The Art of Online Business

Want High Converting Emails? Do This First! Featuring Copywriter Elise Hodge

• Kwadwo [QUĀY.jo] Sampany-Kessie • Episode 930

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Elise Hodge is back on the podcast to share how to create high-converting email sequences. 

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After showing us how she turns $200 into $350 daily with Facebook and Instagram ads, she now breaks down what makes an email sequence truly connect with your audience. She explains why using personal, direct language is key to making your message resonate. 

Elise also shares strategies for gathering audience insights quickly, like using giveaways as surveys to collect useful data. She highlights the power of authenticity—your personality should enhance your message, not overshadow it.



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Watch the previous episode on YouTube, "How a Copywriter Turns $200 Into $350 Daily With a Facebook Ads Funnel featuring Elise Hodge" 

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Please click here to give an honest Rating/Review for the show on iTunes! Thanks for your support!



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Speaker 1:

Hey, welcome back to another episode of the Art of Online Business podcast. Elise Hodge is back. We just had a phenomenal episode. She kind of pulled back the curtains on her profitable SLO funnel. And if you're like, what does that even mean, koijo, it means that she takes what did we decide? Well, it fluctuates, but it means, on average, she's taking $200 in ad spend and turning that into $350 every day with Facebook and Instagram ads, and that is pretty phenomenal. I was saying that before. Elise and I stand by that. That is pretty phenomenal. So, dear listener, if you didn't hear that episode, it is linked up in the show notes below. You can go and get acquainted with Elise Hodge and right now I'll just tell you she's a funnel strategist who helps coaches and course creators make daily sales in their businesses. Since 2017, she's helped business owners launch six-figure offers, build simple and high converting funnels. She's a mom of two toddlers, about to be well, a mom of three. Right, you have three weeks left, four weeks left.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's it Three. Hopefully no more than that.

Speaker 1:

I remember side note, when we were in China, my wife, both of our kids, were made in China. We always give that joke and it makes people laugh. But our first had to be induced and she was, think, a week and a half past the due date and, yeah, I tell you, our our whatever you call her our regular nurse that we went to see was very much on us. We must induce, we must induce, and my wife was like.

Speaker 1:

I want to have a natural birth without being induced and then you realize later on it didn't even matter. You know what seems so stressful then, after you have a couple more kids, just seems like yeah no, big deal so here's to having your third child right on time, though I was saying that as a mom of two almost three kids.

Speaker 1:

You run your business part-time and you're passionate about helping others create flexible, profitable businesses that fit their lives. And when you're not optimizing funnels or sharing strategies on your podcast, the expert status show, you say you're chasing your energetic boys around or speed reading the latest historical fiction book, elise Hodge. I'm happy to have you back on the show. Thanks for being here. Thank you for having me. Converting email sequence. That is on the back end of the lead magnets and paid offers that I run adds to. So what is the one thing or maybe you can share two that make an email sequence convert the best that you've seen with your students?

Speaker 2:

as a copywriter. Yeah, I will say that there's a lot of talk lately right about how we, how we can, I guess, make our funnels more interactive, make our funnels more engaging, all of that stuff and I'm not saying that's not important, because I do think it is and I'm playing around with some stuff there too but there is no substitute for just making sure your copy actually connects with the person who's reading it, because if it doesn't, you can have all of the you know reply to this and I'll give you an audit or I'll send you a voice message or I've got a video here. You can have all of that stuff, those engaging elements that people are talking about these days, and you know, same thing, you can have like a mini class. You know, don't do long webinars these days, do shorter classes. Everyone's saying all these different things.

Speaker 2:

You can have all of that stuff, but if your messaging doesn't connect with the person who is reading it or listening to it, you know it's going to fall on deaf ears. So the number one, most important thing is making sure that you are using language that actually instantly connects with the person who is receiving it, where they go. Oh, it's like you were in my head it's like you were a fly on the wall and I will say there's no greater compliment to a copywriter when someone says that or when you know a client says ah my, my, you know, student, my audience is replying and saying how did you know that? I was thinking that. So number one is just making sure that your messaging actually connects.

Speaker 1:

This is hard for me. I do work with a copywriter that I pay to work to help my copy and she makes it sound like me, but better. And why it's hard for me is because I get stuck and I'm like what language really will connect with my reader and do I write in my voice or do I write in their voice? Because I've pulled them. Like how do you sort this out?

Speaker 2:

Yeah Well, I think there's two different things going on there. One is your voice and who you are and your personality. That's like one thing. I look at that actually after the first thing, which is using words that they understand, using expressions that they understand, hitting on desires, pain points, questions that they have that are actually in their head. So you know like I sell, you know digital products, courses and do more of the coaching side of this now like coach people through doing this themselves.

Speaker 2:

But when I've written copy for clients in the past, for many years, I would do you know a real research, research phase, first of actually understanding who their ideal buyer is and you know there's many ways you can do that but just actually understanding all of those different things that they have, like the desires, and then on a deeper level and so many layers you can go into understand, and then you know, yes, there's your personality, but I actually I personally I don't know, maybe other copy copywriters are different, but I do like to take the approach of making sure that we take into account all of that. You know stuff from your audience, first, when writing something, like literally writing it with all of that in mind, and then the it's almost like an editing phase is going through and putting more of if it's not really in there, or putting your own voice into it, and ways that I've done that in the past and I recommend people do that, is by having even things like a simple word. Bank can be really helpful. I've done that for clients in the past. Like words, I would say. Words I would never say you know, it's so simple. But especially if you are getting someone else to help write things for you whether it's for social media or a copywriter or anyone marketing kind of person writing anything for you you could give that to them, you can use it for yourself, you can give it to ChatGPT. These days, you know that's how we can use AI in a really smart way, not a generic way. Like you know, even things down to.

Speaker 2:

I used to do this with my clients, like how do you greet someone, how do you say hello in an email? How do you say hello? You know, because one of my clients she would literally talk in this sort of like hey, babe. Like this, really like peppy voice. And then for me, though that word would not be in my vocabulary because I just I don't in my word bank because I don't use it right. I might say, hey, how are you? Or, like you know, someone might say, might say say hi, or you might have, like just a certain way of saying something. So all of those little things that you actually do, making a note of them is really helpful, and then, if you can give it to someone else, or if you are using, say, ai to help you refine things, you can give all of that to AI as well and it's like we could get more you know we could get more into this.

Speaker 2:

You know, of course there's more like your brand voice and all of that, but essentially just, you know, looking at the things that you actually how you actually talk and how you don't talk, and I think that's like a secondary thing to first making sure you're actually connecting with your client because, yeah, your emails will come. I don't know if this is controversial, but I think your, your content is going to convert, whether you are fully in your brand voice or not, as long as you initially have that first piece of connecting, making sure that your words actually resonate with them.

Speaker 1:

Because it's their voice, it's their words.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's the things they're thinking and if you know you could be all in full personality, right, you could have all this personality packed copy, but if your words don't resonate with them, it doesn't matter, it's just like. It's like that nice, oh, I feel like I know you. It's all those like no, like no one, like pieces which do definitely do come into play and help you win over people. But, yeah, making sure that your words actually connect with what they're thinking first.

Speaker 1:

All right. What are your go-to strategies, though, for getting their words Like? I'll put another way let's say you have a super high paying one-on-one client who has hired you to just bust out the most amazing registration email sequence for a launch that's going to set people up to buy their thing during a launch, and the sales sequence, for once they launch their offer. Super high paying client, like your biggest client ever, but also your shortest timeline and, by the way, babies do in one week right now. What's your go-to strategy to collect those words?

Speaker 1:

like try to intrude, it will not fail you go okay.

Speaker 2:

Okay, if we're doing something and we need answers quickly, I would run a giveaway. I say giveaway, but it's a survey. It's a survey disguised as a giveaway. Yes, we're giving something away, but to one person, obviously, and this always works, especially if incentives really good and it's aligned with who you're wanting to attract. So I have this survey actually that like I give my students and clients to do, or that I've done for clients in the past, and you know, for example, like I used to have a website copy program. So it'd be like, by completing this form, you'll go in the draw to win a complete website copy audit. You know, I know one of my clients, she gave away like $500 like PayPal cash and she got, I think, like nearly a hundred people complete a survey.

Speaker 2:

Mind you, I think in that case instance, you're not necessarily going to have everyone being super qualified. So if you did something like that, I'd pair it with like something that's relevant to your expertise, so like maybe you're giving away course access or a coaching session or something just to make sure you're actually getting the people who are not just like seeking out the prize but want are a good fit for your office. But yeah, a survey is really good, can't go wrong. You'd have a deadline on it, ask a bunch of different questions, like there are heaps of questions actually that you can ask and pop that everywhere. You're not positioning it as a survey. You're saying I'm running a giveaway, I'm giving away a coaching session. You know, do you have five minutes to fill this out and you know you'll be in the running to win this coaching session or this course access or this bundle. Like I would just make it the most no brainer thing you can to get results results for us. So that's what I've done in the past with clients. That's like step one.

Speaker 2:

If we're on a short timeline, that that's. That's a great start. Then what I actually do even in that survey, at the bottom I have this question that's like would you be willing to hop on a 20-minute call with Elise to discuss your answers in more detail, or with whatever your name is? Yeah, it's interesting, a lot of people actually say yes, but then that gives you permission to reach out to people who you know really seemed like a good fit, who gave great answers, and to maybe get on 15, 20 minute, say, zoom call, to ask deeper questions, to gather even more information from them. So you might do that with, like, another five to 10 people. Again, if you're on a short timeline, you want to move that around fast. You might, even if you have a survey, you might even include a Calendly link and make spots open for the next few days and try and run as many of those as you can to get more voice of customer data. Yeah, those would be my first two things and they flow really nicely into each other.

Speaker 1:

Wow, elise, I don't even think. I have heard that and I have probably talked to five, maybe that, and I have probably talked to five, maybe six copywriters on the podcast.

Speaker 2:

So thank you, all my secrets today.

Speaker 1:

You're welcome guys because we came out of the last episode where you showed us like all the cool things you're doing to run that. That's funnel, to get offer. Okay, on the survey, that's disguised as a giveaway. You're saying once they submit they go to like a thank you page, that right there ask if they'll be willing to hop on a 20 minute call to share more with you. Or is that like the first email that they get after they submit the survey?

Speaker 2:

No, no, no. I mean you could do that. That's a nice idea. But I actually just have a second last question in the survey.

Speaker 2:

There's two One's like would you be willing to hop on a 20 minute call at least to discuss your answers in more detail, yes or no? So that's just giving me permission to reach out to them. And then it doesn't have to be awkward. I'm like, hey, you said yes, here's, you know, then I'd send them like a calendar link to book. You know, if you want, if you wanted to shorten the time, you could include. But that's just so I can sort of choose who I reach out to.

Speaker 2:

Because sometimes if you are running one and you get like 50 or 60 responses and then for some reason like 20 people want to hop on calls and you don't have the ability to do that many calls, you can maybe select the people. But hey, if you have all the time in the world, maybe it doesn't matter to you. And then actually, interestingly, I have another question at the bottom which says would you like Elise to keep you in the loop about her upcoming offer that will help you write website copy that converts? So I just insert whatever offer you have there. So I kind of have a question. It's like do you want me to keep you in the loop about my whatever this offer is relevant to you know, my funnel program, my email marketing, membership, my whatever.

Speaker 2:

You know, I'm drawing the research for. So again, I'm drawing the research for. So again, I'm just getting their permission or they're like them putting up their hand and saying, yeah, I'm interested. So I can reach out to them later and say, hey, you fell out the survey. I know you're interested. Maybe you could give them like an early bird bonus. Or I just want to thank you again and you know you didn't win it, but I do want to give you like a hundred dollars off.

Speaker 1:

The course, I don't know there's so that right there, the email to all the people who didn't win, but then you offer them a coupon for the course, like something off. That is beautiful. This I have seen work in funnels of people who have paid me to run their ads and it works quite well.

Speaker 2:

Interesting.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, so, wow, okay. So if somebody says on that second to last question, like would you like at least to keep you in the loop about an upcoming offer, that all and I don't know, let's just say benefit, benefit, benefit, then how long are you waiting until you send that segment of people, whether it's manual or automated another email about that offer?

Speaker 2:

well, it depends if you are in like the creation process of your offer still if the offer is actually ready. So yeah, I don't know, I'm thinking more for this survey, say like a relaunch or something like that. I mean, I haven't thought too much about this. There's obviously a lot you could do. You could sort of nurture them a bit separately if you wanted, or it could just be. You know, maybe you already have an early bird waiting period and you say you're launching next month. I mean, ideally you'd be doing the research before this, though. So I don't know, you'd have them in your world, you'd be nurturing them on your email list, but maybe it's reaching out to them on like a week before the normal early birds or like five days before.

Speaker 2:

I'm thinking for like a card open period. If it was evergreen, it probably wouldn't be because you're doing the survey. But if it's an evergreen, well, if you were just like updating things and it was evergreen, yeah, maybe you're sending it to them like five days later or a week later and just getting them a special offer. Maybe that's manual I could think of so many things you could do, dep and just getting them a special offer. Maybe that's manual. I could think of so many things you could do. It depends how many replies you have again, like, maybe you send them a little Loom video Thank you so much for filling this out and maybe it's after the giveaway expires. If it's an evergreen thing and I want to give you this because I really appreciate your time yeah, I just think like it depends on the situation.

Speaker 1:

Sure.

Speaker 2:

Surprise and delight. Surprise and delight.

Speaker 1:

So to the listener right now and they're wondering okay, but is this really worth it for me to give an hour of my time for free just to get people's responses to the survey? What would you say?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, oh, absolutely, because then you can improve your copy, you can improve your messaging and you know, obviously that's a, that is a big undertaking, don't get me wrong. But when you look at data and if you've run something once and twice and you're like listening, then you can refine. Obviously, the first time you're creating your copy, if you're listening to this you're like, oh, my gosh, I've got a sales page. This is a lot like. Please do this, though at least you know you're going to get an indication. You like, I always think, in your head. You're an expert, so you might think that the issue is one thing, but then you can see patterns, you can see trends and you might see, oh, actually, people, really, you know, say an objection. If it's worth it. Telling people if it's worth it and I was just saying, like you know, you don't know what's in their head.

Speaker 2:

Sometimes you have an idea of what people are thinking and we make assumptions. Assumptions are not good in copy. You know. That's when you have maybe a launch that flops, or an evergreen funnel that's not converting. That's why it's good to update this stuff every now and then too. So, yes, it is. It is a little bit of effort but honestly, at the very least, if you just do the survey like yeah, people are afraid of getting on calls but I think this makes it easier because you get their permission. But you know, if anything you do run a survey to gather information from them, it will help. You see where patterns are, where you've missed things, where you've assumed things, where you can tweak your copy and like anything, looking at the data, seeing how it runs, listening to your audience all super helpful.

Speaker 1:

I like it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

By the way, what do you do with said data once you have it like okay, I've done the thing, I've listened to you. I've had this giveaway that's a survey disguised as a giveaway, but now I have all these responses yeah like is there, is there a quicker way? You know, but what do we babies do? And I have the best paying client ever like how do I make sense of this data?

Speaker 2:

quick enough to yeah, yeah, well, I'm organizing it based on a few things, obviously, like you know the things that they say they want, things like things like the frustrations, things like the desires. You know the outcomes, they want, their goals. But then things also like what have you tried before? So I these are all based off the question. The questions that I like to ask as well, so it might be one of the questions I ask might be like what steps have you taken in the last 12 months to, you know, improve your email marketing? So then I can that tells me what they've tried before, which is a really important thing that I can speak to on a sales page like you've tried this before, you've tried this, but still, oh my gosh, it's so frustrating or it's still it's not working, and that's just meeting them when they're at. So things like what they've tried before, maybe mistakes or or even myths, like beliefs they've had about it. You know, again, that comes down to to other questions too. You know I ask questions like what kind of places like resources, copywriters, obviously, if I'm a copywriter, so I would use that, but if you'll say like you're a I don't know dog trainer, you might say like what other? What kind of places resources, other dog trainers, education have you turned to to help, you know, train your dog? So, again, like all of those questions sort of relate into different categories of like these are the things they've tried. These are, you know, some, some beliefs they have about this that I actually don't agree with. And then this is what's at stake. If nothing was to change, like if nothing was to change, this is where you're going to be. So, yeah, well, I mean, it gets super complex with this because they it does sort of line up with things that are important to hit in your copy. But organizing is a great place to start. So, just like, organizing it based on what you're seeing is really helpful.

Speaker 2:

And then you can bring that into different sections, I guess, of a sales page or different emails. Like an email might talk about oh, they've tried this before. Okay, cool, I'm going to write an email about the things you've tried before and why that may not have worked for you. Or then you know, I know I've got this category of different myths they have about email marketing. Cool, I'm going to write an email that talks about that. Or you know what's at stake if nothing were to change.

Speaker 2:

You know, if you can't get people to, if you can't convert people off your email list, what's actually at stake? Let's write an email about that, you know. Oh, let's imagine it's six months down the track and you're still doing the same things you've been doing, but you still can't get people to convert, like, ah, it's so frustrating, you know. So you can just turn each of these little categories, once you've categorized, into a piece of content which, for an email, can be an email each which, for a sales page, like yes, it seems a bit more complicated, but it's more like a section. I always think of it like we just tackle a different sort of thing in a different section, but yeah, this I can confirm.

Speaker 1:

like the kind of questions that you use, they're good because they are very similar to the questions that I have on my intake form, on my onboarding questionnaire, and I pull from those questions, or usually my copywriter pulls from those questions to come out with the first versions of ad copy yeah so yeah, yeah yeah, I mean, there's so many ways you can use this, right?

Speaker 2:

yeah, you know, to improve a funnel, to create new copy, to create like for all of your copy. You can inform your content as well that you're creating on Instagram. If you're wondering, what on earth do I say on Instagram at the top of my funnel? When you have this research, you use it everywhere.

Speaker 1:

I mean, can't say any more about that. Dear listener, if you haven't yet do this, I think I'm going to have to do this myself, because I haven't done it yet. Truth be told. Survey disguised as a giveaway. As a giveaway to get all the things that will make my email sequence really speak to the reader in a way that they're like how is Quajo in my mind Done? Tell us about this lead magnet that you have that I will link in the show notes below, called the welcome email template. Please.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely so. I have a free welcome email template that you can grab, obviously by the link, and that will help you warm up new subscribers. Because I find that people, you know they're growing their email list and then people are just coming onto their email list and then they, you know, onto their email list and then they, you know, only email them when they have a launch, when they're launching a new offer, when they want something say, they want people to fill out a survey, like we just talked about and they only email them when they actually want to get something done. Or, alternatively, they're just like too scared to email at all, but they're growing their email list because they've heard that they should do that. So that welcome email template or a welcome email will really help you bridge the gap to actually connect with people who land on your email list. They can get to know who you are, how you help them, perhaps hear about a few of your offers.

Speaker 2:

I always say, like, don't be shy to include your offers in your welcome emails, because people are interested in you, in your world and they want to know how you know they can work with you too. So don't be shy to do that. But yeah, that welcome email template will really help just introduce you and help them know that they're in the right place. Gives you a nice little introduction and then you don't need to feel so awkward popping into their inbox, because they already know what to, I guess, expect from you.

Speaker 1:

What to expect from you. That is so key, so key. That's the welcome email sequence template and that is in the show notes below. What is the last thing that you would say if the listener somehow never decided to hear from you again?

Speaker 2:

That would be really sad now never decided to hear from you again. That would be really sad, it would be really bad. Um, just in case, okay, oh gosh, always be refining and tweaking and optimizing and don't be afraid of it, because sometimes the increase in your conversion rate or, like you know, you can be so close and you can think, oh my gosh, my offer, my offer's bad, everything's bad, it all sucks. But sometimes you're just like one or two tweaks away from things working. And this is a journey that you know this is what I've done for clients for years is all that tweaking and optimizing.

Speaker 2:

But now, in the last year or two, running some more digital products and courses myself, I have really had to tell myself to be very disciplined to this journey of tweaking and optimizing and not being afraid of learning new things and being uncomfortable, even though it's like, eh, because if I want this to work, I've got to put in that work, obviously. But you know, sometimes we do things once and we think surely that's enough. But you know, pay attention to your data, track it, just keep thinking, analyzing it. You know what can you change. Maybe it's a word, maybe it's pricing, like obviously testing separately, but testing and tweaking like that's. That's where you know the power of creating a converting launch or funnel really lies.

Speaker 1:

Thank you, Elise Hodge. Thank you for being on the podcast and sharing all this with me and the listener thank you for having me you're welcome and dear listener. Thanks for listening till the next time that you see me or hear from me, or hear from Jamie, take care, be blessed and we'll see you in the next one. Bye.

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Kwadwo Sampany-Kessie

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