The Undetected Narcissist Podcast
Your host, Angela Myer, takes you on a journey toward shifting your perspective from self-doubt, fear, hate, and anger into wisdom, understanding, compassion, and eventually forgiveness, so you can truly heal. Angela wants to support you in discovering and awakening your authentic self.
The Undetected Narcissist Podcast is here to educate, support your recovery, and encourage your empowered transformation following narcissistic abuse. She will shine the light on various topics from attachment styles, trauma, emotional abuse, PTSD, narcissism, toxic relationships, self-care, and dating advice. Angela has a spiritual approach to healing that bypasses religion because it is a relationship one forms with our Creator, not religion. Therefore, she removes the shame that some faiths can focus on when healing from toxic people.
Angela Myer, author of The Undetected Narcissist, has over 20+ years of experience, is an award-winning CCHT, wellness, and narcissistic recovery coach. Angela works with people globally to understand how a narcissist is not born; we create them. If we want to live in a world of peace and cooperation, we need to change the way we parent, treat each other, and stop being trauma ignorant.
The Undetected Narcissist Podcast
When Infatuation Masquerades as Love
Have you ever confused intense infatuation with genuine love? That overwhelming, all-consuming feeling that makes you believe you've found "the one" might actually be limerence – a psychological state of obsessive attachment that mimics love but lacks its substance and stability.
In this transformative episode, Angela Meyer untangles the complex web of misconceptions surrounding love, particularly for survivors of narcissistic relationships. With compassion and clarity, she distinguishes between the addictive high of limerence (complete with intrusive thoughts, idealization, and emotional volatility) and the steady warmth of authentic love (characterized by mutual respect, freedom, and consistency).
Drawing from her expertise as a mental health professional and her personal journey of healing, Angela introduces a powerful metaphor – The Garden of Many Doors – that reimagines boundaries not as walls that close us off, but as doorways that protect our hearts while still allowing connection. This fresh perspective helps listeners understand that unconditional love doesn't mean unlimited access; it means loving with wisdom and discernment.
The episode weaves together psychological insights with touching personal stories, including how Angela learned about unconditional love by watching a mother cat care for her kittens. This seemingly simple observation became a profound template for understanding what genuine nurturing looks like – something many survivors of toxic relationships never experienced growing up.
Whether you're healing from narcissistic abuse, questioning your current relationship, or seeking to build healthier connections, this episode offers a roadmap for transforming how you give and receive love. Visit undetectednarcissist.com for the supporting blog post with additional healing resources.
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Website: https://www.undetectednarcissist.com
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Welcome to Season 4 of the Undetected Narcissist Podcast. Your host, angela Meyer, is here to bring you clarity if you are stuck in confusion, self-doubt or feel lost, without a sense of direction. This podcast is extremely different because Angela comes from a place of wisdom, compassion and has been able to forgive the unforgivable. She's a mental health professional, trauma-informed human consciousness guide and empowerment strategist. She knows one can't truly heal and recover when one is stuck in hate, anger and fear. One must rise above it, find meaning, understanding, compassion for oneself and the toxic people within our lives. This season is about self-empowerment, self-realizations and transformation. There is always a blog post supporting this information, so please visit undetectednarcissistcom so get ready to learn about yourself, others and find a way to truly live and thrive. Once again, enjoy the show.
Speaker 2:Hello Obi-Wan and welcome back to another episode of the Undetected Narcissist. Today I'm going to be discussing misconceptions of love. Earlier today I was speaking to a young man about the misconceptions of love, and earlier today I was speaking to a young man about the misconceptions of love. He still struggles with the concept that there are many different layers and levels of love. People get so caught up in this misconception of what love means to them that love can look as if it's black and white. It does not represent freedom and it of course has conditions. Yet the love I know and follow is limitless and unconditional. There are moments when I use myself many times as examples to get my point across. I let this young man know that, even though I still love a specific family member differently, I have just learned to set healthy boundaries with them and no longer allow their personality traits to trigger or offend me. I can stay neutral and still love them because I have zero expectations, conditions or attachments. Some people might still be confused, but I'm describing the evolution of love from ego-bound expectation to soul-level freedom. It's a deeply important teaching that some people can grasp and others cannot. Like this young man, many people are still learning to distinguish between conditional love, which seeks to possess or control, and unconditional love, which liberates and transforms Love and Infatuation.
Speaker 2:Since this is a podcast about narcissism and toxic people, I need to unpack limerence, infatuation and love. I need to unpack limerence, infatuation and love. Most of us have never experienced healthy love because the narcissist or toxic person knows how to trap us easily with addicted love. Limerence and love are both powerful and intense. Falling in love can seem like a powerful emotional roller coaster experience that often intertwines and confuses us. Sometimes we can second guess or ask ourselves is this really love? Is this genuine or fake? Am I being love bombed again? Can you see the confusion? We think or believe we are in a healthy romantic relationship, yet still don't fully comprehend the difference between love and infatuation. Romantic obsessions can disguise themselves as passion, when in fact it is limerence in disguise. So let's unpack this subject to give everyone a better understanding, so we will not fall into another trap and give up on finding love again.
Speaker 2:Limerence versus love. Have you ever met someone and immediately began to feel this intense, obsessive infatuation towards the other person? You can't stop thinking about them. You might have intrusive thoughts, you start to fantasize about this person and have an intense longing for them. Some people can even begin to idolize this complete stranger. Or has anyone done this to you? It can either be creepy or flattering. Either way, it's not healthy. Love is the complete opposite, because genuine love tends to build over time and it is a slow burn. Limerence is the exact opposite. It is sudden, smoldering, hot, all-consuming and can trigger all your good and bad buttons. We can even lose our sense of self because we are so hyper-fixed on this person. Celebrities often experience limericks. When they meet someone like they say oh I'm your favorite fan.
Speaker 2:In the past I've spoken about attachment styles and how important having a secure attachment in a relationship is, so important Research has been able to track the origin of limerence to unmet emotional needs and unresolved childhood trauma. For example, if you grew up in a home with inconsistent or emotionally distant caregivers, you can develop a heightened desire for connection with another person. You seek and crave this intense emotional dependency to be loved. As you grow from a teenager into an adult, you seek what you never got growing up. But limerence is not love but infatuation. If you recall, I addressed this concept in the blog post and podcast about why people cheat. A person struggling with limerence will seek validation and fulfillment through an intense attachment to another person's life. I will be transparent here. I think all teenagers struggle with limerence. Some people grow out of it and others do not. Our environment and culture can also play a significant role as well. Therefore, I want to share the two sides of limerence versus love.
Speaker 2:First, I will unpack limerence Signs and characteristics of limerence Intrusive thoughts and idealizing caries. Intense, obsessive infatuation. The person cannot do anything wrong and you idolize them. You could be manipulated into doing things outside your comfort zone to please and appease this person. Next one you are overwhelmingly preoccupied with and fantasizing about this person. You will not be satisfied until you have them completely. It is like a craving that can never be fully satisfied until the other person submits or gives in.
Speaker 2:Next one the obsessed person can fall into the trap of needing to control the other person submits or gives in. The obsessed person can fall into the trap of needing to control the other person, manipulating them, engaging in power dynamic struggles and having unrealistic expectations. For example, one guy who was so into me and thought I would be moving into his place next month I was like that's never going to happen. But he was such a firm believer, oh yes, it's gonna. No, it never did. On to the next. There is a tendency to idolize the other person while disregarding their flaws and negative traits. When this happens, you can get blindsided easily when reality kicks you to the curb. Next, the pattern of limerence can be short-lived and may fade once the initial infatuation wanes, especially if the need for validation and self-fulfillment has been achieved. For example, once the obsessed person gets you into bed, they turn around and ghost you.
Speaker 2:Next, one Limerous is associated with heightened emotional volatility. This means their feelings are extreme and hard to control. The person can burst into yelling, crying or acting out because they do not know how to manage or control their emotions. Their emotions feel too big to handle, which can be extremely scary on the receiving end. Next, there can be mistrust, jealousy, insecurities, and the other person can be dishonest. Next one the person can have an anxious attachment style or a disorganized attachment style.
Speaker 2:Next, infatuation is about taking, not giving. It is immediate and quick, which burns out quickly. Next, the person is selfish and looks after their interests. They are building a surface relationship, not a deep and caring relationship. Next, the relationship is based on a physical attraction and less on truly forming an emotional relationship with you. And the last one.
Speaker 2:The intense focus on the object of affection can lead to neglect and other vital areas of one's life, such as work, friendships, family and personal and professional goals. This tunnel vision can result in a sense of imbalance and a loss of self-identity. Others can see the dramatic changes in you, but you cannot recognize the unhealthy changes within yourself Signs and characteristics of genuine love and affection. Love is about giving and taking. Some people have a hard time taking and receiving love after experiencing narcissistic abuse. Why we question if it is real. That is why we should take our time to see if it's fake or for real. Being love-bombed felt great, but it creates this fear around the aspect of falling in love again.
Speaker 2:Love is slow. It's a slow fire that builds and burns over time. Each person shows concern for the other, respects boundaries and can be vulnerable and honest. You feel safe and secure with this person. They foster trust and show a commitment towards one another. Love is stable and genuine. The person can show genuine care, empathy and stability. Love is full of mutual respect, emotional intimacy and kindness. With love, there is a genuine emotional connection. Love is open-hearted. With genuine love, one can share experiences without judgment or shame. Love makes you feel 100% safe. Love makes you feel 100% safe. Genuine love allows you to be vulnerable and know you are safe and secure. This person is here to support you, not leave you.
Speaker 2:When life gets difficult, love will agree to disagree. Love accepts everyone's differences and opinions on various subject matters. Love allows freedom. Love is not jealous, demanding, rigid or controlling. Your partner can spend time with friends and family, with or without you, and vice versa. There are no guilt trip games or interrogations before and after. There is respect and trust. Love allows personal space. Some people need more personal space than others. Love respects and honors the time a person needs for their mental, emotional and spiritual well-being. Love compromises when work gets demanding. Love is understanding and patient. Love lets you be your authentic self.
Speaker 2:This is one of my favorites. If you cannot be genuine around the person you love, you are missing out on all the crazy, fun aspects of life. Here are some bold and wild truths. We all pass gas and some farts do not smell like roses. When I laugh, sometimes I snort. My mom would sneeze and fart at the same time. I love to dance, sing in my car, talk to animals and start conversations with strangers. Some people will think I am strange, but I don't care. My husband finds me fascinating. He would never do those things, but he loves me for it, so you shouldn't care either. Be wild, silly, your adventurous self.
Speaker 2:And last one love is consistent. When you are sick, you lose your job or get into a disagreement, genuine love is still consistent. You could be barfing in the toilet and your partner still loves you unconditionally. We've all been there. Well, hopefully and hopefully not, partner still loves you unconditionally. So both limerits and love involve intense emotions. We all want to be desired and to feel attraction for the other person. Both can bring excitement, passion and a sense of connection. It is just learning to recognize the signs, because both stem from a desire for emotional closeness and intimacy. The problem is that one person is seen as an object of affection and the other is seen as an object to conquer and possess. Both can influence behaviors in a positive and unhealthy manner.
Speaker 2:Limerence is primarily fueled by the desire for validation and the need to alleviate internal insecurities. It is the complete opposite of genuine emotional intimacy and connection. Opposite of genuine emotional intimacy and connection. Now, if you recall in the episode about why people cheat, I discussed adrenaline junkies. When someone has experienced limerence, the brain will release a surge of neurotransmitters, including dopamine and serotonin. These chemicals create the euphoric feeling. This euphoric feeling is similar to the rush of a drug, which can be highly addictive because it is about conquest. That is why, when someone is in the cycle of obsession and longing for another, this addictive, false sense of love can be challenging to break free from. Your body and brain are addicted to the high more than the person. You are infatuated with the Many Facets of Love.
Speaker 2:Now that we have unpacked limerence, some might still wonder about love's many facets. I like to think of it as the yin and the yang, with all the intense infatuations masked as love. People can still be confused because love is multifaceted, emotional, encompassing various experiences and behaviors. We can and do love the people in our lives differently. We can love a person and still not like their actions, lack of actions, personality, behaviors or beliefs. This is common when family dynamics are involved.
Speaker 2:Over the years, as a mental health professional, I've realized with age that love can be classified into different types, such as romantic love, which is passion, attraction and a desire for physical and emotional closeness. There's family love, which can bring about a sense of responsibility, care and support for one another. Responsibility, care and support for one another. There's love for a partner or spouse, your grandparents or relative, love for a child, love for a toy or personal object, love of your parents or your siblings. There's platonic love. There's love for an animal, love for a friend, love for music, cooking, sports, hobbies, love for mother earth, love for a co-worker, a teacher, love for religion or spiritual enlightenment and love for having a deeper relationship with ourselves, the many faces of love involving into a higher truth.
Speaker 2:Most of us are taught to believe that love is one thing, a singular, all-consuming force that either exists or doesn't. We are conditioned to see love as black and white, on or off, earned or withdrawn. But love in its true essence is far more nuanced and multi-dimensional than that. It's not a single color, it's a whole spectrum. There are layers of love, energetic frequencies. Some love is rooted in need, habit and fear of loss. Other love is rooted in freedom, in presence, in deep reverence for the soul of another, even when we don't understand them, agree with them or choose to be close to them.
Speaker 2:Unconditional love does not mean unlimited access. It does not mean tolerating harm or chaos in the name of quote keeping the peace. What it truly means is being able to see someone as a whole, even when they are acting from their wounds. It means choosing to love without trying to change, fix or manage the other person's journey. It is love without strings, love without needing the other person to behave a certain way in order for your heart to stay open. Setting a boundary is not the opposite of love. It's an expression of it. Sometimes, the most loving thing you can do is release someone from your expectations, your inner battlefield and your need to be seen or understood by them. You create sacred space by honoring their path. Therefore, you protect your peace and still you love. Unconditional.
Speaker 2:Love is not an emotion, it is a state of being. It is the highest octave of truth we can embody in this world. When we do, we stop needing love to look a certain way and begin to trust that real love always frees, never binds Love in layers. Most people have been taught to believe that love is one-dimensional. It's either there or it's not. You're either in or you're out of it. But this idea, this narrow definition of love, is what creates so much confusion, disappointment and heartbreak in our relationships.
Speaker 2:Love as I know it, as I live, it, is layered. It has depth, texture, vibration. It is not black and white, it's an entire spectrum of consciousness. Some love feels warm and safe, like a soft blanket in winter. In contrast, other forms of love can feel like lightning, chaotic, awakening, intense. Some love is familiar, based on shared history or bloodline, and some love is divine, boundless, unshakable, without expectation or need. This is the kind of love I've come to understand as unconditional.
Speaker 2:Unconditional love is not an emotion, it is a state of being, a choice, a frequency you hold, not because someone has earned it, but because you've remembered who you are. It's the kind of love that doesn't demand anyone to be different from what they are. In fact, it doesn't require agreement, closeness or even understanding. It simply is. It stands firm like a mountain, unmovable by the storms of ego and personality. This is why I can say with peace in my heart yes, I love my children differently. I love my friends, my animals, my land differently, but not less, not more, just purely and with presence. And part of that difference comes from how I relate to them, what they mirror back to me and what I've learned to let go along the way.
Speaker 2:There was a time when love meant attachment, when love meant sacrifice, when love meant crossing my own boundaries to keep the peace. That's not love, that's conditioning, that's fear dressed in affection. Now love looks like honoring myself and others. It looks like setting boundaries, not because I don't love you, but because I do and I love me too. It means I don't need to fix you, save you or convince you of anything. I trust your soul's journey and I trust mine. Therefore, I no longer carry the burden of needing love to look a certain way. I no longer need it to be mirrored perfectly back to me in order to validate my giving. When I say I love you, I mean I see your soul and I let you be exactly who you are. That is the most radical love of all.
Speaker 2:So if you're struggling with love, feeling too complicated, too messy or too conditional, pause, feel into your own heart. Ask yourself what kind of love am I offering? Is it rooted in fear, control or unhealed expectations, or is it free, vast and unconditional? You are not here to earn love, you are here to become it, and when you do I'm smiling. I hope you can tell when you do you embody love as a state of being. You will start to recognize its many layers and languages. There will come a time when you will stop asking love to look a certain way, because you will feel it everywhere, even in silence, in distance and even in goodbye. That, my friends, is real love and it is the path to a higher state of consciousness. Was that deep? Did it move you? I hope so. As you know, I love metaphor stories, so today I want to share a metaphor story that shows why boundaries are essential. When dealing with individuals who do not share or value have the same values or morals. You can still love them. Over time, you realize we no longer need walls guarding and protecting our hearts, but doors. So here we go, the Garden of Many Doors.
Speaker 2:There once was a woman who lived in a vast and beautiful garden. The garden had no walls, no fences, only winding paths, tall trees and the sound of wind moving like breath through the leaves. She called it the garden of love. Each time someone entered her life, she welcomed them into her garden with open arms. She would lead them to the innermost part, where the most fragrant flowers bloomed and the warmest sunlight touched the earth. She offered them her favorite fruit, her gentlest shade and a place by the fire of her heart. But not everyone who entered her garden treated it with reverence. Some trampled upon the soil not knowing how sacred it was. Others picked the flowers without asking and left without looking back. And some returned again and again, not because they cherished the garden but because they believed they owned a piece of it.
Speaker 2:The woman was confused. She thought love meant offering everything, no matter what. She thought love was all access, all forgiveness, all giving. But the garden began to wither. The fire in her chest flickered low. One day she sat at the center of her land and asked the wind what am I doing wrong? The wind replied you are not here to close your heart, but you must learn that not all who enter are meant to stay at the center. So the woman began to build doors, not walls, just doors. Each path in her garden now had a door with a sign Welcome traveler. Walk with care. You will be met in love according to your own readiness to receive it. She didn't turn anyone away, but she no longer led everyone to the sacred center. Some were greeted at the outer edge where wildflowers still grew, others were invited to sit by a tree, not the fire, and a few, a rare few, who knew how to honor the soil, were welcomed all the way in. She loved them all, but she loved them differently. She loved from a place of clarity, not confusion. She loved without abandoning herself and something miraculous happened the garden bloomed again. Because love, she realized, isn't about how much you give away. It's about how consciously you give it, without conditions, but with wisdom.
Speaker 2:Now I have some journal prompts or things to practice for you listeners. And if you struggle with that story, like you immediately want someone to get in the center of your BFF circle I'm an image on the blog post that talks about the center is for individuals. There's your best friend. Then it goes out even further. There's a close friend, a great friend, just a general friend, a casual friend, an acquaintance, someone that's a reference. You can reference them. There's many different layers of friendships.
Speaker 2:So who in your life has been trampling and disrespecting your sacred space within your heart? Ask yourself that question who? Who has it? Have you set any doorways that symbolize boundaries and if not, why? Okay, if you do have someone in mind, I want to offer a healing ritual. Write a letter to that person who's been trampling and disrespecting your heart. Express your feelings and decide whether this person stands in the seven layers of friendship where they stand. And don't get me wrong, you can also do this for family members too. When you're done writing that letter to the person, thank it, Just thank the letter. You're thanking the energy that you just exuded out onto that paper. Put the letter in an envelope and write the person's name on the front of the envelope. Then, symbolically, you can burn it, bury it or tear the letter as a conscious release and affirm to yourself this out loud this is an affirmation to anchor in and you can put your hand on your heart when you say this, because it actually is for your heart.
Speaker 2:I honor my heart and the walls I have built to survive. I choose now to dismantle my walls and to replace them with doorways, not just to protect myself but my heart. I will love again in stages as trust and mutual respect are re-established, with courage and compassion. I not only do this for myself, but for you. I am safe to expand, learn and grow. I am safe as I establish doorways within my heart. Yes, I am free to be me, modeling Unconditional Love.
Speaker 2:This is a deep subject and the truth is many of us never had unconditional love. This is a deep subject and the truth is many of us never had unconditional love modeled to us growing up. If you did, you are a rare and lucky one. I didn't, but I did learn what unconditional love looks like and would feel like, not from a human but an animal. So let me share a story from my childhood that shaped my understanding of love and maybe it will resonate with you too.
Speaker 2:I was seven or eight years old. The most impactful time I witnessed unconditional love model to me growing up was watching a mother cat take care of her newborn kittens. As a little girl, I admired her patience, kindness, comfort, warmth and nurturing presence. She was so gentle with them and tender. When they fussed about, these tiny fluff balls could tumble into fierce kitten battles and then curl up together like nothing had ever happened. That's forgiveness in action. We all know animals are so forgiving and can experience trauma. With the right person and tender, loving care, these animals eventually let down their walls and create doorways for us to unlock over time, creating a bond that is so strong and powerful. That bond was built on patience, kindness, forgiveness and the kind of unconditional love we often forget exists.
Speaker 2:Have you ever witnessed birth of an animal or a child? Not on a screen, but in real life? It's amazing and I'm not talking about watching it on television. In real life it's so much more impactful why you are feeling the energy and vibration of all the juicy, fantastic frequencies. In 5D human consciousness. There is unconditional love, joy, pure happiness, celebration and the beauty of life from our Creator all wrapped up into one magnificent, energetic moment of creation. Sometimes there are no words for what one feels in that moment of pure grace and the gift of life being birthed before one's eyes. You have to take a deep sigh because it can take one's breath away when one is enveloped by pure, unconditional love and gratitude. Have you ever witnessed or experienced what I'm trying to describe? It is almost like one of those top 10 life experiences. Therefore, I would watch this mama cat care for her babies for hours and weeks. The joy I felt, her unconditional love, was intoxicating. Sometimes I wished and longed for that kind of love from another human being.
Speaker 2:I did my best, growing up, to emulate the state of being displaying unconditional love. At one point I thought it was impossible to find it in another, just like the woman in the metaphor story. I got hurt, abused and experienced trauma. So I shut down and built walls, like we all do, to survive and stay safe. So as I got older and wiser, I realized I was happier when I let go of all my expectations about others and eventually myself. I had to accept that my parents could never give me what my heart desired, but animals, music, cooking, dancing and nature could. So I made a choice to dismantle the walls I built and replace them with doorways opening for love to walk through. Setting healthy boundaries was vital and of course, I got a lot of pushback.
Speaker 2:Unconditional love and acceptance became my path to healing from narcissistic abuse. Was it easy? Hell no. There were people I longed to see pay for what they did to me. I wanted justice and I wanted them to suffer the way I did. Can anyone relate? It is hard to turn the other cheek when someone begs you to snap or intentionally smears and ruins your entire life, taking away everything you love and hold high in value. If you read my book, you know what I mean. Being able to forgive my father for his relentless abuse against me was not easy. I did it for me, not him. I decided that I no longer wanted to live with resentment, bitterness, judgment and a victim mindset.
Speaker 2:As time passed, I realized that I had to love myself first if I wanted to experience true happiness again. I had to rise above it all, and the truth is I've come a long way. Therefore, as far as I have come along this journey of becoming light and love again, I have been my most excellent client in recovering from narcissistic abuse. Once my past no longer influenced my future, I was truly free. I returned to what I desired to become, just like that nurturing mama cat. And you know what? In a way, I have become that mama cat. Oddly enough, someone asked about me, and the person who described me said that I was nurturing like a mother who makes you feel warm, accepted, heard, seen and understood. Who was Really. Who was your mama cat? The one who showed you what love could look like, even only if it was for a moment? Who was that person for you? When you know who that person is, honor them today. That was a gift they gave you and that's a beautiful gift. Therefore, that mama cat was my teacher of unconditional love. Sounds strange, but it's true and I'm so darn proud of it. That is why I am the cat whisperer and owner of a few spoiled cats.
Speaker 2:Closing thoughts on misconception is love. So many of us have spent our lives searching for that kind of love, the kind we saw in a mother cat's gentle touch, or maybe in a song, a sunset or a quiet moment where we felt safe, just being ourselves. We search for it in others, hoping someone will cradle our wounds with patience, see our mess and still stay. But what if the invitation all along was to become that kind of love? What if we are the ones meant to embody it Strong, soft and unwavering, like the mama cat tending to the wild wounded parts within us and others? That kind of love doesn't just heal, it transforms, and maybe, just maybe, when we stop chasing it, we start living it. So if no one told you today, you are worthy of that kind of love and even more than that, you are capable of giving it, you are. So until next time, in love and light. Angela Meyer and Keri Logan Bye.