The Art of Online Business

What's working on Instagram in 2025 with Jodie Brown

• Kwadwo [QUĀY.jo] Sampany-Kessie

Share episode

Jodie Brown is a marketing agency owner, educator, podcaster, and international luxury retreat host who specializes in helping coaches and educators refine their messaging, play to their strengths, and create marketing strategies that feel authentic and deliver results. 

‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍

‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍

Today, she’s back to share her insights on getting real results on Instagram in 2025. Jodie breaks down the tactics that drive engagement, from refining repurposed content to crafting fresh posts that grab attention. We discuss the importance of quality over quantity and explore strategies that help content creators connect more effectively with their audience. 

Jodie also offers practical tips on growing your Instagram account by focusing on strong hooks and creating valuable content that resonates with your followers’ interests.


‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍
‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍
‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍
Watch the previous episode on YouTube, "Six Figures as a Content Marketing Agency Owner & Luxury Retreat Host With Jodie Brown"


‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍
‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍

Please click here to give an honest Rating/Review for the show on iTunes! Thanks for your support!



‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍

Kwadwo [QUĀY.jo] Sampany-Kessie’s Links:




‍‍ ‍‍ ‍‍
Jodie’s Links:

Speaker 1:

So if you're wondering how do I get this Instagram thing to work and my reels to pop off as it?

Speaker 2:

were.

Speaker 1:

Is it just repurposing content? Does that work at all? Did it ever really work? How do I make it work better? You know, from my podcast, long form content to YouTube, long form content to bringing it up onto Instagram or producing content natively Like. And how do I get more engagement and grow? How do I grow my account? You're going to like our guest. If you already heard her on the previous episode, well then, you're no stranger to Jodi Brown.

Speaker 3:

And if you haven't.

Speaker 1:

Jamie, I think they're in for a treat, right.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely, yeah, absolutely, we just had a lovely conversation in the first episode, which you can find, dear listener, in the show notes below. Click there after you watch this one. So Jodi is a marketing agency owner. She's a marketing educator, podcaster and international emphasis on the international luxury retreat host this is so cool. Who specializes in helping coaches and educators refine their messaging, play to their strengths, create marketing strategies that feel good and work effectively. Jodi found her sweet spot helping coaches and educators get visible and create content that not only builds their brands but also gets results and reaches the right people, which is what she's back with us to talk about today. Thank you for being here, jodi.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for having me again. I'm so excited.

Speaker 1:

You're very welcome. I feel like we should add. I didn't add before, but we know each other from the Mixer Mind, which is, like this, really easy to be a part of mastermind.

Speaker 2:

It's a year long right, yeah, and it's interesting actually because I think my friend, michelle Knight, who has been on the podcast before, I actually think that she might've told me about your podcast and might have referred us even before we knew we were in the Mixed Remind together, which is cool.

Speaker 3:

Oh yeah. Yeah, we had a good session with Michelle. We did Last year Last year, yeah, towards the end of last year.

Speaker 1:

It's a very, very small world, so let's jump right in. Please tell us. I know the listeners like ooh, instagram growth. Can you give us a quick, like one minute short synopsis? What got you here to be able to talk about Instagram growth Like? We know why we're going to listen to you, but the listener doesn't quite yet, unless they watched the previous episode.

Speaker 2:

For sure.

Speaker 2:

So I kind of long story short, started out growing my own business, which, as a hairstylist, with Instagram, and then in 2020, I made the leap into educating other stylists how to get really, really great results, so building their brick and mortar businesses and along the way, I again was kind of selling my education through Instagram, organically, built my audience, was kind of selling my education through Instagram, organically built my audience, organically built my podcast and organically had these launches, mostly organically, like we said before, utilizing Instagram as my main platform.

Speaker 2:

I, you know, use it to grow my email list. All of the things landed really cool opportunities. So I was, you know, asked to speak at events, I was asked to speak in other people's podcasts in there all of these things, all from building my brand through Instagram. Along the way, a lot of my peers started approaching me, noticing what was happening and saying, hey, can I hire you to help me, can I hire you to, you know, in done for you and consulting. And so for the last four years, almost five years now, which, oh my goodness, it'll be in 11 days from today, will be my last day behind the chair. So it has been almost a full five years now.

Speaker 2:

I've been helping other entrepreneurs grow their brands and businesses online and get some really cool results, Like, for example, even just last month, one of our agency clients and I looked at it this morning. It's still going so far. They've gotten something like 500 plus opt-ins from one organic reel, and so which fun fact was repurposed content and so there is so much capacity. I know there's a lot of people who are feeling very frustrated around social media right now. You know, who are feeling like they're not getting the results that they want, and so, yeah, that's kind of I think there's still so much opportunity from this platform and I'm excited to share that today.

Speaker 1:

Very cool to share that today. Very cool, just what you finished saying Got 500 opt-ins from repurposed content. Just right there. Okay, what trends are you seeing? Is making content directly for Instagram working better now, or is repurposed content still working?

Speaker 2:

Okay, there's several caveats. So more often than not, if you're okay with this, we'll start with kind of like what I'm seeing doesn't work in terms of repurposed content. One of the biggest things is, particularly for us podcasters is not optimizing the content for social, and so this can be things like framing and things like video quality and all of those different kind of pieces. Anything that doesn't look super native to the platform, I find doesn't do as well. So we can repurpose content, but and again, for a couple of my clients, it's actually the best performing content, but it's high quality video. Another thing is and I know that this is going to be kind of a controversial statement However, unless you've really figured out a great solution, I have found AI doesn't do a great job at repurposing content because it's not looking for the kind of hooks that we need in order to succeed, right?

Speaker 2:

So when you are repurposing content, you still want to look at all the same things that you would if you were creating it natively, right? So you want to make sure there is a really solid hook, right? So that's going to kind of deliver. You also want to make sure that someone can get value from the content, whether or not, they take the next step right. So if they are, it's almost like you want to give a little micro win when it comes to the content. So if they listen to this clip from your podcast, are they going to get something valuable? Are they going to get a mindset shift, a tip, something that's going to add value to their day? Or is it more kind of for you to just check the box of create content? So that's?

Speaker 2:

kind of you know these are kind of unpopular opinions A little bit. I told you there was a hot take. But you know, when it comes to repurposing content, I love efficiency. You know, when it comes to repurposing content, I love efficiency, but efficiency cannot come at the expense of effectiveness, which I think is what happens a lot of the time when we're repurposing content.

Speaker 1:

I agree. By the way, I found this true in my business. If you look at my Instagram content, all the way up until last summer, there were, you know, maybe three or four different posts that were pulled from you know, videoai or Opus Clips from a podcast and I just noticed that those never did well and I actually just discontinued my subscription because it was going on for like three months and I didn't know that we weren't using it. Because it was going on for like three months and I didn't know that we weren't using it. But I just had my video editor look himself through the content and pull out clips when I was still doing it, and that worked a lot better.

Speaker 2:

So and that's kind of what. And there's tools that we can use to make it easier, Like, for example, in my agency. I love Descript. Descript is probably if you had to pry a piece of software out of my cold dead hands, it would be that I love it so much because it really does like make the video editing process so much easier. And again, it's like you're pulling from that.

Speaker 2:

I think a lot of the time people focus on the wrong thing when it comes to repurposing and they're like okay, how can I add a bunch of like really flashy text? Okay, how can I add a bunch of like really flashy text and how can I add a bunch of like you know, different clip shots and all that and and that kind of stuff can be really helpful, but also it doesn't make up for for unvaluable content. Right and and value doesn't have to be just an educational clip. It can be, but it can. It's, you know, it's paradigm shifting, it's it's specific, it's unique, it's like that's what we want to look for, because with this flood of efficiency over effectiveness, there is a lot more like bland, generic, not so great content out there, and so if we want to stand out out, we need the antithesis of that. We need things that are you know story, that are everyday examples, like all of these different things we can do to stand out, doing handstands she's referring to the second most recent video that we posted.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, we're like we're just gonna dance and then, like he's all I'm gonna do a handstand, you catch my legs. I'm like what, dying, laughing, making this, making this real, it was I can't wait to see this it's already out there. You can, you can go see it now.

Speaker 1:

go to our Instagram and if you want a good laugh, Okay, now, because of the listener too, I'm going to leak this link to this crazy post in the show notes below Okay, listener, and then you can go see that too, and even say hi to me on Instagram.

Speaker 2:

As fun as it sounds, though, like it honestly a visual hook can go a long way, so it's going to be different for everyone. Like maybe it's you know, if that's on brand for you a handstand. I love that there's so many other different ways. There's so many ways we can grab that attention and be scroll stopping Right. Just just give that little bit extra to catch attention.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, All right, All right. So then what I? What I took away from what you just shared was that repurposed content can work if you don't use AI and are very specific about going in finding a good hook, making sure that that content alone provides a micro win for somebody and is valuable. Is that accurate?

Speaker 2:

Yes, and by doing that it's actually going to make them a lot more likely to do what you wanted them to do anyway. If you're a podcaster who's repurposing and go listen to the episode, right, because you know people don't just want like and there's a lot of things that are fatiguing audiences on social media too. Right, like, like. For example, one of the things that was working really well for a short period of time was those really short reels where it's like read the caption for more. Right, people got burnt out by that because they're like I don't want to read the caption, just tell me what. Just tell me what you're saying. Like, you know what I mean. Like the one second reels, like it just kind of got. It's like anything. It's like. One of my favorite phrases as a marketer I think all of us love this is zig, where other people's egg right. Once everyone starts doing something all the time not that there isn't a place for trends, because there is like there's some nuance to this, but like all of those things like, people start to get really annoyed by them. And that was kind of the general statement with that. So what I find is you know, for a podcaster, if right now you're just like, unless you have something really juicy, like, if this is, like you know, say you're interviewing some celebrity who's done something like absolutely wild, then you're like listen to this interview with Taylor Swift where she talks about, you know, the Superbowl or whatever. Then you can probably have a trailer like style clip, and that's fine for the majority of podcasters, though that, you know, just like a little bit of a hook, but that feels a little bit click baby, that is working less well than just excellent content. And then saying, you know, comment podcast or comment X to listen in on the rest of this. Here's what we're going to cover. So it's more like, if you liked this, then check out this type vibe versus versus a trailer, and so that's an example.

Speaker 2:

I also would be remiss if I didn't mention video quality. Video quality is big. It's big, big, big. So when you are like here's kind of an example, if you're repurposing content from your podcast and you're finding you're not getting great results, one of the things that you could do if the quality is not great is you could just take whatever that is and just record a face to camera clip, just record. Like you know, hold your phone like this. It doesn't have to be professionally produced, but if you take that same content and you kind of talk through it like it's, it's a native to the platform content, it's still the same messaging and then you can say your keyword, like your many chat keyword, which is what I recommend for getting people to go to the next phase. If you're a podcaster, then that can work really well. If your video content from repurposing isn't that great, so I like that.

Speaker 1:

That's something I've never heard before, and you also said mini chat several times, so are you favoring mini chat for clients over sending folks to the link in the bio?

Speaker 2:

I am, and the reason for that is twofold. So, number one I think of it as like a white glove, kind of like concierge experience, right, like, you can have those, and you can even take it a step further, for for sometimes I'll kind of play around with comment Apple or comment Spotify, and then you can send them that link directly to the platform that they are listening to. Right, so it's delivering that. Also, there's less distractions along the way, because we think as creators which is funny, because we don't think about this like this as consumers because we think as creators which is funny, because we don't think about this like this as consumers but we think as creators, that when someone listens, like looks at your content, they're dropping everything, they're consuming all the content, they're going to the Lincoln bio, they're signing up for the podcast episode, they're listening to it right there. But what probably actually happens more often than not is they look at your post, they love it, their kid needs a drink, right, they, you know, maybe the phone rings, maybe someone texts them, maybe a notification pops up dah, dah, dah, dah, dah.

Speaker 2:

There's a lot of things that can happen between going to your post, clicking on your profile and going and consuming whatever's in the link in your bio, versus if they comment, that's in their inbox, regardless of whether or not they're distracted or not, right? So when they open the app again, they're having that little piece of content, that little nugget, and they're thinking, oh, maybe I'll go listen to this now that I have time. So that's kind of the first piece. The second piece is when people are commenting on your content, it's boosting your engagement, which is then going to show that content to more people, right? So I think it's kind of a win-win, honestly, when it comes to many jobs.

Speaker 3:

I keep seeing that like please don't do the see the link in my bio anymore because it's just not working.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, yeah, and you know, I think there is. There is definitely truth to that. I think that when you should definitely have your link in bio optimized because but I think the more likely path for people is going to be not that you told them to go to the link in bio optimized because, but I think the more likely path for people is going to be not that you told them to go to the link in your bio. It's more, they see a piece of content, they click over to your page, or maybe someone mentions you in their Instagram story or whatever, and then it's optimized for new visitors right when you, when you go. So that's kind of the difference, like it's. There's a couple different journeys, there's a couple different ways that someone can get there, but I think the the like go to the link in my bio from an Instagram post, like it's. It would be more rare for that to happen, I would say, at this day and age.

Speaker 3:

Right.

Speaker 1:

All right.

Speaker 3:

Kind of like what we say with you know, with a lead magnet, when people opt in, like, have it go directly to like that opt-in page or a thank you page and not to your website where they're going to get lost looking at all the other things that they could be distracted by on there. So make it easy, right, exactly. So, speaking of like, what about those call to actions? How do we make those more effective?

Speaker 2:

One of the biggest things that I have noticed in terms of a change would be to have them in multiple spots.

Speaker 2:

So if you have a carousel post, don't just have it be at the end of the caption, like put it on the slide, put it on the video, like actually have it everywhere so that they're more likely to see it. And then also, everyone has made a post with a call to action that people didn't follow. So don't think of it always as the call to action's fault either. Maybe they just didn't get there, maybe they didn't get to that point like. So I think, just having that call to action be there without being attached to it, because you know, like same same thing, like you'll have people, you'll have posts where they won't do well, you'll have posts where they'll go off. And I think we need to kind of detach a little bit from this expectation that every single time we post a call to action, we're going to get a million comments. And I mentioned that because I've seen so many people get discouraged, like the first couple of times they try it, that they stopped doing it. It works, it still works.

Speaker 1:

Okay, now you have a social media agency who is getting results for your clients on Instagram, a social media agency who is getting results for your clients on Instagram, and we started by asking repurposing content versus making native content and why you gave caveats for how repurposed content can work and, like the next let's say four minutes here because we're going to finish up this episode what works for making native content to Instagram right now that you're seeing.

Speaker 2:

So there's a few things that work, like I I always think about and after publishing like thousands of pieces of content to dozens of different accounts over the last few years with the agency, I think the biggest thing to be aware of is that no account no two accounts are going to be exactly the same, right? No two audiences are going to be exactly the same, right? No two audiences are going to be exactly the same. So the first thing I always look at is what has worked for you historically and how can we bring more of that in? So, for example, does your audience like it when you are sharing like a hot take? Do they like it when you are sharing more step-by-step how-to content? What is actually working for your account? And start there, because whenever we look at a strategy, we like to meld kind of like what's already working with some testing and also like looking for patterns with someone's content so that we can kind of like weave new ideas into existing well like content that performs well. So, for example, if you are someone who is teaching photographers like how to run their business and you notice that every single time you post about social media marketing, right, that is something that that goes off for your people, then how can you weave that into the hooks of some of your other content? Like, how can you be like? You know, maybe the thing that's like social media won't help your business do this, but this will, for example, so you're mentioning what's working for your client, you're mentioning what they're they're into, and then you're kind of using that to to weave into your other topics and other ideas that you want to share with them. So that's like one of the number one things, because it is different for every account and every person.

Speaker 2:

Also, different accounts do better with certain types of content and so, like I have some clients where carousels go off like nothing else, even now, and a lot of people think reels are the only way to get traction. That's not always the case, right, or is it? B-roll reels are doing well. Some people just do face-to-camera content, that's it, and it works really really well for them. Just do face-to-camera content, that's it, and it works really really well for them.

Speaker 2:

The other thing that I always want people to think about is when you do a, when you get a post that hits, don't just think, oh, that was great, and then move on. Think, how can I like leverage and squeeze every single drop out of this post idea, like if it was a carousel. Every single drop out of this post idea, like if it was a carousel, record it as a face to camera post. If it is, you know, make it a B-roll reel, make it another carousel with a different hook. Like really really go in on this, because repetition equals reputation and that is what is required to build your brand in the online space.

Speaker 1:

Well, that's an. Instagram of a quote. I should have been recording that Repetition equals reputation, and that's what's required to grow in the Instagram space.

Speaker 2:

Yes, yeah, that is 100% something that makes a huge difference. And then also, like I said before, I kind of alluded to this at the top of the episode, but there's so many fringe benefits beyond just the visibility of an individual post, right, like you want to think about, I always think about it as like a patchwork quilt. Like if someone comes to your Instagram page, is it extremely obvious what it is that you do? Is it extremely obvious, like what you sell? Also, like that's an important piece, right, whether you put that in your highlights, whether you put that, you know, in your Lincoln bio, in your bio, we want to make sure that your goal for your audience is going to be very obvious to them when they land on your page. So, when it comes to content, that is a big piece of the puzzle, but it's it's not the entire puzzle. Like, each individual piece of content should lead towards the goal, and so I think that's something a lot of people don't think about.

Speaker 2:

The other thing I want to mention too, when it comes to content, is not every piece of content has to quote, unquote, do well in the algorithm in order to be worth posting. Like, I post stuff all the time that I know is not going to get great reach, but it is going to get me DMS. Right, it's going to get my people who are paying close attention to reach out to me. Like I posted something the other day and it got like I don't know like quite low amount of likes for me, but I got three DMS from people who were like tell me more about your program. So really balancing that desire for you know great metrics, because we do want to maximize visibility, but not at the expense of great messaging, and I, I really, I really encourage people, especially now when the way that we use Instagram has changed a little bit. It's a great brand building platform and we can and do optimize for visibility, but don't get caught up in that validation addiction. Think about it as a tool to grow your business.

Speaker 1:

There we go.

Speaker 3:

I like it. Yeah, good stuff.

Speaker 1:

Jodi, where can somebody? Follow up and meet you and learn more from you.

Speaker 2:

So I do have a resource that I'm going to give to your listeners, called the Social Pulse 2025. And essentially it's going to go into how you can update your messaging to resonate. We didn't get a chance to get into it in this episode, but there are things you can do to take the content that was working for you, you know, in 2023 and update it so that it starts to hit and resonate again in 2025. And you can find that at wwwaligncreativecocom. Forward slash art for the art of online business listeners. This is a paid training you can get on my website, but we're going to gift it to your listeners because I think it's important to really get the nuance and follow up on your own strategy. You can also find me at my podcast, the Visionary Rising. We talk all things marketing, mindset and what goes into being an entrepreneur over there or on Instagram at it's Jodi Brown.

Speaker 3:

All right, thank you so much for that resource. You guys want to make sure you grab that because she's offering it for free. We like free.

Speaker 1:

Clearly you know what's up with social media. So I would definitely recommend listener.

Speaker 3:

You want to get that and apply it to your own business.

Speaker 1:

Yes, Thank you for recording with us, Jodi.

Speaker 3:

Yes, thank you so much. Thank you for having me Until we see you hear from you next time. Be blessed, have a great day. We'll talk to you.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Kwadwo Sampany-Kessie

Host