Crafting Connections and Building Business with Chris Winter

Step into the world of innovation with the shed industry's very own Chris Winter, as he unravels over two decades of his experiences right from the heart of Texas. From the genesis of expanding a manufacturer's dealer network to the entrepreneurial leap of operating his own dealership, Chris's narrative is a treasure trove for anyone eyeing the shed business. Tune in to hear how incorporating carports and tiny homes into their offerings has skyrocketed their family business, and how Chris's insights as a writer for Shed Builder Magazine are shaping the future of sheds.

We also shed light on the mule delivery system's game-changing role in logistics, and how competition spurs camaraderie and innovation in industry hubs. Chris Winter sprinkles in a dash of humor with tales of business strategies that turn companies into destinations for discerning shed shoppers.

Finally, get ready for a candid discussion on the challenges and triumphs of the shed dealership landscape. Chris shares his expert advice on evaluating partnerships and scouting prime real estate. We also discuss the carport industry's growing pains and the power of supportive manufacturer relationships. Wrapping up, Chris reflects on his intriguing switch from wine sales to sheds, reminding us of the importance of community and connection in business success. Join us for this masterclass in nurturing an industry that's steadfastly building more than just structures—it's crafting enduring relationships.

Also, find out how the podcast can be heard throughout the plain communities by dialing the number 330-997-3055. If the number is busy, just dial again! 

For more information or to know more about the Shed Geek Podcast visit us at our website.

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Transcript

SHED GEEK: 0:36

Okay, welcome back to another episode of the Shed Geek podcast. For those of you that's listening, we're mixing in these different podcasts throughout the different locations we've been going to, but quite a few here in Texas and we're still here in Texas and we're getting deeper into South Texas down here close to Austin. So lots of fun. Our guest today is Chris. I'm gonna let him introduce himself, but you probably recognize Chris for those of you who do any reading about the shed industry. Happy to be here, Chris, so thankful to get a chance to sit down and interview you today. Do you just want to introduce yourself a little bit about who you are and what you do, sir?

CHRIS WINTER: 1:20

sure, and it's a. It's nice to have you guys in Texas, welcome. Um, yeah, I'm Chris Winter and I kind of fell backwards into the shed business. I answered an ad that a manufacturer uh put out about. This was back in 2003, so it's been over 20 years and I was a uh, I was a manufacturer's rep, uh, basically a dealer's rep opening up uh lots in Texas and Louisiana for a manufacturer. That's kind of how I got into it and I had a, had a couple of uh, a couple of of runs with the same manufacturer uh, but uh eventually ended up opening my dad as one of my dealers in a lot here in Bastrop, just to get him out of my mom's hair. He was newly retired and driving her crazy, so she said he needed to find a hobby and I said, hey, why don't you be one of my lots in my territory? And he was a sales guy too. So he did really good. I knew that he would do well and he could put as much into it as he wanted to. And you know he did. He did pretty good. He was one of my one of my better accounts on there and he was working four or five days a week, which was more than he wanted to.

CHRIS WINTER: 2:37

And eventually, some years later, like around 2008, the bottom kind of fell out of the business that I was in. I was in the recruiting business, and so I came back to help my dad sort of streamline his dealership and we had changed, we had changed manufacturers. At that point we came on with Derksen as a a manufacturer. We've been with them ever since. But, uh, worked with my dad, um, for a while and then I understood why my mom wanted to get him out of the house. He, he drove me crazier than he drove her and uh, you know, it was just like kind of uh, you know, two, two bulls in a small pen and eventually I, uh, I gave him an ultimatum, I gave him a deal, a deal that he couldn't refuse, an offer that he couldn't refuse yeah and uh said like I'm gonna pay you to stay home.

CHRIS WINTER: 3:30

So yeah, so we, we did that um, but our um, you know our growth as a uh, uh, as a shed dealer has really been phenomenal. Since that time We've experienced some great growth and a great relationship with our manufacturer. And then we also branched out into the carport business. When I came in, we really expanded our carport business and then we also brought on tiny homes, so manufacturing tiny homes out of Derksen buildings. So with those three companies those make up the Winter Team Enterprises, umbrella.

SHED GEEK: 4:15

I see Very nice, very. And then, for those of you who may not recognize the voice but but recognize the train of thoughts here, uh, you're also a write, an editorial piece, and the shed builder magazine.

CHRIS WINTER: 4:30

You've been doing that for a year or so now yeah, just just a little bit over a year, um had four articles uh published with shed builder uher between January 23 and January 24. And it was great because they spanned not only the shed business but the tiny house business and they were very open. I think once they learned that I could put some words together, um, it was. They pretty much gave me and you know, they took, took me off the leash to to come up with whatever I wanted to and well, so far everything I've sent to them they published appreciate them and appreciate your writing.

SHED GEEK: 5:13

For them uh always educational and I love to read, uh, all the different editorial pieces in there. Uh, and just watch our industry continue to grow and develop. And, yeah, thankful for the opportunity to be here. I'm glad we connected and I appreciate the invite to texas absolutely, absolutely.

SHED GEEK: 5:35

We caught a good lunch there too well, we did, we, yeah, I love the little place that we got a nice little burger at. We got to visit and just kind of talk about. You know, I probably got in the industry about 10 years ago yourself, 20 years ago and a lot's changed in both 10 and 20 years.

CHRIS WINTER: 5:50

But I bet, 20 years has been even more so huh industry in of itself, whereas before you know, I don't know exactly what you'd call it, but they were generally. The stories were are pretty much all the same. My dad and I built a shed in our backyard, you know, for, for, for his, for his brother, and then his neighbors said boy, where'd you get that? And you know, one turned into 10, 10 turned into 100, and, uh, now you've got all these, all these companies. But their stories are very similar, aren't?

SHED GEEK: 6:24

they. You know, you're right, they are eerily similar. And what happens, I think a lot of time is just that. I think it's, you know, enterprise that you want to create for yourself. Um, a lot of times that happens. Uh, you know, second generation guy comes along and if dad's not done with his career yet to be able to hand over the business, it's hey, we can go start a shed shop. We understand what to do, how to do it. But man, back back when you, you were starting, you said, you said back early, two thousands, man, there wasn't a whole lot of territory, reps and people going out and like opening up shed lots, and there was a few names maybe out there associated. But then all of a sudden, 10, 12 different manufacturers. Now, at least in probably 50 miles or 100 miles.

CHRIS WINTER: 7:08

That yeah, I'd say that's pretty pretty fair estimate. Um, you know, the, the first company that I worked with, I think really pioneered the industry in a lot of ways. When I look back at you know how they started and how they grew. Same thing you know, dad built a shed with his sons and then it took off from there. But these guys, I think, as far as I know, they were the first ones to go multi-state and say, hey, look, we've got a template, let's see if we can copy it and do it here and here and here. And they went out and looked at manufacturing facilities and then put together sales forces and, um, they didn't have a lot of competition, yeah, which was their downfall. Um, I think in fact, I I think I heard recently that cook is sold.

SHED GEEK: 7:53

Um, yeah, they had company they had sold at least I.

SHED GEEK: 7:57

I saw it online and then I even saw it in shed builder magazine yeah, that's where I read it too, yeah they, uh, they put it out there that, uh, they had sold to, uh, yeah, a company out of virginia or north carolina. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of it's kind of wild how things, yeah, definitely changed. They were a big name, uh, there. I grew up actually just south of them. Uh, that started in 86.

SHED GEEK: 8:19

I think my brother bought a uh cook shed at one point and sold that to uh Deanna's father. I got a really good story about that, Chris. If you've never heard it, um, we, we were the original. For those that follow the shed hauler page, we were one of the 250 guys not really we were.

SHED GEEK: 8:37

We weren't doing this as a business, but I'll tell you what we did do. We had a little eight by ten uh mini barn and we had to move it and we didn't know who to call. Uh, he had it delivered and then he sold it to I don't know for like 500 bucks to my father-in-law. But what we did have was four wheelers and four wheelers you could hook a chain to and we took had enough of them that we drug that thing down into the driveway. We got some uh jacks underneath it, got it lifted in the air and then we took a 6x12 utility single axle trailer. Uh pulled underneath it with a dodge 2500 and uh set it right on the angle iron and then strapped it all the way over the top of the building and drove it 14 miles with the tires pancake in the whole time.

CHRIS WINTER: 9:29

I know all too well that experience. Just recently, one of the things that I, we talked about, some of the Derksen folks and Ralph's name came up and I called Ralph, like back in October, and I said, hey look, I'm thinking about putting a playhouse on a trailer and making it look like Santa's workshop and then and then we can be in the parades, the local parades, and you know I don't know about, you know back home where you're at, but here, even the little town of Smithville, which I told you is 4,500 people, the Christmas parade is just a blowout. I mean, you've got people coming from other counties, don't you?

CHRIS WINTER: 10:16

love that and you've got everybody and they're dressing up their 4Runners and they're side-by-sides and driving tractors and horses and kids and it's just great. And so they have a big one in Smithville, they have a big one in Bastrop which is up the road a little bit, so I had them build me a 10x16 playhouse. In fact it's sitting right up there. The red and white one.

SHED GEEK: 10:43

Nice Still got the candy cane.

CHRIS WINTER: 10:46

Yeah, we really decked it out with lights and everything else. To go the extra mile, I dressed up as Santa Claus Nice. I had been growing my hair and my beard out the whole time. By Christmas I had this big beard and the white hair and everything else. My wife joined in as mrs claus, and then the little dog that I was telling you about, swiffer.

CHRIS WINTER: 11:09

Uh, had a little reindeer suit on, so uh, so um, we did the whole parade but, um, when it came time to get that shed onto the trailer, we had the same kind of thing you had like a 20 foot trailer with the angle irons on it, and my thinking was well, they can take the mule and if we can scoot it up there, you can sit on the angle iron, the skids will be inside, we can block it up on the skids and then strap it down and all that. Well, so they built. They built the playhouse for me. We get it here and dress it up and whatever. And I'm waiting until the next time that we have a driver down here to help me put it on the trailer. So when he got here, I told him what we needed to do.

SHED GEEK: 11:56

He looked at me and he goes no way I'm not going to touch that, you know.

CHRIS WINTER: 12:03

And after some coercing and everything else, and told him, like, I mean, you know, sign a waiver or whatever, I won't hold you responsible, but we really got to get this thing up there and we did and it worked. And then, uh, uh, you know, come come the week after new year's, the other driver that we had and I said, hey, I need to get this thing off the trailer.

CHRIS WINTER: 12:23

And he goes no, I'm not touching yeah, I'm not touching that and uh, so I ended up, uh, I ended up strapping it to the uh telephone pole over over here and and pulling it out from underneath it well, this, this was just letting it fly much like one of those trips.

SHED GEEK: 12:41

We ended up making this the 14 mile trip. But he gets a hold of it with his little tractor, uh, and hooks a chain to it and tries to to drag it, and it's barely scooting on the angle iron.

SHED GEEK: 12:52

And so we get the bright idea of if my brother goes one way with the truck and he goes one way with the tractor uh, which it did when it came off, though, his tractor kept rolling and went straight up in the air, uh, and he was lucky it came, came back down, uh, and it said a little bit crooked, and 20 years later it still sits there. Kind of just a little bit of jar from where it should be. We gave a half attempt at putting it back together, so I would imagine some shed haulers would have got a good dose of laughter if they could actually seen what we did I'm sure and looking back now, with all the professional equipment that exists now, it would have been obviously more than worth it to just pay it to have it moved.

SHED GEEK: 13:33

But but since then they bought a Derksen shed too actually a long time Derksen dealer bless you yeah, close close to them, close to close to home. So they've purchased that. So now they have a cook shed out there and a Derksen shed, which is in our territory, in our area. Those are two of the oldest, definitely most established companies.

CHRIS WINTER: 13:50

I'll tell you how long ago it was that I worked for Cook. Cook didn't own a single mule in their entire network. We were placing sheds with the rollback trailers and having to get the trailers into people's yards and you know same thing with on lots trying to set a lot with a trailer whole different ballgame.

CHRIS WINTER: 16:40

Yeah, for sure, I mean that mule is a game changer.

SHED GEEK: 16:43

Well, I was about to say it changed so much that it almost got to the point where everybody's had to go to that. I know not everybody has completely embraced it, but I think by and large they've seen the value for sure, if you're, uh, in business, at the level that those guys are too. So, yeah, lots of, lots of big names, you know what I mean. Like that that comes up around a lot of guys, you know, um, right there in that 40-mile, 50-mile radius for us, just a lot of these. I don't know if I should call them big box stores. I don't know how they want to be called, what they want to be called themselves, so we don't want to call them the wrong thing.

CHRIS WINTER: 17:18

But I mean.

SHED GEEK: 17:18

Derksen and Graceland's home office are close to there, you know, know, cook, they're in southern Illinois. And then, uh, you know, of course, old Hickory's down in Nashville, premier is over in Fulton. I mean, those are, you know where's Fulton. Uh be just south of Derksen, probably about 35 40 miles south of. Derksen yeah, there's a Fulton, Kentucky and Tennessee. Okay, actually, it's right on, right on the border, so and then, uh, I mean there's just so many others.

CHRIS WINTER: 17:45

I mean ummits, come out of there, easy's come out of there isn't it strange that you know that's like the portable building mecca, just like, uh, what is it? North Carolina Uh, area. North Carolina, you've got all the carport, all the carports.

SHED GEEK: 18:02

Well, I would say is as as good a lock as we got on it. Lancaster is a pretty Lancaster. Uh, Pennsylvania is pretty darn big. You know, uh shed center, maybe even, uh, the oldest and most established shed capital we, we definitely have it's not as much as sheds as it is like the core a lot of corporate men. You know mentality that comes out of there, but I mean even like the joey lift there and nna uh being made, and then cardinal there and carrier mills uh, there's quite a few rto companies that you know what I mean have their home around there, and then lumber distribution as well uh comes out of there too.

CHRIS WINTER: 18:41

So which is, yeah, which is it just kind of lends itself it makes sense that you know, put your manufacturing where you're close to where your materials are.

SHED GEEK: 18:51

Yeah, it's of course Midco, I mean I don't know. You can go on and on and on. There's a lot of just a lot of companies that just kind of.

CHRIS WINTER: 18:59

There's a lot now I can tell you that.

SHED GEEK: 19:06

Yeah, there's a lot now. Yeah, yeah, it's changed, just saying so much from what?

CHRIS WINTER: 19:08

what you started in 20 years ago and I started in 10 years. Yeah, it's good, it's good and bad. We were never afraid of, of competition. Um, I mean our, I think our viewpoint was, if there's going to be another lot, uh, you know, let them. Let them open up as close to us as they want, because then we'll be a shed destination for people that are shopping and all we have to worry about is doing a better job than them.

SHED GEEK: 19:30

That's right.

CHRIS WINTER: 19:32

And that way they're not going to get lost trying to find you.

SHED GEEK: 19:35

You can't win them all. I've told my joke on here a couple times. People may get tired of hearing it, but I always laugh because I had a shed guy tell me one time. He said if a shed company opens up next door to me, uh, I just always hang a sign on mine that says main entry right here.

SHED GEEK: 19:54

You know it's uh so uh it is. It's like you know, the same in the food, food world I mean a lot of you know food restaurants will will search for areas where there's going to be other restaurants, because it's sort of like you said, it's a bit of a destination where people can go and car dealers do a lot of the same thing. They want to be kind of close to the competition in some way.

CHRIS WINTER: 20:14

Well, yeah, and you almost know that if you're in a strange town and you you know you see a Chili's or whatever, then there's going to be a what?

SHED GEEK: 20:24

Olive Garden? Yeah, something like that. They tend to pair up and yeah, you know, you can almost depend on if there's one, there's the other so tell me, uh, for the audience who's fairly new to the industry, or even those who are established, getting started all those years ago, even opening up territories, um, what do you, what do you feel like has changed the most from your perspective?

CHRIS WINTER: 20:48

you mean in in finding dealers?

SHED GEEK: 20:51

you know, let's go, both let's go with finding deal. I don't think you do that regularly anymore not any, not anymore.

CHRIS WINTER: 20:58

But I think that the uh, the the same principles that I applied back then, that I was very successful with, are still as important today as they are then, and one of the articles that you can find in Shed Builder that I focused on was really opening up a dealer.

CHRIS WINTER: 21:17

It was more from the viewpoint of well, I've done both. I did one article opening up dealers from the viewpoint of the manufacturer and finding, you know, building your sales territory, and then the other was from the guy that is thinking about getting into, you know, something like shed sales and what should he look for, and I think that's where I'd probably like to concentrate on, if you are a, couple things. One is that if you've ever wanted to be your own boss, this is a really good, kind of easy way to transition into that and give you a fair chance of making it, instead of just, you know, burning, burning out, um, with, uh, you know, multi-level marketing thing or whatever you know, where people think that they're their own boss but they're they're really not at all, um, you know. Or if you find that you know you've aged out of a, a trade or whatever you don't, especially sales guys and that's what I was.

CHRIS WINTER: 22:12

I was a sales guy for my career and, um you, you started to find that your sweet spot was really somewhere around 40 years old 40 to 45 where you had all this experience but you still had, you know, stamina, everything else. And then, once you turn that corner, your market value just started to plummet.

CHRIS WINTER: 22:31

And you know, by the time you turn 50, you know, forget about it.

CHRIS WINTER: 22:35

It's hard. You know you don't want to be, you don't want to be throwing elbows with the 25 year olds that can just go all day, all night, um, so in that regard, uh, this was a great opportunity that I never would have seen had I not been in the manufacturing end of it, you know, and opened up dealers and saw how that, how that works, and then got my dad involved and and was able to kind of take both of our experiences and put them together and uh and and grow successfully. But as far as the nuts and bolts of it go, if you've decided to do something like that, I think the first thing that you probably want to do is go shop some lots, go find out who's doing it and where they're doing it, and be a shed shopper and see how you're treated and what you like about what this guy says or that guy says, or you know what you like about the product itself and that's going to give you kind of a background of who maybe you want to get involved with.

CHRIS WINTER: 23:37

You know what companies you want to get involved with.

CHRIS WINTER: 23:40

And then finding real estate, you know a lot of folks well.

CHRIS WINTER: 23:48

I see some dealers are able to put something on an existing property or an existing business, or they're able to lease a piece of property and that's what we did at first. We didn't have any, you know highway front acreage or anything. So we looked for vacant lots where nothing was going on I mean, there was no business there because you don't want to spend, you know, all of your income on on rent, on, on, you know, on the on the lot. So you look, look for the deal and it's pretty lucrative If you can find a couple of acres, you know enough room to be able to put enough inventory on there and move it around where that landowner it's not making them any income. You say, look, you know, I know I can only offer you $500 a month, but you know at the end of the year that's ten thousand dollars that you didn't have, uh, before well, I almost, almost want to dig in there a little bit too, because there is a struggle if you're a consignment dealer.

SHED GEEK: 24:55

Sometimes, um, you know, I always like to say a lot of guys who are making the decisions and gals who are making the decisions may not have been in your shoes at one point.

CHRIS WINTER: 25:07

If we look, at the business side of it.

SHED GEEK: 25:09

You know you should be able to open a lot, you should be able to sell a lot of product. You should be able to make it and I mean honestly, if you're a consignment dealer, uh for say, like Derksen for instance, I mean they're putting a big investment in you. You know, they're bringing a lot of inventory to you already as a dealer.

CHRIS WINTER: 25:30

That's what's really special about the shed industry that I found, which really really brought me to it and had me seriously consider it and sink my feet in. Where else can you get a company to put you know half a million dollars of inventory on your lot that you didn't have to pay for? Yeah, um, they're going to give you, you know, sales materials. They're going to give you support, they're going to do all that and it's not going to cost you anything. Yeah, uh, and then they're, um, you know their, their commission splits are are very reasonable. You know I can't really complain about them.

CHRIS WINTER: 26:07

I, I look at, I was in real estate for about six years before I got into sheds and you know you, you might grind it out. You might have a listing that you had to fight for and spend money on and market yourself and you know, make all these investments plus all the money that you put in just keeping your license current and everything else, and you know you're going to get a full commission might be 3% on a sale and if you're new, you're splitting half of that with your broker and before you know it, I mean you really have to turn some properties to do that. Well, um, I, I can make as much money selling one shed as some realtors can for marketing a you know a home for six months and selling it. So in that sense, yeah, it's, it's.

SHED GEEK: 26:54

It's a good business to start with very little in your pocket and on top of that, I mean, how do you feel dealers receive that? Because it is a different model. There's no skin in the game. You know, and I don't know, all the ins and outs of Derksen or any other competitors. You know even some that we mentioned here already. I don't know the complete ins and outs of it, but let's just assume that you know by and large they're investing this money into you, like you said. You know 200, 300, 400, 500, 000 and and you're paying lot rent. Uh, let's look at both sides of the puzzle there.

SHED GEEK: 27:34

As an independent dealer, uh, the struggle sometimes can be hey, I'm already putting in five to a hundred thousand dollars in, you know. So now I gotta sell. You know, if I'm paying a thousand dollars in in rent, I gotta sell ten thousand dollars before I break even roughly. Or you know, just, I'm using I'm using, uh, generic numbers, right, right of of. What's been vaguely familiar for me in the industry is a ten percent commission. Um, doesn't mean everybody gets that, it means some get more, whatever just some get less, yeah, some get more, whatever, just some less.

SHED GEEK: 28:05

Yeah, some get less, whatever it looks like, but just using, using simple math. Uh, yeah, you've got to do that before you start making money. But then you've got an office, or you got utilities, you got bills, you got insurance, or you got this, that another, if you have a down month uh, two, three, four months in a row, that begins to really affect the psyche of a dealer, or it could very quickly um, whereas if you're purchasing that inventory you know you're kind of having to to turn it yeah, you better not regularly but you might get caught paying taxes on it, right?

CHRIS WINTER: 28:43

you know, I don't have to pay, pay taxes on the inventory that we keep. Yep, yep, which is good.

SHED GEEK: 28:50

So it's interesting to look at it from both perspectives. I mean, what more could they do? They're bringing you all this inventory. What's happening now that I find interesting and I want your thoughts on it is you know, it's no longer just about creating an onlot presence. It's about creating an online presence too.

CHRIS WINTER: 30:14

You really, you really better, you know, make your investment there and it's not unlike a lot of businesses, but I found that the more money that I made in this business, the more I had to spend. Um, it really did. And you've got. You've got levels of well, uh, I can reach my comfort level working this many, this many days and investing this much, this much money. But I'm going to, I'm going to max out there. It's not going to.

CHRIS WINTER: 30:45

You know, I might have a good month, I might have a bad month and hopefully they'll cost average, you know, over time and I'm still able to make my house payment and my lot payment and all of that. But you know, as you, as you get bigger, you know, now maybe you have to stay open more. Now maybe you're up to six days or seven days a week. Now maybe you're having to hire another salesperson and then what's that going to cut into your income to do that? And what do you offer them that it's going to be good enough to keep them hungry. So there's different, different levels and you know, after 20 years, um, I'm still, I'm still trying to figure out what the next level for me is and how to get there, because I have, uh, you know, I I've taken just about everything that I can do pretty much by myself and, um, you know that's another thing is that you can't actually run one of these businesses by yourself as long as you, you know, you've learned enough things.

SHED GEEK: 31:50

You know, learned enough to keep, keep, keep it going do you find it challenging with the new either technology that's sort of hitting just not just the industry but the world, like I mean, just as do you find that for one person it's getting more difficult?

CHRIS WINTER: 32:12

no it, it should get easier. But again, that that goes into the investment type of thing. And you know, give you carports for, for example, um, you know if there's, if there's 10,000 shed dealers out there, there's 100,000 carport dealers, and yeah, so you know, when you're doing this as a sole means of income, you know whether you're selling sheds, carports or playscapes or anything else that you can kind of bring in to that fold, um, everything that you, you add, takes more time and more, more money to to market and to get out there. But, like with the carport business being so competitive, and not only are you competing against other dealers like yourself that are just selling carports, but you're competing against a bunch of manufacturers too, because a lot of these manufacturers are putting up sites like my carport site. You don't know that it's American Steel Carports, you see it as Carport Kingdom and you don't know that the only affiliation that they have is that Carport Kingdom is selling American Steel Carports.

SHED GEEK: 33:24

Which, by the way, I don't even know. If there's a Carport Kingdom out there, there is Okay.

CHRIS WINTER: 33:29

And it's produced by American steel.

CHRIS WINTER: 33:30

Okay, yeah, that was one of the reasons why I transitioned to other companies after about 10 years of really loyal relationship to American steel is that I don't want to have to compete against my manufacturer. You know I don't want to know that they're spending money trying to get customers, that I'm spending money trying to get. And with the carport business you can either do what you can locally and you'll get those leads and those people that come in and stop in and that's still probably 80% of what what we sell people within 50 miles of here, but there's a whole nother market out there that if you can tap into and if you can build an online presence that's fully functional. That that you know a guy in uh decatur can, uh, can, can get online and be able to navigate our website and go end-to-end. If they wanted to buy that carport online, they could put the deposit down and do it all without ever having to call me or talk to a salesman and some people hate talking to salespeople.

SHED GEEK: 34:39

Well, and just I mean the conversation, just where it's even turned here today, is like wow, you know, you realize how much of a presence that, like steel and the carport side, has, even with the average shed dealer Not that you're average by any means.

CHRIS WINTER: 35:05

What.

SHED GEEK: 35:05

I mean is like we think of manufacturing all the time, but I mean manufacturers have to put those products somewhere and we've seen some of that. We've seen where some guys will leave shed manufacturers and go to another provider, but also carports, because it's not just so competitive but you have so little control over the situation, the process, the delivery, the customer service, but you get all the blame, obviously, obviously whenever it comes to your customer. It's really funny how that customer changes to uh.

CHRIS WINTER: 35:31

Well, it's your customer, your problem uh when it's bad at some point, or another, things turn bad and you go no, wait a minute, it's, it's your product and it's your.

CHRIS WINTER: 35:40

I think I literally had a when it's good, it's not your customer, just when it's bad, right I had a manufacturer rep tell me one time when some things got sideways and I said look, I've taken this as far as I can. I need your support. I need you to call this customer. You need to be called today. You need to straighten this out because there's nothing I can do on my level and I'm not gonna you know'm not going to go through all this and then offend the guy and tell him to take a walk, but if you want to do it, that's up to you. And this fella said it's your customer. And I went that's just the wrong answer. He goes, did you make a commission on it? I said, yeah, he goes there, you go, it's your, your customer. And, uh, we were taking their signs down, like you know.

SHED GEEK: 36:30

Yeah, the following week I was taking their bandage your customer, then it's a shame you can't. You know, uh, you don't have the authority to fix the the problem too. Do we, do we? Do you see that in in the shed world? Do you see it happening? Do it coming Like? Is that something that we're going to experience?

CHRIS WINTER: 36:46

You know, it's great that you mentioned that, because I guess the short answer to that is no. But there's a reason no for me, and it goes back to the guy that's looking to get into this business and why it's so important which companies you choose to work with on here, and what you're really looking for is. You're looking for a manufacturer that wants to be a partner. They have a vested interest in your success, and the carport industry just doesn't get that yet.

CHRIS WINTER: 37:23

I mean, I've contacted, you know big manufacturers and have said to them hey look, I don't know how many carport dealers come to you and say that they want to grow their business, but I want to be your biggest carport, I want to be your biggest account total. You know if your biggest account is doing $4 million a year, I want to be that biggest account total. You know if your biggest account is doing $4 million a year. I want to be that guy you know. So I'm telling you that I'm willing to. I'm here, ready to work, willing to work. What can you do to help me get there? You know, and as a sales manager or people running a company that survives on sales, you, I mean, you'd love to see that guy coming through the door.

CHRIS WINTER: 38:02

I mean you'd love to see that guy coming through the door. I mean that guy that is hungry and wants to you know, wants to have it and I was surprised how little resources that anybody was willing to put up. And you know, all I said is that, hey, look, I want to develop a very dynamic website. That is the best you know that there is on there. And I want a great, you know, customer reputation to follow through on sales. And you know it is on there. And I want a great, you know, customer reputation follow through on sales and you know it's got to be end to end and if I can get your commitment, you'll get my commitment. Yeah, and let's, let's do it and it you're, you're, you're on your own. I mean, you're on your own.

CHRIS WINTER: 38:37

It uh, um, it's rarely that you see that I see a manufacturer rep on the carport side come through the door, except for the ones that want me to, want me to sell. I get all the. I get all my competitors coming through trying to, trying to try to change me out and companies you know that I've never heard before coming out of the woodwork. But, like you said, there are a lot of people that are in the business, that stay in the business and they go from one company to another, to another. You know there are a lot of people that are in the business, that stay in the business.

SHED GEEK: 39:04

Yeah.

CHRIS WINTER: 39:05

And they go from one company to another, to another, you know, and they start their own.

SHED GEEK: 39:10

Yeah, there's definitely a lot of that, even beyond, just like a father-son team or something like that, where they go out and create their own. I think a lot of people get into maybe like sheds or even carports, and they have like a negative experience in the commission or in the consignment arena and I think a lot of that's got to do with, like you know, you want to. A lot of times you want to speak with the personality who has been there. Yeah, done that, who's so chance? I worked at a faith-based drug and alcohol rehab and they used to always say there's just areas you can't relate because you haven't been through what I've been through, which I hadn't.

CHRIS WINTER: 39:47

And.

SHED GEEK: 39:47

I said, yeah, to some extent it really does, Because if you've been there, seen it, done it, there's a lot of value that you can add to that conversation. Absolutely, absolutely and we don't think that corporate bindedly sometimes I mean, if I'm just being honest and we're being awful critical here, just to be clear but sometimes corporate-minded is like well, if I save $10 a week for you know what I mean this many weeks, I should have this many dollars. But everybody who controls a budget knows it just don't always work that way.

CHRIS WINTER: 40:20

Yeah, and corporate shortcomings aren't necessarily criticism, way, yeah, and corporate shortcomings aren't necessarily criticism, you know, I mean I put this out there in hopes that maybe there, you know, there is a uh, a carport company that's, that's starting out looking to build that. Yeah, here's this and go goes. Yeah, that makes sense, man, like you know yeah, why don't we find some?

CHRIS WINTER: 40:40

chris, chris winners out there to really, you know, crush the competition. And back when I was opening up, you know, dealers in Texas and Louisiana, I would get in a lot of trouble for closing more dealers than I opened. And what I was doing is I was trimming off all the waste. You know, if there was a dealer that was taking up all these resources but you weren't getting the sales out of them, no-transcript.

SHED GEEK: 41:17

Do you think that dealers who do this primarily whether consignment or wholesale, it doesn't really matter who do this primarily whether consignment or wholesale, it doesn't really matter. The question I guess I'm asking is do you think it matters that someone is all in on Sheds and it's their primary source of income, or if it's their secondary or third source of income because they already have a primary business, Do you think that it's a more successful endeavor? Is there more gain on sales, or is there just more gain in willingness to listen or embrace?

CHRIS WINTER: 41:50

the company.

CHRIS WINTER: 43:13

You're putting yourself at an advantage to all the other guys. If I'm exclusively in the shed business and the steel frame building business, carport business, on that, then I know that my customer is going to walk away from here knowing that the information, the advice that they got was from the most knowledgeable person that you know that is in the industry and it's not, you know, it's not the guy that. Whatever, I don't care if I do or I don't, I mean that's in the low rung. Then you've got some folks that find that they can sell sheds and it makes sense. They've got the room and they, they like it, they use sheds, their friends use sheds, and so that's, that's pretty easy because they can, you know, they can talk comfortably to their sphere and and, and you know, add to their, add to their bottom line that way, and there's nothing wrong with that. But I I don't see any of those guys competing with what we do here.

SHED GEEK: 44:21

What I, what I've, I feel like, what I've experienced, what I've seen, is like I've known some, some sellers at times who I feel like I've even seen it, but I've, I've definitely feel like it's what they do is like, well, I'll sell you a shed, sure, sure, yeah, I'll say if there's no resistance, if it's not difficult, if it's easy, and this becomes all easy money. But then there's, there's a lot out there that, uh, have switched over and made it their primary business, where it wasn't initially, because they begin to see the opportunity in it, uh, because they embraced it. I don't know what it is that changes about a person that makes a person see it or or make another one, not someone who's been selling sheds for 20 years who says, yeah, you can't do that, uh, whereas a new guy can come in and blow it out of the water. Um, what I mean? I'm not saying they all do.

CHRIS WINTER: 45:15

Some guys are just all personality and they'll sell you. They can sell you anything that's in their pockets and that's great if you get a guy that's just a natural like that on your team. But let me put it this way I would say that about 50% of your business that you get our business is given, and what I mean by that is that I didn't necessarily have to work overly hard to get that customer.

CHRIS WINTER: 45:46

They were driving from Houston to Austin and they went oh, and that's also what's important about finding a lot on a well-traveled road that might have a turnout in it. You know, we're on Highway 71 here. We might get 40,000 people past our lot in a day's time. And I get a lot of people that say, oh, I've been driving by here for years and I've always wanted to stop by to see what you do. These buildings look really cute or whatever, and guess what? They end up buying a building sometimes.

CHRIS WINTER: 46:19

Or you know, the guy comes through and he knows exactly what he wants, and he comes here and he's in and out in 15 minutes and you sold him a $20,000 cabin or something Just falls right at your feet. That's half of it. The other half you got to really earn and what that means is that you know if I get a phone call from, and what that means is that you know if I get a phone call from, let's say, I get a phone call from Viter, or you know Denton or something one of these towns that's 200 miles away, right, and they just found me because I am old and established and spend money marketing online. So it was easy for them to find me. And they saw Derksen and they heard about Derksen, whatever. So they call me they don't know if I'm the closest dealer or I'm the furthest dealer, whatever.

CHRIS WINTER: 47:05

Well, I've still got an opportunity.

CHRIS WINTER: 47:06

If he's in texas, I've got an opportunity to make that sale.

CHRIS WINTER: 47:10

And that's where you really need to to not only kind of have your, your, your pitch or your, your responses, but you need to know how to make them feel really comfortable with them and be able to.

CHRIS WINTER: 47:26

You know it's a lot to ask somebody to give you their credit card number you know for to run for six or $7,000 and they've never met you and it's over the phone, but it's doable and the better that you get at those types of things. Seven thousand dollars and they've never met you and it's over the phone, but it's doable. And, um, the better that you get at those types of things, the more business you close, and probably 10 to 15 percent of what I sell are customers that I never meet. The other important segment of that is return and referral. I mean, if you can't, if you are not, if you are not really taking care of your customers and investing your time with them and making it an experience that they only want to come to you in the future and they're going to tell their family and their neighbors and everything else.

CHRIS WINTER: 48:14

You've got to go see this guy right and everything else you got to go see this guy right. If you can be that guy, I would say 25% of what we do every month is a return and repeat customer. And that's another thing too is I've sold five, six, seven buildings to the same families, you know before. You know the kids grow up and they move out and they come to a place for your stuff to get their building. And you know we've. You know the kids grow up and they move out and they come to a place for your stuff to get their building. And you know we've been around long enough, it's almost generational. So really taking care of repeat and referral. And then you know also if you can close a phone, phone up. That's the margin. I think that's the margin that separates the guys that are staying in this business and, you know, going on vacation at the end of the year and the ones that just burn out, yeah, burn out or struggle to get by.

SHED GEEK: 49:05

I mean, I think there's a I told you before. I said you know, I anticipate everything in the industry that I can read. Listen to the industry that I can um read listen to um I I like if there's something new that's coming out, I want to hear about it.

SHED GEEK: 49:26

Read about it, view it uh I'm just invested, invested into the product and into the industry and you begin to realize how you say, well, I'm just in my little neck of the woods, nobody ever really bothers me, which can be true. But how much more are you missing out on by not expanding your knowledge, your understanding, your understanding of your own products, your competition's products? Trying to be better, like competition gets a bad name sometimes. Like we love to collaborate, collaboration is a big thing for us, but competition is a very valuable thing in the sense that it makes you sharper, it makes you better. Otherwise we'd never improve.

CHRIS WINTER: 50:02

Yeah, it does. I mean either grow or stagnate and die. There's really no sitting back on your laurels in this business if you don't want to get eaten up by somebody else in that sense. And I tell you, we have seen a lot of, we've seen a lot of names come and go in our area, mainly because we're not a huge market, okay, but man, it's hard to sell against us. Everybody's been here. Everybody's been here at least once. And you know Cook has got a plant based out of here, so they're easily seen. But then outside of that, you know there were only a handful when we got started and there's only a handful today in our market. Now I'm not saying, hey, there's, there's lots of everybody.

SHED GEEK: 51:00

Everybody come here.

CHRIS WINTER: 51:02

Come move to Bastrop and put this guy out. He seems to be awfully full of himself.

SHED GEEK: 51:08

But you have been doing it for 20 years. You develop skills over that time and it seems like you've done that well for a place for your stuff, doing the cabin work that you guys have have done and even doing the metal structures and things that you guys have done, switching gears here before we uh close up, believe it or not, it's we're like close to 50 minutes. You know, isn't it crazy whenever?

CHRIS WINTER: 51:34

and and it's easy right it's not when you enjoy talking to somebody about something that you're interested in you enjoy. Yeah, it doesn't feel like a struggle. You can spend all day doing it.

SHED GEEK: 51:43

Yeah, yeah, I I say all the time that's always say we need to do a follow-up episode a lot of times.

CHRIS WINTER: 51:49

Stay tuned for part two. That's right.

SHED GEEK: 51:51

Yeah, that's right, we need to do well and we should. We should just, you know, uh, do something regular once a year, once every six months, I don't know, but when it's easy conversation and it is you're passionate about it, it's easy to talk about. But 50 minutes does go by really fast. Who is Chris? If I were to just ask the question, so many people may know you from reading your articles in Shed Builder Magazine. How did you get started? Where did you come from? Where did you? I know we're doing this backwards, this would normally be at the beginning, but you said you actually moved to Texas years ago.

SHED GEEK: 52:24

So what's your previous experience before this?

CHRIS WINTER: 52:32

I grew up in the Sonoma County wine country of Northern California. There were vineyards and big wine labels up and down my neighborhood out there and eventually I got into wine and spirit sales. I moved to San Francisco and worked for a pretty fair-sized distributor calling on accounts in San Francisco selling all their liquor and wine and all that, and stayed in that industry for about 11 or 12 years. Eventually ended up working for the biggest winery in the world, which is the Gallo Brothers, and they were opening up a real specific high-end line of wines which for Gallo was unheard of. So it was a real hard, it was a real tough sell and they brought me on to do that specifically.

CHRIS WINTER: 53:26

And after a while I met a girl in one of my old accounts in San Francisco neighborhood bar, showed up there and real cute gal behind the bar got to know her, ended up engaged and uh, she was from texas and had been living in san francisco, uh, for about a year and just didn't like the weather, didn't like you know, didn't like certain things about it. And uh she said, uh, I think you know I'd like to live somewhere else. And I said, well, you know we can, we can pretty much live anywhere. I can sell wine, whatever, whatever, anywhere. Where do you want to go? And we looked at a few different places. She said well, you know, I grew up in Austin. I really like Austin and I had been there a couple times before. I said, all right, let's make it Austin. So we were married and two weeks later packed up and put everything in a little U-Haul and hauled it behind my Volkswagen Jetta and barely made it here and got a little apartment and then sooner, after a while, we got some ranch property out here and I got out of wine sales and transitioned into tech, had a lot of buddies at that time you know this is around 2000.

CHRIS WINTER: 54:38

And I had buddies that I'd grown up with that were killing it. They were making mad money, you know, in software and you know firmware and that kind of thing. I didn't get all the way to finishing getting my college degree so I had some disadvantages in getting on with, you know, really structured companies that you know you couldn't get through the door unless you had this or that or whatever. But I took a run at a couple of tech companies, a couple of dot-coms here in Austin and back then it's when all the IPO, pre-ipo, things were really on fire and all these companies were coming out of nowhere, and so the two that I worked for were fairly similar in saying look, you know, we're not going to pay you guys anything, but we're going to give you these mad stock options and you're going to be like the Google and the Yahoo guys that you know, you put your five years in and you get vested're going to retire on that.

CHRIS WINTER: 55:38

So, basically, it was slave labor for a couple years and both, both companies ended up, you know, selling off and and all the, all the you know c, c level guys made out like bandits and all of us, you know, were left, left, uh, left with empty pockets and uh, it was that time that I was really kind of struggling with uh, what am I going to do? Um, you know, what am I going to do now? I've got, you know, I've got a new wife. I'm gonna have a baby coming pretty, pretty soon. Um, don't want to get back into this, back into that. And it was, um, just dumb luck that my, my parents moved from California to Texas to be closer to us and, like I said, my dad was driving my mom crazy, being newly retired, so she made him get a job and he found this ad in the paper and then told me about it and I ended up working for Cook.

SHED GEEK: 56:34

Everybody has a shed story.

CHRIS WINTER: 56:35

That's what I love, what was crazy is that I was, even though I wasn't learning anything about sales from Cook. In fact, I was teaching more than I was learning. I was hugely successful at it, which you know, spurred me to it. I liked the relationship, you know between the customer and the dealer and manufacturer and I thought that I had some really keen insight on on you know how to how to uh work on that level and motivate people to bring them from from looking at a shed or thinking about it to buying one. Everybody. That's a big step it is.

SHED GEEK: 57:13

It is, everybody has a shed story and I like to say it's, sometimes telling your story is easier than you think, uh and uh, sometimes you'd be surprised at what other people glean from it. You know, the word says iron sharpens iron. So, like I believe that it's good for us to build community, and sometimes you can do that with a pen and paper typewriter, uh, sometimes you can do that with your voice and I think um, um, yeah, we do our best to try to make everybody welcome, so if you're looking to come on, just watch for our newsletter, watch for Facebook different things.

SHED GEEK: 57:48

We'd love to tell your story, whether you're a shed seller, shed manufacturer, shed hauler, shed supplier.

CHRIS WINTER: 57:56

I feel like you know it adds value to people's day who want to be invested in the shed industry so I mean, I think that that you're playing an important part in the overall picture of this and I really appreciate the fact that you know that you've created something that does give value, especially to to people like me and in in my situation and people that are coming up or considering, you know, doing the same thing. It's a great education, in fact. If you were to ask me, you know, what's the one thing that you would recommend to somebody that is looking to maybe get involved in this business, I would say, hey, get online and watch as many shed geek episodes as you can. It's going to give you a really good background, um, not only on your little circle, but how the whole system works yeah, and I appreciate that, that's.

SHED GEEK: 58:47

I can't say thank you enough for that. I'll send you a check. Uh, you just have to give me the address but uh but uh, I do appreciate that and, having you on as a guest today, I want to turn the mic around that way. We've got a little bit of time just left. Do you have any questions for me? Shed related, faith related, podcast related, family, it doesn't matter. Full transparency. You be the host for a question or two. What would you ask?

CHRIS WINTER: 59:12

if anything.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:00:12

Shannon where do you see yourself in five years?

SHED GEEK: 1:00:15

oh well, uh, at this rate, I think probably about the same weight. Uh, that I have been. Where do you want?

CHRIS WINTER: 1:00:23

shed geek to be. What do you want to create out of this? What do you want it to become? Yeah, good question what would be the panacea for you?

SHED GEEK: 1:00:30

well. So my passion is most, first and foremost, this right it's, it's building the relationships. Uh, I'm a community guy. Um, you know, I've told the story a couple times of how I have been lost without purpose and then you begin to find purpose in in um, our savior, and how he has opened up those relationships. And there is a business aspect to it. Just the same as it takes money to run a church takes money to run everything else, right. So we have to do that. And that's the only part that gets kind of a little bit sticky is, you know, if you serve the industry that you also represent Don't get me wrong. I'd love for someone to you know Spotify to go throw a big dollar amount at it, but they just don't care about the shed industry. Like they don't like, like they do the rogan material right, like we're not. We're not that guy, we're not reaching those audiences so.

SHED GEEK: 1:01:24

So for me, um, you know we have to work in this industry but you know, we we did do the uh, the marketing, the rto, and I think eventually I would like to do a consultation leg, and those to me would be the three legs to help hold up the Shed Geek brand. But my passion is to really just be able to let those things spur forward my ability to travel with my family, stay at these RV parks and these shed lots around the country meet people and build community.

SHED GEEK: 1:01:51

Move the kingdom forward through those conversations and build community. You know, move, move the kingdom forward through those conversations. Encourage people, be encouraged myself through speaking with them. So the podcast is really my baby, it's, it's what I love to do.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:02:06

Yeah.

SHED GEEK: 1:02:06

Like, I feel, like I. I feel like if I struck it rich tomorrow and somebody said, go do something you love to do, I'd be like man, I don't know, I like to fish. I like to play baseball, I like to ride four wheelers, but I love doing this. This. This is fun to me.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:02:20

I like the idea. I like the idea that you're, you're building products underneath your podcast as well, um, and you know, you never know which one of those might be. You know the, the, the, the real home run, uh, or they might all be, or they all you know. Work, work with each other to to elevate. You know all of them, but, um, it just shows that you know you're, you're passionate and more than just being a voice online and yeah and all that, yeah it's.

SHED GEEK: 1:02:49

It's definitely not about you know ego, because it's easy to it's easy to seem that way, if you're you know what I'm saying.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:02:56

Uh I do know what you're saying. I just laugh at myself. Uh, you know because, uh, because we do like the industry and we do like what we're doing and somehow or another, we we find a way that it's interesting and trying to make it interesting, uh. But, um, yeah, ego should be a part of our ego shouldn't be a part of it. We used.

SHED GEEK: 1:03:18

We used the term shed liberty yeah whenever it first came out and we were like we want to interview all these guys, that that.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:03:25

That I see is like a shed liberty yeah right, and then all of a sudden people come up and they're joking and they're like oh, mr shed geek, you know, you're known by everybody and I'm like, oh man, I'd really not rather get that rumor started right.

SHED GEEK: 1:03:36

I see my service as interviewing you guys. That's something I genuinely enjoy to do.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:03:42

That's why it works.

SHED GEEK: 1:03:43

Yeah, I don't want to be. I definitely don't want that. Don't put me on a pedestal that I'm probably just going to fall from. It makes sense.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:03:54

You know you touched on something else that I'm just going to share that I think is very important, and you know, regardless if it goes in line with your faith or regardless of your faith, or you know whatever lack thereof, maybe, it is still one of the most important things. I think, um, and I'm going to get sidetracked for a second, that's okay, when I want to jump in and say, uh, let let my fellow uh shed people know that there's no shame in sheds. Yeah, there's no shame, shame in sheds. And I know, when I got started and I'd go home for a you know, back to california for a reunion, whatever, and I talked to these, you know some friends and yeah, yeah, I got a nice house and there's the golf course and all that kind of stuff.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:04:42

And then what are you doing? Yeah, I'm selling sheds and whatever. No, I'm building. I'm building a company and doing what I like. That's right, but to dovetail on that, really the most important characteristic that that you can um, develop, retain, have naturally, whatever it is, uh, in this business that's going to make you succeed is being honest is being is being ethical.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:05:07

Is, you know, coming from from a, really coming from the right place? And whether that's, you know, through faith or otherwise, it's equally important that I'm treating everybody fairly, the way that I would want to be treated. At the same time, you'll get people to come through the door that just want to roll over you. Their intentions aren't, of course, aren't good. They want to. They want to get over on you and that might mean, you know, criticizing your product or criticizing you or finding fault in this and with with those guys. I just simply tell them I don't think we're the right place for you.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:05:40

And what's really been amazing is that, if you come from a place of abundance instead of scarcity, when you do get that person that you know just is, they're just over the top and over the top and, and you know, pushing you nasty or whatever Um, there's nothing more powerful than opening up the door and going. You know, I don't think we're in the right place for you. Um, uh, you know you might want to go down down the road or or whatever Cause it, it. It really shocks them and I, uh, I found it so, uh, so fulfilling. How many of those people that, all of a sudden, I can get them to turn around and discover some humanity in themselves, or whatever it might be. Or it's just the fact that they want to win right?

SHED GEEK: 1:06:31

Sure.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:06:31

They don't want to be pushed out the door, they want to win. So they will come back Well.

SHED GEEK: 1:06:38

I love a couple of the words you use there abundance. I always say, lord, let me be so abundant that even my haters prosper. You know what I mean. Let me have abundance in such a way that you can change the voice of the way it always has been Right, so that you can, instead, uh of going to them and saying, um you know, haha, we, uh, we done well in this area, or something, you can come back and you can show grace and love and mercy and you can do something different.

SHED GEEK: 1:07:10

You know what Jesus did for us, like all know. All of us know what he could have been capable of or what he could have done. What he chose to do is go to a cross and die, and and and, uh, like I didn't deserve that. So, like you know, even whether it's you and you don't deserve um, the grace, the mercy, or whether it's your or or your, your enemy, so to speak, uh, or whatever it is, uh that they probably don't deserve it either. That's that's when you offer it. That that's what probably breaks the heart the most. That they probably don't deserve it either. That's that's when you offer it. That that's what probably breaks the heart the most is whenever you don't act the way the world always acts and you decide to take a different approach toward it that's.

SHED GEEK: 1:07:46

That's definitely what we try to do. But we are human, we are flesh, chris and we are imperfect and you're gonna catch probably me and you and so many other listeners making a mistake. Because a mistake? Because we all fall short.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:08:00

That's why ego can be such a. It's so scary.

SHED GEEK: 1:08:04

It's so scary it comes before the fall, right that's right and I try, I definitely try to stay away from it, but I'm sure I have a do and will fail again and that's why I have to constantly call on forgiveness and ask for ask for that, Dude. I've really enjoyed the conversation here today.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:08:25

I want to do this again for hours. There's some stuff that you know I I would love to take cover.

SHED GEEK: 1:08:27

Let's do that, let's schedule a zoom call and let's do a round two. Man, and I really wanted to add this. I wanted to say this before I got off the air. I got to thinking you probably want to do this, maybe they don't want to do it, they'll see this possibly as ego. But you said you dressed up as Santa Claus, yeah, and I was like you know, it'd be really cool. It's like if you had that little shed and you dressed up and you called yourself the Derksen claws we can edit that out.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:08:52

yeah, that sounds too dumb, you know I mean it. It it was fun. It's really crazy stepping into those boots of Santa Claus and I mean I love kids and you know I loved raising my kids and I really enjoy. You know especially the smaller ones that you that christmas is still oh, it's magical still on, and santa is a rock star.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:09:21

Yes and uh, yeah, being uh. So not only did we have the float for the smithville parade, but since I, uh was gonna be santa, the chamber of commerce asked me if I would do, uh, do a little gig if I would bring the the playhouse over to the chamber of commerce. Asked me if I would do, uh, do a little gig if I would bring the the playhouse over to the chamber of commerce for the weekend while they had this adopted gingerbread man thing and let kids sit on your lap and hear their their whole thing. So, uh, I was able to to, you know, do some community work and spread the cheer and all that kind of stuff. And then they said well, why don't you be our Santa for the parade? Because there can only be one Santa at the parade, right? They don't want to confuse the kids, so nobody else gets to dress up as Santa unless they're designated and they're the last float that comes through. Santa's like the big closer on that whole thing. So it was just crazy.

SHED GEEK: 1:10:14

It is community and I know maybe some people get stuck on. You know different, different thoughts behind that, but uh, honestly, I think when the heart's right, it's just blessed and uh, yeah, man, I I enjoyed this uh thoroughly. I'm so glad we had a chance to talk. I definitely would love to do a follow-up. I feel like me and you can uh, we can uh, bend an ear for a good solid hour a couple more times for sure it was a pleasure.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:10:43

It was actually a lot easier to sit down and just jaw with you than I even anticipated it was.

SHED GEEK: 1:10:50

I think people just enjoy the audible version from time to time of being able to do that. I wish you nothing but luck. Let's talk again. Uh, so happy to have you on the show, uh, and be able to um um, discuss products and services and things like that. And, uh, big cheerleader for Dirkson, I want to make sure to get that in there.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:11:10

So I appreciate that, um, they have been, uh, they have been a partner, uh, through this whole thing. And that's how we look at them and they look at us is that we're in this together and you know, what's good for for them is good for me, and what's good for me is good for them, and if it's a win, win everybody's, everybody's up for it.

SHED GEEK: 1:11:29

That's awesome, I love it.

CHRIS WINTER: 1:11:32

Enjoy the rest of your time in the great state of texas, uh, and have a safe trip back home and, um, yeah, I look forward to the next time yeah, let's do it again.

SHED GEEK: 1:11:41

All right, thanks, so much you're welcome.