you're putting a scab on a wound and not allowing it to have air to breathe. And I'm saying air is life.

unknown 22:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

You have to allow life to touch that thing and to heal it. You know, but if you don't allow anything in it, that part of your life is gonna be like cancer and it's just gonna it's gonna kill you. And it's gonna present a hardness to every other relationship you have based on the experience you had with one person.

SPEAKER_05 23:15

Now, in saying all that, what realities do you think you discovered after writing this book, even for you?

SPEAKER_01 23:23

One of the greatest realities that I finally accepted was that I'm a people pleaser. And that hurt me simply because I've been called a control freak. Well, I mean, one of my businesses is a janitorial service.

SPEAKER_04 23:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 23:42

And when I commit to a customer, we're gonna do this, this, this, this, and this. Guess what we're gonna do? I'm paying you to do everything that's on that SOP.

unknown 23:53

Right.

SPEAKER_01 23:53

That's what we said we're gonna do, we're gonna do it. Oh, well, it doesn't need it. Well, if it doesn't need it, you can do it fast, but you gotta do it.

unknown 23:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:00

Because what you see with a blind eye from a long distance is different from what you see when you're walking across it. You can say the floor don't need a vacuum, but if you're walking and you're looking, okay, you walk right by it.

unknown 24:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

If you didn't take that step and look at it from a granular perspective, you know, you're guaranteed to miss something. So, you know, for me, learning and accepting the fact that, you know, I was a people pleaser, it shocked me because I'm like, okay, well, you know, how can you be a control freak and a people pleaser? And the truth is, I'm a people pleaser because I love people.

SPEAKER_02 24:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

It's people pleaser because I want people to grow, which is why I wrote the book. I'm a people pleaser because people are God's greatest creation. He loves people, I'm gonna love people.

SPEAKER_04 24:46

100%.

SPEAKER_01 24:46

I'm I'm I'm gonna do what my daddy does. And control freak, well, you know, my daddy has standards, I have standards. If we're say we're gonna do something, integrity matters. You know, but it it but it was hard, you know. No one wants to say anything negative about themselves.

SPEAKER_02 25:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:05

Well that that sounds that's being a people pleaser sound like a weakness to me. I'm too hardcore for that.

SPEAKER_03 25:10

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Oh man, no, I not me. But yeah, I'm I'm a softy.

SPEAKER_05 25:19

Now, getting the actual book out, what has been the most difficult parts for you know, the people listening that may want to write their own book one day? What was the hard parts about getting the book actually published and out into the world?

SPEAKER_01 25:36

The hardest part for me was first identifying the audience that I want to read the book. The who's it's for. So that way I can write directly to them.

unknown 25:47

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

And, you know, that's one thing that makes my book somewhat unique, because my audience is very broad and is loaded with principles, and you know, there's definitely a couple sequels coming out, because again, a principle is a principle that applies anywhere you use it, whether it's friendship, romantic, you know, or work. And you know, while most of the principles that I wrote in this book, I wrote based on, as I said, my journals from my marital, my romantic relationship.

SPEAKER_02 26:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

Which is such the title of the marriage seed, they're also the same principles that I use in business. You know, so the hardest part to me was okay, how do you write something that's gonna reach a target audience so you can speak to them? And then, you know, pushing it out to the right people to get it out there for them. Does that mean that it can only reach one group of people? No, because you know, when you go to school, what's that?

SPEAKER_05 26:54

I was gonna say you never know who you're gonna reach.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 26:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:57

Yeah, I was I was thinking about for me, you know, in school, yeah, I had a major in a minor.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

Yeah.

unknown 27:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:04

Again, I I'm I'm a principal dude. I it's like I have a major, and I look at things practically. I had a major in a minor. I really want to do this, but this one would probably pay me more money. So I'm gonna learn about that, what I really care about, but I'm gonna go, you know, just make some money. You know, so yeah, major in a minor.

SPEAKER_05 27:21

Definitely. Now, okay, we talked about the pain, the struggles, and then going through the process of redeveloping everything. What have been the amazing parts? What's the good parts so far through this journey?

SPEAKER_01 27:36

Ironically, for me, the good parts are the same as the hard parts. Because I I've I've learned to love myself for who I am, and I love the fact that I still have life in me where I can enjoy me. I remember, you know, I was married and I had this friend of mine who was single, and he said to me, Man, I take myself to the movies, I grab some popcorn, I'll sit there and I'll crack up by myself, go home and have a good night's rest, just laughing and chuckling all the way. I thought it was hilarious. I mean, it's like, really? You do all that? But now, guess what I do? I do that sometimes because I come to the realization that if I don't love my presence, who else will?

unknown 28:21

Right.

SPEAKER_01 28:21

The most amazing part is that I get to discover me every day. And what I bring to a relationship is an authentic me that's unbiased and that's not pressed for anything.

SPEAKER_05 28:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

You know, so for me, it's amazing to sit back and reflect on all my years and you know, some of my relationships, you know, that I had, I and not romantic, I'm talking with friends and my kids and everything. They're so much stronger simply because I have more time. I'm not as stressed. Because when you live, you know, as an imitator and you're wearing a mask all your life, it's heavy.

SPEAKER_05 29:02

Yeah, I bet.

SPEAKER_01 29:04

That's heavy.

unknown 29:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:05

And to now just be free and okay, I'm gonna love me for me, and I'm gonna present myself authentic me to everyone else, and you know, the most amazing part is the guy I was hiding was love, but this guy is loved even more. And most importantly, I feel the love.

unknown 29:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

See, when you're wearing a mask, you may feel that someone loves you, but you know you're wearing a mask. So do they really love you or do they love the mask?

SPEAKER_05 29:30

They love what you're presenting, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:32

Exactly. Exactly. So my representative got love, but now Lionel's, you know, for one of the first times in my life, Lionel's starting to feel love for who I am. And it's funny, you know, I I went to church on Sunday. And um I got friends, some people like me. This guy's a troublemaker. So we see me coming, he'll say, Oh man, here comes the troublemaker. And I just started laughing because when I say troublemaker, in a good way, you know, just good humor and fun. I'm like, yo, dude, man. I said, why you call me troublemaker? He said, because that's what you are. I said, Jet, you still hang with me. It's like birds of a feather. Right. You know, but just the freedom, you know, of knowing who I am, planting the authentic seed, allowing the authentic seed in me to grow. You know, and appreciate life, you know, that's that's that's my true heart and the message and the desire, desire to have for anybody to read my book. I want you to take the time to invest in you and you know, and learn how amazing you are. That's the most amazing part. That you're amazing. I read it in my favorite book that I'm beautifully and wonderfully made. I believe it.

SPEAKER_05 30:41

If you know the book, you know, catch that. If you know, you know.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

Exactly, exactly. My favorite book, man.

SPEAKER_05 30:51

All right. Um now, what has been the feedback from your readers? Like, has anyone I know on this podcast there was a lady who you know was gonna commit suicide, and I have a I have a segment on the show where I do a different side outside of um one on ones where I answer emails. And a lady, you know, she said she wanted to commit suicide, so she like she wrote in and told us about her story, and we helped her like you know, get into church and get into community and find help so people could help her. And then, you know, I still every now and again, shout out to you, Blue, you know, she'll write me or I'll talk to her every blue moon. So what's been your experience with your book helping people?

SPEAKER_01 31:42

It's funny, I have a mixture. Um I have a lot of people that say, you know, I like your book, but the title threw me all.

SPEAKER_05 31:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 31:53

Because it says marriage. I'm not interested in a marriage, I don't want a marriage. But you know, being on shows like yours, you know, it's like and talking to people, it's not just about marriage. And and as you said in the intro, it's it's about a self-awareness, about learning who you are and identifying that you can't leave your happiness with anyone else. You have to put in yourself. But on the flip side, I've had couples that were married for years that simply said, Wow, you know, I've never thought about this. Now here I am. I'm a guy that was married twice, you know, and had, you know, other relationships. And people that were married 30, 40 years haven't seen or experienced some of the things that I've experienced, or haven't thought about the way I thought about it. They would work through their stuff and they would stay together, but you know, that vantage point about things were a lot different. And then for singles, which is where I get most of my feedback from, because most people buy it because they have an intent to get married and they want to, you know, their relationship to be great, is it's like, you know, I never looked at myself like this.

unknown 32:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:58

And when I hear that, well, I appreciate all the comments, but when I hear that, I'm like, yes, my mission is accomplished. Because I want people to know the things that where I struggle and my thought process before you get into a situation that I got into. So if you're reading at 23 to 29, you know, when you're thinking of just what is a real relationship, and I'm giving you, you know, gems and jewels that I've learned throughout my 40, 45 years of life at that point, you're ahead of the game.

unknown 33:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

You caught a tailwind already. Now, are you going to experience everything I experienced? No, but it gives you a tailwind to things to look for within yourself and how to identify things within yourself. And, you know, for me, that was not something I was ever taught. So when I hear people saying that they learn concepts and principles that they just never thought of, I'm like, great. Because, you know, as I said, my purpose in life is to help people with relationships, and you know, that starts with, you know, the self-assessment. Regardless of what type of relationship it is. So I I love that. It's a mission accomplished.

SPEAKER_05 34:12

Definitely. Now, future goals. If you could map out how you want it, how the dream, what what it is, what would that be for you going forward? What is the what is the goal? What's the dream?

SPEAKER_01 34:28

Well, I'm actually work, I'm actually working on my dream now, honestly. I have uh several workshops set up where I just teach principles of relationships. Uh within the next year or two, I'm gonna split them out where I'm focused one strictly for professional and the other, you know, for romantics and platonic relationships.

SPEAKER_03 34:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

But I'm I'm I'm actually working in my purpose now because that's that's that's my dream. I thrive on relationships, and I believe I thrive on relationships. It's because I'm the the next to the youngest of six, five. Oh, wow. And um, you know, there were some traumatic things that took place during my formative years where, you know, my mom wasn't able to care for me, you know, like I should, based on, you know, what therapists and psychologists have told me.

SPEAKER_05 35:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01 35:19

Which is why I lean towards relationships that was because during my formative years, I had nothing. And and again, I understand the choices that were made.

SPEAKER_02 35:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:31

But still, you know, and this was something I learned during my healing process. While I understand the choices that were made, they still affected me.

SPEAKER_02 35:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:39

And what my therapist at the time kept pushing me at, and I didn't get it. But it's like, yeah, I understand that. Yeah, I understand that, but that's not right. Yeah, I understand that, but that's not right. Because I was defending my parents.

SPEAKER_02 35:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:53

Naturally. It is natural, yeah, but it's not the right thing to do. Because it doesn't allow the young Lionel to hear.

SPEAKER_05 36:01

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

From that childhood womb.

SPEAKER_05 36:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:05

Now I'm good. Because you're right, it did hurt.

SPEAKER_05 36:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

You're right, it didn't, I didn't like it. But that's part of my formation process that, you know, part of the divine design that created Lionel.

unknown 36:17

Nice.

SPEAKER_01 36:17

Because, you know, someone greater than me and my mom and my dad knew what I was gonna endure to make me who I was. And it's also that same environment that made me a people pleaser. Because again, when you're next to the youngest and you have four sisters, you know, it's like, okay, I got one brother and I got four sisters. You know, actually five sisters. But it's like I'm trying to please everyone.

SPEAKER_02 36:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:40

Because I'm looking up to them. So, okay, I I I want to be loved, I want to be this, I want to be accepted, you know. And as a as a younger brother, you know, there were times where my older brother didn't want me near him because again, who wants to keep a brother with him?

SPEAKER_05 36:54

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm I'm the oldest of two brothers, so I get it, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah. Now, did you treat them that way? So as a 35-year-old now, I realize like I should have done more with them. You know what I'm saying? But you didn't know. But I didn't, because I didn't know. And the things that I did do with them, I wish I didn't do that with them.

SPEAKER_01 37:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 37:21

You know?

SPEAKER_01 37:22

Yeah. Yeah. So there you have it. That's life.

SPEAKER_05 37:25

That's life.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

That's life. So, and again, it molded me.

SPEAKER_05 37:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:29

To who I am, which is why I invest my life in relationships, because I was blessed to have some great relationships. You know, my my I have the greatest siblings on this side of heaven.

SPEAKER_05 37:43

Definitely.

SPEAKER_01 37:44

Almost every day, you know, because we have a we have a sibling chat, and almost every day, someone in there is saying something. And and and a lot of times, Five, it's like, it's it's nothing but a something. Like something stupid, like a joke, or just something we've seen on social media, or just something crazy. But just to acknowledge that we're here for each other and we love each other, yeah, and we're separated geographically, which makes it even better today. Yeah. So it's like, wow, you know, we're we're all separated.

SPEAKER_05 38:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

We keep the connection.

SPEAKER_05 38:16

You got to. And I I love that. This week's episode is sponsored by the Design Lab at Shutter Shock Co. From logos and business cards to invitations and custom tees, the design lab is your one-stop shop for graphics. The design lab is the sole creator for Copacetic merchandise available now. Use your promo code Copacetic for 10% off your Copacetic merchandise. Shop now using the link in our bio. So I want you to tell a story. If you had to pick one moment in your life that completely changed how you viewed love, relationships, or emotional growth, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 39:28

Okay, so you're gonna put me out there like that. Woo! Okay. We're trying to get to know you. Hey, look, it's just us. We're amongst friends. Everybody, you and all the lists, we're all friends, so yeah. I can trust my truth with you.

SPEAKER_02 39:44

Facts.

SPEAKER_01 39:46

Oh my gosh. So if I had to choose one moment in my life to that completely changed how I view love, you know, relationships. As interesting or ironic as it sounds, I would say it was after my second divorce that, you know, I truly, that truly, you know, shifted, you know, the paradigm on how I saw love relationships and everything. It's because it was after that where I came to the conclusion that, you know, you're you're right. You have been presenting a representative all this time. So initially, come out of the fetal position or the floor balling and say, okay, you know, either you're gonna live or you're gonna die. Yeah. You got it's gonna be one or the other. You can't stay on the floor balling forever because if you don't pay the mortgage, they're gonna take the house.

SPEAKER_05 40:51

100%.

SPEAKER_01 40:52

You know, so you you gotta get up and get out and do something. And it was in those moments where, you know, one of the movies that I love is a movie called Hancock with Will Smith.

SPEAKER_02 41:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

And there's a scene in the movie where Hancock, well, just a little bit about the story. Well, Hancock was a superhero, and in a former life, he was married. He had superpowers, his wife had superpowers, she remarried, had a family. He didn't know she existed. But when they come together, they get weaker.

SPEAKER_03 41:27

Right.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

So in that moment, I envisioned myself as Hancock, meaning I was just so weak. And towards the end of the movie, he was in the hospital dying, because that's how I felt on the floor in the feet of position at the Mundabor. I felt like I was dying. But I had a choice to make either lay there and die, and it affects everyone around me. Hancock saw his family, you know, through the corner of his eyes, and how sad it made them. What I saw was my family as I was laying on the on the ground, you know, bawling, because again, love hurts going in and coming out, and while you're in it. You know, because I I did not go into a marriage, you know, for divorce or to be, you know, separate, anything like that. I was bawling. But when I decided to stand up and start taking those slow steps towards the end, just like Hancock, there were times where I stepped out and the ground was nowhere near me, and it was a horror fall. But I had to continue working because life did not stop. I had a minor child to support.

SPEAKER_03 42:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:38

I still had to earn money. My family depended on me. But as time went on, as in a movie, you know, the steps got easier and easier and easier. And what I learned throughout the time, my healing came while I was working as a clean, uh, you can have my cleaning service, and I was working at night and it was quiet. I go and looking, seeing the work other people did, just assessing stuff and asking questions of myself throughout the whole time. And the biggest thing five that helped me was that because it was quiet, I was able to listen. See, a lot of times, you know, for me, it's like we hear sounds, we hear stuff, our body talks, you know, that pain, that gut feeling. You know, are you listening to it? And if you listen to it, are you asking questions of that? And that's when I begin to learn who the real me was. I begin to have so many aha moments, like, you know what? I can't change it.

unknown 43:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:42

I'm still young.

unknown 43:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:44

You know, and people would say stuff, oh, okay, you know, my friends did not know the pain I was in because I wore a mask. But yet, okay, I feel love. So what I started doing is putting the mask down. You know, when I say down, I'm If you see, I'm tilting my hand.

SPEAKER_02 44:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:02

So it's like a fan holding up, tilt my hand, exposing to see if it's safe. You know, but it was it was it wasn't until that moment that I was able to not just view love differently and view relationships differently, but I was able to grow emotionally in loving me and identifying who I was. And once I began to learn who I was and I began to love me, my perception, my vantage point of every relationship I ever had changed. Because now it's like, you know, I'm not a bad person because, you know, as much pain as I'm in, I'm holding it down.

SPEAKER_05 44:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:44

And there are people that still love me. I might be okay. So, you know, for if I had to choose one moment that changed it, it was one of the hardest and one of the worst times of my life, but it was also the greatest.

SPEAKER_02 44:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:59

Because I I got to learn the line of that was created and who I was created to be. And while, you know, I heard stories and, you know, been to therapists and been to, you know, boot camps and stuff about learning your identity and all kinds of stuff. And people showed me things, that was my aha moment where everything clicked. And you know, when I began to put it to practice, you know, I was I I was good.

unknown 45:28

Nice.

SPEAKER_05 45:28

I was good. Nice. Now, last two questions before we get you up out of here. We appreciate you being here. Um, if you can see one person on this podcast, the only catch is you gotta help us get that person on the podcast, who would it be?

SPEAKER_01 45:48

Hands down, no questions asked, President Barack Obama.

SPEAKER_05 45:52

Okay, yeah, I'm with that.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

No questions asked.

SPEAKER_05 45:56

You know Barack Obama?

SPEAKER_01 45:58

Yeah, hey, why not? Hey, look, I'll I'll I'll hey I'll hit him up on IG as soon as I get here. Okay. As soon as I get off.

SPEAKER_02 46:06

Definitely. Let him know.

SPEAKER_01 46:08

Whether he responds or not, that's that's that's the guy I would like to talk to.

SPEAKER_05 46:13

Definitely.

SPEAKER_01 46:14

I mean, he he's just to me, he's just so eloquent as speech. And his formulation of words is so practical.

SPEAKER_02 46:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:24

That anybody can understand them. So he does, you know, what one of my greatest mentors say, Barack Obama knows how to speak to every chair without making anyone have to dumb down or feel like it's over their head. And his smile and his genuine concern for mankind is unquestionable. And I feel that, you know, he's one I believe that exemplifies, you know, the loving your neighbor thing and loving your enemy more than I do. Because, you know, people come at him and he'll just, you know, you know, all right, you know, there's an issue. I still have a little brick city, I may swing. I may swing.

SPEAKER_05 47:09

Don't we all? Don't we at all?

SPEAKER_01 47:11

Yeah, man.

SPEAKER_05 47:12

It's like all right. Now, if someone listening feels broken from past relationships, what advice would you give them or what's one seed from the book that you would advise them to focus on right now?

SPEAKER_01 47:31

What I'm gonna say is not correlated exactly with the chapter that's in the book, but it is principles that's written throughout the book, and that's the one chapter is entitled, We've Been Doing It All Wrong.

SPEAKER_05 47:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 47:44

And, you know, the reason why I would encourage someone with that is because if you were in a relationship, similar to, you know, my one moment that changed my life, if you were in a relationship and you feel hurt, crushed, and don't have any hope, that says two things about you that's very important that you can't forget. The first thing that it says is that you're alive. And the second thing it says about you is that you're capable of loving. So as long as you have those two things, there's always hope for you. And the good news is that sometimes separation is a good thing.

unknown 48:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:22

Because, you know, you know, I was told this, you know, I can see to the door, but God can see around the corner and through the door. So not knowing what's ahead of us, you know, and I can tell you from past experience that, you know, I've seen people that, you know, I grew up with who they're in, you know, a different place in life. And if I was connected to them as I wanted to be in that season, where would I be today?

SPEAKER_05 48:54

Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:55

You know, so sometimes, you know, again, just one of the principles of gardening that we talk about in the book is pruning. It's pruning time. Sometimes you have to cut stuff off for new stuff to grow. And again, as long as you got those two things, you're breathing meaning, you're alive, you're capable of love, pruning is just gonna help you grow.

SPEAKER_05 49:15

You are watching a master at work. That was good. That was good. I like that. Um, I just want to thank you for being here. Um I feel like you dropped so many gems in this short span. Like, it's really gonna connect with people. Um give them your hit up, let them know where they can follow you. Anything you want to promote other than the book, go get the book, guys. But anything you want to promote, let them know.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

Well, again, my my website, lionelmosis.com, has everything there's going on with me, or you can go to themarriage seed.com. Um, I'm on Lionel Moses on your most platforms. And your other platforms you can go to to find stuff about me, you'll see me with the corporate name of EmpowerSync. That's the name, that's the that's that's the actual name of my business. Okay. It's EmpowerSync LLC. So, you know, I'm again, I I'm on all socials. I do you know like a actually like a bi-weekly blog on the marriage seed as it pertains to relationships on the marriage seed website, marriageseed.com, and on lionelmosis.com, I deal more on a corporate professional side. You know, because again, because I do both, I I separate them with that. But you go on lionelmoses.com and you'll you'll have me.

SPEAKER_05 50:35

Definitely, definitely. And I am your host five. Uh we want to thank Mr. LionelMoses for being here. You can catch us at uh the copacetic hour at gmail.com or catch me personally at notorious underscore big underscore e on Instagram. Catch us on TikTok, the Cobacetic Hour, catch us at YouTube, the Copacetic Hour. Um, keep buying your merchandise at www.thecopacetic hour.com. And as always, please walk by faith, protect your peace, secure your wealth, and define your destiny. This is the Copacetic Hour, people.