Inside The Shed Industry’s Shift - PART 2

Cheap leads are easy to brag about. Profitable shed sales are harder. We dig into a real tension we’re hearing everywhere right now: Facebook can flood your pipeline with low-cost inquiries, while Google search often delivers fewer leads that close at a much higher rate because the buyer is actively looking. The point isn’t to “pick a side.” It’s to stop optimizing for lead price and start optimizing for intent, close rate, margin, and the actual customer journey from first click to delivery.

We also unpack one of the hottest debates in shed sales: follow-up. When someone hears “14 follow-ups,” they picture 14 pushy calls. That’s not what we’re advocating. We talk about touchpoints spread over time, using a CRM, drip campaigns, and low-pressure clarity to stay top of mind while customers deal with permits, site prep, and financing decisions. If you care about response time, response rate, conversion by product, and which ads truly produce revenue, this conversation lands right in your wheelhouse.

From there, we zoom out into the bigger business philosophy behind it all: creativity wins when markets get tight. That can mean better content, better processes, better reviews, or even turning hard-earned industry knowledge into a real consulting model that helps dealers and manufacturers avoid expensive mistakes. If you’re trying to grow through change, sharpen your marketing, and build systems that scale, hit play and take notes.

If this helps you, subscribe, share it with another shed professional, and leave a review so more of the industry can find the show.

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This episodes Sponsors:
Studio Sponsor: Shed Pro

Stryker Hunting Blinds
Cardinal Leasing
IFAB
Making Sales Simple
Velocity 360

Transcript

Sponsor Message And Industry Pressure

INTRO 0:00

Hello and welcome back to the Shed Geek Podcast. Here's a message from our Studios sponsor. Let's be real. Running a shed business today isn't just about building great sheds. The industry is changing fast. We're all filling the squeeze of competing for fewer buyers while expectations keep climbing. And yet, I hear from many of you that you are still juggling spreadsheets, clunky software, or disconnected systems. You're spending more time managing chaos than actually growing your business. That's why I want to talk to you about our studio sponsor, ShedPro. If you're not already using them, I really think you should check them out. ShedPro combines your 3D configurator, point of sale, RTO contracts, inventory, deliveries, and dealer tools all in one platform. They even integrate cleanly into our Shed Geek marketing solutions. From website lead to final delivery, you can quote, contract, collect payment, and schedule delivery in one clean workflow. No more double entries, no more back and forth payouts. Quoting is faster, orders are cleaner. And instead of chasing down paperwork, you're actually running your business. And if you mention Shed Geek, you'll get 25% off all setup fees. Check it out at shedpro.co/ shedgeek. Thank you, ShedPro, for being our studio sponsor and honestly for building something that helps the industry.

Cord 1:32

Welcome back to the Shed Geek Podcast. Today we will have part two of two, finishing up our conversation from last week. Hope you enjoy.

Shannon 1:42

I know that we're, well, I don't know, 40 minutes in for so for those that want to listen, but I do want to run through these real quick, uh, just to be relevant. So those of you that are still with us, you know, uh Cord, maybe I'll ask you some questions, maybe you ask me some back. I don't know. Uh, but I want to go into shed sales professionals. Why not start there and just kind of talk about what people are talking about in the industry? This is one way that connects us all that we can all chat. So, this is you know, I was I was kind of surprised. Saw this question on him today. Anyone got any shed cleaning hacks? I thought, man, that's not gonna get any, you know, anything. There's 16 people on there, 256 posters about you sometimes you just don't know like what people are asking what they need or what's going on. Uh, you know, Tyler Mayhan, of course, you know, we love Tyler. Uh and I I think you guys know that Tyler is, you know, one of our Shed Geek consultants and uh doing a really great job in business development and so much more.

Cord 2:40

Who focuses on the exact same, the exact thing that we were talking about earlier, which is uh unit economics, it is that sort of you know, the things that that wind up cost control, uh labor control, all the things that wind up on a PL, right? And so um, you know, that really is his specialty. I know he is uh at the moment, uh he's finishing up his house. And so, you know, he's got a lot of things moving right here at this very moment, but the exact type of lean operations that we're talking about, that is Tyler's thing. And so would definitely encourage anyone to reach out and maybe a few weeks before he can kind of take on uh another client, but um, you know, give us a call.

Shannon 3:23

Um worth it, growing, growing, they're growing out there, you know, in Oklahoma. So, you know, on top of him helping, you know, with what we're doing, which means helping other people in the industry, they're growing themselves, you know. And he's been doing that that role of CEO for 20 years. Izaak Neil just met this guy recently. He's actually doing a podcast next week, and then he's coming over the week after to visit in person. Super excited to see him. I'm gonna read this to you. Uh, we got, I don't know, we're 45 minutes in. We got a little bit of time. Well, uh, it's a Saturday cord. Uh, you know, we're just meeting with a big wig tonight. No, no, nothing important going on. So, uh uh uh something I noticed after spending a few years calling shed leads, uh uh shed leads. This is Izaak putting a video on here. Companies often celebrate really cheap Facebook leads, like $3 a lead. But I've seen situations where a campaign generated around 700 leads and only five buildings sowed. Meanwhile, Google leads might cost $40 to $50 each, but the close rate can be dramatically higher because those buyers are actively searching. So the real question becomes are we optimizing the cheap leads or actual sales? Curious what other shed professionals are seeing uh seeing in their market. What's your thoughts on that? Uh Court?

Cord 4:35

Well, I think he's absolutely right. Um, you know, of course, you want the volume if you're a seller, a dealer, you want the volume, you want to have people's names and numbers and email addresses in front of you. You want to have that that um prospect, you know, you want to have all of that potential sitting there. Um, but he's absolutely right. You need the intentionality, Google uh website, you know, the path from Google, whether it be then via a Google ad or just organic SEO, Google Business Profile, however you wind up navigating from an actual search query to a website, always going to be more intentional. Of course, then they wind up on a 3D builder, always going to be more intentional. I think the real question here um, you know, is not just that sort of comparative question, but it is how do you develop Facebook leads or how do you develop Facebook users so that by the time they become a lead, they're a better lead. My answer to that would be content, content, content, content. How do you put how do you put content in front of that, you know, the whole reason you want Facebook leads or why Facebook is effective is because everybody uses it, right? My daughter's on there, she's 17, right? My daughter's on there because she's trying to book uh babysitting jobs, you know, so all the old people are on Facebook, so she's on there to get in front of them.

Shannon 6:03

But boomer book, they call it boomer book now. It's not even Facebook no more, it's boomer book or whatever.

Cord 6:09

And so, you know, it's volume, it's because it works. But the issue is that whenever you run that uh interruptive style of advertising and you get people to click through on a whim, that is not a deeply held relationship to them, right? They're playing around. It is, you know, a lot of people, it is it's a form of entertainment, obviously. We know this to scroll Facebook. It's a form of entertainment to click through on something you know is an ad.

Cheap Leads Vs High Intent Search

Shannon 6:35

And they could be distracted by the next ad of a four-wheeler or a motorcycle or whatever. So, they're not intentional for another shed, yeah. They're not intentional. And that kind of goes into the next question, which was a velocity 360 uh post where they were asking, are you leaving revenue on the table? You know, obviously, Joe, uh Velocity 360 had him on the show two, three, three years ago initially, and then uh ended up being a, you know, connecting him with Peter, you know, to be a speaker at the Shed Sales Summit. That worked out really good for him. He's done a lot of good business, and we've uh since got an exclusive agreement with him because we think what he's doing with the CRM is working. And like, look, you know, once you need a CRM, that you need one to work. I mean, that's the whole point. You don't, you know, need it until you got the lead flow uh coming in, you know, but it's an organizing tool and they're doing a really good job at it. And he posed six questions on here, which we'll never get through since we're 45 minutes in, we'll never get through them in 15 minutes. So maybe pick the one that you like the most. Uh Peter actually comments on the very thing that you just said, which is Facebook being disruptive marketing versus intentional uh, you know, search queries like uh Google uh, you know, would actually, if someone's searching sheds for sale or sheds near me or whatever, and now you're optimizing keywords, it gets into a whole different conversation, doesn't it, from a marketing perspective. But Joe says, you know, do you call a lead every 60 or within 60 seconds? Uh do you follow up at least 14 times automatically? That's a hot button topic right now. You know, just even in the responses, number two got a lot of attention because of the following up 14 times. Uh number three, do you know your response rate in real time? Number four, do you know your sales conversion rate by product? Very important. Uh number five, do you know which ads have the highest sales conversion rate? Number six, do you automatically gather five-star reviews? I feel like we can talk about the five-star review part too, uh, just reviews in general. But any of those questions that stick out to you, to me, there's a lot of conversational. I say a lot, there's six comments on here, but about following up 14 times. One person says, if you did that with me, I'd deliberately find your competitor and go buy from them if you followed up with me 14 times. What are your thoughts on that?

AD-STRYKER HUNTING BLINDS 8:52

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CRM Discipline And The 14 Touch Debate

Cord 10:33

Well, let me just finish my thought um on the last thing first. So, what I was getting to is that uh you have to figure out how to make those leads more intentional in the first place. So if someone, if you are putting out content, you're building trust, and then you have your lead form pinned in a post at the top of your page when that person comes seeking your page, right? When they when they leave the Facebook reel, when they leave their newsfeed, when they leave your piece of content, and they've built a uh relationship with you, and now they're seeking, now they're intentional, right? So, you know, you can you can start to move the needle on intentionality on Facebook as well. Um, but you know, Izaak there was talking about, of course, just running kind of you know Facebook ads with lead forms and pushing people into CRMs. So, to that point, you know, all these from Joe, obviously they are so good at CRM work and most of these are CRM centric. You know, I think if I was really saying like pulling one of those things out of there the 14 times uh and people getting upset about it and even saying they would go in a different direction, you know, I think that I think that takes for granted that you're assuming that there are 14 um phone calls with immediate text messages after or something, right? Like the most annoying version of what it looks like when people follow up. You know, if I'm getting 14, you know, that person sounds like they're talking about the most annoying style, which is you call me, I'm in a meeting or I'm at work or whatever it is, I can't take the call, I get a somewhat pushy text messages, text message saying, like, you know, this is such and such following up on that building, right? Just brief, you know, whatever it is, and then two days later, the next day or later that afternoon, you get another version of that type of follow-up. You know, obviously the white glove service that Joe and those guys are putting into practice is so deeply uh psychological and sociological based. Um, I just had a conversation with Joe the other day, actually, where he was talking about making sure that there is clarity um through their entire process. They don't want there to be, they don't want their customers, um they don't want the your customers, right? They don't want the customers of uh their clients, their dealers and manufacturers to have any hesitation about the clear path to choosing your company, right? So, whenever he's talking about follow-ups, um, you know, of course they've got some secret sauce inside the inside the automations and everything else. Um but you know, he they're talking about doing in a very nuanced way that is not uh that is not pushing people away, but is continuing to make clearer and clearer why your company is the company that you should buy a shed from. Right. And so, um they've got they've got a lot of kind of industry techniques, and Joe's a great salesman along with being a great presenter and a great uh software developer. So they're very good at that.

Persistence Without Annoyance

Shannon 13:56

I know we've got dinner tonight, but I'm gonna jump in here and say I love this conversation so much and where it's going. I feel like we're hitting on all cylinders right now. Let's keep this thing rolling. And if it turns into two parts, so be it. We'll leave you, we'll leave you cliff hanging to have these conversations because we're just out of feel, I feel like we're in the zone right now. So, you might have to come back for a part two. We'll just have to see. But Joe's answer, I really love Joe's answer here. And I've got some commentary I want to add to it. You know, Jared jumped in there and said, can't argue with the numbers. Jared Ledford from Steel Kings, Peter, you know, Miller jumped in there. Uh, you know, there's six comments just on that post alone, and we're spending a lot of time on that, but that's okay. Uh, I love this answer. Joe says, we appreciate all the perspectives here. It's the age of debate, persistence versus annoyance. At velocity 360, we don't guess. We look at the data. If you're not responding within 60 seconds, someone else is, or they're trying to. On average, we see a 60 to 80% response rate when the follow-up is low pressure, you know, uh spread over 75 days. It's not about pestering, it's about being the first person they think of when they finally clear that space in their backyard and they're ready for a shed. 14 touch points isn't a sprint. I love this phrase. It isn't a sprint, it's a marathon to stay top of mind and consistent to the potential buyer. And that could come in all forms of touch points. When we're hearing 14 touch points, you know, I'd almost be curious to have this person on here who are to talk and get their thoughts on saying, you know, I would go to someone else if you contacted me 14 times. But you're I wonder if they're thinking that's 14 phone calls. Do you want to buy yet? Do you want to buy yet? Do you want to? What about now? That's not what that's not what he's saying. There's different ways that you can approach this through drip campaigns. There's different ways that you can approach this through phone calls, through text messages, through several different areas. And I'll tell you what, a lot of times you'll find at the end as somebody who's been uh had had that conversation where they've been reached out to multiple times, and you say, Why'd you buy from me? And they was like, Well, you were the only one who stuck with me. I wasn't ready to make a decision right away, but six months, you know, it took me six months to clear the land, had to go through this, had to go through that, whatever, had to get a permit, you know, had to pick out the right one. And you come to find out, they were like, Well, you were the one that kind of like stuck with me. Thank you for continuing to. It's not about pestering, it's not like you call them every day and you're like, What about now? What about now? I'm not gonna leave you alone until you buy from me. You take unconventional approaches, and I think that's where creativity comes in. And I'm gonna, this is a perfect segue. Maybe this goes is where we go into episode two. I'm not sure. Okay, this is a perfect segue to something I showed you today, Cord. Uh, just you you've seen my notes app. I just keep just like these, just all these reels saved. It's probably my ADHD. I don't know what it is, but you know, I keep all these things. I'm like, I'll go back and look at them. And I actually did last night. I went through and I labeled the ones I wanted to keep. And I remember one guy was talking. I'll tell you guys this. I hope you'll enjoy this this joke. You know, he and I'm probably gonna mess it up. I'm not a joke teller, just to be clear. Uh, but he, you know, he kind of talks about how business belongs to those who are willing to be creative and those who are willing to be brave. It's not always those who have a degree, it's not always the smartest people in the room, it's those who are willing to take a chance. Joe Loney's, you know, suggestion to read uh Teddy Roosevelt's Man in the Arena is a is a perfect example of that. Go Google that today, The Man in the Arena, you know, uh that poem. It's beautiful. But this guy says, uh, you know, he's on a train ride. Uh, you know, it's a doctor and it's a farmer, and they're on a train ride, and uh they're trying to kill some time. So, our doctor, it's a professor, uh, rather. And uh see, I already messed the joke up. It's a professor and a farmer, and the professor proposes to waste some time. Uh, you know, hey, uh uh, how about we challenge each other with some questions? And I'll tell you what, if you get uh uh how does he say it? If you if I get the question wrong, I'll give you $500, you know.

Cord 17:58

But if you get the question wrong, if you can't answer, basically. Yeah, yeah.

Creativity Story And Sales Follow Up

Shannon 18:02

If you can't answer the question, uh then I'll give you uh $500. But if you can't answer my question, you know, you only have to give me five. And the farmer's like, sure, why not, Mr. Professor? You're smart, we'll give it a shot. And the professor says, if you can tell me the exact distance from the moon uh to earth, uh I'll you know, then I'll pay you. And uh so the farmer says, I don't know. And he hands him five hundred dollars. And the farmer says, uh, or professor says it's your turn. So, the farmer says, Um, you know, what animal has three legs when it goes up the hill, but four legs when it comes back down. And uh the professor thinks for a long time, but he just cannot come up with what the uh what the answer is. So, he hands the farmer five hundred dollars. Farmer puts his hat back over his head, goes back to taking that. The professor is like, wait a minute, wait a minute. He's frustrated and he says, I don't know the answer. What's the answer? So, the farmer gets out five dollars and hands him the five hundred dollars or the five dollars, puts his hat back on, goes back to sleep. The point being, uh uh, I was saying my internet was unstable. The point being, it you know, it's not always the smartest person in the room. It's sometimes it's creativity. And that's what you've got to do. I'm trying to tie this back in, Joe. I'm trying to tie it back into your Velocity 360. That it's your approach, it's your unique approach. It's not you just being some demanding person calling them up, you know, and asking them to purchase a shed. It's becoming so competitive that you've got to find new creative ways through video, uh, through Zoom calls. I mean, people are selling on Zoom in the shed industry today. I know they are. Yeah. Of course. But you know, it's the it's the creativity. It's the it's figuring out a new way to reach your customer cord.

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Networking Wins And Education Sources

Cord 21:39

Yeah, and I guarantee you he would echo what we're saying here. It's continuing to provide value and clarity to that customer across those 14 touch points, right? Um it is not pestering. Um, it is it is persistence and it is uh letting them know that you're there, and it's continuing to provide clarity for. that. You know, but no, they're doing they're doing such a great job um over there. They I continue to get updates on their response rates and the fact that they can hit those really tremendous response rates. They are doubling and tripling people's revenue. They've got some case studies that are going to be coming out. So, you know obviously we love those guys, but that's not the point. The point is they're getting results for people on the ground, for dealers and for manufacturers, and they're able to be very consistent in reproducing those results, which I think just you know honestly goes to their approach overall, right? The fact that they can deal with vastly different uh types of companies or uh types of people even and can consistently deliver those types of results is really a testament to them uh and that white glove approach that they take.

When Advice Becomes A Business Model

Shannon 22:55

I'm gonna go one more just because the next one's me actually proposing uh that an alma shed builder reached out to us talking about that Knoxville area. I was very excited of what we uh what we saw between the manufacturers and the professionals page you know that we did get reached out to they're looking to move some inventory that had some excess over the winter uh needed to move some of that pretty quickly reached out to us we put a Facebook post out uh excited to see like four different people reached out curious about this inventory within 150 mile radius of Knoxville that's exciting to me that's what networking should be that's why I love these pages is because you can jump on there and find a solution just like we did the solution uh of the email to text you know there was plain communities who needed you know an option you know digital shed builder they've done a great job at this right like creating uh a product that no one else is creating which is an offline 3D configurator you know advertiser of ours good friends of the show love what they're doing taking a creative and different approach at even 3D configuration you know uh uh that's what it's gonna take to expand either an RTO I mean and that's what you're seeing this to go back to the base of your question your initial question you know why finance well why would an RTO company pick up a finance provider yeah you know because there's opportunity there and you know what finance is going to enter that space and I wanted to give a shout out to Phil Falls you know because Phil was one of the guys that really started that early in in uh in an RTO national with what they were doing with rent to own and finance and he came on the show we even did a two-parter where he talked about you know the difference in rent to own and finance and being state regulated and federally regulated and all the different nuances that goes along with it. Education is the key guys and education I mean where are you finding your education is the question. Where are you learning more about these things? Who are you trusting with these processes? You know that's why we love being a connector that's why we don't mind putting something like that on here because hopefully we can find and it seems like we have a solution for that Amish builder. Like we want to do more of that because that's a business model and I'm getting ready to segue and I'm gonna ask you this is probably a question you would want to ask me but I'm gonna beat you to the punch you know is when does it turn into when does it turn into a business model court when does advice turn into a business model we get calls here all the time you see that we get emails we get texts we get calls we get messenger messages whatever and that's years of working in this industry that is a solution it's like a hauler who has the knowledge to go out and move a shed and they have the equipment and they can do it in 15 minutes where it might take a redneck like me and you know half a day to get a tractor and do it the wrong way and risk you know getting hurt and everything else because it's cheaper. You know uh um but when does it become a real business model whenever you're starting to help people and I'm gonna pick a one post in particular because I haven't gotten a chance to go to the haulers page but where one guy was talking about being a shed dealer and offering up the number to shed haulers who might want to um haul sheds on private moves that are not you know company controlled in any way these are paid for sheds that he just wants to provide leads and he got raked in my opinion uh he got drug across the across the haulers will do that though you know they'll do that to you maybe they get a pass I don't know uh but it just I felt bad for the guy because I kind of felt like you know I was on his side if I'm being honest with you here.

Trade Organization Idea And Quality Ratings

Cord 26:53

I mean cue the cue the booze and I'm sorry you know if you if you boo me for that but um I do think it goes both ways one of the one of the comments was well why don't I just start charging you for you know every lead we said to you know uh who buys a shed and I'm like yeah I mean good uh well you could and people would and you should maybe and well and people would gladly the shed dealers would gladly pay it I mean they're used to paying well I mean I guess it depends oh gosh it depends right it depends uh what that's why I beat you to the question yeah what dealer we're talking about and you know who the manufacturer is and whether or not they're running their own leads and distributing those and everything else but you know generally you know independent business owners are used to paying for their leads and so you know uh I know that that is that's not been the custom up to this point but in most areas of the country and you know I'm not sure exactly you know what area of the country that gentleman was talking about. I'm trying to remember because I just looked at his Facebook page a couple days ago but either way in most areas of the country you know there are overlapping you know independent shed haulers you probably have three four five options uh in most of the places out there where people are listening across the you know the north you know Pennsylvania uh central Pennsylvania Ohio through the Sunbelt down to the south there's lots of lots of guys operating and so to think that there would be some level of competition or pay for on that side of it is certainly not unreasonable. Now I can still I can also understand you know the shed hauler perspective which is these guys you know um as compared to a dealer uh if they're an independent shed hauler you know they're getting into it right you talk about skin in the game if you're an independent shed hauler um you're providing a service that costs a lot of money uh just to be in business you know whereas um you know if you're an independent dealer um selling on consignment which is of course the most common model um you know you can see where there could be a little bit of where people feel some type of way uh you know about one of those businesses uh you know kind of uh asking the other for that finder's fee but you know the fact of the matter is and this goes back to my point um from earlier these are all the you know the breaking of the shell the wiggling out of the shell of an industry that's really becoming professionalized whether that be finance whether that be then figuring out you know how to adjust those net margins whether that goes directly to price or whether that goes into efficiency and processes and where do we save on whatever that task might be right trusses putting trusses together um whatever that task might be all the way down to um you know pay for basically every back and forth transaction and I'm not even saying that that's something that that I or you or anybody is advocating for I think that we like the idea that not everything in sheds has to be transactional all the time because it is you know a network of people who generally get along with each other and who show up to the Shed Expo every year and have dinner with each other and you know uh obviously a lot of traditional and plain community people um uh broadly uh vast majority of uh you know Christian based businesses out there so I you know it's not like we're advocating for this but this is just how the march of business works right you said something about uh I like the I like the joke that you told I was just talking to my mom earlier and very similarly the idea of um being entrepreneurial right finding that finding your own path uh figuring out how to navigate margins whenever they start to get tight what does that mean right where do we make it up or or how do we manage to add margin on top what can we offer that's unique and that doesn't always have to be a product or feature it can be an experience it can be customer service it can be the lot itself right how many things can you control that you're not actively controlling but what I was saying to my mom was uh you know the it's a similar truth uh in we were talking about healthcare and Medicare and Medicaid and everything like that. And I was talking about the downfall of socialism and communism and that command economy type of stuff I said they could have never come up with a snuggie. They could have never come up with an untrustable right because nobody you don't know what you want until it's there right and command economies require that people say I need bread I need cheese you know I need a I need a tractor um people don't know sometimes what they want and you know that to me is what is the most fun part about marketing is that you get to go out there and say how can I make this person feel the type of way that makes them want to buy what I'm selling and frankly it doesn't matter what that thing is right.

AD-IFAB 32:22

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Shannon 33:41

it's even it's even interesting uh uh when you hyper focus on something like the conservative side of the industry but how they sort of perceive creativity um like very creative like a lot of German and Swiss roots and things like that in the industry and like just generally speaking German engineering is like amazing like I think most people just acknowledge it for that and that starts with an attention to detail on education I mean kind of kindergarten you know like uh you know before you even go to formal school you know in first grade you know let's do this other educational piece even before that right uh so education seems to be which I think we can all agree like the more educated you are on anything or any situation the better and probably the more profitable decisions that you can ultimately make so when you go back to like what you're controlling the question is what are you reading? Who are you listening to? Where are you investing your time uh into being better? Uh whether that's at marketing uh learning about rent own learning about uh lumber trends learning about metal you know the things that actually go into the industry um you know and one thing that that I can say as conservatives you know Republicans always get the party of no right like the party of no they just say they just say no to everything because of the conservative nature that's one thing that hinders us sometimes in the industry is I remember coming up with some ideas and me I'm like every personality test comes back as trailblazer. I mean uh too many people said who would have thought to start a podcast or that it would work even in the industry I'm like man it's one of a million ideas I just can only do so much there's only 24 hours in a day we've talked about a trade organization we want so badly to get something like that off the ground I mean when we you know started shed you and you know ultimately shed sales professionals came to be very excited to see that Peter you know went and made that thing happen because it just needed to happen there's so many there's so many areas in this space that things need to happen but the idea is there it's the desire and the want to I mean like you got to get up every day and put out podcasts if you want to do it. It's not something that's gonna come easy all the time. And it's the same way with sheds it's the same way with hauling it's the same way with sales you've got to get up and better yourself constantly through what you read. And I remember asking somebody one time well why don't we just do this? He's like it's a great idea. I was like so why don't we do it he's like we'll never be first to the market with that I was like why? It's like we'll let someone else do it and then we'll try to improve upon it uh but we'll never be the first to go out and launch it. And I think that's kind of interesting because it goes against my nature is to sometimes be like well let's uh you know let's I don't know you start to learn your own you know where you're risk adverse where you're not probably depends on some situational you know things like where you're at in life where your money's at you know where your risk tolerance comes in is you know what can I afford to do um but I yeah I we can we can talk about all those things forever.

Cord 36:56

I mean I think how well defined is the business model I think is what a lot of people um a lot of is what a lot of conservatives look for, right? How well defined is the pay for and the reality is with new ideas um those pay for's you know can be a little murky. So, in the case of I mean let's just go on and talk about it because I'm determined to um you know try to get it off the ground but uh in the case of something that is more like a trade organization you know the pay for becomes direct a customer. So anything that winds up going to the general consumer winds up having a pay for so what I mean is you know if you are an A-rated shop or even an A plus rated we're kind of going back and forth on you know where those where those breaks are you know is A plus really truly like you know home build quality basically so A is what we would expect out of a really high quality shed um and then A plus says that your shop can actually you know produce home quality house quality um you know type of framing and tolerances and quality control and everything like that. But you know that's but my point is if you are able to instead of just like everybody else say quality we sell on quality well I'll show you why our quality here this thing right here quality right if instead of having to pitch the same message as everyone else around you just say just like you do at a um you know the health inspector or the here we have the reader's choice the Paducah Sun has reader's choice right it is a sticker that you put in your window that says we are an A plus rated we carry A plus rated um or the sheds that we carry come from an A plus rated uh shed man shed manufacturer that shop itself is A plus rated you know people have come in and looked at the operation they've got the jigs they've got the processes um they've got the tolerance they've got the quality control procedures uh you know they use the materials uh and they keep them not only do they use them for one-off sheds you know when somebody asks for an upgrade but they keep these things on hand these are these are materials and designs that they produce regularly and they produce consistently and so when you go direct to the consumer and you give them a way um Michelin stars another example right when you give them a way to discern without having to actually have I mean my goodness the amount of detail you could get into uh just about the floor structure you and I had that conversation this morning the amount of detail you can get into when you're talking about uh the runners and the joists and then you know how you are actually putting your uh in joists on how you are then connecting the floor system itself what materials are being used what standard um you know if you really have to have a 45 minute conversation about every system you know floor system wall system roofing system ventilation system if you have to have a conversation about that I'll just tell you that customer is no longer interested in buying from you because you've done put them to sleep right a can a consumer a customer needs shorthand and so to me that's the type of like business model although it would be a uh an organization but that's the type of thing that has direct pay force for all people who are involved um because you can directly put it out there to the customer and it's a differentiator and in fact there's probably even more um advantage to being a first mover in something like that so you know how well defined can you make that business model?

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Shannon 41:50

Making sales simple because every lead deserves a closer I like that we're having the conversations and if nothing else we're bringing things to the table you know hopefully that I mean like you see you know upgrade being adopted you know we were out there two years ago partnering with Joel.

Consulting Offers And Closing Thoughts

Cord 42:09

So, I'm excited to see it but you know we were out there talking about CRM you know like uh uh education you know to understand it better and you've just seen that sort of like blow up you know and I so I I'm excited because I feel like the conversations you guys have when you come on here and discuss with us are the things that kind of help uh move the needle you know whenever professionals like you guys come on and do discuss the different things very excited about our consulting like I just think we've got just a really good team man uh you know Chris on the marketing I mean that dude is just phenomenal I think you guys are gonna love it you know Richard and his ability to just overall business you know uh mergers and acquisitions mergers and acquisitions what he wants to be a focus on actually evaluation um was his kind of was his kind of specialty of course he can do anything but I think he really enjoys digging in and looking at those fundamental economics um what do you control what's in your vertical right um you know where can you uh where can you grow a line of business or uh things like that and so I think he really enjoys that valuation process so you know if you are one of the companies that we're talking about if you're one of the companies that we're talking about that is running lean and is kind of looking to either be the buyer uh or the uh the buyer or the buyer you know if you want to be on either side of that the seller uh you know the seller or the buyer side um you know I think that talking with Richard um about that valuation process and how he's approached it in the past and giving that sort of very high level insight would be totally invaluable.

Shannon 43:56

I mean Tyler you know Peter on the sales side I just really feel like we have the people who are really invested in what they want. I wish we had more. You know, I'm sitting here looking at these questions and we won't have time to get into it today. We can't do a three-part uh chord, you know. We gotta go meet this big wig. And I'm purposefully calling him a big wig because I know he's gonna listen to this and just give me a hard time about it. Uh, so I'm doing it on purpose. Uh uh, but you know, like these questions, like, you know, for guys who have experience with both uh uh what are the pros and cons of steering axles versus sideway wheels? Yes, 14 comments on here. I love this, but I really wish we could formalize that. Nothing wrong with free advice. You can go there, you can get all the advice you want. But sometimes there's people who want more than that. They want a little bit more of a, I don't want to use the term handheld approach, but to some extent, a consultant, you know, someone who can walk them through that. I wish I had a hauler that, you know, wanted to occupy that space and say, because here's the thing, you know, consulting can be, you know, whatever, you know, it's advice, but you want, you know, professional advice that's gonna help you uh not make these costly mistakes. I think that's where we've really shined on, you know, the clients that we've brought on so far is they're realizing that like the more educated I am, the better decision I make. And I don't end up spending a lot of money unnecessarily. But sometimes that can be tough for people who are on a budget, particularly dealers. And I think we just got to find a way. And like this, this this is my this is my you know commitment to you. You know, we'll find a way. Uh, we'll find a way. If you're a dealer who just like needs some more eyeballs on what you're doing or thoughts on what you're doing, we do the whole thing. We get you to sign the paperwork. We we're gonna do a non-disclosure. We want to be able to talk openly and freely with you. If you're a manufacturer who needs that help, you know, give us a call. We we're happy to put the years of experience that we've had in here to work. And, you know, that's why we spent so much time setting up the idea that it's a business model. It's not because we don't want to help, of course we want to help. But we also, just the same as the church wants to help, you know, there's tithes that are necessary to keep the missions alive and keep the lights on. And that's what we're doing here is we're trying to find, you know, use creativity to find ways to use our expertise to help you or those who are experts uh working alongside us. So, we just want to be a we just want to have a servant's heart. We've talked about that, uh, and help in any way we can. So, if it's something that interests you, uh excellent. Give us a call, 618-309-3648-info at shedge.com. If it's not something and you're bored out of your mind with it, well, then just you know, uh, don't tell us, I guess. I don't know. Uh we're here to help. So, uh we welcome constructive criticism uh only. So, uh Cord, final thoughts, man. Any questions you want to ask? This is an easy two-parter. We've been talking for an hour and 20 minutes just because we're Shed Geeks and like look, it's not even just sheds. I mean, some of these philosophies we're talking about are business philosophies in general. They affect all industries, and we bleed over into some of those other industries, whether it's furniture, post-frame, you know, livestock shelters, you know, metal buildings, like they tend to the common denominator tends to be the shed a lot of times or the shed lot. Uh I mean you're seeing how many manufacturers getting in into steel buildings now? I mean, we didn't even get a chance to we talked about finance, but we didn't talk about you know, some of these companies that are getting into uh steel buildings and square tubing. And it's more expensive than it's ever been, but it's still also in demand. So maybe for another episode. But any final thoughts, any questions you have, uh wrap-ups, whatever you want to do, the floor is yours.

Cord 47:44

Um no, I mean I think I think that you know we could continue to talk about just the things that are um you know circling around, but like you said, the um whether it be the steel side or the continued movement of all of those solutions to be um at one place on one lot. We see that out of independent dealers, um, the movement of the big manufacturers in that direction to be offering those solutions to their dealers or even to be putting out uh company lots that are offering um all those solutions in one place. It's you know, the march is happening. There's always gonna be um niches to fill into and people who uh can just sell sheds and all that. But uh the industry is on the move, and I think that this spring and summer are gonna be great, and the conversations around here are going to be very interesting um, you know, as the industry continues to uh press through a time of change. And you know, for me it's exciting. Um I'm you know glad to be in the shed geek office um, you know, so that I get to experience these kinds of conversations and relationships and really kind of be here to witness a an industry of you know as it as it grows up and as it matures and as um all of those business lines become more well defined and uh we keep getting better at getting to the customer, um, you know, whether that's Joe or uh you know, uh ads or on the ad side or marketing side or whatever else. So um, you know, I'm just appreciative and uh and so want to continue to uh make friends out there. I've been reaching out and I think I've got some people who uh are interested in contributing uh to the newsletter and jumping in and doing some blog posts for us um because I really just want to continue to dig in um and build those relationships within the industry and really get to know people and what their business is and um what they aspire to do and hopefully how we can help them get there.

Shannon 50:01

So well, be sure to share the episode, guys. Uh whenever if it's something that you feel like is beneficial to you because you listen, we don't like it's hard to be on here, you know, for two hours and talk about something that's constantly entertaining you every five seconds. We're doing our best, you know. We are we're trying to bring conversations uh to the table that matter, things that are in real time, things that are affecting you and your bottom line. So, we thank you all for listening. The increase in numbers has just reinvigorated me for sure because it was just, you know, it's always in question, you know. Uh and man, what a what a great, great thing. What a just a cool opportunity to uh to serve this industry, you know. Um, you know, God's always God's always given us, you know, what we need, you know, and uh and I'm thankful for that. So, man, I'm just excited for the next five years, Cord. Let's just go make it happen. Let's go continue to talk. Uh let's continue to communicate. Let's continue to hopefully improve someone's day by tuning in and listening to us. Uh, we want to be educational, uh, we want to be entertaining. Uh we want you to come on and be educational and entertaining. And sometimes that's as simple as telling your story. So, feel free to reach out to us. Thank you guys so much. Uh we're just trying to wrap everything up for this little monologue type episode that we're doing here. Um, if you will. I know it's both of us talking, so there's not much monologue happening here. But uh anyway, I just I'm overwhelmed. Thank you. Um can't say thank you enough for all that you guys uh do to continue to listen and promote. Go buy something. Tell them Shed Geek sent you. That helps me out so much. You wouldn't believe it helps me out so much. I guess that's it. Didn't really leave that in a in a segue that lets you talk, did it?

Cord 51:51

I didn't know if you if you wanted me to or not. I was gonna say, I was gonna say it's probably more of a dueling monologue episode when me and you get.

Shannon 51:59

Oh, there you go.

Cord 52:00

You know, I wouldn't call it a dialogue because a lot of times the both of us just like to have a have a little monologue.

Shannon 52:06

And we got these long runs inside of the dialogue. They should hear us whenever we're inside a truck. Thank you, Shed Nation, for listening. We appreciate you.

OUTRO 52:17

Thanks again, Shed Pro, for being the Shed Geek's studio sponsor. If you need any more information about Shed Pro or about Shed Geek, just reach out. You can reach us by email at info@ shedgeek.com. Or just go to our website www.shedgeek.com and submit a form with your information, and we'll be in contact right away. Thank you again for listening, as always, to today's episode of the Shed Geek Podcast. Thank you and have a blessed day.