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Firing The Man
THANK YOU TO OUR 25,000+ LISTENERS! We are so thankful to be one of the TOP E-Commerce Podcasts delivering high-quality authentic content to you! Serial Entrepreneur’s David Schomer and Ken Wilson share tips, advice, and insider knowledge about all things Amazon FBA, Walmart WFS, and E-Commerce. Discover how you can create multiple income streams by selling physical products online so that you can have the time and freedom to do what you love - whether that is spending more time with family or traveling the world. Ken and David have successfully created several six and seven figure online business ventures. During the journey, they have had major wins, losses, and lessons learned. This podcast will teach you about selling physical products online through platforms such as Fulfillment by Amazon, building a team, outsourcing, listing optimization, pay per click (PPC) advertising, driving traffic to your listings, and productivity tips / life hacks that will provide a path to be successful in building your online business. It’s a mix of interviews, special co-hosts and solo shows from Ken and David you’re not going to want to miss. Hit subscribe, and get ready to change your life.
Firing The Man
Mastering Amazon PPC: Strategies for E-Commerce Success with Ritu Java
Ever wondered how to turn a side hustle into a thriving business? Join us as we chat with Ritu Java, the innovative co-founder of PPC Ninja, whose journey from an Etsy venture in 2010 to mastering the art of Amazon advertising is nothing short of inspiring. Discover how Ritu navigated the complexities of Amazon’s PPC landscape, confronting challenges like increased placement saturation and escalating costs per click, all while evolving into a data-driven decision-maker. With her unique insights, Ritu offers invaluable lessons for any e-commerce entrepreneur eager to refine their advertising strategies.
As we gaze into the future of Amazon PPC, the conversation uncovers pivotal strategies essential for 2025. Ritu emphasizes the importance of a holistic approach, integrating SEO, PPC, and an awareness of surrounding ads to outshine the competition. Delve into the transformative role of Rufus, Amazon's AI shopping assistant, and learn how to future-proof your listings through enhanced product visibility and strategic use of FAQs and infographics. The discussion also sheds light on the intricate relationship between PPC, conversion rates, and reviews, preparing sellers to avoid common keyword ranking mistakes and create comprehensive PPC campaigns.
Our exploration doesn’t stop there. Navigate through the complexities of Amazon advertising success by embracing day partying strategies and branded campaigns. Ritu illustrates how PPC Ninja software helps sellers safeguard budgets by pausing campaigns during low-conversion hours and shares insights into managing budgets during key events like Prime Day. Wrap up the session by understanding the ideal client profile for PPC Ninja Agency and how to connect with Ritu and her team for further collaboration. Whether you're a seasoned seller or just embarking on your e-commerce journey, this episode is packed with strategies to propel your Amazon advertising endeavors forward.
Want to connect with Ritu?
Website: https://ppcninja.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/Ritujava
Twitter: https://twitter.com/ppcninja
Welcome everyone to the Firing the man podcast, a show for anyone who wants to be their own boss. If you sit in a cubicle every day and know you are capable of more, then join us. This show will help you build a business and grow your passive income streams in just a few short hours per day. And now your hosts, serial entrepreneurs David Shomer and Ken Wilson.
Speaker 2:Welcome everyone to the Firing the man podcast. On today's episode, we are thrilled to have Ritu Jhava, the co-founder of PPC Ninja, join us. Ritu is an expert in Amazon advertising and PPC management, helping e-commerce entrepreneurs optimize their advertising strategies for maximum profitability. With a strong background in digital marketing and a passion for data-driven decision-making, she has helped countless sellers navigate the complexities of Amazon PPC. In this episode, we'll dive into Ritu's journey and discuss the evolving Amazon advertising landscape.
Speaker 3:Welcome to the show Ritu. Hey David, thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. To start things off, can you share with our audience a little bit about?
Speaker 3:your background and path to PPC Ninja. Yeah, absolutely yeah. So I actually started my e-commerce journey way back in 2010. And this was on Etsy. I used to live in Japan at the time and had this day job and I wanted to do a side hustle and so I got into Etsy and then I realized that it's not just about creating a listing and uploading your products and just selling. It doesn't happen that way. So I had to do a lot of work to train myself on marketing. I had to teach myself Facebook ads, google ads, youtube blogging, custom audience generation all of that good stuff. So it just led me to learning a lot about marketing.
Speaker 3:And then I decided to go back to school and do a formal degree in data science. I'm an engineer of a background, so this was like an add-on and I was always interested in data and I just thought that everything is about the numbers, including which products you pick or how you sell them, how efficiently you sell them, and you might think that you're in the business of selling products, but actually you're in the business of leveraging data. That's what I learned, you know, from my experience back then, and so I was able to kind of get into the data analytics space and then came across Amazon. I was like, oh my God, this conversion rate on Amazon is like way better than anything I've seen in the past, and so that's how I kind of got into Amazon and Amazon advertising per se.
Speaker 3:And then in 2020, I founded the agency so PPC Ninja agency, which is helping seven, eight and nine figure sellers on Amazon as well as on Walmart and with Google ads, et cetera, on Amazon as well as on Walmart and with Google ads, et cetera. So we're we're an agency that focuses on PPC as well as SEO and we help our customers kind of get that whole flywheel going on Amazon. And it's been an exciting and, you know, interesting journey and I'm super passionate about everything I do, including like data, ai and everything to do with Amazon and AI. It's very, very exciting for me.
Speaker 2:Very nice, very nice. I love that background I will share with you in. The audience has heard me say this a million times I'm a retired accountant and accountants and engineers there tends to be some overlap in how their brain is wired and their attention to data-driven decisions, and so it's exciting to hear that from you and, as we're getting into our discussion on Amazon PPC, feel free to go deep on those data-driven decisions and what you're looking for when you're looking at an account. So why don't we turn the corner and start that discussion? So Amazon PPC has changed quite a bit over since I've been selling, which has been about a decade now. So let's just look at the last five years. What have been some of the major changes in Amazon PPC?
Speaker 3:years. What have been some of the major changes in Amazon PPC? Yeah, so I think the biggest change has been placement saturation. I just think that there's a lot more ads now and there's a lot of very similar looking products vying for the same spots and it's very hard for, you know, buyers to kind of make up their mind about what is a good product versus what is not. I mean, yes, of course they can see review counts and price and all that stuff, but it's very hard for people in general to decide which one is a better product, right? And so I think that that kind of led to everybody trying to kind of get those top spots above the fold, because organic ranking has become harder and harder over the years and it's getting diluted in some ways, also because Amazon has opened up a lot of different placements on Amazon as well as off Amazon, and so it's really really hard for most people to decide which one is a good product, even though they might be showing up in the recommended at the top.
Speaker 3:Now, what that also manifests in terms of challenges for sellers is the cost to advertise right. The cost per clicks are just going up and up and up every single year to advertise, right, the cost per clicks are just going up and up and up every single year and I believe at this point the average CPC on Amazon is very close to $1.5 per click, which is quite a lot. If you're selling a lower ASP product, you have two clicks and that's the end of your ACOS goals. Like you already exceeded them with just two clicks. But then there's also the whole idea of conversion rate. Like your conversion rates have also suffered over time because there's so many options. Right, every single page has alternatives that might be equally good, you know. So there's a lot of bouncing off that happens on those pages. You bring someone in and then someone else takes the fail right. So that's another kind of challenge because of this placement saturation and just competition in general.
Speaker 3:And I think the second kind of big change that's happened on Amazon is just the range of options and settings and it's becoming harder and harder for just normal sellers to even set up PPC campaigns and do a good job with it.
Speaker 3:I mean, it's not enough just to do one or two or three or four campaigns. You've got to do so much. You've got to do micromanagement, you've got to slice and dice your data and try to get impressions, when you think, okay, a $1 bid should buy you impressions, but it doesn't, and then you want to kind of put more money behind that, but that ends up in creating like a pendulum effect with high cost and then you bring it down, and so that has been kind of the trend I've seen, with people struggling with their PPC and not knowing how to optimize it, how to scale it. It's just getting quite hard, and that's why, at our agency, we try to keep that mantra of we deliver profitable growth. It's not just growth, it's not just profitability, it's both at the same time. So, which is challenging, but that's the only thing that matters at the end of the day.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:One thing I took note of in your response was you were talking about the organic versus PPC as well as the rising cost per click, and I'll share with you.
Speaker 2:I have had one particular brand for six years and every single week I go through and I look at a bunch of different metrics, but one of those metrics I look at is what's the percentage of my PPC versus organic? And I would say two to three years ago we were probably about 30% PPC and 70% organic, and so my thought during that time was okay, well, if I have a 30% break-even point on my products, then that's going to be kind of like my target ACOS. I'm willing to break even on 30% of my sales because I'm going to have profitable sales on the rest of my sales, and what I've noticed is that has eroded slowly and surely and it is now flipped on its head to where we're at about 70% PPC and 30% organic. And so my question to you is is that unique to me, or are a lot of sellers seeing that? And how do you handle that from like an economic standpoint of breaking even on a percentage of sales?
Speaker 3:Absolutely. What you're seeing is pretty universal. I would say you'd be lucky if you could get like a 50-50 split between PPC and organic at this point, and one of the reasons is that Amazon has changed their layouts over time, so it used to be that you would only have like one or two ads up at the top above the fold and the rest maybe three or four placements or two to three placements on the right were all organic. But they have forced this whole idea of like you first see sponsored ads. You see a big sponsored brand ad, then you see four sponsored product ads and maybe you'll see one organic above the fold. But that's also not guaranteed. In some cases you'll see all sponsored ads above the fold not guaranteed. In some cases you'll see all sponsored ads above the fold. So for a shopper who's looking for the right product, they'll probably assume that what Amazon is promoting at the top is the recommended option and with all those badges you see, and there's a lot of gaming that goes on.
Speaker 3:If you see a deal or something that's prioritized above the fold, then that's where your people are led. They're not actually going to discover your organic listing at all. It could be below the fold, and it's not that kind of time that people have to kind of go exploring and say, oh, let let me skip, skip over these ads, why should I waste their money? Let me go and check in the organic section. No, they don't do that because there's no difference visually between an organic listing and an ad. It looks the same. There's no special flashy colors on your ads that deter people from clicking into them. People just go ahead and click. They don't have time, right? So because of that, I think the ratios have flipped, because people are clicking more and more on ads rather than on organic. And so what do you do about that? Right? First of all, that ratio can't be managed that much, but you can try to be more profitable in the choices of what do you go after, what targeting should you do, and so on.
Speaker 2:Okay, it's good to hear that it's not just me that's experiencing that, and I think that is a really good perspective on this changing landscape, and so I think we have good coverage on a lot of the changes. Why don't we talk about what does a winning PPC strategy look like in 2025?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I think a winning PPC strategy definitely needs to assume that your product is a winning product. First of all, you can't just run PPC on a product that isn't optimized in all possible ways, which means your listings are optimized for not only human readability, but also for the algorithm and now for Rufus right. So those three things need to be true about your listing that it's perfectly optimized. Then you've got to make sure that you don't have any negative signs that might deter people away from your listings, like negative reviews that are tanking everything or those frequency return patches. Things like that can always deter people away. And then there's this whole idea of Amazon showing ads all around right. So if you're not doing defensive marketing, there's a chance that your hard-won lead who's coming to your page is actually going to see something else and then just disappear from your page right Very quickly. So I think a winning strategy will require you know, paying close attention to everything that's on that page, including what you're putting out, as well as what Amazon is putting out on your page. All of the ads that are showing up around you. You need to watch them right. Showing up around you, you need to watch them right, and so there's got to be like a good fly wheel, a solid fly wheel between your SEO, your PPC and the ads that are showing up on your page, in order to make sure that you're getting people's attention but then you're keeping it as well.
Speaker 3:I think the second thing I'd like to say about a winning PPC strategy is to kind of already start future-proofing your listings for Rufus. Now, rufus is kind of new and maybe we can talk about it in a little bit more detail, but I just want to say that Rufus is already prompting people towards certain products and it shows up on your product detail page as well as on the search results page, right? So people are shifting behaviors slowly towards an LLM-assisted chatbot who can tell you quickly where to go rather than spending their own time. And people are getting lazier because it's an easier interaction with an LLM to say, hey, which product will solve all of these things and it's going to tell you what it is right. So if your listings aren't optimized for Rufus, then down the line you will have a certain amount of loss there, because Rufus is going to be indexed for certain things and it's going to give people a different path. So those are some of the things that I think a winning strategy in 2025 need to include.
Speaker 2:Okay, I'm glad that we're talking about Rufus. It seemed like six to nine months ago. I started receiving some emails from Amazon indicating some of these changes coming up from Amazon indicating some of these changes coming up. It has been recently, in the last month, that I've noticed, as a shopper, where Rufus is making some suggestions, and it's interesting to be an Amazon seller as well as an Amazon customer where you can kind of notice these things. And so what are some ways people can optimize for Rufus and get those? You know you use the word future proof, which I really, really like. What are some ways that they can do that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, so let's talk about Rufus. So Rufus is this AI shopping assistant that has deep knowledge of your product, which means it knows everything that you put out there on your product, as well as everything that other people say about your product. It also has all the information about external signals that are coming to your product, where they're coming from, what the source was, et cetera. So it's got like deep product knowledge, right? So, um, I would say that in order for us to understand Rufus, we've got to start paying attention to what prompts Rufus is pre-populating in its window when you're on your page. So if you can start looking at your own page, just clicking on the Rufus button and seeing what shows up like what are the questions, the common questions that people typically ask and you know I've been noticing that space quite a lot and it just changes all the time. And you know I've been noticing that space quite a lot and it just changes all the time Like there's different questions that get populated from time to time based on you know the dynamic nature of like who's asking. They also know me. They know what kind of questions I might ask because of how I might interact with products in general on Amazon, so they also know the shopper Right, so that's the other kind of piece that they're aware of.
Speaker 3:So I think it's important for us to pay attention to what Rufus is pre-populating and then go and click on those answers and see what shows up. I've just recently developed a tool using AI that can help to quickly extract what Rufus is asking and you can just kind of copy it in memory and so on. But I think even if you were to do it manually, there's no problem. Just have someone go to your listings and just make a note of all the questions that are showing up and then try to answer those questions. Either you're going to answer them through an infographic on your listing, because it can now read images as well, or it could be just you know, just an FAQ section that can answer these questions. So there's many ways to address questions that people are asking, and I think the best thing would be to, you know, start building out those sections already so that when the switch happens and when people actually start using it in large numbers, then your listing is promoted by Amazon.
Speaker 2:I really like that response and it's really interesting. One thing I've taken note of as we've been talking is, yes, the subject of this is PPC, but we're spending a lot of time talking about other things that support PPC, and I think that's a really critical topic for people to think about is, yes, you can have well-optimized PPC, but that is reliant on having a good conversion rate, having good reviews and optimized listing and, as Rufus is being rolled out, I think, having a listing that is optimized for Rufus, and so I really like that, and so I have a couple. Let's stay on the PPC topic. What are some mistakes that you're seeing a lot of sellers make as they are navigating Amazon PPC?
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's a great question. So I think you know we can. We can start with, just maybe ranking mistakes, right? I think ranking is a pretty hot topic, like, everybody wants to rank their keywords and they want to be on top of search, which is, you know, obviously the goal, right, you want to be the most visible where you can be. But I think one of the mistakes people make is assuming that every product can rank. I don't think every product can rank. Even if you were to put in your best efforts, it won't rank because of the way Amazon prioritizes cheaper products over more expensive products, right?
Speaker 3:So to give you an example, we have a furniture brand that we work with. Their products start at $500 and go up to $800, $900. And they're selling. Let's just say, let's say, coffee tables, just making this up, but let's say they're selling coffee tables. Now, when you type the keyword coffee table, what shows up at the top? You're going to get $80, $90 products, cheap products that Amazon will prioritize because Amazon wants to make their shoppers feel like they're getting the best deal. Amazon has trained us to find the best deals on Amazon, right? So that's going to show up there and if you fool yourself into thinking that you can rank for the keyword coffee table and crush it all the time. It's a mistake. You might be able to somehow get the maximum bid, go after $49 a click and somehow get there for a little bit, but as soon as you kind of go back to normal standards, more profitable PPC, you're going to start losing those ranks very quickly. So what do you do instead? Like, do you keep going after those keywords or do you do something else? There's other alternatives that you could do.
Speaker 3:So what we generally do for such clients that have pretty high ASP is that we go after categories and not keywords. So categories are basically the group of products, the collection of products that meet a certain price requirement. So, for example, for a $500 product, we will set up a category targeting ad with price refinements starting at $500 or at least $400, because you know that people who are visiting pages that are $500 products or $400 products are the right audience because they've already bought into this idea of buying a premium product. They're not looking for the cheap products out there. They are looking for a premium product that meets a certain style or has a certain attribute that you don't get, you know, with the general keyword.
Speaker 3:So when we do it this way, we are actually able to rank our keywords within those price bands way faster than if we were to go after the keyword and waste and blow through a bunch of cash and not get anywhere with it, right? So it's a choice of are we doing keyword ranking for the sake of ranking, or are we doing it the smart way and then getting the ranking because you're in the right band, in the right price band, right? So that's one of the mistakes that I see people making over and over again thinking that every product can be ranked on page one. That's one. Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2:I really like that and that's a sad reality for a lot of sellers.
Speaker 2:I look at the evolution of my selling.
Speaker 2:When I started, I did have a lot of Me Too products, products that were under $20, and they fit in a backpack, just like I learned in all the classes that I took along with everybody else. And so it is. It is seemed and I'm interested in your opinion on this but it it has seemed like brands with those me too products are getting crushed currently, like 2024 was a challenging year for those types of brands, and I'm interested in your opinion on this, and you have a very interesting lens that you look at this through, in that you're interacting with a lot of different seller accounts and you're seeing the data, and so one thing I've tried to do personally is move to higher priced items, like items above $50. And I've also seen some opportunities in oversized. But what you know, if you think of your clients that you're working with, who who's winning? Uh, and I'm not asking for specific people, but like what are some characteristics of their products or their account that make it a winning account relative to ones that are underperforming?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so definitely the age of small Me Too products under 20 is over. I think we should just let Timu and Sheen take care of those and not bother on Amazon. But I think the product types that are winning are ones with higher average order value. So they're bigger, like they're more expensive. For some reason they're more expensive and there's a justifiable reason for why they're more expensive. That's number one.
Speaker 3:Second is multi-pack. Multi-packs are better than just selling one product, because for the cost of one click you're getting to sell two products right. So it's like improving your margins right there. But just having a multi-pack right, that's the second level.
Speaker 3:And I think the third type of product that does really well is one that has a repeat purchase rate associated with it. So, for example, if you have like a supplement or replenishable or, let's say, a dog chew that people like the flavor, the dogs like the flavor of, and you want to keep selling to them over and over again, then you're essentially spending not on one sale. You're not spending your PPC dollars on one sale but on a customer acquisition which then you can lead into subscribe and save, or you can remarket to them through a sponsored display ad, a remarketing ad, so you get a better return on your PPC investment if you have a repeat functionality there. If people are just by design coming back for more because they need a refill or they just like your product, that you can sell to them over and over again for the same initial cost of customer acquisition.
Speaker 2:I really like that, and while you were talking, I was making notes of the bundling on or the quantity packs. I think that's a really really good strategy that doesn't take a ton of legwork right. The creatives are already done, the listing's already there. Adding a variation doesn't seem to take that long, and so I really really like that, along with your other suggestions, and so one another question that I have, specific to PPC, is day partying, and when I first heard of this, it was like, oh, I can turn my PPC off and maybe keep my organic ranking. How wonderful in this pay to play atmosphere. And there were a series of third party providers that were doing day partying, and then, I believe now Amazon is offering this as a tool, and so I'm curious what have been your experiences with day partying, and what do you think is the right move for sellers in 25 and beyond?
Speaker 3:I love day partying and I'll share different ways to do day partying and I'll tell you which one is my favorite. Okay, so so one of the ways that people try to do day partying is by altering their bids throughout the day. So, for example, you know, if you, if you sell more between 8 AM and 4 PM, then during those hours you keep your bids elevated. Rest of the time you keep your bids lower, right Now the thing is, with that strategy there comes some disadvantages, because when you lower your bid, what happens is that you're risking your ad showing up in a different placement altogether. You know, because we have one bid that represents three placements. I wish they had three different bids for the three placements, but they don't. So what you're doing is you're risking not showing up on top of surge, for example, and then instead showing up on the worst placement, the product pages placement, where your conversion rate drops. You thought you were saving money by lowering your bid, but end up seeing worse results, worse ACoS, worse conversion rate, and so I don't think that strategy works. So we don't do that.
Speaker 3:I know that Amazon does that. They have their internal bidding. The bid adjustment throughout the day can basically do that, but I don't think that's a good strategy for this reason. And then the other approach is that you could, you know, change your budget throughout the day. You can maybe change your budgets so that you have a certain budget cap in the morning and a different budget cap in the afternoon, different budget cap in the evening, but that's so hard and clunky to control, because guess what Amazon can actually spend above your budget. It doesn't mean that if you set your campaign budget to, let's say, $50, that they'll spend exactly $50 on that day. In fact, they make you choose between either a 25% increase or a 100% increase over your campaign budget caps in one of the settings, right? If you haven't noticed, you should just go and check that out, because you're at least allowing Amazon 25% over and above whatever cap you've set at your campaign level. So if that's the case, then how do you actually control it, right? And how do you change that throughout the day? It's very clunky.
Speaker 3:And the third method is where you basically find out what hours of the day your conversion rates are the worst, your ACoS is the worst and you're barely getting any sales, and turn your campaigns off in those hours so that your budget is intact.
Speaker 3:For the rest of the hours where it does have a good impact, where you do have a better conversion rate and you can make more profitable sales during that time, use your budget for that time period and then that way you can get best of both worlds. And that's the strategy that we use. We have our own proprietary software that does this kind of turning on and off all day long, and we also kind of do a day of week partying as well, because sometimes you have business buyers and their businesses don't work so well on weekends, so we try to turn them off. The only thing that we keep running is branded campaigns, because branded campaigns represents your brand and if you have a strong brand and people are looking for your products, they shouldn't be seeing other people's products when they're looking for yours, so just make it easy for them. The only thing we changed in that case is the targeted cost, which means that we make sure that our branded campaigns don't exceed a certain targeted cost, but they are allowed to run all day long.
Speaker 2:Okay, and one thing I want to highlight is that when you are employing that third strategy that you mentioned, you are you're using PPC Ninja software. You are not using the Amazon day party module. I, that's something. When that came out, I remember thinking to myself, you know, I really don't think Amazon's going to help me spend less with them. Like, I was skeptical of that, and so that's. I think that's a decision people need to make. Am I going to do day partying or not? And if I am, how am I going to do it? And so what about? So I guess I don't know what the word would be for this, but essentially, day partying when you're looking at a year. So I one thing I usually do is I will turn PPC budgets to a dollar from December 23rd to January 2nd. That seems to be a really slow time for me. Are there any strategies when you're looking at the course of a year that you find to be very effective?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think you know, especially around tentpole events. You know some products aren't really aligned for tentpole events, especially if they're not offering deep discounts. So any tentpole event, like Prime Day or the Cyber Monday, people are there for the deals. If you don't have a deal, if you really shouldn't be advertising during that time, so we actually turn our campaigns off during tentpole events if there is no deep discount being offered. And by discount I don't mean just the typical 5%, 10% type of discount. I'm talking about at least 20% to 30% discount, which is what people are expecting on those days. And, better still, if you have a red badge of some sort, either the lightning deal or deal of the day or deal of the week or prime day deal, et cetera, those are fine, those you want to be visible. So definitely run ads during that time, but other than that, we turn our campaigns off. We don't even do the $1. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's really good to know. That's really good to know. Yeah, all right. Well, final question before we get into the fire round what types of clients does PPC Ninja Agency work with?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So we work with seven, eight, seven, eight and nine figure sellers and we, first of all, we want to make sure that they have a good product and that they have a good conversion rate, and if the conversion rate is at least 8%, then they are a good fit for us, because PPC only works when there is a good conversion rate. So that's one of the really important metrics that any agency or PPC manager should be looking at, which is to say, how many clicks would it take for me to make a single sale? That's essentially what conversion rate is right. If you have a conversion rate of, let's say, 20%, it means that you need five clicks to make one sale, and if I just do the math and say five clicks times a dollar each, that's $5 spent to make, let's say, $50 in sale. I know my ACoS before I even get started, right. So that's what the conversion rate does. Now, if your conversion rate is really bad let's say 1% this means that you need 100 clicks to make one sale right and $100 to sell a $50, you know that you have a 200% ACoS right there.
Speaker 3:So we don't work with brands that have a poor conversion rate. Now in some cases, conversion rate could be low because they have a very high price product, and that's okay. So let's say they have a $300, $400, $500 product, um, and they have a conversion rate of, let's say, 2% or 3%, uh, which means, again, you have, you need 33 clicks to make one sale, you know, uh, and that's fine, because the the price of each click easily absorbed in in the sale price, and so we don't mind that. And so that's the kind of customer we would be working with.
Speaker 3:The other type of customer that we're, the ideal customer profile for working with our agency, is one that's not 100% reliant on Amazon alone. We would like them to have, like, some sort of diversification and other channels as well, cause otherwise the longevity of, you know, their time with us is probably going to be very limited, because they'll be like, you know, I just want to make my Amazon sales go up and then, you know, I'll be fine, I'll bring it in-house, et cetera. So we like to work with clients that are more diversified and have, you know, like a brand mindset rather than a well I'm just going to sell this product and see if it works kind of mindset. So we want to work with real brands. That's our ideal customer audience.
Speaker 2:Outstanding, outstanding. All right, well, this has been a really good interview. Before we close it out, I would like to go through the fire round, which is four questions. We ask everybody at the end of the episode Are you ready for the fire round?
Speaker 3:Yes, I am ready. All right Sounds good. What is your favorite book? It is the Goal by Eliyahu Goldratt. That's his name, eliyahu Goldratt, and this is a book I read in the 90s, so it is foundational to everything I do, and it's all about bottlenecks and business process optimization.
Speaker 2:Very nice, very nice. What are your hobbies outside of e-commerce?
Speaker 3:I like to hike and I like snowshoeing, like climbing mountains and things like that. It frees up my mind and it gets me ready for the week.
Speaker 2:Very good, very good. What is one thing you do not miss about working for the man?
Speaker 3:My paycheck.
Speaker 2:Very nice, very nice. And final question what do you think sets apart successful entrepreneurs from those who give up, fail or never get started?
Speaker 3:Oh, that's a good one. What sets them apart is vision, I would say, because if they know where they want to be, you know, then they can just no matter what, they'll get there. But if their vision is short-sighted or if they're just looking for, like, a quick win, they might get deterred when things don't go their way.
Speaker 2:So I think vision is the one thing that sets everybody apart. Very good, very good, all right. Well, if people are interested in getting in touch with you or working with PPC Ninja Agency, what would be the best way?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I'm pretty active on LinkedIn. It's my full name R-I-T-U-J-A-B-A Ritu Java. Other than that, you can reach out to us at support at ppcninjacom to work with us at ppcninjacom to work with us, and you can also check out our page, our ppcninjacom website, and we also have an AI website and an AI newsletter. That's ppc-ninjacom. You'll be able to get access to our newsletters.
Speaker 2:Outstanding and for all of our listeners that are driving, that will be posted in the show notes. Uh ritu, thank you so much for your time today and looking forward to staying in touch yeah, thank you so much, david, for having me, I appreciate it.
