109 - How to Lead as an Executive: Skills, Style & Confidence Tips - Ursula Llabres

In this episode of the Women In Customer Success podcast, my guest is Ursula Llabres, the Global Director of Customer Growth and Commercial Sales at Reality Labs, Meta.

Ursula was one of the founding leaders of customer success practice (being one of the first 10 in CS at salesforce.com back in 2005) and has since transformed and led high-performing global teams at some of the top tech companies like Oracle, Salesforce, Box, Microsoft, InsideSales and now Meta to name a few. 

We talk about how to reach an executive position and the important senior management skills needed for an executive-level position. Whether you're just starting out as a Customer Success Manager or you’re an experienced manager, Ursula shares helpful information that will help you get ahead. 

Ursula gives tips on communicating with authority, articulating thoughts and ideas clearly and effectively, and how to be confident as a manager.

She also advises how to dress like an executive and the right executive style to help you look and feel professional.

In today’s episode, you’ll learn:

• How to lead as an executive
• Confidence tips for managers
• Senior managerial skills
• How to be articulate and well-spoken
• How to communicate with authority
• How should an executive dress
• Inclusion and diversity
• Strong body language 
• How to get into an executive position
• Skills to thrive as an executive

If you're on your own leadership journey, feel free to share your experiences in the comments below. Let’s grow together!

This episode is brought to you by Vitally.io.  Visit vitally.io/women today to schedule your demo and get your Airpods.

Follow Ursula! 

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

In today's episode, you'll meet Ursula Labresse, global Director of Customer Growth for Reality Labs at Mera. She has a fascinating career journey and she's been part of companies that are household brands in business, from Oracle, salesforce, microsoft, vox to Mera at the moment, where she's currently leading the B2B division. So this conversation is all about the executive presence. We're talking about what makes one an executive, how to get into executive position, what are the skills to thrive and how do you lead as an executive, and you will also hear about Ursula's exchange with the famous Sheryl Sandberg from Mera. I think that you will enjoy this episode. Let's get into it.

Speaker 1: 0:47

Hi everyone, this is Maria Scobepillay and you're listening to Women in Customer Success podcast, the first women-only podcast where remarkable ladies of customer success share their stories and practical tools to help you succeed and make an impact. If you want to learn more about customer success, get career advice and be inspired, you're in the right place, so let's tune in. Welcome to the new episode of the Women in Customer Success podcast. Today, I'm just super, super, super excited to introduce this wonderful, amazing executive, so inspirational lady, ursula Labresse. She's a Global Director of Customer Growth for Reality Labs by Meta. I've known her, or I've known about her for years and I am just very honored to speak with her today. Ursula, welcome to the show.

Speaker 2: 1:46

Thank you, maria, and you really made me feel so special. I'm so, so honored to be in your podcast. I mean, I've known about you for years and I've seen how you've created this incredible community for women in customer success, so thank you for having me here.

Speaker 1: 2:05

Thank you for this conversation. I'm excited because what we are talking about today is super interesting. It's all about the executive presence. What does it mean to have an executive presence? How does an executive, especially a female executive, how should she look like, how should she talk feel?

Speaker 2: 2:25

everything.

Speaker 1: 2:27

I just want to tap into that topic so much, so I'm just super excited about it. But we can't go straight into it, right? Because I know that everybody are bursting out of curiosity to find out a bit more about you. How did you get to where you are? Because, like you're in meta, you work with, like Mark Zuckerberg used to work with Cheryl to speak about that as well are Because, like you're in Meta, you work with, like Mark Zuckerberg, he used to work with Cheryl to speak about that as well. But, like you're awesome, tell us, how did you get there?

Speaker 2: 2:53

Oh, what a journey. And so originally I am born and raised in Lima, peru, and when I was 16, I emigrated to Toronto, canada. So I'm both Caribbean Canadian and, through my father's side, I'm also Spanish. So I would say, as a result of my first move to Canada and then to the US, I feel like I'm a citizen of the world and, honestly, when I was a young kid in Peru, I never in a million years thought that I would work in one of the top tech companies, most innovative companies in the world. So my journey really started in Toronto After I graduated I would say my sister's the one that brought me into the technology world and she invited me to apply to a job in the company she was working in Fast forward.

Speaker 2: 3:50

In the first years during my 20s, I did several roles. I did sales roles, I did marketing roles, consulting roles, until I ended up at Oracle, oracle Direct. At the time I was doing pre-sales consulting. So this is a role that does all the demos, all the solution design for a sales journey, and I was always competing against Salesforce and I'm like they were just phenomenal and I'm like I have to work in that company. And so I applied as a pre-sales engineer. But they actually came to me for this new role they had created was a customer success manager. And I'm like, what's that? And once they explained it to me and they also said you know, it's a fairly new role, we only have a few people in the company that are doing it. I signed up immediately, so I joined Salesforce 2005 and the rest is history.

Speaker 2: 4:48

Really, that was kind of the birth of customer success. Incredible leaders have kind of come from that school because really, at the end of the day, it became the original university school of customer success, the original University School of Customer Success. I was there at the very beginning when we were trying to define, you know, the methodology for approaching this job. How do we measure its success? And then, how do we, what does success look like from a customer's perspective? Right, so fast forward.

Speaker 2: 5:20

You know, I started as an individual contributor and then I really enjoyed coaching others and kind of my love for team sports maybe helped me help others, my peers, and as a result I became a manager in my early 30s and since then I've had the opportunity to work at different companies like Microsoft, box and now Meta, leading and transforming teams for the last 20 years in this practice.

Speaker 2: 5:53

So how did I end up at Meta? It's through another incredible female leader. So you know, in your journey, I think, whether you're female or male, it's very important to build connections with people that you admire, people that you work really well and to nurture that, and I think it's as a result of that network of incredible leaders in CS and outside of that that I've been able to be exposed to these great opportunities. So I think never would I have thought that First Meta would have an enterprise B2B arm, and that was actually. I was one of the first employees in their attempt to go into the enterprise. So that's how I ended up here, and it's been almost eight years, almost eight years in.

Speaker 1: 6:41

Meta, that's incredible. Before we move on, you said something awesome about nurturing relationships and networking. I mean networking, how somebody, another lady, almost got you into Meta. Tell me more about it. Every time we speak about the networking, people have different ideas about it. But how does it actually look like? Like? What is that relationship like, that somebody will either recommend you or guide you through the process, like because, in fairness what I want to address as well sometimes people think, oh, when you're connected on LinkedIn, now we are in our network, now I'm just gonna ping everybody oh, there's a job in your company.

Speaker 1: 7:24

Can you recommend me, without ever speaking to the company or to the person.

Speaker 2: 7:28

That's not a thing.

Speaker 1: 7:30

It doesn't happen. So just tell me more about it. What is that tangible relationship? How can somebody know your skills and strengths to really guide you through the process? Because it's not only recommendation right, it takes much more than that.

Speaker 2: 7:51

Absolutely. That's a great question because there's different levels of relationship as you build a network right. There are deep relationships and in this case I used to work for her at Box and it kind of our relationship really was born. In our first interview we really hit it off and I said I want to work for her because I know I'm going to learn a lot and I felt like she would also learn a lot from me because we had really complementary skill set. So that relationship became much more deep in the sense that she knew what I could bring to the table and I just happened to bring things that she needed to solve for and develop in this new opportunity. So that's kind of the best of and the deepest of the relationships.

Speaker 2: 8:37

But you know, there's other types of relationships of people perhaps that you are peers to in a job or that you have networked through events that you've attended, and sometimes it can start from a personal connection. Maybe you know both of you are women with families, or both of you are interested in sports, or both of you are really passionate about you know data, analytics and how do you translate data into the things that you're doing. I have several groups of I call them now friends, because it's been years since we've nurtured our relationships and we have different types of conversations, right? Some where we have a WhatsApp group and I would say once every three months, somebody posts a problem that they're facing and solicits insights, and I think those are the people you could potentially ask for a referral right, because even though you haven't worked together, you have solved problems together through having being in the same practice. If you're just socially connected to somebody, I think you still can ask them to be a referral, but potentially like reference in terms of submitting a resume, but maybe not have a conversation with the hiring manager as a you know, as a person that they've worked together, because it's not so.

Speaker 2: 9:59

I think it is important to be truthful in how you approach the people that you're interested in, and if you don't know somebody you know, because sometimes there's women that I would love to know. Here is something that we talked about in our pre-interview is like time is currency. When you're, the higher you go in someone's I guess executive influence, the more conscious you have to be about their time and their value exchange and what you're bringing to the table in exchange for the ask that you have. So I think that is important in terms of I would say, never fear, because I have cold call people and have approached them, but I do it in a way that I connect, if I can, to something personal and I try to bring something in exchange for that ask right.

Speaker 1: 10:52

So thank you for clarifying For everybody listening. It's so important to always have in mind when you're working with somebody. When it's a good relationship, like everybody seems to be happy, it's win-win. It's kind of common sense that there might be opportunities later on in life to work together again, and typically people tend to do it. They tend to move somehow together if they are really a good team. But even if that relationship is not great, just try to make it better, Simply because, whomever you're working with, those relationships are following you throughout the years. But I want to say thank you as well for saying how, even if you're solving problems together with somebody, that almost again qualifies you to ask for referrals, to ask for help, and speaking about so many different communities that we have, especially in customer success, that's really a valuable place for people to start making solutions to their problems together and be in a position to get referred at some point.

Speaker 2: 12:00

Yeah, exactly, and I think the key to success is that you achieve success not on your own, it's through working with others. It's through your ability to build community, to either elicit the help of others or help others along the way. And a lot of people are afraid to ask for help. They feel like by asking for help, you're vulnerable and you may be perceived as not as competent. Actually, to the contrary, if you think about when somebody asks you for help, how do you usually feel?

Speaker 1: 12:37

Fluttered. Right, you feel unrightfully and fluttered, that's right.

Speaker 2: 12:42

So I always say asking for help is giving somebody else the opportunity to feel valuable. So it's actually something that you should do, obviously carefully, but you should never be ashamed. To the contrary, you should be absolutely proud of it, because you're just the feeling of others trying to help you in a meaningful way. It's just giving that feeling of value that's exchanged right. So that's how I would flip the things around being afraid to actually be super confident in asking for help.

Speaker 1: 13:18

Speaking about super confident. So there is that one that one lady in the world, extremely famous, called Sheryl Sandberg and, as it happened, you did work with her on multiple occasions while during her time in Meta, for everybody listening. Obviously, sheryl Sandberg has been a COO at Facebook for I don't even know how many, but many, many years, but she's also incredibly popular because of her book Lean In. I read that book and Plan B and Plan B yeah, plan B as well.

Speaker 1: 13:53

I haven't read that one yet, but I read Lean In for Graduates. That completely changed my idea about the world, the work you know jungle gym. So obviously Cheryl is one of a kind you know up there in the world the work, you know jungle gym. So obviously Cheryl is one of a kind you know up there in the world extremely. You know, famous, popular, capable and confident. Now I wonder how was it working with her, like when there is that person that you see on the TV almost like tell me yeah.

Speaker 2: 14:22

Let's qualify in terms of what working with her means. I obviously she was the COO of Meta and I was, you know, an exec in a division of the business and so oftentimes she would be having to get prepared for having important conversations with customers that spanned the different business units at Meta. Right, there were customers that are ads business customers, that are workplace customers, that are business messaging customers, and she solicits the help of the execs for each of those divisions to provide the updates, right, what are the key TikTok they call it, the TikTok points that she must understand about that account from that perspective, and also what are the messaging that you would like for her to land during that exchange? So I did that many, many times and I did have an exchange with her. She came to one of our all hands and I will never forget. I asked her a question about a book, crossing the Chasm, and it's a book about adoption actually, and she had never read that book and she asked me what is the book about? And of course I was so nervous but I was able to summarize it in five minutes and then I sent a book to her.

Speaker 2: 15:49

So she does remember my name and we did have several exchanges, but yes, so the point of the matter is she is indeed an incredible leader that is extremely genuine and transparent, but also absolutely confident and very, I would say, she knows her stuff. But she knows her stuff because she also prepared. So when you see her speaking at important events or when you see her influencing a topic that is important for her or for the companies that she's representing, there is a lot of preparation that happens in the background and beforehand. So that is actually a key, one of the really important components in being an executive that articulates and comes across confident and respected right. It's key. It's preparation is key to that process. I mean, I have other points around that, but I would say she really exemplified that element.

Speaker 1: 16:56

That is the key, Simply because I guess that there is hope for everybody now and listening, you know if Sheryl Sandberg is so awesome and then you say how much preparation goes into it? Yes, obviously, and just for everybody. You know if Sheryl Sandberg is so awesome and then you say how much preparation goes into it? Yes, obviously, Just for everybody. You know, for anyone doing something for the first time, yes, you are gaining confidence little by little, but don't expect to be awesome in everything you do. You know at the beginning there is loads of preparation that goes into it. Another quick point or lesson, even for CSMs listening, that skill of simplifying facts and preparing it for your executives is going to follow you all of your career. Even when you're an executive, you will have another boss to summarize information about a customer. So that's an incredibly valuable skills to start developing.

Speaker 2: 17:49

Yeah, I would say I have like on that whole genre right In terms of tips for being articulate and confident and communicating with authority. I would say it comes down to five things for me in terms of what I practice and also what I've seen some of the best leaders, both female and men, right. One is the first one that I've mentioned right, the preparation, preparation is key because it helps you become confident in the subject matter that you're developing. The other one is know your stuff. Oftentimes right, like in customer success, I am really confident because I've been speaking about it in the subject matter for many years. But there's times where I have to speak about innovations that are happening at Meta that I'm not an expert on. And so preparation and developing a deeper understanding through learning and you can learn by reading, you can learn by speaking, by being exposed to other events. I mean, there's so many ways that you can learn something about a topic. It's very important, right. So know your stuff that you're representing in the way you are speaking is very, very important. And then the other three things are more about style.

Speaker 2: 19:10

I would say One is to speak simply. I know a lot of people speak really fast or use big words, and it may be because I'm from another country and I've learned English and I also work with many people who are from different parts of the world and I know language is so important, and language means is like the simpler you speak, the more chances you are you have to be understood, and that, to me, is more important than sounding smart. Sounding smart is actually can you convey the complexity of what you're speaking in the most simple ways, in the most simple terms, using repetition, and so I think that is very key in both being effective and articulate, and it's also simpler, right? Like. If you can keep your language simpler, you're probably likely to be more effective, because you're not trying to use big words or have a chance to mispronounce them, right? I'm always afraid of that.

Speaker 1: 20:13

I just love that. I just love it because how many times have you been in a room with somebody who needs to sound smart? How many times you are hearing people putting so many words out there and like five minutes later you're thinking what did you just say?

Speaker 2: 20:33

For me. Sometimes it's funny there's a lot of people who speak like that.

Speaker 1: 20:38

Yeah, same like politicians, yeah, business speak or politician, like so many words. But after 10 sentences, what was the point, you know, of so many words put in together? Anyway, what was the point of so many words put together? Anyway, I just love how you highlighted it. Even when you are an executive on a very high position, speaking clearly is a strength.

Speaker 2: 20:58

Yeah, absolutely, and I think, depending on how high your role is, to align, usually for employees to understand your objectives, the company objectives, or, if you're driving change in some sort, you want people to listen and to be able to understand and connect with a message right. The other thing that the other two elements I think it's really important is to be genuine and transparent. And I think one of the stories when I just started my career you know I'm quite lively, you know and maybe because of my Latin background, I'm always high energy, happy, social and somebody said you're too friendly, ursula, if you really want to get to an exact position, you can't be so happy all the time or friendly and I was like you know there's no A-holes at the very top, I don't need to add to that list and I think I took that as the best, worst advice I got and I think honestly is I decided to really be myself. Now, of course, not everybody, not every culture of every company, accepts or wants a very high energy leader, but that's why I've been in the companies that I've been and I've been quite successful in being genuine and being transparent, because the outcomes of that is that you're building trust and people are more engaged and feel better in listening or in speaking with you, and that's so important in being effective in whatever you're trying to do Right. So it does enhance your communication it does.

Speaker 2: 22:41

And the other one is to maintain a strong body language, and I think that's important to practice. Oftentimes, when you're speaking in public or when you're speaking with others, there's nervous, there's fear. That is absolutely normal. I mean, I think if you're not afraid or if you're not nervous, you probably don't care as much about what you're about to say or worry about to do right. So I think that is a very natural emotion. But is how do you breathe and how do you control your body or teach your body to be calm? And I think that is incredibly important in terms of making eye contact with who you're speaking with. You know practicing and I've taken many, many, many many presentation trainings, executive presentation, presentation practices. I think if it doesn't come naturally, that's okay, but practice makes best. So take courses, because presenting and using your body, the body language, is 90% of what you're communicating.

Speaker 2: 23:48

Oh, absolutely, those are the five things that I would really center on Key elements of executive presence and communication, the all-in-one customer success platform.

Speaker 1: 24:05

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Speaker 1: 24:40

As you may know, I was trained as a classical musician, so all my life was on a stage. People who are taking theater lessons as well are, you know, a good performer. So I would also say it doesn't always have to be on presentation skills, like if somebody took presentation skills, that's awesome, but there is so many of those other very creative avenues to make you feel really composed on the stage and, just to you know, to get a sense of yourself, of your body, of your body language, because I like, as you said, even as an executive, what you're doing most is communicating and influencing, and that always comes with speech and with body language, and that's something that will always follow all of us around throughout our careers.

Speaker 2: 25:32

I love that you said that, because it just reminded me one of the female executives at Meta that I admire the most. Her name is Maxine Williams and she's our chief diversity officer and she is incredible. She's one of the best speakers that I've ever met in my life and she actually used to take improv lessons. Oh, that's the best. So you know, it's fun. I never connected the dots between those two, so if you're ever you know interested, improv lessons is an avenue to being an incredible speaker, but Improv Lessons is an avenue to being an incredible speaker.

Speaker 1: 26:10

Yes, oh, absolutely Gosh, this is really awesome. One more question on that whole kind of aura of executives what do you feel about the appearance of a female executive, or how would you choose your outfits? Especially in today's day and age with so many different options, but I would like to hear your thoughts. What?

Speaker 2: 26:37

matters? Actually, that's a great question, right? So obviously I love fashion you can ask anyone. I love to wear bright colors and to wear all kinds of different outfits, but what I've learned over time is also that different cultures wear different things for a business setting, right? So one of the things that have become really important for me is first, understand the audience, who you're speaking with, and then dress accordingly. If you are going to Japan, actually, one of the things I learned is that they dress very conservatively and most people wear dark colors. You don't see a lot of reds and flower prints, no, I mean. And so I would choose things that are aligned to my personality but are also aligned to the expectations in that culture, right? Other, you know, if you're going to parts where there's a middle east, you may want to have to wear a hair cover, for example, right. So choose ones that are aligned to your personality, but also always be mindful in terms of the audience that you're going after Now. Always be mindful in terms of the audience that you're going after Now.

Speaker 2: 27:48

Personally, in the tech industry, people wear more casual clothing, right, like they wear jeans, and the funny part is, when I moved to the Bay Area, it's so different how they dress in the Bay Area than how they dress in New York. In New York City, you know you're wearing designer, you're wearing very sleek, very chic outfits, but in the Bay Area, you know, you see a lot of people wearing jeans and a hoodie, so you don't really have to get too dressed up when you're talking to other execs. So it's fascinating the whole topic of what you wear and I think honestly, that is just a detail, right, that is, if you're into fashion at the end of the day, really, because there's some misconceptions right about female executives in terms of appearance and what they need to do. I think to me, if you convey confidence, if you know your stuff and if you communicate articulately, you can wear whatever you want at the end of the day right, it should be, but we know that we're getting there and not in every place it's like that.

Speaker 2: 28:56

So the secondary thing is then understand your audience and dress accordingly, so you're not starting at a deficit in terms of the impressions that you're making right. So I think, in terms of the look and feel, I think it's up to each person. I really don't care what people wear, as long as what matters is can I connect with them, can I believe what they're saying and are they genuine and transparent? So I think that is to me more important than what you could wear. But if you want to talk fashion, I'm all for it.

Speaker 1: 29:31

No, absolutely, because in Europe we all got used to, you know, bay Area or Americans in shorts and hoodies at work. I don't think we do it if we don't. It's just that you know it's a swag hoodie, you take it when you don't have something else, but't? It's just that you know it's a swag hoodie, you take it when you don't have something else. But no, it's very interesting for me.

Speaker 1: 29:51

I asked the question because earlier on in my career I got really disappointed one day and then I felt very guilty about it. I was meeting an executive who came to our office and, you know, hoodie, very sporty, but you know there is a way of wearing hoodie and sport that you still look awesome. And she didn't. And I felt very disappointed, thinking, you know, if somebody comes to our office wearing something that I wouldn't wear, even in my home lounge, or like almost pajama, I kind of felt like, ah, is that showing? Well, I'm not. I know it's not showing disrespect to us, but I just felt something was missing and then I felt guilty about it. Like who am I to judge? In my head? You know how somebody is dressing. Of course I'm no one to judge others. I shouldn't be.

Speaker 2: 30:48

But you see, I still remember so many years after how I felt disappointed on that day, right, and it's interesting because we place a lot of meaning and symbolism and appearances, and I think that is one of the things we are sometimes.

Speaker 2: 30:59

Just it's part of our culture and you know it's hard to deep unprogram those perceptions, right, but I love that you kind of caught yourself. But not everybody catches themselves and people do judge you based on what you look like and it's unfortunate, I mean, that's the age old added about discrimination and you know, and all these things that we're battling against. But I do think it is important to be mindful of where you're going and how do people dress or behave in that space, right, and if you can, if you're interested, you know, kind of bring your style that is acceptable and easy to digest and if not, and if you're bringing your style as is, then make sure that how you communicate and how you connect with people overcomes that barrier that may occur, right? Thank you for clarifying. But it's, I mean, I love that you share that because that's a very vulnerable story, right, and God, we all have that, we absolutely all have that.

Speaker 1: 32:07

Ursula. What were some of the biggest lessons you learned on your way to the executive level?

Speaker 2: 32:16

So great, there's so many. I would say, where do I start? I think I mentioned this. Time is currency, and this is so important in how people want to engage with an executive, but also, as you become an executive, how you need to account for your time and where you spend your time with ruthless prioritization. So, by considering that time is currency when you are approaching a executive, less is more, and that requires a lot of preparation, getting to the point quickly, creating context, doing briefings that is absolutely critical, and so I think if you have 15 minutes with an executive, it's almost important to deconstruct those 15 minutes in terms of okay, you have five minutes to introduce yourself, you have five minutes to land your point, you have five minutes to do the closing and the ask right. So it's, when you start deconstructing those 15 minutes with an exec, you realize you don't have a lot of time to dilly dally with so many things.

Speaker 2: 33:30

So what is the most important thing and what's your desired outcome from that exchange? I think when you become more scientific about every exchange, you really create more value in how you spend time with executives and how you help others spend time with you right in. In doing so, there's different frameworks that I like to use, and one is the PPO and this is a framework that I learned from a friend of mine, doug Landis is purpose, plan and outcome. What's the purpose of that exchange, how are you planning to delivering or going through that exchange, and what's the outcome that you have? So that's a good framework PPO, ppo, purpose, plan and outcome.

Speaker 2: 34:12

The other lessons and I think we could do an entire session just on this is know your data, be, I would say, data literate, in the sense that you have to understand your business and use data as the leading way in which you present and so create stories with data around it. To highlight your point and I think that is incredibly important is understand your data, understand the business results or, if you're going into a new job, for example, which you know, or even in interviews, right, understanding how your systems are connected, how does the data flow and how reporting happens right and how the insights are discovered. Because if there's a mess there, that's the first thing you need to fix, because if you don't have data, you're blind, you're running a business blind and there's only so much words can take you. I think data really brings people along the journey and educates and really unites people. That may not agree with you. It's hard to argue with data.

Speaker 1: 35:29

Oh, that's a good one. It's hard to argue with data, or you can't argue with data, so use it in your advantage.

Speaker 2: 35:36

Yeah, and I think I mean there's others and one that I like to highlight. I mean, obviously, be authentic, be yourself, foster inclusion and diversity, especially at the exec levels. It is extremely important to have a diversity of thought and to be surrounded by people who bring that to the table, because you may see a problem in a certain way and as much data as you can, you're still bringing your experiences and your perspective by allowing and including others with a different viewpoint that may be contrarian to the one that you have. It is important to foster that openness in dialogue and communication and being inclusive of that diversity, because it's kind of like your blind areas, right as you're driving. You need to bring people that will help you see in different ways, to make sure that you can see problems in a more comprehensive and holistic way.

Speaker 2: 36:33

And, lastly, is to bring joy. I think too many, too many, and this is just my own. Being an executive is hard, right. There's a lot of competing priorities, your own personal life, you're struggling or juggling, there is a lot of pressure, there is a lot of self-pressure and you are exposed at much wider levels and I think it takes a toll and I think it is important to find ways in which you can recharge your batteries with energy and joy, because if you bring joy, you can then make others feel enthusiastic about what they're doing, even if what they're about to do is terrible, for example. Right, or if they're about not terrible but it's like not fun, yeah, right.

Speaker 2: 37:29

And I think if you bring joy, you also bring empathy. And I think it is important to be intentional about your energy and the energy that you bring to others, because if you're upset, your energy is going to be there. You're going to make others upset. Oh, definitely, I much rather have fun at work, even if I'm handling something really, really important and perhaps, you know, difficult, because when you're having fun, you're more relaxed and you probably can see more things that when you're stressed out, your vision really narrows, right? So I think that is also important. And you're spending so many hours at work. Who wants to like be pissed off all day or work with people who are like grumpy, right? Yeah, I remember. My own recommendation is I want to see more high level executives who have fun.

Speaker 1: 38:24

That is awesome Because I remember one of our executives many years ago who would make everybody miserable completely and no one would dare to say a word or be creative, like there's no creativity, when you're just literally afraid, like you can't. But on another hand, in one of my previous startups, the executive was the brightest star out there, constantly, you know, pulling out jokes. There was so much laughter in the office, so much brightness, and you just feel the difference. You just feel how everybody wants to be part of it because it is awesome. So let's bring much more joy. Especially if you're an executive, that is a beautiful way to influence your culture.

Speaker 2: 39:06

Yeah, and you made an important point. If you're driving innovation and you have an executive who you still fear, good luck with that. Really, no one's going to challenge that executive, no one's going to bring difficult conversations forward, right, because no one wants to have their head chewed off, and so you're missing so much of important discussions that will allow you to discover innovations. And I think when there's joy, people get more creative, they work harder sometimes and they are more willing to problem solve.

Speaker 1: 39:42

Excellent Ursula. I could speak to you like for days and weeks about executive presence until I become an executive.

Speaker 2: 39:51

You are my friend, I know, I know.

Speaker 1: 39:53

Should remind myself. Let's wrap it up with something a bit different Now. This may surprise you, but hey, I need to ask you the question. What is one thing that people are generally surprised to find about you?

Speaker 2: 40:08

Oh, so interestingly, they do notice that I have an accent. But a lot of people are surprised that I'm from Peru and that I've lived in so many different countries. So that's something that people I always see them. I'm like, oh, you're from Peru and you've lived in Canada and you've traveled so much. So I think that's one thing, and the other thing is I always tell this story because I love to cook and there was a point in time when I left Salesforce because I wanted to start an empanada truck.

Speaker 2: 40:47

Ooh, my empanadas are next level. And I know people are like, oh, we must try. But I did. I did a business plan, I was. So I was registered to attend a culinary school just to learn, and my neighbor at the time owned a pastry factory, so I learned so much about pastries from her. So I felt like ready to embark. And then, unfortunately, I found out I was pregnant with my second and I'm like you know, having two little kids in such a short time difference. I felt like, and starting a food company is going to be too much, so I actually stopped. But that's, you know, the food truck. It's something that people really do not expect, but I love, I love. One day, who knows? Let's see, let's check in in 10 years in 10 years time.

Speaker 1: 41:37

On weekends that's right, ursula, this was, but this was fantastic conversation. Thank you so, so much for your incredible insights and just giving us a little bit of a glimpse of your world and your career. It's, it's just inspiring.

Speaker 2: 41:53

Thank you, oh thank you so much and thank you to all the women who I've worked with, I've come across and who have influenced me and who maybe I've come across and who have influenced me and who maybe I've influenced in some way. I think, really, we don't succeed alone and I'm grateful. I'm grateful for you, maria, for bringing me on board, so I look forward to coming back, maybe to talk about data. Yeah, let's do that.

Speaker 1: 42:17

Until then, a virtual hug.

Speaker 2: 42:20

I know Wonderful.

Speaker 1: 42:28

Thank you for listening. Next week new episode, Subscribe to the podcast and connect with me on LinkedIn so you're up to date with all the new episodes and the content I'm curating for you. Have a great day and talk to you soon.