Reimagining Sustainable Food Systems through Circular Economy with Sandra Vijn of Kipster

Our latest episode is with Sandra Vijn, US Managing Director of Kipster, which is dedicated to offering the first carbon-neutral egg by revolutionizing sustainable food production with circular economy. If you’ve ever wondered about circular economy and regenerative agriculture, this episode is for you! Sandra will provide an overview of circular economy- what it is and why it is important. We’ll dive to answer the age old question- when it comes to circularity, what comes first? The chicken or the egg? We conclude by making the business case for circularity and sharing how Kipster can serve as a model for other companies interested in reducing food loss and waste.

If you have an idea for an episode topic you’d like to see featured or if you would like to participate in an episode of USAID’s Kitchen Sink, please reach out to Nika Larian (nlarian@usaid.gov).

There’s no time to waste!

Transcript

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welcome to USAID's kitchen sink a food loss and waste podcast I'm your producer n laan 30 to 40% of the food that is produced is either lost or wasted contributing to a global food crisis with over 800 million going to bed hungry listen on on as USAID experts speak with researchers and development professionals to explore solutions to this critical issue that Demands a kitchen sink approach when it comes to climate food security and food system sustainability we have no time to waste thanks for tuning in to USAID's Kitchen Sink a food lost and waste podcast my name is Nika Larian senior food safety advisor and producer of the kitchen sink today I will be speaking with Sandra Vijn U.S. managing director of kipster which is dedicated to offering the first carbon neutral egg by revolutionizing sustainable food production with circular economy if you've ever wondered about circular economy and regenerative agriculture this is the episode for you and we'll dive into the age-old question when it comes to circularity what comes first the chicken or or the Egg thanks for joining us Sandra please introduce yourself thank you for having me Nika I'm happy to talk about circular farming systems and circular economy and how kipster is part of that so um just for background I grew up on a tulip farm in the Netherlands um and that really deeply influenced my passion for sustainability and also really put me on this path towards gibster um my father was actually a very small scale farmer uh who really relied on family and neighbors and and friends to do harvesting every year and so we were really on our knees and soil and feeling that connection to to the soil and everybody in our town farmed and produced food and so it was really um ingrained in me uh but it also really gave me insights into hard farming is the reality of farming the challenges that farmers are facing uh especially when it comes to poor soil Health heavy pesticide use trying to come by you know make it every year um I went to study food and business and international relations I worked at the dairy industry in the United States I worked at the World Wildlife Fund constantly looking like hey how can we produce food in more sustainable ways and um I also saw that a lot of projects that we were working on didn't make it really to the big scale um they didn't move Beyond pilot farming projects uh and to me they felt more like it was a tweak to the current system instead of really transforming it it was really focused on supporting the food systems with the majority of farmed animals in it and the majority of land that goes to feed animals uh while I think we really need to move to a more circular system um so when I really met rud Sanders the founder of kipster uh about 10 years ago he demonstrated to me that you can actually produce eggs in a sustain aable way with maximum animal welfare and economic viability while reducing the environment impacts through a circular farm system and that just intrigued me and so when kipster moved to the United States in uh two in 2022 I I really joined them and uh yeah happy I did well thank you for sharing some of your background and your Rich experiences in in this space and um I I also grew up in a heavy rural agricultural uh Community I'm from Kentucky so definitely appreciate the understanding of the challenges of farming but also the really great sense of community amongst Farmers um but even though we have horses I don't know a tulip farm in the Netherlands that's that's hard to beat uh but uh well we're happy to have you here today and and to learn more about kipster and while we've mentioned circularity and and talked about circular economy in previous episodes we haven't really taken a deep dive into this topic so I'm I'm hoping that you can start by talking about what does a circular economy actually mean and why does it matter for food loss and waste sure yeah to me this circularity and food system that is really circling the nutrients instead of having them leak out is such a big part of the future and it's missing currently from regenerative uh agriculture discussions and sustainable food discussions in general um we often hear that farmers in the Western countries are so efficient um we are best in producing really cheap food um but we always look at feed efficiency fertilizer efficiency um but then the question is are we really truly that efficient a circular farming model I would argue is more efficient because keep the nutrients cycling throughout the system instead of leaking out and creating pollution um so rutin kipster Founders actually designed the farm on this principle so when you take a step back and look at Food Systems in general over 70% of agricultural lands currently are just used to feed animals uh while they only produce like onethird of the calories to um to feed people um and also onethird of calories in the US is wasted right now and all that wasted food takes about like 30% of arable land 20% of fresh water um 30 to 40% of energy consumption so it is a lot of resources uh and greenhouse gas emissions that we um create and and resources that we throw away uh by wasting food um and within that food that's wasted you know there's nutrients uh like carbon carbohydrates proteins vitamin minerals they could all be brought back into the food system instead of leaking out as you know nitrogen and phosphorus that create pollution so you know you can really of course first food waste needs to be reduced and then whatever is left that can be eaten by people needs to be fed to people uh but then the second best step is really to feed animals with it animals can uh eat a lot of things that we cannot eat anymore or do not want to eat and upcycle that into value protein and nutrition for people um and so if you really look at that you know we can move a lot of animals uh from the land we can free up crop land to feed people directly with nutritious crops and then feed animals with the waste that's in a system that will always remain there like scraps and Peels and byproducts from from crop processing so of course some lands are not suitable to this like marginal land shouldn't be cropped and then you can put like dairy animals on it to to uh for them to maintain that grass and produce food for people um so that is actually the concept that we're using so you know we use our hands to um to eat byproducts from the system so that we can move away from the land and this really minimizes environmental impacts so um but only if you do it the way that we don't incentivize the creation of food waste of course the aim is still to reduce food waste but then match it to the animals to the amount of food waste that's in the system so that also means a significant reduction of animals in the system um and we are okay with that we are consuming way too much animal protein in the west like more than double that's recommended on a daily base so um if we actually would use this model we could still use 10 to 20 grams a day to uh to feel people with animal proteins um so it's not saying that we need to move away from animals alog together but take a significant St step back so um and especially as we headed to um insecure future regarding climate change and weather patterns and resource constraints as water and land um we think this is really needs to be part of the solution to to switch to a circular farming system definitely well thank you for setting the scene for us and and kind of laying the land of what what a circular economy could look like and I I appreciate the the beginning of your response and I think that's one of the great things about the this movement around food loss and waste and and bringing attention to it is really Shifting the conversation around agriculture from Simply being focused on productivity but to also think about efficiency and and I think you've really elaborated on that point um so now that we have an understanding of of circular economy and and its importance and it's definitely important at USA as well we are are thinking about circularity and our public private Partnerships through our feed the future food loss and waste accelerator where we partner with small businesses in Southeast Asia and Africa to scale different Innovations and a lot of those are using circular economy approaches whether that's upcycling previously wasted food into new products like coconut water or dried or frozen fruit or using black soldierly larvae to take food waste and transform that into animal feed and and fertilizer so now that we have a a a good overview of circular economy let's let's dive in deeper to to kipster so can you speak to how kipster is approaching sustainable food production through circularity with its chickens yeah so as you alluded to you know feeding byproducts is not something new uh it's actually been done for hundreds if not thousands of years uh it used to be the way of Agriculture and in a lot of countries it's still happening in the US yes it's still happening too but it's only like about 10% of a diet of of farmed animals um and that's mainly like by products from crop processing like wheat middlings um what's new about our approach is that we really try to maximize the amount in our feed so we have about 80 to 85% that we are aiming for to in the feed of the hens the chickens that is really only byproducts and food waste uh so that we can minimize our lens and environmental foodprint ideally we would bypass land Al together um so we use this model in the Netherlands we started with this in 2017 and we use a high percentage of Bakery byproducts uh there like cookies that were baked too long or rhines of bread or you know um things like that in the US we're also working with a local feed meal um we don't just throw banana peels at the chickens but we work really closely with the veterinarian uh the nutritionists uh from both the farm that we work with in the United States as well as on our staff and then and the feed meal to make sure that chickens get what they need um you know from their productive stages of life and also to remain healthy um and so we Source um through the feed mill the feed mill looks for these ingredients and brings them together in a comprehensive mual uh it's mainly byproducts right now from crop processing uh that's locally available in the state of Ohio uh and in the midwest ideally we would move to also include more food waste uh in the future but we're currently around like 65% of inclusion of byproducts right now um this really helps us to reduce our carbon foodprint significantly so usually when you have an egg um feed is responsible like for 70% of the carbon footprint in our case we reduce that by around 50% and just by feeding those byproducts that were already in the food system um and uh we also have solar panels on our roof and then um offset any remaining carbon um to get to carbon neutral eggs but the feed is just really key in what we do um also the fertilizer uh or the the chicken litter is used as fertilizer as you also alluded to in your other example that is also part of the circularity right there's so many nutrients in that in the manure and in the litter that can be uh applied to crop land and um for people to to grow crops that people can eat um so that's what we're trying to do and then um we also try to bring the consumer along and understand the importance of circular economies and and farming system so we actually have a visitor center where people can come and learn about this uh as well as webcams in the farm so people can go to our YouTube channel and see the chickens and see that they're still healthy and running around and doing well even if it's you know on on feet that they're not used to um so that's uh the approach that we take well that's that's awesome I did not know about the the YouTube channel and now I feel bad that we didn't invite the the famous YouTube chickens on this on this episode but uh you hit on a lot of really a lot of really great points and I think it's the circular economy Space is really exciting and requires a lot of of creative thinking and solutions and I think it's really great to see some of the the really innovative ideas that have come out of this space and I I appreciate the steps that that kipster is taking to increase consumer awareness and I think that's a very important part of this I we that work in the space we know what circular economy means we know why it's important and if we see a product that says that it contains upcycled ingredients we know what that means but I think a lot of consumers don't and I think things like the visitor center and the YouTube channel are really great examples of of how to socialize that um you know for example I I actually just made uh some cookies today from a a brand um that uses upcycled oat milk flour and uh you know we had some questions of like what does that mean like what do what does upcycled flower mean um so really great that you're you're creating that interface with with with consumers to become familiar with what circular economy means and and in a really tangible way um so can you share what's next for kipster and what areas are you hoping to explore in the future that's a good question uh we are just two years old in the United States uh and um you know we've been really focused on getting up and running uh this whole upcycles uh feed is a new thing to the feed meal that we work with and and the producers um and we want to aim for getting an inclusion rate of 80 to 85% minimum um you know it sounds really easy to just put things in the feed but it actually you know requires consistency we need to know the nutritional uh profile we need to make sure that the chickens are doing well with it it it really is not easy it takes years of r& ding to really get it right to make sure that the chicken stay healthy um and so um yeah we would like to continue working with our feed mill to to really get it right we would love to take more real food waste because now we use a lot of byproducts from the crop processing but we would love to be able to take food waste from a retailer or from a restaurant but right now we cannot because the FDA the the Food and Drug Administration and uh other regulations prevent us from taking that because there's a risk they say that if you you know before for example if there's still beef in the food waste um it cannot go to the feed mill if they also make beef feed um because of contamination issues that for example the M cow disease or even the African swine fever they're they're worried about those things um also there is a lack of um understanding of how the things work so we need a lot more research from the government um grant for universities to do a lot of experimentation with this also you know the the chickens that we use are from a breeding company that is really focused on producing chickens that do really well on a soy and corn diet like all farmed animals in the US and so even the breeding companies would need to work with us to really look at how these chickens can convert food ways better so there's so many moving parts still that we would love to work on with a whole range of stakeholders to improve this model and we understand this is a long-term game um we won't be able to do that in the next year or two um and so that is next for us to really look at how can we make this uh better improve it and and also share the knowledge that we uh we get well I I appreciate the effort that that you and kipster are taking to as you said play the long game with with circular economy and I think you really outlined a systems approach to to what you're doing at kipster and um that's we also emphasize a Food Systems Approach at us a and it's even though I think we can agree that it is the best approach and the best solution it is not always the easiest because as you mentioned there are so many different considerations that you have to make when you're taking a systems approach and it takes time and it takes um collaboration and it takes research it takes development it takes partnership um you mentioned you know this very intimate relationship between food safety and food loss and waste so it does take time and it takes a lot of consideration and I think that effort might be intimidating for a lot of businesses who may be interested in getting into this space but are um a little intimidated by all of the the different considerations that that have to be taken so what are some lessons learned that you can share um from your time with kipster and some of the opportunities that you see for the private sector and and maybe make the business case for business sector or the private sector to care about circular economy yeah it's a it's a really good question Lessons Learned um it's not really done before so it's indeed like don't feel intimidated and just keep going and make sure you don't give up up after one try um and and seek out the stakeholders that are really supportive of this and the right Partners to uh to understand this is a long-term game and uh and be able to provide that support for the longer term um I I do think one of the bigger opportunities is really that consumers want to make a better environmental Choice uh but they don't know always how uh there's so much noise out there uh what is now truly sustainable what's not so we feel like we've done homework for them and so they don't have to think about it they can just buy the eggs for climate smart choices um and then the education of the consumer to really bring them along that we just talked about is really important for them to understand what is circularity what does it mean is it really garbage that we just feed to the birds and we are like you know people are like ew um but we tell them it's safe it's nutritious we use byproducts that are human great you know food um and it's actually chickens are are excellent in in providing that into food for people and so we really try to bring people along and engage them through social media and through the visitor center um and I think a lot of other people and other companies can really start communic communicating clearly about that like what is sustainability um to really avoid greenwashing and and what they're doing I think it is a tremendous opportunity for them to reduce their environmental impact on the company side by instead of externalities uh which at some point will need to be incorporated into the price of a product right uh externalities are pollution greenhouse gas emissions uh water use deforestation currently that's not included in the price of the food products that companies produce um but somebody's got to pay that price somewhere and it's probably the future generation uh I think the circular model really helps to internalize a lot of that uh by avoiding you know land use by avoiding fertilizer use by avoiding a lot of these things so trying to incorporate those externalities um of course it's not a perfect model there will always be some um but we do really think that that will really help low lower the environmental impact uh in an economically viable way so yeah yeah definitely I you you outlined for the private sector it it makes sense for them to uh reduce their environmental impact but it often makes economic sense to reduce food loss and waste because you are oftentimes throwing profits into the trash if you are wasting inputs that you can't sell and I think while it may require as we discussed Innovative thinking and maybe establishing some new infrastructure within within your company to to support these circular economy approaches it can also be a great opportunity for economic development and we've seen that with some of the Partnerships through our food loss and waste accelerator you're creating new products that that you can sell from things that you were previously throwing away and with that you have new jobs created to make those new products so there's there's a lot of opportunity I think there's also a lot that needs to be learned still and and you touched on this as well of some of the things of you understanding what is the the rate limiting step for Behavior change among consumers to switch to more sustainable products and and what is the willingness to pay for a product that may be slightly more expensive but is sustainable in a way that takes into consideration the environment and Animal Health um as well as food loss and waste and food safety all those important different considerations so a lot to learn there I think a lot also um just raising awareness among the consumer and and also getting over some of the the ick factor with certain products um I know every time I bring up black soldierly even though we're not we're not even suggesting insect protein but just the the thought of of bugs you know gives gives people the ick and it's it's not very palatable for them to consider and um I had a conversation with someone recently about even just semantics around should we be calling it food waste or should we be calling it wasted food because maybe someone is more likely to um you know whether that's like Food donation or or repurposing or redistribution if you're saying wasted food it has a different connotation than food waste like food waste kind of sounds like oh this is going to the trash whereas wasted food is is kind of like a missed opportunity so I think there's there's really a lot to to still learn um in this space and I don't know if we've answered the question of what comes first the chicken or the egg but we certainly have a better understanding of of circular economy and and some of the really great work that companies like kipster are doing to as you said like you're just getting started you're um you are the business case for for how to make this work so I really appreciate you taking the time to speak with us today and um for kipster willingness to continue to think creatively and and um innovatively in this space thank you so much for having me and um and sharing this story and I really hope it inspires others and uh always happy to work together to make this a reality so thank you thank you for tuning in to USAID's kitchen sink this podcast was produced by Nika Larian and is organized by the USAID food loss and waste community of practice co-chairs Ahmed kablan and Anne vaughn additional Thanks goes to feed the future the US government's Global Food security initiative and the USAID Center for nutrition