SEO Podcast The Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing

Building Trust and Recognition: Advanced Multi-Channel Marketing Techniques with RJ Schultz

• bestseopodcast.com • Episode 628

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Unlock the secrets of multi-channel marketing with RJ Schultz from Blip Billboards. Learn how to engage audiences across platforms and build trust using Google's 7-11-4 rule: seven hours of interaction, 11 touchpoints, and four platforms. Discover the power of long-form content like podcasts to foster relationships and brand loyalty.

RJ shares insights on blending digital and traditional strategies, showcasing full-funnel marketing's psychological and strategic advantages. Explore case studies, including McDonald’s success in pairing digital ads with billboards for cohesive brand experiences.

This episode emphasizes understanding your Ideal Customer Profile (ICP) to target audiences effectively in both digital and physical spaces. We highlight the importance of a 90-day advertising commitment and a balanced budget to achieve impactful results. From marketing psychology to actionable Blip Billboards strategies, gain valuable tips for businesses of all sizes to boost brand recognition and consumer engagement.
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Guest Contact Information: 

- https://offers.blipbillboards.com/podcast 

- https://www.linkedin.com/in/schultzrj/

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The Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing podcast is a podcast hosted by Internet marketing expert Matthew Bertram. The show provides insights and advice on digital marketing, SEO, and online business. 

Topics covered include keyword research, content optimization, link building, local SEO, and more. The show also features interviews with industry leaders and experts who share their experiences and tips. 

Additionally, Matt shares his own experiences and strategies, as well as his own successes and failures, to help listeners learn from his experiences and apply the same principles to their businesses. The show is designed to help entrepreneurs and business owners become successful online and get the most out of their digital marketing efforts.

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Speaker 1:

Howdy. Welcome back to another fun-filled episode of the Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing. I am your host, matt Bertram. For those of you watching, matthewbertramcom is what I'll get launched next year as far as the coaching program going, and also I'm going to be having some new handles come out. Any of you watching still see the old podcast cover. So we do have a new podcast cover, so be looking out for that. I didn't really want my face so big on it, but it is on there. Look for internet marketing real big if you're looking for it or if you haven't been listening in a while. But we're going to be rock and rolling next year. We're going to have a lot of stuff going, if you see it. Internetmarketingsecretscom Internet Marketing Secrets hashtag is where we're going to be found starting next year. Got a great guest for you today to continue the conversation on the degradation of and changes in click volume online. How you have to be other places. I got RJ Schultz with me here from Blip Billboards. Hey RJ, how are you doing buddy?

Speaker 2:

Doing well, Matt. It's good to be here.

Speaker 1:

You know, one of the things that we were talking about was that rule that Google came out with the 7-11-4 rule. Right, and really anybody that's been in digital marketing for a while knows you know seven times people got to hear your information. I think with the proliferation of ads everywhere, uh, that number's probably gone up quite a bit. Um, actually 11,. So sorry, 11, but seven hours, and I've talked about that a lot on this podcast and that's why I really believe in long form content. Um, is someone's got to consume seven hours of your content, okay, to to actually know, like and trust and do business with you, and one of the best ways to reach somebody doing that is through podcasting or long form content. But tell us a little bit about yourself. I love what your company's doing, I love how you're disrupting the space and we can start the conversation maybe with the 7-11-4 rule, okay.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, 7-11-4, I think it's the evolution of what we all heard growing up. Going to school People need to see you a bunch of times seven or eight times before they're ready to decide to choose you. Google put some research into this a year and a half ago and published what they call 7-11-4. Year and a half ago, and published what they call 7-11-4. And seven hours. Like you mentioned, 11 interactions across those seven hours, and most effective when those interactions happen across four different platforms. And so that's really what we at Blip have been teaching our clients or our users to implement in their full funnel marketing. It's like you've got to get to where your target audience is and be part of their daily life. You need to be giving them content that helps them feel better at their jobs, and connecting 11 times over seven hours in four different places, and we found that, as we took that approach, like we just started to see all the key metrics.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean that speaks so much to what we've been also doing internally, like so we've known right that you know 7-11 touch points, like I think, 11. Yeah, that's about the right number. I think it's maybe even a little bit higher. The seven hours we've been talking about that. I put that in my book, like years ago Build your Brand Mania how do you reach that? What's the most effective way to reach that number? Even in no like trust, I talk about that.

Speaker 1:

The four different channels. That's something we've seen. We've seen AdWords not work very effectively. I think it's oversaturated, especially since COVID. We've pushed people out to Bing, duckduckgo, which is pretty easy. You got AI and AI chat happening, but we've really pushed out our clients to run branded campaigns, visibility campaigns on multiple channels and kind of spraying that out, kind of blue ocean strategy strategy. We're seeing that too. When people are hearing you on multiple channels, that comes together. So this study I'm going to put that link in the show notes for everybody too, because we follow the EAT metric as well that Google put out there the expertise, authority, trust. They add the experience component to that, and so I just love that. Tell me a little bit about your background. I know we were talking about some veteran stuff before this as well. How did you come to this evolution with Lip?

Speaker 2:

Great question, man. I am absolutely a business transplant. I never thought that I'd be starting companies or running companies or working in companies at all. I spent the first part of my professional life in the government and I thought that that might be where I spend my whole life. So I went to undergrad and studied aeronautical science concurrently, got a pilot's license and then joined out of school. I joined an intelligence program that was affiliated with the Army the US Army and went straight into three years of training and so for three years, like I was absent and I emerged 26, 27 years old, still never having even worked a real job you know what I mean Just so far from the wisdom of the world, so to speak and went operational and had a lot of fun. I got to see some of the world that I wouldn't have seen otherwise, and even over the past couple of years it's been cool to see some of those same places but through a different lens, like as a tourist or, you know, for this type of work. And it's been a lot of fun.

Speaker 2:

But I started having kids and decided that that is not where I wanted to be long term. In fact, when my first son was three, I was home. I was gone a lot, but I was home and we were playing like cars on the floor. He's like, dad, this is fun. And I'm like, yeah, buddy, I think so too, man, this is great. And he's like next time I want to do it at your house. I was like, oh man, like my son doesn't even think I live here, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2:

And so that that truly was the impetus for me to start looking beyond government work and I just went straight to, like the Google search bar and I was like what's next? What can I do? What do people who leave this line of work end up pursuing? And I settled on business school and so went to business school and during business school well, actually in the government I applied to a program called, like McKinsey and Companies Emerging Scholars and I became a semi-finalist there and so got onto campus and continued into those activities and thought like, yeah, this is going to be great Once I get there. I'm like this is not going to be great. This is absolutely not what I want to do. Like no way, this is just another place to. Well, I mean, I won't disparage that publicly, because it's a fantastic route. You know consulting is a fantastic route, but I really got.

Speaker 2:

I became enamored with the idea of starting and working on new ventures through some classes I was taking, and so after that I went after school, I went to Amazon in Seattle and worked on an emerging markets team, and that fed the beast a little bit more. And after a year or so, many of us were looking around thinking like why are we, why are we doing this for someone else, like let's go do this ourselves. And so I left Amazon for a younger company. I think I arrived at their Series B. So it was another educational couple of years for me to see a company grow from $20 million to $100 million plus. And I left that for Blip, which was even smaller, way smaller. And so that's been the evolution of things, and it's been a fun ride, that is for sure.

Speaker 1:

So so, to just educate everybody which I it was new to me as well. So so, blip is digital billboards where you can basically buy at certain times, like just fractionally, right, it's kind of like a fractional, like Uber of billboards, right, like? Tell me a little bit about it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and when I hear digital billboards and when you guys hear digital billboards, you're probably thinking the same thing. I thought when this job opportunity like came up, I'm like billboards, like where's the time machine to take me back to the 50s, like I do not want to spend my career around this medium. But you're right, it's an uber style marketplace, right, and so it's best understood. Using uber as a proxy you got, uber is a scheduling algorithm. It's an Uber-style marketplace, right, and so it's best understood. Using Uber as a proxy You've got Uber as a scheduling algorithm.

Speaker 2:

It's a piece of technology in a two-sided marketplace. It sits between car owners and car riders, but Uber does not ride, they do not own cars. We're the same. We're a scheduling algorithm that sits between board owners, billboards, car toppers, wall scapes, whatever and people who advertise. And we don't own billboards and we don't advertise. We just connect the two through an open exchange. So the value proposition is you know, with Uber you can get a $15 ride from the airport instead of a $50,000 car that you're now stuck with. With us, you can pay whatever you want to pay for a week advertising in Times Square instead of figuring out who owns that board and then going on to a multi-year contract and spending millions of dollars to get into Times Square. So it's a lot more control with the spend that you have and the big value is it allows us SMBs to play in out of home, because before we don't have the runway, the purse, the budget to accept these big contracts as part of our marketing expense.

Speaker 1:

Well, yeah, we were talking about like conferences, right, like all the different billboards when you, when someone gets off a plane, off of like certain routes, right, like to be so nimble to be able to be at the right time to reach the right people when you have the density that you're looking for, or different kinds of events. I mean, is it tell me a little bit about like use cases as well as like, is it a a bid auction? Like how, how does it work?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so it's the second place bid auction. Use cases are really interesting Interesting for us in particular because it's not something that we went out and championed. We just kind of put our heads down, built, went to work and then came up for air and started to look at the customer data to tell us what people were doing with it and it's like, oh my gosh, that's kind of cool. So you have everything from a proud parent who wants to tell the small town they live in that their son or daughter just graduated high school and they'll leave that up for a week. We've got an interesting use case is musicians, mainly rappers. You know they'll plot their tour locations, their tour map, and then they'll buy up billboards in those cities a month prior and they'll just pepper their tour path for ticket sales. Right, and, like you mentioned, it gives them that control, that geo control over locations, which is something people find a lot of value in and we see used pretty widely. You got use cases like that all the way up to um.

Speaker 1:

you know berkshire hathaway and you know keller williams, these big real estate groups who have multiple locations all over and need to shift focus from one place to the other for whatever reason, and amazon prime that spends a ton of money um so well, I mean I just like the democratization, okay, of of now you have these media channels that you can reach people, that before you might have to have a huge budget to be able to do it, and, uh, huge relationships, huge contracts to reach these people. I mean they're they're opening up um disney plus and amazon and netflix, all these bid auction places, right, so you can build a strategy where you're hitting those multiple touch points and staying in front of people. I think that digital billboards a lot of times when I think about it, I think about like, well, that's what display ads are, right, like digital billboards chasing around on your phone. You're talking about digital billboards, like on billboards, like out there, like anything that's digital, that you see it changing. Yeah, how, how do you connect that whole network? Right, so that that's what you're doing. You're bringing that together and collecting that inventory.

Speaker 1:

I think it's just a phenomenal way to get more reach. I mean the world today, with even social media and how TikTok changed the algorithm. I mean one post, you can reach millions of people, right, you can. A post in Reddit is bigger than a traditional press release. Right Now you're able to incorporate that traditional like if they're not on their phone they're walking around looking at something, and the more digital billboards there are, the more you can kind of build out what that experience is right. And so I think that there's a lot, there's gonna be a lot of evolution of this, of even like VR and like everything connecting, I guess, and how augmented reality that's where I was going, sorry, I was like VR is like really augmented reality and Google Glasses and like how everything's gonna be an experience and even like what I'm seeing in the art is digital billboards.

Speaker 1:

Big digital billboards are part of it all, and if you have access to reach people in that way and you need to touch them on multiple touch points multiple times, like this should be a tool in everyone's arsenal is really the way I thought about it. And when I saw what you were doing and military background and everything, I was like let's talk, like tell me more about it. I mean what? Can you share any interesting insights into some of the data? Maybe expound upon the 7-Eleven 4 rule with Google, like how are you seeing it pulled through and how are you seeing people use maybe multimedia like, or different channels, what's their marketing mix and how they're incorporating this into it? I just really wanna hear kind of use cases, because I just think it's super fascinating Like smart marketing, right, like let's talk about smart marketing, you know.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely. I think the message, you know the answer to all that is a few fold, and then I'll break these down. It's like people need to be conditioned before they're ready to choose you. They need to know something and they need to feel something, and those somethings are pretty defined by the interested parties, right? So people need to know something, they need to feel something, and the question for a marketer whose job is to drive demand is like, how do I most effectively move a person from unaware along that path to knowing something and feeling something such that they're ready to purchase? And I think the key is to point appropriate advertising mediums at them, depending on where they are along that 7-11-4, you know pathway or journey to you, right? And so that's what I think it is and that's what we call smart marketing. Right? What's the most efficient and effective way to condition your audience or to develop your audience, to get what's called qualified impressions? And we push that smart marketing centers on this concept of qualified impressions. Qi. This is something. It's a proprietary term. It's something that we've been using internally, because one thing we struggled with early on was convincing people to choose billboards as part of their mix. The first objection is like no, I don't want to use billboards, I'm already using this. And we're always like we're not asking you to stop using that and start using billboards, we're asking you to make more effective or more efficient at the top of your funnel. To make more effective or more efficient at the top of your funnel.

Speaker 2:

My favorite study ever and I have to say I cannot find it anywhere on the internet anymore Like in 2020, I took some absent time. I'm still affiliated with the government and like a I own you reserve capacity type thing. So in 2020, I spent like nine months in Syria and when I came back, like this thing was gone. I could not find it anywhere. But before I left, I was just championing this thing and I remember the details well. So McDonald's launched a menu item in five cities. These were DMAs like Dallas, oklahoma City, that type of thing. They launched a menu item in five cities. In all five cities, they did six weeks of Facebook advertising. In four of the five cities they layered billboards on top of the Facebook for the same period, same six weeks, and those four cities combined to outperform in sales the control city by 729%. And that's the message we have. Right, utilize the full funnel marketing approach so that you can create those meaningful touch points for your target audience.

Speaker 2:

Because, like you mentioned degradation, like digital marketing, nothing I say is absolute right. Digital marketing in some ways is becoming degradated. It really is because you show an ad to someone five times, it doesn't know who you are yet and you're trying to develop them along that path of seven hours and 11 touch points and four different platforms. Well, if they don't know who you are yet and they swipe your ad away or they spend no time with it, they don't engage with it the algorithm is not likely to show it to that person again. So you are just wasting money, and a lot of times at a very high CPM $14 to $18 on Facebook, for example to no avail, right. And so, like, the whole message is use the full funnel.

Speaker 2:

I'm super interested in and we have a couple of professors at a few local universities, brigham Young University being the main one in Utah researching this for us Because it's like why did those four cities outperform the control city by 729%? And I am super interested in that because it brings into question the psychology of survival, which deals a lot with my background and essentially what we're saying there is when you are served an ad on your phone and you're like on the toilet or you're playing chess or you're scrolling Instagram or whatever you do on your phone, you're not in shot mode and you swipe that away. And very rarely do you tune in and like give it an honest look. But when you're confronted by a billboard for eight seconds, like it's forever and that was only two seconds, right?

Speaker 2:

You're forced to psychologically ingest colors, logos, maybe a couple of words, even if you're driving in a daze, right, you're forced to psychologically ingest those things. So the next time it surfaces on your phone, at the subconscious level, your fight or flight kicks in and says like, hey, matt, where you recognize these colors, this logo, this word, they're in the database. Do we need to dwell an extra second to see if it's a benefit or a threat? And the answer is physiologically yes, right. And so that's the differentiator, right there. And that's the importance of matching this medium out of home to everything else you're doing down funnel, matching this medium out of home to everything else you're doing down.

Speaker 1:

Funnel Dude, rj. This is just super interesting. Like I love the psychology talk of of the marketing component of it. I, I'm, I'm really fascinated. I, I, I would love to, when you find that study, send that through, or even the research that you find, because I'm, I'm, you know. Here's what I can tell you. I've run a lot of campaigns. The pushback I get is attribution right, like you know, like how do I?

Speaker 2:

convert.

Speaker 1:

I'm spending money on this. I got you know CMOs, I got you know business owners. Hey, like I'm spending money on this, like I want to know where that conversion is right and we're a big search marketing company and and Google is kind of like today is where people are going through some validation, but it they gets the attribution a lot because it's the last click okay, it's not the first click. That starts on social media, that starts on billboards, that starts somewhere else that the demand gets created. Right, and what I've seen on a lot of campaigns is like radio I've done a lot of radio stuff right, whether it be streaming radio, whether it be terrestrial radio, um, and and we see brand lift like heavy right, people are searching for the name. Google likes that right, they want to work with brands, they want to.

Speaker 1:

There's a trust factor associated with that. I like this fight or flight instinct. I have not gone down that rabbit hole enough and I would love to expand upon that and in our conversation. If you have more to add to that, I I can just tell you, I, when I look at, I look at the marketing channels we put together. What is the end goal? That I mean the attribution. It just should be like okay, like an average way to cross them all, whatever. But what is the result of what it's pushing, um, whether it be like you know, influence, um, whether it be like the bottom line sales, whatever it have you like, all of these things combined give you a multiplier effect and, and I like that, that you have to be confronted with something before you make a decision. I think that there's a trust component to that. When you see something on a billboard like, there's established like a feeling of like permanence right, that's a legit company that's up on that billboard.

Speaker 2:

You know what I?

Speaker 1:

mean.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

With ads. You can just see ads and I think to your point too, you can run that ad and hit that same person over and over again and they're just going to keep swiping away that this is not interesting to me. So you have to hit them at a different vertical, a different angle, with a different message to, to, to try to get it into their subconscious to actually like you know. That's why the taglines are so important to get them to actually open it, open the ad or or read beyond that, because they're hit with so much and and and. That's kind of what I uh gutly think some of it is is like man, there's some permanence associated with this, um, you know the like that that message might be a little bit different, um, but it approaches and hits them, like you said, at a different time of what they're doing. That that puts it in there Some conscious, in a different way, like. I love that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, phenomenal. I mean to anyone listening today. You don't say it out loud in your car or whatever, but like what do you read on a Chick-fil-A billboard? You know, right, eat more chicken. It's like the quintessential billboard campaign that does exactly what you're talking about, hits them from a different angle, stays in their mind, stays in their mind. It's very authoritative, it's very consistent and it's very trustworthy. But you know, billboards are just that and not to mention, relatively cheap, right, and you know if you broke down what the, what smart marketing looks like. It's like you think about this pathway with seven steps or 11 steps that people need to to stand on at one point in time to start building trust with you. It's like, how do you deliver those 11 meaningful touch points across this journey from when they don't know you to them? You know being ready to buy and billboards have their place, right? It's not just do billboards until they see you 11 times. It's like use out of home for awareness, maybe those first two, three, four impressions. Because's accessible, it's efficient and it's authoritative, right?

Speaker 2:

One thing we worry about with digital advertising Facebook meta, for example is like are our ads being served to people or to bot accounts? Because that's an expensive thing to just deal with, right. But with billboards, you can be sure that it's an actual set of eyes that's seeing that ad, right. So, first couple of impressions, billboards. Next couple of impressions maybe three, four, five, six, seven. Keep the billboards going and then start to mix in some of your own content, the stuff that you're doing online podcasts, things like that so that when people listen to a podcast or they're fed an online ad, they can start to make the connections with the things that they're seeing out on the freeway and out in the city, things like that. And then, once you're sure that a large percentage, large enough percentage, of some area has seen your ad six, seven times, yeah, be okay, layering in that expensive one-to-one digital call to action with a meta ad or the like. And so that's where we've tried to play in the last year and that's what we're rolling out.

Speaker 2:

What we've rolled out about six months ago is there are multiple brains at the decision table in any company, right, and one half of the table is like performance marketing, attribution. I need to know how many dollars we're putting in and how many dollars we're getting out, and that's a hard thing to prove with brand marketing with brand advertising right, and you'll see a lot of companies plateau. They'll stall because that mentality will prevail. It'll win the day and they'll pump more money into paid ads and they'll do things they can, they can track, because they want to show each other and they're bored like. This is our growth. You know what I mean. But you got brands that have figured it out liquid death locally kizik. You know some of these brands that everyone knows about um, because they're such good brand marketers, and so we've tried to determine how can we speak to both heads so that they can believe they can agree on something at that decision table. And that's where we came up with what we call QI qualified impressions.

Speaker 2:

It's going to be a disservice to force your marketers to try and bring you know one-to-one attribution to a billboard, right. But what we can do with government data, with GeoPath and all this stuff we know about our demographics and our cities in the United States. We can do with government data, with geopath and all this stuff we know about our demographics in our cities in the united states. We can run a statistical model that will say, with a relative degree of certainty this is how many people have seen your ad x number of times, based on the length of time your ad has been up, how many times you show it like, how much. You know how many boards are the same area, stuff like that, and so you can buy say a, a million impressions from a billboard company and they'll say, hey, yep, this has been seen a million times. Here's the proof that it's up on that board. And then you're done.

Speaker 2:

But with us we go two steps further to try and speak to both of those brains at the strategy table. Come by the million impressions and you know, say it's in salt lake city, that's, that's where we're headquartered. So I use that as an example. Say it's in Salt Lake City. We'll be able to say, hey, this is not a million people, this is two hundred and seventy two thousand people, nine thousand of whom have seen it one time, eleven thousand of whom have seen it twice, forty three thousand three times, and so on and so forth. And so we can produce this statistical like bell curve that shows, all right, a critical mass of people in this area have seen your ad more than four times. It's time to feel okay, layering on that expensive digital marketing, because they're primed, they know you, they're ready to go.

Speaker 2:

And then the third thing we can do in that same scenario for the same customer is to say, like, when we do have a critical mass of people who have seen you, you know, four or five times, we can help you by retargeting. So we'll put a geofence through a partner, put a geofence around either your store or our board, and then, anytime they drive through, we can shoot a mobile ad right to their device. And so this, this is our answer. This idea of qualified impressions is our answer to that.

Speaker 2:

Why can't I, you know, give proper attribution to billboards? Well, like, let's give us something we can track and measure, and that's a qualified impression. And so I'll end that little rant with a quick definition of what a qualified impression is. And a qualified impression is an impression delivered to someone who has seen you at least six times. If you deliver an impression to someone who's seen you once, twice, three times, four, five or six times, or four or five times, that's a general impression. But the impression becomes qualified once they've seen you six times, because now you can feel really good about the trust that you've started to build and really good about spending a little bit more on the digital front to convert these customers no, I love that.

Speaker 1:

I I mean the data I've seen is like when, anytime even you're running digital ads, you've got to wait about two weeks to see any kind of real like data, like you've got to hit them a few times to to let it soak into the psyche. You know, and one of the things that we we mentioned previously that I think is worth bringing up and I think this is a great time for the call, at least in in my journey. You know everything's. It's interesting because certain people are brought to you at different times, right, like you think it might be serendipitous, but there's probably like something to that.

Speaker 1:

But at the conference, the Brighton conference that I was at, the keynote speakers all talked about how click volume is going down and how you need to build a brand right and build it on other people's platforms, how you need to build a brand right and it's and build it on other people's platforms, build it everywhere you can, but build it in the, in the mind right Of of your target customer. It doesn't need to be on your now. Email does great, okay, email still crushes it Okay, and I think everybody said it was going to die for a long time, but a lot of people talk about hey, you got to build it on your own property. You never know how these social media platforms are going to change things. I mean, they're starting to become more like public utilities to a certain degree, um, and I think that they're going to be around and like any of the rules like are probably good for the whole and you should navigate around those, but you should be everywhere, right, you should be everywhere and you should be building um your brand in the uh, mind of the client and and it.

Speaker 1:

And it shouldn't matter on the click right, it shouldn't matter on the attribution, if you know that they're seeing it, because that is the issue. I mean, there's even companies out there that their whole job is they get a percentage of ad spend to get out all the bots, right, and this one company I was talking to you had to spend a million dollars and they charged 1% of the ad spend to basically get rid of all the bots. Well, if you have to spend at least a million dollars, how many of those clicks are bots versus?

Speaker 1:

real image, so, so.

Speaker 1:

So there's all these different components in this complex world on how to reach people, and the right answer is like all of them, I believe Right.

Speaker 1:

The right answer is like all of them, I believe Right, and this should be a tool in the tool belt and it really should be looking at.

Speaker 1:

Well, do you have enough budget, one to figure out how many channels you need to be on? Like, maybe talk to me a little bit about, for let's talk about a smaller company and a bigger company, maybe like, or give me like, a couple of scenarios how they might incorporate this is that add on strategy, right, like, not the sole strategy, but an add-on strategy to what they're doing digitally to expand their reach, to expand, um, you know, uh, uh, the customer base. Um, I, I've even seen data for some different kind of platforms and different kind of things. Some of these people, like you might not, you might be able to reach people on a billboard that aren't on social media, right, like, there's probably a data set of people that are not on some of these social media channels. That well, you're reaching them in the physical world, right, and so just kind of curious how you would structure something like that for big and small companies.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, good question. A lot of caveats here. So I'll start out by saying, like, everything I would recommend doing starts with who you're targeting, right. So really, really in-depth understanding of where your ICP lives. You know where they work, what they do, their hopes and dreams all that because your company, your brand, needs to become part of that world for them, Right. And so if in that research, you find that your ICP spends time on the road, spends time downtown or stuff like that, then billboards are an appropriate medium for you to add into the mix at the right, at the right time, Right.

Speaker 1:

Their target persona. You got to know your target persona and a lot of people just start marketing without even thinking through all that stuff. Yeah, absolutely. That is super critical.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely so in terms of spend, for, like a small company, we tell this to people all the time, like very, very bluntly up front, because the last thing we want is for someone to try us for a month and be like nothing happened. Well, I can tell you right now nothing is going to happen in a month. Right, you need to think about 90 days because you're saturating an area so that people see you multiple times. Right, you're trying to have that eat more chicken effect in one particular area so that people can just recall the taste of your product or the feeling they get when they use it or eat it or whatever it is. That that's what you're trying to affect, the type of change you're trying to affect.

Speaker 2:

Right, and so 90 days typically, pretty, typically pretty safe window and depending on the size of the city, like Salt Lake, for example, it needs to be between $3,000 and $5,000. That will get you 60% of the population in these DNAs, roughly 60% of the population to see you six times, and so that's just general rule of thumb. But we have tools. You give us your ICP, you tell us where you live and where you want to target and we'll run it through the tool, but generally it's like 3 to 5K a month for 90 days and you'll start seeing results.

Speaker 1:

Awesome, so I think this should be a tool in everyone's tool belt. I really thought what you're doing is fascinating. One stool belt. I really thought what you're doing is fascinating, so I'm so glad I had you on and could share you with the audience. Before we go like what is one unknown secret of internet marketing that you might not have shared, or if you want to repackage it in a different way, just say if someone is, like you know, wanting to take something away, what's the one biggest takeaway? I guess.

Speaker 2:

And I did share a little bit of this, so let me try and repackage it. But I think it's widely overlooked that even when we say we want to be the most creative company, we want to be in people's minds Like just listen to the language there, we, we, we, it's all about me, it's all about me, this is what I want to do. This is what I think. It's all about me, this is what I want to do. This is what I think, and I think the change that has not happened in companies who are struggling or plateauing is that that we needs to be changed to they right.

Speaker 2:

The takeaway is people need to be conditioned. They need to know something and feel something about you before they're ever ready to choose you. So let me say that a different way, that's not correct. I need to be as creative as possible and be everywhere they are so that they choose me. Like that's what we do. That is not right. People need to know something and feel something before they're ready to choose you. And so the question for all of us as marketers is like, how do I most effectively move these people along that development path of trust toward them being ready to choose me? And the key is to point appropriate advertising mediums at that. You know, at different stages of that path, and I think that's what we all miss. We start with us. We don't start with them nearly enough, even if we say we do like our actions truly do not start with them nearly enough man, I love the psychology.

Speaker 1:

Thank you so much, rj for for coming on the show. How do people find out more? Or or uh reach out to you? I know that we got a blip. Billboardscom is, uh, probably like one of the main ways. Um, how else might people find out more about what you're all this psychology that you're talking about, as well as like your services, because I'm I'm eating it up myself, so yeah, the website is the main place.

Speaker 2:

we have a blog there with some of these psychological rants, um, and we also will put in in the stuff that we send out here in conjunction with you, like a landing page connected to this podcast for anyone who wants to try this as part of their marketing mix. Right, we'll, you know. Offersblitbillboardscom forward slash podcast. Come and create a campaign and we'll match your spend 25% to get you started.

Speaker 1:

Well, everyone, I'll put those links in the show notes. If you want to create your own PSYOP um, psyop, uh, in the space, um, definitely reach out to to RJ. Um, thank you so much for coming on. If anybody really enjoyed this, please share it. Um, please follow, please subscribe. Uh, leave a review. All that interaction helps. Even leave a little emoji, um, or something like that. Uh, thank you so much. Thank you so much for listening. And if you want to grow your business with the largest, most powerful tool on the planet, the internet, reach out to EWR Digital for more revenue in your business. And until the next time, my name is Matt Bertram. Bye-bye for now.

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