From Adoption And Adversity To Patient-Centered Care with Dr. Stefano Sinicropi

What if the moment you’re trying to avoid is the doorway you need? We sit down with Dr. Stefano, a board-certified spine surgeon and healthcare innovator, who opens up about adoption, racism, and the alter ego he used to survive. He traces how secrecy around identity grew into shame, then shows how sitting with pain—rather than outrunning it—became the turning point for a career and a life built on integrity.

Across this conversation, we connect personal transformation to practical healing. Stefano shares a harrowing story from his teens, the split-second love that stopped a catastrophic choice, and the slow, steady work of separating events from identity. We explore how “casting votes” for a new self lines up with behavioral science: small, values-based actions rewire loops, reduce shame, and create lasting change. That same approach shapes his practice today. He talks about treating people across the spectrum—patients with Black Panther ties and patients with swastika tattoos—and why authentic presence, respect, and safety can dissolve fear faster than lectures ever will.

If you care about addiction recovery, trauma-informed care, and integrative medicine, you’ll find a roadmap here. We discuss why technical skill without deep listening misses the mark, how energy and empathy shift a patient’s nervous system, and what it means to become the CEO of your own health. This is not a highlight reel; it’s a field guide to coherence: say your real name, tell the truth, make the next aligned choice, repeat. Stay to the end for a tease of part two, where we dig into medical training, system incentives, and how to rebuild care so people actually heal.

If this resonated, follow the show, share it with a friend who needs hope, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway. Your story might be the spark someone else is waiting for.

For more about Dr. Stefano, click below!

https://midwestspine.net/providers/stefano-sinicropi/

https://www.instagram.com/doctor.stefano.md

To book a FREE discovery call with Dr. Harte, click below!

https://calendly.com/drharte/free-discovery-call-w-dr-harte

Transcript

Welcome And Two-Part Setup

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Welcome back to the truth about addiction, everybody. I am so excited for this. This is actually going to end up being a two-part episode. So this is part one. And it is with an amazing man that I met earlier this year. No, a few months back. It is already 2026. Good lord, guys, time's going. Sometime in the second half of last year is when I met him. His name is Dr. Cinecrappie, and he's such an amazing man, such an amazing physician, has a heart of gold, does very similar work. His ethos around breaking out of the current healthcare model and reinventing the wheel is so similar and in alignment with mine. So we hit it off. He also is an author and a speaker. And so we he and I could talk forever. And uh I couldn't wait to get him on here. I can't wait for you guys to hear what we're talking about. I actually got some stuff out of him, not because I was trying to, but just because I was persistent in wanting to know the why behind some of what he was telling me. He shared some things that he's never shared before. And this was just the first episode. So I'm really excited for you to hear this. Let me read you his bio, which is nothing short of impressive before we start. Dr. Sinacrappi is a board-certified spinal surgeon, healthcare executive, and entrepreneur who has performed over 10,000 spinal surgeries. He's the president and CEO of Midwest Spine and Brain Institute, where he helped build one of the nation's leading physician-led spine centers. Beyond surgery, he is the founder of Hypercharge Health and Hypercharge Wellness Centers, pioneering a new model that bridges medical care, recovery, and performance optimization. He is also the author of Wellness at the Speed of Light and a national speaker dedicated to helping people become the CEOs of their own health. All right, you guys, let's jump in. As you guys know, my podcast, which has been up and running since 2022, has evolved as I have evolved. And what I mean by that specifically is that while a lot of the earlier conversations were with people I knew directly from recovery, they have since branched out because I've also since released a book that is meant to take this idea of addiction and emotional cycles of dysfunction, or truly any pattern that we're stuck in that is probably there for good reason from something that happened when we were young, but is showing up in our adult life and actually blocking our blessings. I like to have conversations around all the presentations, which means that my guests come from all walks of life, not necessarily substance abuse. So this amazing man and I hit it off almost immediately when we met, which was not that long ago. We're both in the medical field. He is an orthopedic surgeon, he's an amazing man. He's writing a book, starting to speak on stages. And so we're kind of walking this walk together, and we're both extremely passionate about a much more integrated approach to health and wellness. And I'm super excited about wherever this conversation takes us. Stefan, Stefano, please welcome ever welcome yourself to the show. Say hello. Tell us where you're coming from.

Energy, Community, And Purpose

Early Life: Adoption And Identity

SPEAKER_00 3:48

All right. I mean, that's a I mean, that's a loaded, you that's a loaded question. And you know, you know, much like it's so anyway. I um, like you said, thank you. Thanks for the introduction. Thanks for having me. I mean, it's been, you know, like, I mean, you're absolutely right. We we hit it off uh, you know, when we met, it's about energy, vibrational energy, you know, like, you know, whatever, calls from the universe. We can get into all that uh as as much as you want, but uh, you know, I I'm just a guy that is so passionate about bringing the message of hope and healing and the fact that, you know, we we've we've got one life, you know, working together. I get so much energy from you know, meeting people like yourself that just inspires me, you know, to go forward. And I think one of the similarities uh that we both have is that when we go into these rooms and there's a lot of positive energy and people are excited because they're looking at the future, they want to make changes, or you know, in your case, all these people that want to come out of like addiction and and like just achieve like that really recharges my batteries. And I know you you feel the same way. I feel so energized. And so if I'm in a room around surrounded by these people, like when we met at the Suspire conference, like every 30 minutes that goes by, if you checked my level of energy, it keeps going up until I can't go up anymore. And then I just crashed. Then I was like, I gotta, I gotta, I gotta get a little bit of rest, otherwise, I'm gonna have like a lot of mental disorganization. But you know, my background, we can we can get into whatever you want to get into. I've just got a crazy background, you know, you know, born and raised in the Bronx, you know, was adopted, had a crazy upbringing, had to deal with all this stuff growing up, a lot of strife, uh, a lot of um, you know, being told that I couldn't do the things that I want to do. You know, I shared this story the other day. I did this uh this little event, and I just talked about the fact that one of the stories I remember the most, and I know it was it's all about stories, is I sat down at my uncle's house and um I was all excited. I was like, you know, I want to be a doctor one day. I was maybe, you know, I was like in my teens, and um I was excited, I was like, whatever. And he just looked at me like straight in my face, like you know, you gotta be smart to go to med school.

SPEAKER_04 6:08

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 6:09

So I I just I think that I think about that every single day. And we could take one of two ways. We can let it destroy us and and you know, worsen our imposter syndrome or whatever, or we can take it directionally another way and say, hey, this is this is fuel. So I had to go through a ton of stuff growing up, and a lot of like people, you know, and my parents you know believed in me like crazy, but a lot of people from outside, they just, you know, it's always negative messages. We're just surrounded by a lot of negative energy. Um, it's just like, you know, like what we're trying to do now, we're trying to get to different, you know, levels. And people like, ah, that's too hard. You'll never do that. Oh, it's hard to break in. There's just too much. It's like they're projecting their their own thing. So I want to be the antidote to that. And I want to be the guy that that uplifts people and says, you know what? The power of the mind, and I have a great story for if you if if if you want to talk about it, but the power of intention and the power of the mind and the power of harness, harnessing this infinite universe really allows us to overcome almost anything. Like, if you look at your like life story, it's in it's insane. Think about what you overcame with that, but it all starts in here, and I see so much dysfunction in here, and that's like a like it's a big part of my mission too. Not only do I want to heal people's bodies or help them to heal their bodies, but I really also want to be part of helping to heal their minds because it's just I'm not even talking about like, you know, like serious, you know, anxiety, depression, PTSD. I'm just talking about purely thought patterns that people have and these broken loops. It's such a problem. And interestingly, I just find like it's getting worse. And it's not, I don't know if it's because I'm looking for it, but I certainly just get the sense that there's just so much negativity and so much that, and that's why I want to surround myself with people like we are, you know, like meeting at these events and things and things like that, where they're all coming together in a positive way because they want to move forward, they want to better their lives, they want to improve. And then you take that knowledge and that energy and you impart it on, you know, people that are going the opposite direction. And and hopefully we can we can help a lot of people with with our platforms and what we're trying to do.

Family Silence And Shame

SPEAKER_04 8:41

So, you know, I feel like, and maybe maybe this isn't true for you, but certainly for me, my childhood informed so much of the behaviors I now deeply understand that showed up in my adolescence, my teenagers, my twenties, and and it's been not from a place of wallowing or self-pity, but certainly from a place of compassionate inquiry and understanding and pattern recognition. So unbelievably important for me to go back in order to move forward. And so, you know, you touched on a tough childhood, and and you know, first of all, I'm curious, just coming to terms with finding out whenever that was that you were adopted, what that was like for you in terms of whether or not it affected your self, your sense of self-worth. And the second part would be since you gave us uh a snapshot of that moment where you were essentially being told you you were not smart enough to be a doctor. And and what did you do in that moment? Because it's one thing to sit where you are today. Obviously, you went forward and you are a doctor, right? But but what did you have to overcome? What mental gymnastics, what limiting beliefs from things like that that continued to happen to you? Because I feel like when we have these experiences that are traumatic at whatever level, and then we have the experience of overcoming it, we so badly, in order to create real meaning and purpose in our lives, want to give those messages to other people, right? It's what makes our lives rich. Yes. And I don't know if that is true for you, but I'm I'm feeling like, you know, with what you sort of said and what you're doing now, there's a connection there. So if you could take me back to finding out you were adopted and what how whether or not you internalize that coupled with that particular moment when he said, you know, you need to be smart to be a doctor. So that we, you know, I'm always looking to talk specifically to the listener who is suffering. And there's plenty of people who are listening that are just ready to be inspired. And don't worry, you guys, you will be. But for the person that's like, I don't know how to get out from under, I think it's great to just talk about the reality and the pain of these times in our lives, and then the rise.

Racism, Belonging, And Resilience

Radical Empathy In The Exam Room

SPEAKER_00 11:30

No, yeah, you're you're you're you're absolutely right. And I mean, there's so much to you know to unpack. And I wish this was a you know a 10-hour, you know, episode, because as you know, our talks can go pretty long. So let me just I just start from the the the beginning, and it's almost like um I feel like even as a very young, um, you know, like a very, very young, um, I feel like I internalized some of the traumas that my parents went through. So let me, I'm just gonna briefly tell my story. So when so my my biological mother, okay, was white, actually, blonde hair, blue eyes, believe it or not. You know, sometimes this comes out. Um, and uh obviously my biological father was was black, but anyway, they lived in this neighborhood up in um up in Canada. And uh when she got pregnant by a black man, she knew that in her neighborhood because of racism, this is 1970, she would have got pregnant at like probably right at the beginning of like right around New Year's of 1973. And I was born in I was born in September of 73. So you figure nine months. I'm doing I'm doing the math. I don't know exactly when all that that stuff went on, but at some point there was a conception. And so, anyways, so she found out. So thankfully, thank you, she decided she did not want to give up this child for adoption. I'm sorry, did not did not want to have an abortion, but wanted to go down the adoption route. So it just so happened that somehow she got connected with these, this attorney group, and that knew that that there were these that these these immigrant Italians that were looking to adopt a baby. She got connected with them and she actually moved down to the Bronx and she lived with my aunt and uncle during her entire pregnancy once she started showing, and then gave birth to the baby and then left. That's the last I I know of her. And everyone's like, Oh, you try to find out this and that. I I don't, it doesn't matter. My my parents were amazing that raised me. They've both since passed amazing people, anyway. So the the story's kind of funny. And my my father used to talk about he did not like to talk about it. He was severely scarred by the whole uh adoption thing, and it was like in and you know, like in our household, like you can't hide the fact that that I'm adopted, like I don't look like anyone in the even though it's weird because you see these like Netflix specials, and like clearly that is not their biological, and they don't like know for adoption's a whole other thing. I want to do a lot of work on adoption because it's a lot, it's a lot, it's a lot to handle. Anyway, my dad goes to the hospital, all right. And again, like this is a blonde-haired woman, right? And so they're all excited, right? So three days later, they come to pick up the baby at the nursery. And my dad, when he was able to talk about it as I got older, because he did not like to talk about this stuff early on, just too scarred. He, you know, they got there and right away they knew something was a little different about this baby. They had no idea that the father was black, no idea. And so he just tells the story. It's very funny. He's like, something's different about the nose. That's not the Roman nose that we were quite like that's not exactly what we thought was gonna come out of this lady. Like, did they switch, like, was there a swap? You know, all the stories about the swaps and the and the thing. But they said, you know, they they picked up the baby. That was their baby, they were dying for a child, and and it was like, you know, kind of love at first sight, and they're like, you know, and they and they took me in. But I I know, like obviously, when I was very little, I don't remember that stuff. But I grew up in a household where only Italian was spoken. I mean, they spoke very, very broken English, and but I'm sure they were very traumatic, because as you know, like now it's very common. You always see you see all kinds of people walking around with kids of all kinds of whatever, right? But that was very outside of the noise, especially in a neighborhood that's 90% Italian at the time at the time. I was very, very Italian, the neighborhood, and so they had to deal with a lot of racism themselves and personally, and I'm sure that that angst and that thing, it's honestly it happens because when we're anxious, like as parents, right? That our kids feel that they know they know your pet feels that, right? They want to cower, they just want to go away. If you're really angry, even though you're not talking to them, you might be on the phone. The pet, you could tell they're they're they're they have anxiety, right? Because our vibrational frequency is you know, you know, matching with theirs. So, anyway, but long story short, that that I knew early on, because you asked me like when I knew, I knew early on, but the weirdest thing, it's the weirdest thing, and I I talk about it openly. It's like people in the family, like my aunts and uncles, and they did not want to talk about this thing. Like they just didn't want to talk about it. It was like they're oh, this and that. Like they were trying to be like, oh, you know, like, and even like you know, there were times where they were like trying to pass me off, like you know, I was full. I mean, I'm I'm half and half, right? But they're just trying to, it was just it's the I can't even explain the weirdness factor.

SPEAKER_04 16:44

How did that affect you when they were extremely, extremely?

The “Steve” Alter Ego And Turning Point

SPEAKER_00 16:48

I didn't know. I was very, very conflicted because now I love talking about people love it's it's the opposite. It's like it's my origin story. Your origin story is that's what made you, that's what whatever. And the only thing that I regret, listen, I had the most loving parents that you could imagine, like doting, like you know, like uh honestly, like it's in it's insane. Like I'm so lucky to have had them, the most loving people. And I I had, other than a lot of strife that I had to go through, you know, I had a very loving household always to go to. So even when I experienced racism at school or or whatever, because you can imagine I the environments that I was in. But the one thing that I do regret is I was so conflicted about it at the time. And I just didn't know what to do. I didn't know how to answer questions. People were always asking. And like my parents, like they, it wasn't, they were, they couldn't have been more proud of me, but somehow, like it was like, I don't know if they had like a sense of shame or or whatever, not about that, just about like the whole situation. I can't even, it's hard to explain. I mean, I talked to this about it, you know, as they got older, but it certainly affected me. I had a lot of angst about it, a lot of anxieties, um, you know, about and I remember, you know, that being stressed. And I remember like one specific thing that that bothered. It's like it people don't know, like those of you who are there are watching, if you know the Italian culture, these are people that when like somebody passes, like they keep like people's like uh like their stuff like is still there 10 years later in their drawer. It's a very ethnic thing. Like they don't want to talk about it. It's like almost like the person, I was like, no, they're dead, they passed. That's six years ago. And so they have a lot of angst and anxiety of their own. It's just, it's just the it's a proudness. I don't, I don't even know what to say, but I just still remember I was in the car one time, and um this lady was asking my mother, you know, when she gave birth to me. I I I literally remember this. I was coming home from the dentist. This is how like burned into my head it is. That's random that I remembered that. And I haven't even, I don't think I've ever told anyone until this right now. Anyway, we're driving in the car and she's like, Oh, when did you get pregnant? And my I remember my mother's words, and I remember how like upset I was in the car. She said she started it with, oh, I'm sorry, uh, he's adopted. Like, why are you starting it with I'm sorry? That is like a a sense of shame. But listen, these people love me on beyond not even unconditional. I can't, I it's hard to explain how much they loved me, but they felt this profound thing, and then that passes to the like that passes on to the child, and then you're just like, I don't belong here, I don't whatever. And that that that can turn into a you know a whole Did it turn into something?

SPEAKER_04 19:34

Like, did you have a period of your youth or adolescence where you were acting out, where you had low self-worth? Like, did you see the ramifications of this bumpy childhood later on? And if so, what did that look like for you?

SPEAKER_00 19:50

Oh, absolutely. So uh what I what I would say is this the one regret, I just I just want to finish my my you know my thought, and then we'll get into the bumpy childhood and whatever. But the one regret I had is that if they had been more open about it, even though it's obvious, right? There was a kid across the street that lived from me. He was adopted too. He found out when he was 16 years old, and he literally tried to run away from home because he was so angry. And it was it was unnecessary. Again, he had a he had adopted Italian immigrant parents and they could not talk about it. It was it's bizarre, it's like this thing, you know, that goes on. But anyway, so I regret that because it's my origin story, and people love this stuff.

SPEAKER_04 20:30

Like, when what do you regret though? What do you regret? Because your parents were the ones that didn't want to talk about it. So, what what about that could you I couldn't talk about it?

SPEAKER_00 20:41

I didn't want to talk about it at the time.

Sitting With Pain To Heal

SPEAKER_04 20:42

Like I didn't could you have done anything literally? Now you're you're telling me you regret this. This is a really important moment that I'm I'm kind of coaching you for a second, but I but I believe it's important because I know what it is to live under the weight of regret and and and below that you know, guilt and below that shame. And it's a very heavy burden to bear. And the the reality is it's very easy for us now with who we are today and everything we've learned and how much we've learned to love ourselves and how proud we are of where we came from and all these things, right? Say, you know, damn it, I had a real opportunity when I was young, even though they had their own shit around it, to speak up and be proud. But the truth is, did you, did that version of you at that age, who was being basically taught that it's not okay to talk about it, that we sweep it under the rug, that we get weird and we get anxious, did you actually have the ability? Because if you did, you probably would have exercised it. So if we get into reality about the past. And the truth that we actually had and what was being modeled, the real answer probably is no, I couldn't have done anything other than what I did. And now that I know, and I now I know how empowering it is to speak about it, now I do it differently. And then right?

Shame, Identity, And Behavior Change

Rock Bottom As Catalyst For Growth

SPEAKER_00 22:22

So like so let me let me let me let me clarify. I know exactly I mean, I know exactly what you're saying. My regret is it's not even so much like when I'm 10, but my regret is like when I was a teenager, for example, trying to be who I'm not. And and it's just the it I can't, it's just the weirdest thing because in certain instances, and you see this, like and I and I see this because I, you know, I I I talk to other people that have been through adoption, and it's weird. It's very different when you're adopted by people that clearly you can pass for their kid. And I could certainly, if I was just with one of them, I could clearly pass for their kid. You're like, oh, you're that, and then the other, because that's actually my, you know, like my biological background. But when I'm with both, I mean, what do you what do you it it's not like regret about that? It's just that people are are you I always felt that people wouldn't accept, you know, my story or they would feel that I'm less than. But then in looking back at the time, it's like it's it's it's not that like people didn't know. It's like I couldn't express myself in that way. I I couldn't, I couldn't really find myself. And it wasn't until you know I became a little bit of a, you know, like of a mid-level teen where then I started seeking out like trying to learn about different, you know, cultures and being with people that let's just say were more brown and stuff like that. But but it it it it's just it's just different. But even then, I for certain people I did like kind of share my story, but for other people I didn't. It depended on on the on the group that I was with, and that's why I love, I know we both love this one of the same people, David Goggins. I love his story because there is a big part of it that he talks about how he tried to be somebody who he's not, depending on the group he was in, because he just was so desperate to fit in. And I think all of that stuff made me like so desperate to fit in to different groups. Now, there's a big positive to kind of my upbringing, I talk about it all the time, and that is that I've always seen like race, culture, whatever, whatever background you you want to throw out there. I've always seen it as in a way, yes, it's true, you have red hair, I'm talking to you, you have a certain background, I have a certain background, but doesn't matter. I've I don't see it that way. I have broken bread with pretty much every single like ethnic, everybody. And I don't see them that way. That's why it allowed me, because I was uncomfortable in my skin, I really was for a long time. And that's why I share with like David Goggins. He always talks about. I mean, we just literally just make stuff up to just fit in, even if you don't even care about that stuff, whatever. But I was so uncomfortable in my own skin that I was just so open to other people and other cultures, knowing you have no choice, it makes no sense. Like if you think about it, who gives a crap if if somebody's adopted or not adopted? What they like I had a choice. Like, I don't have a choice. Like, I don't even have a choice, but I like you almost feel like you had a choice, or it's just the weirdest thing. And so there's nothing, it's just like people that are like they're uncomfortable because they're uh you know Asian or they're from Pakistan or they're from what Croatia. I don't know. I'm just throwing out anything. It makes no sense. Here's how our lives go. We open our eyes, and there you are. That's it. That's it. This is the the the cosmic forces, God, the infinite, whatever you want to call it, all came together to create Samantha, to create Stefano, and here we are. This the cosmic forces or the the universe comes together and we just open our eyes and we open it up. So it really gave me a good sense of it makes zero sense to me being prejudicial against a specific person because they look a certain way. That never I honestly, that is the one of the biggest takeaways I've had. And I think that it is so sad to see people's bigotry and racism and whatever. It's literally based on nothing, it's just a power struggle, and we we can go into that that whole thing. But what it has done for me as a person and as a physician is that I like deeply, deeply love all people. Like, I don't really care like what their religious background is or what their political persuasion is or whatever. If we're vibing on a positive energy level, it's it's it's fantastic. And this allows me to sit in rooms, like for example, with patients of all, you know, I'm in age and I give like the most extreme example. I've had Black Panthers in my office, and I've had white nationalists that have swastika tattoos all over the place. But guess what? I'm comfortable now. I couldn't be more comfortable in my own skin. And when you, when people feel that you're you're with them, you want to help them and you're comfortable, no matter how different you are from them, they can feel your energy, they can feel the fact that that that you deeply want to connect with them and help them in any way you can. Immediately they get so comfortable. I have a, I mean, when I was in Louisville, Kentucky, I had this one guy, swastika is all over his arm. It's just besides you could just tell. So he sees my last name is Cynocropia, and clearly he didn't go to the website. But anyway, he comes in and he's sitting there. You could tell this guy was like ready, like he didn't know what to do. Once I started talking to him and treating him with respect, that guy was telling me all about stuff that he does and he lake and he hangs out, completely felt comfortable because he knows that I just see him as a person. Because a lot of that, like that racism, fear of others, not even racism, anything, anything like we're different, you know, like I'm skinny, that person's fat, I'm this, that person has pimples, whatever, whatever you want to. We have all these bizarre, like made-up stuff. It's all made up. But once you show people that you genuinely deeply want to connect with them, those barriers just like melt away. And now it's just two souls sitting in our room, heart-brain coherence. We're all kind of merging together, we're all tapping into like this infinite source. And now we're having a great conversation. The ice is broken, and and and and it's just incredible to have that. And I feel like a lot of that is missing. And I did I do talk about that in my book about how many physicians cannot connect deeply with their patients because they they haven't come, they haven't really been exposed to this massive, wide variety of people. And when I say exposed, I don't mean exposed like they see them in the office. I mean they know them, they know their culture, they've been in their homes, they've talked to them, et cetera. So I think that even though I talk about, you know, we went down the shame, all this stuff, I wouldn't trade it for the world because it's made me, you know, who I am today, just like you wouldn't. I mean, obviously you've had tragic things happen in your life, but it's made you who you are. Obviously, you'd love to bring, you know, your sister back and all that stuff. Of course we do. Of course, the loved ones that I've lost, I'd love to bring them back. But in general, we wouldn't trade it because you wouldn't be, you wouldn't be who you are. You like I wouldn't be who who I am. And and uh, you know, it's it's uh it's been an amazing ride. You can't connect the dot like listen, I'm Steve Jobs, right? You can't connect the dots looking forward. You can only connect them looking backwards. And when I connect them looking backwards, it's such a beautiful, like, you know, like the the the infinite, the universe is it's just it's amazing, you know, what it what it can do if you allow it to do its to do its thing, God to do its thing, whatever you guys, whatever you want to call it, folks.

SPEAKER_04 30:15

You know, it's fascinating because obviously a lot of what you shared gives credence to the type of doctor that you are and why you care at the level that you do, right? Which kind of goes back to when I introduced you that part of our work that is very much a commonality between us, right? And and at the same time, there's this there's this thing in recovery that we say, which is you can't transmit what you haven't got. And I think we can be great friends, great lovers, great physicians, great whatever, whatever it is, to the extent that we have uncovered that greatness within ourselves, which then implies we have to unpack the dark stuff. And so I'm curious if there's a story that comes to mind. If you jog back in the throes of I'm not really sure who I am, I feel like I want to be proud and I'm I don't want to be ashamed, but then there's kind of this veil of shame around me, and I'm I'm inhaling it all the time, and I I'm gonna say and do what I need to do to fit in, because that's also just what we do as teenagers. Was there a moment or or a defining situation relationship, something where you were so sick of not being who you actually are that you were like, my only option now is to turn back toward who I am and start living from that place because these are the the foundational elements, the the dark nights of the soul that I think profoundly shape the people that we become, and then of course the types of teachers, coaches, practitioners that we are in the world. So I'd love to hear a I got, I mean, that that's easy.

Medicine That Sees The Whole Person

SPEAKER_00 32:25

Um, let me give you the background to it first. So, you know, obviously I have a super Italian name, Stefano. And it uh I feel like just just having this name takes me, you know, pretty far because now I'm Dr. Stefano MD. You know, that that's that's you know, that that's what I mean, kind of my patients know me as or whatever. There was a time in my life, like late teens, and um, you know, kind of in my in my 20s, again, not to go back to Goggins, but very Goggins-like where you want to be, you want to kind of have an alter ego, you don't know what you know what to do. So I was so sick of answering, like I didn't really, I still didn't want to talk about it in my 20s. I did not want to talk, I just didn't want to talk about it. I just wanted to be me. I just want to be like a regular, like I just want to be like a person that doesn't have to deal with this stuff. And so it's funny because in certain circles, obviously around my family, whatever, but in circles outside of my family when I would hang out or was on the dating scene or doing whatever, you know, what I was doing, a lot of times instead of going by Stefano, I started going by Steve. Because if you go by Steve, I don't have to answer all the damn questions. Oh, how'd you get that name? I don't want to talk. I don't, I didn't want to, I just don't want to talk about it. I've been already traumatized as a kid. Like we've been like we're just doing this whole thing over and over again. So it is so fun because you know, when I when I met my wife, she first knew me as Steve. So for the first like two or three days, like we like when I met her, like we hung out every day, like since since I met, and I I quickly got to know her just like literally in days. And I was just when I just told her like my whole background and story, she was like completely like and I'm I'm talking this is like days in. It wasn't like this went on for a long time, but it was just so crazy that then like she started helping me to unpack that I don't have to have like this alter ego. I just made up this other guy, like I just made up this, and it's different because Goggins is still doing his got like he's Goggins or whatever. I went back to my roots, and that you know, it's just different, but it's it's just like I was Steve, and they still make fun of me now today. Like randomly, my wife will be like, Oh, you are you Steve or you Stephanie? Like, who, you know, like who are you today? But it's just true. And then I had to uh you know start unpacking a lot of that stuff, but it took years to really unpack because it just gets bottled up, like the comments I've had made at me and other stuff. I've literally like people, it it's just it's just hard to explain. Like people would just randomly say things like, you know, I would say something and they're like, oh, he actually thinks he's white. Like just random stuff. Like, what has that what is that even? But what does that even mean? And I hear that now, and it really bothers me. Like people say, you know, you see a kid, like they look like, like, you know, they might look super dark-skinned, like African kids, but he talks a certain way. And they're like, Oh, why are you talking white? What the hell does that even mean? I don't even know what that means. And it makes me so mad. So I just intervene. I time out, I have an answer for this. Let me let me bother you be yourself. Give me a break. And there, and this is happening every day, all day. Listen, with the people you counsel and you work with, I'm sure there's a lot of people that are trying to be other people still, and they're 70, right? Like people like get into these infinite loops, and thank God, eventually through my 20s and 30s, I started to really get out of this ridiculous infinite loop that I was in.

Part Two Tease And Where To Find Stefano

SPEAKER_04 35:56

I mean, what was what was a what was one tool that helped you to really start to heal and come into self-acceptance?

SPEAKER_00 36:06

I mean, I think that I mean the biggest tool was actually spending quite well. First of all, my wife, when when I would, you know, even from the beginning, she's like, Well, that's weird. Like, well, what she's like, you have an amazing.

SPEAKER_03 36:17

Yeah, but that's that's outside of you. That's your wife pointing out. What did you have to do?

SPEAKER_00 36:22

What did I do? I had to, I had to have the courage to go in a quiet space in my own mind and actually sit there and painstakingly think about the pain and the trauma that I had gone to, including all these like different anecdotes, because I could give you anecdotes for hours of things that were said to me as a kid, or the one time that I'll give you another, I just want to give you an example of a trauma. And this is true story. By the way, this is like all breaking news. I don't even talk. This is I I don't, I mean, I talk about stuff to my clothes, but I never like publicly talk about these things.

SPEAKER_04 37:00

No, I know.

SPEAKER_00 37:01

This is what you do. This is what you do. This is why I'm on the this is why I'm on the Dr. Sam show. But anyway, so true story, and I'm not crazy, I'm just letting you I'm I'm just gonna talk. So I'm I was I was a really good athlete as a kid, and I was by far the best athlete like in our neighborhood. And of course, I had to get all the racial stuff. Well, you're just you know, you're just black, you know, just just genetics, you know, like you're like you're just like well, you animals, you know, you're just faster than us, and what are we gonna do? Like that kind of whatever. Uh I don't think they think it was just that's this is 1970s, 1980s, the Bronx. Very divine, like crazy, crazy. Anyway, I'm out there. So one time I'm I'm playing football, and I'm just just like it's just dusting everyone. It's not even close. Like they're just I'm just like I'm going long, they I'm just catching touchdowns left and right, and I'm talking, I'm talking smack, right? And and they were, you know, like they were getting upset. There was a group that was like not from our you know exact neighborhood, but a but a competing neighborhood, right? But all Italian kids for the most part. There was not everyone was Italian, but I can tell you no one was black or Hispanic, no one, zero. Um, other than actually my cousin that I grew up with that my aunt, he was half Puerto Rican, but he looks as you know, like he he's very uh very, very uh Italian look. Anyway, that being said, so these kids all of a sudden they decided they were gonna like jump me. So they literally like like just started like like punching me and doing that. Everyone's jumping on top of me and doing stuff like that. So for somehow I get out of the pile. I'm pretty strong, kid. I get out of the pile, I run home. This is a true story. True story. I run home, I grabbed the butcher knife. Okay, I was so mad. I start running. My father sees me. It's like, what the hell's going on? My father's old, by the way. He was old at the time, he was a very old dad. So if I'm in my teens, you're talking about a man that's already like in his upper 50, like he's around 60 at this. I mean, old, I mean, whatever, but he's older, not at the prime of his like athletic career anyway. So I grabbed this butcher knife, he sees me, I I sprint. This man, so I sprint, this man comes sprinting. I don't know how he caught me. I have no idea. He caught me, he caught me by my he caught me by my hood. He caught me by my hood and may have saved my entire childhood. Because I was mad. I mean, they literally, I mean, I mean, they were when I say I was jumped, I mean they jumped me like this was for injury. This wasn't like, hey, this is haha, we're funny. Like they were legitimately like, you know, like trying to break a rib or or break an arm or whatever they were doing. I mean, there's like five or six of them like piled on top. I'll never forget it. That's how much like it's just crazy. Like, and that's what adrenaline, you know, like the stories of like people lifting up a car to save their child. That's what my dad did. I mean, I don't think I think he's probably never run that fast. And he used to be a soccer player. He's never run that fast in his life. Never. And he caught me to say, to save his son. This is the kind of trauma that I had to put in some in these drawers so that I can like move on with, you know, with with with with my life. And I had to unpack it slowly in these dark places. You have to go on to these deep, dark places, and you have to like let it sink in. And then you have to say, well, I didn't have anything to do with that. That wasn't, I I didn't bring that upon myself. It wasn't my fault. Because you feel like somehow it's your fault, like you did something, and you and you really have to unpack it. And then when you unpack it and you really kind of put it all down and you start writing things and you start doing stuff, all of a sudden you're like, God, I wish I had done this a long time before that, because then I wouldn't have had to carry that load for you know 15 years or 30, whatever, whatever it was. So, anyway, first time I've ever shared that story, it's literally not even in my it's not even in my book because I feel like when I was even writing the book last year, I'm like, it's too painful, I can't even put it in here.

SPEAKER_04 41:08

But the it's so important, right? Because for there's so there's so many layers to that story, and you know, the the very real you know, crime against your own humanity that forced you to get to such a state where all you wanted to do was retaliate is a real is a real thing, right? And then the second part of your father being able to play the whole tape out and just on probably understood in a nanosecond something horrible just happened. My son is infuriated, and if he does whatever he's wanting to do right now, it could change the course of his life, he could end up in prison, like and I I will not, right? Like, I I I will run until my body gives out before I let this child ruin his own right. Okay. So, you know, great acts of of first of all, just when our when we are violated, we become utterly dysregulated. And all bets of any rational decision making, especially at those younger ages, are are all bets are off. And then a parent's love and the extent they're willing to go, right to save their child from anything, and the the level at which you did not process these things, even not putting it in the book, right? And I I understand I have a story that I actually did put in my book, but I had only just a little bit before that started to unpack it, because I there was still so much shame around me. And and so the sitting with our hardest things and feeling what needs to be felt long enough to then separate our identity from our mistakes is the is the very foundation of stepping into a new self, right? And so I think one of the dangers of shame is that we become the thing that we are ashamed of. We are now the person who did that thing. We are the person who didn't self-advocate. We are the person who let ourselves get beat up, we are the person who was in the wrong skin color. We are now stamped as if it is permanent. And when we spend time with it, and and often with good counsel and trusted advisors, right? When we spend time with it long enough to either to either stop acting out on the shame, because shame will wanna make us numb and anesthetize, or take our shame out on you, or it will make us just. Believe everything it's saying. If we can spend enough time to go, wait, there's a there's a thing that happened to me, or there's a thing I did, and then there's me, and they are not the same thing. And if they're not the same thing, then who am I in light of my greatest mistakes, of my greatest traumas, of the greatest offenses against my humanity? Who am I? And you were able to go, I am I am a person who deserves a seat at the fucking table. I am a person who is extremely smart, who is extremely athletic, who is extremely capable, who did not ask to be treated that way, who did not ask to get adopted, who did not ask. I I was in a situation, I handled it at the time the best that I knew how, but today I am a person who doesn't have to carry that very heavy load. I'm a person who can actually use it as a superpower. I'm a person who can use it to now express my own humanity as a physician and to reach people in a type of way that an ordinary physician going through the system that is medical school will never really be able to. And what a fucking gift. Right. And I think for the person listening that I'm always thinking about, I'm always thinking about an older version of myself. I'm always thinking about the person who's still in pain, who who cannot understand how on earth they're gonna get out from under, whatever the thing is, right? Because you don't click on the Truth About Addiction podcast unless you are suffering from some cycle of addiction, or you know and love somebody who is, and this is all where we start to understand these presentations of why people are making seemingly horrific choices, why they're harming themselves, why they're harming other people, and the beginning of what is required to heal. And by the way, this isn't just spiritual in nature or even woo-woo. This is literally what we're talking about is behavioral science, and there's research and literature to support that the most sustainable types of change are the changes that happen when we very, very slowly shift out of an identity that we no longer relate to and into an identity that feels aligned with our values and our integrity. So, in those tiny moments where you separated yourself and you went, Well, I actually want and desire to start identifying as this other version of myself. So if that's true, well, then that version of me can't keep saying Steve when someone asks me my name. That version of me has to start saying this, has to start doing that. When he wakes up, he's gonna look at himself in the mirror and acknowledge himself differently. He's gonna and and you just start casting votes towards a new identity, right? And this is the beginning of a whole new life, which is what you made for yourself, right? And and I think this is why we go through this arc of storytelling from some of the really hard things into because who fucking cares about how good it is today unless we understand that there was some roadmap that is unique to you and is unique to me, but that that we're willing to get vulnerable enough to share our specific roadmap so that the person listening doesn't feel so alone or so afraid or so ashamed, and then you better believe we're gonna double down and tell you how fucking good it gets because it does, right? I'm really glad, I'm really glad you shared that. It's it's it's so important, and it helps me make like this is the work I've had to do on myself, right? So anytime somebody's skipped over some of these details, I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, stop.

SPEAKER_05 48:25

I love it.

SPEAKER_04 48:26

You didn't tell me how you got, wait a second, like I know you don't want to go back there, I understand, and we're not going back there to to relive the pain again. We're going back again to just acknowledge what was so important about that situation where it it broke something open in you, right? Because in the greatest periods of darkness, the the silver lining is that that is when the light can come in.

SPEAKER_00 48:52

Right.

SPEAKER_04 48:52

Right. And I always say, like, it's ironic that my book is called Breaking the Circuit because I wasn't thinking about this when I made the title. I was literally trying to be Dr. Hart scientific and talk about breaking neural circuitry and replacing old feedback loops for new ones. But the reality of that is in order to do it, nine times out of ten, the pain has to be the circuit breaker. This is why people can coach in discomfort not just for a really long time, but sometimes for their entire life. It just hasn't gotten painful enough, whether it's in their body, their heart, their mindset, in order for them to go, I cannot live like this for one more second. But if you have a pain and a circumstance, right, that becomes or enough of them that pile up where the pain of living in this false identity is so great that you are zapped into a state of consciousness and you go, I cannot fucking live this way anymore. I don't even know what the way forward is, I can't even see it. But this is so dark and it scares me so much to live one more second like this that I'm putting my hands up and I'm saying, there's got to be another way forward. There's got to be. And that is the most magnificent time. And that's what's so crazy about rock bottom moments is we want we want to avoid them, like the plague. We want to skip over them, we want to rush them along, but they are miraculous moments in our healing and in our transformation. And imagine if all of us in our darkest moments were like, I am being prepared for miracles right now.

SPEAKER_00 50:56

It's your origin story. It's it's it's what it's what makes you you. You just have to, you know, you just have to accept it, you know, internalize it. And uh absolutely, there's so many miracles to be had. I mean, I just I don't want to, you know, you said woo-woo before. I love that word because it's true, because you start talking about the infinite and the universe and and the secret, right? Which is you can attract the law of attraction and all this stuff. It's like it's more about like the law of vibration and and what you and it attract. And and and to be honest with you, neither of us, right? We're the reason that that people want to hear our stories, especially now that I'm actually telling my story. You've you've been telling it for years and you've come to grips, and you know, I know your whole story, fascinating. They they everybody has pain, everybody has scarring, everyone has their their their their their you know, their go-through, you know. Eric, Dr. Eric Thomas, everyone's got their go-through, and you gotta go through it. And and I didn't go through it until decades later, but I went through it. I was like, I'm gonna go through all this pain again, and I'm gonna just like suffer in my own mind, and out comes a person that then can be well equipped so that when my patients or people come to me and confide in me and whatever, I'm coming to them completely non-judgmental, right? Even if they've committed some horrific crime. I don't know why they committed that crime. I have no idea. I have I have no idea. Or they've gone down a bad path, or they don't take care of themselves, or or they're just a horrible person. I don't know why they were a horrible person. When you come with an open, uh when you're just open, just just openness, and your heart is open, your spirit is open, you're vibrating, and you're you're you're you're just positive. You're like, how can I help you to heal? And for me, it's uh obviously a lot of it's physical, but I do a lot of a lot of other stuff, you know, like doing the integrative health stuff too now. They know that it is so healing to have, you know, uh uh uh people that are around you, like just me talking to you, right? I feel I feel like I'm healing, just telling these stories. And I'm hoping my patients feel the same thing because I'm so open with them. It's just non-judgmental. I'm just there to guide them and and try to help them. And I get so many comments, as I'm sure you do as a count, you probably even get more because that like literally what you do, where it's like, oh my God, you're the first person that really listened to me, not took a history, I mean listened and didn't judge and didn't like you know, like didn't metaphor, you know, like like sometimes actually or kind of metaphorically roll their eyes at at my story and why I'm here and and and but like because they're coming to us for healing. They're not coming to us because they want to be our friend, like they they have a problem, right? As a physician, you have a problem, you come see me. And so I I am just so happy with this.

SPEAKER_04 53:51

And obviously, we need to do a part two of this as we as I think for sure I'm gonna have you back on because I I yeah, we have to do this again. This is an amazing start, and it's enough to help a ton of people. I think the next part of the conversation that would be really fascinating would be around the journey through medical school and your sort of coming out from that academic bubble, what that reality was like, and how you transitioned from traditional orthopedic surgeon and all the protocols that come with that to a more integrative doctor, right? Because even though I was on a spiritual path during my time in graduate school, it was years before I really started to say, no, no, this is all a part of how I'm practicing and how I'm treating patients, and it's not gonna be separated ever again. And I don't know what that whole chapter of your life looks like. And I I want to save some time. So there's your cliffhanger to the audience members.

SPEAKER_00 55:02

Exciting, exciting. I can't wait.

SPEAKER_04 55:07

And I I would would guess that maybe that wasn't initially the case, or didn't, you know, because we don't teach us these things in school, you guys. We we we we often come out and we get pushed inside of a system that wants us to operate a very specific way, and it is not designed, as you guys probably well know, in the best interest of the of the person, because they they want us to match your symptoms, they don't want us to get you to actually heal and not need us. So it we need to kind of come to grips with that ourselves and then reinvent the wheel completely on how we design our work in the world. And that's its own conversation.

SPEAKER_00 55:52

Oh, a huge conversation. You better book two hours for that podcast. That's gonna be a that's gonna, I'm serious, that's gonna be a doozy because I mean I got some stories of of miracles I've seen and and stuff I've seen, the whole thing about the traditional medical system and really what the motives are behind it. A lot of it's in my book called Wellness at the Speed of Light, by the way. Same as my podcast, that you were gracious enough to come on. And uh I I've got I we I've I've got so much to unpack. And obviously, you know how to get it out of people. So I I we gotta we gotta do a two-hour one if your audience can tolerate two hours.

SPEAKER_04 56:27

Well, we'll come back for a part two, but in the meantime, if somebody hears this and wants to reach out to you, how can they find you?

SPEAKER_00 56:34

Yeah, they can just find me at at Dr. Uh Stefano uh MD Instagram, you know, Twitter. I'm not very active. I'm going to, but Instagram, Facebook, um, they can find me on LinkedIn. My LinkedIn is just it's just mostly basically my name. They can just they can just go go on there. They can certainly Google me. They can go to uh Synecropiespine.com, which is my more my um kind of my surgical website, my personal surgical website. And then they can go to hypercharge health, s-in-i-c-r-o-p-i.com. Uh synocr spine, s-in-i-c-r-o-p-i-spine.com. And then they can go to um hypercharge health, hyperchargehealth.com, which is our integrative health clinic, and uh and go from there. And I'm excited. I and you know, I'll answer all the questions. If anyone has questions, please reach out to me if you have an issue. I may not be able to give you medical advice. Everyone's always asking me for my inbox is filled with people, deep medical advice questions. I'm like, we've got to do this in a different setting because this it's not an appropriate setting to do that. So yeah, I look forward to thanks for having me on the show. This has been amazing. I always love talking to you and can't wait to unpack the crazy medical school journey, residency, also nuts. And then yes, I love that the me like I have seen some stuff and I and I look at it in a very deeply spiritual way, and I'd love to share some of those stories with your audience.

SPEAKER_04 58:04

Yeah, that would be amazing. I can't wait. So good to talk to you.

SPEAKER_00 58:08

It's amazing. It's always good to talk to you.

SPEAKER_02 58:32

Take me to my feet.